Browse content similar to 23/04/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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It's Sunday afternoon - this is the Sunday Politics. | :00:35. | :00:38. | |
Jeremy Corbyn wants to give everyone in Britain four | :00:39. | :00:41. | |
extra bank holidays - but is the Labour leader up | :00:42. | :00:44. | |
to being Prime Minister if he wins the election in just | :00:45. | :00:46. | |
Theresa May says she wants a stronger hand to deliver Brexit - | :00:47. | :00:52. | |
how will the Conservatives go about getting the bigger | :00:53. | :00:54. | |
I'll be asking Party Chairman, Patrick McLoughlin. | :00:55. | :01:01. | |
And I've been in Paris where voters are going to the polls in first | :01:02. | :01:05. | |
round of the French Presidential election - what could be the impact | :01:06. | :01:09. | |
on the EU and Brexit of this most unpredictable of contests? | :01:10. | :01:13. | |
Later in the programme: For the first time since | :01:14. | :01:15. | |
the election was called, the leaders of the five main | :01:16. | :01:17. | |
parties in Wales will be here live to tell me why | :01:18. | :01:20. | |
Will the Remain majority punish the Tories for the decision? | :01:21. | :01:22. | |
Or feel they may not like it but the Tories | :01:23. | :01:25. | |
And with me has always ready for the marathon task of covering a snap | :01:26. | :01:39. | |
general election, even working on bank holidays, the best and | :01:40. | :01:43. | |
brightest political panel in the business. David Wooding, Polly | :01:44. | :01:44. | |
Toynbee and Toby Young. So Labour's big announcement this | :01:45. | :01:47. | |
morning was a crowd pleaser. Four more rainy bank | :01:48. | :01:49. | |
holidays to enjoy - one for each of the patron saints | :01:50. | :01:51. | |
of England, Scotland, But Mr Corbyn probably won't be | :01:52. | :01:54. | |
getting the time off work if he wins And on The Andrew Marr Show this | :01:55. | :02:00. | |
morning he was asked what he would do as Prime Minister | :02:01. | :02:05. | |
if the security services asked him to authorise a drone strike | :02:06. | :02:08. | |
on the leader of Islamic State. What I'd tell them is, | :02:09. | :02:10. | |
give me the information you've got, tell me how accurate that is, | :02:11. | :02:14. | |
tell me what you I'm asking you about decisions you | :02:15. | :02:17. | |
would take as Prime Minister. Can I take you back | :02:18. | :02:26. | |
to the whole point? Is the objective | :02:27. | :02:28. | |
to start more strikes that may kill many innocent | :02:29. | :02:32. | |
people, as has happened? Do you think killing | :02:33. | :02:34. | |
the leader of Isis would be I think the leader of Isis not | :02:35. | :02:36. | |
being around would be helpful, and I'm no supporter or defender | :02:37. | :02:45. | |
in any way of Isis. But I would also argue that | :02:46. | :02:48. | |
the bombing campaign has killed a of whom were virtually prisoners of | :02:49. | :02:52. | |
Isis. So you've got to think | :02:53. | :02:55. | |
about these things. Mr Corbyn earlier. David, is his | :02:56. | :03:02. | |
reply refreshing damaging? It is damaging. He has clearly been | :03:03. | :03:06. | |
freaked to the fire already in the first week, there will be lots of | :03:07. | :03:11. | |
questions on his suitability as a leader and the damage it could cause | :03:12. | :03:14. | |
to our national security over the weeks ahead and Andrew Marr has cut | :03:15. | :03:18. | |
straight to the chase here. The other thing, of course, is the | :03:19. | :03:21. | |
letters of last resort, one of the first duties of a Prime Minister | :03:22. | :03:25. | |
when he walks into No 10 is to sign these letters on his own, on or -- | :03:26. | :03:30. | |
or on her own in a room, a very lonely moment, to decide whether he | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
should press the nuclear button and that goes in the Vanguard submarines | :03:35. | :03:37. | |
and is opened in the event of a strike and he has dodged a question | :03:38. | :03:41. | |
so many times. One must wonder what he would do that. He has to make | :03:42. | :03:45. | |
these decisions as Prime Minister. On the Isis point, refreshing or | :03:46. | :03:51. | |
damaging? It sure is his base, the people who support him, that's the | :03:52. | :03:55. | |
sort of thing they support info and maybe his tactic is that's all he's | :03:56. | :03:58. | |
going to get, that is what the polls seem to suggest, in which case they | :03:59. | :04:02. | |
will be pleased, and say yes, the man is a man for these who doesn't | :04:03. | :04:06. | |
press buttons and shoot people down. But if you want to win you have to | :04:07. | :04:12. | |
deal with your own weaknesses and reach out to other people. I think | :04:13. | :04:16. | |
most people would say that's not somebody who could defend the | :04:17. | :04:21. | |
country. I wonder if he was being totally honest in saying he would | :04:22. | :04:25. | |
consider it he would ask for more information. He has previously been | :04:26. | :04:30. | |
on the record as being against drone strikes in principle, he's | :04:31. | :04:33. | |
campaigned against them, he wants to abolish drones. I think Andrew Marr | :04:34. | :04:36. | |
let him off saying it was a drone strike rather than a Navy SEAL or | :04:37. | :04:40. | |
SAS operation and he had the fact that they could be collateral | :04:41. | :04:43. | |
damage. We that's not his position because he condemned the | :04:44. | :04:49. | |
assassination of Osama Bin Laden even though there was no collateral | :04:50. | :04:53. | |
damage. David is right on the Trident point, he fetched the | :04:54. | :04:56. | |
question. We heard Niall Griffiths on this very show saying Trident, | :04:57. | :05:02. | |
the renewal of Trident, would be in the next Labour Party manifesto. It | :05:03. | :05:05. | |
turns out now we don't know and when he was asked he said that remains to | :05:06. | :05:09. | |
be seen, his re-opened a can of worms. What he has said about | :05:10. | :05:12. | |
Trident which was extraordinary was, we will rebuild the submarines but | :05:13. | :05:17. | |
not have any nukes on them which is expensive and useless. And of course | :05:18. | :05:20. | |
the Labour Party were forced soon after that interview to put out a | :05:21. | :05:23. | |
statement saying it is Labour Party policy to renew Trident. So where | :05:24. | :05:29. | |
are we? Do we know what the party's policy is? It is to renew Trident | :05:30. | :05:34. | |
but he has started this review which involves looking at it all again. We | :05:35. | :05:39. | |
know he is a unilateralist to start with but whether he can force this | :05:40. | :05:44. | |
through is dubious. Does it matter, though, if the party policy is in | :05:45. | :05:48. | |
favour of Trident, if the leader is not? The potential Prime Minister is | :05:49. | :05:52. | |
not? They split three ways when they went to vote on it in the Commons. | :05:53. | :05:55. | |
The party agreed they were pro-Trident and when it came to the | :05:56. | :06:00. | |
vote they split three ways. I think it's difficult for them, it's always | :06:01. | :06:04. | |
been a really difficult issue for Labour. The question is whether you | :06:05. | :06:08. | |
want to seal off your negatives, whether you really want to try and | :06:09. | :06:12. | |
reach out to people. There are an awful lot of people who will like | :06:13. | :06:15. | |
what he said, there are an awful lot of people that think we have been | :06:16. | :06:21. | |
involved in terrible wars, we have wasted a lot of money and blood and | :06:22. | :06:24. | |
let's just get back from the whole thing, let's retreat from the world | :06:25. | :06:29. | |
and not try punching above our weight. There is something to be | :06:30. | :06:32. | |
said for that and it is a reasonable argument. He's been true to himself | :06:33. | :06:37. | |
on this. I think he is and Polly is right, lots of people will agree | :06:38. | :06:40. | |
with him, not enough to win a general election, the latest ComRes | :06:41. | :06:44. | |
poll shows Tories on 50% and Labour on 25 and as my colleague James | :06:45. | :06:48. | |
Forsyth in the Spectator said if this was a boxing match it would | :06:49. | :06:51. | |
have been stopped by now by the revelry. We are not stopping, we are | :06:52. | :06:53. | |
going on. So the political parties have had | :06:54. | :06:54. | |
to move into election mode Stand by for battle buses, | :06:55. | :06:56. | |
mail shots and your social media timeline being bombarded | :06:57. | :07:00. | |
by political propoganda. But none of this comes cheap - | :07:01. | :07:02. | |
Adam's been doing his sums. Democracy is priceless but those | :07:03. | :07:07. | |
planes, trains and automobiles used in the last election cost money | :07:08. | :07:12. | |
and we know exactly how much, thanks to the Electoral | :07:13. | :07:15. | |
Commission database. The Conservatives flew David Cameron | :07:16. | :07:20. | |
to every part of the UK in one day on a private plane costing ?29,000, | :07:21. | :07:24. | |
in-flight meals extra. They shelled out ?1.2 million | :07:25. | :07:30. | |
for adverts on Facebook. The most expensive item was their | :07:31. | :07:36. | |
election guru Lynton Crosby. They bought ?2.4 million worth | :07:37. | :07:40. | |
of advice and research from his firm Labour's biggest expenditure | :07:41. | :07:43. | |
was on good old-fashioned leaflets, costing ?7.4 million | :07:44. | :07:50. | |
to print and deliver. Hope they didn't go straight | :07:51. | :07:53. | |
into the recycling. Cheap for all the | :07:54. | :07:58. | |
enjoyment it gave us. To turn a normal minibus | :07:59. | :08:06. | |
into Harriet Harman's pink bus Nick Clegg toured the country doing | :08:07. | :08:09. | |
all manner of stunts transported although the party got a grand's | :08:10. | :08:16. | |
discount when it broke down. Ukip's then leader Nigel Farage | :08:17. | :08:28. | |
was accompanied by bodyguards Nicola Sturgeon's chopper | :08:29. | :08:30. | |
cost the SNP ?35,450. Plaid Cymru spent just over | :08:31. | :08:39. | |
?1,000 on media training And the Greens spent ?6,912 | :08:40. | :08:43. | |
promoting their tweets. It adds up to a grand total | :08:44. | :08:57. | |
for all the parties of ?37,560,039. Jabbing at my calculator that works | :08:58. | :09:01. | |
out at less than ?1 per voter. Adam Fleming there - | :09:02. | :09:07. | |
and joining me now is the man responsible for the Conservative | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
election campaigns - for the locals next month | :09:13. | :09:16. | |
and the general election in June - Welcome to the programme. The Crown | :09:17. | :09:24. | |
Prosecution Service is reviewing evidence from 14 police forces that | :09:25. | :09:27. | |
your party breached election spending rules on multiple occasions | :09:28. | :09:32. | |
in the last election. What are you going to do differently this time? | :09:33. | :09:38. | |
Well, the battle buses are part of the National campaign spend. You saw | :09:39. | :09:44. | |
them just on the shot that you did, all three parties had those battle | :09:45. | :09:47. | |
buses so that's why we believe they were part of the national spend and | :09:48. | :09:51. | |
it was declared that way. At least 30 people in your party, MPs and | :09:52. | :09:54. | |
agents, being investigated because they may not have been right to | :09:55. | :09:59. | |
include it in the national spend. Are you saying you are going to do | :10:00. | :10:02. | |
nothing differently this time? You asked me about last time and the way | :10:03. | :10:09. | |
the position is... Was. I asked you about this time. We will take a | :10:10. | :10:13. | |
careful count and make sure that everything that we do is within the | :10:14. | :10:20. | |
law. But as I say, the last election, all three parties had | :10:21. | :10:23. | |
battle buses. It is your party that above all has been investigated by | :10:24. | :10:28. | |
14 police forces. You must surely be taking stock of that and working out | :10:29. | :10:33. | |
how to do some things differently. You are being investigated because | :10:34. | :10:37. | |
you put stuff on the National Ledger which should have been on the local | :10:38. | :10:41. | |
constituency ledger. Are you looking at that again? All of the parties | :10:42. | :10:45. | |
had battle buses and they all put them on their national spend. I | :10:46. | :10:48. | |
don't think any of the parties put them on the local spend. The other | :10:49. | :10:53. | |
battle buses were not full of their party activists. Your party stuffed | :10:54. | :10:56. | |
these battle buses with activists and took them to constituencies. | :10:57. | :11:02. | |
That's the difference. And I ask again, what is different this time? | :11:03. | :11:06. | |
Are you going to run the risk of being investigated yet again? We | :11:07. | :11:10. | |
believe that we fully compliant with the electoral law as it was. What | :11:11. | :11:15. | |
will happen if one of these, or two or three or four or five of these 30 | :11:16. | :11:20. | |
people, Tory MPs, or agents running campaigns are charged during the | :11:21. | :11:26. | |
campaign? As I say I believe we properly declared our election | :11:27. | :11:30. | |
expenses. What happens if they are charged? You asking me a | :11:31. | :11:33. | |
hypothetical question, the importance of this election is about | :11:34. | :11:37. | |
who is in Downing Street in seven weeks' time. Let me clarify this, | :11:38. | :11:41. | |
you maintain that in 2015 you did nothing wrong with how you allocated | :11:42. | :11:45. | |
the cost and the activities of the battle buses and you would do | :11:46. | :11:47. | |
exactly the same this time round? What we did at the last election we | :11:48. | :11:52. | |
believe fully complied with the law. So the battle buses this time, | :11:53. | :11:58. | |
stocked full of activists, will still be charged to the national | :11:59. | :12:01. | |
campaign even when they go to local constituencies? Will they? We will | :12:02. | :12:09. | |
be looking at the way we do it, there is new guidance from the | :12:10. | :12:13. | |
Electoral Commission out and we will look at that guidance. It is not the | :12:14. | :12:17. | |
guidance, it is the lawful stop the Electoral Commission said that, if | :12:18. | :12:21. | |
you look at the report they did on us, they said there was one area | :12:22. | :12:24. | |
where we had over claimed, over declared, and another area we had | :12:25. | :12:28. | |
and declared. We haven't worked out what to do | :12:29. | :12:31. | |
yet, have you? We will get on with the campaign and | :12:32. | :12:35. | |
start the campaign and I'm looking forward to the campaign. | :12:36. | :12:37. | |
I'm trying to work out of the campaign is going to be legal or not | :12:38. | :12:41. | |
because last time it seems it could have been illegal. | :12:42. | :12:45. | |
I am sure the campaign will be legal. | :12:46. | :12:46. | |
You started the campaign warning about the prospect of, the coalition | :12:47. | :12:51. | |
of chaos. Mr Corbyn has ruled out a post-election coalition with the SNP | :12:52. | :12:59. | |
and so have the Lib Dems so who is going to be in this coalition? | :13:00. | :13:02. | |
Vince Cable said he was looking towards a possible coalition trying | :13:03. | :13:04. | |
to stop a Conservative government. Is not the leader of the Lib Dems. | :13:05. | :13:07. | |
He's an important voice in the Lib Dems. Who will be in it? Let's see | :13:08. | :13:13. | |
because of the Conservative Party is not re-elected with a strong | :13:14. | :13:16. | |
majority, what will happen? There will be a coalition stopping us | :13:17. | :13:19. | |
doing the things we need to do. Who will be in it? It will be a | :13:20. | :13:24. | |
coalition of the Labour Party, the SNP and the Liberal party. They have | :13:25. | :13:28. | |
ruled it out. I think they would not rule it out if that was the | :13:29. | :13:31. | |
situation. Like Theresa May not ruling out an election and then | :13:32. | :13:35. | |
changing her mind? The things the Prime Minister said were very clear, | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
once she had served Article 50 there was an opportunity, as we know | :13:40. | :13:43. | |
today, there is going to be the start of a new government formed in | :13:44. | :13:47. | |
France and in September we have the German elections. So it was quite | :13:48. | :13:50. | |
right that we didn't get ourselves boxed into a timetable. That is why | :13:51. | :13:56. | |
the Prime Minister took the view that they should be a general | :13:57. | :14:00. | |
election to give her full strength of an electoral mandate when it | :14:01. | :14:03. | |
comes to those negotiations. What about Mr Corbyn's plan for four new | :14:04. | :14:10. | |
bank holidays, good idea? I'm not... If we get Corbyn in No 10 Downing St | :14:11. | :14:14. | |
we will have a permanent bank holiday of the United Kingdom. We | :14:15. | :14:19. | |
will have fewer bank holidays of most other major nations, most about | :14:20. | :14:25. | |
major wealthy nations. What about at least one more? Well, look, he's | :14:26. | :14:28. | |
talked about four bank holidays. Today would be a bank holiday and | :14:29. | :14:33. | |
next Monday would be a bank holiday and the other week was a bank | :14:34. | :14:37. | |
holiday too. I don't think it's very well thought out. It sounded more to | :14:38. | :14:41. | |
me something like you get in school mock elections rather than proper | :14:42. | :14:45. | |
elections. Your party is the self-styled party of the workers and | :14:46. | :14:48. | |
you have no plans to give the workers even one extra bank holiday? | :14:49. | :14:52. | |
What we want to do is ensure Britain is a strong economy and building on | :14:53. | :14:57. | |
the jobs that we have created since 2010. We were told that by reducing | :14:58. | :15:01. | |
public expenditure unemployment in this country would go up, | :15:02. | :15:06. | |
unemployment has gone down and the number of jobs have gone up | :15:07. | :15:11. | |
substantially. But no more bank holidays? Well, we will make our | :15:12. | :15:14. | |
manifesto in due course but I don't think four bank holidays held in | :15:15. | :15:18. | |
April, March and November are very attractive to people. When Ed | :15:19. | :15:24. | |
Miliband as leader of the Labour Party suggested the government | :15:25. | :15:33. | |
should control energy prices by capping them, the Conservatives | :15:34. | :15:37. | |
described that as almost Communist and central planning. Do still take | :15:38. | :15:41. | |
that view? You'll see what we have to say on energy prices. I didn't | :15:42. | :15:45. | |
you about that, I asked you if you take the view... The Prime Minister | :15:46. | :15:50. | |
made a speech at the Conservative Spring conference in which she | :15:51. | :15:52. | |
outlined her dissatisfaction about people who are kept locked on a | :15:53. | :15:55. | |
standard tariff and those are the issues we will address in the next | :15:56. | :15:58. | |
few weeks when the manifesto was published. | :15:59. | :16:03. | |
Would that be an act of communism? You will need to see what we say | :16:04. | :16:09. | |
when we set out the policies. It could be. You could put a Communist | :16:10. | :16:16. | |
act into your manifesto? I don't think you'll find a Communist | :16:17. | :16:20. | |
manifesto in a Conservative manifesto which will be launched... | :16:21. | :16:24. | |
You are planning to control prices? We will address what we think is | :16:25. | :16:28. | |
unfairness in the energy market. Mr Jeremy Corbyn was reluctant this | :16:29. | :16:32. | |
morning to sanction a drone strike. You heard us talking about it | :16:33. | :16:39. | |
earlier against the leader of Islamic State if our intelligence | :16:40. | :16:42. | |
services identified him. What would it achieve? When the Prime Minister | :16:43. | :16:47. | |
gets certain advice in the national interests, she has to act been that. | :16:48. | :16:51. | |
We've seen with Theresa May in her time as Home Secretary and Prime | :16:52. | :16:54. | |
Minister, she's not afraid to take those very difficult decisions. What | :16:55. | :16:58. | |
we say this morning from Jeremy Corbyn was a his tans, a reluctance. | :16:59. | :17:03. | |
I don't think that serves the country well. What would it achieve | :17:04. | :17:10. | |
if we take out the head of Islamic State he's replaced by somebody | :17:11. | :17:14. | |
else. It brings their organisation into difficulties. It undermines | :17:15. | :17:19. | |
their organisation. It shows we'll take every measure to undo an | :17:20. | :17:23. | |
organisation which has organised terrorism in different parts of | :17:24. | :17:27. | |
Europe, the UK. I think it is absolutely right the Prime Minister | :17:28. | :17:29. | |
is prepared to take those kind of measures. Jeremy Corbyn said he | :17:30. | :17:34. | |
wasn't prepared to take that. Because he wasn't sure what it would | :17:35. | :17:40. | |
achieve. The Obama administration launched hundreds of drone strikes | :17:41. | :17:44. | |
in various war zones and we in the west are still under attack on a | :17:45. | :17:50. | |
regular basis. Mr Corbyn's basis was what would it achieve? It would | :17:51. | :17:56. | |
achieve a safer position for the UK overall. The war on terrorists. But | :17:57. | :18:00. | |
the Westminster attack, Paris has just been attacked again? There's | :18:01. | :18:06. | |
been attacks which have been stopped by the intelligence services. We | :18:07. | :18:10. | |
must do all we can to support them. The question was about drone | :18:11. | :18:14. | |
strikes. Whether it is drone strikes or other action, we have to be | :18:15. | :18:18. | |
prepared to act. Let's move on to Brexit. It is the major reason the | :18:19. | :18:22. | |
Prime Minister's called the election? Not the only within but | :18:23. | :18:26. | |
the main reason? It is one of the reasons. Now we start the two-year | :18:27. | :18:30. | |
negotiations and then a year afterwards. Also the way in which | :18:31. | :18:36. | |
certain people said they would try to use in the House of Lords or | :18:37. | :18:38. | |
House of Commons to prevent us making progress. I think you'll put | :18:39. | :18:46. | |
in your manifesto, it is the Government's policy, the Brexit | :18:47. | :18:51. | |
negotiating position will be no more freedom of movement. Leave the | :18:52. | :18:58. | |
single market and no longer under the jurisdiction Europe. You expect | :18:59. | :19:02. | |
every Tory MP to fight on that manifesto. What will you do with Ken | :19:03. | :19:08. | |
Clarke and Anna? They will have fought on their manifesto. They will | :19:09. | :19:12. | |
understand the Prime Minister has the authority of the ballot box | :19:13. | :19:15. | |
behind them. Will they fight the election on these positions? I'm | :19:16. | :19:20. | |
sure they'll fight the election supporting the election of a | :19:21. | :19:25. | |
Conservative Government and it's manifesto will quite clearly set | :19:26. | :19:28. | |
out... You know they're against these positions. Ken Clarke has a | :19:29. | :19:33. | |
prod tradition of expressing a certain view. Overall, the party's | :19:34. | :19:38. | |
manifesto, it is not just individuals like Ken Clarke, it is | :19:39. | :19:41. | |
what happens as far as the House of Lords are concerned, people said | :19:42. | :19:46. | |
they'd use the House of Lords to prevent certain measures. You're the | :19:47. | :19:50. | |
party chairman, will it be possible for people like Ken Clarke to fight | :19:51. | :19:55. | |
this election under the Conservative ticket without sub describing to all | :19:56. | :20:00. | |
-- subscribing to all of these Brexit conditions? Ken Clarke will | :20:01. | :20:06. | |
fight as Conservative candidates. That wasn't my question. I know | :20:07. | :20:10. | |
that. Will they be allowed to fight it on their own ticket and not | :20:11. | :20:14. | |
subscribe to what is in your manifesto? The manifesto will be | :20:15. | :20:18. | |
what the Conservative Party fights the General Election on. There will | :20:19. | :20:23. | |
always be cases where people have had different views on different | :20:24. | :20:28. | |
parts of the manifesto. That will be the guiding principles for the | :20:29. | :20:34. | |
party. Philip Hammond says your election promises in 2015, in your | :20:35. | :20:39. | |
manifesto not to raise taxes tied his hands when it came to managing | :20:40. | :20:43. | |
the economy. Do you agree with him? No. The simple fact is we have to do | :20:44. | :20:48. | |
the best things for the economy. We'll set out in our manifesto in a | :20:49. | :20:53. | |
few weeks' time, what the policies will be for the next Parliament. Can | :20:54. | :20:58. | |
I clarify, you don't agree with your Chancellor? What Philip was saying | :20:59. | :21:03. | |
was some of the areas we wants to address as Chancellor, what the | :21:04. | :21:08. | |
party will do, it will set out all the issues we're fighting on. It | :21:09. | :21:11. | |
will set out clearly the choice we have in this country. That's the | :21:12. | :21:15. | |
important thing. Let me put the question to you again. Philip | :21:16. | :21:20. | |
Hammond said this week your election promise in 2015 not to raise taxes | :21:21. | :21:24. | |
had tied his hands when it came to managing the economy. I ask you, do | :21:25. | :21:29. | |
you agree with him? You said no. Philip expressed his view as to what | :21:30. | :21:34. | |
he would like. What I'm saying is in a few weeks' time we'll set the | :21:35. | :21:39. | |
manifesto which will set the policies, agreed with the the | :21:40. | :21:43. | |
Cabinet. He's Chancellor. Doesn't he determine what the economic part of | :21:44. | :21:47. | |
the manifesto is? We'll talk about that in due course. Will you have a | :21:48. | :21:52. | |
lock on the taxes that you locked in 2015 on income tax, VAT, national | :21:53. | :21:58. | |
insurance? That will be decided. You'll see that when we publish the | :21:59. | :22:05. | |
manifesto in a few weeks' time. Will you rule out the possibility taxes | :22:06. | :22:08. | |
may have to rise under a future Conservative Party? Conservative | :22:09. | :22:13. | |
Government. We've taken four million people out of tax. Now, on average, | :22:14. | :22:19. | |
people are paying ?1200 less tax than they were on the same salaries | :22:20. | :22:25. | |
in 2010. I'm very provide of that. I can assure you, the Conservative | :22:26. | :22:28. | |
Party will want to see taxes reduced. It is the Labour Party | :22:29. | :22:31. | |
which will put up taxes. We have the evidence where this he did so. | :22:32. | :22:37. | |
Council tax went up by over 100%. You haven't reduced the tax burden | :22:38. | :22:43. | |
as a percentage of the GDP is now going to reach its highest level | :22:44. | :22:49. | |
since the mid-180s which was when Conservatives were in power. The tax | :22:50. | :22:54. | |
burden in this country under your Government is rising? We've more | :22:55. | :22:57. | |
people paying taxes which is something, because we've a growing | :22:58. | :23:00. | |
economy and more people... What about the tax band? You said you | :23:01. | :23:05. | |
reduced the tax burden on your own Government's figures is rising? We | :23:06. | :23:11. | |
have reduced the tax burden. The threshold at which people start | :23:12. | :23:16. | |
paying. These are tax rates not the tax burden. It is rising. The tax | :23:17. | :23:21. | |
rates have been reduced. You said tax burden. Perhaps I misspoke. Tax | :23:22. | :23:26. | |
rates have been reduced. We'll leave it there. No doubt we'll speak again | :23:27. | :23:35. | |
between now and June Is France now about to make it | :23:36. | :23:36. | |
a hat-trick of shocks The prospect terrifies | :23:37. | :23:40. | |
the governing elite in Paris. But they're no less scared | :23:41. | :23:44. | |
in Brussels and Berlin, given what it could mean | :23:45. | :23:46. | |
for the whole EU project, never mind the huge potential impact | :23:47. | :23:48. | |
on our own Brexit negotiations. 11 candidates are contesting | :23:49. | :24:08. | |
the first round of the presidential Only the top two will go forward | :24:09. | :24:10. | |
to the run-off on May 7th. For the first time since General De | :24:11. | :24:16. | |
Gaulle created the fifth Republic in 1958, it's perfectly possible that | :24:17. | :24:21. | |
no candidate from the ruling parties of the centre-left or the | :24:22. | :24:25. | |
centre-right will even make it The election has been dominated by | :24:26. | :24:28. | |
the hard right in the shape of the who's never been elected | :24:29. | :24:36. | |
to anything and only started his own party | :24:37. | :24:42. | |
a few months ago. And the far left in the form | :24:43. | :24:45. | |
of Jean-Luc Melenchon, a former Trotskyite who has surged | :24:46. | :24:48. | |
in the final weeks of the campaign. The only candidate left from the | :24:49. | :24:51. | |
traditional governing parties is the centre-right's | :24:52. | :24:55. | |
Francois Fillon and he's been struggling to stay in | :24:56. | :24:57. | |
the race ever since it was revealed that his Welsh wife was being paid | :24:58. | :25:01. | |
at generous public expense for a job I've just come across | :25:02. | :25:06. | |
this magazine cover and it kind of sums up the mood | :25:07. | :25:21. | |
of the French people. It's got the five main candidates | :25:22. | :25:24. | |
for President here but it calls them the biggest liar, the biggest cheat, | :25:25. | :25:27. | |
the biggest traitor, the most paranoid, the biggest demagogue, | :25:28. | :25:30. | |
and it says they are the winners The four leading candidates, | :25:31. | :25:33. | |
Le Pen, Melenchon, Macron and Fillon, or in with a chance | :25:34. | :25:43. | |
of making it to the second round. Only a couple of points separates | :25:44. | :25:46. | |
them in the polls, Frankly, no one has a clue what's | :25:47. | :25:49. | |
going to happen. Of the four, there is a feeling that | :25:50. | :25:55. | |
two of them may be President But the two of them may not find | :25:56. | :26:00. | |
themselves in the second round. Somebody said to me that the man or | :26:01. | :26:13. | |
woman on the Paris Metro has as much a chance of knowing | :26:14. | :26:27. | |
who will win as the greatest experts Because the more expert you are | :26:28. | :26:30. | |
the more you may be wrong. The country has largely | :26:31. | :26:37. | |
stagnated for over a decade. One in ten are unemployed, | :26:38. | :26:42. | |
one in four if you are unlucky Like Britain in the '70s there is | :26:43. | :26:45. | |
the pervasive stench There are three keywords that come | :26:46. | :26:49. | |
to mind. Anger, anger at the elite, and in | :26:50. | :26:57. | |
particular the political elite. And an element of | :26:58. | :27:03. | |
nostalgia for the past. These three words were decisive | :27:04. | :27:09. | |
in the Brexit referendum. They are decisive in | :27:10. | :27:13. | |
the French election. Identity and security has been | :27:14. | :27:25. | |
as important in this election France is a proud nation, it worries | :27:26. | :27:28. | |
about its future in Europe It seems bereft of ideas about how | :27:29. | :27:35. | |
to deal with its largely Muslim migrant population, huge chunks of | :27:36. | :27:40. | |
which are increasingly divorced It is quite simply exhausted by | :27:41. | :27:43. | |
the never-ending Islamist terrorist attacks, the latest only days before | :27:44. | :27:54. | |
voting in the iconic heart of this If Fillon or Macron emerge | :27:55. | :27:57. | |
victorious then there will be continuity of sorts, though Fillon | :27:58. | :28:09. | |
will struggle to implement his Thatcherite agenda and Macron will | :28:10. | :28:12. | |
not be able to count on the support of the French parliament, the | :28:13. | :28:16. | |
National Assembly, for his reforms. But if it's Le Pen or Jean-Luc | :28:17. | :28:19. | |
Melenchon then all bets are off. Both are hardline French | :28:20. | :28:25. | |
nationalists, anti the euro, anti the European Union, anti-fiscal | :28:26. | :28:28. | |
discipline, anti the market, Either in the Elysee Palace | :28:29. | :28:32. | |
would represent an existential Brexit would simply become | :28:33. | :28:40. | |
a sideshow, the negotiations could just peter out as Brussels | :28:41. | :28:50. | |
and Berlin had bigger fish to fry. We're joined now from | :28:51. | :28:54. | |
Paris by the journalist 8th Welcome to the programme. | :28:55. | :29:05. | |
Overshadowing the voting today was yet another appalling terrorist | :29:06. | :29:09. | |
attack in Paris on Thursday night. Do we have any indications of how | :29:10. | :29:16. | |
that's playing into the election? That initially people thought this | :29:17. | :29:20. | |
has been almost foiled in that the police were there as a ramp up. One | :29:21. | :29:25. | |
policeman was killed. But the terrorist did not spray the crowd | :29:26. | :29:29. | |
with bullets. It was seen as not having much of an effect on the | :29:30. | :29:35. | |
election. This has changed. We now know the policeman who was killed, a | :29:36. | :29:41. | |
young man about to the promoted, he was at the Bataclan the night of the | :29:42. | :29:47. | |
terror attack. He was a fighter for LGBT rights. The fact he was | :29:48. | :29:53. | |
promoted, happy within his job, he has this fresh face. Sudden, he's | :29:54. | :30:00. | |
one of us. It took perhaps 48 hours for the French to process this. But | :30:01. | :30:06. | |
now they're angry and this may actually change the game, at least | :30:07. | :30:11. | |
at the margins. To whose advantage? I would say the two who might | :30:12. | :30:18. | |
benefit from this are Marine Le Pen, she's been absolutely | :30:19. | :30:22. | |
anti-immigration, anti-anything. And made no bones about it as she | :30:23. | :30:27. | |
immediately made rather strange announcement in which she'd said if | :30:28. | :30:30. | |
she'd been president none of the terror attacks which happened in | :30:31. | :30:35. | |
France would have happened. Francois Fillon has written a book two years | :30:36. | :30:42. | |
ago called Combating Islamic Terrorism he's has an organised plan | :30:43. | :30:47. | |
in his manifesto. Unlike Emmanuel Macron who stumbled when he was | :30:48. | :30:51. | |
asked the evening this happened what he thought, he said, I can't dream | :30:52. | :30:55. | |
up an anti-terror programme overnight. The question, of course, | :30:56. | :30:59. | |
that arrows was this is not the sort of thing that's just happened | :31:00. | :31:02. | |
overnight. It's been unfortunately the fate of France for many years. | :31:03. | :31:08. | |
Let me ask you this finally, what ever the outcome on May 7th in the | :31:09. | :31:13. | |
second round, who ever wins, would it be fair to say French politics | :31:14. | :31:19. | |
will never be the same again? Yes. Absolutely it's a very strange | :31:20. | :31:22. | |
thing. People have no become really excited about this. You cannot go | :31:23. | :31:27. | |
anywhere without people discussing heatedly this election. The anger | :31:28. | :31:31. | |
that was described is very accurate. Very true. There was this feeling as | :31:32. | :31:38. | |
for the Brexit voters and the Trump voters, vast parts of the people | :31:39. | :31:42. | |
were being talked down to by people who despised them. This has to | :31:43. | :31:48. | |
change. If it doesn't change, we cannot predict what the future will | :31:49. | :31:54. | |
be. We'll know the results or at least the ex-the Poll London time | :31:55. | :31:59. | |
tonight at 8.00pm. Thank for joining us from the glorious heart of your | :32:00. | :32:00. | |
city. Now, the Green Party currently has | :32:01. | :32:04. | |
one MP and they'll be contesting many more seats in June | :32:05. | :32:07. | |
as well as hoping to increase their presence on councils in | :32:08. | :32:10. | |
the local elections on 4th May. Launching their campaign | :32:11. | :32:13. | |
on Thursday, co-leader Caroline Lucas made | :32:14. | :32:14. | |
a pitch to younger voters. When it comes to young | :32:15. | :32:16. | |
people they've been But one crucial way they've been | :32:17. | :32:18. | |
betrayed is by what this generation and this government and the previous | :32:19. | :32:24. | |
ones have been doing when it comes We know we had the hottest year | :32:25. | :32:27. | |
on record last year, you know, you almost think what else does | :32:28. | :32:31. | |
the environment need to be doing All the signs are there | :32:32. | :32:34. | |
and it is young people who are going to be bearing | :32:35. | :32:38. | |
the brunt of a wrecked environment and that's why it's so important | :32:39. | :32:40. | |
that when we come to making that pitch to, yes, the country at large | :32:41. | :32:44. | |
but to young people in particular, I think climate change, | :32:45. | :32:47. | |
the environment, looking after our precious resources, | :32:48. | :32:49. | |
has to be up there. And I'm joined now by the Green | :32:50. | :32:54. | |
MEP, Molly Scott Cato. Welcome back to the programme. | :32:55. | :33:08. | |
Promised to scrap university tuition fees, increase NHS funding, rollback | :33:09. | :33:11. | |
cuts to local councils spending, how much would that cost and how would | :33:12. | :33:15. | |
you pay for it? Like the other parties we haven't got a costed | :33:16. | :33:18. | |
manifesto yet, it's only a few days since the election was announced so | :33:19. | :33:22. | |
I will come back and explain the figures. You don't know? Like every | :33:23. | :33:26. | |
party we have not produced accosted manifesto yet, we produced one last | :33:27. | :33:31. | |
time but public spending figures have changed so we're not in a | :33:32. | :33:34. | |
position to do that but we will be in a week or so. What taxes would | :33:35. | :33:40. | |
you like to consider raising? We would consider having higher taxes | :33:41. | :33:43. | |
for the better off in society. I think we need to increase the amount | :33:44. | :33:49. | |
of tax wealthier people pay. How do you define better off? I'm not | :33:50. | :33:51. | |
entirely clear what the precise number would be but I think 100,000 | :33:52. | :33:58. | |
people would pay a bit more, 150,000 quite considerably more but the real | :33:59. | :34:01. | |
focus needs to be on companies avoiding paying taxes. I work on | :34:02. | :34:05. | |
that a lot in my role in the European Parliament, we see an | :34:06. | :34:08. | |
enormous amount of tax avoidance by companies moving profits from | :34:09. | :34:11. | |
country to country and we need European corporation to make that | :34:12. | :34:14. | |
successful. It has not made much difference yet. We have made lots of | :34:15. | :34:20. | |
changes. Google turned over $1 billion and only paid 25 million in | :34:21. | :34:24. | |
taxes last year. There was a significant fine introduced by the | :34:25. | :34:29. | |
competition commission on Apple and in the case of Google we must change | :34:30. | :34:33. | |
the laws so that people cannot move profits from country to country. | :34:34. | :34:38. | |
Everybody wants to do it. But you couldn't face a big spending | :34:39. | :34:41. | |
programme on the ability to do that. You'd have to increase other taxes. | :34:42. | :34:45. | |
If you look at the cost of free student tuition, tuition fees and | :34:46. | :34:48. | |
also maintenance grants to students, that would come in at about 10 | :34:49. | :34:52. | |
billion a year. One way of paying for that would be to remove the | :34:53. | :34:56. | |
upper threshold on National Insurance, bringing in 20 billion a | :34:57. | :34:59. | |
year, that's the order of magnitude we are talking about. It is not | :35:00. | :35:03. | |
vast, and some of the proposals we have... That would be an increase on | :35:04. | :35:08. | |
the better of tax? National Insurance on people earning... | :35:09. | :35:14. | |
People earning above 42,000. You would have another 10% tax above | :35:15. | :35:19. | |
42,000? I can't remember exactly how much the National Insurance rate | :35:20. | :35:24. | |
changes by. But in government figures it would be 28 billion | :35:25. | :35:28. | |
raised. I think it is up to 45, a bit more you pay a marginal rate of | :35:29. | :35:32. | |
40%, you would have them pay a marginal rate of over 50%? We would | :35:33. | :35:37. | |
put the National Insurance rate on higher incomes the same as it is on | :35:38. | :35:41. | |
lower incomes. If you are a school head of an English department on 50, | :35:42. | :35:45. | |
60,000 a year you would face a marginal rate under U of over 50%? | :35:46. | :35:50. | |
It is not useful to do this as a mental maths exercise but if you | :35:51. | :35:55. | |
look at other proposals would could have a landlord licensing system, | :35:56. | :35:59. | |
longer term leases on properties, so young people particularly, but also | :36:00. | :36:02. | |
older people who rent, could have more security which needn't cost | :36:03. | :36:06. | |
anything. We could insist on landlords paying for that. The | :36:07. | :36:10. | |
mental arithmetic seems clear but we will come back to that. How is the | :36:11. | :36:14. | |
Progressive Alliance coming? It is going well, I have heard of a lot of | :36:15. | :36:18. | |
interest at local level. Winterset this in contest, context, lots of | :36:19. | :36:23. | |
progressives are concerned about the crisis in public services, prisons, | :36:24. | :36:28. | |
social care system, and also about the Tories' hard extreme Brexit they | :36:29. | :36:31. | |
are threatening. You want the left to come together? Theresa May has | :36:32. | :36:36. | |
given us opportunity, she has taken a risk because she has problems with | :36:37. | :36:39. | |
backbenchers, she doesn't think she can get through Brexit with a small | :36:40. | :36:43. | |
majority so there is an opportunity and we are saying progressives must | :36:44. | :36:46. | |
come together to corporate, Conservatives are effective at using | :36:47. | :36:49. | |
the first-past-the-post system and we have to become effective as well. | :36:50. | :36:54. | |
Do you accept this Progressive Alliance cannot become the | :36:55. | :36:57. | |
government and Mr Corbyn is the Prime Minister? How could it happen | :36:58. | :37:02. | |
otherwise? I think that is a secondary question. For me the | :37:03. | :37:05. | |
primary question is who do people choose to vote for? Aluminium | :37:06. | :37:08. | |
government afterwards comes after the election. In most countries that | :37:09. | :37:12. | |
is the case. I understand that but we have the system we have and you | :37:13. | :37:15. | |
accept this Progressive Alliance cannot be in power and thus mystical | :37:16. | :37:19. | |
Burmese Prime Minister? Personally I think Mr Corbyn is less of a threat | :37:20. | :37:23. | |
to the country than Theresa May, she has shown herself to be an | :37:24. | :37:25. | |
authoritarian leader and she has said she doesn't want to have | :37:26. | :37:32. | |
dissidents, which I would say is reasonable opposition, and what we | :37:33. | :37:34. | |
are suggesting at the moment is there is a way of avoiding that very | :37:35. | :37:37. | |
hard Brexit and damage to public services. You'd be happy to pay the | :37:38. | :37:39. | |
price of having Mr Corbyn as Prime Minister? I do not see that as a | :37:40. | :37:44. | |
price. People have the choice of Jeremy Corbyn or Theresa May as | :37:45. | :37:48. | |
Prime Minister, that's the system that works. You would prefer Mr | :37:49. | :37:52. | |
Corbyn? I would but votes are translated into seats and the | :37:53. | :37:55. | |
Progressive Alliance is a step towards that. | :37:56. | :38:07. | |
Hello and welcome once again to Sunday Politics Wales. | :38:08. | :38:09. | |
Well, Theresa May's snap election caught almost everyone | :38:10. | :38:11. | |
in the political world off guard, but now it's all systems | :38:12. | :38:14. | |
In a few moments, the Welsh party leaders will go head | :38:15. | :38:28. | |
to head for the first time since the election was called. | :38:29. | :38:30. | |
Mark Williams who leads the Welsh Liberal Democrats | :38:31. | :38:32. | |
is in Aberystwyth, and here with me in studio | :38:33. | :38:34. | |
the Welsh Labour Leader, Carwyn Jones, Andrew RT Davies | :38:35. | :38:36. | |
the Welsh Conservative leader is here, along with the leader | :38:37. | :38:39. | |
of Plaid Cymru, Leanne Wood, and Ukip's leader in | :38:40. | :38:41. | |
But after the initial excitement what's | :38:42. | :38:44. | |
We sent our reporter, Cemlyn Davies, straight | :38:45. | :38:46. | |
to Downing Street to find out - but it might not be the one | :38:47. | :38:50. | |
Yes, welcome to Downing Street in Newport. | :38:51. | :39:07. | |
It may not be quite as glamorous as its Westminster namesake, | :39:08. | :39:11. | |
there aren't any fancy gates or gangs of photographers | :39:12. | :39:15. | |
waiting to snap the locals, but in a few weeks' time, | :39:16. | :39:18. | |
the people who live here will have power to wield when they vote | :39:19. | :39:21. | |
This street is in one of 25 Welsh Parliamentary seats | :39:22. | :39:26. | |
The Conservatives have 11, following their best general | :39:27. | :39:33. | |
election showing in Wales in a generation two years ago. | :39:34. | :39:35. | |
The Liberal Democrats have one Welsh seat. | :39:36. | :39:41. | |
So, what are the parties' chances this time around? | :39:42. | :39:45. | |
A swing to the Conservatives will actually mean a good six | :39:46. | :39:49. | |
or seven Labour seats are very much at risk. | :39:50. | :39:51. | |
So for Labour it is very much a defensive job, | :39:52. | :39:53. | |
they are trying to keep hold of the seats they've already got. | :39:54. | :39:56. | |
Plaid Cymru might go for a few seats, they might throw | :39:57. | :39:58. | |
It's quite a big win for them, they've only got three MPs | :39:59. | :40:03. | |
in Parliament at the moment, if they can get a few more, | :40:04. | :40:05. | |
The Conservatives will probably capitalise on the bits of Wales, | :40:06. | :40:09. | |
particularly those that voted Leaving the referendum. | :40:10. | :40:11. | |
Now they can say, well, we delivered the referendum for you, | :40:12. | :40:17. | |
we've delivered Article 50, now vote for us to | :40:18. | :40:19. | |
The Lib Dems lost two Welsh MPs in 2015 and, last year, | :40:20. | :40:23. | |
the party was left with just one Assembly Member. | :40:24. | :40:25. | |
I think it's #LibDemFightback all the way. | :40:26. | :40:30. | |
The Lib Dems are very optimistic about this. | :40:31. | :40:34. | |
They have selected candidates already, unlike any other party, | :40:35. | :40:36. | |
The Lib Dems were the only ones that were anticipating a snap election. | :40:37. | :40:40. | |
They are standing in local elections as well, so, like all parties, | :40:41. | :40:45. | |
I think they will be seeking to stand candidates. | :40:46. | :40:48. | |
Whether they are successful, it is difficult. | :40:49. | :40:53. | |
They mostly claimed third place in 2015, even at their peak. | :40:54. | :40:55. | |
With Labour struggling in the polls, the other parties are all | :40:56. | :40:58. | |
Several seats are seemingly up for grabs. | :40:59. | :41:02. | |
There are good seven or eight seats that are quite | :41:03. | :41:04. | |
For Labour, they have to worry about Delyn, | :41:05. | :41:07. | |
We've also got Anglesey, we've got only a 200 | :41:08. | :41:11. | |
Last time, Plaid Cymru very nearly took it. | :41:12. | :41:17. | |
They do have the assembly seat as well. | :41:18. | :41:18. | |
I think that will be a particularly interesting one | :41:19. | :41:20. | |
But it is still very much all to play for. | :41:21. | :41:25. | |
Theresa May's decision to call a snap election means voters | :41:26. | :41:27. | |
here and across Wales will be asked to go to the polls for | :41:28. | :41:30. | |
the fifth time in two years on the 8th of June. | :41:31. | :41:33. | |
I've been looking forward to it, I wanted Theresa May to have a good | :41:34. | :41:39. | |
majority in the Houses of Parliament so she can push through with Brexit. | :41:40. | :41:46. | |
And do you think that's what's going to happen now? | :41:47. | :41:49. | |
For an ex-Labour supporter, it's hard for me to really say that. | :41:50. | :41:57. | |
I'm glad, the country needs sorting at the moment. | :41:58. | :41:59. | |
The poor are getting poorer, the rich are getting richer. | :42:00. | :42:06. | |
I'm not sure at the moment, but it won't be Conservative. | :42:07. | :42:13. | |
Labour, what do you make of Jeremy Corbyn? | :42:14. | :42:16. | |
That seems to be a big issue at the moment? | :42:17. | :42:19. | |
He's making a lot more sense than the Conservatives at the moment. | :42:20. | :42:24. | |
All 40 sitting Welsh MPs are standing again. | :42:25. | :42:27. | |
They all know that this campaign will be dominated by Brexit, | :42:28. | :42:30. | |
but they'll have to be ready to discuss other issues, too. | :42:31. | :42:33. | |
Considering this is the only election for five years, | :42:34. | :42:36. | |
although people will be voting on Brexit, and they will be voting | :42:37. | :42:39. | |
on how negotiations go - they might be voting on hard Brexit | :42:40. | :42:42. | |
or soft Brexit - I think a lot of people in Wales, | :42:43. | :42:44. | |
they will be voting on the usual issues that people worry | :42:45. | :42:47. | |
They will be voting on the economy, they will be voting on if they think | :42:48. | :42:52. | |
their wages are getting better or not. | :42:53. | :42:54. | |
They will be voting on the Health Service, | :42:55. | :42:55. | |
Even though those are devolved issues, of course? | :42:56. | :42:59. | |
Even though they are devolved issues, the UK parties | :43:00. | :43:01. | |
are going to be campaigning on these pledges. | :43:02. | :43:03. | |
On this street, and across the country, there are decisions | :43:04. | :43:05. | |
to be made, votes to be won, to determine who occupies Number 10 | :43:06. | :43:08. | |
Good to see 10 Downing Street, keeping up with their recycling. | :43:09. | :43:25. | |
There are challenges for the parties, but what will they be | :43:26. | :43:28. | |
offering? Let's find out for the next 35 minutes or so. Carwyn Jones, | :43:29. | :43:35. | |
you are a senior Labour politician. What is the party position on | :43:36. | :43:39. | |
Trident? In favour of renewing it, quite clearly. In the manifesto? I | :43:40. | :43:43. | |
don't run the manifesto, but has been clear today it will be in the | :43:44. | :43:49. | |
manifesto. We need to make sure that the world disarms multilaterally. | :43:50. | :43:53. | |
Defence is hugely important. But it is not just about the nuclear | :43:54. | :43:57. | |
deterrent, it is about making sure we have sufficient capacity in the | :43:58. | :44:01. | |
defence forces to provide security. A nuclear deterrent only works if | :44:02. | :44:06. | |
you have a Prime Minister that says they will use it, and he says it | :44:07. | :44:09. | |
won't? That is true, if you are Prime Minister, you have to quite | :44:10. | :44:15. | |
often look at the possible as you're taking difficult decisions. Nobody | :44:16. | :44:17. | |
wants to take that decision, but if you have a deterrent, it is | :44:18. | :44:23. | |
unfortunate that you have to say you cannot rule out using it. You said | :44:24. | :44:28. | |
recently that the party has a mountain to climb in the general | :44:29. | :44:32. | |
election. That seems to be an understatement? It is true, no point | :44:33. | :44:35. | |
pretending otherwise. But the mountains are there to be climbed, | :44:36. | :44:39. | |
to be conquered. It is important that people are able to hear what we | :44:40. | :44:42. | |
are saying, that we want a fair deal for Wales. We have had seven years | :44:43. | :44:46. | |
of austerity. We were told it would sort things out, balance the books, | :44:47. | :44:50. | |
there is no end to it. We need some hope, a party with vision, and we | :44:51. | :44:56. | |
need a change in Westminster. Your party, the Shadow Chancellor said | :44:57. | :45:00. | |
?500 billion more borrowing to give the economy a bit of a boost. You | :45:01. | :45:02. | |
would go with Yes. There has never been a better time | :45:03. | :45:12. | |
to borrow. A Labour government came in after the war when things were | :45:13. | :45:17. | |
much worse, and yet it created the NHS, it made sure the economy was | :45:18. | :45:20. | |
rebuilt, it built houses. All of these things were done at a far more | :45:21. | :45:24. | |
difficult time. If they could do it, there is no reason a Labour | :45:25. | :45:29. | |
government cannot do it after June. Coming into 2010, all of the | :45:30. | :45:34. | |
political problems you got into because of so-called excess | :45:35. | :45:36. | |
borrowing, you're not concerned about that? It was a world problem. | :45:37. | :45:41. | |
On the 9th of August 2007, the stock market started to crash and it was a | :45:42. | :45:45. | |
problem for all governments, not just the UK. It was a Labour | :45:46. | :45:47. | |
government that made sure that the banks did not collapse, things were | :45:48. | :45:53. | |
not left to get worse and worse. If it wasn't for the action Gordon | :45:54. | :45:56. | |
Brown took, things would have been far worse. Andrew RT Davies, going | :45:57. | :46:02. | |
into the 2015 general election, David Cameron was clear there was a | :46:03. | :46:07. | |
tax block, a promise of no increase in VAT, income tax or national | :46:08. | :46:11. | |
insurance. Should Theresa May have a similar promise going into this | :46:12. | :46:15. | |
election? We are the party of low taxation. A promise, rule it out? We | :46:16. | :46:21. | |
get it, if people are incentivised to go out to work, and agree to give | :46:22. | :46:26. | |
a fair amount over, they will work harder to get on in life. If the | :46:27. | :46:31. | |
government loads the tax system against it, they will not put the | :46:32. | :46:34. | |
timing, they will not make the opportunities, entrepreneurs will | :46:35. | :46:37. | |
not invest and you will see a contraction. We are the low tax | :46:38. | :46:42. | |
party and we stand on that record. We are also about making sure that | :46:43. | :46:46. | |
public finances are in good health. You can only borrow if people have | :46:47. | :46:49. | |
confidence that you can repay the borrowing, when you look at Labour's | :46:50. | :46:56. | |
commitment to ?500 billion, which the Prime Minister just endorsed, | :46:57. | :46:59. | |
you can suddenly see the financial markets running a mile from the UK. | :47:00. | :47:05. | |
So, cast iron, you think there should be a promise ruling out any | :47:06. | :47:10. | |
sort of tax increases? We will see what the commitments are in the | :47:11. | :47:12. | |
manifesto. I am saying that the Conservatives are the party of low | :47:13. | :47:18. | |
taxation. So rule it out? What we would be doing is making sure we | :47:19. | :47:20. | |
build on the strong credentials of the first seven years we have been | :47:21. | :47:23. | |
in government, where 4 million people do not pay tax because they | :47:24. | :47:28. | |
have been taken out of that. 31 million-plus people are in | :47:29. | :47:37. | |
employment make sure we safeguard the interests of the vulnerable in | :47:38. | :47:39. | |
society by continuing to grow the economy. That is what this election | :47:40. | :47:42. | |
is about. It is about giving Theresa May the mandate to continue to build | :47:43. | :47:44. | |
the economy, build Britain and negotiate Brexit. You are not ruling | :47:45. | :47:50. | |
out raising taxes, Theresa May will not rule it out, either. That will | :47:51. | :47:54. | |
lead to confusion? It will not lead to confusion, we are the party of | :47:55. | :47:58. | |
low taxation. The manifesto will be coming forward on May the tenth, and | :47:59. | :48:02. | |
people will be able to read it. The election was only called last | :48:03. | :48:05. | |
Tuesday. As the part of low taxation, we want to make sure that | :48:06. | :48:11. | |
the taxation system is fair and it allows entrepreneurs to invest, | :48:12. | :48:14. | |
workers keep a fair share of income and we continue on the strong | :48:15. | :48:17. | |
economic part we have built up. I guess the truth of the election is | :48:18. | :48:21. | |
that it will be a battle along normal party political lines between | :48:22. | :48:24. | |
the Conservatives and Labour. Is it difficult for you to get your voice | :48:25. | :48:29. | |
heard? I would be concerned if you are right on that point, because | :48:30. | :48:32. | |
Wales faces grave threats at the moment. There is a real job of work | :48:33. | :48:37. | |
to do to defend Wales. We are under threat from an extreme Tory Brexit, | :48:38. | :48:42. | |
which risks pulling us out of the single market. That risks many jobs | :48:43. | :48:47. | |
in Wales. As well as the future of public services, and continued cuts, | :48:48. | :48:52. | |
people face a downturn in their economic outlook. On top of that, we | :48:53. | :48:57. | |
have the potential of a power grab from Westminster, where the powers | :48:58. | :49:05. | |
that will be given by Brussels will not come back to Cardiff. The Tories | :49:06. | :49:10. | |
will grab them for themselves in Westminster. So, Wales needs a team | :49:11. | :49:16. | |
of MPs with a strong voice, defending Wales. We have an | :49:17. | :49:20. | |
opportunity to provide that in this election. Will you be part of that | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
team? I have a big decision to make over the next couple of days. I | :49:25. | :49:28. | |
think, as I have said, the very nature of our country is in the | :49:29. | :49:34. | |
balance now. So it is a no-brainer? If Scotland becomes independent, we | :49:35. | :49:37. | |
risk becoming part of some England and Wales entity, and our voice | :49:38. | :49:42. | |
within that structure risks being very, very small indeed. We do need | :49:43. | :49:46. | |
a very strong team of MPs in Westminster. That is why I am | :49:47. | :49:51. | |
actively considering it. We also need a strong team in the national | :49:52. | :49:55. | |
assembly, and the election in 2021 is an opportunity for Plaid Cymru to | :49:56. | :49:58. | |
form a government. That is something to bear in mind as well. Your | :49:59. | :50:03. | |
colleagues in the assembly, are they capable of running their own | :50:04. | :50:06. | |
affairs, having a leadership battle, having a First Minister, it isn't | :50:07. | :50:11. | |
your time and effort best pursued in Westminster? These are the issues I | :50:12. | :50:17. | |
am actively weighing up. You have had a few days? The Labour MP for | :50:18. | :50:21. | |
the Rhondda is in a very vulnerable situation. He is constantly | :50:22. | :50:26. | |
attacking his leader. The party is riven with divisions and people can | :50:27. | :50:30. | |
see that. He has an appalling expenses record. I think we can win | :50:31. | :50:32. | |
there with a number of different candidates. I think we are in for a | :50:33. | :50:38. | |
very interesting election, in a number of seats throughout Wales, | :50:39. | :50:41. | |
not least in the valleys, where people are still very desperate for | :50:42. | :50:46. | |
change. Neal Hamilton, we have been talking about whether Leanne Wood | :50:47. | :50:48. | |
would stand, your leader was refusing to refer to back row | :50:49. | :50:53. | |
confirm if he was standing, surely the leader of Ukip us to stand in a | :50:54. | :50:58. | |
general election? He may well do. It is not for me to advise him. I | :50:59. | :51:03. | |
intend to be a candidate myself, to give a lead, because elections for | :51:04. | :51:06. | |
Ukip our work in progress, always. One leads to another. We are still | :51:07. | :51:12. | |
building our support base. This is going to be an important | :51:13. | :51:15. | |
opportunity. Is the problem for Ukip, what can you offer a voter | :51:16. | :51:20. | |
that they can't get from the Tories right now? This election is not | :51:21. | :51:23. | |
about electing a government, that is done and dusted, we know what it is | :51:24. | :51:28. | |
going to be. This is about electing an effective opposition. The best | :51:29. | :51:31. | |
opportunity to leave Bracco opposition to the Conservatives is | :51:32. | :51:34. | |
one that forces them to get the best Brexit deal possible for Britain, | :51:35. | :51:39. | |
deliver on promises on immigration and many other things. We have other | :51:40. | :51:43. | |
policies, like drastically reducing the foreign aid budget and putting | :51:44. | :51:47. | |
it into the Health Service, scrapping green taxes on energy, | :51:48. | :51:51. | |
which would reduce the average household electricity bill by ?300 a | :51:52. | :51:56. | |
year. But those are fiddling around the edges. On the main issues of the | :51:57. | :52:03. | |
day, there is a fag paper between you and the Tories? I don't know | :52:04. | :52:07. | |
what you mean by the main issues of the day, Theresa May was a Remain in | :52:08. | :52:13. | |
pain. A lot of Conservative MPs were Remain campaigners. Ukip is, | :52:14. | :52:16. | |
unambiguously, the only party that supported Brexit. We are the guard | :52:17. | :52:25. | |
dogs of that process. Mark Williams, last, but not least, I guess the big | :52:26. | :52:31. | |
challenge for you once again will be to be a party that stands for | :52:32. | :52:33. | |
something other than so-called standing up for those that voted to | :52:34. | :52:38. | |
remain? We're going to stand for the whole of the country, the whole of | :52:39. | :52:41. | |
Wales. There are huge issues at stake on the European issue. You are | :52:42. | :52:46. | |
right, the tone of the discussion we have had so far, there are other | :52:47. | :52:50. | |
issues which the Tory party must be challenged on. We did not mention | :52:51. | :52:57. | |
the triple lock on pensions. We talk about vulnerable people, there is a | :52:58. | :53:00. | |
group of people there that are very vulnerable, very concerned over what | :53:01. | :53:04. | |
is being sad. Of course, the Prime Minister was very clear what this | :53:05. | :53:11. | |
election was about. It is about Brexit, it is essential she doesn't | :53:12. | :53:14. | |
get her way when she talks about the country being united, which it | :53:15. | :53:18. | |
isn't, the need to have a compliant House of Commons that will give her | :53:19. | :53:22. | |
a blank cheque to do what she chooses, with dire implications, | :53:23. | :53:24. | |
particularly on the issue of the single market, particularly on the | :53:25. | :53:27. | |
issues of what is there to replace subsidies for farmers, a structural | :53:28. | :53:35. | |
fund regime, and concern that the powers currently exercised by the | :53:36. | :53:38. | |
European Union will not find their way in Whitehall, when I have to | :53:39. | :53:42. | |
vote for them, when they should be decided in the National Assembly. | :53:43. | :53:45. | |
These are critical times and critical issues that need to be | :53:46. | :54:04. | |
decided. Andrew Davies I have been waiting for a long time. It is | :54:05. | :54:10. | |
important that people have clear choices. Not be threatened like they | :54:11. | :54:14. | |
were at the last general election. Let's look at the opinion polls and | :54:15. | :54:19. | |
be realistic. Theresa May called this election because she wants to | :54:20. | :54:24. | |
kick Labour Party down even further. We're not going to have a coalition | :54:25. | :54:30. | |
government but it is important the stores of all parties are clearer | :54:31. | :54:40. | |
what is at stake. Andrew, one of the points raised, the only reason | :54:41. | :54:43. | |
Theresa May has held this election is because she thinks she can | :54:44. | :54:47. | |
thought the opposition. She was saying outside Downing Street she is | :54:48. | :54:50. | |
doing it for the good of the country and needs to have a clear set of | :54:51. | :54:55. | |
proposals. Where has there been any difficulty in her Brexit Road? She | :54:56. | :55:00. | |
was clear on Tuesday why she is going to the country. The arithmetic | :55:01. | :55:04. | |
of the House of Commons is challenging. The country is going to | :55:05. | :55:11. | |
get it say on June eight. What is interesting from Mark Williams when | :55:12. | :55:15. | |
he talks about no coalitions with Labour or the Conservatives, many in | :55:16. | :55:21. | |
2010 remember when they said no to tuition fees and within a couple of | :55:22. | :55:25. | |
months, they brought their men. Now she clearly outlined that she was | :55:26. | :55:33. | |
doing it with a heavy heart. You believe that? She was very | :55:34. | :55:40. | |
articulate. People at my her courage to go to the country. We take | :55:41. | :55:46. | |
nothing for granted and as was Conservatives, will have to fight | :55:47. | :55:52. | |
every seat, every square root of battle ground. As we go forward, | :55:53. | :55:55. | |
what people are voting for is for a strong confident leadership of | :55:56. | :56:02. | |
Jeremy -- of Theresa May rather than the confusion of Germany cordon -- | :56:03. | :56:12. | |
Jeremy Corbyn. They are divided as any party. Liam Fox wanted to put | :56:13. | :56:19. | |
the clock back. To reason may is a Remainer and somebody who is a | :56:20. | :56:24. | |
Remainer, I would want to negotiate a sensible Brexit. I don't see any | :56:25. | :56:37. | |
sign of leadership. If strong leadership means down the ship -- | :56:38. | :56:43. | |
Downing Street leadership, is that the strong leadership he approves | :56:44. | :56:52. | |
of? You have said the Labour Party has two leadership battles and group | :56:53. | :56:55. | |
meetings which have had to break up in chaos and that is what is on the | :56:56. | :57:00. | |
table for the people in this country on June eight. Chaos and confusion | :57:01. | :57:05. | |
and labour or competent leadership of Theresa May. You have said | :57:06. | :57:10. | |
they're fighting with the Parliamentary groups, that fighting | :57:11. | :57:13. | |
leads to stop. This morning, anything less than victory is a | :57:14. | :57:18. | |
failure and there will be a reckoning. That is not a united | :57:19. | :57:25. | |
party. That is true of any party at any time. I will not pretend things | :57:26. | :57:29. | |
are good in Westminster. We are very united in Wales. Let's not pretend | :57:30. | :57:36. | |
the Conservative Party is wonderfully united. There are some | :57:37. | :57:40. | |
who want to go back to the days before devolution. They are the | :57:41. | :57:43. | |
people that want to see the powers come from Brussels to London and | :57:44. | :57:47. | |
never come to Wales. That is appalling as part -- as far as the | :57:48. | :57:53. | |
people of Wales are concerned. It is important that the message goes from | :57:54. | :57:56. | |
Wales to the UK Government in Westminster and Wales is not there | :57:57. | :58:01. | |
to see powers taken away. I put the questions to Carwyn Jones about | :58:02. | :58:07. | |
taxation and we have seen Andrew saying there should be no promises | :58:08. | :58:12. | |
on low tax. Carwyn Jones, 5 million of borrowing. Where does Plaid Cymru | :58:13. | :58:18. | |
come in that? We have said we are concerned about the level of cuts to | :58:19. | :58:23. | |
Welsh public services. Health service waiting lists are creaking. | :58:24. | :58:31. | |
There are investments that should go into schools. More tax? In these to | :58:32. | :58:37. | |
be fair. The issues around people being able to offshore tax in other | :58:38. | :58:42. | |
countries is a massive one. That hasn't been resolved yet and I think | :58:43. | :58:49. | |
we have had since 2008, cut after cut and so many communities have | :58:50. | :58:54. | |
lost so many precious assets and we can't allow it to continue. That is | :58:55. | :58:58. | |
why it is important that we don't give the Tories and increased | :58:59. | :59:02. | |
mandate from Wales in this election. We had to see a reduction in the | :59:03. | :59:06. | |
number of Welsh MPs or otherwise people will be giving the Tories a | :59:07. | :59:11. | |
mandate to carry on with more privatisation, to further cut and | :59:12. | :59:15. | |
take powers away from the National Assembly. Mail, where do you come in | :59:16. | :59:24. | |
on this? We have not been in an age of austerity. George Osborne | :59:25. | :59:29. | |
increased the national debt. The idea that the Tories are somehow the | :59:30. | :59:40. | |
custodians of prudence is nonsense. There have been cuts. They have been | :59:41. | :59:46. | |
reductions in spending increases and their art questions are priorities. | :59:47. | :59:54. | |
Why close libraries and parks and leisure centres and day centres? | :59:55. | :59:59. | |
Because of foreign aid. Tory austerity. The government is running | :00:00. | :00:05. | |
a deficit of 50 billion a year. The possibility that Labour could borrow | :00:06. | :00:13. | |
500 million is absurd. I want to bring in Mark Williams because we're | :00:14. | :00:17. | |
having fun in the studio. Mark, I'm sure you would have something to say | :00:18. | :00:23. | |
on this. The tax issue, you will have to look at the detail but one | :00:24. | :00:28. | |
particular concerning issue that will concern everybody is the health | :00:29. | :00:31. | |
budget and the cost of social care. Whether we have to happen English | :00:32. | :00:40. | |
context and funds come to Wales to address social care may well be a | :00:41. | :00:49. | |
reality. I have to say one thing and that is the Lib Dem policy which was | :00:50. | :00:53. | |
raising the tax threshold for those paying income tax with a significant | :00:54. | :00:56. | |
policy and I hope that will continue for the hardest working and knowing | :00:57. | :01:04. | |
-- low-income families. One of the other things mentioned was the | :01:05. | :01:08. | |
triple lock on pensions. They will go up by 2.5% every year. Should | :01:09. | :01:16. | |
that stay? We will have our manifesto commitments. We have stood | :01:17. | :01:25. | |
up for the triple lock and we will be working on the manifesto over the | :01:26. | :01:29. | |
next week and people will be able to marry about pledges with this. It is | :01:30. | :01:36. | |
an important factor. You have a Labour First Minister saying it is | :01:37. | :01:39. | |
fine to borrow an extra ?500 billion. You have the leader of | :01:40. | :01:46. | |
Plaid Cymru was saying it is good to raise taxes. You are not committing | :01:47. | :01:56. | |
to anything. We stand clearly on our record of strong leadership and | :01:57. | :02:00. | |
confidence when it comes to managing the economy. We are in turbulent | :02:01. | :02:04. | |
times but we know there are the Brexit negotiations. We know where | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
we need to continue to play down the public deficit. That is the three | :02:09. | :02:14. | |
things the lecturer will be voting on and when you compare it to the | :02:15. | :02:17. | |
chaos and confusion of Jeremy Corbyn propped up by the Liberals and Plaid | :02:18. | :02:23. | |
Cymru, I know which way the country will go. We have many years of this. | :02:24. | :02:31. | |
It never gets any better. It is austerity after austerity. If you | :02:32. | :02:36. | |
get a job, you will get more money. What do we see, the bedroom tax, in | :02:37. | :02:41. | |
what tax credits, the lowest paid sick more thermally taken in tax. It | :02:42. | :02:49. | |
is not about improving society. It is a difficult one to live with. If | :02:50. | :02:54. | |
you are advocating warren of ?500 billion, it resurrects the idea of a | :02:55. | :03:01. | |
country living beyond its means. Some people have 30 year mortgages | :03:02. | :03:04. | |
to invest in something they could have as an asset. That is what | :03:05. | :03:09. | |
governments do. This is borrowing to invest and then get better return | :03:10. | :03:13. | |
and more of your money back. It is what the government did. Your party | :03:14. | :03:19. | |
borrows money. That is exactly why you borrow. You cannot go on | :03:20. | :03:30. | |
believing money grows on trees because it doesn't. You can borrow | :03:31. | :03:33. | |
for a certain length of time and eventually your credit limit is | :03:34. | :03:38. | |
reached. That is the position Britain has reached. And George | :03:39. | :03:42. | |
Osborne com he doubled the national debt in seven years. ?750 billion. | :03:43. | :03:53. | |
215 more than this. I'm not getting a sense of what you are offering. We | :03:54. | :03:59. | |
are offering a B designation of priorities within government instead | :04:00. | :04:04. | |
of spending billions on foreign aid. It is a drop in the ocean. Not in | :04:05. | :04:09. | |
terms of the health service billion -- budget. We were meant to have | :04:10. | :04:18. | |
?350 million extra a week to stop that was promised by you and you and | :04:19. | :04:25. | |
we have not seen it. Brexit dividend will be eight to ?10 billion on top | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
of that. On top of foreign aid and many other savings, it adds up to a | :04:33. | :04:37. | |
substantial amount of money. Look after our people first, is our | :04:38. | :04:42. | |
slogan. We have to make sure we have a voice. We have had no mentions -- | :04:43. | :04:47. | |
we have had more mentions of Gibraltar than Wales and we had the | :04:48. | :04:50. | |
Tories who are signed up to those Brexit promises and are able to | :04:51. | :04:57. | |
influence the UK Government and the priorities of the Conservative | :04:58. | :05:00. | |
Party. He was going to fight for Wales? What are your proposals for | :05:01. | :05:07. | |
Brexit? We want to continue participation in the single market. | :05:08. | :05:12. | |
That is vital for many industries within Wales. What kind of | :05:13. | :05:16. | |
participation? We would like to have the same terms as we have now. We | :05:17. | :05:20. | |
are exporting so much to that single market. No control on immigration. | :05:21. | :05:27. | |
How can we control it? It would be impossible. If you want to control | :05:28. | :05:34. | |
immigration, many want to control it from outside the EU. None of that is | :05:35. | :05:38. | |
possible. Even immigration from within the EU, because there was | :05:39. | :05:44. | |
going to be a soft border within Ireland, there's good to be a | :05:45. | :05:52. | |
difficulty of the free flow of movement between the UK and what is | :05:53. | :05:58. | |
left of the UK and the existing policy. I want to hear from all of | :05:59. | :06:02. | |
you but what can you tell me that you will be offering for Wales? I | :06:03. | :06:07. | |
want to follow up. I am still looking for the guarantee on the | :06:08. | :06:12. | |
triple lock from Andrew. It was said in good faith and now the Tories are | :06:13. | :06:16. | |
trying to get rid of it. That is a disgrace and it will resonate with a | :06:17. | :06:19. | |
lot of hard pressed pensioners around the country. This is an | :06:20. | :06:24. | |
issue, an election that will be dominated by the Brexit debate and | :06:25. | :06:27. | |
sometimes we have to take this down to the human level. It is about | :06:28. | :06:31. | |
those levels of farm subsidy and those schemes that have been | :06:32. | :06:36. | |
supported in the valleys of West Wales and reminding people that it | :06:37. | :06:39. | |
would be lost. That is why it is important to have strong voices in | :06:40. | :06:42. | |
the House of Commons who will argue that case. The offer is we need to | :06:43. | :06:48. | |
remain members of the single market or at the very least, have | :06:49. | :06:52. | |
unfettered access to it. And not fall off the edge with those world | :06:53. | :06:56. | |
trip -- World Trade Organisation tariffs that are looming close to us | :06:57. | :07:01. | |
in the couple of years from now. That is a really important thing. We | :07:02. | :07:06. | |
have so clearly as a party that if these negotiations proceed, just as | :07:07. | :07:10. | |
this process started with the people and the referendum, it should end | :07:11. | :07:13. | |
with a referendum on the terms of the deal that Theresa May set out. | :07:14. | :07:19. | |
But -- will that be in a manifesto? It is not a second death -- second | :07:20. | :07:26. | |
referendum. It is a racket -- ratification referendum. We don't | :07:27. | :07:30. | |
know those terms. We don't go into this negotiation with uncertainty | :07:31. | :07:34. | |
but we are in an uncertain age. We need clarity of the terms and a vote | :07:35. | :07:36. | |
at the end. Should there be a referendum on | :07:37. | :07:47. | |
ratification? Referendum, no, ratification, yes. What we don't | :07:48. | :07:50. | |
want is a UK Parliament full of sheep with blue rosettes, who simply | :07:51. | :07:58. | |
will not challenge what is proposed. What will you be proposing, as a | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
Labour Party? I know that you proposed, as a Welsh government, you | :08:04. | :08:06. | |
can come to work here for six months as an immigration policy after | :08:07. | :08:09. | |
Brexit. This morning, Jeremy Corbyn was promising no such thing. Is he | :08:10. | :08:14. | |
ignoring you? It is a work in progress, we have been clear on what | :08:15. | :08:19. | |
we want. I am a Remain, but the result is what it was. So was | :08:20. | :08:24. | |
Theresa May, we have moved on. Leanne and myself, two parties came | :08:25. | :08:27. | |
together and put forward a sensible proposal for Brexit. It is not one | :08:28. | :08:33. | |
that has been rejected by the UK Government. Wires Jeremy Corbyn not | :08:34. | :08:37. | |
using that? This morning, you said no such thing. We know there is a | :08:38. | :08:43. | |
template, and that he is aware of it. We have to respect the result of | :08:44. | :08:47. | |
the referendum. That is gone. It is trying to interpret what people | :08:48. | :08:50. | |
actually wanted, what outcome they wanted. You have outlined why we | :08:51. | :08:57. | |
need a strong team of Plaid Cymru MPs. No matter how many Labour MPs | :08:58. | :08:59. | |
you have in Westminster, they will not fight for Welsh interests, the | :09:00. | :09:06. | |
same way that Plaid Cymru MPs will. It is only Plaid Cymru that will | :09:07. | :09:10. | |
stand up for Wales. I guess this is your opportunity, as a pro Believe | :09:11. | :09:15. | |
Conservative, you must be chomping at the bit to see those Vote Leave | :09:16. | :09:21. | |
promises in the manifesto? And they will make it to the manifesto. We | :09:22. | :09:26. | |
are mapping out what it will mean. Leanne goes on about a strong team | :09:27. | :09:31. | |
of Plaid Cymru MPs. Plaid Cymru exists to smash up the United | :09:32. | :09:34. | |
Kingdom. The biggest single market we are a member is the United | :09:35. | :09:38. | |
Kingdom. Economic, it would be devastating if we polled the United | :09:39. | :09:46. | |
Kingdom apart. That is what the election is about, strong, confident | :09:47. | :09:51. | |
leadership. That worries me, what he just said. Against the chaos and | :09:52. | :09:55. | |
confusion of Labour, Plaid Cymru and the Liberals clubbing together. That | :09:56. | :10:00. | |
would be disastrous. I don't believe the Welsh Conservatives are standing | :10:01. | :10:04. | |
for Wales, it is about centralising power in London. We think the best | :10:05. | :10:08. | |
way forward is the partnership for four nations across the UK. ALL TALK | :10:09. | :10:20. | |
AT ONCE... The viewer at home is not going to be able to pick up these | :10:21. | :10:28. | |
points. What is happening... You are responding to the point about | :10:29. | :10:32. | |
leadership, but it is a difficult one for you to raise, leadership, | :10:33. | :10:36. | |
when you have problems with Jeremy Corbyn? He has to prove himself, | :10:37. | :10:41. | |
there is no getting away from that. Will he be leader when the election | :10:42. | :10:46. | |
is over? We have to see what the result is. As leaders, we know, and | :10:47. | :10:50. | |
I am the same, with a referendum last year, if things go badly, you | :10:51. | :10:54. | |
carry the responsibility. If things go well, you take the credit. That | :10:55. | :10:58. | |
is how these things have always operated. What worries me is that if | :10:59. | :11:03. | |
we get more Conservative MPs in Wales, the Conservatives will run | :11:04. | :11:06. | |
all over Wales. We will see power taken away. The money we were | :11:07. | :11:12. | |
promised, saying that Wales would not lose a penny, it will stick to | :11:13. | :11:16. | |
summary's fingers in Whitehall. And I am sure you will be fighting to | :11:17. | :11:21. | |
make sure it comes back to Wales? Yes, I would say that every penny of | :11:22. | :11:25. | |
UK money that was spent in Brussels should come to Wales after Brexit. I | :11:26. | :11:30. | |
am against any power grab from Westminster of the powers which are | :11:31. | :11:34. | |
devolved in agriculture, environment, etc, being exercised | :11:35. | :11:37. | |
from Brussels. They should automatically come to us in Cardiff. | :11:38. | :11:42. | |
I very much hope that one of the major issues in this election will | :11:43. | :11:48. | |
be child poverty. I think the Westminster Government, the Tories, | :11:49. | :11:51. | |
in terms of welfare reforms, taking money away from the third child, | :11:52. | :11:56. | |
unless the mother can prove she was raped to conceive the child, and | :11:57. | :12:03. | |
also the Welsh government taking away Communities First funding from | :12:04. | :12:05. | |
the most deprived communities with no guarantee of anything to replace | :12:06. | :12:10. | |
it. On top of losing structural funds, it means child poverty levels | :12:11. | :12:14. | |
are likely to increase. I very much hope we can have a debate about | :12:15. | :12:17. | |
tackling child poverty in this election. We have too much in Wales | :12:18. | :12:22. | |
already. We had a great debate this afternoon. Shouldn't Theresa May | :12:23. | :12:25. | |
stand up and be counted with the other leaders in the TV debates? | :12:26. | :12:30. | |
There is a huge art of access to the Prime Minister. She will be doing | :12:31. | :12:35. | |
two and a sessions. I do want to take the First Minister to task on | :12:36. | :12:41. | |
this issue. He says the Welsh Conservatives do not stand up for | :12:42. | :12:44. | |
Wales. Over the last six years we had two Wales bills that delivered a | :12:45. | :12:48. | |
huge amount of responsibilities to the Welsh Assembly. We have the | :12:49. | :12:56. | |
referendum result, transferring lawmaking powers. The Conservatives | :12:57. | :13:00. | |
will deliver strong, decisive leadership if we are elected. We | :13:01. | :13:04. | |
take nothing for granted. And the rest of them it is chaos and | :13:05. | :13:09. | |
confusion. Chaos and confusion with Labour, Plaid and the Liberals. I am | :13:10. | :13:14. | |
seeing shaking off the head in Aberystwyth? We have the next Prime | :13:15. | :13:19. | |
Minister's Question Time on Wednesday, and then she is off the | :13:20. | :13:22. | |
hook for six weeks. She should have debates with all parties | :13:23. | :13:26. | |
represented. It is a democratic necessity. You talk about | :13:27. | :13:31. | |
leadership, you cannot be a leadership... It is time to finish | :13:32. | :13:36. | |
the programme, we have run out of time this afternoon. We will be back | :13:37. | :13:39. | |
with the latest development is at our regular time next week. Hope you | :13:40. | :13:43. | |
can join me then. If you cannot contain yourself until then, you can | :13:44. | :13:44. | |
follow all of the latest on Twitter. Diolch am wylio - | :13:45. | :13:50. | |
thanks for watching. It's time to clock in... | :13:51. | :13:56. | |
Whoooa! | :13:57. | :13:58. |