Browse content similar to 20/01/2013. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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In the West, a landlord who cannot sell his own pub. How the | :01:24. | :01:30. | |
Government's new localism act gives the community the first chance to | :01:31. | :01:40. | |
:01:41. | :01:41. | ||
Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2293 seconds | :01:41. | :39:54. | |
Thanks, Andrew. Welcome to the Sunday Politics here in a very cold | :39:54. | :39:58. | |
west country. But it's not just the weather that's in the deep freeze - | :39:58. | :40:02. | |
many people have had their pay frozen too. This man hasn't though, | :40:02. | :40:06. | |
the new mayor of Bristol finally had his salary agreed this week. It | :40:06. | :40:08. | |
raises the question, are local politicians underpaid for the | :40:08. | :40:13. | |
privilege of looking after us? With me are two guests who join me for | :40:13. | :40:17. | |
the usual BBC appearance fee on programmes like this - nothing at | :40:17. | :40:22. | |
all. They are Stephen Williams, a Liberal Democrat MP in Bristol. And | :40:22. | :40:26. | |
Justin Tomlinson MP, a Conservative from Swindon. They're in government | :40:26. | :40:30. | |
together but on the issue of Europe they don't agree about anything. | :40:30. | :40:33. | |
Stephen WIlliams says, and I quote, "the EU is the most successful | :40:33. | :40:35. | |
multilateral organisation in history and to leave would be | :40:35. | :40:45. | |
:40:45. | :40:48. | ||
madness." that is quite a controversial view these days. | :40:48. | :40:56. | |
I do not know, I think it is quite common sense. Since Britain joined | :40:56. | :41:01. | |
the European Community it has been a great success for us and for | :41:01. | :41:07. | |
Europe as well. When I got into politics we had the Warsaw Pact, | :41:07. | :41:17. | |
the Iron Curtain, the prospect of war and now no one considers the | :41:17. | :41:22. | |
possibility of Europeans fighting with each other. I would far rather | :41:22. | :41:28. | |
go to conferences than be one of those and people who are younger | :41:28. | :41:37. | |
with the prospect of going to war. The position we have with our | :41:37. | :41:45. | |
European neighbours, the vast majority want to reconsider that, | :41:45. | :41:54. | |
is that right? Absolutely. I think it would be the right thing to give | :41:54. | :42:03. | |
people an opportunity to reconsider. I am naturally Eurosceptic. We have | :42:03. | :42:10. | |
got to do what is best for this country. We must recognise | :42:10. | :42:15. | |
fundamental change in the way that Europe works, the UK works and the | :42:15. | :42:20. | |
world economy works. The owner of a village pub in Somerset claims he's | :42:20. | :42:23. | |
lost thousands of pounds because he's not allowed to sell his own | :42:23. | :42:28. | |
property. It's because the government introduced a new law, | :42:28. | :42:30. | |
The Localism Act, which insists that local people should have the | :42:30. | :42:34. | |
first option to buy community buildings. Danie Linsell reports. | :42:34. | :42:38. | |
This is the kind of thing the Localism Act was hoping to save. | :42:38. | :42:42. | |
The old hospital in Minehead closed down in 2011 but two years on, a | :42:42. | :42:45. | |
group of residents have applied to give the building Community Asset | :42:45. | :42:55. | |
:42:55. | :42:56. | ||
status, to stop it from being grabbed by greedy developers. | :42:56. | :43:01. | |
concern has always been that it will be turned into flats. The | :43:01. | :43:07. | |
community really does not want that. It is a fantastic asset for the | :43:07. | :43:13. | |
local community. It is right in the heart of the town here, it creates | :43:13. | :43:23. | |
:43:23. | :43:26. | ||
a perfect community pub. -- hub. They're hoping to turn it into a | :43:26. | :43:29. | |
cultural centre for the town. And are asking for pledges of support | :43:29. | :43:32. | |
and money from locals. Listing it as a community asset means they've | :43:32. | :43:42. | |
:43:42. | :43:43. | ||
now bought themselves some time to try and buy the building. It is a | :43:43. | :43:48. | |
triumph for democracy of a bureaucracy. Well, people in | :43:48. | :43:50. | |
Minehead might agree with local Government Secretary Eric Pickles, | :43:50. | :43:53. | |
but they certainly don't a couple of miles down the road in | :43:53. | :43:56. | |
Monksilver. The local pub has been shut ever since a community group | :43:56. | :44:00. | |
tried to keep it open. The pub here in the village closed its doors | :44:00. | :44:03. | |
last September and it was put up for sale. But local people were | :44:03. | :44:07. | |
worried that they might lose it for good, so they decided to take Mr | :44:07. | :44:10. | |
Pickles up on his offer, and nominate the pub as a Community | :44:10. | :44:19. | |
Asset. The only problem is, the owner wasn't told. I had absolutely | :44:19. | :44:26. | |
no idea this was happening. I had never heard of this legislation. I | :44:26. | :44:30. | |
was dumbfounded. The more I found out about it I was absolutely | :44:30. | :44:36. | |
appalled. In my view this is very bad legislation and I cannot | :44:36. | :44:42. | |
understand why it has come about with a Conservative Government. | :44:42. | :44:45. | |
Under the Localism Act, groups can nominate things like shops or pubs | :44:45. | :44:48. | |
as Community Assets. If the local council approves it, the building | :44:48. | :44:51. | |
cannot be sold on the open market, unless the community has had the | :44:51. | :44:54. | |
chance to buy it first - and they've got six months to come up | :44:54. | :44:58. | |
with the money. The Notley Arms had barely been on the market before it | :44:58. | :45:01. | |
was approved as a Community Asset, giving locals first refusal and | :45:01. | :45:10. | |
stopping any other sales in their tracks. The net result was that we | :45:10. | :45:15. | |
had not one but two purchasers ringing and ringing to purchase. It | :45:15. | :45:20. | |
would have been open, up and running, if it had not been for | :45:20. | :45:25. | |
this ridiculous new legislation. And while the six months provides a | :45:25. | :45:28. | |
welcome buffer zone for the group in Minehead, others are picking up | :45:28. | :45:32. | |
the tab for this new legislation - forced to pay business rates on an | :45:32. | :45:34. | |
empty property they're not allowed to sell. Despite challenging the | :45:34. | :45:37. | |
Community Asset on his pub, West Somerset ruled against Mr Wilkins. | :45:37. | :45:42. | |
But he's adamant. The confrontation with the council may now end up in | :45:42. | :45:47. | |
the courts. So is the Localism Act not what people had hoped for? | :45:47. | :45:50. | |
Joining us in the studio is Darren Jones, who's Labour's chosen | :45:50. | :45:55. | |
candidate for the parliamentary seat of Bristol North West. And | :45:55. | :45:57. | |
beside him, Professor Robin Hambleton, an expert in local | :45:57. | :46:07. | |
:46:07. | :46:14. | ||
government from the University of the West of England. A Conservative | :46:14. | :46:16. | |
Government or conservative in coalition Government passes along | :46:16. | :46:23. | |
that stops at six since selling his property, how does that work? | :46:23. | :46:27. | |
a member of the Save the pub groups will I understand this issue very | :46:27. | :46:37. | |
:46:37. | :46:38. | ||
well. Often a community Cup is the last standing community facility. | :46:38. | :46:43. | |
It is frustrating for the business but that six months allows the | :46:43. | :46:52. | |
community to organise themselves, raise the profile for a sustainable | :46:52. | :46:59. | |
Asset. Here you are telling an honest citizen who he can sell his | :46:59. | :47:06. | |
property to. Six months is not an unreasonable amount of time. But he | :47:06. | :47:13. | |
is still having to pay business rates and he has lost a buyer. | :47:13. | :47:18. | |
know communities where this is the very last facility and once it is | :47:18. | :47:26. | |
gone, it is gone forever. I think there were very good intentions. In | :47:26. | :47:33. | |
this case there may have been poor administrations. It is not just a | :47:33. | :47:41. | |
rural issue, it could be an urban issue as well. There was a similar | :47:41. | :47:46. | |
situation in Bristol where the owners wanted to sell a pub that | :47:46. | :47:51. | |
was more valuable for flats and houses. That is what it is designed | :47:51. | :48:01. | |
:48:01. | :48:04. | ||
to combat, to make sure a community as it is not sold for private use. | :48:04. | :48:09. | |
I think the intentions are good but there are 200 on sections in the | :48:09. | :48:14. | |
act. There is not significant devolution of power flowing from | :48:14. | :48:20. | |
the legislation. We have had a creeping process of centralisation | :48:20. | :48:30. | |
:48:30. | :48:30. | ||
and the desire inadequate process of reversal. Did you notice it was | :48:30. | :48:40. | |
all top-down from Government? said we were committed to localism. | :48:40. | :48:47. | |
Let us be clear about this Act. It is an example of the Government | :48:47. | :48:55. | |
saying one thing and doing another. That is a bit rich coming from | :48:55. | :49:03. | |
Labour. When hospital managers had a question and answer session under | :49:03. | :49:09. | |
Labour the had to ring the Health Secretary. Ed Miliband is talking | :49:09. | :49:13. | |
about a one-nation Labour and what that means for the future of our | :49:13. | :49:18. | |
country. We need to work together to find sensible solutions and make | :49:18. | :49:25. | |
these things work for local people. His localism ever going to work? | :49:25. | :49:33. | |
The Government says it wants more houses but most people have found a | :49:33. | :49:41. | |
fundamental clash between what is happening on their own doorstep and | :49:41. | :49:47. | |
the bigger picture. We are out of line in the UK. We have centralised | :49:47. | :49:52. | |
power in the way that other countries have not. We need a | :49:52. | :49:58. | |
significant reversal. It is helpful that Michael Heseltine in his | :49:58. | :50:03. | |
report, no stone unturned, was looking for ideas for economic | :50:03. | :50:11. | |
growth. He proposed transfer in �12 billion of spending from Whitehall | :50:11. | :50:15. | |
to the local level. That would really be localism but we have not | :50:15. | :50:24. | |
heard too much response to his ideas. M Bristol City v New near | :50:24. | :50:32. | |
now has more control over his budgets. -- in Bristol City v New | :50:32. | :50:40. | |
Mayor now has more control over his budgets. We are committed to | :50:40. | :50:45. | |
localism and have made a very good start but there is still a long way | :50:45. | :50:53. | |
to go. Eric Pickles over wrote the views of local councils when it | :50:53. | :50:59. | |
comes to housing. I was told us a councillor we had to find �36,000 | :50:59. | :51:04. | |
within 10 years which was staggering. We now say that local | :51:04. | :51:09. | |
communities can set their own numbers and if they can agree on | :51:09. | :51:17. | |
that they can afford it. What you have to do if you are going to | :51:17. | :51:23. | |
decentralise is allowed those sorts of things to go on. Councils would | :51:23. | :51:27. | |
be financially rewarded if they went out to build houses and could | :51:27. | :51:35. | |
then spend that money however they wanted. In Bristol the mayor has a | :51:35. | :51:42. | |
little bit more leeway but this is about centralisation of power and | :51:42. | :51:50. | |
decentralisation of responsibility. The Government are saying go and | :51:50. | :51:59. | |
talk to a local commissioning group, but it is the Government to have | :51:59. | :52:09. | |
:52:09. | :52:09. | ||
centralisation of power. I think parties have failed to realise the | :52:09. | :52:17. | |
way power has become centralised. It is a really radical shift. In | :52:17. | :52:24. | |
Sweden 80% of citizens only pay taxes to local Government. Here it | :52:24. | :52:30. | |
is nothing like that. Thank you very much indeed for coming in. The | :52:30. | :52:33. | |
new mayor of Bristol, George Ferguson, is promising to give away | :52:33. | :52:35. | |
�12,000 of his salary, that's �1,000 a month. It follows the | :52:35. | :52:39. | |
decision by the council to pay him �65,000 a year, about the same as | :52:39. | :52:42. | |
an MP. The trouble is, many people expect politicians and councillors | :52:42. | :52:47. | |
to work on our behalf for next to nothing. Here's Paul Barltrop. | :52:47. | :52:57. | |
:52:57. | :52:59. | ||
Bristol's new mayor is adamant, he's not in it for the money. | :52:59. | :53:06. | |
would say I am going to read the chamber until a decision is made. | :53:06. | :53:09. | |
He stepped out as councillors made him the West's second highest paid | :53:09. | :53:19. | |
:53:19. | :53:21. | ||
local politician, earning �65,000. With a salary like that there will | :53:22. | :53:27. | |
probably never be a shortage of people wanting to be mayor but | :53:27. | :53:33. | |
council chambers are often dominated by older people. The most | :53:33. | :53:35. | |
recent census found the South West had England's oldest councilors. | :53:35. | :53:38. | |
Nearly a quarter were over 70. Most are retired. Only 16% have full- | :53:39. | :53:42. | |
time jobs. Allowances vary enormously. At the upper end are | :53:42. | :53:45. | |
big unitary authorities. Wiltshire and Bristol pay councillors just | :53:45. | :53:50. | |
over �11,000. At the bottom end are small district councils. Cotswold | :53:50. | :53:58. | |
pays 4,000. While in West Somerset, it's just �2,700. So it's unusual | :53:59. | :54:02. | |
to find someone like Simon Killane. The Wiltshire councillor has both a | :54:02. | :54:12. | |
:54:12. | :54:12. | ||
demanding job and young children. It is extremely difficult for me to | :54:13. | :54:17. | |
do what I do with the council. The system has really no place for | :54:17. | :54:26. | |
those people, middle to low income with children and nine to five jobs. | :54:26. | :54:29. | |
To get to numerous daytime meetings he uses up annual leave. He admits | :54:29. | :54:37. | |
his career loses out, as do his wife and kids. It has an effect on | :54:37. | :54:42. | |
your family because when you are passionate and you push and push | :54:42. | :54:48. | |
you have a situation where you have no time to spend with your family. | :54:48. | :54:53. | |
I was home for five minutes last night, just time to grab a shirt | :54:53. | :54:58. | |
and get out again like I came in. The challenges of being a | :54:58. | :55:00. | |
councillor were investigated by a committee of MPs. To attract | :55:01. | :55:03. | |
younger people they suggested changes that could push up pay | :55:03. | :55:11. | |
levels. Out canvassing is another atypical councillor. It is very | :55:11. | :55:16. | |
difficult for councillors to take a boat on raising their own pay and | :55:16. | :55:21. | |
conditions. There are alternatives. Joe Harris is just 19. Things like | :55:21. | :55:24. | |
career and kids lie in the future. He doesn't complain about | :55:24. | :55:33. | |
Cotswold's lowly allowance or the variable workload. It is a big | :55:33. | :55:41. | |
commitment and you are told about that when you get elected. They say | :55:41. | :55:51. | |
:55:51. | :55:54. | ||
you can put as much into it as you want. I to cooked in a good amount, | :55:54. | :55:58. | |
three days in the amount of hours by comparison. I think that pays | :55:58. | :56:02. | |
off. In November Joe Harris helped tackle the floods in Cirencester. | :56:02. | :56:05. | |
He and many others are busy this weekend dealing with the cold snap. | :56:05. | :56:08. | |
There are times, say councillors, when their money really doesn't | :56:08. | :56:18. | |
:56:18. | :56:21. | ||
matter. Money going to the victims of the cups, what does this amount | :56:21. | :56:31. | |
:56:31. | :56:33. | ||
of money say about our politicians? -- cuts. I do not think the money | :56:33. | :56:39. | |
is the problem, it is the timings of the council meetings. The guy in | :56:39. | :56:43. | |
the video of news that Wiltshire council with the daytime meetings | :56:43. | :56:49. | |
is having to use up all his holiday town to attend these meetings, I | :56:49. | :56:57. | |
think that is where the have to have a look. If you peer a big | :56:57. | :57:07. | |
:57:07. | :57:07. | ||
salary would you get a better calibre of person? Most places do | :57:07. | :57:14. | |
not have executive responsibility for running the city. What really | :57:14. | :57:22. | |
matters is what time the meetings are held. If you want people who | :57:22. | :57:25. | |
are a cross section of population you have to make sure it is a time | :57:25. | :57:32. | |
when people can attend who are of working age. I simply could not | :57:32. | :57:38. | |
continue taking time off from work when I was in that position. Let us | :57:38. | :57:43. | |
be sensible about it. If we want people going to meetings and | :57:43. | :57:49. | |
attending to their duties, working with local people during the | :57:49. | :57:55. | |
working day, they have to be remunerated for it. People go to | :57:55. | :57:59. | |
work to pay for things and if we need them to do stuff we need to | :57:59. | :58:06. | |
renew many them sensibly otherwise you end up with a large percentage | :58:06. | :58:14. | |
of retired people who have the time to do it. Have you got something | :58:14. | :58:24. | |
:58:24. | :58:24. | ||
against the over 70s? Absolutely not, the maker tremendous community | :58:24. | :58:30. | |
-- a tremendous contribution to but to get other people with a | :58:30. | :58:39. | |
different understanding. I think it is about the relevance of the | :58:39. | :58:45. | |
meetings, the time of the meetings. If you can make the council | :58:45. | :58:51. | |
meetings talk about matters that matter at to a cross section, money | :58:51. | :58:59. | |
is so relevant. Some wanted an increase of �20,000. In true | :58:59. | :59:02. | |
coalition spirit neither of us participated in that and I think | :59:02. | :59:10. | |
sensibly so. Isn't it because you are worth it? I find it a rewarding | :59:10. | :59:20. | |
:59:20. | :59:25. | ||
job anyway. Thank you for joining us. It's time now to take a look at | :59:25. | :59:30. | |
the political stories of the week in our 60 second roundup. Bristol | :59:30. | :59:33. | |
councillors got a big cheer from football fans on Wednesday as they | :59:33. | :59:38. | |
approved plans which should mean Rovers getting a new stadium. But | :59:38. | :59:41. | |
the news that Sainsbury's will build on their old site hasn't been | :59:41. | :59:45. | |
so well received by nearby traders. But there was all-round | :59:45. | :59:49. | |
condemnation of an online comment by South West MEP Graham Watson. | :59:50. | :59:53. | |
His tweet: Al-Qaeda 1, David Cameron 0, was called sick and | :59:53. | :59:55. | |
offensive by party leader Nick Clegg. He quickly apologised and | :59:55. | :00:01. | |
deleted the tweet. Calmer conditions for Stroud MP Neil | :00:01. | :00:06. | |
Carmichael who's just been to the Antarctic. Days later he talked in | :00:06. | :00:09. | |
Parliament about the visit as he led a debate on his private members | :00:09. | :00:12. | |
bill to boost protection for the continent. And a former health | :00:12. | :00:14. | |
minister is proposing that owners of hospitals like Winterborne View | :00:14. | :00:19. | |
should be liable for prosecution where things go wrong. Paul Burstow | :00:19. | :00:29. | |
:00:29. | :00:34. | ||
has introduced a bill. This new law would act as a deterrent forcing | :00:34. | :00:41. | |
week providers to pull their socks up. That was a rather cold week | :00:41. | :00:49. | |
that has gone by and let's pick up on one of those stories. The MP to | :00:49. | :00:59. | |
:00:59. | :01:00. | ||
tweeted about Alcan leader one, David Cameron 0. How daft is that? | :01:00. | :01:06. | |
I was coming back from London on the train when I saw it on my eye | :01:06. | :01:14. | |
pad and I hope it was not Graham. He realised it was a big mistake | :01:14. | :01:24. | |
:01:24. | :01:24. | ||
and what realised -- what he did when he realised was to apologise. | :01:24. | :01:28. | |
Treating is the equivalent of broadcasting and that is the | :01:29. | :01:38. | |
:01:39. | :01:40. | ||
equivalent of seeing it on this programme. It was daft and he | :01:40. | :01:46. | |
apologised. I am surprised politicians allow other people to | :01:46. | :01:50. | |
post on their behalf on their accounts. Twitter can be helpful | :01:50. | :01:59. | |
but it can also cause other problems. I do the do It | :01:59. | :02:04. | |
considering the mind feels that are dear? I held out for ages hoping it | :02:04. | :02:11. | |
would go away. It is interesting to see what other politicians are up- | :02:11. | :02:15. | |
to- and any opportunity to keep in touch you welcome. You have not to | :02:15. | :02:20. | |
get too obsessed with social media and forget to go out and talk to | :02:20. | :02:27. | |
people. OK, that is where we have to leave it. That is it from us in | :02:27. | :02:32. | |
the West for it this week now we can return to London and Andrew | :02:33. | :02:41. | |
Neil. You can e-mail us if you have anything to comment on. You can | :02:41. | :02:51. | |
:02:51. | :03:02. |