11/05/2014 The Andrew Marr Show

Good morning. Euro-election fever is upon us. Picture of the week must be

the selfie captured in a Nandos when one diner spotted that the Prime

Minister had popped in for a chicken peri-peri. She looks stunned. Not as

stunned as the chicken, obviously. And joining me today for our review

of the Sunday newspapers, the renowned foreign correspondent

Christiane Amanpour who anchors a nightly programme on CNN. And the

Times columnist David Aaronovitch. All the politicians are at it of

course, giving interviews on trains, molesting innocent market stall

keepers, nibbling babies. Following our interview with Msrs Edward

Miliband and Nigel Farage last Sunday, the leader of the

Conservative Party will be joining us live in the studio this morning.

Just ten days to voting, can David Cameron transform our unhappy

relationship with the European Union? Will he advise us to leave if

he fails? And what about all those jobs at stake at AstraZenica as the

American drug giant Pfizer circles them? Talking of jobs at stake, what

about Barclays Bank? Barclays chief executive Antony Jenkins announced

plans to slash thousands of of jobs in Britain this week. And, unusually

for senior bankers, he's agreed to come on television this morning.

Joining us from the arts world, Johnathan Kent and Imelda Staunton,

an actress described as as filling a cracking lead role to perfection for

her current West End appearance. It's a play about class and poverty

and it really is funny. With music from the wonderful Sir James Galway

and his wife right here in the studio I hope you'll enjoy the hour

ahead. First, as usual, to the news desk and Katherine Downes. Thank

you, Andrew. Good morning. British forces have pulled out of their last

outpost in Helmand province. It means Camp Bastion is the only

remaining base for UK forces, ahead of the full withdrawal later his

year. The Defence Secretary Philip Hammond has been visiting the

troops, and the BBC Afghanistan correspondent David Loyn was the

only TV journalist with him. For the last time, a US helicopter lands on

the rough Helmand province landscape carrying a British Defence

Secretary. Philip Hammond came to see troops who had been sleeping in

the open Sundays now with only bottled water to wash in the open

Sundays now with only bottled water to washing. Since all the buildings

intense been taken away. Given the high loss of life, and the dubious

success of this operation, it's still a source of most of the

world's a legal heroin. With a public support in future conflicts?

I sense there is a touch of wall wariness but the British people are

clear we came into Afghanistan to protect our own national interests

first and foremost. And part of protecting that has been helping to

build a credible Afghan state for the future. Having stability in this

part of the world is very much in Britain's national interest. Troops

been leaving by helicopter and by road everyday. Until this is just a

bare hill again. Britain's Long engagement in Helmand is drawing to

an end. The closure of this last base leaves only camp Bastian as

Britain's base in Helmand and within a few months, that will also close.

A row has broken out within the coalition over the funding of school

places. Lib Dem sources claim 30,000 school places are being lost as

money is diverted instead to free schools. They have accused the

Education Secretary, Michael Gove, of lunacy. His office disputes the

claim and calls the attack on Mr Gove pathetic. Voting is under way

in eastern Ukraine, in a referendum on independence for the Donetsk

region. The referendum has gone ahead despite calls earlier in the

week from Russia's President Putin for it to be postponed. The

Ukrainian government and the international community have said

the vote is illegal. The number of billionaires living in Britain has

risen to more than a hundred for the first time, according to the Sunday

Times Rich List. At the top are the Indian-born Hinduja brothers, with a

combined wealth of ?11.9 billion. 104 billionaires are now based in

the UK. Three times the number resident here a decade ago.

Austria's bearded drag Queen, Conchita Wurst, has won the

Eurovision Song Contest, with her ballad, Rise Like A Phoenix. Russian

politicians had described the act as perverse and corrupt. The audience

in Copenhagen booed and jeered when it was Russia's turn to vote. There

was disappointment for the UK's Molly Smitten-Downs, who came 17th.

Sophie van Brugen reports. # Rise like a Phoenix. It was her night,

favourite of the like a Phoenix. It was her night,

bookmakers, she rose like a Phoenix to be declared in the clear winner

of Eurovision. With 290 points. Austria, 12 points. She had a clear

message. This night is dedicated to everyone who believes in a future of

peace and freedom. CHEERING

You know who you are. We are unity and we are unstoppable. Politics

inevitably covers both the voting and the performances and this year,

it was between Russia and Ukraine. There were audible booing amongst

the audience whenever Russia were awarded points.

the audience whenever Russia were AUDIENCE BOOS

the audience whenever Russia were The competition is over for another

year and no doubt Austria are already making plans as to how they

want to host the competition for its 60th anniversary. That's all from

me, for now. I'll be back with the headlines just before ten o'clock.

Back to you, Andrew. Many thanks. Conchita Wurst, these

are made up names, surely? Now to the papers. There is one big

political story running which is the fight between Michael Gove and his

Liberal Democrat rivals, allies, colleagues, whatever you call them,

in the government, but the government, over shifting funds

around. The Independent has a great front page here. There he is looking

very zealous and slightly frightening. Interesting that zealot

is now an equivocal term of abuse. The Sunday Telegraph has the other

poetical story here. David Cameron tells Eurosceptics, trust me, I get

it. We will be talking about later on. The Sunday Times is leading the

super-rich story we heard about earlier on. This extraordinary story

on the front of the mail on Sunday. The BBC sacking a disc jockey for

playing the sun has got his hat on in the original version which has an

offensive word. We would talk about that later with Christiane Amanpour

and David Aaronovitch. Thank you for joining us. We will start off with a

David Cameron story. The Sunday Telegraph has an article by him and

the front page, trust me, I get it. I think it's an extremely bad sign

when anybody is either asked to get it or say they get it. It is the end

they are required to get which is wrong usually but nevertheless, you

want to reassure people. He has written this article because the

postal ballots are just about to come through letter boxes. And his

phrases, with those readers whose fingers are hovering over the

Conservative box, so this is what he is offering them, the idea that he

alone, of course, will give them a referendum and he will get great

changes inside Europe, deliver that to them, and therefore they should

go for him. And a previous article on the Sunday express can we now

know what is the man express can we now know what his demands are going

to be, roughly speaking. Well, very roughly speaking. The one thing we

do know is whatever he gets, he will attempt, if he is in power, and

there was a referendum in 2017, he will say his demands are being met

because he knows it will be a disaster for Britain to pull out of

the EU in 2017, so whatever happens, he will be trying to convince you

now that his demands can be met, and he will convince in 2017 they have

been met because he will want a Yes Vote. The big problem is, large

section of that conservatives are determined his demands will be met

and they want a No Vote. Lots of fun to come, as we say. You have chosen

the biggest international story at the moment, Boko Haram and the

terrible abduction of these girls in Nigeria. Yes, it's a massive story

obviously and for the right reasons. It's not just girls have

been kidnapped and taken away. And as a vendor speed of Boko Haram

who've gone on the air swaggering and laughing about having taken them

and threatening to sell them. First of all, it's a massive human

trafficking story. A massive story which has touched the whole world.

We have the first Lady of USA who was joined the campaign. Britain,

United States, France, , helping Nigeria with intelligence, hostage

to go shooting expertise and maybe some military help. To try to fix

this terrible thing which has gone wrong. On the one hand, a campaign

like this is great because it mobilises people on the other hand,

I'm a tiny bit concerned it's a bubble which collapses with nothing

being done. The Internet has huge power but a short attention span.

Yes, we will find it on our programme on CNN that Nigeria is

100% saturated with social media, with such problems with electricity,

being able to watch the news, they are all on social media, so this is

getting to the people in Nigeria. The fact is, we have been reporting

on these terrible disappearances for years and years and years. OK, now

it's getting a lot of coverage and hopefully something will be done

about it. Absolutely thought of to domestic politics, David, have

chosen Michael Gove. That's a very scary photograph of Michael Gove and

those of us who know him have not often team that face made, except in

jest. I don't find the actual story of the day version of money so very

surprising. It's not a huge amount of money in education budget and is

not clear from context how many people will won't miss out as a

consequence of it. I'm not diminishing it, but the importance

of it in political terms of fact there is a row with Lib Dems who

unnamed sources are prepared to absolutely put the boot into their

coalition partners, which means it'll be put in the other way round.

It feels as if it's coming from the top, around the Deputy Prime

Minister? It's hard to judge but essentially the languages of

extremely senior cabinet based Liberal Democrat sources. Of course,

we have almost one year to go to the election. There will be distancing

going on but it is a reminder and actually, in the Observer, they

sternly in their leader, this is squabbling, unsightly squabbling,

between the two coalition partners. And both will get it in the neck

from the electorate if, by the time of the next election, if they have

both been seen to knock each other for strictly electoral reasons. I'm

ruthlessly using you to Julie international stories this morning

and you have chosen Ukraine which gets nasty by the minute. There's a

referendum in parts of eastern Ukraine which is going on this

morning. Apparently, even define that Putin, although who knows what

it means when he asked them to postpone it. This is a massively

difficult problem for Ukraine and for the West to deal with in that

part of the world, which has decided it wants to be independent and

govern its own realities, but Russia is interfering so incredibly

heavily. We saw this weekend, at the end of the week, Vladimir Putin in

Crimea celebrating victory. We don't know what his next move is. I

interviewed a commanding general of NATO said that they are trying to

landlocked Ukraine, and the USA feels they're trying to do that as

well and that would be very, very dangerous. What will that mean?

Putting a barrier all the way round to death, and putting so much

pressure on this country. People have now decided that I know what's

in Peebles had done may not be invading it but to try to force it

with the reality on Ukraine which matches what Vladimir Putin once. --

Odessa. They will want maximum matches what Vladimir Putin once. --

autonomy which flies in the face of the West and the Kiev authorities.

One of the other papers is an interesting report from the pro-Kiev

paramilitaries. There's no huge paramilitary unit on both sides

fighting each other and the power war going on in the east, out of

control from Moscow, I suspect. It is. The Kiev authorities spent a lot

of time sitting on their hands and not provoking Vladimir Putin. They

try to establish a central control but didn't want to give them an

excuse to invade. There have been deaths, as you mentioned, and that

it Putin has not moved in to save the poor bully good people of

eastern Ukraine but what's really important for your viewers, eating

kippers and mash, but... I love tapas but they do repeat. Anyway,

these polls which are being conducted show overwhelmingly that

75% of the Ukrainian people want to remain part of the United Ukraine,

but also in the East, also among the pro-Russian speakers, 58%, a

majority in anybody's mathematics, want to stay part of Ukraine so

Vladimir Putin is really barking up the wrong tree in my view. He must

be worried that these forces, because they're out of control,

could themselves conduct their own massacre and he would get the blame.

And how about Vladimir Putin suddenly seeing on his border, an

Afghan style civil war like they had when they went into Afghanistan? It

could bring him down. You did talk about Afghanistan and we both think

one of the great things which just happened in Afghanistan was a

successful election in which people defied these terrible Boko Haram

style Taliban. These are the same people who terrified girls and

normal people and yet women and men came out and voted in a democratic

election. They came out and they didn't get hanged. Let's turn to a

slightly less important story, didn't get hanged. Let's turn to a

very strange one, the BBC has sacked a Devon DJ.

They have sacked him, or rather he played this song, The Sun Has Got

His Hat On, which somewhere contains the 'N' word. The Jeremy Clarkson

word. Somebody played it, he issued an apology, but strangely she said,

I can offer an apology or I will fall on my sword if you want. The

BBC could have said, you didn't realise it was there, that is fine.

They said, that is a good idea, fall on your sword. Never say to a BBC

manager that you will fall on your sword if they want you to because

you never know what they will say. David Cameron is on the front page

of one of these newspapers urging a female head of the BBC, not a moment

too soon. The BBC Trust, we should say. The BBC Trust, OK. We cannot

make any racist comments or anti-Semitic comments, but this

seemed... A natural mistake. In the Sunday Times, France says it

confronts racism with a giggle and they are talking about a film where

these bourgeois French families wanted their children to marry well

within their same class and they all bring back the north African, a

Jewish entrepreneur, and Asian businessman. It seems to have struck

a chord with a lot of people in France. David, you are next. My last

story constitutes the single worst piece of advice given to the Prime

Minister this year, it is in the Sunday express. He will win

thousands of millions of votes if he promises to bring back fox hunting

because he will win back those UKIP supporters. I think most of those

supporters are motivated by immigration. Nevertheless, there it

is on the front page. You won't have time, maybe we can ask him

afterwards. It is very popular in central London. You can hear the

Tally Ho. They are talking about Prince Charles and these bills about

trying to take away that little power that he has and there is a

play on at Islington which is all about this. It is a brilliant

production and I thought, life imitating art. There are a lot of

good players we will be talking about, another one later in the

programme. Was that another good Segway? It was!

We had some pretty lively weather yesterday with the wind hurling rain

at us. Let's find out what's in store for the rest of the weekend

with Chris Fawkes in the weather studio.

For the time being, it is a cloudy start with outbreaks of rain but

there will be slow improvements in the weather. Fairly gradually we

will see some brighter spells working in. There will be some heavy

showers later this afternoon, probably the heaviest of them

forming across parts of England, maybe the north Midlands with some

slow-moving thunderstorms here. There will be gusts of wind up to 40

mph, with temperatures degree also down on yesterday. Overnight those

brisk winds continue, staying cloudy with further showers on and off

through the course of the night. It will be fairly mild, between seven

and nine Celsius. It will be a breezy start of the day with showers

from the word go, some of those could turn heavier into

thunderstorms. The temperature is recovering to a degree, looking at

highs of 17 Celsius and that improvement in the weather will

continue in the week ahead. High pressure will build from mid week

onwards, with temperatures climbing into the low 20s for some from

Wednesday and Thursday onwards. I will hold you to that.

The Great Recession may be over, but the long unwinding of all the

problems in the banking industry, which caused the financial crisis,

goes on. The boss of Barclays has just announced a major re-think of

the bank's future. So, is this the death knell for casino banking in

this country? And should we all applaud its demise, or be a little

worried? I'm joined now by the Barclays chief executive, Antony

Jenkins. Good morning. Congratulations for coming in and

having this conversation, most of your colleagues won't do it.

Thousands of jobs around the world and in Britain going from the

so-called casino banking, are you getting out of this business

entirely? Lots of things investment banks do are very important to

economies. Companies need to raise money, we need people to protect our

investments and so on. This is about focusing Barclays on what really

matters but it is also about saving the world of investment banking is

changing dramatically. The amount of capital we hold means it doesn't

make any sense to do that any more so this is a change in focus. There

was a time when the banks were jostling against JP Morgan and

Goldman Sachs and so forth. It does seem that has been a British retreat

from that kind of game. The world of investment banking has changed

greatly and we need to focus on the part of the business where we can

make of difference. Size itself is not the objective. Having an

investment bank that works is. You have got a lot of criticism after

the shareholders meeting, about a third of them voted against the

board on salary and enumeration, and particularly the pay-outs going to

investment bankers. I think they rose by 10% which seems like the bad

old days again. We knew that these very significant changes were coming

and we wanted to protect the parts of the investment bank that are part

of the future. It was a one-time thing, we will not be repeating the

situation in which profits are down and the bonus pool goes up. We were

told these million pound plus bonuses were stopping and yet it is

still here, what would you say to people who say that this is insane,

securely when the bank is going down in terms of profits? I can

understand the concern, but the truth of the matter is that if we

want to be in that business, and it is important for Britain, we need to

be competitive. Are they so good that they can command the salaries?

They can, and the way we are focusing the bank going forwards

means we will get value for money. Can I turn to so-called high street

banks, you have said there will be branch closures, can you give us a

sense of the scale of that? This is driven by what customers want to do

and we are in the middle of the technology change in banking because

we all do things online and we want to do things at our convenience.

This means the nature of retail banking is changing fundamentally.

There will still be hundreds of branches and tens of thousands of

people employed within them, but as customers do business differently we

have to respond. We don't have a target for branch closures, in fact

we are opening branches in supermarkets and other locations so

it is really about how we can deliver the services customers want.

On Friday this week, customers paid a check in to the bank using their

mobile. An awful lot of your employees are worried about their

futures, when will they learn? We have no scale so our colleagues in

the branch network have nothing to have no scale so our colleagues in

what they are doing. have no scale so our colleagues in

ahead, do you think our high streets will have lots of banks on them, or

it will be all call centres and mobile phones? I think a lot of

business will be done on mobile phones but probably less in call

centres. If you take a ten year horizon there will probably be fewer

bank branches but there will still be the need for people to go in and

talk about products. You said to me these guys being paid these huge

bonuses are worth it, but bankers will

bonuses are worth it, but bankers guys for as long as this goes on

which is a big problem for the industry, isn't it? It is, and just

collapsed after the crisis and it is our job to build that back. That is

what we are committed to doing at Barclays. Thank you for joining us

this morning. Imelda Staunton's career covers an

enviable list of Blockbuster movies, an Oscar

nomination, Olivier awards galore. In recent years, her stage success

has been shared with the director Jonathan Kent. He directed her in a

rave revival of Sweeney Todd and they're now reunited for a funny but

gritty American play which has just transferred to London's West End.

"Good People" is set in Boston. Staunton plays an out-of-work mother

whose desperation to survive in a grim economy gives rise to some

spiky and uneasy scenes. I'm going to be talking to both Imelda and

Jonathan in a moment, but first here's a glimpse of Good People. You

worked hard, you're right, you escaped, I didn't. You had a little

help but you did it. What does that mean? You were luckier than most

people, you were smart and you had a dad that pushed you, I wouldn't be

complaining. I'm just saying we struggled, life wasn't easy. For

most people I know, that's just how it is. We are seeing a whole series

of plays from the Americans at the moment about survival, people

falling off the edge, why do you think it is the Americans are so

good at this and we are doing less? We have done a lot of it in the past

I think, we have done in class, we are riddled with it but it is a

fairly new thing for them. There seems to be a new energy and

American theatre and dealing with what were English preoccupations,

class, race and the limits of opportunity. This is south Boston

and eukaryote south Boston accent perfectly through the play. You came

from an Irish background, I wonder whether there was a crossover

between your understanding of the world growing up, and this play.

Absolutely working class, but my family and my family friends, all

Irish in the 1950s, they could all get a job but the difference with

these people is that they cannot get a job. The politicians say that

everyone can get a job, if you work hard enough you can get to where you

want to be but it is not true now. Is it that you are making bad

choices and failures, or is it luck that some people get out? There is

this ghastly doctor that has made it out and you say it is just luck.

What about yourself, is it great and hard work that has brought you to

the top? It will be both for me and I think I was lucky in the fact that

my mother was a hairdresser, she wanted me to go to a great school so

I went to a little private convent because she wanted me to do better.

She wanted me to get out or get up whatever. Jonathan, you have worked

with Imelda on Sweeney Todd, how differently do you approach a play

like this? It is a small set, very fast-moving totally different. In

it's about telling a story and in truth, and that's what is great

about working with Imelda. It is the pursuit of the truth of the

character. Who picked to? Did you think I want to work with Imelda

Staunton or did you think I want to work with Johnathan Kent? I don't

work with her all the time. Nonetheless, you would be a fool not

to want to work with Christiane Amanpour. We did Sweeney Todd and we

got lucky. We are going to do something at the end of the year. We

had a gap, and we thought, if anything we could do? This was

lucky. You read the play and thought this is what I want to do? Yes.

Hampstead Theatre club sent it to us. It was obvious the minute I read

it that it was a great part for Imelda. It arrived in Hampstead

Theatre and you got some great reviews. Did you know you could take

to the West End then? No, it's always about availability of

theatres. And you're going to go on until next together? We are going to

do Gypsy, the great American classic movie from the 50s. Meanwhile,

Maleficent is a new Disney film where you appear, not as a cartoon

character. I haven't seen it yet. Would you like to see a little bit

of it? That would be charming. We have to be big enough to look after

this baby. Get ready. One, two, three, grow! That worked quite well.

That's very nice. Now there will be no questions asked. We are no longer

fairies. We are three peasant women raising our orphaned child in the

woods. So no more flying. Peasant woman, is it credible that Angelina

Jolie as the wicked witch? It's a stretch to say the least, isn't it?

Not at all. She can do anything. I haven't seen her in it or anything

so I'm rather excited about the prospect of it. It must be weird

acting in something presumably against the blue screen and not

seeing what is going to be like at the end? We spent three weeks of

blue dots all over our faces, flying up and down, about the most exciting

thing I've done for them it was absolutely glorious. And then to get

to turn into your actual size, I'm small enough as it is, but I was

made even smaller, so it was good fun. Thank you both very much indeed

for joining us this morning. The Prime Minister faces an insurgency

over Europe, both inside the Conservative Party, and from UKIP.

The real question for millions of voters is whether they can trust

David Cameron to negotiate a transformed relationship with the

EU, and give Britain a referendum. What exactly are his demands? Are

they realistic? And is this, as he says, one last chance for our

European future? Good morning, Prime Minister. Good morning. Let's talk

today about Europe largely today Saint of the big issue at the

moment. First of all, can you give me a cast-iron guarantee that a

David Cameron led government will give Britain and in ad referendum

within two years? Yes, absolutely. We'll held by the end of 2017,

referendum on and in ad bases, do we stay in a reformed European Union or

to relieve? Whatever the outcome of the next election, of course I want

an overall majority and I'm hoping and believing I can win an overall

majority, but people should be in no doubt I will not become Prime

Minister unless I can guarantee that we'll that referendum. If for

instance the Conservatives are the largest party with a minority, that

suggests he would not then be Prime Minister because you couldn't

guarantee that referendum if you didn't have a referendum of House of

Commons seats. I won't become Prime Minister unless I can guarantee that

in ad referendum will be held. There's a good reason for this. The

British public have not had a say since 1975 and yet we have the

Maastricht Treaty, the Lisbon Treaty, the Nice Treaty, the

Amsterdam Treaty, you can't help people in an organisation against

their will, and now it's right that this renegotiation, this referendum,

and that people have their say. I think it's right to have a

renegotiation first. There are changes we can make this

organisation to improve it and improve our membership of it. OK.

There is only one party which actually has a plan to change Europe

and allow people to have a say. And it is not UKIP. Labour and Liberal

Democrats don't want to give you a referendum but the Conservatives

will. You know the EU very well and how negotiations can drag on and

drag on and drag on. You're not going to be sucked into a position

where you can't come back in 2017 and say, I know I promised you a

referendum that you have to wait another year. We will have a

referendum whether or not I have successfully renegotiated. I believe

I will be successful because others in Europe need to change to the

European Union. The euro currency needs change because it needs a

banking union, a fiscal union, so we are legitimate to ask for our

changes and other leaders in Europe including Angela Merkel in Germany

are not rejecting out of hand what Britain are saying, but saying we

can discuss these issues and see what we can do. I think the

reception from European leaders for what I have said and business

leaders, many of whom are keen we stay in Europe, have been very

positive. Looking ahead in your diary, have you got a date in 2017

when you have the referendum will take place? I haven't, but it will

be before the end of 2017. It could be the autumn. I think negotiations

I'm undertaking will be successful and we are clear about what we want

to achieve. Let's enter benefit tourism. Let's make sure the single

market is properly safeguarded. Let's make sure Parliament gets

together and blocks unwelcome proposal from the European

Commission. Let's make a series of changes to make Europe more

flexible, more competitive, these are the sorts of things I want to

see. I have set them out in different places. Perhaps the most

important is getting Britain out of the clause which says the European

Union must be committed to an ever closer union. I don't accept that. I

want to come back to this by want to be very clear that if you have this

negotiation and you don't get what you want, you will each party into

that referendum saying we have to leave Europe, it's no longer worth

it? You won't sit on the fence. I'm confident I will achieve the

objectives I have set out a knife in the right way to go into a

negotiation is of confidence in a positive nation that nature, and I

want to see Britain stayed in a reformed Europe. I will recommend

the changes, I believe we should stay in this. If you haven't got

those changes? You can't be sure. I have a very positive optimistic plan

for this country. We have turned around Britain's economy. 1.5

million more people in work, cut the deficit. Britain is growing faster

than any other G-7 country, faster than America, we've shown we can

make changes and I'm upbeat and optimistic about what Britain can

achieve in terms of the economy and about our place in Europe. We have a

plan and not the most important thing in politics, to show to people

we have a clear plan for the economy, for the future. One last

gentle and applied go, in that referendum, you will tell people to

vote yes or no. You won't sit on the fence. Of course not. Will a cabinet

have a free vote in the Conservative Party? The whole of the Conservative

government, more than half, are all committed to this plan for a

renegotiation and a referendum. We are all convinced it is possible to

achieve these changes. We are going for those changes and will act on

them. You mentioned the importance of getting out of ever closer union

of Europe, the original founding Treaty of Rome would trade the whole

thing. Do you think you can start again and read that up? Du think the

EU will allow that to happen? That essentially doesn't apply to Britain

and the Treaty is made clear it is an applied to Britain. I think if

you go back... It'll be an addendum to the Treaty of Rome? Some other

things require treaty change and that will be one of them. There was

sent in our country which I understand in many ways ship that we

wanted to be part of the single market, part of an organisation

where nation states cooperate. We do not want to be part of a country

called Europe. I understand that. It's not just symbolic because

actually, the concept of ever closer union in forms so much about the

European Union does. It's an optimistic outlook because UKIP are

saying that at the barriers, we can't succeed and compete in the

modern world. Let's give up on Europe altogether. We are the only

party with a very clear view. Let's move on. You also mentioned an end

to benefit tourism. The EU has more or less accepted a three month

moratorium on people coming into this country before they can claim

benefits. The organisations like migration watch of said five years

before people can claim benefits. Is that the kind of thing in concrete

terms you want? We need to make sure that the freedom to move to work is

about that, to go and get a job, not to claim benefit for them I would

like to see longer periods in terms of before you're allowed to claim

benefits. How much? Certainly longer than what we have today. Several

years? Today, if you travel and work from another European country into

Britain, you can then claim child benefit and other benefits for your

family back home, even though they are not living in the UK and going

to UK schools and all the rest of it. Under the current rules, it

seems extremely difficult if not impossible to change that. I haven't

met anybody who thinks that the sensible thing. That's a big change.

On the general principle of the free movement of people, Nigel Farage

talk about 400 million people could come here, you have no proposals to

end the free movement of people? I think it's important and needs to be

returned to the original concept, which was freedom to be able to go

and work in another country. Many British citizens go and work in

other European countries. Many Europeans work here. Freedom to go

and work in another country, that's one thing. What we have seen

recently something else. Free movement of people would stay after

the referendum in the way you have described? Let me turn to something

else. It's related to that, the expansion of the EU. The board is

always moving east and Britain have been among the countries supporting

the accession of Turkey to the EU. You want longer transitional

controls. They are just transitional controls so David Cameron could

negotiate this deal successfully, have a successful referendum and

then a few years down the line, everybody currently working in

Turkey free to come and work here. I have argued clearly we need longer

transitional controls and possibly transitional controls on a totally

different basis. You get these big migrate free flow is when you have

countries with different levels of income so the massive movement there

was from Poland recently was based on the fact that the income levels

were so different so you could have transitional influxes. Cedar at the

freedom to move and get a job in another country until your level of

income per capita is at a certain level, a way of avoiding some of the

difficulties we had in the past. Is that doable? Yes, because all new

countries joining the European Union have to be agreed by unanimity, so

you have a block, Claire say about that issue. And again, I am rightly

responding to what is happening in Europe in recent years -- clear

faith. After 2004, about a million people moved from Eastern Europe to

Britain, about 700,000, which has changed. It's changed our culture,

and it is right... For better or worse? A lot of people are continued

a lot in terms of working but I think it's absolutely right to grip

this issue and have a plan for sorting it out. Let me make one last

point. I think the other parties are forgetting that immigration policy

is meaningless on its own. It's got to be accompanied by welfare reform

so it pays for people in our own country to work rather than not work

and it's got to be accompanied by robust educational reform so we are

producing people who have got all of the skills necessary to compete in

today's world and what you can see with this government is a long-term

economic plan which includes schools and skills being the best in Europe

for young people and also, a welfare revolution. Which is tougher? It

already is. Some people would say tough, but actually, there's a very

compassionate side to this. We are seeing around 100 people a week

coming off benefits and into work, simply because of the welfare cap

because it is working in terms of encouraging people to go out and

work. And provide stability. I want to concentrate on Europe. You said

you'd Britain to be forced join the euro of the Maastricht Treaty but

there's no way we could. I sit in these European Council meetings with

my 27 fellow heads of state and government and I've lost count of

the times that it is stated by one or other member or indeed by the

European Commission notes that the euro is the currency of the European

Union and I keep saying, it is for some of you full it is in for some

of us, and Britain, if I'm Prime Minister Erdogan will never join the

euro. We should keep the pound as our currency, which gives

flexibility. It's in our national interest. It's very important, as

the euro zone changes and has new rules and regulations, we absolutely

make clear you can be a full member of the European Union with all of

your rights but not in the euro zone and the single market needs to be

properly protected so this is actually again not a strawman very

important. What about Britain's contributions?

You have done a deal, you are not going to pick that, are you? No, I

am confident. People said we would never cut the budget, we did that,

and I also got us out of the Eurozone bailout funds. People can

see a track record of the changes in Europe. What are the red lines on

contributions? We want to embed this budget deal that was agreed.

Interestingly UKIP MPs in Parliament voted against it. Elections are an

opportunity to register a message or a protest but we are looking at

sending men and women to the European Parliament to stand up for

this country and that's why I want people to send Conservatives there.

A new Parliamentary veto, that would apply to all parliaments, able to

veto any European commission proposals? This is known as the red

card system where European national parliaments can club together and

say about a particular proposal, we don't want that. So you would have

to get support from the German or French parliaments? We would have to

work out the exact numbers we require in order to blocked

proposals. Is there anything else on your agenda? We have managed to stop

some parts of the working time directive, but there are more things

like that. Some will say why should there be an uneven playing field on

these matters? The working Time directive is part of that, you can

pick this and that but this is going too far? The Eurozone countries need

change and Britain is happy to agree to that change as long as we can

make the broader changes to the European Union as well. Britain

brings a huge amount of the European Union. We are big, free trading

economy with links all over the world. When we are discussing the

future of Ukraine, or Burma, Britain has got great strength and power

that it brings to those discussions. I think people

recognise, as Jose Manuel Barroso said last week, there are things we

can bring to the table. I think some people will be saying, let him

negotiate that, but I need to keep my foot on the Prime Minister's

neck. I need to vote UKIP to put pressure on him, that is a logical

thing to do, isn't it? In Europe, we need a strong Conservative minister

that will be taken seriously by our European partners. The problem with

sending Labour and Liberal Democrat MPs is that they don't want change,

and members of UKIP are not taken seriously. If you want to change,

you need to vote for change and I have this clear plan that I can

deliver. If you decided to Pfizer bid for AstraZeneca was not in the

interests of this country, could you stop it? Firstly I would speak out

very clearly. I think it is right to engage and get stuck in with these

companies to make sure we get good guarantees and the best deal for

Britain. Which you haven't yet. We have made good progress. Frankly it

has been instructive how different politicians have reacted. As soon as

I heard this happening, I asked Cabinet ministers to engage with

AstraZeneca and Pfizer. You engaged more with Pfizer. That is not the

case. Ministers spoke to AstraZeneca before Pfizer. Don't underestimate

what they have said, for example making sure that 20% of their

research and development jobs will be in the UK. I want more but it is

interesting that the Labour leader's reaction, when asked to

engage with Pfizer, he said he was too busy because he wanted to stand

on the sidelines and score political points. A lot looking at Pfizer's

record will say that is a good thing too. They are praying mantis. Can

you stop it? There will be a report to Parliament, but I will do

whatever is right for Britain. I will always stand up for British

jobs, science, research and development, but it is important to

make this point which is that Britain benefits massively by being

an economy that is open to overseas investment. Think of Jaguar Land

Rover bought by the Indians, it has created 9000 jobs in the Midlands

since I have been Prime Minister. Companies like AstraZeneca benefit

by being able to go into other countries. Don't think there is some

pull up the drawbridge... Still on the subject of efficiency and so

forth, there have been proposals for a change in the law on public sector

strikes to raise the bar for the number of people voting. Is this

something you are attracted by? Yes, I think in the essential

services like the London Underground, the pain caused to

people trying to get to work, caused by the strikes, often supported by a

small percentage of people who work the London Underground, I think it

is hugely damaging. The time has come to set a threshold in strike

ballots. It is not something I can achieve in a coalition government,

it will be in our manifesto. There has been a row in the papers between

Michael Gove and his colleagues about school budgets, is the

Coalition going through a really bad for year itch now? The Coalition

works well at delivering the long term economic plan, and on education

and I'm happy to be judged on the record of what we have done. 250,000

fewer children in failing schools, more highly qualified teachers going

into schools, a real war on raising standards that you can see across

the pitch. On the specific issue of this story, we are spending ?5

billion on new school places, twice what Labour spent in the previous

four years. How do you feel about a senior Cabinet Minister

disrespecting Michael Gove? You get these stories in newspapers but let

me make this point, free schools are an excellent innovation and two

thirds of the first three schools got good or excellent ratings from

Ofsted. Thank you for joining us. I'm afraid we have to move on now.

Now over to Katherine for the news headlines. David Cameron has

reiterated his guarantee that he will not become Prime Minister after

the next general election unless he can deliver in in-out referendum on

Europe by 2017. He said he was confident he could achieve a

successful renegotiation of Britain's relationship with the EU

including an exemption from the aim of ever closer union.

Voting is under way in eastern Ukraine, in a referendum on

independence for the Donetsk region. The referendum has gone ahead

despite calls earlier in the week from Russia's President Putin for it

to be postponed. The Ukrainian government and the international

community have said the vote is illegal. That's all from me. The

next news is on BBC One at one o'clock. Back to Andrew in a moment.

First, a look at what's coming up immediately after this programme. We

will be in London at ten o'clock, debating zero hour contracts, races

in the Church of England, and men - are dads pulling their weight? The

Prime Minister is still here and Christiane Amanpour and David

Aaronovitch have returned. Are going to have British troops

involved in Nigeria, Prime Minister? We have offered to send out a team

to work alongside the bigger American team going out there. We

stand ready to do anything more that the Nigerians would want. We cannot

just pile in and do whatever we would like. It is immensely

complicated because they are in this deep area of jungle that is three

times the size of Wales but we will do what we can. We were mentioning

the Michelle Obama moment that has gone around the world. This has gone

viral, bring back our girls, and it is because of this that the world

viral, bring back our girls, and it don't know if you would like to hold

this and join the campaign? I think one of the things that really

matters is that we recognise this is not just a problem in Nigeria. We

are seeing this violent extremist Islamism in Africa, parts of the

Middle East, and even here in the UK. And targeting women and girls,

which is particularly frightening. There are circumstances in which we

might use British troops to help, if we were asked to. That is unlikely

but we have worked with Nigerians in the past in hostage rescue

operations were special forces have helped and advised and the rest of

it. I say to President Jonathan, if asked we will see what we can do.

British helpers and advisers have asked we will see what we can do.

been working with Nigerian police and military on other issues so they

know us, they have worked with us. We have run out of time, I'm afraid.

Do join me again at the same time next week on BBC One. I'll be

talking to the Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg and that doyenne of

celebrity interviewers, Lynn Barber. So, the Andrew Marr Show. Lots of

wind. But this morning, lots still to come. For 50 years, Sir James

Galway's playing has helped popularise classical flute music

around the world. Known as "the man with the golden flute", he's

performed for popes, princes, presidents, and of course prime

ministers. His great body of recordings has just been re-issued

together in recordings has just been re-issued

time - 71 CDs, no less. We leave you now with Sir James and Lady Galway

and Schultze's Sonata for Two Flutes. Goodbye.