19/11/2017 The Papers


19/11/2017

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LineFromTo

I'm talking to Chris Bodington, the

mountaineer who has reached the

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world's highest places his memoir is

called, of course - Ascent.

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Hello and welcome to our look ahead

to what the the papers will be

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bringing us tomorrow.

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With me are Henry Zeffman,

political reporter at the Times

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and public affairs

consultant, Jacqui Francis.

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Welcome to the both.

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Tomorrow's front pages,

starting with The Financial Times,

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which reports that ministers

are expected to give

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Theresa May the go ahead to increase

the Government's Brexit

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financial settlement offer

to move on EU negotiations.

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The taily Telegraph one of a number

of papers moving on Robert Mugabe's

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defiance of the country's generals

by remaining in power this evening.

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The Metro also leads on Zimbabwe,

describing Mugabe as "Clinging On".

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And the I also focuses Mugabe's

defiance of the Zanu-PF party's

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decision to remove him as leader.

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The Daily Express reports research

that the Royal family has

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contributed £1.8 billion to the UK

economy this year, as the Queen

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and Prince Philip celebrate

their 70th wedding anniversary.

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The Daily Mirror saying former Tory

defence chiefs have accused the

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Government of damaging the Armed

Forces by cutting funding no.

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Picture on this at the moment. But

it gives you a little flavour. Let's

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kick off. This evening, Jacqui, one

big story in town making it through

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to the front pages, Robert Mugabe

and this surprise turn and big

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announcement that wasn't a big

announcement

Absolutely. It I is as

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here he shocked the world. I imagine

there are more people in Harare, in

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Zimbabwe that are shocked than the

lest of the world. It must have been

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patently obvious to him he was

going, and the fact he was doing a

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televisedes announcement, everybody

is waiting to hear, to find out that

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he thinks that mistakes have been

made and that he can

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he thinks that mistakes have been

made and that he can come back.

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That's what I understand he seems to

be saying, he is not going anywhere.

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I'm not sure whether or not they

gave him the right speech or he read

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T something has gone

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gave him the right speech or he read

T something has gone horribly wrong.

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There are suggestions going around

maybe a couple of pages he turned

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over deliberately on purpose but it

was a turn up for the books.

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Well it was almost chaotic, there

were bits during the 30-hour ramble.

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More of a ramble than a speech where

he seemed to lose his place and one

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of the generals near him had to

point out what page he was on and

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when the cameras were rolling at the

end he said "I'm sorry can we

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correct bits" perhaps not realising

it was live. So it was a peculiar

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what we thought was going to be the

end of his 37 years in power but it

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wasn't, that and obviously quite

chaotic in Harare tonight.

What do

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you make of what might happen next?

One of the interesting things in the

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past week has been t started as a

military coup, as it were, with

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Mugabe's sacked deputy looking line

he was going to take over but then

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the people took to the streets. One

of the interesting dynamics will be

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whether it is a transition to

democracy that the Zimbabwean people

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want or whether it is a change for

one part of the ruling elite to

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another part of the ruling elite.

What happened today suggests

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something a bit more like the loot

At the

Jacqui, it was interest,

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within his speech, Robert Mugabe

talked about conflicts potentially

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within the party, intergenerational

conflict. Talking about the need it

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perhaps bring on new blood but keep

the old established players as well.

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It goes to show there is a lot going

on in ZANU-PF.

There is indeed and

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as you said Henry there might be

backtracking, I don't know whether

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they fought people were too

ingrained inthe military didn't have

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the decisive hand in terms of

getting rid of people. Because, you

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know you are getting rid of one set

of people for another who are

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equally, in some case, people would

say corrupt and it is about power

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and who has the power. Maybe the

idea of saying - go now, it was

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actually, do you know how much you

would have to get rid of in order to

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put your own people in place and the

fact that his wife - I still quite

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get that bit. Because, you know, he

has obviously been planning this for

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a long time and all of a sudden

people realise she really does want

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to become the next leader so we

should do something about it. I have

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this horrible suspicion about when a

woman decides to do something - wou,

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it is terrible, horrible, but if it

had been a man who was plotted the

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same thing, would there have been

the same response?

All the way

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through the generals were saying it

isn't a kou. We don't want to take

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Mugabe out of office, we want to

change parts of the corrupt ZANU-PF

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elite. People thought it was cover

and they were trying to remove him

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and place him with their deputy. But

tonight suggests maybe they were at

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their word and maybe they wanted to

get rid of Grace Mugabe and who

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weren't war vetted rans, the younger

generation, and it wasn't about

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taking Robert Mugabe out.

And the

Daily Telegraph - Mugabe defies the

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generals and clings on. We were well

aware, we were speaking to the

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ZANU-PF representative in the UK

tonight. We arewell aware his own

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party says he is no longer the

leader yet he said in his speech

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tonight - I will be overseeing the

meeting in December of ZANU-PF's

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Congress and so on. Somehow some

communication has gone badly wrong.

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.

Something is going on in the

background, whether or not he is

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negotiating, dotting the I's or

crossing the t's to his exit or

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conspiracy theory, are people in

other countries saying - we are not

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sure what the deal is going to be

with the new leader, maybe we will

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back him because he has had strong

backing from China all along and as

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far as I'm concerned if they say zsh

we are not sure all of a sudden it

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pauses until they are reasthurd this

transition is going to be the

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transition they need in order to

continue to build the infrastructure

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and make as much money as they can.

It is certainly true that some other

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countries in Africa, which have

similar ruling elites in place for

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some time, will be looking at

Zimbabwe and hoping what is

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happening there doesn't catch on.

They won't want the African

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equivalent of the Arab Spring, which

some of the scenes in Zimbabwe over

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the last few days have reminded me

off but it comes back to the scenes

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of the people exercising the coup,

doing what is going on at the top in

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the presidential Palace but the

clips are seen of people in the

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streets whop want investment in the

country, who want a stronger economy

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and a more modernised

infrastructure. Those are two

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different things.

We mustn't forget

the background to all of this is a

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country in economic meltdown and the

problems Zimbabwe have faced, the

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people there are Des straight to see

change.

They are. I suppose it is

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not very popular to remind people,

that yes, he has been there for

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what, nearly 40 years? But this

wasn't a problem and this wasn't

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something that started with him. We

are talking about, it used to be

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called Rhodesia, Ian Smith. Let's

not forget this is down to him at

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the moment but it has been a long

time coming and isn't something that

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happened overnight. As you have

said, yes, the people on the ground

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want jobs and stability. If you

start hollowing out the whole

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country and taking the money out,

where elsewhere you going to get the

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very much, except for other

countries that have decided - yes,

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we want to put more money back into

this place.

Henry we mustn't forget

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that these Pape letters come out

tomorrow morning and in those terms

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it is a crucial day in Zimbabwe. --

papers will come out. Because

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ZANU-PF said if he didn't step down

by noon tomorrow they'll start

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impeachment and that will be the

crucial decision for them to be

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mulling over tonight whether they'll

hold him to that.

Rab salutely. One

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of the strangest parts of Mugabe's

speech is having been sacked by his

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party, earlier that day, he talked

about how he was going to preside

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over ZANU-PF's scheduled Congress

next month and establish a sort of

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plan for getting out of this

situation. It's not at all clear how

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that is compatible with the fact he

doesn't run ZANU-PF any more. So,

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the people that you have been

interviewed today have made quite

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clear, members of ZANU-PF that they

are going to lanch impeachment

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proceedings. I suppose the question

to which extent the rules which have

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been established to work for Mugabe,

work for the people trying to I can

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at that down Mugabe. Typically in

dictatorships they don't.

Plenty

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more to talk about on this tomorrow,

a big story. Let's move to one side

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Jacqui. Staying with the Daily

Telegraph, the story on the

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right-hand side, a Brexit story

about the money.

Yes, we had the

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conversation before about how much

money we were going to pay and it

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was almost like - well we want to

negotiate first, then we will decide

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how much money. And I was saying to

Henry, last I heard somebody was

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talking about, it is a bit like them

wanting to pay for a meal and we

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haven't finished it but if you go

out for a meal you have an idea it

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is going to cost because you can see

the prices on the menu. Here it

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seems to me that the Prime

Minister's arm has been twisted by

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Philip Hammond, who is saying - we

want to know what we are getting

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first before we increase the amount

of money we are talking about. We

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are talking about £20 billion,

possibly but, you know we are back

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to this - show us, you know there is

no show us the money first, there is

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show us what the deal is, fist, then

we'll start on the money. Everybody

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is getting fed up.

Henry, remind us

of some of the figures we are seeing

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in some stories. What might change,

how much might this offer go up by?

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At the moment, Britain sorted of

publicly accepted they are offering

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around £20 #3wi8 yob. There are

suggestions it'll double, an extra

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pods 20 billion to persuade the EU

to declare in their own terms

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something called sufficient progress

in mid-December to move talks on to

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trade and transition next year.

Theresa May had meetings in Sweden

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at the end of last week with Donald

Tusk, Emmanuel Macron and the Irish

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Prime Minister who insisted we are

far off. That's the context of the

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discussion over money. Clearly the

Government is going to offer some

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more money but although, Philip

Hammond, you know sort of leading

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pro-EU, although he is not

particularly pro EU but in relative

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terms in the Cabinet, pushing more

money to move to on but we are

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talking about the Brexit

subcommittee, Boris Johnson in

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alliance with Michael Gove, who

ruined his o leadership intentions

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la year, saying they have to move

on.

People say is it really about

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the money or is it political. Is

moving it that much a big deal for

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our economy?

Because we started with

the stance - we are only going to

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give you a certain amount and

nothing else. We have found it

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difficult to be more conciliatory,

when actually it is about the detail

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now. There are people in this

country worried about whether or not

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they can style. There are businesses

making decision abouts whether or

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not they are going to stain if this

is a stumbling block, we are going

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to keep going around and around and

not actually starting to discuss the

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substance which is what everybody

outside of Westminster wants people

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to do, discuss the substance. The

FT, Henry of course has this story -

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May set to secure Cabinet support

for higher Brexit divorce bill

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offer. That really highlighting what

you were starting to allude to.

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Which is, whether she has the

combination of people in the Cabinet

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to back here. It does expose again,

tensions in who wants to play it

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which way?

It is kind of a reminder

of why May called a general

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election, now seven months on or

whatever it looks disaster, the

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worst mistake a Prime Minister has

made in peace Tyne so on but she

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wanted to have the authority from

the public to be able to say to her

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Cabinet - I don't care what you

think or what you said what side you

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are on in the referendum. I'm the

Prime Minister the people have given

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me a mandate to negotiate a deal and

this is the amount I'm going to

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offer. Now she is and the FT sets it

out well -- she is at the mercy of a

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finely-balanced Cabinet. Lots of

people now to want to take her job

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in due course as well who all have

their own view on how they can

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negotiate it Bert. I also think it

is worth remembering, it is not just

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money which is the stumbling block,

a striking thing last week, both the

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Irish Prime Minister and EU

officials were insisting, if you

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don't have an answer to the Irish

border question before December,

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whether or not you offer us the

money, we are not moving the talks

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on. It is very striking the absence

of anything in the papers tomorrow

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about how the British Government is

going to solve that aspect of it as

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well.

Plenty of head scratching.

While we are talking about money,

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take us on to the Daily Express,

this is the Royal Family in this

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instance, a picture of the Queen and

Prince Phillip celebrating 70 years

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of marriage but the story is based

on a research that has been done

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about whether the monarchy gives us

good value for money, really?

Well

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according to this they do indeed.

They contributed £1.8 billion and

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they cost us £292 million, which is

the equivalent of £4.50 per person

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or £1p a day, which, you know what

can you buy for 1p.

£4.50 per person

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per year.

Yes, I think they are

trying to tell us they are good

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value for money. Who is the

definition of monarchy? Who is

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included? Because there are a number

of people that you and I probably

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think - actually do I want it pay

for those individuals? Are they

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included in the £2. 9 -- £292

million.

What do you make of this?

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Well not enough to pay our divorce

bi. I notice although they say the

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monarchy has contributed £1.8

billion they don't break that down

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per person, only the cost per

person. One of the interesting

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things about the research is it

measured the monarchy's value as if

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it were an branded business. I don't

think that's how the British people

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see the monarchy, I don't think

that's why it is so popular as we

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saw there was a tame when it was

less popular, after Princess Diana

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died. It is more popular in how

people see this country and their

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place in T maybe breaking it down

with perhaps slightly spurious

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figures doesn't quite get to why

people are still happy to have what

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might be quite an outdated way of

running a country in 2017.

Are you

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prepared to pay 1p a day, Jacqui?

I

am. I'm certainly prepared to pay

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for the Queen. I think she does a

really difficult job, can you

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imagine all the people she has met

and you have to keep on smiling and

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you know -- I just dread to think

what will happen if she has to meet

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The Donald.

Well, an interesting

thought to leave everyone on for

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now. My thanks to Jacqui and Henry.

We will be back for another go

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around at 11.30 but coming up next

it is time for Meet the Author with

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Chris Bonington.

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