03/03/2016 This Week


03/03/2016

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Tonight, as the pioneer creator and writer of Coronation Street

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passes away, This Week presents another episode of the long-running

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Petty squabbles continue over the future of the EU,

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as the migrant crisis continues to get worse and worse and worse.

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We keep hearing why are the refugees Owen Jones, is on the cobblestones.

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We keep hearing why are the refugees coming into our street, but it is

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actually the poorest countries who are taking the brunt.

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The Street has always been good at building a plot line

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but is the Prime Minister manufacturing Project Fear?

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The New Statesman's Helen Lewis is pulling a pint

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While the bars at Westminster are full of chatter about the EU

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referendum, is anyone talking about it down the Rovers Return?

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And soap opera, US style, as the Hillary and Donald

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The man with many voices Simpsons star, Harry Shearer will be talking

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Smithers, who is that power hungry billionaire I keep hearing

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Evenin' all, welcome to This Week and the end of days.

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We've got the gas masks, duct tape, Pot Noodles,

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chicken and mushroom, natch, and a lifetime's supply of Blue Nun.

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Alan's brought his harmonica, just to keep our spirits up.

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But I fear we're fighting a losing battle.

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Forget your biblical plagues of frogs, boils and Polish plumbers.

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Because Project Fear now stalks the land and is taking

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all the Project Fun out of the EU referendum.

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We've heard the four-minute warnings and it's clear now to everyone that

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leaving the European Union would, quite literally, be the end

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Which is strange because only two weeks ago Call-Me-Dave was

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"ready to walk away" from the European Union if he didn't

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get his modest way on in-work benefits

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And yet to listen him now, Brussels is the only thing standing

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between civilisation and a dystopian world of radioactive cannibal

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motorcycle gangs circling the M25 on customised high-tariff chopper

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bikes, as feral tribes of unregulated children

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fight to the death in Tina Turner's O2

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the Common Fisheries Policy, say hello to a scorched-earth

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zombie-pocalypse and hordes of sun-burnt wrinkly old Brits,

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forced to return from their villas on the Costa Del Sol,

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to live among us as the walking dead.

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Speaking of a terrifying future, I'm joined on the sofa tonight

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by a pairing that's got disaster written all over it.

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Think of them as the Liam Payne of One Direction,

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and the Cheryl Fernandez-Versini of late night political chat.

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I speak, of course, of #manontheleft, Alan "AJ" Johnson.

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And on her This Week debut, #sadscouseronasofa

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Esther "not attending Cabinet anymore" McVey.

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Your moment of the week? It has to be when the mild-mannered Andrew

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Tyrie, who is the chair of the Treasury Select Committee, basically

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usually very measured when he speaks, let rip to Stuart Rose, the

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guy who is heading the remaining campaign. And all week we had heard

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words, Project Fear, statistics batted either way, but this was the

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first time that somebody had systematically said how untrue these

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figures were, because Stuart Rose had come forward saying what it was

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worth to be in the EU. He said, the statistics don't work. You gave us

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five sets, two do not belong to the UK, they are ten years out of date,

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wrong methodology, those do not work. I hope it is going to be the

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start now that we were actually get through statistics coming forward

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because I think that is what the public want. We will be doing our

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bit on the Daily Politics to do that. Talk about wrinkly old Brits,

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myself and Michael Portillo are often criticised for our Neanderthal

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approach to social media. But this week, President Hollande went to

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visit an internet company and all his people said he has to modernise

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his image. So he used this video app called Paris scope, but he did not

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realise, and none of his people told him, where you could stop unwanted

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comments. So throughout his visit, people's comments were streamed

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live, about his thickening waist, his love life, his trousers being

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too short above his socks. And after 21 minutes they had to pull it. An

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absolute disaster. Hilarious. Never try to change your image and get

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down with the kids. Stick to the wind-up phone.

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Now, the migrant camp in Calais known as The Jungle has loomed large

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in the early days of Britain's EU referendum, even though it has only

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a walk on part in the far larger European migrant crisis.

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More migrants have made it to Europe in the first six weeks of this year

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than made it in the first six months of last year and the numbers

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will only grow as Spring makes the sea crossing from Turkey

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There are only a few thousand in The Jungle but they've become

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pawns in the Remain vs Leave debate and French politicians have been

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Noody seems to have any idea how to resolve the plight of those stuck

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Here's journalist Owen Jones with his take of the week.

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20 million French people pour into Britain,

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They are being absorbed into our communities.

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But it's not a million miles away from what's going on in Lebanon.

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That's a tiny country and they've taken in 1.5 million refugees.

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In comparison, we've taken in a handful.

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We look at these people in the Calais camps and we ask,

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But the truth is, the vast majority aren't.

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They are in far poorer countries than our own.

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Those few actually wanting to come to Britain often feel an affinity

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Maybe they speak the language, maybe they have

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relatives here, maybe they are from former colonies.

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But we are expecting those countries with the least resources to carry

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You've got to remember too that our governments

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have been complicit in instability that's driven people

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from their homes, whether it be wars in Iraq

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or Libya, or arming a Saudi dictatorship that bombs Yemen

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Now, I went to the camps in Calais and the people I met,

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And the key difference wasn't their language

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It was the violence that they'd suffered.

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The Afghan kid whose dad was shot dead by the Taliban.

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The Sudanese man whose fellow villagers were burned to death

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The Syrians who fled Assad's barrel bombs.

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But while we are turning shipping containers in this country

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into trendy shops and cafes, the Calais camps are

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And they are being replaced with containers

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The thing is, you make this case, and it

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is well easy to be accused of being some, you know,

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But I think this is partly about patriotism.

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Our country has been enriched by refugees.

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Whether it be the Huguenots who fled France, the Jews

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who fled Eastern Europe, or Asians who fled Idi Amin's Uganda

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If we turn our backs when far poorer countries are doing far more

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to help, that could be a matter of national shame.

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But if we do more to help people, that

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From Box Park in Shoreditch to thinking squarely inside the box

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on This Week, Owen Jones joins us now.

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We will come onto what is to be done in a moment, but once again you say

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it is the West's fault. It is always the West's fold, isn't it? But a lot

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of the people in the camp are Syrian. I don't remember us invading

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Syria. A number are sub-Saharan African, Sudanese and Eritrea, and I

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don't remember invading either of these countries. I did not say it

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was all the West's fault. I said governments have been complicit in

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various forms of instability, whether Iraq or Libya. You are

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correct, this is a world riven with conflict and the West is not the

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scent of all those conflicts. I never claimed it was always our

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fault, so it is a slightly odd line of argument. In the case of Syrians,

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and it is not to blame the West for that conflict, I would like us to

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put pressure, for example, on Turkey, a Nato ally, to stop, for

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example, Isis fighters going over that border and attacking Kurdish

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freedom fighters. I would like us to put pressure on our Saudi allies,

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who we are farming to the teeth, who are complicit in exporting

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international terrorism. Is it all to blame the West, of course not.

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The issue is what we ask about government, because we have control

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over our government and can hold it to account. In a world riven with

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conflict, by no stretch of the imagination all to do with the West,

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but clearly the West in various countries has been complicit... I

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will give the Iraq and Afghanistan but I would not give you Syria. I am

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interested, too, that you want us to put pressure on the Saudis. That is

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a British ally. You want pressure on Turkey, a Nato member. You do not

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mention pressure on Russia, which is creating a new migrant crisis as it

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continues the war, even though there is a ceasefire. I wrote an article a

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few weeks ago calling for the left to speak out against Vladimir

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Putin's regime. You just failed to do that. I was talking about the

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role of our own governments. Russia is not a Western client state. We

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can certainly call for Russia to stop bombing Syria. It is a country,

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you are quite right, bombing civilians, killing civilians, and it

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is another power complicit in a war which is murdering tens of thousands

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of civilians. That was a short video. Let me finish that point.

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There is a form of argument called a strawman argument, which is when

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someone invents an Aga given their opponent and then knocks it down. I

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have never claimed the West is at the source of all instability across

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the world. Of course it is not. Countries like Russia and other

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countries are heavily complicit. You have had the opportunity to

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establish your opinion and I'm grateful for that. There is a

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humanitarian case for doing something about Calais, that is

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clear. But it would only be humanitarian. It would do nothing to

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resolve the much wider migrant crisis. But there are practical

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things we can do. There is a problem with unaccompanied kids who have

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fled conflicts, whether Syria, Iraq or Afghanistan. Unicef are arguing,

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and they have some practical proposals, is firstly that our

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family reunion laws in this country are unduly restrictive. If you are

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an unaccompanied kid, if you have a mum or dad here, there is a wrong

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with the process that takes too long. I think we should extend that,

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this is what Unicef are arguing, that if you have an aunt, uncle,

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grandad or grandmother, there should also give you the ability to claim

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asylum here. Equally, last year in June only one of -- one in ten of

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these refugees coming to Europe were kids, and it is now over a third. I

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think we should look to other children, particularly unaccompanied

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kids at risk of people trafficking, serious exploitation, and also take

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a share of those. What numbers are we talking about? Unicef have argued

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not to set an arbitrary limit. They have said you should not do that. I

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want to bring in the others. I agree we should be doing

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want to bring in the others. I agree refugee crisis but I also think that

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France has been very slow in tackling this issue in Calais, to

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discern between genuine asylum seekers, Syrians, people from

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Afghanistan, those that you mentioned, and economic migrants.

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That is what needs to be done. It needs to be done at Europe's

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external borders. There was progress this week about putting more into

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that. Calais is a result of that, a symptom of that. But the French have

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been very slow. As I understand it they have yet to even begin the

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process of doing that. In the meantime, I do agree about

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unaccompanied children. There is an issue about unaccompanied children

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with relatives in this country that we should be looking at very

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seriously. But if the argument was, and I don't think it was, that we

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just move UK Border Force away and let people come across, then I would

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disagree. And it wasn't argued. We'd still be part of the European

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continent and wouldn't we have an obligation to be part of the

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solution to resolving the migrant crisis? As internationalists, you

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have to be a part of solving that crisis now. We all look at the

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pictures, it could be your daughter, you know. You say, where are we

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going to solve it, at source, what is the best way to send a message

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across? The whole of Europe's dealts with this issue really badly. I look

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at say Austria who was one of the countries saying we want a European

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solution, they have now closed the borders, done what the nine

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surrounding countries have done, everyone's gone into a

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fragmentation, how do we do this as individuals, so we have got to say,

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what is the message we send out. I see Tusk saying don't come unless

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you are an economic migrant. A million people came last year.

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There'll be at least a million, there's already been 120,000 and

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it's only early March, that is this year. Isn't Britain obliged in or

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out of the EU to play a major role? In a way it has, it's put in over a

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billion pounds. That hasn't been coming? No, but we say, what do we

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do to help Turkey, Lebanon, Syria. Actually, you don't hear me praise

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this Government very often but there's been substantial aid to

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parts of that region which we need to build on. The issue - I went to

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that camp and it's grim when you go there because the problem with

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refugees, they are often stripped of their humanity. They are very

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complex cases because some have relatives here. Some work for the

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British Army, you know, they were translators and put their lives at

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risk and are being denied entry. I don't understand that. I met an

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Afghan man who lived in Shepherds Bush for 15 years, was deported and

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come all the way back and considers this his home. What unites them is

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they have all fled violence and war. What we kind to do with an orderly

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accepting people into the UK, we said we'd go over there and see them

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in their centres and bring them over. 20,000 over five years? That

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is what they were deciding on. Iceland's taking 10,000.

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There's been a complete European failure on this. There were two ways

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to deal with this migrant crisis. First under Schengen was the weakest

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border is your border under Schengen and Europe had to do something to

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strengthen the borders, particularly in Greece and southern Italy, do

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something major, then it had to get together and, perhaps including

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Britain too and decide look, we have a million people coming in, by the

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size of our economies, let's divide them between the various nations.

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None of that's happened. It's a fail, fail, fail for Europe. Two

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points. You are making the point to Esther that actually turning our

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back against the EU isn't going to solve the problems. People are still

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going to want to move around the world. The EU is not solving the

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problems. The second point, where is the UN in this? No international

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organisation's covered itself in glory with this, tackling this. It's

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on our doorstep. Yes, it is, but what have we been doing throughout

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this crisis? We have been over there saying, listen, do you mind talking

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about ever closer union on our agenda. In a way this was happening

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for a year, it still seems to have taken everybody by surprise with the

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sheer numbers as volume so where Greece said we could do 70,000, it

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wasn't expecting 2,000 people every day. It's one of the greatest

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humanitarian crises since World War II and help is desperately needed.

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It's going to get worse. 20,000 is not a lot. Compared to countries

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smaller than ours, like Sweden, they have taken in far more. These are

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human beings, they have been demonised and vilified, I think

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let's take a stand, let's take in some unaccompanied children as a

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start. Thank you. Now it's late; diverted Ryanair

1:27:141:27:13

flight to Slovakia late, so take it easy on the Blue Nun

1:27:141:27:13

chaps, because waiting in the wings Harry Shearer, aka Derek Smalls,

1:27:141:27:13

aka Principal Skinner, aka Mr Burns To talk about the politics

1:27:141:27:13

of showbiz, and the showbiz And don't forget to power-up

1:27:141:27:13

the Vic20, Commodore64 and follow us on The Twitter,

1:27:141:27:13

The Fleecebook And Gordon Brown's Now, here on This Week

1:27:141:27:13

we like a fright. In fact, we enjoy nothing more

1:27:141:27:13

than dressing up an unsuspecting journalist in a silly

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costume and sending them So when David Cameron's latest

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warnings about leaving the EU were dismissed by his own MPs this

1:27:141:27:13

week as scaremongering. And one minister said

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it was like Halloween come early. For us, it was like

1:27:141:27:13

Christmas come early. That's why we sent

1:27:141:27:13

the New Statesman's Deputy Editor, Helen Lewis down to the tombs

1:27:141:27:13

at the London Bridge Experience. This is her terrifying roundup

1:27:141:27:13

of the political week. Get ready to hide behind the sofa,

1:27:141:27:13

because a new terrifying monster The only project I'm

1:27:141:27:13

interested in is Project Fact. I think it's all baloney,

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it's all Project Fear. The name comes from the Scottish

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independence referendum campaign, where the unionist side

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was accused of running a negative campaign, talking down Scotland,

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issuing bloodcurdling warnings about what might

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happen if the country Now, say the Brexiteers,

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the same is happening again. I just think this

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whole Operation Fear By the time we get to June,

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we will have dragons coming out of the Thames, and serpents coming

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out of our taps being predicted. The trouble is,

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the one thing we know about fear campaigns

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is that they work. And the pro-Europeans say the other

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side have been doing some scaremongering of their own

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by saying that staying in the EU means accepting

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effectively unlimited The First Minister of Scotland made

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a rare trip to London I think the answer

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to the concerns that people have isn't to clamp down

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on free movement. Instead, the answer

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is to ensure that the economy works more effectively for people

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who are currently unemployed or on low wages, or

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struggling to access It is to generate hope,

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rather than play on fear. And that wasn't the only

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row raging this week. Angry Conservative backbenchers

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demanded to know why the Government was spooking the electorate

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with horror stories of life outside the EU when just a few weeks ago,

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David Cameron was supposed to be considering everything,

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even leaving the EU, If my right honourable friend's

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rather apocalyptic view of our leaving the European Union

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is correct, was it not both either irresponsible or inaccurate

1:27:141:27:13

of the Prime Minister to say he ruled nothing out

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prior to the completion of the most unsatisfactory

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renegotiation? We have secured

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a renegotiation which I think addresses the principal British

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concerns about our membership Now we can advocate membership

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of this reformed EU, and I think we will be stronger,

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safer and better off in that The leave side are also annoyed

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with Sir Jeremy Heywood, the head of the civil service,

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who this week ruled that exit-supporting ministers

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should not have access to official documents that might undermine

1:27:141:27:13

the Government's case. MPs at the Public Administration

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Committee were so spine tinglingly scary that he agreed

1:27:141:27:13

to back down a little. I don't think it's appropriate,

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the Prime Minister doesn't think It didn't happen in 75,

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very much the same precedent, to provide material

1:27:141:27:13

to ministers that want to argue against the Government's position,

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so they can make that case And with Europe dominating

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the headlines, where, you might ask, was Labour

1:27:141:27:13

leader Jeremy Corbyn. Well, he didn't ask

1:27:141:27:13

about Europe at PMQs. In fact, he had bigger worries

1:27:141:27:13

on his mind this week. On the day set aside

1:27:141:27:13

on Labour's grid for campaigning about Europe,

1:27:141:27:13

he attended a CND rally. I first joined the Campaign

1:27:141:27:13

for Nuclear Disarmament when I was 16 years old,

1:27:141:27:13

and I'm still a member, CND and the wider peace movement

1:27:141:27:13

play an absolutely vital They speak up for peace,

1:27:141:27:13

speak up for justice, speak up for human rights,

1:27:141:27:13

and whilst many of our media will never give any

1:27:141:27:13

of you the credit for it, actually have an enormous effect

1:27:141:27:13

on the politics of this country. Still, luckily for

1:27:141:27:13

Corbyn, on Europe at It now looks as though fully half

1:27:141:27:13

of Tory MPs will defy their leader With three months of rows

1:27:141:27:13

and splits to go, it's nothing less than a Nightmare

1:27:141:27:13

on Downing Street. The New Statesman's Helen Lewis

1:27:141:27:13

there in the tombs at Esther, remain or leave? Leave. Did

1:27:141:27:13

the Prime Minister's renegotiation play any part in that decision? Not

1:27:141:27:13

really. I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. He'd offered a

1:27:141:27:13

referendum, he was going to see if he could get a deal and I thought

1:27:141:27:13

that was only right. But actually, my decision came from earlier than

1:27:141:27:13

that. I would have been probably somebody who would have been more on

1:27:141:27:13

the fence, I could have been an in, but when I went to Council of Europe

1:27:141:27:13

the last two clears and saw how the law-making process was made, that

1:27:141:27:13

was really what changed me into saying if this is how it's

1:27:141:27:13

structured, looking deeper into the whole structure of Europe, do we

1:27:141:27:13

have a greater say, well not particularly. I was doing something

1:27:141:27:13

in particular, we had a blocking minority vote, it had taken six

1:27:141:27:13

months to get that, I thought this was going to happen, the law was

1:27:141:27:13

gon't going to come through, 4 o'clock coffee time, 6 o'clock the

1:27:141:27:13

vote was coming, it fell apart. There was nothing that could have

1:27:141:27:13

been realistically brought back to change your mind? If there could

1:27:141:27:13

have been an ability for us to have more of a trading union, if there

1:27:141:27:13

could have been an ability for us to act in different countries so it

1:27:141:27:13

could have broken it down so it wasn't a rigid 29 or nothing... So

1:27:141:27:13

that wasn't realistic so he couldn't have brought that back? No, but it's

1:27:141:27:13

interesting behind-the-scenes how many countries were actually saying

1:27:141:27:13

the things like that, but they never seemed to have the courage or the

1:27:141:27:13

convictions when they speak publicly that that's what they want to do. A

1:27:141:27:13

lot of people were talking about free movement. Doesn't your side of

1:27:141:27:13

the camp - don't you have to give us a clearer picture of what this

1:27:141:27:13

country's position would be post a Brexit? I do think we have to look

1:27:141:27:13

more into that but I think there are two pictures really. There is one

1:27:141:27:13

that it isn't all safe and fine in Europe. We see there is a gradual

1:27:141:27:13

destruction and falling apart of Europe. I understand that, but that

1:27:141:27:13

is what I asked you, that if you are going to take us out, we need a

1:27:141:27:13

better idea of what out means? And out means that we'd have the ability

1:27:141:27:13

to make our own Free Trade Agreements which we can do. We know

1:27:141:27:13

that the UK outside Europe would be the biggest export market for Europe

1:27:141:27:13

so we can stand alone. In fact there's one thing, if I had to do

1:27:141:27:13

one comparison, I feel at the moment people are wanting to stay in Europe

1:27:141:27:13

because it's too big to fail. When have we heard that before? Too big

1:27:141:27:13

to fail. We said we'd never have that again and I will draw

1:27:141:27:13

comparisons with the banks. We didn't know about the bank's

1:27:141:27:13

finances, they said the debt was toxic and they said it was fine.

1:27:141:27:13

Europe's the same, it doesn't clear its books, it has them qualified

1:27:141:27:13

accounts... OK. Another thing... No, no, no, Alan Johnson? Why does the

1:27:141:27:13

No Campaign we main negative? There is an issue that if you are joining

1:27:141:27:13

something, you stress the opportunities, if you are leaving

1:27:141:27:13

something, you mention the threats. The clips there, there was probing

1:27:141:27:13

on their position in the EU, there was a lot of talk about whether

1:27:141:27:13

Scotland's currency would be the same, a lot of talk about over

1:27:141:27:13

dependency on oil. If you are pulling away from something, you are

1:27:141:27:13

bound to emphasise the threats and the hazard. Now, that doesn't mean

1:27:141:27:13

to say the whole argument should be about that. I take issue with Esther

1:27:141:27:13

about it's always something done to us Europe, the poor old Brits

1:27:141:27:13

getting sand kicked in their face on the beach. Sometimes we lose under

1:27:141:27:13

qualified majority voting, who wanted qualified majority voting, we

1:27:141:27:13

did, Mrs Thatcher did otherwise you never get anything done if it needs

1:27:141:27:13

unanimity on everything and I don't agree with this, Europe is falling

1:27:141:27:13

apart. It's like the banks, you know, pre-Lehmann Brothers, it's

1:27:141:27:13

just such a caricature. Not in great shape though is it? No, neither are

1:27:141:27:13

we. None of the component parts of the European Union are in great

1:27:141:27:13

shape after what happened with the economic shock and in their case...

1:27:141:27:13

Our economy is in better shape than the eurozone?

1:27:141:27:13

This is the thing about Brexit. They say number one brussels makes our

1:27:141:27:13

laws, and number two we are the fifth most successful world economy.

1:27:141:27:13

Which is it? Brussels does everything, but miraculously we

1:27:141:27:13

happen to be a successful economy. On a mature basis we say, what is

1:27:141:27:13

best for the future, to work together or go off into isolation.

1:27:141:27:13

Project Fear worked in Scotland because there were a number of big

1:27:141:27:13

issues, particularly around currency, that were not answered by

1:27:141:27:13

the people that wanted us to leave the United Kingdom. That is a

1:27:141:27:13

weakness for those that want to leave because there are questions

1:27:141:27:13

you cannot answer, which will make Project Fear more salient. Except we

1:27:141:27:13

do know we can make our own trade agreements. We don't know for sure

1:27:141:27:13

we can make a deep single market agreement with the rest of Europe.

1:27:141:27:13

We know there will be something but we don't know it will be a deep

1:27:141:27:13

single market. We are the biggest trading partner, export market for

1:27:141:27:13

Europe. We will get something but you can't tell us what it is. It may

1:27:141:27:13

be fine, it might not be as good as what we have at the moment. That is

1:27:141:27:13

the uncertainty. At the moment what have we got? We pay a membership,

1:27:141:27:13

?20 billion a year. We get some money back. Not 20 billion. We get a

1:27:141:27:13

third back but we are told how to spend it. We have a trade deficit of

1:27:141:27:13

?2 billion a year. Who tells us how to spend it? They do not tell us how

1:27:141:27:13

to spend the rebate. They do in a way because it funnels down in

1:27:141:27:13

various schemes. Equally, ?62 billion is a trade deficit. We are

1:27:141:27:13

part now of a group which is diminishing on a global scale. There

1:27:141:27:13

are things we could do better outside it. So I don't go along with

1:27:141:27:13

Project Fear. As I said, we are part of something which I believe is

1:27:141:27:13

falling apart. We are running out of time. For Mr Cameron to win, he

1:27:141:27:13

needs the Labour vote to be mobilised because Tory votes will be

1:27:141:27:13

divided. There is no sign of Labour votes being mobilised, certainly not

1:27:141:27:13

by Mr Corbyn. I am doing my best! Jeremy was with me on Saturday. He

1:27:141:27:13

went to a CND rally but before that he was with me in Sheffield with the

1:27:141:27:13

campaign. Has he given you a schedule of rallies he will speak

1:27:141:27:13

at? We are drawing up. Are Labour going to give you money to fight the

1:27:141:27:13

campaign? Yes, absolutely, I am amazed at how much they are giving.

1:27:141:27:13

How much? I don't want to go into details. We will declare it. I want

1:27:141:27:13

to ask you this, if your side wins, Boris Johnson as unstoppable as the

1:27:141:27:13

next Tory leader, isn't he? He might be but everybody has to vote on

1:27:141:27:13

that. He is unstoppable. We don't know. We will have to see what

1:27:141:27:13

happens with Boris. He is on stoppable, isn't he? I think so. If

1:27:141:27:13

he gets through the process of MPs nominating him. I hear a lot from

1:27:141:27:13

Conservative MPs that think he is an opportunist and think he might not

1:27:141:27:13

be able to cut it at the dispatch box. It is tickled tattle.

1:27:141:27:13

Interesting tittle tattle. Now, politics is

1:27:141:27:13

a very serious game. Regular This Week viewers

1:27:141:27:13

know to their cost that if you get your head

1:27:141:27:13

on the wrong position, full-contact with Michael Portillo

1:27:141:27:13

can result in serious trauma. That's why it's always best

1:27:141:27:13

to tackle him below the waist much But with the American presidential

1:27:141:27:13

race getting Super serious after Super Tuesday and the Oscar

1:27:141:27:13

ceremony desperately trying to! We've decided to risk verbal

1:27:141:27:13

concussion and put the politics of showbiz and the showbiz

1:27:141:27:13

of politics in this week's Let us not take this

1:27:141:27:13

planet for granted. Racial diversity, climate

1:27:141:27:13

change, sexual abuse. There's plenty on the policy agenda

1:27:141:27:13

at this year's Oscars ceremony. Should politics take a leading role

1:27:141:27:13

in showbiz or would we rather lovies It's a cliche that politics

1:27:141:27:13

is simply showbiz for ugly people. The next President

1:27:141:27:13

of the United States! Donald Trump's campaign's

1:27:141:27:13

managed to combine the two, turning the Republican race

1:27:141:27:13

into a Machiavellian contest worthy Marco Rubio had a tough

1:27:141:27:13

night but he worked hard, he spent a lot of money,

1:27:141:27:13

he is a light weight. We choose Donald Trump

1:27:141:27:13

as our nominee, he will have carried out the most elaborate con job

1:27:141:27:13

in the history of American politics. Super Tuesday, it was the political

1:27:141:27:13

event of the year, at least for Hillary Clinton

1:27:141:27:13

who won in seven states. The former First Lady had superstar

1:27:141:27:13

name recognition but she's also seen as part of an elite that

1:27:141:27:13

people no longer trust. Harry Shearer and co

1:27:141:27:13

cranked the satire up to 11 They said there is no business quite

1:27:141:27:13

like showbusiness, And we're joined in the studio

1:27:141:27:13

by one of our very favourite people writer, actor, voice

1:27:141:27:13

of the Simpsons! Welcome back to the programme. Thank

1:27:141:27:13

you. Are the Oscars in danger of overdoing the self-righteous

1:27:141:27:13

politically correct stuff? The Oscars, self-righteous? Surely you

1:27:141:27:13

jest. But now they are about issues. This goes back to Marlon Brando who

1:27:141:27:13

refused an Oscar and had someone come up and take it on his behalf

1:27:141:27:13

because he was concerned about the plight of Native Americans. This has

1:27:141:27:13

been going on for a long time. The Oscars got a protest this year about

1:27:141:27:13

the fact that there were no black nominees for best actor and Best

1:27:141:27:13

actress. It was a protest based on the peculiar idea that Hollywood is

1:27:141:27:13

fair, or should be fair. This is a movement that started where fairness

1:27:141:27:13

was called for, public education, public accommodation, voting rights.

1:27:141:27:13

Fairness is appropriate there. Hollywood has never been fair and

1:27:141:27:13

never will be. The interesting thing is, you are right there is a history

1:27:141:27:13

of this, but it seemed this year there was so much, with Lady Gaga

1:27:141:27:13

and Leonardo DiCaprio and all the rest. Remember Philadelphia and the

1:27:141:27:13

Bruce Springsteen song? Yes, but it is more the volume of it. They get

1:27:141:27:13

to say their bit, they take a line. Leonardo DiCaprio takes a particular

1:27:141:27:13

line on the planet. And in his case, he is probably off on his private

1:27:141:27:13

jet. But they never get questioned. If they say things, if they take

1:27:141:27:13

policy issues, they have to face people like me to ask them

1:27:141:27:13

questions. They do not get paid $20 million a picture. This programme

1:27:141:27:13

pays very well for these two. I am hoping that! But they are not

1:27:141:27:13

publicly accountable. You are talking about the privilege of

1:27:141:27:13

celebrity, which takes us to Mr Trump. I watch with some amazement

1:27:141:27:13

the pundits in the States turning themselves into pretzels trying to

1:27:141:27:13

figure out this phenomenon. I am screaming at the screen, celebrity!

1:27:141:27:13

A guy who runs in the Republican primary and uses almost every

1:27:141:27:13

vulgarity and profanity would be thrown out of the party, except he

1:27:141:27:13

is a celebrity. A guy in the Republican party who has contributed

1:27:141:27:13

money to Hillary Clinton in the recent memorable past would be

1:27:141:27:13

thrown out of the party, except he is a celebrity. Celebrities get to

1:27:141:27:13

violate the rules. Show business, not in the Democratic nomination

1:27:141:27:13

process, but because of Trump in the Republican one, it is a form of show

1:27:141:27:13

business. It is all a form of show business. The fact is, American

1:27:141:27:13

politics has been for years decided by who makes the best 32nd

1:27:141:27:13

commercials. And a profusion of 30-2nd commercials is fuelled by the

1:27:141:27:13

fact that the consultants and advisers commission them at a rate

1:27:141:27:13

of 15%, so they have a built-in incentive to put more advertising on

1:27:141:27:13

the air and discourage politicians from making any other kind of

1:27:141:27:13

appearance than those for which the consultants get paid. I am

1:27:141:27:13

interested you say it explains it, because Mr Trump has broken every

1:27:141:27:13

rule in the book and you think, he has crashed and burned, and before

1:27:141:27:13

you know it he is soaring up again. It is interesting that you say it is

1:27:141:27:13

because people do not see him as a normal politician. They see him as a

1:27:141:27:13

celebrity, part of a show business operation. And therefore he is

1:27:141:27:13

judged by different standards. Yes, absolutely. This has happened for

1:27:141:27:13

Ronald Reagan and George Murphy, a former movie song and dance man.

1:27:141:27:13

Both elected in California in the mid-19 60s, and for the same

1:27:141:27:13

reasons, they were saying to the public, your politicians have failed

1:27:141:27:13

to control this out-of-control phenomenon. At the time it was

1:27:141:27:13

student protesters. And the public decided they had to turn to

1:27:141:27:13

celebrities to act in local and is an control the kids the public could

1:27:141:27:13

not control. Scary when show business takes over politics. It is

1:27:141:27:13

scary looking at Trump. He was the winner in Ross County where the

1:27:141:27:13

county town is 90% Latina and Hispanic, and he beat two Latinos.

1:27:141:27:13

Lets be fair, they split the opposition to Trump. That is the

1:27:141:27:13

problem. In almost all of these elections, the vote against him is

1:27:141:27:13

higher than the vote for him. So they didn't decide who should run

1:27:141:27:13

against him. You are seeing ego at play in the Republican Party. I am

1:27:141:27:13

the one to beat him! It is unbelievable how he has tapped into

1:27:141:27:13

two key messages, jobs and immigration. When you listen to what

1:27:141:27:13

Americans say on the street they say, we got behind him because he

1:27:141:27:13

made millions, has employed people and has used the fear tactics of

1:27:141:27:13

immigration. Even though he has employed immigrant is himself.

1:27:141:27:13

People seem to be forgiving him for those things because he is a

1:27:141:27:13

celebrity. Can he win as president? I don't think so. I think at the end

1:27:141:27:13

of the day the vote against him will be greater, but this journey has

1:27:141:27:13

been believable. You have a radio project. Yes, it has been on the air

1:27:141:27:13

for some years and is now on in London on Soho radio. It is my sand

1:27:141:27:13

box to make political commentary, satire. It is also on the internet.

1:27:141:27:13

Good to see you. Now, that's your lot for tonight,

1:27:141:27:13

folks, but not for us. Because it's Sam Smith

1:27:141:27:13

night at Lou Lou's. Apparently it's the first ever gay

1:27:141:27:13

club in the country! But we leave you tonight

1:27:141:27:13

with pictures from the camp in Calais, known to

1:27:141:27:13

everyone as The Jungle. The British media has spent many

1:27:141:27:13

months highlighting the terrible conditions migrants are forced

1:27:141:27:13

to endure in the camp, and the past week highlighting

1:27:141:27:13

the apparent injustice of the camp's It's almost like we can't make

1:27:141:27:13

up our minds what we think. Nighty night, don't let

1:27:141:27:13

the cognitive dissonance bite. MUSIC: La Vie En Rose

1:27:141:27:13

by Louis Armstrong. She's always like, "This is a nice

1:27:141:27:13

dress. These are nice shoes." I am in the shop

1:27:141:27:13

two, three times a week.

1:27:141:27:14

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