29/10/2015 Victoria Derbyshire

I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme.

As MPs debate plans by Labour MP Frank Field to water down

the impact of tax credit cuts, we've taken him to meet some voters.

What messages would you draw about what we have in talking about for

the Chancellor? What they are doing will push so

many children into poverty and it is not about adults, it is about the

children. Once you have given something to

somebody and once the government has decided to make that decision that

they will give that family that amount every month, you do not take

Plus, we now know that Kids Company received at least ?46 million

of public money, that's your money, despite repeated warnings

We'll talk to one charity who say they're "utterly bewildered"

by how much cash was ploughed into the failed charity.

Children, young people and really vulnerable mothers are hearing about

us on the street, making their way to our street level centres. A lot

of mental health issues, they have child protection issues, they are

without food. So we are completely overwhelmed by the numbers that are

arriving at our door and a lot of them, they are child protection,

child mental health cases. That is why I kept going back to the

government and saying, you cannot leave it children'scharity with

If you've been trying to get a ticket for the new Harry Potter

play, chances are you're pretty disappointed this morning.

We'll tell you the best ways of getting tickets,

Welcome to the programme, we're on BBC2 and the BBC News

Throughout the programme, we'll bring you the latest breaking

news and developing stories and - as always - we're keen to hear

from you on all the topics we're covering this morning.

A little later, we'll be talking about IVF.

Leading fertility experts tell us a fixed maximum charge should be

introduced on the amount fertility clinics can charge the NHS for IVF.

Your contributions to this programme and your expertise

Texts will be charged at the standard network rate.

And, of course, you can watch the programme online wherever you

are via the bbc news app or our website bbc.co.uk/victoria.

And you can also subscribe to all our features on the news app,

by going to add topics and searching 'Victoria Derbyshire'.

First this morning, cuts to tax credits will be debated in the House

Over the last few months, it's become a toxic issue

From next year, we will reduce the level

of earnings at which a household's tax credits and universal credits

The income threshold in tax credits will be reduced

These changes to tax credits are not easy, but they are fair,

and they will return tax credit spending to the level it was

Does he not see the value of giving support to people trying to improve

their lives, rather than cutting their ability to survive properly?

We must make sure as we reform welfare, and as we cut

taxes, that we protect the hardest working and the lowest paid.

All these questions on tax credits in a way come back to

the same point, which is how you build a strong and secure economy.

Two in ten people will be worse off, how do you justify that?

Well, by saying to you it's eight out of

But also, the point I was trying to make...

Let me just give you this very quick, sort of, what is happening

What is happening on the ground is that two in ten working people, they

You, a Conservative government that claims to be on the side

of hard-working families, will be poorer...

It's about, surely, respect for those who strive to do everything we

ask of them and now find themselves punished for doing what's right.

Last night, unelected Labour and Liberal peers

have voted down the financial measures on tax credits approved

That raises clear constitutional issues, which we will deal with.

We will continue to reform tax credits and save the money needed so

For three million people out there who have done everything asked

of them, bringing up their children, going to work, this

Instead of manufacturing a phoney constitutional crisis,

why won't he put his toys back in the pram and appreciate he needs

This is what the Chancellor - George Osborne - had to say on Monday

night, shortly after the Government was defeated in the Lords.

I said I would listen and that's precisely what I intend to do.

I believe we can achieve the same goal of reforming tax credits,

saving the money we need to save to secure our economy while at the same

That is what I intend to do at the Autumn Statement.

I'm determined to deliver that lower welfare, higher wage economy that we

were elected to deliver and the British people want to see.

Following the government's defeat in the House of Lords last Monday,

the Chancellor - as you just saw - has promised to "soften the blow"

of the cuts to tax credits, which millions of families rely on.

But it's not clear yet who will be better or worse off under

the changes, all of which are due to have taken effect by 2020.

A single parent working 20 hours a week would be ?1,000 worse off.

A low earning couple with two children, with one parent working 16

hours and the other 37.5, would lose out by ?850.

But a mid-earning couple both working a five-day week

Later this morning, MPs will debate and vote on a plan

by Labour's Frank Field, which calls on the Government to water down

Mr Field - who heads up the Work Pensions Committee - thinks cuts

should be introduced gradually to allow employers to increase wages in

We asked him to make this exclusive film for you, meeting people who

receive tax credits and those who support the proposed cuts.

Hello, my name is Frank Field, I am a Labour member of Parliament for

Birkenhead and the chair of the Select Committee of the House of

Commons on Work and Pensions. Over the last couple of months,

Parliament has become increasingly concerned about what will be the

impact on individual families of the quite large cuts the government is

proposing to make in tax credits. I have some ideas about how we can

protect the very poorest in this position but also, there is a number

of ideas now before the House of Commons which we will be debating

shortly. Before that debate, I have come here in Westminster not far

from the House of Commons to talk to four individuals, all of them

taxpayers, but two of them also claiming tax credits. I want to get

the feeling of people who pay tax but get no benefit and also I am

interested in finding out what it is like to be inside the skin of those

families who face quite large cuts in tax credits next April one must

Parliament is successful in persuading the government to

mitigate the effects of cutting the tax credit bill.

Sarah, how would you be affected by what the Chancellor proposes? As far

as I understand at the moment, I would be 100, ?150 a month worse

off. For a family like mine, that will have a massive effect. We

already cannot afford luxuries, holidays, meals out and things. All

the tax credits go to her childcare bill. Me and my partner, I do not

work in a high-flying job and now the does he. And we do not receive

1p of any type of support from the government. And we managed to get

by. I think there needs to be a better distinction between who

actually needs them and who is claiming them because some people,

friends of mine, claim Working Tax Credit, and they actually bring home

more each month than I do and I work 37.5 hours a week. I am putting in

the hours but I am not necessarily receiving as much at the end of the

month as some of them. How'd you feel about these changes, Chris? I

do think it is right there are people out there working full-time

who have not got the amount of money coming in that some other people

have. Some people out there are one benefits of all sorts, housing

benefit and the rest of it, and they have got sky television, mobile

phones coming out of their ears, cars in the drives, and we have not

got any of that. When I was younger and had the children, we did not

have any of that because we were earning over the limit so that has

to be something, somewhere worked out so it is therefore everybody

including the taxpayer. Some people forget that people claiming tax

credits are often taxpayers themselves. I have paid into the

system and I have always worked. I continue to work even though I have

a two-year-old. The only way I can do that is through tax credits to

pay for childcare. The issue with me at the moment is if I work longer, I

pay more childcare. If I was to work full-time, I would pay almost double

the amount of childcare as I do at the moment. So that is not possible.

I would not have more money coming in. What about working longer,

Nicola? It is not as black and white as working longer hours because I do

not financially benefit and what way do with 11-year-old daughter in the

school holidays, in the evenings? I am on my own, I am on my own with

you like it or not. How about if the changes were phased in, but that

work? I earn ?10 an hour so the living wage makes no difference to

me. My daughter is my world but she costs a lot of money. To get her to

secondary school was ridiculous, people do not understand how much it

costs. Do not say to me I could not have a daughter, I could not afford

it. I was married, I always worked, things happened, I was 26 and I had

my daughter. What am I supposed to do, make disappear? You said you

earn ?10 an hour. I earn ?7 50 an hour so a lot to... How old are you?

I am 28 and I have 18 years more experience working. If you work it

out each month, would you find it you were bringing home more money

than me? I do not know. I earn ?11,000 each year. I rent, I get tax

credits of ?98 a week, I get help with my housing benefit and my

ex-husband helps. I privately rented my own house and I do not get

anything. Sometimes I do feel at the end of the month and when payday

comes around, I do see people around me who do benefit more. Chris, what

messages would you draw from what we had been talking about for the

Chancellor? E has the difficult job of coming back with new proposals.

It has rolled out of control. We have been trying to help those who

need help but in that process, we have also helped those who take and

do not give. What they do next year will push so many children into

poverty and it is not about adults, it is about the children. Once you

have given something to somebody and wants the government has decided to

make that decision that they will get that family that amount every

month, you do not take it away. That quickly. So the key question is the

pace of the reforms. How these cuts will affect individual families. The

Chancellor, thank goodness, has begun to talk about ringing in

reforms which will help some of the families who will be most affected

by the cuts. He perhaps for obvious reasons is not keen to talk to me

today so I am going to talk to a Tory MPs who has been supporting the

Chancellor all along. Mark, you have been broadly

supportive of the government in his attempts to win the benefits bill

down, why? One of the arguments which I think is important is it

does not aid -- it does not make a huge amount of sense to tax people,

to take the money away and effectively lose valued and hand it

back to people. At a later date. We have a huge deficit problem, it does

not make sense to take money away and give it back again. There is an

issue as to whether this will subsidise employees, employers, that

is debatable but I strongly believe employers rather than employees so

we need to resolve this problem. The government is now saying they will

bring in some changes to the original proposals, what is your

response? My response is that I hope the government sticks with the

overriding policy. It mitigates the effects on people at the lower end

of the wage scale. People do earn, they work 16, 20 hours a week and

Big Ben minimum wage and they will be badly affected by this and I

would like them to be helped, and they earn. One proposal I put to the

government is they should ensure everybody below the statutory

minimum wage should not be affect on but if they do this at no extra cost

to the taxpayers, it means people above that level would see benefits

at a tougher rate. What is your response? One thing I've -- one

thing I think is important for everybody, and you have plenty of

warning of what is going to happen, people can budget a year or two head

but they cannot budget from today to April next year. So I think whatever

measure you are proposing has to have a certain amount of flexibility

in terms of the delivery of it and if it means those people on higher

wages have greater flexibility but not necessarily that much. We need

to give them the opportunity to be able to plan for the future. And

also, to see the effects of rising wages coming through to those people

before they will lose out in terms of reduction in their working

credits. The Chancellor will be off his

rocker if he doesn't listen to you? He's a very sensible man and he

listens to everything. As the Chancellor it's an incredibly

difficult job of being able to balance huge numbers of different

things. Big divisions in the country over the government proposals to cut

tax credits. Here in the House of Commons today we will debate the

proposal I put forward to protect the poorest. But other MPs will be

keen to put forward their ideas as well. The effects of our debate, we

will know them in the Autumn Statement which the Chancellor will

give in a couple of weeks' time. As with so many issues in British

politics today, it's over to you, George.

Your views on the cuts to tax credits are very welcome.

Get in touch by emailing/texting/sending me

A couple of messages. Janet says the government is hitting the hardest,

the hard-working people they say to represent! If we are talking about

unemployment benefits than I could join in the argument, but the truth

is wages are not rising in line with costs, and that's the biggest

problem. Colin says that Frank Field, the Labour MP, helped the

Conservatives right at the start of the Conservative attack on the day

disabled and poor. He's one of the main reasons Iain Duncan Smith has

got away with it this time. Anything he says now goes in one ear and the

other. He's one of the 20 right-wing traitors.

News just in, the UK population will rise by 9.7 million over the next 25

years. Those according to the Office for National Statistics.

at least ?46 million of public money, despite warnings about

was run. We'll be hearing from one charity, who says it's bewildering

how much money the failed charity got.

And a leading fertility doctor calls for there to be a limit

on how much fertility clinics can charge the NHS, in an attempt to

stop access to the service varying so much across England.

First, it's time for the main news this morning.

A report on the failed charity Kids Company has found that it

received at least ?46 million of public money, despite repeated

The report by the spending watchdog, the National Audit Office,

says civil servants raised concerns about the charity, which collapsed

Friends of Bailey Gwynne - the schoolboy who was stabbed to

death in Aberdeen yesterday - have laid flowers at the gate

The school's head teacher says pupils and staff are in a

Police are continuing to question a 16-year-old boy

The Labour peer Lord Harris has accused the government of ignoring

a review he conducted on how to reduce the number of young people

More than 60 people have taken their lives behind bars

British Gas has contacted more than 2000 customers to warn them

their email addresses and account passwords have been posted online.

Bank account and payment details wouldn't have been revealed, but

the logins could have been used to see names, addresses and old bills.

Let's catch up with all the sport now.

There was another big night of League Cup football. The shocks

continued with Manchester United going out on penalties to

Championship side Middlesbrough. The England trio of Ashley Young,

Michael Carrick and Wayne Rooney all missed penalties, not what Roy

Hodgson will want to see ahead of another major tournament next

summer. Manchester City are through, as are Liverpool, and they are

likely to be the favourites for the trophy now. I will take a look back

at the round with former Arsenal and Celtic striker John Hartson later.

We will also be looking at Fifa and suspended President Sepp Blatter,

who admitted that before the vote it was already decided that the 2018 go

to Russia. The English FA say they will speak to their lawyers about

recouping cash for their bid. The world athletics Championships was

littered with medals. More joy for Hannah Cockroft, Richard Whitehead

and Hannah Davies. A silver medal for the men at the world gymnastics

Championships as well. Plenty of reasons to be cheerful. We will have

a closer look at those stories just after 10am.

A damning report out today into the children's charity Kids Company

shows it received ?46 million pounds in taxpayers' money over a decade

and a half, despite civil servants warning ministers SIX

times over the years that the charity wasn't offering value

Kids Company helped vulnerable inner city children and young adults

in parts of London, Liverpool and Bristol.

When it closed suddenly in August, big questions were asked

The report today from the spending watchdog the National Audit Office,

It details how Kids Company received government funding for

Over that period it got ?42 million from central government

Other funding came from local councils and lottery funding, and

More than half of the 42 million came

This is the charity's founder, Camila Batmanghelidjh,

back in August, telling us why it needed this money.

Young people, really vulnerable mothers, are hearing about us on the

street and making their way to our street level centres. A lot of them

have mental health issues, child protection issues, and they are

without food. We are completely overwhelmed by the numbers that are

arriving at our door. A lot of them are child protection, child mental

health cases. That's why I keep going back to the government saying

he cannot leave a children's charity with cases like this.

Today's report goes onto show how Kids Company received larger

In 2008, it was awarded 20 percent of the

overall funding from the Department for Education's grant programme.

The remainder was shared between 42 other charities.

And in 2011, Kids Company received twice as much as any other charity.

It got twice as much as Barnardo's for exampe.

The report also shows that officials repeatedly raised concerns

about Kids Company's finances, but grants were still awarded.

It highlights a "consistent pattern of behaviour" from staff at the

charity showing that Kids Company would lobby the government for more

funding, if officials resisted, Kids Company would write to ministers

expressing fears about redundancies and closures. Ministers would then

ask officials to review the funding decision; officials would then award

Two weeks ago, Camila Batmanghelidjh, and one of the

the BBC executive Alan Yentob, defended to MPs how

Yes, from 2014 onwards, we had problems. There's no question. Up to

that point, for all those years when I was chairing, from 2003 until

2014, it was well run, well-managed, in very difficult

circumstances. And this morning

we've got more detail on those years at the charity, when the

funding was overseen by the Cabinet In April 2015,

the Government agreed to pay the charity's annual grant of ?4.3m

upfront, rather than quarterly. And in June,

when officials warned ministers that a further grant didn't represent

value for money, they were told to We've asked to speak today to both

Camila Batmanghelidjh and Alan We've also invited the Department

for Education and the Cabinet Office to come on and explain this funding,

but both turned us down. Our bid for the Cabinet Office

ministers Oliver Letwin and We also tried to approach all

the former Education Secretaries Ruth Kelly -

we couldn't get hold of her. Charles Clarke - again,

didn't want to speak to us. We can speak to the chair

of the Public Accounts Committee. They're a group of MPs who monitor

what the governemnt spends. Labour MP Meg Hillier -

she describes these figures And we can also speak to the head

of the charity Children England, Kathy Evans, who says she's

in "shock" at the figures. Your reaction to the report and the

figures in it? I think it's really shocking. Some of it, particularly

in the recent parts of the story will be familiar to many of us

following since August. The most shocking thing for me was to see in

black and white the first grant from the Home Office in 2002 for

emergency funds to prevent closure. That has taken 15 years, nearly 15

years, of repeated brink of closure. That came as a shock to me. I work

in a charity sector, we are a membership body for all children's

charities, and we were part of the grand programmes in many cases,

receiving money. This is a very different picture from what we and

our members experienced from Whitehall decision-making. Where

Kids Company treated differently? Some kind of special case, you would

say? I think it's clear from the report that they were treated

differently, whether it's in the volume of ground they received

compare to others, or in the repetitiveness of being given

another chance. We do not have any money from the Department for

Education, but we didn't close, and we've had to adjust to the loss.

That's the norm for charities and our members. It is unbelievable that

over 13 years, as you highlight, repeated warnings were made. A

pattern of behaviour that there was a brink of crisis and requests for

better financial plans, but the money was given anyway. The first

grant of this year, the last grand, 4.5 million, it was spent very

quickly. Cathy Evans, one of the things I picked out from the report,

in 2013, Kids Company failed to win grants through the normal

competitive process, it rose is that you and other charities go through.

-- a process that Hugh. The Department for Education said it

prepared a public interest case to support it getting cash. Because of

the quality of the work and the damage to the government's

reputation. I think that's quite extraordinary. Those of us funded

under that programme were clearly told at the beginning of the two

years, don't assume there will be any money after this. It could not

have been communicated more clearly to the rest of us. During the course

of the second year, we were all quite explicitly expected to explain

how we were preparing for the end of the ground, and being clear with the

Department where there were redundancy indications, but where we

also might be offered an extension, just because that Grant had

finished, and we wouldn't get another one. That is exceptional,

absolutely exceptional. What do you think of the fact that up until June

2013, successive governments, Labour, the coalition and the

Conservatives, relied on Kids Company's self-assessment to monitor

its performance. It's one of the real concerns will stop its a good

thing they were asking questions, but the data they were getting back

was from Kids Company. Anyone else would think something was funny

there. If you were paying for subbing out of your own pocket, as

it is with taxpayers' money, you would want to know what's

responsible. Kids Company do say their books were independently

audited and passed the audit year after year. There is a difference

between being audited financially, and for is that the government put

the grants in for. If you look at the report, some of the real

concerns, some of is the government funded massively exceeded by Kids

Company's own figures. That should have rung some alarm bells more

thoroughly than it did. It pointed out in the report what was being

monitored was the number of interventions, rather than the

outcome, whether the interventions worked. Even know civil servants

over the years said you needed to look at the outcomes, nobody did

that. Who's responsibility was that? Our experience of that is that we

agreed outcomes at the beginning. We were rigorously challenged about

whether they were real outcomes and we had to report an quarterly. I

would say most of us, and our grant programme, add an independent

evaluator, not just an independent auditor. In our cases, self-report

assessment wasn't the gold standard for knowing whether they got value

for money. My big regret is when I think of the disproportionate grants

to Kids Company out of those rogue rams. It was a highly competitive

process. -- out of those programmes. Many other organisations will have

put in worthwhile bids, and been told it was worthwhile, but there

wasn't enough money. That's a real opportunity cost for many charities

who would have delivered something really valuable. From your point of

view in the charity sector, what do you think was going on with Kids

Company? What was it about this charity that meant that for years it

could continue to get so much funding even though it wasn't...

There was a cash flow problem, they all knew about it, and it wasn't

necessarily offering value for money. I have to say that in the

charity sector we ask ourselves the question as he went along. I can't

put myself in the minds of civil servants or ministers in terms of

their decision-making, and it will be interesting to watch the

committee next week. Kids Company was unique and they prided

themselves on being a very, kind of a loner within the sector. They

didn't join my organisation and rarely collaborated with others. For

many of us, they were known about but not worked with. We could see

something different was going on in terms of the favour they had and the

kind of funding they had. But, they looked like a very expensive

community project to me. By comparison to the value for money

that many other charities in the country offer.

Harry Potter fans curse at websites and phone lines, as ticket sales for

the wizard's new play are hit by problems.

A gay man has won the first-ever compensation award for scrum nation

based entirely on homophobic gestures. In an exclusive interview,

Tim tells us about the months of taunts he was subjected to based on

his sexuality. He sued a locksmith called Peter Edwards under the

Equality Act and he won what is believed to be the first case of

discrimination based on a case where not a single case was spoken -- word

was spoken. He has been talking to Clive Coleman.

I would describe it as a very minor difference of opinion.

It never got heated, the gentleman concerned, the individual, he became

a little bit defensive. He looked a sarcastic kiss at me. As I was

leaving the shop on that particular incident. A sort of was in shock

really after that and it would range from low-level sarcastic winking at

me, sarcastic kissing at me like you would see perhaps in a film,, you

know? But from a distance. But he was looking at me. He put his hand

on his hip, a teapot, if you want to call it a teapot. A limp wrist, if

you like. Hand on the hip? Yes, that kind of stuff. It was what I call

file and for the homophobic gestures. -- vulgar homophobic. It

is not pleasant, can you tell me the kind of things? The wording I would

use is inferring oral sex with a man.

This was 2013. It started initially in 2013 and into 2014. Not 1913,

1914. How did it make you feel that you were the subject of this sort of

mocking and abuse? It was that I was his joke. I was his bit of fun. A

source of amusement. I don't know. I do not know his mindset. It was

surreal. I was stressed out by it, distressed, a bit of anger. It made

me anxious. I suffer with anxiety anyway. And coupled with other stuff

going on. What you hope will come of it? The first thing I would say is I

do not regret anything I did and I would do the same again tomorrow. If

it makes one person come forward who is suffering, gesturing, verbal,

physical, whatever, abuse, you have to have the courage of your

conviction to report it. Otherwise, it will not ever stop. On the flip

side to that, if it stops one person in the street from gesturing, from

shouting something discriminatory to somebody, it might not just be

homophobic, it could be anything, the equality at 2010 is there to

prevent many characteristics and I would be happy if it stops one

person, a bigot, from gesturing or giving somebody who just has their

heads down minding their own business and going about their

everyday life, I would be chuffed and delighted with that aspect as

well. Tim, not his real name, talking to Clive Coleman.

We contacted the locksmiths company Taylor Edwards and their employee

Peter Edwards but they declined to comment on the case.

So projected figures now on that increasing population?

It is planning exactly what the population is going to be doing. So

the figures for this year, dating back to 2014, they have just been

released. Headline figures, we know it is a growing population. The UK

population projected to reach 70 million by 2027. It ticks down by

age. We have an elderly and ageing population which will continue. By

2039, more than one in 12 of the population will be predicted to be

aged 18 or over and largely that is a result of the baby boom of the

Second World War. They will reach that age. So implications in terms

of health and pension services. Also, and I think the big change

between two years ago is the change in migration. Those are the

interesting figures. The headlines, assumes net migration accounts for

51% of the projected increase over the next years. So they assumed net

migration, more people coming in and going out, that will account for 51%

of the projected increase over the next 25 years. And that is about 7

million? Yes, an increase from 43% two years ago. But you also have

direct migration, people coming into the country, and indirect migration,

so they tend to be younger people he will have babies here. So you have a

bigger percentage and that is 68% of the projected increase was down to

direct or indirect migration. So clearly a change. And people will be

concerned about that but the counter is we have an ageing population so

we need more young people to pay for these older people as well. So an

interesting snapshot of how the population is changing. Thank you.

Singer Phil Collins has said he is coming out of retirement, four years

Announcing plans to tour, the 64 year old said, "The horse is out of

# I can feel it coming in the air tonight, hold on.

# And I've been waiting for this moment for all my life, hold on.

# Can you feel it coming in the air tonight?

We can talk to our entertainment correspondent. Kevin Geoghegan. Do

some people call you Kevin Keegan by accident?

It has happened. Phil Collins did an interview with Rolling Stones

Magazine. He is officially out of retirement. The horse is out of the

stable and raring to go. He announced his retirement four years

ago and we have not heard anything of him in four years. He said in

this interview he is planning to go back into the studio, he has a

studio in his home in Miami which is nice if you can afford it! He plans

to go back next month into the studio.

Is that good news for fans? Great news for his fans! He is one of the

most successful singer songwriters in music history. I think alongside

Michael Jackson and Paul McCartney, between the three of them, they are

the only artists who have sold more than 150 million records worldwide

with a group and as a solar artist. He has won Grammy awards, Brit

awards, he has an Oscar, Golden Globes. He has achieved everything

any artist could want to over the course of his career. He announced

his retirement four years ago to be a full-time father to his young

sons. They have grown up now and he is anxious to get back to the studio

and get working again. His motivation is he wants to make

music, because he does not need the money. Absolutely not, he has an

estimated wealth of ?115 million so he has pennies in the bank. Some of

his solar albums will be reissued shortly. -- solar. Based on how they

get received will be motivation for him to begin recording new music. He

has not released a new album of new material since 2002. He had an album

of covers, Motown covers, in 2010 which did very well, but he has not

released new material for well over ten years. Are we getting to the

drum roll pushed up the drum solar. Turn it up. This is my favourite

bit. There you go! He was known as a drummer before a single. In 2007,

there was a reunion tour with Genesis. He was strumming and he

injured his back quite badly. That caused a lot of nerve damage which

meant he could not hold drumsticks. He had countless surgery to correct

that and recently in 2014, he said that he could not play the drums

properly because of the damage that had been done. He is almost

completely deaf in his left ear so he has had a number of medical

issues. But he has clearly spent four years in retirement. He has got

bored! He wants to make new music, so fair play to him. Thank you.

We have had an exceptionally bright full moon known as a Hunter's men.

We are seeing a full moon and also, the moon is that it's close to this

point to the Earth on the loony, is. So we have high tides across the UK

-- lunar eclipse. And across the Atlantic. Some coastal flooding is

possible with the exceptionally high tides. Flood warnings across the UK

and on the other side of the Atlantic. This was taken in South

Carolina yesterday. You can see coastal flooding across South

Carolina and they have had the remnants of Hurricane Bertha show.

We could see coastal flooding -- Patricia.

And it is warm? My heating has gone off! It is very mild and so was last

Halloween. We had 23.6 Celsius last year on

Halloween and we could see 20 Greece again this weekend.

What about today? Today, we are looking at rain for

many parts of the country. It has been a soggy start the day but it

will brighten from the West through the day. A return to sunshine for

many areas later. This shows where we have had rain already spreading

from the West. Heavy over higher ground in Scotland and the North

West of England. This rain continues to progress further East through the

remainder of the day. It will fizzle out into Eastern counties of England

this afternoon but squally winds as well. Further West, it will improve

through the afternoon with a return to sunshine. Sunshine across parts

of Wales and the south-west of England, but further East, still

drizzly and damp across the South East of England and East Anglia.

Miles, but fairly grey and breezy across the Midlands. Wales does look

brighter, as does England. After a wet start, looking better later

across Northern Ireland and Scotland. Sunny spells, showers and

rain lingering across the Northern Ireland is. This rain will push

towards the East. A quieter and dry spell before the next rain from the

South tonight. A wet night across much of England and Wales. To the

North of that, a chilly night, especially for the North West of

Scotland. Frost possible and fog patches first thing tomorrow.

Through the day, this rain will move steadily North, it will ease. Behind

the rain, cloudy and slightly drizzly. That cloud will break and

we could see temperatures up to 17, 18 degrees. So the mild weather

continues towards the weekend. We have southerly winds shoring up mild

air from the south, across much of the country. Temperatures will do

well during the day on Saturday. It will not be dry everywhere. Showers

for Halloween on Saturday but sunshine and in the sunshine, 18,

possibly 20 degrees. Sunday is cloudier. To summarise the weekend,

after the next soggy couple of days, things will stay mild, turning dry

as well, or do not expect wall-to-wall disguise, we could have

patchy fag -- purchase by -- patchy fog lingering.

I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme

As MPs debate plans by Labour MP Frank Field to water

we meet some of those who will be hit by the changes.

What messages would you draw from what they are doing? What they are

doing next year, it will push so many more children into poverty.

It's not about adults, it's about the children. Once the government

has made the decision to give something to somebody to a family,

every month, you do not take it away.

Plus, why leading fertility experts say a fixed maximum charge should be

introduced on the amount fertility clinics can charge the NHS

And if you've been trying to get a ticket for the new Harry Potter

play, chances are you're pretty disappointed this morning.

We'll tell you the best ways of getting tickets

Repeated warnings about the charity Kids Company didn't stop

it getting at least ?46 million of public cash, a report says.

The National Audit Office says there were concerns as far back as 2002,

but Kids Company kept warning of closures if public officials

Kathy Evans, the CEO of children's charity Children England, says Kids

It's clear from the report they were treated differently, whether it's in

the volume of ground they received compare to others, or in the

repetitiveness of being given another chance. We now don't have

any money from the Department for Education, but we didn't close and

had to adjust to the loss. That's the norm for charities.

Police are still questioning a youth about the death of Bailey

Gwynne - the 16-year-old stabbed at an Aberdeen school yesterday.

Friends of Bailey have laid flowers and there'll be

The head teacher says pupils and staff are in a state of total shock.

The UK's population will rise by 9.7 million over the next 25 years,

projections published by the Office for National Statistics show.

It's calculated net migration will account account for 51%

The rest will come from the natural increase of more births and deaths.

The Labour peer, Lord Harris, has accused the government of ignoring

a review he conducted on how to reduce the number of young people

More than 60 people have taken their lives behind bars

More than 2000 British Gas customers have had their email addresses and

The energy company has written to warn them of the security breach.

It says bank account details wouldn't have been revealed, but the

data could have been used to access names, addresses and old bills.

Let's catch up with all the sport now.

Three England players missed penalties last night as Manchester

United were knocked out of the League Cup by Middlesbrough. But

Jurgen Klopp witnessed his first victory as Liverpool manager. John

Hartson, former Arsenal, West Ham and Celtic player was at Anfield

last night. We will start with Manchester United though, not the

display their fans will have wanted to C. They didn't play particularly

well, hence going out on penalties last night. I think with Chelsea

losing the previous night against Stoke and Arsenal losing against

Sheffield Wednesday, they might regret the opportunity of not

fielding a stronger team last night and trying to win the trophy. You

were at Anfield. Jurgen Klopp, always entertaining. Is it working

yet? Yes, I think he works with the crowd. There were a couple of times

where Roberto Firmino went through and missed. He inside the crowd to

not get on his back and stay with him. You can see when they lose the

ball they try to get it back as quick as they can. Joao Teixeira,

great bit of skill with the backheel, and Nathaniel Clyne

followed up really well to score the goal off the rebound. Chelsea, Jose

Mourinho, they went out on Tuesday night. Can they get things together

on and off the field? I think it would be very naive to think he

can't. Jose Mourinho is a renowned winner. He's used to working with

top players. Chelsea have an abundance of top players. I think he

will it around. Everybody is just waiting for them to get on that run.

There have been a few off field problems. He's dropped one or two of

his major players, Hazard, Matic, Oscar, Terry, so it's clearly not

all happy and great in the camp. But Jose Mourinho is a proven winner and

I think he will turn it around eventually. Remember you can see

reports from all of last night's matches as well as the quarterfinal

draw on the BBC sport website. And we just want to show you this,

Celtic went through to the semifinal of the Scottish League Cup last

night, Leigh Griffiths with a great individual goal, and he also set up

the other one, Celtic beating Hearts 2-1. Great goal by Leigh Griffiths.

They won that League Cup last year, so they are trying to hold onto it.

We will stay with football, the FA is consulting lawyers after the

suspended Fifa President Sepp Blatter's stunning disclosure that

there was an agreement in place for the 2018 World Cup to go to Russia

before the vote took place. The FA spent ?21 million on the bed

including 2.5 million of public money. Chairman Greg Dyke said it

would be very nice to get the money back from the bid. Great Britain's

men have won eight team medal at the British athletics Championships for

the first time. -- at the world athletics Championships. A great

floor routine from Max Whitlock secured the gold medal ahead of

Japan. Everybody has pulled together and do their job. It was a great

display, pulling together, ignoring everything else that's going on, and

showing what we are capable. Everybody did their job. Even better

at the IPC athletics World Championship with a British clean

sweep in Doha. Hannah Cockroft won her second gold of the meeting with

a championship record time. Mel Nichols took silver with a

14-year-old taking bronze. Richard Whitehead won the 200 metre title

for the third time in a row, equalling his own world record in

the process. Aled Davies broke the world record twice in winning the

discus competition, to add to the gold he won in the shot put.

Fantastic performance in Doha. I will be back with more sport at

around 10:30am. Good morning, welcome to

our programme. We're on BBC 2 and the

BBC News Channel until 11:00am. Your contributions to this

programme and your expertise Many of you getting in touch about

Kids Company. It shows we can't trust ministers to look after our

taxes. Some are incompetent amateurs. Colin says the funding to

kids company is amazing considering I operated in only three relatively

small areas. National funding for something that is anything but

national. Another text, I've never contacted a programme before, but I

feel so angry about the Kids Company story, all that money for children

in three cities. Think what could have been done for other children

around the country, especially since it was tax payer's money being used.

Wheels appreciate your contributions. And expertise in any

area is always welcome. -- we always appreciate.

Texts will be charged at the standard network rate.

And of course you can watch the programme online wherever you

are - via the bbc news app or our website bbc.co.uk/victoria

-and you can also subscribe to all our features on the news app,

by going to add topics and searching 'Victoria Derbyshire'

Let's get more on that fatal stabbing

A 16-year-old boy has been held overnight by police investigating

the murder of a fifth-year pupil who has been named as Bailey Gwynne -

Our correspondent David Henderson is outside the school for us now.

What is the latest? The school remains a crime scene this morning.

This is normally a very busy school with more than 1000 pupils here.

Police at the gates, and police inside and outside, police providing

security at the gates but also continuing with their forensics

examination of the crime scene. After that fatal stabbing yesterday

lunchtime. Teachers are here as well, more than 100 of them, because

this at a really traumatic moment for the school. Nothing like this

has happened here, or, for that matter, any school in Scotland for a

long time. We understand those teachers are preparing for the

coming week. The school will remain closed for the next couple of days,

but when pupils return here, probably at the start of next week,

there will be a lot of concern, a lot of tears, and a lot of talking

to be done before people can put this very traumatic episode behind

them. In the meantime, the police investigation continues. A

16-year-old boy, who was detained by police in the aftermath of the fatal

stabbing yesterday, remains at a police station. We are told he is

helping police with their enquiries. He may continue to do so for the

next few hours. In the meantime, what we have seen over the last few

hours is lots of youngsters, teenagers, bringing flowers to the

gates. You can probably see dozens of bouquets of flowers with

heartfelt tributes to the 16-year-old pupil who died. We have

flowers and cards from fellow pupils, from parents and teachers,

from people in the local community who are just shocked and horrified

by what has happened. Can you tell us any more about Bailey Gwynne, the

16-year-old who died? What we know is that he was a pupil in fifth year

of senior school, 16 years of age. Somebody through the teachers

referred to, the headteacher referred to as a gentle and caring

pupil, somebody with lots of friends. A well liked young man. It

seems from what we can gather that he seems to have been a good guy,

somebody who got on well with people. Somebody who was quiet, but

was friendly and fitted in well. He had been at another school before

this one, he came here a year or two ago. But he seems to have done well

to fit in and get to know people in his year and make a good impression.

For all concerned, his friends and teachers, they are just shocked and

appalled as to why he, of all people, should be a victim of a

fatal stabbing. Joining me now

from Nottingham is a former school principal, Dr Belinda Harris,

who is now a child psychotherapist How does a school cope with

a tragedy like this? It sounds to me like they are

already beginning to do some of the right things, bringing all the

teachers together to develop a strategy for how they will support

the children and young people as soon as the police have closed down

the crime scene. That's really important. The leadership team and

teaching staff will also need support to begin to talk about and

communicate their own feelings and shock and sadness about this

terrible event. The school is closed because the police investigation

continues. Is that a good thing for the pupils? It's essential for the

police to do that. As soon as it can open, the better for the pupils. Why

do you say that? Because they need to gather. Particularly adolescents,

they like to gather in groups, and they are led by their peers. It's

important that they should be together to communicate their grief

and distress to one another and support one another. The teachers

and kids together will have to build their capacity to support one

another for a long time to come. This will have reverberations, not

just over the next week, but over the coming months and years, as

people who are in year seven in the school now, they will move up

through and share that history. Will you expect the head teacher to bring

in councillors to speak to pupils and members of staff? I would hope

that support will be available to the headteacher. Not particularly to

deal with individuals, apart from those young people who were closest

to both of the young people involved in the incident, but mainly to work

with groups using creative approaches, I would say. That's so

people can work together to release the distress and discharge their

emotions from their bodies by doing things together full stop it might

be creating a col arch, a theatre piece, whatever the kids want to do

to communicate and support one another. Perhaps some of the

children who go to the school, and their parents, might ask, is my

child safe? The pupils themselves, are we safe? I think in a traumatic

situation like this, that's the first thing to be completely

undermined, people's sense of safety. Particularly in a school

community and local community where there is less crime than elsewhere.

It's not a big inner-city that is used to it, people are in shock.

That worries me about the children during these few days when they are

apart, and they are using social media to communicate with each

other, that their sense of Ealing unsafe is intensified because they

are not with their friends. -- sense of feeling unsafe. All of that is

part two moving through their grief. Belinda is a psychotherapist at the

University of Nottingham. Leading fertility experts have told

this programme a fixed maximum charge should be introduced

on the amount fertility clinics can charge the NHS in England

for providing IVF treatment. One in every 50 babies born

in the UK is as a result of IVF, but access to it can vary greatly

depending on where Our health correspondent,

Jane Dreaper, can tell us more. What are couples are entitled to

receive on the NHS? They can expect full three cycles of IVF on the NHS

if they are under 40 and had been trying to get pregnant for two

years, that guidance have -- has come from the health Watchdog but

they are recommendations are not always consistent throughout

England. This problem has been going on for about a decade. Huge

variation. In Scotland and Wales, it is more like two. Will is on the

NHS, but they have got more consistency than the other nations.

Scotland has put in a lot of money and energy into tackling waiting

times. Why are there such variations across England especially? Because

IVF provision can often be targeted when health groups looking to save

money. It is something some people question, why do we spend money on

infertility treatment? It can still be a controversial area for some

people. In some areas have historically got rules about the age

limits of women and whether previous children from other partners and

relationships are a factor, although NICE says that should not be a

factor. And the fertility experts, what do they say? They want to see a

cap. This group of fertility doctors say there should be a cap on the

amount the NHS pays credit clinics for treatment because there is huge

variation in that as well. Here to discuss the issue is

Professor Geeta Nargund, the medical Director at Create Fertility clinics

and a leading figure in the UK fertility sector, alongside Isabella

Lafferty, who was refused IVF on the NHS and has spent 50,000

on private treatment. Professor, how much should one cycle

of IVF treatment cost? At the moment, as you heard, there is a

variation. A massive variation. Some areas, it is about ?1000. Others,

?10,000. I do not think ?1000, it is between ?5,000, up to ?6,000. That

is totally acceptable. Equal and fair access to treatment is a

fundamental value of the National Health Service and that is not

happening here, which is a scandal. Tell me why IVF providers,

contracted by the NHS, why are they charging sometimes ?6,000 and

sometimes ?3000? At the moment, the CCGs Commission it individually. I

believe if they do it collaboratively, they will achieve

economies of scale and cost savings. We will return to you because we

have bikinis. We can talk to our political

responds to -- breaking news. What is happening?

We have seen on the Iraq enquiries website a letter posted from the

chairman, Sir John Chilcot, to the Prime Minister, a letter sent

yesterday outlining the timetable for the eventual publication of his

report. This has been a long time coming. In this letter sent from Sir

John Chilcot the Prime Minister, we have learned this document should be

published in June or July of next year. The entire report will be

completed we are told by the middle of April, but after that, it will be

sent to national security for the process of screening so we will not

see it until next summer. By that stage, we will be more than five

years on from the last person to give evidence. Such has been the

longevity of the process in pulling together the information so John and

his team needs to complete their work but we now at least have a

timetable. And tell us again what Sir John

Chilcot has been looking at all this time. Yes, a huge amount. In 2009,

the 15th of June 2009, the then Prime Minister Gordon Brown said

there was a necessity to set up an enquiry looking into the lessons

that could be learnt from the Iraq war, over a huge period. 2001 to

2009, looking at the build-up to the Iraq war, whether troops were

trained and equipped correctly and looking at the aftermath of the war

itself. The beginnings of the process of gathering evidence then

began with all sorts of leading lights from the New Labour in Iraq

and senior voices from the Foreign Office and elsewhere giving evidence

in public. The last evidence session was on February two 2011. At the

time, we were told by Chilcot it would be some months before the

final report would be published. It is 56 months since that and we have

another seven, eight months until we actually see it. One reason that has

been given for the delay is a process known as allowing those

people being referred to and criticised in the report to see a

draft of that criticism and allow them to respond to it. Given the

number of people they have spoken to, that is a process that has

clearly been taking some time. This is the latter. You can see it here.

Six or seven paragraphs. A couple of hundred words. To give you the

specific dates, they hope to complete the text of the report in

the week commencing the 18th of April 2016. It says, at that point,

national-security checking of contents by a team of officials who

will be given confidential access to the report on your behalf can begin.

It is estimated that will take a couple of months. It says, I

consider once national-security checking has been completed, it

should be possible to agree a date for publication in June or July

2016. We expect to hear from the Prime Minister's official

spokeswoman within about half an hour at the lobby briefing at

Westminster for political respond -- for political reporters to hear his

response, he has been critical of the delay. I also expect more

criticism from the families of those who lost their lives in Iraq. 179

service personnel were killed in Iraq from the UK. No doubt huge

frustration from them that the wait continues to find out.

Thank you. Reg Keys, his son was killed in 2003 in the Iraq war. Good

morning. How do you react to the fact that this report finally, you

will get to see it in June next year?

It is with a certain amount of anger because I think this delay has gone

on far too long. The enquiry was first started back in 2009 and we

are now looking at 2016. It is seven years which is far too long. He

allowed this ridiculous process to run on too long. It was something

like two years. Six months would have been fine. There was no legal

requirement for him to do that and all we will get now from the report

is a watered-down version of some of the criticisms Sir John put the

civil servants and senior politicians in general.

Why are you so sure it will be watered down criticism as you put

it? Because under the process, any criticisms put these people, they

will have the opportunity to respond. And no doubt they will

respond to this through legal channels so you will have caught

cases going on along with the enquiry and Sir John will eventually

published a criticism both sides feel is exceptional -- acceptable.

It is like going into a court room to watch a case and you cannot hear

the original charges put the keys, only the sanitised version. The

families will not hear the original criticisms that Sir John pot to Tony

Blair, Alistair Campbell and other senior figures, only what they

believe was acceptable in the end. And the date of June next year, we

see no reason why it could not have been treated before Christmas. There

is a defining line between delivery of the enquiry and publication. Just

listening ever little earlier, we understand it will be delivered in

April for checking, national-security, and published in

June. I think we can go back to Chris Mason at Westminster. He has

been looking further on the website. Is that right? You have more

information? Some more information. From this

letter from Sir John Chilcot to the premise to, the final report will be

more than 2 million words in total. -- Prime Minister. To unpick the

justification for the delay between the completion of the report in

April and its publication in June, July, they say the reason for the

delay is firstly one of national security to ensure they do not

inadvertently each muscle security with the contents, and given its

length, they anticipate that will take time -- national-security. And

to ensure it is within the government's obligations under

Article two of the European Convention on Human Rights rights.

So the process will take less between April and June and July next

year when the report will be completed but it will be subjected

to external checks. Mr Keys, 2 million words in total, I

wonder what kind of things you were hoping the Chilcot report would

address? Well, I need to know why we had this ridiculous rush to war. On

the false sort of weapons of mass destruction and why Tony Blair felt

it necessary to mislead Parliament, the public and those great troops

including my son who went out believing they were going to face

this onslaught of weapons of mass destruction. I hope it answers

questions about the colon Powell e-mail saying Tony was on board 12

months before and he would handle the PR -- Colin Powell. That was in

November 2002, months before we went to war, he said Saddam Hussein could

stay in power if he handed over weapons of mass destruction. It was

a deceit and a lot of brave young men and women died in that conflict

and over 150,000 innocent Iraqi men and women and children. We need

answers, not just the families of the fallen in this country. I

attended two sessions of the Iraq enquiry and was surprised to see

Iraqi families who want to know why they lost loved ones in this

unjustified conflict. Saddam Hussein was no threat at that time and you

cannot justify the war that George Bush and Tony Blair and the spin

machine got us involved in. I am sure it you will have heard the

interview Tony Blair at the weekend where he said he cannot apologise

for removing Saddam Hussein? Nobody is going to support Saddam Hussain,

it he was no doubt an evil dictator. But I would almost guaranteed there

would be no IS in Iraq under him. It would not be a fermenting ground for

breeding terrorism. We've removed Saddam Hussein and created that

power vacuum filled by these warring factions. Tony Blair did allude to

this in that interview, about the Arab Spring in 2011. Perhaps the

recce people themselves would have dealt with Saddam and it would not

have exacerbated -- the recce people. It has spiralled in the

Middle East towards the West. Thank you for talking to us this

morning, Reg Keys. The Chilcot report into the Iraq war will

finally be published in June next year after its last took evidence in

2011. Back to our conversation about IVF

after the news and sport. The latest headlines.

The long-awaited and controversial Chilcot inquiry

into the Iraq War has a date for publication - at last.

Sir John Chilcot, the chair, says it should be ready

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq 12 years ago says it's still

not good enough. Repeated warnings about

the charity Kids Company didn't stop it getting at least ?46 million

of public cash, a report says. The National Audit Office says there

were worries as far back as 2002, but Kids Company kept warning

of closures if public officials Kathy Evans, the CEO of children's

charity Children England, says Kids It's clear from the report they were

treated differently, whether it's in the volume

of grant they received compare to others, or in the repetitiveness

of being given another chance. We now don't have any money

from the Department for Education, but we didn't close

and had to adjust to the loss. Police are still questioning

a youth about the death of Bailey Gwynne - the 16-year-old stabbed

at an Aberdeen school yesterday. The UK's population will go up by

9.7 million over the next 25 years - that's according to projections from

the Office for National Statistics. Net immigration will count for

just over half the predicted rise. The rest will come from the natural

increase of more births than deaths. A gay man has won

the first ever compensation award for discrimination based entirely

on homophobic gestures. The man was subjected to months

of taunts based on his sexuality. It's believed to be

the first ever case of discrimination based on a case

when not a single word was spoken. The Labour peer Lord Harris has

accused the government of ignoring a review he conducted on how to

reduce the number of young people More than 60 people have taken

their lives behind bars More than 2,000 British Gas

customers have had their email addresses and account

passwords posted online. The energy company has written to

warn them of the security breach. It says the data could have been

used to access names, Let's catch up with all

the sport now. The main headlines in sport, three

England players missed penalties as Manchester United were knocked out

of the League Cup. It was goalless against Championship side

Middlesbrough after extra time but Wayne Rooney, Michael Carrick and

Ashley Young all missed from the spot. The FA is consulting lawyers

after suspended Fifa president said blatter revealed that there was an

agreement in place for the 2018 World Cup to go to Russia before the

vote took place. Great Britain's men have won 18 medal at the world

gymnastics Championships for the first time. A superb floor routine

from Max Whitlock secured silver medal. Hannah Cockroft led a British

Queen soup at the IPC world athletics Championships in Doha.

Also gold medals for Richard Whitehead and Aled Davies. And Sam

Burgess has been given time off by Bath as he considers his future in

rugby union. He has been speaking to former rugby league club Sydney, but

his coach at Bath hopes huge stays with the sport.

We can carry on a conversation with leading fertility experts who say a

fixed maximum charge should be imposed on clinics providing IVF in

Britain. One in 50 babies born in the UK is born through IVF.

Professor, you were trying to explain why in some parts of England

IVF providers are charging the NHS ?2000 for a cycle of IVF, and in

other parts of England it can be ?6,000. That's not at all consistent

with the values of the NHS, it's supposed to be equal and fair

access. The inconsistency in price is unacceptable. The reason why,

generally clinical commissioning groups commission individually, and

they do not have the resources and knowledge base to understand how

much and IVF cycle should cost. That is why there is such inconsistency.

What I'm calling for is a maximum price, a national tariff for one

cycle of IVF treatment, which is exactly the same across the nation.

That fits in beautifully with what the National Health Service stands

for, increasing access to IVF for many more women and couples across

the country within the existing budget. It could double the number

of cycles in many regions where they are paying 6000 as opposed to 3000

in other regions. What the CCGs should aim to do is commission

collaboratively, join hands together with many CCGs, the same price, this

is what they will pay, and then they will achieve economies of scale. It

does happen with hip operations, heart operations, does it? Many

treatments in the NHS have a national tariff, which is what the

hospitals abide by. They have two abide by the national tariff to get

the contract. IVF, a treatment that is essential for many women and

couples who are devastated by the fact they can't get access to IVF

through the NHS, they don't have the money or don't know where to turn

to. It's extremely important that we as a nation address this urgently. I

hope the Department of Health, because I wrote to Jeremy Hunt in

July about this to take notice of it, and it will give more couples

access to cycles of IVF within the existing budget. I have not had a

reply from the Health Secretary. Why were you turned down for IVF on the

NHS? We were turned down because my partner already had children. It's

very disappointing for me, the fact he has had children doesn't mean

that I don't want them, and we want them together. I am still yearning

for a child. It was disappointing. What do you think about the huge

variation in charges across England? I think it's a scandal, a dreadful

scandal. Women who struggle with fertility problems go through all

sorts of anxiety, depression and trauma. This is an absolute scandal.

If the NHS can buy better, purchase a cycle for two or ?3000, why not do

so? I spent as much as ?15,000 on one cycle. That was in a very

well-known London clinic. But that wasn't successful. At least you have

the money to be able to do that? I was very fortunate. We had money but

aside for a wedding, but instead of using it for that, we used it for a

cycle of IVF. You're told at the beginning it will be several

thousand pounds, and you are encouraged to make many add-ons as

the time goes on. If the NHS can cap it then that will be right and more

women can have treatment. In Europe, it's funded a lot more. Six cycles

per year. And they have achieved it. In Belgium, for example, the

national tariff was established, they paid 4000 euros. No extras. It

can be done, it has being done, and we should do it.

More than 4,000 migrants and refugees have had to be rescued

off the shores of Lesbos this month alone.

Hundreds have already died making the crossing from Turkey and Greece.

There are fears more could drown as the winter approaches

But the people trafficking has become a multi million dollar

industry for the smugglers and up to 9000 people are landing

We sent our correspondent Ed Thomas to the island and in just 4 hours

at sea he counted 22 boats packed full of people making the crossing.

We've only been out at sea for a few minutes and already,

we've spotted this boat leaving Turkey, trying to get to Greece.

Behind it, there's another orange dot, another boat arriving.

What it tells you is that this flow is constant now.

You can see fathers holding their children.

Many of the people have not got any life jackets on at all.

There is a father there in the middle just holding on to his child.

Who would put all those people onto that boat, pack them in, and then

We can hear whistles and shouts coming from that boat.

People waving, trying to get our attention.

It's right in the middle of the Aegean Sea,

This is the exact centre between Turkey over there

Now, you won't be able to see them down the lens of the camera,

but I can tell you we have one boat on the horizon there,

another boat full of refugees and migrants over there, there are

I can see the specks of the orange life jackets.

And towards Greece, towards the bay down there, we can see two

There is a child at the front of the boat, she is

I don't think any of those people there have realised

And it's just luck if they make it across without

Kostas, how many years have you been fishing for?

You found seven people drowned in the sea?

All of them were together, people were wearing life jackets.

Others were not wearing life jackets, but they were all together,

And remember, every woman, man and child

The going rate is around 1,000 - 2,000 euros just to get a seat

This shows you just how big a business this has become now.

That boat has been towed away and is being used to smuggle and traffic

It's the biggest ship we have seen doing this

Hello! BBC News!

We thought maybe you were a smuggler boat.

They're yards from the shore, so close to Greece,

And there is an argument now about what to do.

It shows you that these people are not professionals,

they don't know the seas and that is why so many are dying in this narrow

And this is what it is all about - reaching Europe.

As these people were crossing, they were shouting, Syria!

They were cheering, they were screaming, as soon

But this is just the beginning of the journey.

They go on from here up through Macedonia, Serbia, Croatia,

trying to get to Austria, then Germany or Sweden or Denmark.

And to try to begin their lives again.

Breaking news, model and MTV presenter Sam Sarpong has died after

jumping off a bridge in America, he is the brother of June. The

40-year-old who lives in California died after officers spent seven

years trying -- after officers spent seven months -- hours trying to talk

him down. June has paid tribute saying his passing is a loss to the

world. She has said in a straight meant, I love my brother very much.

Sam was an amazing human being. His passing is a loss for the world. I

would ask anybody going through tough times to get help, please talk

to someone. That is the tribute of June towards her brother Sam

Sarpong, a model and TV is enter who died after jumping off a bridge in

the United States. Here, this bit of news regarding Paul Gascoigne. He

has pleaded guilty to harassment of his former girlfriend and guilty to

assaulting a photographer at Bournemouth Magistrates' Court, in

the last minute. Paul Gascoigne has pleaded guilty to harassing his

former girlfriend and assaulting a photographer as he entered a guilty

plea at Bournemouth Magistrates' Court.

From the first movie, The Philosopher's Stone, to the last

movie, The Deathly Hallows, the fanbase for Harry Potter films has

grown massively, and now its creator is taking the first Harry Potter

story to the stage, in a two-part play to make its world premiere

But if you've been trying to get a ticket, chances are you're pretty

Tickets for those who'd already registered online sold out within

an hour, but more do go on general sale tomorrow.

Matt Hemley is News Editor at The Stage - a theatre magazine.

And we can also speak to some who tried, and failed, to get tickets.

And we've got Megan Lucas, in Northampton,

What do we know so far? It is a play in two parts. Harry Potter and his

first child and it picks up where the seventh book finished. He is a

father of three school-aged children. My God! I know, it his

relationship is very much with his younger son. I think the past comes

back. A big deal for the West End? A huge deal, if you look at her books

and reading, I imagine that will work for theatre and so many people

will come to see the show. It will be an event. It is over two nights?

And you can get tickets for ?50. No, ?30 for two nights. Up to hundreds?

It goes up to ?130 for both parts. ?65 for each performance. In terms

of the West End, it is quite good value. Some shows go over ?200 at

the moment. So the issue is not the price, it is the fact that as always

with these things, Jessica, demand outstrips supply, what happened to

you? I've found out through Priority Booking -- I spent two hours through

parity taking -- Priority Booking trying to get tickets and I could

not, so just a bit disappointed. I am quite disappointed. How old are

you? I am 25. You are too old for Harry Potter! A group of with the

books and I read them countless times. -- I grew up with. Very

enough, I was not being rude, I was checking your age. What happened

with you? I queued for 4.5 hours waiting for tickets and I did not

get any. So you are queueing, or on the website? Queueing on the

website. Did you get a Countdown for where you were in the queue? Yes,

there was a list of people and I started at about 22,000 in the

queue. No way! It was really long. So you decided to wait? How far down

did you get? I did get to the end and the website had technical

issues. They said there was a lot of availability at the did not update

when they ran out of availability so I was furiously clicking, hoping for

something but nothing came up. So you did get to the front of the

queue through those thousands of other people? Yes, I did. Oh, no! It

was really frustrating. You are still smiling! Yes, yes. Just a

shame I will miss the play. Yes, it is. Katie, your technical problems,

you did not even get to queue. I did not get to that stage. I did not

even get the link once I had subscribed to the show to create an

account which was where they were selling tickets from the website. I

did not even get to the stage where I could queue and nobody was

available to help me on the day. Realistically, did you think you are

unlikely to get one anyway? So many people wanted them. At the end of

it, there were tickets available and people were getting tickets. There

were so many technical problems on the day, they did not anticipate how

many people were fans of the books, which seems absurd. The organisers

of the play said, customers can be assured we were doing everything to

ensure the process was as smooth and efficient as possible. I question

that quite a hit. Twitter was very hit and miss with who they replied

to. It was only when you gave them bad PR that they noticed you on

Twitter and even then, once they got to direct messaging, it took hours

to reply and even those messages were not helpful enough to get

tickets. Megan, what about you? It was different, I was trying to get

wheelchair tickets. I needed axis of all space. I spent five or six hours

on the phone yesterday. Phone system was not set up with queues. We were

left on hold for half an hour and it would cut out. So while the regular

tickets had a queue system, there was nothing for wheelchair tickets.

They had plenty of time to realise there would be that kind of demand,

we preregistered. There was no real excuse for not being prepared for

the demand. And what happened in the end? Eventually, after my messaged

the Twitter feed, the polite box office manager gave me a call and I

was able to book tickets but only because I was determined and other

people in the same situation could quite easily have been disappointed.

But more tickets will go on sale, is this right? Yes, general public

tickets go on sale tomorrow morning and they have announced they have

extended the booking period and they will do so again tomorrow. And to be

fair to them, 100s and 5,000 people did get tickets is today. So

although we have had bad stories, and 75,000 people were successful,

that a huge number to get the kids in one day so in some respects, the

system did work to accommodate that many people. You going to try it

again, Jessica? Definitely, yes. Good luck! Thank you. Good luck if

you are going to keep trying. We can bring you this news, it is just one

line. It says that China is abandoning its one child policy,

allowing two children for all couples if they should want them. So

dramatic news from China, they are abandoning their one child policy,

allowing two children for all couples, which will have indications

for the huge population. More on that on BBC news throughout the day.

A gay man has won the first of compensation award for

discrimination based and highly on homophobic gestures. In an exclusive

interview, Tim, not his real name, tells us about the months of

tolerance he was subject to based on his sexuality. He sued a locksmith

called Peter Edwards and the Equality Act and he want what is

believed to be the first ever case of discrimination based on a case

when not a single word was spoken. He has been talking to our legal

eagle, Clive Coleman. I would describe it as a very minor

difference of opinion. It was about some goods that I bought from a

shop. Quite close to me. It never even got heated. The gentleman

concerned, the individual just became a little bit defensive. He

blew a sarcastic kiss at me. As I was leaving the shop, on that

particular incident. I was in shock really after that. It would range

from low-level sarcastic winking at me, sarcastic kissing at me like you

would see perhaps in a film. You know? You know? From a distance. But

he was looking at me. He put his hand on his hip. The sort of teapot

if you want to call it 80 but. You know? A limp wrist, if you like.

Hand on the hip? Yes, that kind of stuff. It was what I would call vile

and vulgar homophobic gestures. It is not pleasant to talk about. Can

you tell me the kinds of things? The wording I would use is inferring

oral sex with a man. This was 2013 it started initially. Into 2014. Not

1913, to 1914. How did it make you feel that you were the subject of

this sort of mocking and abuse? I was his joke, I think, his bit of

fun. The source of his amusement. I don't know what his mindset was. It

was surreal. That is Tim, not his real name,

talking to Clive Coleman. We contacted Taylor Edwards and that

employee Peter Edwards, he declined to comment on the case.

So that news from a couple of seconds ago that China has announced

the end of its one child policy. In the last minute or so, it's official

news agency said all couples would be allowed two children. The

principle was introduced more than three decades ago to limit

population growth in the country. They are now relaxing that one child

rule. If couples want to, they can have up to two children. That is

breaking in the last couple of minutes.

A long-running bid to build the UK's largest mosque

in the London borough of Newham has been rejected by the government.

Our news correspondent, Emilia Papadopoulous,

Why has it been thrown out? A number of reasons. A lot of speculation

behind this, this is the second time these plans have been rejected.

People are calling it the mega- mosque. It has the capacity for

10,000 people and it would be four times the size of St Paul's

Cathedral. There has been a lot of controversy surrounding these plans.

The site was bought almost 20 years ago and the people behind it have

campaigned to have this mosque built so this is the second time it has

been rejected. In 2012, Newham rejected those plans and it was

controversial and about 3,000 people from the Muslim community went down

to protest. One main reason it has been rejected, people say if it did

go ahead, it could cause tension and division within the community in

East London and Newham. The government said today they rejected

the plans and the decision was based on concerns including local housing

provision and conflict with the council's local plan for the

borough. It also took into account evidence from all parties and it is

in line with the council's original advice from an Independent planning

enquiry. Do we know if that is it, no more? I suspect the group hand it

will appeal again. They have been trying to build this mosque for over

18 years and they have appealed the decision before and this will

definitely be a huge blow to them. Thank you.