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I'm Joanna Gosling, welcome to the programme. | :00:07. | :00:10. | |
More than 130,000 people are recorded missing | :00:11. | :00:22. | |
but what's happened to those left behind? | :00:23. | :00:25. | |
Don't leave it too late on Sunday getting back. | :00:26. | :00:29. | |
Nobody has seen or heard from him since. | :00:30. | :00:39. | |
We'll hear from one woman who tells us the only way out | :00:40. | :00:42. | |
She's now been reunited with her family. | :00:43. | :00:47. | |
Plus warnings that so many prisoners are falling ill from "legal highs" | :00:48. | :00:54. | |
that it is straining local ambulance services. | :00:55. | :00:56. | |
We'll speak live to the chief inspector of prisons who tell us | :00:57. | :00:59. | |
the abuse of psychoactive substances had turned them into the top | :01:00. | :01:02. | |
The terror attacks in Paris left 130 people dead and the world in shock. | :01:03. | :01:15. | |
Survivors tell of their experiences inside the Bataclan concert hall. | :01:16. | :01:23. | |
I'm still wondering why he didn't trigger his detonator at this | :01:24. | :01:32. | |
moment. If so, we would have all been killed. | :01:33. | :01:40. | |
Welcome to the programme, we're on BBC 2 and the BBC | :01:41. | :01:44. | |
As you'd expect we'll keep you across the latest breaking | :01:45. | :01:49. | |
And we're keen to hear from you throughout the programme. | :01:50. | :01:54. | |
Texts will be charged at the standard network rate. | :01:55. | :01:57. | |
And of course you can watch the programme online wherever | :01:58. | :02:00. | |
you are via the bbc news app or our website, | :02:01. | :02:10. | |
by going to add topics and searching 'Victoria Derbyshire'. | :02:11. | :02:13. | |
First this morning, there are more than 130,000 people now recorded | :02:14. | :02:16. | |
as missing by police, according to new figures seen | :02:17. | :02:19. | |
Most those who disappear will return home quickly, | :02:20. | :02:23. | |
But a small proportion, around 1%, are still not found a year later. | :02:24. | :02:30. | |
When someone disappears the first job of the police and other | :02:31. | :02:32. | |
authorities is to make sure they're safe. | :02:33. | :02:34. | |
It's thought there are 15,000 families in the UK | :02:35. | :02:43. | |
who are still trying to find their loved ones more | :02:44. | :02:46. | |
than 12 months after they first vanished. | :02:47. | :02:47. | |
Jim Reed has been speaking to some of them. | :02:48. | :02:49. | |
Every two minutes, someone is recorded missing. | :02:50. | :02:54. | |
95% are found safe and well within 48 hours. | :02:55. | :03:03. | |
But around 2500 people each year are still missing 12 months later. | :03:04. | :03:08. | |
He said "I'm going to mates at Mile End for the weekend" | :03:09. | :03:16. | |
and he said he would be back on Sunday because he has | :03:17. | :03:19. | |
On Thursday evening, the 8th of April... | :03:20. | :03:34. | |
"Don't leave it too late on Sunday getting back." | :03:35. | :03:45. | |
No-one has seen or heard from him since. | :03:46. | :03:51. | |
Five years ago, Matthew Green, on the right, vanished from his home | :03:52. | :04:00. | |
As far as his parents know, he wasn't in any trouble | :04:01. | :04:06. | |
His bedroom hasn't been touched since that day. | :04:07. | :04:12. | |
On Wednesday when I went to the police station, | :04:13. | :04:16. | |
I felt stupid, for want of a better word. | :04:17. | :04:23. | |
I thought, he's 26 and I'm coming here to report him missing. | :04:24. | :04:29. | |
I don't know if I'm doing right or wrong, or if he is missing, | :04:30. | :04:32. | |
He hasn't been in contact since last Friday. | :04:33. | :04:39. | |
Which is totally out of the ordinary. | :04:40. | :04:45. | |
And then they wanted to come to the house to look at his room | :04:46. | :04:48. | |
and see if there was anything that might show up. | :04:49. | :04:51. | |
That was totally unusual because at that time, | :04:52. | :04:58. | |
it was like this all the time, it was super glued to his ears. | :04:59. | :05:02. | |
He would never, ever leave his phone. | :05:03. | :05:05. | |
That's when the alarm bells started ringing, | :05:06. | :05:07. | |
Matthew didn't just leave his phone behind, he took his passport, | :05:08. | :05:14. | |
birth certificate and ?1,700 in cash he had been saving. | :05:15. | :05:19. | |
His parents have spent five years following every lead. | :05:20. | :05:23. | |
The last five and a half years have been hell, | :05:24. | :05:26. | |
Quite a few people have said to me that I'm a strong person | :05:27. | :05:33. | |
You don't see me when I'm in the bathroom myself | :05:34. | :05:40. | |
And then you continue, you just carry on. | :05:41. | :05:52. | |
I mean, I have done 30 years plus in the rescue service | :05:53. | :05:56. | |
and I have resolved a lot of different problems | :05:57. | :06:00. | |
for different families, but the hardest thing that I feel, | :06:01. | :06:03. | |
At the end of the day, I look at it and say, | :06:04. | :06:11. | |
I've done it for all of these other people. | :06:12. | :06:18. | |
I'm saying, I'm sorry, girl, I don't know what the answer | :06:19. | :06:21. | |
I can't wave a magic wand and make everything better. | :06:22. | :06:30. | |
Because it won't go away until we find him. | :06:31. | :06:36. | |
If someone dies in traumatic circumstances there is support | :06:37. | :06:40. | |
for the family and however hard, there is a resolution. | :06:41. | :06:43. | |
The families of the missing don't always get the same attention | :06:44. | :06:46. | |
from the media, local authorities, or the police. | :06:47. | :06:50. | |
Certainly the early days it's all about getting the message out, | :06:51. | :06:55. | |
getting the missing person back as quickly as possible. | :06:56. | :07:00. | |
Families in this situation for sadly months, years later, | :07:01. | :07:04. | |
they will say to us that waiting and not knowing is like some kind | :07:05. | :07:07. | |
Many families would say to us, how can I go out and go on holiday, | :07:08. | :07:15. | |
how can I move house, even years later, | :07:16. | :07:17. | |
In a handful of cases there is no resolution, | :07:18. | :07:24. | |
She didn't restrictions, she didn't like being told | :07:25. | :07:36. | |
what to do so when dad said, you have to be in by a certain time, | :07:37. | :07:40. | |
Mary Flanagan is the oldest missing person case in the history | :07:41. | :07:44. | |
She left home aged 16 on New Year's Eve, 1959 | :07:45. | :07:48. | |
She worked here at the giant Tate Lyle sugar refinery in the east end | :07:49. | :07:58. | |
of London and told her family she was going to a party that night. | :07:59. | :08:01. | |
The next morning when mum got up, she realised that Mary | :08:02. | :08:05. | |
So they went to the firm and when they got there, | :08:06. | :08:11. | |
they had the shock of their life, she hadn't been to work | :08:12. | :08:14. | |
Her sister Brenda was just eight years old at the time. | :08:15. | :08:17. | |
Back then there was no DNA testing or phone records. | :08:18. | :08:20. | |
Mary had a boyfriend, a man called Tom, but more than half | :08:21. | :08:24. | |
a century later his whereabouts and even his surname are lost. | :08:25. | :08:30. | |
The thing that comes to our minds, siblings, I'm sure it was in mum | :08:31. | :08:33. | |
That would have been the worst thing, at 16, | :08:34. | :08:41. | |
to say that she's pregnant. | :08:42. | :08:42. | |
Dad would have hit the roof but he would have calmed down | :08:43. | :08:45. | |
What were your parents going through around that time? | :08:46. | :08:50. | |
Hell, I don't know how else to explain it. | :08:51. | :08:52. | |
We was young and we wanted to talk, she was our sister. | :08:53. | :09:01. | |
We knew we had a sister missing, even though she was young. | :09:02. | :09:04. | |
Something in my heart is telling me that she's there, | :09:05. | :09:09. | |
we need to let her know we want her in our lives. | :09:10. | :09:14. | |
In the '80s and again more recently, police searched | :09:15. | :09:16. | |
In 2013 when she would, or could have turned 70, | :09:17. | :09:24. | |
Posters were printed and newspaper articles written, | :09:25. | :09:28. | |
It is still raw, especially at special times of the year. | :09:29. | :09:36. | |
Time is getting on, we are getting older, you know. | :09:37. | :09:43. | |
Something has to happen before it's too late for any of us. | :09:44. | :09:51. | |
Mary Flanagan may be unique but there are thousands of other | :09:52. | :09:54. | |
people missing in the UK for a year or more. | :09:55. | :10:00. | |
Every one of those cases is life changing, not just for the person | :10:01. | :10:03. | |
who disappeared but for the families left behind. | :10:04. | :10:10. | |
You can watch that film again on our programme page, | :10:11. | :10:12. | |
Later we'll be talking to one woman who said she vanished in an attempt | :10:13. | :10:17. | |
Thanks for joining us today, still to come. | :10:18. | :10:26. | |
The use of legal highs in prisons is said to be out of control | :10:27. | :10:29. | |
We'll have the details and find out why the authorities seem powerless | :10:30. | :10:33. | |
Some of the survivors of the shootings at the Bataclan | :10:34. | :10:42. | |
concert hall in Paris relive their memories of that | :10:43. | :10:44. | |
David Cameron has said a pathway has been created to help Britain secure | :10:45. | :10:55. | |
a deal to renegotiate its relationship with | :10:56. | :10:57. | |
He said talks at the EU summit in Brussels last night made | :10:58. | :11:02. | |
progress, but it would be "tough" to reach agreement at the next | :11:03. | :11:05. | |
We have taken a big step forward for a better deal for Britain, | :11:06. | :11:12. | |
but there is still a lot of hard work to be done | :11:13. | :11:27. | |
The energy regulator, Ofgem, has fined Npower a record | :11:28. | :11:31. | |
?26 million for failures in the way it billed customers | :11:32. | :11:33. | |
The money will be paid to the worst-hit customers | :11:34. | :11:36. | |
Production at Britain's last deep coal mine will end at lunchtime | :11:37. | :11:44. | |
today, with 450 people set to lose their jobs. | :11:45. | :11:46. | |
UK Coal, which owns Kellingley Colliery in North Yorkshire, | :11:47. | :11:48. | |
blames competition from cheap coal imports. | :11:49. | :11:50. | |
The National Union of Mineworkers has described it as a sad day. | :11:51. | :12:00. | |
Prison inspectors have warned that the use of so-called "legal | :12:01. | :12:03. | |
highs" is the biggest threat to safety and security in jails. | :12:04. | :12:05. | |
The chief inspector for England and Wales, Nick Hardwick, | :12:06. | :12:07. | |
who's about to leave his post, has criticised the government | :12:08. | :12:10. | |
for being slow to tackle the problem. | :12:11. | :12:21. | |
Pope Francis is reported to have recognised a second miracle | :12:22. | :12:24. | |
attributed to Mother Teresa, clearing the way for the nun to be | :12:25. | :12:27. | |
A Catholic newspaper said the miracle involved | :12:28. | :12:30. | |
the inexplicable healing of a Brazilian man with | :12:31. | :12:32. | |
Mother Teresa was beatified, the first step towards sainthood, | :12:33. | :12:35. | |
Let's catch up with all the sport now and join Hugh, who has | :12:36. | :12:40. | |
the latest on Jose Mourinho's sacking by Chelsea. | :12:41. | :12:52. | |
sport is dominated by the sacking of Jose Mourinho from Chelsea, just | :12:53. | :13:06. | |
seven months after leading the club to the Premier League title. They | :13:07. | :13:10. | |
have lost nine of their 16 games this season and are sitting just one | :13:11. | :13:13. | |
point above the relegation zone. Last season's heroics were not | :13:14. | :13:17. | |
enough to save Mourinho. His second spell in charge and he has been | :13:18. | :13:27. | |
sacked again. Michael said that the situation was down to a powerful | :13:28. | :13:31. | |
discord between the manager and players. We will have more on the | :13:32. | :13:36. | |
fallout after 10am. And at Fifa as Michel Platini has his case heard by | :13:37. | :13:41. | |
the ethics committee today. He won't be attending, saying the result has | :13:42. | :13:46. | |
been predestined. And eight serious fall for the basketball star Labuan | :13:47. | :13:51. | |
James. He was fine but the wife of Jason Day came off worst -- le Bron | :13:52. | :13:55. | |
James. We're taking a break for Christmas | :13:56. | :14:05. | |
and this is our last programme This morning we're going to bring | :14:06. | :14:08. | |
you some of our highlights from the past eight months | :14:09. | :14:11. | |
since we first went on air in April. On our first programme we looked | :14:12. | :14:15. | |
at the growing number of children aged ten and under | :14:16. | :14:17. | |
who have been referred to NHS support services to help deal | :14:18. | :14:20. | |
with transgender feelings. The figure has more than quadrupled | :14:21. | :14:22. | |
in the last six years. In particular, we head the story | :14:23. | :14:24. | |
of Lily, one of the youngest transgender children in the UK, | :14:25. | :14:27. | |
with permission from her parents Now I'm living as a girl, | :14:28. | :14:30. | |
I feel much better. Would you be able to draw me | :14:31. | :14:57. | |
a picture of how you look, Can you remember when you were being | :14:58. | :15:00. | |
treated as a boy, why you wanted I wanted to because I wanted to just | :15:01. | :15:15. | |
see how it looked and see if anyone Why were you so sure that | :15:16. | :15:26. | |
you would be happier Because I'm sort of am | :15:27. | :15:36. | |
a girl, I like girl stuff. Can you remember what you were | :15:37. | :15:48. | |
thinking, what you felt like when you were wearing boys | :15:49. | :15:51. | |
clothes when you were younger? When I started wearing | :15:52. | :15:53. | |
girls' clothes to school, I have girl trousers, | :15:54. | :16:01. | |
a girl cardigan, a girl Tell me about school, | :16:02. | :16:11. | |
what was the day They had footballers and fairies, | :16:12. | :16:17. | |
I was a fairy and my friend Can you tell me about | :16:18. | :16:22. | |
the outfit you wore? What else, is there more stuff | :16:23. | :16:25. | |
here that you wore on that day? Do you think as you grow up a bit | :16:26. | :16:50. | |
you might change your mind? Because I will just have girl | :16:51. | :17:18. | |
clothing and never forget about anything because girl things | :17:19. | :17:30. | |
are all over my room and I have a bunch | :17:31. | :17:32. | |
of Hello Kitty things. Can you imagine what it would be | :17:33. | :17:34. | |
like if you were living as a boy? I suppose what I mean is, | :17:35. | :17:46. | |
if you were not allowed to play with girl stuff and wear girl | :17:47. | :17:53. | |
clothes, if everyone around I would be really upset | :17:54. | :17:56. | |
and I would tell my mummy and daddy and see if they say yes | :17:57. | :18:02. | |
or no and if they say no, Now I'm living sort of as a girl, | :18:03. | :18:05. | |
I feel much better. As soon as Lily could talk, | :18:06. | :18:17. | |
she came into my room, I had a dress on and she said, | :18:18. | :18:27. | |
mummy, can I wear one Just so excited about | :18:28. | :18:32. | |
earrings and dresses. She was very preoccupied | :18:33. | :18:40. | |
with gender which, for a three-year-old, | :18:41. | :18:42. | |
this was unusual. I guess at that age, | :18:43. | :18:46. | |
it's quite cute and you think well, they'll grow out of it, | :18:47. | :18:49. | |
or maybe they will grow up to be You have two boys, one | :18:50. | :18:52. | |
of them is older than Lily. Presumably you brought them both up | :18:53. | :19:02. | |
in pretty much the same way? Yeah, my eldest son just did | :19:03. | :19:05. | |
everything you expected, he loved cars and tractors | :19:06. | :19:07. | |
and diggers and dinosaurs. You have a second and you think | :19:08. | :19:12. | |
they'll be the same but they just We are on the same page with how | :19:13. | :19:16. | |
we think we should go forwards and how we should support Lily, | :19:17. | :19:27. | |
which I know is great because I know families where that hasn't been | :19:28. | :19:32. | |
the case and it's What about the wider family, | :19:33. | :19:34. | |
your parents, Lily's grandparents? Yes, I think the wider family have | :19:35. | :19:42. | |
found it harder to understand and it Is there an element that you have | :19:43. | :19:46. | |
indulged your child I'm sure some of them | :19:47. | :19:55. | |
will see it like that, yeah. They will think that we should | :19:56. | :20:00. | |
have tried harder. Some may think that the child | :20:01. | :20:06. | |
is six, it is bound to be a phase, We thought that, I guess, | :20:07. | :20:09. | |
to start with. But this has been going on since | :20:10. | :20:16. | |
she first started talking. There's no point trying to force | :20:17. | :20:19. | |
them to be someone they aren't, you have to accept | :20:20. | :20:22. | |
them and support them. And throughout Christmas | :20:23. | :20:28. | |
watch our for special programmes from Victoria looking | :20:29. | :20:30. | |
back at our exclusive You can see the first part of that | :20:31. | :20:32. | |
on the BBC News Channel on Monday Next a warning this morning | :20:33. | :20:39. | |
that the use of so-called legal highs in jails has become | :20:40. | :20:44. | |
so widespread that ambulance The chief inspector of prisons, | :20:45. | :20:47. | |
Nick Hardwick, who's about to leave his post, | :20:48. | :20:50. | |
has raised the alarm over substances like Mamba and Spice | :20:51. | :20:54. | |
which are chemically designed He says it's the most serious threat | :20:55. | :21:00. | |
to security in prisons The Prison Service says | :21:01. | :21:04. | |
it is using a range of robust We can speak to Nick Hardwick | :21:05. | :21:08. | |
now and Steve Gillan, who is the general secretary | :21:09. | :21:15. | |
of the Prison Officers' Association. We can also speak to | :21:16. | :21:17. | |
Dr Hazel Torrance, who's a toxicologist at | :21:18. | :21:20. | |
Glasgow University. Steve, there has been an incident | :21:21. | :21:29. | |
overnight with prison officers taken into hospital. Indeed their house. I | :21:30. | :21:36. | |
have not had time to digests the Chief Inspector's report on the | :21:37. | :21:42. | |
substances, but what I can say is at Durham prison, yesterday, three | :21:43. | :21:45. | |
prison officers were taken to hospital, suffering from the effects | :21:46. | :21:51. | |
of MPS, just by breathing it in. They were kept to six hours, I | :21:52. | :21:57. | |
understand, in hospital, for observations, because their heart | :21:58. | :22:03. | |
rate was up and it was causing problems. Is this the first time | :22:04. | :22:07. | |
prison officers have been affected? I do not think so but the | :22:08. | :22:12. | |
information I have is it has happened at Durham in the past | :22:13. | :22:16. | |
couple of weeks and also at other prisons. There is not enough is | :22:17. | :22:20. | |
known about what is coming into prisons but I agree with what I have | :22:21. | :22:25. | |
read of this report there is a massive security implication for | :22:26. | :22:30. | |
prisons. How would you assess it? You have said the issues are so | :22:31. | :22:33. | |
great it is depleting ambulance resources. It is a serious threat. | :22:34. | :22:41. | |
Because each batch is different and people don't know what they are | :22:42. | :22:48. | |
taking... 19 prisoners have died, we think, from taking Spice. The | :22:49. | :22:54. | |
trading in prison causes debt, which leads to violence against staff and | :22:55. | :23:01. | |
prisoners. Some of the debt is forced on prisoners' | :23:02. | :23:05. | |
prisoners. Some of the debt is community. My thought is organised | :23:06. | :23:08. | |
crime is getting behind the supply and said the profits that can be | :23:09. | :23:12. | |
made from this go back to feed crime in the community, so it is not just | :23:13. | :23:16. | |
a problem for prisons, it is spreading to the community. How on | :23:17. | :23:22. | |
earth is this happening? Prisons should be the most secure | :23:23. | :23:27. | |
environment in the country. It should not be happening and it needs | :23:28. | :23:31. | |
to be stopped. Drugs get into prisons in a lot of different ways. | :23:32. | :23:35. | |
If you have a big training prison with a long perimeter, it tends to | :23:36. | :23:39. | |
come in over the wall. People will throw it over, sometimes using | :23:40. | :23:44. | |
catapults, putting it in tennis balls. In a local prison, where | :23:45. | :23:49. | |
prisoners go in and out to court, we have instances of prisoners getting | :23:50. | :23:54. | |
themselves recalled to prison with legal highs in their body cavities, | :23:55. | :23:59. | |
which they can then sell for large amounts of money and collect the | :24:00. | :24:04. | |
money when they come out, and sometimes staff are involved, | :24:05. | :24:08. | |
visitors are involved. You can spray legal highs on paper and sent a | :24:09. | :24:12. | |
letter in pregnant to do with it which you can bowl and smoke as a | :24:13. | :24:16. | |
cigarette. It is difficult to stop. Who is failing here? They have not | :24:17. | :24:26. | |
had an effective testing mechanism. If prisoners are under the | :24:27. | :24:35. | |
influence... They will be punished and disciplined for that. They will | :24:36. | :24:39. | |
be sanctioned. But if people take it... Most of it is undetected | :24:40. | :24:43. | |
because people will take it at night, take delivery and smoke it at | :24:44. | :24:48. | |
night in their prison cell and if it does not make them ill, it would be | :24:49. | :24:53. | |
difficult to find out what is going on. Normally what happens, there is | :24:54. | :24:59. | |
an effective test. They do random tests on prisoners so you can tell | :25:00. | :25:04. | |
if they are taking things they shouldn't. The problem is up to now | :25:05. | :25:09. | |
there is no effective test for legal highs. There are tests being | :25:10. | :25:12. | |
developed, but they are behind the game on this. Our prison officers | :25:13. | :25:18. | |
being lax in trying to deal with this? I think the prison service has | :25:19. | :25:24. | |
been lax in not keeping methods are up-to-date and it is putting | :25:25. | :25:27. | |
prisoners and staff at risk with violence that the MPS drugs are | :25:28. | :25:33. | |
having, it is a massive increase over the past year. 37% increase on | :25:34. | :25:41. | |
violence. You put it down to the drugs? Absolutely. In relation to | :25:42. | :25:46. | |
the drugs, prisoners have been taken to hospital because they are out of | :25:47. | :25:51. | |
control with these drugs. And because they cannot be detected, I | :25:52. | :25:59. | |
am worried about the staff, the health and safety of prison officers | :26:00. | :26:03. | |
breathing in fumes, coming into contact with these drugs, that | :26:04. | :26:07. | |
nobody knows a lot about. The difficulty is it is making prisons | :26:08. | :26:13. | |
more violent, it is making the health and safety of prison | :26:14. | :26:17. | |
officers, putting that to the test. I think Nick is right. I believe the | :26:18. | :26:23. | |
prison service need to get tougher on this. We need more staff, Nick | :26:24. | :26:29. | |
mentioned perimeters, there is not enough being done. Prison officers | :26:30. | :26:34. | |
have been cut by 30% in the past five years. Numbers have decreased | :26:35. | :26:38. | |
and it makes prisons on stable. We can bring in our forensic toxicology | :26:39. | :26:45. | |
expert. Tell us more about these drugs. We hear about the impact of | :26:46. | :26:49. | |
them not just on prisoners but people around them. If prison | :26:50. | :26:54. | |
officers are going to hospital having inhaled something like this | :26:55. | :26:56. | |
from a distance, how potent are they? The short answer is we do not | :26:57. | :27:04. | |
know. They are variable. Everybody has an individual effect it to them. | :27:05. | :27:12. | |
There is such an unknown in everything surrounding these drugs | :27:13. | :27:18. | |
in prison. It is not just inhalation of these drugs, but officers who | :27:19. | :27:23. | |
have to deal with these people who are very violent, hallucinating, it | :27:24. | :27:26. | |
is not an easy situation to deal with. Would you say the effects are | :27:27. | :27:32. | |
worse than illegal drugs in some cases? I think the problem is it is | :27:33. | :27:41. | |
so uncontrolled and unpredictable. We know quite a bit about the | :27:42. | :27:45. | |
classic drugs of abuse. People know how to take them. With these newer | :27:46. | :27:54. | |
drugs, they can be so variable, the concentrations, the mixtures, how | :27:55. | :27:58. | |
people take them, whether you can snort these things as well as smoke | :27:59. | :28:05. | |
them. There are many unknowns. Prison say there is a zero tolerance | :28:06. | :28:10. | |
policy on drugs. Is that meaningless when we hear this? If they know | :28:11. | :28:16. | |
someone is taking it, the prisoner will be sanctioned and disciplined. | :28:17. | :28:21. | |
The problem is there is not an effective testing mechanism. This is | :28:22. | :28:26. | |
not organic, it is not growing, it is manufactured in a sort of factory | :28:27. | :28:31. | |
in a kitchen, garage, and each batch is different. That is why it is | :28:32. | :28:36. | |
difficult to test for and why the effects are unpredictable. There has | :28:37. | :28:39. | |
to be away for the authorities to get a grip on this. There are two | :28:40. | :28:45. | |
things they need to do. They need to develop testing methods that enable | :28:46. | :28:50. | |
it to spotted and dealt with. How far off is that? They tell us it is | :28:51. | :28:56. | |
almost there, I think there are tests being piloted at the moment. | :28:57. | :29:01. | |
It is not just a question of stopping the supply, you also need | :29:02. | :29:07. | |
to reduce demand. You can do education with prisoners. Often | :29:08. | :29:11. | |
prisoners educating other prisoners works well, so there is a credible | :29:12. | :29:16. | |
source of information, telling them how dangerous it is. You can have | :29:17. | :29:21. | |
equipment, trying to wean people off. These things are some way off, | :29:22. | :29:25. | |
in the meantime how worried are you about what is going on? There is a | :29:26. | :29:32. | |
real risk now. At the moment it is the most serious threat to safety | :29:33. | :29:39. | |
and security in the prison system. It is... It could lead to death | :29:40. | :29:46. | |
because of the effects. It is leading to violence. It is rippling | :29:47. | :29:50. | |
out beyond prison walls into the community, into the families of | :29:51. | :29:54. | |
prisoners having to pay off debt sometimes, and into the communities | :29:55. | :29:58. | |
who suffer from crime gangs who are behind this, who are getting rich on | :29:59. | :30:00. | |
profits to be made. Nick is absolutely right, I think | :30:01. | :30:11. | |
the contributory factor to prisoners's debts is unacceptable to | :30:12. | :30:17. | |
the prison service. I believe prisoners have been bullied into | :30:18. | :30:20. | |
taking them, to test them out, to pay off debts, to see the reaction. | :30:21. | :30:26. | |
And I worry about prison officers. Michael Burr has agreed to meet me | :30:27. | :30:33. | |
next week because it is a major problem. Keep us updated, thank you. | :30:34. | :30:39. | |
Martin has said that nothing should be legal about these drugs, they | :30:40. | :30:43. | |
should all be banned. Another says that if anybody be to take a drug to | :30:44. | :30:48. | |
get out of living, they should get help. And a statement from the | :30:49. | :30:52. | |
Ministry of Justice, saying they take a zero justice approach and | :30:53. | :30:55. | |
there are a range of measures. Coming up, we'll be live | :30:56. | :31:15. | |
at Kellingley Colliery in North Yorkshire, Britain's | :31:16. | :31:17. | |
last deep coal mine, which ceases production today | :31:18. | :31:19. | |
with the loss of hundreds of jobs. So many questions are still being | :31:20. | :31:24. | |
asked about last month's terror What was it like to be | :31:25. | :31:27. | |
one of the 1,500 people inside the Bataclan concert hall | :31:28. | :31:32. | |
as three gunmen unleashed the carnage that would ultimately | :31:33. | :31:34. | |
leave 90 concertgoers dead. You're about to hear from some | :31:35. | :31:37. | |
of those who lived through As you might expect, | :31:38. | :31:40. | |
much of what they say in this | :31:41. | :31:44. | |
extraordinary film by Newsnight's The film is 11 minutes long, | :31:45. | :31:46. | |
so if you'd rather not watch then you've got time to do | :31:47. | :31:53. | |
something else for a bit. But if you want | :31:54. | :31:55. | |
to carry on watching, It had been Katie's birthday three | :31:56. | :31:57. | |
weeks previously and I had decided It had been Katie's birthday three | :31:58. | :32:52. | |
getaway. It's one of the best musicals in Paris. We thought we | :32:53. | :32:55. | |
would have one of the best nights of our lives. | :32:56. | :33:10. | |
We saw Jesse standing there so we asked him if it was OK for pictures | :33:11. | :33:18. | |
and he said of course. He said to us that he would rock the place for us | :33:19. | :33:25. | |
tonight and we were really excited about it. | :33:26. | :33:35. | |
We were thinking probably we would avoid going into the big crowd and | :33:36. | :33:45. | |
maybe it would be better to stand back by the door. In that picture we | :33:46. | :33:54. | |
are just behind Paul. A few steps down to the main dance floor the bar | :33:55. | :34:01. | |
is behind us. And the entrance doors are directly behind us. | :34:02. | :34:12. | |
I posted my traditional picture on Facebook, some videos. We said it | :34:13. | :34:31. | |
was one of the best concerts we've seen because of the energy of the | :34:32. | :34:34. | |
band and the public. It is one of the most beautiful | :34:35. | :35:00. | |
venues in Paris, we were one of the first to get in, to be within a few | :35:01. | :35:04. | |
metres. It was the first time I was seeing | :35:05. | :35:20. | |
them on stage and it was fun, it was very fun until the fifth or sixth | :35:21. | :35:22. | |
song, when it all began. We heard, you know, clacking noise | :35:23. | :36:07. | |
is, something very weird. -- noises. I felt a knock, something being | :36:08. | :36:35. | |
spilt on my shoulder. David was standing behind me, kind of | :36:36. | :36:39. | |
protecting me from getting bashed, moved around at the concert. I | :36:40. | :36:45. | |
turned to David and as I said "Did somebody spilled their drink?" ... | :36:46. | :36:54. | |
They're worth flushes and sparks and persistent gunfire -- flashes. It | :36:55. | :37:00. | |
wasn't a good sound. The only way to know is to look at the guys on the | :37:01. | :37:05. | |
stage and I could see them looking towards the entrance. And their | :37:06. | :37:15. | |
mouths just dropped and I could see fear and I knew that there was death | :37:16. | :37:16. | |
on their faces. They were getting nervous because | :37:17. | :37:30. | |
they wanted the police to stay far from the corridor. There is also a | :37:31. | :37:39. | |
big silence. We saw before the final assault the red lights, so we knew | :37:40. | :37:42. | |
that people were on the roof, snipers. We knew that the police | :37:43. | :37:49. | |
were there. Every hostage is very quiet. We didn't talk to each other. | :37:50. | :38:00. | |
The three hostages behind the door, the terrorists were giving orders to | :38:01. | :38:07. | |
these hostages, asking them to listen to what was happening inside | :38:08. | :38:18. | |
the Bataclan. And for the six first standing in front of the window, the | :38:19. | :38:24. | |
action was to look at what was happening in front. | :38:25. | :38:31. | |
How many people we were, where we are, whether we are safe, whether | :38:32. | :38:39. | |
there are injuries. They asked if we could see the explosive belt. The | :38:40. | :38:47. | |
terrorists asks one of the hostages to shout the smartphone number to | :38:48. | :38:55. | |
the police. During this period they had more or less five or six calls. | :38:56. | :39:05. | |
The terrorists were only saying "We have hostages, we have exposed | :39:06. | :39:10. | |
belts. If you come too close, we are going to kill the hostages, so stay | :39:11. | :39:18. | |
far. " They seemed not to have any demands. So it gave more impact for | :39:19. | :39:28. | |
me, the fact that they were going to kill us. | :39:29. | :39:34. | |
There's a lot of shooting and explosions. Going boom, boom, boom. | :39:35. | :39:46. | |
The police were throwing stun grenades. And this moment, I fell. | :39:47. | :40:02. | |
I think I was the last hostage, maybe one of the last. I can | :40:03. | :40:13. | |
remember precisely the image of one of the terrorists shooting. In one | :40:14. | :40:23. | |
hand he has his Kalashnikov and in the other hand, his finger on the | :40:24. | :40:24. | |
detonator. So, two terrorists are escaping | :40:25. | :40:41. | |
using the stairs. At this moment, the police start shooting. | :40:42. | :40:49. | |
I'm still wondering why he didn't trigger his detonator at this | :40:50. | :40:59. | |
moment. If so, we would have all been killed. | :41:00. | :41:16. | |
When the police took us out of the corridor, they said not to look at | :41:17. | :41:27. | |
what's happening in front of the stage. But it wasn't easy for us not | :41:28. | :41:36. | |
to have a look. How can you think like that, walking in and shooting | :41:37. | :41:43. | |
people in the back while they are having fun at a concert, you know? | :41:44. | :41:50. | |
It doesn't make any sense to me and I don't think it makes sense to you | :41:51. | :41:52. | |
either. How are you sleeping? Not very well, | :41:53. | :42:10. | |
a lot of nightmares. During that dream, every time, I think my brain | :42:11. | :42:18. | |
is trying to let me see what it was protecting me from. Every night it | :42:19. | :42:23. | |
is the same dream, the black background. I don't feel any anger | :42:24. | :42:33. | |
or hatred, it's just sadness. I feel sad about everybody that was there, | :42:34. | :42:38. | |
whether they were the ones shooting, or the people who were shot. I just | :42:39. | :42:44. | |
feel very sad. There's no point in being angry, it's done. | :42:45. | :43:13. | |
That film was made by Warwick Harrington and Alessandra | :43:14. | :43:15. | |
You can watch a much longer version of that film online, | :43:16. | :43:21. | |
follow the links at bbc.co.uk/newsnight. | :43:22. | :43:28. | |
Coming up: more than 100,000 people are missing in the UK at anyone | :43:29. | :43:36. | |
time. We'll speak to one woman who disappeared from home for 18 months. | :43:37. | :43:41. | |
We'll talk to her about why she went and why she decided to go home in | :43:42. | :43:45. | |
the end. Now, let's catch up with the weather. Sarah Keith Lucas has | :43:46. | :43:52. | |
the details. It's so mild, it seems a silly question, but any prospect | :43:53. | :43:56. | |
of a white Christmas? It has been very mild, it feels more like the | :43:57. | :44:00. | |
middle of May. We are going to keep that theme to the weather as we head | :44:01. | :44:05. | |
towards the festive period. Looking at white Christmases, that's what | :44:06. | :44:08. | |
everyone is wishing for, it only needs one flake of snow to be | :44:09. | :44:13. | |
observed falling during the 24 hours of Christmas day, at any of our | :44:14. | :44:19. | |
weather stations, that constitutes a white Christmas. Has it ever | :44:20. | :44:24. | |
happened that there is one flake? Probably not! Normally more than | :44:25. | :44:29. | |
that. It is reasonably common, over the last 55 years we have had a | :44:30. | :44:34. | |
white Christmas 38 times, so in theory it is more likely than not | :44:35. | :44:38. | |
that some parts of the country will see a white Christmas. The most | :44:39. | :44:42. | |
white on record, when we had the most snow, that was five years ago, | :44:43. | :44:49. | |
in 2010. Many parts of the country, 80% of the weather stations in fact | :44:50. | :44:52. | |
reported snow lying on the ground in 2010. | :44:53. | :44:58. | |
I remember it well! If we look ahead at the festive period we are likely | :44:59. | :45:06. | |
to see colder air pushing into northern parts of the country with | :45:07. | :45:09. | |
just a chance we could see hill Snow, mainly on top of the mountains | :45:10. | :45:14. | |
of Scotland, but for the majority, we are not likely to see a white | :45:15. | :45:19. | |
Christmas. Further south stay mild and unsettled, so breezy and | :45:20. | :45:24. | |
outbreaks of rain. It does not feel like Christmas. It has been | :45:25. | :45:28. | |
particularly mild over the past few weeks. December well above average | :45:29. | :45:32. | |
for the time of year. Weather watchers have sent pictures of him | :45:33. | :45:38. | |
roses blossoming in Kent, daffodils also. We have heard wide reports of | :45:39. | :45:44. | |
spring bulbs popping up as brothers blossom on the trees. Mild weather | :45:45. | :45:49. | |
will continue for the next few days. Outbreaks of rain pushing across | :45:50. | :45:54. | |
Northern Ireland, Scotland, into the north-west of England. Further south | :45:55. | :45:58. | |
and east, dry conditions and brightness, some sunshine in the | :45:59. | :46:03. | |
east. In the west, cloudy. Some hill fog. Drizzle in the south-west and | :46:04. | :46:09. | |
Wales. Further east, the best of the brighter skies in Kent, up towards | :46:10. | :46:14. | |
Norfolk. Further north, some rain across parts of the north-west of | :46:15. | :46:19. | |
England, but nothing heavy today. Spells of rain in Northern Ireland | :46:20. | :46:24. | |
and west Scotland, around 50 millimetres of rain by the end of | :46:25. | :46:28. | |
the day. This evening we'd lose their heaviest of the rain. Cloudy, | :46:29. | :46:34. | |
murky, hill fog and patchy rain and drizzle overnight. Very mild. It | :46:35. | :46:41. | |
could be record-breaking tonight. Possibly the warmest December night | :46:42. | :46:45. | |
ever on record across some parts of the country. Saturday dawning on a | :46:46. | :46:51. | |
mild note. The next weather front during Saturday is positioned | :46:52. | :46:55. | |
through the central part of the country. It will be slow-moving and | :46:56. | :47:00. | |
there will be spells of rain particularly in the south-west of | :47:01. | :47:04. | |
England, Wales and northern England. In the south-east, looking dry and | :47:05. | :47:09. | |
mild. Further north and west, sunshine and scattered showers in | :47:10. | :47:12. | |
Northern Ireland and Scotland. Temperatures up to 12 even 16 | :47:13. | :47:21. | |
Celsius. On Sunday, not quite as mild. A slightly fresher feel to the | :47:22. | :47:27. | |
weather. Some showers in North and north-west parts. Further south and | :47:28. | :47:33. | |
east, remaining dry and bright. Looking ahead towards Christmas | :47:34. | :47:37. | |
week, the festive outlook looks like we will keep mild weather in many | :47:38. | :47:42. | |
parts of the country. There will be further rain and breezy at times. | :47:43. | :47:47. | |
But foremost, a white is pretty unlikely. | :47:48. | :47:49. | |
Hello, it's Friday, it's ten o'clock, I'm Joanna Gosling. | :47:50. | :47:52. | |
Welcome to the programme if you've just joined us. | :47:53. | :47:54. | |
More than 100,000 people are currently missing in the UK | :47:55. | :47:58. | |
and although most will return home quickly, some families may never | :47:59. | :48:01. | |
Don't leave it too late on Sunday getting back. | :48:02. | :48:18. | |
We will have a special report and heard from him since. | :48:19. | :48:31. | |
We will have a special report and speak to a woman who disappeared | :48:32. | :48:37. | |
from home for 80 months. -- 18 months. | :48:38. | :48:38. | |
Also on th programme - the end of an era - | :48:39. | :48:41. | |
Britain's last deep coal mine ceases production today - | :48:42. | :48:43. | |
It is their way of life, their dad and grandparents have done it. It is | :48:44. | :48:53. | |
built into them. I would love to see it carry on, but unfortunately, it | :48:54. | :48:54. | |
is not. It's the Strictly | :48:55. | :48:57. | |
final this weekend. We'll be talking to some | :48:58. | :48:58. | |
of the professional dancers An update on the menus. -- main | :48:59. | :49:00. | |
news. David Cameron has said a pathway has | :49:01. | :49:18. | |
been created to help Britain secure a deal to renegotiate | :49:19. | :49:21. | |
its relationship with He said talks at the EU summit | :49:22. | :49:23. | |
in Brussels last night made progress, but it would be "tough" | :49:24. | :49:27. | |
to reach agreement at the next We have taken a big step forward | :49:28. | :49:30. | |
for a better deal for Britain, but there is still a lot | :49:31. | :49:34. | |
of hard work to be done. Energy regulator Ofgem has fined | :49:35. | :49:44. | |
Npower a record twenty six million pounds for failures | :49:45. | :49:46. | |
in the way it billed customers Npower's billing issues affected | :49:47. | :49:49. | |
more than half a million customers between September 2013 and December | :49:50. | :49:52. | |
2014. Prison inspectors have warned | :49:53. | :49:54. | |
that the use of so-called "legal highs" is the biggest threat | :49:55. | :49:57. | |
to safety and security in jails. The Chief Inspector for England | :49:58. | :50:02. | |
and Wales, Nick Hardwick, who's about to leave his post, | :50:03. | :50:05. | |
has criticised the government for being slow to | :50:06. | :50:07. | |
tackle the problem. It is undoubtedly causing... It has | :50:08. | :50:17. | |
led to death because of health effects. It is leading to serious | :50:18. | :50:23. | |
levels of islands against staff and prisoners and it is moving out into | :50:24. | :50:27. | |
the community, the families of prisoners who have to pay off debt | :50:28. | :50:30. | |
sometimes and into the communities who suffer from the crime gangs | :50:31. | :50:34. | |
behind this, you are getting rich on the profits to be made in this | :50:35. | :50:35. | |
trade. Production at Britain's last deep | :50:36. | :50:37. | |
coal mine will end at lunchtime today, with 450 people | :50:38. | :50:39. | |
set to lose their jobs. UK Coal, which owns Kellingley | :50:40. | :50:43. | |
Colliery in North Yorkshire, blames competition | :50:44. | :50:45. | |
from cheap coal imports. The National Union of Mineworkers | :50:46. | :50:48. | |
has described it as a sad day. Pope Francis is reported to have | :50:49. | :50:56. | |
recognised a second miracle attributed to Mother Teresa, | :50:57. | :51:02. | |
clearing the way for the nun to be A Catholic newspaper said | :51:03. | :51:05. | |
the miracle involved the inexplicable healing | :51:06. | :51:08. | |
of a Brazilian man with Mother Teresa was beatified - | :51:09. | :51:10. | |
the first step towards sainthood - Prince George will begin to attend | :51:11. | :51:14. | |
the Westacre Montessori School Nursery in Norfolk before | :51:15. | :51:20. | |
the end of January. The Westacre Montessori Nursery have | :51:21. | :51:23. | |
said: "We are looking forward to welcoming George to our nursery | :51:24. | :51:25. | |
where he will get the same special A family photograph taken in October | :51:26. | :51:28. | |
has also been released. We can now get the latest on Jose | :51:29. | :51:42. | |
Mourinho colour all over the papers. A brutal end, stuffed, a few of the | :51:43. | :51:49. | |
headlines from the papers, both front and back pages. Some | :51:50. | :51:54. | |
suggesting it was an incident with the former club doctor set off his | :51:55. | :52:00. | |
downfall. Chelsea are one point outside the relegation zone after | :52:01. | :52:04. | |
nine defeats in 16 Premier League matches but they won the title by | :52:05. | :52:08. | |
eight points last season. Who will replace him, what has been going on? | :52:09. | :52:12. | |
We can put those questions to our reporter. Guus Hiddink, a strong | :52:13. | :52:19. | |
rumour he will at least fill in at Stamford Bridge. Do we know anything | :52:20. | :52:24. | |
more? Reports this morning are widespread that Guus Hiddink is set | :52:25. | :52:29. | |
to be in caretaker charge until the end of the season. Some I have | :52:30. | :52:33. | |
spoken to in the Netherlands say he is on his way or even potentially in | :52:34. | :52:39. | |
London. We have not been able to stand up entirely. Those I spoke to | :52:40. | :52:44. | |
at Chelsea refused to confirm anything, but these reports are | :52:45. | :52:48. | |
widespread. If you looked overnight at the Australian football | :52:49. | :52:53. | |
Federation website, they released something that said Guus Hiddink has | :52:54. | :52:59. | |
taken temporary charge of struggling Chelsea after the club announced | :53:00. | :53:02. | |
they sacked Jose Mourinho, following the club's disastrous run. They | :53:03. | :53:09. | |
announced on the Twitter feed, our former boss has taken charge of | :53:10. | :53:15. | |
Chelsea FC. The tweet was later deleted and the website story, as | :53:16. | :53:21. | |
well. Confusion, but not many other names in the frame. Early in the | :53:22. | :53:25. | |
week, row mosque, formerly of top Ramos, and possibly Pep Guardiola of | :53:26. | :53:41. | |
Bayern Munich. All Carlo Ancelotti, who has managed Chelsea before. What | :53:42. | :53:48. | |
about Jose Mourinho? It has come as a shock to many. Was it his fault, | :53:49. | :53:58. | |
was it the players'? Not many have come out in support. Cesc Fabregas | :53:59. | :54:03. | |
offered his support. Very quickly after Jose Mourinho was sacked. | :54:04. | :54:08. | |
There were reports that Fabregas and Jose Mourinho had perhaps fallen | :54:09. | :54:12. | |
out, perhaps Fabregas was the source of dressing room leaks. I spoke to a | :54:13. | :54:17. | |
source close to the player who refutes that. John Terry took to | :54:18. | :54:21. | |
social media and said thank you does not seem enough, a sad day, going to | :54:22. | :54:26. | |
miss you boss, the best I have worked with. Unbelievable memories. | :54:27. | :54:32. | |
They were together at Chelsea over the two spells as manager by Jose | :54:33. | :54:36. | |
Mourinho, but he is gone and Chelsea are looking for a new manager. That | :54:37. | :54:42. | |
is all the sport but we will be back with the headlines just after | :54:43. | :54:43. | |
10:30am. Thank you for joining us this | :54:44. | :54:50. | |
morning, welcome to the programme if you've just joined us, | :54:51. | :54:52. | |
we're on BBC 2 and the BBC Texts will be charged | :54:53. | :54:55. | |
at the standard network rate. And of course you can watch | :54:56. | :55:02. | |
the programme online wherever you are via the bbc news app | :55:03. | :55:05. | |
or our website bbc.co.uk/victoria and you can also subscribe | :55:06. | :55:07. | |
to all our features on the news app, by going to add topics and searching | :55:08. | :55:11. | |
'Victoria Derbyshire'. There are more than 130,000 people | :55:12. | :55:13. | |
now recorded as missing by police, according to new figures | :55:14. | :55:16. | |
seen by this programme. Most those who disappear | :55:17. | :55:25. | |
will return home quickly - normally | :55:26. | :55:27. | |
within in a week. But a small proportion - around 1% - | :55:28. | :55:28. | |
are still not found a year later. When someone disappears the first | :55:29. | :55:32. | |
job of the police and other authorities is to make | :55:33. | :55:34. | |
sure they're safe. It's thought there are | :55:35. | :55:36. | |
15,000 families in the UK who are still trying | :55:37. | :55:40. | |
to find their loved ones more than twelve months | :55:41. | :55:42. | |
after they first vanished. Jim Reed has been speaking | :55:43. | :55:44. | |
to some of them. Every two minutes, someone | :55:45. | :55:46. | |
is recorded missing. 95% are found safe and | :55:47. | :55:50. | |
well within 48 hours. But around 2500 people each year | :55:51. | :55:55. | |
are still missing 12 months later. He said "I'm going to mates | :55:56. | :56:03. | |
at Mile End for the weekend" and he said he would be back | :56:04. | :56:06. | |
on Sunday because he has On Thursday evening, | :56:07. | :56:09. | |
the 8th of April... No-one has seen or | :56:10. | :56:12. | |
heard from him since. Five years ago, Matthew Green, | :56:13. | :56:24. | |
on the right, vanished from his home His bedroom hasn't been | :56:25. | :56:27. | |
touched since that day. The last two years of been hell and | :56:28. | :56:54. | |
people say I am a strong person and I think you don't know me. I did 30 | :56:55. | :56:59. | |
years plus in the Kent Fire and Rescue Service. I resolved a lot of | :57:00. | :57:07. | |
problems for different people. The hardest thing I feel, I cannot | :57:08. | :57:12. | |
resolve this. It will not go away until we find him. | :57:13. | :57:17. | |
If someone dies in traumatic circumstances there is support | :57:18. | :57:19. | |
for the family and however hard, there is a resolution. | :57:20. | :57:21. | |
The families of the missing don't always get the same attention | :57:22. | :57:24. | |
from the media, local authorities, or the police. | :57:25. | :57:36. | |
It is hard to move on. People will say how can I go out, go on holiday, | :57:37. | :57:45. | |
move house? Even years later, what if they come back? In a handful of | :57:46. | :57:51. | |
cases there is no resolution. No hint of what happened. Full of life. | :57:52. | :57:55. | |
She did not like restrictions and being told what to do. Mary Flanagan | :57:56. | :58:00. | |
is the oldest missing persons case in the history of the Met police, | :58:01. | :58:05. | |
leaving home at 16 on New Year's Eve 1959 and was never seen again. She | :58:06. | :58:10. | |
worked at the giant Tate Lyle sugar for -- refinery. | :58:11. | :58:24. | |
The next morning, they have the shock of their life, she had not | :58:25. | :58:31. | |
been to work for two weeks. Police searched the National Insurance | :58:32. | :58:34. | |
database and Mary's number has never been used. In 2013 the case was | :58:35. | :58:38. | |
reopened and newspaper articles written, but nothing. It is still | :58:39. | :58:44. | |
raw. Especially at special times of the year. | :58:45. | :58:54. | |
Time is getting on, we are getting older, you know. | :58:55. | :58:56. | |
Something has to happen before it's too late for any of us. | :58:57. | :58:59. | |
Mary Flanagan may be unique but there are thousands of other | :59:00. | :59:02. | |
people missing in the UK for a year or more. | :59:03. | :59:04. | |
Every one of those cases is life changing, not just for the person | :59:05. | :59:07. | |
who disappeared but for the families left behind. | :59:08. | :59:09. | |
So what about the people who go missing? | :59:10. | :59:11. | |
What makes someone walk out of their own life? | :59:12. | :59:13. | |
We can speak now to Shelley MacKenney, who's in Birmingham, | :59:14. | :59:16. | |
and who went missing when she was 22 for 18 months. | :59:17. | :59:21. | |
Prof Hester Parr joins us from Scotland. | :59:22. | :59:23. | |
She's running a research project looking at why people walk out | :59:24. | :59:26. | |
of their lives, and what happens when they're away. | :59:27. | :59:28. | |
She's spoken to dozens who've disappeared. | :59:29. | :59:29. | |
And here in the studio is Colin Sutton, a former senior | :59:30. | :59:32. | |
investigating officer for the Met Police who has worked | :59:33. | :59:34. | |
on many missing persons investigations. | :59:35. | :59:38. | |
Thank you for joining us. You went missing because you got into debt | :59:39. | :59:48. | |
and lost your job. Things were bad, but what made you think going | :59:49. | :59:49. | |
missing was the answer? I didn't think it through. It wasn't | :59:50. | :00:00. | |
premeditated. It was more like... When I was in the process of losing | :00:01. | :00:06. | |
my job, in debt, I was under a lot of stress and I was finding it hard | :00:07. | :00:10. | |
to cope. I didn't talk to anyone. It was a build-up of emotions and I | :00:11. | :00:16. | |
felt very down and angry and guilty. It was a mixture of emotions. It | :00:17. | :00:22. | |
went on for so long, by the time I actually left, it wasn't like a | :00:23. | :00:28. | |
choice, something had snapped in my head, something clicked and I | :00:29. | :00:34. | |
thought, I'm going, I'm leaving. Then it was a case of, I need to get | :00:35. | :00:38. | |
away as fast as possible. This happened in the space of an hour one | :00:39. | :00:40. | |
morning. I didn't take anything happened in the space of an hour one | :00:41. | :00:46. | |
me, I didn't plan, I just got into a cab, went to the coach station and | :00:47. | :00:51. | |
asked for the next train leaving. She asked me where I wanted to go | :00:52. | :00:55. | |
and I said, anywhere. I didn't think of anything else, where I'm going to | :00:56. | :01:01. | |
stay. I didn't plan the day ahead, I literally decided I wanted to go | :01:02. | :01:07. | |
then and there. You were effectively walking into a void, how scary was | :01:08. | :01:16. | |
that? It wasn't a fear as much. I had dealt with so much. Actually I | :01:17. | :01:23. | |
didn't steal, that's the wrong way of saying it, I didn't deal with my | :01:24. | :01:27. | |
problems. I just wanted a way out. So that way out seemed such a better | :01:28. | :01:33. | |
option than anything I had to fear of the future. What happened after | :01:34. | :01:41. | |
that? Did you feel liberated? It was a very weird sensation. When I got | :01:42. | :01:49. | |
onto the coach, and that point, my emotions switched off, everything | :01:50. | :01:53. | |
switched off. I'd Ashley reached the point of not feeling any more after | :01:54. | :01:56. | |
the months of being depressed and unable to cope. By the time I got on | :01:57. | :02:02. | |
the coach, when I got off, the girl I was before was dead, I wasn't | :02:03. | :02:06. | |
surely any more, I was a different person. -- Shelley. I reacted | :02:07. | :02:14. | |
differently to how I was normally. So what was life like? There was a | :02:15. | :02:21. | |
sense of freedom, but I don't want to say that in a positive way. It | :02:22. | :02:28. | |
was more like post-traumatic stress disorder. I was actually diagnosed | :02:29. | :02:34. | |
with that. It's like I had no restraint any more, no | :02:35. | :02:37. | |
responsibilities, no bills to pay, no one to answer to. If I did | :02:38. | :02:41. | |
anything wrong, I wasn't letting anybody else down. There was a sense | :02:42. | :02:47. | |
of freedom in that. It's dangerous as well because although I didn't | :02:48. | :02:50. | |
care about anything I didn't care about myself either, didn't care if | :02:51. | :02:56. | |
I was attacked, walking down a dark alley, I had given up on life | :02:57. | :03:01. | |
effectively. It was just living from day to day. How did you live from | :03:02. | :03:06. | |
day to day? Where were you getting everything you needed to live from? | :03:07. | :03:11. | |
As I left with nothing, I left as I was, I spent a couple of days just | :03:12. | :03:17. | |
exploring my surroundings, which was Birmingham, finding out where | :03:18. | :03:21. | |
everything was. I slept rough. The next day, I thought I need to find | :03:22. | :03:27. | |
somewhere that I can state properly because it's very dangerous, you | :03:28. | :03:30. | |
know, being a young girl on the streets. I got in contact with | :03:31. | :03:36. | |
Shelter and they got in contact with a hostel where I could stay. I went | :03:37. | :03:41. | |
to the hostel and they said I needed to sign on. Up until then I had | :03:42. | :03:46. | |
always worked and I didn't know anything about signing on. I went to | :03:47. | :03:51. | |
the job centre. I told them the truth and they said to me that I | :03:52. | :03:55. | |
wasn't entitled to any benefits because I'd lost my job, and the way | :03:56. | :04:01. | |
in which I lost my job. So I had to wait for six weeks. I tried getting | :04:02. | :04:07. | |
a job instead. I went from the job centre and I found a job on the same | :04:08. | :04:12. | |
day. When I went back to the hostel they told me I wasn't allowed to | :04:13. | :04:18. | |
work. It was manned 24 hours a day, the rent would be ?400 a week, so | :04:19. | :04:23. | |
effectively I had to leave the job as well. I had no money at all | :04:24. | :04:28. | |
coming in. That's when I had to turn to waste, things are not proud of -- | :04:29. | :04:34. | |
ways. Things I wouldn't want to do again, including Corning, stealing, | :04:35. | :04:41. | |
surviving from day to day. -- conning people. Were you looking | :04:42. | :04:48. | |
back and missing the people and life you had left behind, and were you | :04:49. | :04:51. | |
aware of how much they would be missing you? When I actually had my | :04:52. | :05:02. | |
break, might mental break, I mean, and I left, I was convinced, I felt | :05:03. | :05:06. | |
so bad about myself as a person, I was convinced they were better off | :05:07. | :05:10. | |
without me. I was convinced they would hate me for the mistakes I | :05:11. | :05:14. | |
made, getting into debt, the thought of losing the house. And I thought I | :05:15. | :05:21. | |
was doing them a favour. I thought that their lives would be better if | :05:22. | :05:26. | |
I wasn't there. I thought they hated me as much as I hated myself. So no, | :05:27. | :05:34. | |
I didn't think I wanted that life back because I didn't think I was | :05:35. | :05:38. | |
entitled to it. I felt so bad within myself that I didn't even think I | :05:39. | :05:43. | |
was entitled to survive. Anything I did I felt like I deserved. So you | :05:44. | :05:49. | |
would run for 18 months, what's changed over that period that made | :05:50. | :05:52. | |
you decide to turn around and go back? Well, being a missing person | :05:53. | :05:59. | |
is very hard. Society is always trying to pull you in. You have a | :06:00. | :06:04. | |
national insurance number, jobs, social, so you have to live under | :06:05. | :06:08. | |
the radar, which meets sleeping rough, hanging around with people | :06:09. | :06:16. | |
who don't necessarily conform to society. I did this for 6-9 months. | :06:17. | :06:21. | |
But the change came when I became pregnant. When I became pregnant, | :06:22. | :06:30. | |
the emotional effect on me, I wanted to be a good mother, I wanted to | :06:31. | :06:34. | |
give my daughter a good start. I looked around me and I couldn't do | :06:35. | :06:38. | |
that with what I was doing, how I was living, not eating, running out | :06:39. | :06:44. | |
of restaurants and stealing. I couldn't do that and the people I | :06:45. | :06:47. | |
was mixing with, I couldn't give her the best chance. That's when I woke | :06:48. | :06:55. | |
up and thought I needed to change this and address the issue. The love | :06:56. | :07:00. | |
of her was greater than my fear of what I had become. It was more than | :07:01. | :07:07. | |
that. I went to the doctors and for the first time in a long time I told | :07:08. | :07:11. | |
them everything, I poured my heart out about how I felt, everything | :07:12. | :07:16. | |
that caused it, being in debt, and they recommended that I go into | :07:17. | :07:21. | |
counselling. What was the first contact you had with someone you had | :07:22. | :07:25. | |
left behind was to mark what was it like? I went into counselling for | :07:26. | :07:33. | |
ten months. I still didn't contact my family. It was a long time and it | :07:34. | :07:37. | |
wasn't until my daughter was four sold that I received a letter in the | :07:38. | :07:42. | |
post from the Salvation Army -- four sold. They track down people and | :07:43. | :07:49. | |
they sent a letter to the Department for Work and Pensions and it is | :07:50. | :07:51. | |
redirected to anybody with that number. I received the letter, it | :07:52. | :07:59. | |
had been 18 months now. After the counselling, evaluating my life, I | :08:00. | :08:03. | |
felt strong enough to face might now and, the woman who raised me. -- to | :08:04. | :08:12. | |
face my Nan. I faced up to the mistakes I've made. Speaking to her | :08:13. | :08:16. | |
for the first time was the hardest thing I've ever done. It was harder | :08:17. | :08:22. | |
than walking away. I was running away from everything but this meant | :08:23. | :08:30. | |
going back and facing everything. It was so scary, I was scared that they | :08:31. | :08:34. | |
would hate me and would tell me that they hated me. I was scared of the | :08:35. | :08:41. | |
recriminations coming back to me. But she didn't, she was lovely. She | :08:42. | :08:48. | |
was crying. She just wanted to know I was OK. And if I'd been OK. And | :08:49. | :08:57. | |
how I survived, really. Esther, listening to Shelley, people out | :08:58. | :09:04. | |
there who are still living, but are invisible to the people who love | :09:05. | :09:07. | |
them and have lost them, what are the reasons you have found behind | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
situations like hers, from the people you spoken to? Quite a lot | :09:13. | :09:18. | |
like Shelley, many people feel a sense of frustration, may be dealing | :09:19. | :09:23. | |
with a major difficulty in the life, be it debt, drug addiction, alcohol | :09:24. | :09:28. | |
problems. 80% of missing people have mental health problems and that was | :09:29. | :09:35. | |
the case in our research. And these issues that may be haven't been | :09:36. | :09:40. | |
dealt with, people not receiving any help or intervention to help them | :09:41. | :09:43. | |
deal with the interventions caused the build-up of frustration that | :09:44. | :09:47. | |
Shelley talked about. Causing them to take the step out the door, | :09:48. | :09:55. | |
embarking on what we call a crisis mobility. Paul, the police will get | :09:56. | :09:59. | |
involved when those left behind have no idea what's happened. How quickly | :10:00. | :10:04. | |
can the police ascertained that someone is still alive, but has gone | :10:05. | :10:09. | |
off their own accord? Quite quickly these days because there is a | :10:10. | :10:12. | |
digital footprint and so much bureaucracy, that we heard about in | :10:13. | :10:20. | |
Shelley's moving tale. The police have to make sure that people are | :10:21. | :10:24. | |
safe, that's the first priority, to see if someone is safe. It isn't | :10:25. | :10:27. | |
about tracking them down because that's the wrong thing to do. The | :10:28. | :10:34. | |
absolute priority is trying to find out people are safe and that's what | :10:35. | :10:39. | |
the people left at home wants to know, isn't it? So then you let them | :10:40. | :10:44. | |
know, so they know that the person has gone because they wanted to and | :10:45. | :10:49. | |
then they can't find them? Yes, if the person is an adult and wants to | :10:50. | :10:54. | |
go away, then the police would say yes, we've ascertained that they are | :10:55. | :10:58. | |
safe, we know where they are, but unfortunately they don't want you to | :10:59. | :11:01. | |
know and we are not going to tell you where they are, only that they | :11:02. | :11:04. | |
are safe and you don't have to worry. What goes on after that is a | :11:05. | :11:12. | |
matter for the internal family. It is not the police's point to | :11:13. | :11:15. | |
intervene and tell people where they can find loved ones if they don't | :11:16. | :11:20. | |
want to be found. We heard in the report how people caught up in that | :11:21. | :11:26. | |
situation find it almost impossible to move on because they are thinking | :11:27. | :11:30. | |
that they can't move house, what if the person tries to contact them at | :11:31. | :11:34. | |
that moment when they are not there for them? Yeah, absolutely. In the | :11:35. | :11:42. | |
research study we also contacted families of missing people. We spoke | :11:43. | :11:47. | |
to 25 families of missing people who described that sense of limbo, being | :11:48. | :11:50. | |
trapped in a situation, for ever waiting for news. Being very | :11:51. | :11:56. | |
dependent on the police service for giving them regular, detailed | :11:57. | :11:59. | |
updates for the search efforts they are undertaking so they can | :12:00. | :12:03. | |
coordinate that with their own search effort. What we found is that | :12:04. | :12:08. | |
many families actually put in place their own search strategy and never | :12:09. | :12:16. | |
stop looking. If anyone is watching the programme, Shelley, affected by | :12:17. | :12:19. | |
this, whether it is somebody missing, what would you say to them? | :12:20. | :12:26. | |
I think when you are missing, it's very easy to put obstacles in your | :12:27. | :12:30. | |
way. It is easy to build up a wall. Why comments myself that everyone | :12:31. | :12:34. | |
would be better without me but you need to know that you can go back. | :12:35. | :12:41. | |
Not necessarily straight back because that's quite scary, the | :12:42. | :12:44. | |
thought of going back into the situation you escaped from his | :12:45. | :12:51. | |
scary, but you can make initial contact. When I made contact it was | :12:52. | :12:57. | |
very subtle, I couldn't do it straightaway, it took months of | :12:58. | :13:01. | |
talking here and there on the phone. I wrote my book to tell people that | :13:02. | :13:06. | |
there is a way back. And I would say a lot of missing people probably | :13:07. | :13:11. | |
want to get in contact with family but they are too scared. You can do | :13:12. | :13:18. | |
it. I sought help in the way of counselling, to build myself up to | :13:19. | :13:22. | |
be strong enough to do that. I would say, talk to someone, talk to your | :13:23. | :13:27. | |
doctor, the Samaritans, there are people who can help you. You can | :13:28. | :13:32. | |
build something better than you had before. That's what I did. Thank you | :13:33. | :13:38. | |
for joining us. Glenn has said while, Shelley, explaining things in | :13:39. | :13:42. | |
a way that I've never been able to, well done for doing that on TV. | :13:43. | :13:46. | |
Thank you for sharing your experience -- wow. Get in touch if | :13:47. | :13:52. | |
you are affected by any of the issues we were discussing. | :13:53. | :13:55. | |
A fault in an online form may have led to thousands of divorce | :13:56. | :13:58. | |
settlements in England and Wales being calculated incorrectly. | :13:59. | :14:00. | |
The error on the Ministry of Justice website has been there since April | :14:01. | :14:03. | |
2014 but has only just been uncovered. | :14:04. | :14:04. | |
Nicola Matheson-Durrant works in family law and she discovered | :14:05. | :14:07. | |
A client of mine, Ken, was sent away by me to go and type up his form E, | :14:08. | :14:23. | |
which he was downloading from the mystery of Justice website. He came | :14:24. | :14:26. | |
back frustrated, planing about the figures coming into the box which | :14:27. | :14:30. | |
weren't accurate and he wanted me to check it out -- the Ministry of | :14:31. | :14:35. | |
Justice. I couldn't make it work and I checked the form online on several | :14:36. | :14:40. | |
occasions to see if I could make them work, only to discover that it | :14:41. | :14:44. | |
was absolutely impossible, so there must be a software fault. | :14:45. | :14:46. | |
Our legal eagle Clive Coleman is here. | :14:47. | :14:50. | |
What impact has this had? This is an extraordinary story. You have to | :14:51. | :15:10. | |
fill out a long form and at one point it tries to calculate your net | :15:11. | :15:16. | |
wealth so the court has accurate figures to negotiate with. It looks | :15:17. | :15:20. | |
at your assets and liabilities. In one box it should subtract your | :15:21. | :15:25. | |
debts from your assets. What was happening was it was not doing that. | :15:26. | :15:32. | |
Let's say you are worth half ?1 million but have ?100,000 in debt | :15:33. | :15:35. | |
your net worth is ?400,000, but it was telling you the net worth was | :15:36. | :15:40. | |
half ?1 million. You might think a lot of people would pick that up, | :15:41. | :15:45. | |
but when you are getting divorced, you are upset, financially you are | :15:46. | :15:50. | |
concerned, and you rely on government software. It may be these | :15:51. | :15:54. | |
things were overlooked. We know around 20,000 of these forms were | :15:55. | :15:59. | |
downloaded in the period when this glitch took place. Taking place from | :16:00. | :16:05. | |
April 20 14. It has been fixed. The Ministry of Justice say they are | :16:06. | :16:08. | |
looking into the matter and seeking to contact anyone and firstly | :16:09. | :16:13. | |
affected. On our website there is an e-mail address for people to contact | :16:14. | :16:17. | |
the ministry if they feel they have been affected, but what it means is, | :16:18. | :16:22. | |
if it was not picked up and corrected, divorce settlements would | :16:23. | :16:27. | |
have been agreed and approved, determined by the court, on the | :16:28. | :16:31. | |
basis of unfair figures. Potentially a headache. It really years for some | :16:32. | :16:37. | |
people affected, this will be an unpleasant Christmas present. | :16:38. | :16:40. | |
Thanks for joining us today - still to come before 11. | :16:41. | :16:46. | |
And it's the Strictly final this weekened. | :16:47. | :16:47. | |
We'll talk live to some of the professional dancers | :16:48. | :16:50. | |
David Cameron has said a pathway has been created to help Britain secure | :16:51. | :16:58. | |
a deal to renegotiate its relationship with | :16:59. | :17:00. | |
He said talks at the EU summit in Brussels last night made | :17:01. | :17:06. | |
progress, but it would be "tough" to reach agreement at the next | :17:07. | :17:09. | |
The prison officers association has told the programme three prison | :17:10. | :17:21. | |
officers were taken to hospital after breathing in fumes from | :17:22. | :17:27. | |
so-called legal highs, the incident happened at Durham prison and is the | :17:28. | :17:32. | |
second time in the last two weeks it has happened. It comes as the | :17:33. | :17:36. | |
warning comes that legal highs of the biggest threat to security in | :17:37. | :17:48. | |
prison. At Durham prison yesterday, three prison -- prisoners were taken | :17:49. | :17:53. | |
to hospital, because of the effects of breathing it in. They were kept | :17:54. | :17:57. | |
in hospital for observation is because the heart rate was up and it | :17:58. | :17:59. | |
was causing problems medically. The Vatican has confirmed mother to | :18:00. | :18:10. | |
raise is to be made a saint. It is said Pope Francis cleared the way | :18:11. | :18:16. | |
for canonisation by recognising a second miracle attributed to her. | :18:17. | :18:18. | |
Believed to have involved the healing of a Brazilian man with | :18:19. | :18:20. | |
brain tumours. Prince George is to start | :18:21. | :18:22. | |
nursery next month. The Westacre Montessori Nursery | :18:23. | :18:24. | |
in Norfolk says it's looking forward to welcoming George and he'll get | :18:25. | :18:27. | |
the same "special experience" A family photograph taken | :18:28. | :18:29. | |
in October, of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge with their children has | :18:30. | :18:33. | |
also been released. Imagine the clamour for people | :18:34. | :18:47. | |
trying to join that nursery! 1-storey dominating in sport, Jose | :18:48. | :18:50. | |
Mourinho. Is it true he will be paid if he does not get another job? | :18:51. | :19:00. | |
Whenever a manager loses his job, there is always something about the | :19:01. | :19:03. | |
contract, we do not know the size of the severance package but he will | :19:04. | :19:06. | |
contract, we do not know the size of paid to be at the season, that is | :19:07. | :19:09. | |
normal. John Terry said he is the best he worked with at Chelsea say | :19:10. | :19:13. | |
there was discord between Jose Mourinho and players, which was the | :19:14. | :19:17. | |
reason he was sacked from the club a second time. Chelsea one point | :19:18. | :19:21. | |
outside the relegation zone after nine defeats in 17 matches with Guus | :19:22. | :19:27. | |
Hiddink the favourite to take over, and he managed Chelsea in 2009 and | :19:28. | :19:33. | |
led them to FA Cup victory. He is likely to be taking over in the | :19:34. | :19:39. | |
interim. The suspended Uefa president Michel Platini has had his | :19:40. | :19:44. | |
case heard by the Fifa ethics committee. He boycotted the hearing | :19:45. | :19:49. | |
saying the outcome was already decided. Fifa president Sepp Blatter | :19:50. | :19:54. | |
appeared yesterday. And early day, wife of golfer Jason, found herself | :19:55. | :19:57. | |
an unfortunate part of the action when basketball player LeBron James | :19:58. | :20:06. | |
landed on her in a Cleveland Cavaliers game. She is reported to | :20:07. | :20:14. | |
be fine. After the game, the coach asked the NBA to look at courtside | :20:15. | :20:20. | |
safety. We have had an incredible response to the interview I did with | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
Shelley, who was describing why she went missing. She was missing 18 | :20:26. | :20:30. | |
months and talked us through her experiences up to being reunited | :20:31. | :20:35. | |
with her family. Victoria said it was a wonderful and insightful | :20:36. | :20:39. | |
account of the life of a missing person and thought processes | :20:40. | :20:44. | |
involved. Michelle said, this is a wonderful programme, listening to | :20:45. | :20:48. | |
the lady's story. Nick said it was an amazing story from Shelley. Dean | :20:49. | :20:58. | |
said he recognised her feelings as his own and he is glad she has | :20:59. | :21:02. | |
turned things around. Keep your comments on everything we are | :21:03. | :21:10. | |
talking about coming in. Today is the last show before we go off air | :21:11. | :21:14. | |
over the festive season. We thought it would be the perfect time to | :21:15. | :21:15. | |
bring memorable moments. In September, we spoke | :21:16. | :21:26. | |
to Victoria Balch, a victim of a rollercoaster | :21:27. | :21:28. | |
crash at Alton Towers. She told us that, having had six | :21:29. | :21:30. | |
rounds of surgery in a bid to save her leg, it was a relief | :21:31. | :21:33. | |
to have it amputated. Through the operations, and there | :21:34. | :21:39. | |
were more than six, you were thinking, we are going to save it, | :21:40. | :21:42. | |
the medical staff were thinking that. Yes, they were. They were | :21:43. | :21:50. | |
amazing. They wanted to save it. They thought it would be better to | :21:51. | :21:58. | |
save it. I have a fracture as well. If they amputated straightaway and I | :21:59. | :22:02. | |
said yes, amputate it, because the question from day one was, I am | :22:03. | :22:07. | |
sorry, you will have to make the decision whether you amputate or | :22:08. | :22:11. | |
not. I could not make that decision. I don't think anyone really can stop | :22:12. | :22:17. | |
he said if you amputate, it will be here. Then it would be a short stump | :22:18. | :22:22. | |
because I have a fracture around here that was quite bad. And so I | :22:23. | :22:29. | |
didn't. I did not want to amputate. I could not say yes and I could not | :22:30. | :22:35. | |
say no. I think, in the end, getting an infection made the decision for | :22:36. | :22:45. | |
you. Yes, it did. Operation after operation, it was looking like they | :22:46. | :22:48. | |
could save it and I would be able to walk again. In the beginning, before | :22:49. | :22:53. | |
I had an infection, I was walking with a frame, with crutches, on my | :22:54. | :22:57. | |
own, it was looking good. I was seeing a light at the end of the | :22:58. | :23:03. | |
tunnel. I was sleeping about three days in a row. I did not feel | :23:04. | :23:13. | |
myself. I had my friends there. I just slept. I could not speak to | :23:14. | :23:19. | |
them or do anything. Obviously, you realise something is not right. I | :23:20. | :23:24. | |
told the surgeon and they said if there is sign of infection, would | :23:25. | :23:31. | |
you sign for me to amputate? I said yes, because I could not do anything | :23:32. | :23:36. | |
myself. I had gone back to... I had to sit down and have someone else | :23:37. | :23:42. | |
holding my leg, another leaning on me, it was horrible. When your leg | :23:43. | :23:46. | |
had been amputated, what will your initial emotions? My mum and a nurse | :23:47. | :23:53. | |
was there. Mum on this side and the nurse there. I knew the nurse quite | :23:54. | :23:58. | |
well. I was in so long I got to know them well. They looked at me and | :23:59. | :24:06. | |
they were upset. I got upset and was thinking, why am I upset? I looked | :24:07. | :24:13. | |
at my leg. It was a relief not to have it there. But eventually, I | :24:14. | :24:18. | |
would be able to walk again with a prosthetic. | :24:19. | :24:22. | |
And throughout Christmas watch our for special programmes | :24:23. | :24:24. | |
from Victoria looking back at our exclusive | :24:25. | :24:25. | |
You can see the first part of that on the BBC News Channel on Monday | :24:26. | :24:30. | |
Today the last tonnes of coal will be brought out | :24:31. | :24:41. | |
Today the last tonnes of coal will be brought out of Kellingley | :24:42. | :24:44. | |
coal mine, near Pontefract in West Yorkshire. | :24:45. | :24:46. | |
The mine closes today with the loss of 450 jobs, | :24:47. | :24:48. | |
signalling the end of deep pit coal mining in Britain. | :24:49. | :24:51. | |
Dan Johnson is there for us this morning. | :24:52. | :24:53. | |
It is a sad day for people not just mourning the loss of 450 jobs, but | :24:54. | :25:01. | |
in industry and way of life with history behind it. Coal was | :25:02. | :25:07. | |
influential in the Industrial Revolution, fuelling factories, | :25:08. | :25:08. | |
powering steamships that went around the world and helped Britain build | :25:09. | :25:15. | |
its empire. It kept the lights on, generating electricity, keeping us | :25:16. | :25:20. | |
warm at home, and it was the basis for communities built around these | :25:21. | :25:24. | |
pits. The loss of this today is marked as a significant moment. | :25:25. | :25:30. | |
There was a prospect of the miners moving out quietly with not much | :25:31. | :25:34. | |
being said but a couple of their wives decided to change that and | :25:35. | :25:39. | |
market properly. I have spoken to them about why it was needed. We | :25:40. | :25:44. | |
thought it was important we have closure, this is the end but it | :25:45. | :25:46. | |
gives an opportunity to catch up with friends and say goodbye. Do you | :25:47. | :25:54. | |
feel the contribution the miners her maid is not properly recognise? It | :25:55. | :25:57. | |
is a lack of understanding, unless you are part of the mining | :25:58. | :26:01. | |
community, it is not understood as much. I think they can feel | :26:02. | :26:13. | |
abandoned at the moment. Disappointed, and disbelief it is | :26:14. | :26:17. | |
the last deep coal mine in the country and it is shutting. Why | :26:18. | :26:23. | |
should this be marked? It is such a shame it is the last coal mine in | :26:24. | :26:28. | |
Britain. We could not just let nothing happens, we had to do | :26:29. | :26:32. | |
something for the men to show we care, and the whole community cares | :26:33. | :26:36. | |
for them will stop to just walk out of the pit on the last day and | :26:37. | :26:41. | |
nothing to be done would be really sad. About 800 men have had that | :26:42. | :26:46. | |
happen in the last year. Swiped on, swiped off, that is it, not even a | :26:47. | :26:51. | |
goodbye. And many other communities have been hit. What impact does it | :26:52. | :26:58. | |
have on an area? It is massive. The local shop is, there will be a big | :26:59. | :27:05. | |
impact. A lot of people have moved with the mines and they move over | :27:06. | :27:09. | |
here and now there is nothing for them, no jobs to go to, what do they | :27:10. | :27:14. | |
do? We talked about moving abroad, but why should we have to move | :27:15. | :27:19. | |
abroad for work? It is sad, really. Would you like the industry to carry | :27:20. | :27:26. | |
on. It is a tough job. It is but it is their way of life. Their dads | :27:27. | :27:32. | |
have done it their grandparents, it is built into them. I would love to | :27:33. | :27:37. | |
see it carry on, but unfortunately, it is not. It is hard for the | :27:38. | :27:42. | |
demographic. There are a lot of men over 50 and there are not a lot of | :27:43. | :27:51. | |
opportunities in that age range. Why is this different from any other | :27:52. | :27:56. | |
business that goes bust and has to make people redundant? What is | :27:57. | :28:01. | |
special about mining? They are held with affection and regard. It is a | :28:02. | :28:05. | |
job no one wants to do but everybody is fascinated by and they have no | :28:06. | :28:08. | |
understanding about it so when you meet a miner, it is how do you do | :28:09. | :28:19. | |
it, what does it feel like? It is a dying industry. Are you hoping for a | :28:20. | :28:23. | |
big turnout? When we got together we were naive and it was going to be | :28:24. | :28:27. | |
mates having a walk and a bit of a party and it has got bigger than we | :28:28. | :28:31. | |
thought. We did not realise how many people wanted to be involved. It has | :28:32. | :28:38. | |
been heartening and what we want is that people turn up with respect and | :28:39. | :28:42. | |
kindness and affection and also show the men the dignity they are | :28:43. | :28:46. | |
showing, turning up every day this week, when they do not have too but | :28:47. | :28:49. | |
they are turning up and going down the mine, they are doing it because | :28:50. | :28:55. | |
that is the men they are. If you want a mark of how much the industry | :28:56. | :29:00. | |
has meant, there is a memorial that commemorates the 17 men who lost | :29:01. | :29:04. | |
their lives in different accidents underground here. That is some of | :29:05. | :29:08. | |
the depth of feeling. I am joined by one of the miners, you work on the | :29:09. | :29:13. | |
shaft top where the men come off. Tell me your connection. The | :29:14. | :29:17. | |
connection has been all my life, everything I have had in my life has | :29:18. | :29:24. | |
been paid for by this place. My father sank the shafts in 1959. I | :29:25. | :29:32. | |
followed in his footsteps in 1983. I have been asked to stay on to cap | :29:33. | :29:38. | |
the shafts. Your dad helped to dig it and you will help to say good | :29:39. | :29:39. | |
night. Very poignant, a tough decision to | :29:40. | :29:48. | |
make but if I don't do it, it's not going to change the endgame. The | :29:49. | :29:53. | |
coal industry is shot in this country and I will take the money | :29:54. | :29:57. | |
they offer me to cap the shaft. The UX seven that it isn't economic, it | :29:58. | :30:03. | |
is cheaper to bring it in? -- do you accept. I will never accept that, if | :30:04. | :30:09. | |
you go back a few years, the government was asked for a ?30 | :30:10. | :30:14. | |
million loan by UK coal to keep the industry afloat and the government | :30:15. | :30:18. | |
said it wasn't good value for money. At the same time that year, the | :30:19. | :30:22. | |
government took ?700 million out of the pension scheme. We are asking | :30:23. | :30:29. | |
for 5% of that money to put into the industry. David Cameron getting them | :30:30. | :30:36. | |
today and spouting about 80 million. Transporting coal is part of our | :30:37. | :30:42. | |
energy policy for the next ten years, a lot of it will be burned by | :30:43. | :30:47. | |
coal, so what kind of policy is that? Relying on third World | :30:48. | :30:55. | |
countries. I will never accept, the government could have hoped for | :30:56. | :30:59. | |
small. This place could be producing coal for the next ten years. We have | :31:00. | :31:05. | |
the biggest coal power station down the road. What's happened has | :31:06. | :31:13. | |
happened. We are not going to save the place now, that's fact. As you | :31:14. | :31:19. | |
understand, there is a strength of feeling, some bitterness, some | :31:20. | :31:22. | |
understanding and questions about what the future will be 40 minute is | :31:23. | :31:26. | |
like this that once relied on these heavy industries. When they've gone, | :31:27. | :31:28. | |
what's next? After 12 weeks of quickstepping, | :31:29. | :31:32. | |
jiving and tangoing we have our four Kellie Bright, Georgia May Foote, | :31:33. | :31:35. | |
Jay McGuiness, Katie Derham and | :31:36. | :31:39. | |
and their professional partners will be performing live tomorrow | :31:40. | :31:43. | |
night in a bid to impress, us, One of them will be taking home | :31:44. | :31:46. | |
the Glitterball Trophy. Here's a reminder of the dances that | :31:47. | :31:50. | |
got them into the final. Let's talk now to former | :31:51. | :32:18. | |
contestant Russell Grant, professional dancer Ian Waite | :32:19. | :33:06. | |
and live at rehearsals at Strictly HQ, professional dancer | :33:07. | :33:08. | |
Joanne Clifton. Russell, does that bring back happy | :33:09. | :33:20. | |
memories? Always, the happiest time of my life, apart from launching BBC | :33:21. | :33:24. | |
breakfast time with Frank and Selina in 1983. I am that old! And then | :33:25. | :33:32. | |
doing Strictly, I lost about eight stone. I had lost 11 already and if | :33:33. | :33:37. | |
it wasn't for Strictly, I don't know if I would even be here now. It was | :33:38. | :33:42. | |
a wonderful, memorable time and I loved every minute. Let's check in | :33:43. | :33:47. | |
with HQ, Joanne is there. What's the atmosphere like? Oh my gosh, | :33:48. | :33:52. | |
everyone is so excited. We were in the restaurant last night and the | :33:53. | :33:57. | |
good thing is, they are so excited, but they are making out, "Whoever | :33:58. | :34:03. | |
wins, it will be so nice because we are friends", but at the same time, | :34:04. | :34:10. | |
thinking that we need to go to bed early. Your brother has been in the | :34:11. | :34:14. | |
final every time on the show, how he feeling? I think he's all right, I | :34:15. | :34:19. | |
haven't seen him this morning but last night he was OK he was | :34:20. | :34:27. | |
practising with Kellie until 11pm last night. They were so tired. You | :34:28. | :34:32. | |
see the camaraderie and people saying they hope each other wins, | :34:33. | :34:36. | |
but actually people going for the early night, is it a bit cut-throat | :34:37. | :34:40. | |
behind-the-scenes? Not really, everyone gets along, that's what's | :34:41. | :34:44. | |
great about this year, everyone is so close, they get along so well. | :34:45. | :34:53. | |
They are on a WhatsApp group together, they were saying how it | :34:54. | :34:56. | |
doesn't matter who wins, but then going to bed because it's a long day | :34:57. | :35:01. | |
tomorrow. How intense is the process? It is 24-7 and because I | :35:02. | :35:07. | |
live in North Wales, Snowdonia, used to have to come up on Monday and we | :35:08. | :35:14. | |
lost a day of training when travelling between there and London. | :35:15. | :35:22. | |
But it is joyous. We had a routine, we did it on the piano Strictly | :35:23. | :35:28. | |
cruise, we would start off with a bit of Latin to warm up and | :35:29. | :35:32. | |
everything was just joyous, it was music, music, dance, dance. Ian, you | :35:33. | :35:39. | |
been in seven series, how do you judge the standard this year? It | :35:40. | :35:43. | |
seems to get better every year. This year we've had seven or eight really | :35:44. | :35:47. | |
good ones and from the last six you didn't know who was going to go out. | :35:48. | :35:53. | |
Some of our best dancers who I thought would make the final, like | :35:54. | :35:59. | |
Peter Andre... Sorry, we are a bit distracted! I loved it. We were | :36:00. | :36:10. | |
beaten by William and Kate's wedding for the Bafta highlight of the year. | :36:11. | :36:15. | |
Can't believe it! It is extraordinary because everyone is so | :36:16. | :36:19. | |
good. In the final I expected Jay to be the champion from the beginning, | :36:20. | :36:25. | |
but he's not doing his jive in the final and everyone's expecting it | :36:26. | :36:28. | |
and wanting it but they are not going to do it. Taking a big risk by | :36:29. | :36:31. | |
doing another dance but let's see what happens. Now they are in the | :36:32. | :36:40. | |
final, I think they are the right finalists. They've worked really | :36:41. | :36:43. | |
hard and the semifinals were brilliant. What do you think? I love | :36:44. | :36:52. | |
Jay and his partner, who is a close friend of mine. After that first | :36:53. | :36:59. | |
dance, I rang her up and I said, my goodness, you are in the final. And | :37:00. | :37:04. | |
Georgia and Giovanni, the waltz that they did, did you enjoy it? Her | :37:05. | :37:10. | |
ballroom has transformed her, her Latin isn't as good. You have | :37:11. | :37:14. | |
performed in the final, what is it like? A couple of times, it's quite | :37:15. | :37:19. | |
hard because when you get to that stage there are fewer people around, | :37:20. | :37:24. | |
they are all up in the box. Before you have the camaraderie and they | :37:25. | :37:29. | |
are together but as it gets later on, people start disappearing and | :37:30. | :37:32. | |
all of a sudden it is empty and there were only three of you left. | :37:33. | :37:37. | |
It's an amazing experience and to perform the final in front of | :37:38. | :37:42. | |
millions of people is very special. What is the Strictly magic because | :37:43. | :37:45. | |
is the most watched programme right now? I think it is watching people | :37:46. | :37:51. | |
do something out of their comfort zone, learning a skill and the love | :37:52. | :37:55. | |
of performing. Everybody loves to see a performance and music, they | :37:56. | :37:59. | |
love music and dance. Light entertainment has died and Strictly | :38:00. | :38:03. | |
is alive and kicking, quite literally and that is light | :38:04. | :38:13. | |
entertainment. And it can be for two-year-olds, three awards, up to | :38:14. | :38:16. | |
100-year-olds, it's for everybody. You say that people are out of their | :38:17. | :38:21. | |
comfort zone. Russell, I don't want to be cheeky but some people, more | :38:22. | :38:25. | |
out of the comfort zone than others. Is it a level playing field? I | :38:26. | :38:30. | |
started off in showbiz, astrology was only ever a hobby. I was drama, | :38:31. | :38:37. | |
acting. Not that kind of performance. I did musical theatre | :38:38. | :38:44. | |
but you end up doing the quiz boxes. I thought you were a drama queen! | :38:45. | :38:51. | |
Takes one to know one! When I went into Strictly I had never done that | :38:52. | :38:56. | |
kind of dancing, musical theatre. The two things that really helped | :38:57. | :38:59. | |
me, I was 60 years old when I did it, having a great partner, and I | :39:00. | :39:06. | |
had read. When you have written you can make it work. -- rhythm. Whether | :39:07. | :39:15. | |
you can dance or not it doesn't matter in those costumes, you just | :39:16. | :39:20. | |
let! You had very glittery outfits. -- you just | :39:21. | :39:29. | |
some people were more beginners than others, does that make it fair? I | :39:30. | :39:35. | |
think that the audience recognise that and that's why they vote for | :39:36. | :39:38. | |
certain people who come from a non-dancing position. I think is the | :39:39. | :39:46. | |
first year we've had a boy, all boys, who have had dance experience, | :39:47. | :39:51. | |
Peter Andre and Jay have had dance experience, that is the first time | :39:52. | :39:55. | |
we've had it on Strictly and it's nice to see boys who have excelled. | :39:56. | :39:59. | |
Joanne, what's it like trying to teach someone who hasn't got much | :40:00. | :40:05. | |
rhythm and hasn't danced before? With Scott I just became a ventral | :40:06. | :40:12. | |
Quist, I kind of just smiled like this. Is that easy with a bloke, to | :40:13. | :40:21. | |
be the ventriloquist? Is it easy for me? Yes, for you to be the | :40:22. | :40:28. | |
ventriloquist for a man? Yes, I was just holding onto him and pulling | :40:29. | :40:32. | |
and just smiling through my teeth I'm quite an extrovert, as you can | :40:33. | :40:40. | |
see. It can only take you so far, can't it? Yes, but look at Jeremy | :40:41. | :40:48. | |
Vine for example. He got two week eight and he had no dance experience | :40:49. | :40:53. | |
at all but because he tried so hard people loved him for it and it got | :40:54. | :40:58. | |
him quite a long way. What makes the best performer, contender for you? | :40:59. | :41:03. | |
It is a mixture of different things. You have to have good technique to | :41:04. | :41:09. | |
make the final and you have to be a performer at heart. I think you have | :41:10. | :41:13. | |
to go out and be able to perform. It's that minute and a half where | :41:14. | :41:17. | |
you have to deliver and its week after week. And the standard has two | :41:18. | :41:24. | |
stay high. If you are bad one week, like Helen George, you go. She was | :41:25. | :41:29. | |
one of our best dancers. The choreography is so important. When | :41:30. | :41:34. | |
you consider that my partner won with Louis Smith the year after, a | :41:35. | :41:41. | |
gymnast who could do these fabulous moves, that wasn't me. She knew that | :41:42. | :41:45. | |
my background was musical theatre so I could perform a seven second | :41:46. | :41:50. | |
change into a gold suit. How much say do you have in that? We put our | :41:51. | :41:59. | |
heads together, when I was on the ball going backwards and forwards, I | :42:00. | :42:04. | |
had the Benny Hill glasses on, so I couldn't see. You come together and | :42:05. | :42:11. | |
you come up with a creator and then it works. When I got off the ball, I | :42:12. | :42:16. | |
did a reverse, I took off the glasses and saw this beautiful woman | :42:17. | :42:21. | |
and then I put the glasses back on, and the story was, you know, it was | :42:22. | :42:28. | |
back to front, which is probably my dance! You are obviously game for | :42:29. | :42:33. | |
anything. Was there anything where you said no, I'm not doing it? Not | :42:34. | :42:44. | |
at all. We were told next week that I would be fired out of a cannon, | :42:45. | :42:48. | |
was I up for it and I said of course I am, why should I care, lives | :42:49. | :42:53. | |
living. What do you think about the voting, the audience having the | :42:54. | :42:57. | |
final say? Should it be like that through the show? I don't know what | :42:58. | :43:02. | |
happens in the final. It is all audience. I think they are pretty | :43:03. | :43:09. | |
good judge, not always the best dancer wins but it's not always the | :43:10. | :43:15. | |
best dance. It balances out. They don't all catch the imagination. The | :43:16. | :43:19. | |
public will balance out what the judges want, so you have the 50-50 | :43:20. | :43:23. | |
things going on where the judges will say one thing, some of them | :43:24. | :43:30. | |
going for technique more. We are out of time, folks. Great to have you. | :43:31. | :43:35. | |
Getting excited! Made the best contender win. Thank you very much | :43:36. | :43:38. | |
and thank you for your company today and through the year. | :43:39. | :43:40. | |
We're taking a festive break and will return on Monday 4th | :43:41. | :43:42. | |
January at 9:15am, but do look out for special programmes with Victoria | :43:43. | :43:45. | |
looking back at our exclusive interviews and films. | :43:46. | :43:49. | |
You can see the first part of that on the BBC News Channel on Monday | :43:50. | :43:52. | |
Let BBC Two wine and dine you this Christmas, | :43:53. | :44:05. | |
as Simply Nigella makes your festive delights a reality. | :44:06. | :44:11. | |
Then sample some taste-bud-tingling time travel | :44:12. | :44:15. |