08/02/2016 Victoria Derbyshire

Hello, good morning. Welcome to the programme.

Prisoners should be treated as potential assets rather

than liabilities - that's what David Cameron is set

to say later today when he announces a radical shake up in the way

prisons in England and Wales are run.

Also on the programme, claims from a former top family

court judge that family breakdown is so damaging that the Government

should recognise it as a public health issue like smoking

With hindsight, taking everything into account, I would not have gone

down the divorce road. You would like to have the opportunity to do

it differently and stay together? Yes. What do you think? My life is

happier. Sorry to say, I am glad it ended.

And would you back a ban on all junk food advertising before 9pm?

The Government's under pressure to include the measure

in its new childhood obesity strategy.

We're on BBC 2 and the BBC News Channel until 11 this morning.

Throughout the programme we'll bring you the latest breaking news

and developing stories and, as always, keen to hear

from you on all the stories in the news today.

Later this morning we'll discuss why more and more of you are having nose

jobs, eyelid lifts, and liposuction - a rising number of Brits

And we'll bring you an exclusive report looking at gangs in Salford.

Do get in touch throughout the programme, texts will be charged

And of course you can watch the programme online wherever

you are - via the BBC News app or our website bbc.co.uk/victoria.

Before ten, we will talk in more detail about reform of prisons and

the big plans David Cameron is going to set out for jails. Before that, a

former top judge tells the programme that family breakdown is so damaging

that it should be recognised as a public health issue like smoking or

obesity. Sir Paul Coleridge set up

the Marriage Foundation in 2012. He describes the pain caused

by divorce as the scourge of society If you're divorced, you may be tired

of hearing claims like that - after all, it's a debate that's been

held regularly for decades now. So we thought we'd take

Sir Paul Coleridge to meet couples who've divorced and their children

to try and understand Do take time to watch it

and tell us what you think - later in the programme you'll be

able to put your points I've spent over four decades

in the Family Justice Courts, partly as a barrister,

partly as a judge, and I am appalled by the destruction that

family breakdown causes. Two years ago I started

Marriage Foundation, which is devoted to try and combat

this particular scourge I believe things can be done,

if people knew more about the appalling pain that family

breakdown creates and had better access to help at

an appropriate time. Now I'm in Birmingham to meet

a family who have said they will talk about

their own experiences. You can always go out and get money,

but you can't get back the time that You're used to seeing

a family environment, the cooker going, the smells,

the girls, the sounds, smells. It's not there.

You know? And all you're left

with is the silence. So your great memory is, as it were,

the emptiness and the silence? I worked for the girls

to put food on the table, The thing you've worked

for all your life is gone. Yeah, but it's not

the be-all and end-all. Even the girls will say today,

he wasn't there for school events. It's Catch-22, isn't it?

You can't do both. to provide for your family,

the first thing you do My whole world collapsed

all in one go. Basically, I wasn't

there for the girls, because my head was

just absolutely gone. By both of my parents,

we all got treated like... I got to a point where I'd

had enough of the girls I went to social services

to hand her in, because I The battle, it's

just the two people. But they were brought into it.

We were. It didn't have to be a battle.

That's the point. Do you both admit that,

whatever the rights and wrongs were, They got involved, they got

involved and they were used. They never had the

chance to be heard. Mum and Dad wouldn't

listen to any of us. Also, our...

Extended family. We were, like, we're

not being heard. Mum would make comments

to Maisie about Dad. Very bitter.

It was all nit-picks. I think they always wanted to stay

together for us three, We would rather they'd broken up

when we were a lot littler, because we wouldn't

have the memories that we have I'd have wanted no arguments,

them two just to get on. Do you still have that kind of ideal

wish, that your family could be... Yeah, I probably do have that little

wish that they were still together. It wouldn't work,

I know it wouldn't. But why would you stay

in a relationship that you are both It's impacting your children,

you might not think it is, as they are little, but little

children can pick up on it, On a scale of one to ten,

how bad would you describe the emotional pain of

going through divorce? The worst thing you've

ever had to deal with? The worst thing is, I suppose,

you might have thought you were going to end it all?

I was. Did you ever get to that stage?

Yeah. With hindsight, taking

everything into account, I wouldn't have gone

down the divorce road. You would like to have

the opportunity to do it differently You feel you made

the right decision? So, this is a family

who were prepared to sit together and discuss these extremely

difficult personal issues. The huge impression I'm left

with is that Dad, in particular, is still feeling the pain in almost

a raw way. Mum has made some sense of it

and has moved on. The two children's take

is entirely different. What would be interesting to see

is how other young people have been I ran up to my bedroom and then

I decided So I went out to be

with my friends and just, They've been together

since they were 16. I'd like my parents

to still be together. But obviously it just

wasn't meant to be. I think when you find

somebody and you really Why do you think they were able

to make a go of it, Because I think it was not the ideal

thing to have a divorce. You would be looked down

on if you had a divorce, So there was a social pressure

on staying together? Do you think there is any social

pressure on staying together now? Your family is not a whole,

you know what I mean, But, like I said, we are all

so much better off now. I think there are four things that

struck me very forcefully as a result of those interviews

with those extremely One, that they had both suffered

terrifically as a result of the break-up of their parents,

under different circumstances. Two, they both aspired to something

better for themselves, a long-term, stable,

married relationship. Three, they had both seen,

amongst their own friends, stable families and this had made

them very sad and envious. And fourthly, in the background,

in both cases, there was a stable grand-parental household

to which they had almost clung, I have a sister who passed away very

young, and I compare my divorce Comparable in the terms

of pain that it caused. I think divorce

is not a light thing. I don't think anyone

does enter it lightly. I'll never forget that I just broke

down by the front door. As I walked upstairs -

I'm getting emotional thinking about it - as I walked upstairs

and walked past my son's room, and he was not there,

I completely fell apart. I concentrated a lot

on the children. But then, as they get older,

they're going to do their thing, you've got to think about,

who am I as a person and what am Can I ask you a question,

if you don't mind? Did you, initially,

the beginning, overcompensate? I didn't want them to be

disadvantaged in any way I was just emotionally

overcompensating. Just being there whenever

they needed me, doing whatever they wanted me to do,

listening to everything Almost giving them...

Too much attention, exactly. The thing I am existentially guilty

of is lack of self-esteem, lack of confidence,

lack of resilience. These things, I think,

are a classic manifestation of the trauma of divorce,

which are now playing I didn't want my children

to grow up in a tense, hostile environment,

with people who didn't like each I thought, that's not a good example

to be setting to two young children, that that is what

a marriage is like. The after-effects of my divorce

is that my children are quite driven, they are quite determined,

they go for what they want. My son plays rugby

semi-professionally, my daughter is at

performing arts school. They've gone for their dreams

and I've been behind them You know, we are a happy family

and they are successful children. The degree to how much you suffer,

how much you lose, is in the hands You've only got one life,

and I think if you spend that life pretending,

there can be no worse place to be. I'd rather be alone and happy,

than be together and unhappy. Every relationship, every long-term

relationship, has periods of difficulty, sometimes periods

of very great difficulty. I still am not persuaded that,

in most cases, the right And it sometimes is very difficult,

and the longer you leave it, But where there is a full-blown

family infrastructure with children, it is, I believe, from all the years

of experience that I've watched this, I believe that the better

option is to sort it out, however difficult it is,

than to destroy it. Later in the programme we'll speak

to Sir Paul Coleridge, and to parents who stayed together

for the sake of their kids, and those who got divorced

and thought it was the right Tell us what you did when your

marriage had problems. Thank you to those that have got in touch. John

says I have been a partner in a leading international headhunting

business for more than 20 years, dealing with many GCSE and A-level

students. It is a matter of great concern to me and it is simply not

considered by the system in any way. These children suffer. They suffer

greatly and rarely have any sort of advice or help on how their lives

can be rebuilt. Because they divorce is not just and a woman, it

intimately hurts and involves the future of the children, and damages

them unless huge care is taken by the divorcing parties. Trevor says

one a spouses unfaithful and causes divorce, the children suffer most by

being denied the love and care of both parents. Stewart says it is

good to see the programme discussing this. My daughter has been living

with me for seven years and it has taken its toll. Phil texted to say,

we have seen the scars caused by marriage breakdown for years. It

seems that has gone too far to repair, and too much to recover.

This e-mail from Maria, what a breath of fresh air from Sir Paul.

In 1988, I went to a lawyer and asked for a judicial separation. He

told me it takes three months and costs ?300. Eventually, I changed

ten lawyers and cost ?20,000 and lasted a couple of years, up until

today, I still don't why. If you have a pertinent experience get in

touch. If your marriage has hit problems, how did you deal with it?

Did you end up separating? What impact did it have on the family? If

you managed to stick together, tell us how you do this. If you want to

share the film, you can watch it again by going to the programme

page. High rates

of re-offending amongst former prisoners should "shame us all"

according to David Cameron. We will speak to a former prisoner

about what can be done to improve the conditions and cut the high

reoffending rates. Would your children eat

less junk food if TV ads We'll be speaking to some parents

here and we'd love to hear It is 9:31am. The main news this

morning. David Cameron is preparing to set

out plans to radically overhaul prisons in England and Wales -

describing the "failure" of the current system

as "scandalous". Prison governors are expected to be

given greater freedom over how they run their jails

as part of a pilot scheme. But the Prison Reform Trust says

improving the system won't be easy. We'll bring you more on that

in the next few minutes. Parts of Southern England and Wales

are being hit by strong winds and heavy rain as Storm Imogen

moves across the country. More than 50 flood warnings

are in place, while the Met Office has issued an amber

'prepared warning' for wind. Almost 5,000 homes have

been left without power A former top family court judge

tells this programme that family breakdown is so damaging

that the Government should recognise it as a public health issue -

like smoking or obesity. He warns that it is at epidemic

levels. Search teams in southern Taiwan have

rescued two people from a collapsed building in the city of Tainan, more

than two days after it was destroyed 37 people are known to have

died in the quake - David Cameron is expected to warn

that migrant camps like the "Jungle" in Calais could spring up

here in England, if the UK leaves The Prime Minister says an exit

from the EU could mean British border guards would no longer be

allowed to check Critics have accused

him of scaremongering. A huge new gas plant has been fired

up in the Shetland Isles. The site, which is run by French

energy company Total, is said to contain almost a fifth

of the UK's remaining oil It's expected to produce

around 8% of the country's supply, the equivalent to powering

more than two million homes. Let's catch up with

all the sport now. Good morning. It's time to look back

at a big weekend of sport, the six Nations began, the tournament which

stirs rivalries on these shores and England head coach Eddie Jones was

victorious over Scotland in his first match in charge but it wasn't

that pretty, Francis Crick past Italy before an entertaining game

yesterday in which Wales came from 13 points down to rescue a 16-16

draw with Ireland. It was a great start to the tournament will stop

much more to come in the next few weeks. Lester's miracle season

continued beating Man City and Spurs up to second place, so there could

be a new Premier League champion, unless Arsenal keep up the pressure,

beating Bournemouth. United and Chelsea drew. Louis Van Gaal was

angry with the media once again it using them of inventing stories

again, this time about Jose Mourinho being on the way into Old Trafford.

The stories may be false but the pressure on van Gaal is real colour

they are six points away from a place in the Champions League. Late

last night it was the 50th Super Bowl, Carolina Panthers against the

Denver Broncos. Cam Newton, the most valuable Player of the Season was

ineffective as Peyton Manning and the Broncos became second Super Bowl

champions. The question is will the 39-year-old retired from the sport

now? I will have a round-up just after 10am.

David Cameron is to say that if Britain pulls out of the EU migrant

camps could appear in south-east England. Critics have accused him of

scaremongering. Let's talk to our political Guru Norman Smith.

His argument is we have an arrangement with the French at the

moment going back to 2003 negotiated by David Blunkett when he was Home

Secretary, whereby border controls to come to the UK are carried out in

the French ports, so the checks are done in Calais and Dunkirk and so on

and so forth. As a result when migrants are stopped from coming

here they are stopped on French soil, rather than coming here and

having their checks on here. Mr Cameron is saying, look, if we leave

the EU the French will say forget it, we will not bother policing your

border checks over here, you can Joly well do it in England, which,

says Mr Cameron, the camps like the Jungle and so on and so forth will

move to coastal towns along the south coast of England. So all of

the sort of chaos and violence and squalor that we see in some of these

camps will relocate, in effect, to Dover and elsewhere along the south

coast. That has prompted the countercharge from those who want to

leave the EU saying this is scaremongering and its trying to

frighten people. Point of fact, this was a bilateral deal done between,

as I say, the British government, David Blunkett and his French

counterpart and it's nothing to do with the EU, therefore it is argued

it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference if we left the EU because

this deal is a simple straightforward agreement between

London and Paris. Speaking to No 10 this morning they are absolutely

adamant that if we leave the EU all of our existing relationships with

every country in the rest of the EU will change, including with France,

and don't expect the French to carry on doing this sort of border check.

This kind of claim is an illustration of what the public

should expect over the next few months until the referendum happens.

Two things follow from it, one of the things we already know that

immigration will be such a huge part of this referendum campaign, so no

surprises there. No 10 clearly wants to try and turn the issue to their

advantage, saying in effect things will be an awful lot worse if we

pull out. The second thing which I think is interesting is that it is

part of a broader argument which No 10 are trying to flesh out now

trying to pitch their case of staying in the EU as a case of

national security, about personal safety, not just in terms of the

danger of these camps like the Jungle coming to the white cliffs of

Dover, or whatever, we will hear a lot more about how being part of the

EU enables us to corporate or with other intelligence agencies, it

enables us to share intelligence with our European partners, it

enables us to introduce new measures to restrict suspected terrorists

from travelling through Europe, the European Arrest Warrant enables us

to pick up suspects in other countries. In other words No 10 want

to get away from the technical and specific arguments about tax

credits, or whether we have a red card to block the European

Commission from doing things, or whether we have an opt out from ever

closer union. I think they have worked out that most people will not

decide which way they vote on those Areen narrow specific arguments, but

if you make a bigger argument about our national security and safety,

that is much more of a gut this rule argument more likely to get people

on board. Norman Smith, thank you. Let's talk about what is happening

to thousands of Syrian refugees who are trapped at a border crossing in

Turkey this morning. They have fled from Syria's second

city Aleppo, where Syrian government forces, backed by Russian

airstrikes, are fighting rebels. It's desperate for the people

of Aleppo - what's the best Stay in their homes and risk

being bombed by Russian planes who are supporting

President Assad of Syria? Stay in their home city and risk

being caught in fighting on the ground between rebels,

so-called Islamic State militias Or try and escape north to Turkey

to a refugee camp which is Officials in the EU are calling

on Turkey to let in some About 4.6 million people have fled

the war-torn country since the civil Our correspondent Mark

Lowen is at the border. Linda Tom is from the United Nations

Office for the Coordination She is in Jordan. Linda Ti, tell us

about some of the conditions of people who fled Aleppo to get to the

border with Turkey -- Linda Tom. It is not just people in Aleppo but

also surrounding areas. The situation is extremely precarious

for tens of thousands of people in and around Aleppo seeking safety and

security amidst ongoing aerial bombardment and shelling. We

estimate there are 35,000 people, mostly from Aleppo, who are newly

displaced, this doesn't include people displaced by violence in the

last couple of months. This figure includes 15,000 people who are

staying in a town in collective centres with host families, and in

addition to that we have about 3000 people at the border and in various

camps which are already filled to capacity. Are you saying 35,000 in

the last few days? 35,000 in the last week. OK. What kind of stories

are they telling, aid workers when they reach the bawdy -- border with

Turkey? Our partners are talking to people at the border and I'd managed

to speak to somebody who had been at the border in the last couple of

days. The families that are camped there are being provided with food,

they staying in small tents provided by Turkish NGOs. But what they are

saying to our partners on the ground is that they don't want food, they

don't want money, what they want is safe passage to Turkey so that they

can be safe. OK. I'm sure as a representative of the United Nations

you're not going to pass comment on whether Turkey should let them in or

not but in terms of their safety what would be the best thing for

them? What we are calling for is for the protection of civilians who have

no part in this conflict. With the ongoing shelling we are talking

about safe passage for civilians who need to flee conflict, whether that

be through Turkey, or whether that be through other areas within Syria.

OK. You will understand in terms of the pressure on Turkey they have

allowed thousands and thousands of refugees from Syria. Can they take

any more? That is a question to pose to the Turkish government. What we

can say is at this current time we have thousands of people desperate

to escape these difficult conditions and they have been desperate to

escape for a long time. For example there have been 13 strikes on

medical facilities in the month of January alone. What that means is

that people in those areas are not able to access medical facilities as

they are damaged, or in areas where there is ongoing fighting these

hospitals and health centres are not functioning soap people are left to

fend for themselves -- so people functioning soap people are left to

left to fend for themselves and humanitarian organisations are

trying to reach people in need but because of the ongoing conflict it

makes it increasingly difficult for us to reach them. Thank you, Linda

Mark Lowen is at Turkey's border Tom.

Mark Lowen is at Turkey's border with Syria. Tell us about the

Mark Lowen is at Turkey's border situation for people fleeing Aleppo

trying to find safety? situation for people fleeing Aleppo

catastrophic situation as you can imagine. Aleppo, Syria's

city, is becoming slowly surrounded by this 2-pronged attack by Assad

forces and Russian air strikes. There are over 100 Russian air

strikes a day sometimes and they are closing in on opposition held areas

of the city, trying to drive rebels out of Aleppo. If that were to

happen, develop both felt completely to the regime it could be a fatal

blow to the opposition in Syria. -- if Aleppo fell. The border with

Turkey remains closed. 35,000 refugees on the other side but tens

of thousands more could be flooding to the border will stop Turkey is

providing shelter and food and blankets on the other side, creating

in a sense a Turkish refugee camp on the Syrian side of the border and

says they are not going to open that border for the time being. There are

conflicting pressures here. Turkey on the one hand is being told by

Europe and aid agencies you have to accept this and on the other hand

turkeys being told by the European Union you must stem the flow of

refugees travelling west to Europe, so Turkey is caught between these

two macro conflicting messages. We have shown our audience images of

Aleppo before this latest assault, if you like, from the Syrian army

backed by Russian planes and after. And it is clear obviously the

devastation. For the people in Aleppo it is no choice, you can stay

in your home and risk being bombed by a Russian plane or try and get to

refugee camps that are overcrowded and potentially not able to cope. It

is the best of two bad options, really. We have spoken to some

people that have come over here. Those that are heavily wounded,

gravely injured, they can cross. I spent yesterday at the state

Hospital, right on the border. I saw one man who had lost an eye, because

of a Russian air strike on his home, a wall collapsed on his head, a bit

of concrete had gone into his eye and he had lost it. I saw another

man who had lost his kneecap from a Russian air strike, the shrapnel had

gone into his knee. They are in a dire situation. They have families

back in Aleppo, trying to stay put, withstand the onslaught from the

Russian air strikes and the Assad attacks. When you speak to them, I

said, do you still want to go back to Aleppo, they say, yes, it is our

home, we want to go back to our family. It's hard to know how that

is going to happen, partly because of their injuries and also because

the main supply route to Aleppo has been taken by the Assad regime.

Really, the area controlled by the opposition within Aleppo is

shrinking ever further. The big fear is that if the city is surrounded,

if thousands in that city could be trapped, they could be deprived of

food and water, there could be starvation like we have seen in

other parts of Syria. Really, perhaps the worst humanitarian

crisis of the Syrian war so far could be unfolding. Thank you. Still

to come: more and more people are having cosmetic surgery, if new

figures are anything to go by. Last year, 51,000 of you had something

done. We will talk to people who spend thousands of pounds on their

faces, stomachs, bottoms, bodies generally. If you have had cosmetic

surgery, tell me why. It is not just women, plenty of men as well. Thank

you very much to those who have got in touch about the earlier

conversation on family breakdowns. Paul, a former family court judge,

says it should be effectively be treated by the government as a

public health issue, as damaging as smoking or obesity. Here are some of

your messages. Jo says, my parents split when I was two. I don't know

exactly how it has affected me, but I do know I would not wish it on

anybody. Michaela says, my parents separating at a young age was the

best thing for all of us. It makes you stronger and understand that

life is not always rosy. This tweet from Jerome, parents who cannot

educate children about divorce and ensure healthy lifestyles are unfit

to be parents. Seems a little harsh, perhaps? Jane, children get caught

in an adult conflict, of which they can have no control. There are no

winners when it comes to divorce. This is from Robert, why is there

such a negative spin on divorce? Why not look at it from a positive side

of things? It can also work better for all parties. Caroline says, my

parents divorced when I was 11. It was horribly unpleasant and caused a

number of issues for me and my brothers on a personal level. It

also taught as resilience and gave us strength. My parents were so

different, I believe it gave us a sense of balance. I had friends

whose parents stayed together for the sake of the children, and I

don't see the benefit. They saw marriage are suffering through the

problems. I got fantastic new siblings and a stepmother I would

not be without for the world. My children have four sets of

grandparents. They are spoiled rotten and loved to pieces. My

parents divorced when I was 16, I had to quit six form to look after

my dad, who took it badly. I was an a grade student and I feel I lost my

teenage years and university experience because of this. I grew

distant from my friends. I'm 27 and only just getting back on track with

my education. I started my degree this year. You can e-mail me at the

usual address, send me a message on Twitter or send a text. Let's talk

about a shake-up of the way prisons in England and Wales are going to be

run. In a speech later today, David Cameron will say the failure of the

current system, with high reoffending rates and levels of

violence is scandalous. He will say that current levels of prison

violence, drug taking and self harm should shame us all. A typical week

in a prison in England and Wales is 600 incidents of self harm, at least

one suicide and 350 assaults, including 90 on staff. Some of the

plans that Mr Cameron will announce are thought to include allowing more

inmates out of jail during the week and measures to transform the

education system in jails. Let's talk to our home affairs

correspondent Danny Shaw. This is quite a big speech? A British Prime

Minister hadn't made a speech on prisons in England and Wales for 20

years? That is what Downing Street is saying, I think Prime Minister is

probably have spoken about prisons before, but perhaps giving it the

full attention and making it the main theme of the speech, maybe that

is something different. It was foreshadowed in his party conference

speech, when he spoke about prisons being a key part of social reform in

this Parliament. He is saying wholesale reform is needed. The main

thing he will spell out is to give prison governors more autonomy, have

them say over how prisons are run in terms of budgets, in terms of what

provision they make for rehabilitation and other services.

Prison governors at the moment feel they do not have much control, they

have had to adhere to the guidelines set by the management service. They

would welcome any moves to give them more control. It is a question of

how it is done and exactly how much control they will have. Let's talk

about some of the ideas that have been floated. I don't know if you

know how much truth there is in the idea that inmates will be let out

during the week and go back to jail at the weekend, to free up space?

That is unconfirmed, I think it was floated a couple of months ago.

Certainly, I think the government was looking at ways in which they

can reduce the use of custody and, yet, ensure the public are safe and

not put at risk. Electronic tagging is one possible way of doing that.

The idea of weekend prisons has been tried before. It was tried in the

Labour, when David Blunkett was the Home Secretary. I think it was

called intermittent custody. It was a failure. It was scrapped. If the

Government is to go down that road, they should look very closely at the

lessons learned from that particular experiment. More education, while

inmates are inside? What the Government wants to do here, I

think, is raise the standard of teaching. At the moment, it is not

seen as a great profession to be a teacher inside prisons. They are

going to enlist the help of Teach first, which runs the education of

graduates, and they want a scheme to encourage the best people to go into

prisons and rehabilitate inmates and give them the skills they need to

avoid falling back into a life of crime when they are released. I

don't think anybody would disagree with that. The question is, can you

are effectively promote rehabilitation when there are 85,000

people locked up in England and Wales, staff numbers have been

falling since 2010, although they have stabilised a bit. The prison

regime is stretched, staff are stretched. You have high levels of

violence. Can you make a difference unless you tackle the numbers and

reduce overcrowding? OK. When Ken Clarke was the Justice Secretary,

just after the Coalition Government came in 2010, he came up with the

idea of a rehabilitation revolution. It didn't really happen. That was

about making sure we reduce the reoffending rate. 46% of prisoners

reoffend within a year of release. Is this also going to fail? Will

there be more money on offer? Dyfed there will be more money, but I

think they hope that if they can make it more effective, the prisons

that can spend money more wisely will be able to make a difference.

There has been talk about some kind of league table of prisons. There

are already performance tables and rankings for prisoners. That is

nothing new. If you give governors more control, it will be a greater

incentive to say, my prisoners at the top of the table, look how well

it is doing, and we are spending money wisely. Then you could have

the savings reinvested in that way. It depends so much on numbers. The

prison population is due to rise, it is due to go up. It's about 80,000?

prison population is due to rise, it 80 5000. It is hard to predict how

the prison population will go. The forecasts say it could go up by 2000

or 3000 over the next few years. That puts more strain on the system.

It's hard to make lasting change with those numbers increasing. Thank

you very much. Let's talk to more -- Mark Johnson, a former prisoner and

founder of the charity User Voice. What do you think of these ideas?

I'm a bit of a cynic. I have heard successive governments, since I have

been working in a charity field, talk a lot of rhetoric. If the

rhetoric transforms to action, are they get ideas? Son, yes. But the

devil is certainly in the detail. My biggest thing is that today we are

talking about education in prison. I want to know what kind of education.

The causes of crime are a psychological issue. People make

very poor decisions, or make very calculated decisions, and when they

enter into prison, they are often not tackled. What I mean is somebody

has not sat down and worked with them to find out the real causes of

why they are there in the first place, to make sure they are not

going to do it on release. Teaching maths and English, academic and

vocational training, is not the real issue. It might help somebody get a

job? Historically, policymakers, through the very narrow view of what

education means, they try to regurgitate their perception over a

very volatile group of people. Society will ultimately pay the

cost. Does a prison governor get measured on people break out of

prison, or how many people go back in? Until we started tackle that

issue, we will start to get some sort of stimulation on people

committed to tackling the true causes of crime. Thanks for coming

on the programme. It is time for the weather. Here is

Carol to tell us about Storm Imogen. It is progressing slowly, but I can

show you exactly where it developed. It was off the coast of North

America and Canada. Drifting It was off the coast of North

the Atlantic as a weather bomb. 953 millibars, it did not depend any

further and are starting to fill, so it is weakening. Look at the

isobars, that is giving us the gusty winds. If you look at the direction

of the wind, it is coming from a steady north-westerly direction.

That is over 80,000 miles. That is allowing the waves and the swell to

grow. We have seen some handing us this morning already. This is the

size of wave we are looking for. To put that into context, ten or 12

metres, that is pretty big. A double-decker versus 4.3 metres. As

they crash into sure, they are between two five metres. If you were

unlucky enough to be out at sea and see one that was 40 metres, that is

taller than three double-decker bushes. -- buses. This is a picture

taken at Saint Mary 's on the Isle of silly. That is huge. There is the

building, two stories. It is cashing in on shore. It is going against a

barrier, making its spray even more. Huge waves. If you are thinking

about going for a walk on the coastline, I would not do it myself,

be very careful. I will explain what else is happening.

Storm Imogen has been packing a punch on the Isles of Scilly. 78 mph

gusts. Pembury Sands, 74. Plymouth, 60 mph. Storm Imogen is weakening,

but you can see how the strongest wind, the tiny isobars, are

continuing to drift from south Wales and south-west England, off in the

direction of south-east England. It is the South of England and South

Wales that has The Met Office Amber be prepared warning. Storm Imogen

has already caused some disruption and is likely to continue to do so

as you go to the rest of the day. So, inland, we are looking at gusts

of 55 or 65 mph. Towards the coast, with exposure, 70 or 80 mph,

possibly even more, as we have already seen, at The Needles, where

we had gusts of 96 mph. Couple that with showers, nasty driving

conditions. North Wales and Northern Ireland, still as windy, but not as

windy. We have a plethora of showers, some of them are emerging.

In between, brighter and sunny skies. The lightest wind, the driest

conditions, across Scotland. Fewer showers here. Those that fall on

higher ground are likely to be wintry in nature. To recap, the

Northern Ireland, northern England, parts of southern Scotland, 30 or 40

mph gusts. For most of Wales, East Anglia, 40 or 50. As we come across

South Wales and southern counties of England, 60 or 70 mph. With

exposure, 80 plus. That is where we have the weather warning. Wherever

you are, it will feel cold, apart from anything else. Overnight, the

wind will slowly start to ease. Still going to be very windy. We

will have a band of rain and some showers, and it will be cold enough

for frost across parts of Scotland, with the risk of ice. Here, wintry

showers. We will see a wintry flavour across the Pennines. The

hills, in Wales, and also the moors. That will be how we start

the day tomorrow. Tomorrow, some sunshine around as well. The wind

continuing to is a touch. But it is still going to be a windy day. Some

of the snow across the Highlands and Grampians getting down to more

modest levels. Temperatures, five or eight, roughly where we should be at

this stage of the year, nonetheless, cold. A quick look at Wednesday.

Hello - it's just after 10am, it's Monday,

Welcome to the programme if you've just joined us.

With 19 shootings in just 12 months, including that of a seven-year-old

boy and his mother - we'll be looking at why Salford has

seen such extreme violence spilling onto its streets.

Our reporter Catrin Nye discovers 30 children in the city of are living

with the threat of murder. He was on the floor and he went up to him and

shot him in the chest and shot him again and the bullet went through

his chest into the floor, then he stamped constantly on him all over

his face. Also on the programme: prisoner

should be treated as assets rather than liabilities. That is what David

Cameron is going to say later today as he announces a shake-up in the

way prisons in England and Wales are run. And a former top judge tells us

why he thinks divorce does untold damage to parents and their

children. We will also hear from families who have been through a

break-up. It was a battle. There was also a battle between us. But it

didn't have to be a battle, that was the whole point.

The main news so far this morning, breaking news, an 80-year-old girl

has been pulled alive from the rubble of an apartment complex in

Taiwan after being trapped for nearly three days in earthquake

rubble. -- eight-year-old girl. Rescuers freed two other people

earlier this morning. 37 people are known to have died and 100 are still

missing. David Cameron is preparing to set out plans to radically

overhaul prisons in infant and Wales describing the failure of the

current system as scandalous. Prison governors are expected to be given

greater freedom over how they run their jails as part of a pilot

scheme. We will get reaction to the plans from the Howard league for

penal reform later on in the programme.

Parts of Southern England and Wales are being hit by strong winds

and heavy rain as Storm Imogen moves across the country.

More than 50 flood warnings are in place, while the Met Office

has issued an amber prepared warning for wind.

Almost 5,000 homes have been left without power in the South West.

A former top family court judge tells this programme that family

breakdown is so damaging that the government should recognise

it as a public health issue - and warns that's its at epidemic

One mother tells us the impact her separation had

My whole world collapsed all in one go and basically I wasn't there for

the girls. I went to social services, this is how my head was, I

went to social services to hand her in because I said I couldn't cope.

The Prime Minister says an excerpt from the EU could mean British

border gods would no longer be able to check passports in France.

Critics have accused him of scaremongering.

A huge new gas plant has been fired up in the Shetland Isles.

The site, which is run by French energy company Total,

is said to contain almost a fifth of the UK's remaining oil

It's expected to produce around 8% of the country's supply,

the equivalent to powering more than 2 million homes.

Let's catch up with all the sport now.

The Six Nations is underway - England were clinical and abrasive,

Scotland need a rocket, a draw for Wales and Ireland was no

good to anyone - those were the conclusions after the first

weekend of the championship, that left England and new coach

England making ground, softening up the defence, Jack Nowell into the

corner for the try, what a try for England. The RBS six Nations man of

the match is this man, Billy Vunipola. Victory for England, Eddie

Jones' England. Vunipola. Victory for England, Eddie

would be a difficult game, we had two weeks together with virtually a

new team doing new things but I was pleased with our application in the

first half and the defence was outstanding. That game was there to

be won and that is the hard cold fact of the situation. If we get

ourselves in a similar situation we have two nail it.

He's going on his own and he is over, he scores! What a kick by

Jonny Sexton. We are all square. Would put some pressure on them, we

didn't get those points and they built their way into the lead. In

the end, we are probably reasonably relieved to escape with a 16-6 draw.

I'm glad we managed to get back into the game and get a draw out of it.

13-0 down, to come back and get a draw I guess that is not too bad.

COMMENTATOR: That is a monster of a kick.

Heroic performance by the whole Italian side. But France have come

through, they have squeaked their way to a win.

A good start there. The other big event was the Super Bowl with 160

million watching around the world. They saw the Broncos beat the

Carolina Panthers. The Broncos' Peyton Manning became the first

quarterback to win the title with two different teams at the age of 39

prompting questions over his future is. Panthers hasta looking for the

first crown. But nobody could criticise their dedication, this is

their linebacker Thomas Davis who broke his arm, and he praised his

medical team who stitched him up so he could play. Not sure if it was

deliberate but his arm resembled an American football. And he came out

on the losing side. I will be back with the headlines at 10:30am. Good

morning. We are on the air until 11am. We're always keen to hear from

you if have personal experience of a story in the news. In terms of

prison reform and what David Cameron will set out later today, this tweet

from Paul, we cannot improve the numbers on education inside when

prisoners are locked in cells all day due to insufficient staff.

Another tweet, it is about time that is prison reform, I agree it is

about punishment but we must educate prisoners. And this from Paul as

well: prisons to be reformed while massively understaffed and bursting

at the seams? Keep the comments coming in, texts will be charged at

the standard network rate. You can watch the show online by looking at

the BBC News app and on the website. Salford has seen extreme violence in

the last year, the result of a gang feud that has spilled out onto the

streets. When a 7-year-old boy and his mother

were shot on their doorstep, it became clear things had

reached a shocking low. BBC Panorama has learned that 30

children in the city are living with the threat of murder,

as Catrin Nye reports. A grenade thrown through

the window of a house here. And a man shot dead with a machine

gun on the driveway of his home Patricia Erdman knows what it's

like to live in the middle You know how close we

were just by looking. Her son Lee was shot

and killed in a pub in 2011 in front

of around 30 people. The bullet went straight

through his heart and he just fell to the floor and then he went up

to him and shot him in the chest again, and the bullet

went through his And then he just stamped

constantly all over After he had shot Lee he just

threatened everybody in the pub. Patricia knows potential witnesses

are scared but she's to hopes Despite everybody's best

efforts, nobody has And clearly some individuals

will feel they can Last July another as

yet unsolved murder. Convicted criminal turned would-be

Mayor of Salford Paul Massey was murdered with

a machine gun on the Will you catch the person

who did it, or will it become another unsolved

murder in Salford? Yes, it is challenging but I feel

positive about the progress Seven months after his

death no one has been Paul Ferris is a convicted

gun-runner and friend of Paul Massey, who now writes books

about his criminal past. What are the consequences

of Paul Massey's death? It's a never-ending cycle and it's

a cycle that can only be broken What if the police

find the person that If the police find the person

who did it they've got There's a lot of friends of Paul's

who are still in prison. The escalation of violence

in Salford means last year police personally warned more than 100

people that their lives were in danger, and that's

affecting children. Official figures obtained

by panorama revealed that 30 children in Salford live

in a household where a family member is at risk of being murdered,

or murdering someone. That's a whole classroom

full of children. Four months ago gunmen

targeted this house. for a man named Christian

Hickey. seven-year-old son and the boy's

mother. It crossed a line, where even

for those people who do have a distrust of policing come

forward and tell us what you know For Christmas the injured

boy asked Santa to help the police catch

the men who hurt him. So far the police have

been unsuccessful. And, you can watch Catrin Nye's full

report, Gangs, Guns and the Police tonight on Panorama,

that's on BBC One at 8:30pm. This news has just come in and it's

to do with an Npower, the gas and electricity provider announcing a

5.2% reduction in prices cutting its standard domestic gas tariff, and

Parr announcing a cut in prices by 5.2% cutting the standard gas bill

by ?32. Still to come: should couples struggling with their

relationship do more to avoid divorce? The family court judge says

it should be treated as seriously as smoking and obesity.

More and more of you are having cosmetic surgery -

with new figures showing pretty much every type of nip and tuck and op

Last year 51,000 Brits underwent a procedure -

that's a rise of 13% on the previous year and a new record.

The most popular cosmetic op is still a boob job.

That includes both enlargements and reductions -

and saw a 12% increase to more than 9,600 procedures last year.

The next most popular type of surgery is eyelid lifts which saw

And face and neck lifts were up 16% to 7,419.

The biggest jump in surgeries is for liposuction -

which saw an increase of 20% taking the total to 5,500.

Worth pointing out these figures don't include all the British people

who go abroad for cosmetic surgery - which is thought to be more

We'd like to hear your experiences of cosmetic surgery -

why did you have it - and how do you feel about it now?

Alicia Douvall is a former glamour model who regrets spending over

?1 million on hundreds of cosmetic surgery procedures.

and you regret every single pound you have spent. I certainly do. You

spend ?20,000 on a boot job, nose job and like the suction. What is

that? It is a type of like the suction done with injections,

breaking down the fat and it is removed by a suction machine. Which

part of your body did you have that done on? I had it around the Fima

and the back of the leg. You had an operation last September. ?1 million

on how many operations? More than that. It is probably about 360 now.

Give our audience an idea of what kind of procedures will stop what

kind of procedures? I've had 22 breast operations, nose job, guys,

there is nothing I haven't had done. In terms of the breast operations,

was that to correct previous procedures? Most of it has been

reconstruction surgery. Katharina, tell us why you had the procedures

you had. It started when I was 15, I did not have a proper breast on one

side. The doctor said if I got to the age of 21 and they have not even

doubt, I could apply to have a -- an operation, if they did not even out.

Wasn't having an impact on the way that you thought about yourself, how

you went about your life? Incredibly, when you don't have the

same kind of construction as everybody else, you do feel

masculine, like you don't have that sense of femininity. When I did have

that done, it dramatically increased my confidence. I felt like a whole

new person. I felt normal. What was your reason for going for breast

augmentation? It affected my confidence on a deeper level. I lost

quite a bit of weight. I went from having boobs to losing them. I went

up in size for bras I was wearing, I could not wear the same kind of

dresses as my friends. I did feel like I was the odd one out and I

needed to do something about it. Alysia, can you relate to the

self-esteem and recession? People have plastic surgery, like myself,

because they have low self-esteem. I was very young and naive. I wish

somebody, that age, said, were gone what is inside, it does not matter

what you look like. If you are clever, if you excel at something,

that is what matters. If somebody said that to you, you would not have

listened? I wish. If somebody said, if you start having plastic surgery,

you cannot stop, it is a commitment for the rest of your life, then...

You have had three procedures, might you become addicted? Do you

recognise what she is saying? I do think there is a risk of addiction.

But it is a personal thing as well. I don't think I would go too far. I

am happy with the way things are now. I would maintain fillers, but I

don't think I need anything else. What do you have those four? The

lips. Why do you need bigger lips? They are personal questions, but I'm

fascinated. It is not throughout the whole of them, it is just at the

corners. A surgeon injects some stuff? It is technically

nonsurgical, when you have fillers. I'm not an addictive personality,

I've not been into drugs or alcohol, anything like that, I started with

one boob job, semipermanent make-up, implants are not for ever,

one boob job, semipermanent make-up, It is something you go into, if I

have children, my body will change, the implants will not last. That is

something I'm aware of. There is not really anything else I would

consider having done. I would not rule it out, later my life, there is

nothing to say I will not be comfortable with how my body looks.

But I'm not thinking of having different things other than

But I'm not thinking of having done. The figures published today

show a record high, a record number of British people having procedures,

and not just women, men as well, going for similar sorts of

procedures. We are becoming more vain. It is becoming

procedures. We are becoming more years ago people would not want to

come out and say. years ago people would not want to

salon. We don't see it as a serious operation. You go in, you have your

boobs, your nose done, it is a operation. You go in, you have your

celebrities, which people are looking up to, they all have plastic

surgery. People see it as the answer. I think it is more

accessible to have it done and more acceptable. People can get finance

accessible to have it done and more deals, they can find other ways to

have better access to cosmetic surgery. It is very much something

everybody does nowadays. Most of my friends have had it done. Sadly, it

is advertised on TV. It is sad we are following America in that way. I

don't think cosmetic surgery is a bad thing, there is nothing wrong

with wanting to improve yourself and make yourself a better version of

you. As long as it is for yourself, your own confidence, not something

you have done because you feel other people don't like that about you.

Did you research your surgeon, did you research the risk, were you told

about the risks? It is a serious operation. I did a lot of research,

it was ten years I had been considering. I had always wanted a

bigger boobs anyway, but since the weight loss as well, it was

something I really felt I needed to have done. I did a lot of research

online. I was recommended the surgeon, the people that I went

with, it was a pleasant experience throughout. I could not have any

complaints at all. When you hear somebody like Alysia talking about

her regrets, how does that make you feel? On a personal level, everybody

has their own reasons for having surgery. For me, it is different to

it might be for you, and yourself as well, different reasons that we

choose to have cosmetic surgery. Some people might have regrets, some

people might say it is the best thing they have ever done. In my

case, that is the case. What about you, when you hear about those

regrets? I think it is unfortunate some people do feel like the surgery

was not the best decision. Like you were saying, it is a very personal

choice. I don't have any regrets. Do you feel fake? No. Just checking! I

do! And the mother of a 20-year-old and I always tell her to embrace her

differences, do not put fake eyelashes on, dye your hair, she's

been brought up to believe that she is proud of who she is, confident,

and locks are not as important as you think they are when you are 20.

Thank you very much. Still to come - would banning TV ads

for junk food before 9pm We'll be chatting to some mums

here in the studio, as well as hearing your thoughts

on the matter. Let's talk more about the shake-up

of the way prisons are run in this country, which the Prime Minister's

set to announce a bit later. He'll say that the current system,

with its violence, drug-taking and high re-offending

rates, is scandalous. He's expected to promise more

control for prison governors on how to run their jails and promise

better education for prisoners in the hope they won't

commit any more crimes. Earlier we spoke to a former

prisoner, Mark Johnson. I asked him what he thought

of David Cameron's plan. Because I've heard successive

governments since I've been working within the charity field

talk a lot of rhetoric. But if this rhetoric

transforms to action, Some, yes, but the devil

is certainly in the detail. My biggest thing is,

today we are talking I want to know what

type of education. Because, crime and the causes

of crime are a psychological issue. That was the view of one former

inmate. What about if better prisons could prevent reoffending? Let's

talk to Howard Nielsen from the Centre for penal reform. What you

think of these ideas? And they are very welcome, it is the first time

we have seen a speech from a Prime Minister purely focused on prison

reform in two decades. It is very important that the Prime Minister

pubs his weight behind the proposals. The idea of giving

governors more autonomy is a good one. Seeking to improve prison

education is a holy grail that successive governments have liked

that. Cannot be done, with the prison population as high as it is?

That is the big question. At the moment, the issue is the size of the

prison population, prison overcrowding. The fact that prisons,

like other public services, have seen spending cuts in prisons, it

has meant less staff. When you have more prisoners, that means less

staff. Prisoners are spending more of their days locked in cells, doing

nothing. That is behind a lot of the problems we have seen developing,

the rise in violence, suicide and self harm in recent times. How do

you make an inmate learn, if they don't want to? There are all sorts

of creative techniques that teachers can use. That is the sort of thing

the Government is going to be exploring. But I think the practical

issue is, how do you make a prisoner learn if they are stuck in their

cells and there are not the staff to get them out of the cells and into

classrooms? Government after Government has come up with

suggestions to cut reoffending. It is still really high, 46% of people,

once they come out, reoffend. Do you have your own suggestions? It is

even higher if you look at people with short

sentences. Two thirds gone to reoffend. 12 months or less? People

that spend a few weeks in prison. They have also not committed serious

violent crimes, that is why they got a short sentence. That is why we

need to look at alternatives to prison. If we gave people on short

sentences more opportunities to earn their release, if they engage with

rehabilitation, you can reduce the demand on the system. Then prisoners

are able to focus what resources they do have, on the people the

public are most concerned about. There is talk of reducing demand,

unconfirmed, we will find out when Mr Cameron gives a speech, prisoners

being let out during the week, on tag, more use of community

punishments. If that is confirmed, you would welcome that? We would

need to see the detail. There are some suggestions, releasing

prisoners during the week, only to have them imprisoned at weekend, it

begs the question, why put them in prison at all? If they are safe

enough to be in the community from Monday to Friday, why put them in on

Saturday and Sunday? The use of more urgent release, community

supervision, something we broadly welcome.

The news and sport in a moment. First, we want to show you a bit of

Beyonce's performance at the Super Bowl.

# OK, ladies, let's get in formation... #

# I twirl all my haters Albino alligators

# El Camino with the ceiling low Sippin' Cuervo with no chaser

# Sometimes I go off, I go off I go hard, I go hard

# Get what's mine, take what's mine I'm a star,

The Denver Broncos may have beaten the Carolina Panthers by 24 points

to 10 - but it's Beyonce who stole the show.

Not only was her performance sensational - but many people have

been commenting on how she used her performance to make

a point about the rights of black people - and lots are tweeting

Her dancers were dressed to possibly look like the political group,

the Black Panthers, and they formed an X during the performance,

seen as a reference to activist Malcolm X.

She released a surprise to -- track over the weekend called Formation.

A former top judge tells us why he believes that

divorce is one of the most damaging things we can do to ourselves

Measures to tackle childhood obesity could include a ban on adverts

But would it make any difference to your child's health?

We'll be hearing your views - and chatting to some mums

An eight-year-old girl has been pulled alive from the rubble

of an apartment complex in Taiwan - nearly three days after the building

Rescuers freed two other survivors earlier this morning.

37 people are known to have died in the quake -

The energy provider Npower says it will reduce its household gas prices

The announcement follows similar tariff cuts by rival suppliers E.ON

David Cameron is preparing to set out plans to radically overhaul

prisons in England and Wales - describing the "failure"

of the current system as "scandalous".

Prison governors are expected to be given greater freedom over how

they run their jails as part of a pilot scheme.

Parts of southern England and Wales are being hit by strong winds

and heavy rain as Storm Imogen moves across the country.

More than 50 flood warnings are in place, while the Met Office

has issued an amber 'prepared warning' for wind.

Thousands of home in south-west England, Gloucestershire

A former top family court judge tells this programme that family

breakdown is so damaging that the government should recognise

it as a public health issue - and warns that's its

it as a public health issue - and warns that it's

One mother tells us the impact her separation had

A huge new gas plant has been fired up in the Shetland Isles.

The site, which is run by french energy company Total,

is said to contain almost a fifth of the UK's remaining

It's expected to produce around 8% of the country's

supply, the equivalent to powering more than two million homes.

Let's catch up with all the sport now.

Wales came from 13 points behind to claim a draw against Ireland

England top the table after beating Scotland,

Around 160 million people were watching across the world

as the Denver Broncos beat favourites Carolina Panthers to win

The Broncos' Peyton Manning became the first quarterback to win

the title at two different teams at the age of 39.

Louis van Gaal's frustration with the press continued yesterday,

after Manchester United's draw at Chelsea.

Diego Costa levelled in injury time - and Van Gaal accused journalists

of inventing stories about Jose Mourinho taking his job.

Arsenal are still in the title race - Mezul Ozil

and Alex Oxlade Chamberlain gave them a 2-0 win at Bournemouth -

Arsenal are five points behind leaders Leicester.

In the Scottish Cup Fifth Round, Hibernian came from 2-0 down

against Edinburgh rivals Hearts to force a replay -

Paul Hanlon completed the comeback in injury time.

And Premiership leaders Celtic are into the last eight -

they won 2-0 to end Lowland League side East Kilbride's terrific

That's all the sport for now - I'll have more on BBC

I just wanted to show you this pretty graphic footage of a wild

leopard attacking a man at a school swimming complex in Bangalore. The

leopard strolled into the school grounds and became disorientated and

distressed, it mauled a number of people. Six people were hurt, but

despite the images, nobody was seriously injured, which is

astonishing. After ten seriously injured, which is

leopard was tranquillised and released into a national park. There

are around 12,000 leopards in India released into a national park. There

and they have been known to stray into populated areas before.

Conservationists have warned that such confrontations may increase as

humans encroach on animal habitats. It is thought this particular

leopard came from a patch of forest not far from the school. Nobody

seriously injured, quite remarkable. In the next few weeks the Government

will announce how it plans A new poll suggests three quarters

of you want it to ban adverts for junk food before

the 9pm watershed. Junk food includes big fast-food

chains as well as sweets, chocolates, crisps

and sugary drinks. At the moment unhealthy food can't

be promoted during programmes specifically aimed at children,

but there are no restrictions on what can run during family

shows like the X Factor Here's an example of some ads

which ran this weekend before 9pm. VOICE-OVER:

KFC's chicken Tuesdays. Nine pieces of original

recipe chicken for just Which is your favourite

Haribo Starmix? VOICE-OVER:

Do you like your burgers made Do you like rashers

of beechwood-smoked bacon? VOICE-OVER: Sometimes

all you need is the smooth creamy taste of Werther's Original

Caramel to remind you that you're So should those adverts

be banned before 9pm? Will it make any difference

to obesity and the amount of junk As you can see we've got

lots of examples of the kind of junk food we're talking about here -

and I should point out these are just some of the examples -

there are loads and loads of companies selling food high

in salt and sugar. Amanda Broomhall has children

and really struggled Mel Fallowfield has two

children aged six and nine. Annie O'Leary is editor in chief

of the social network Netmums, and Tim Rycroft is from the Food

and Drinks Federation. Welcome all of you and thank you for

coming onto the programme. Amanda, is advertising to blame for

childhood obesity? I think it is one of the reasons why it is happening.

I think the bottom line is that food manufacturers spend millions and

millions of pounds advertising specifically to certain types of

people because it works. That's the bottom line because they wouldn't

spend the money to advertise to a group of consumers they were trying

to get to unless it was worth the investment. You cannot blame it all

on advertising, parents have to take some blame. We are there to show

children the best way forward. It's not helping with being bombarded

with advertising and is on television and in newspapers

everywhere. It's like everything, children are very easily influenced.

And with the best will in the world parents will try and show their

children the best way but it doesn't help when you are being shown that

this is a really tasty food. You struggled particularly with your son

when he was growing up with his weight. What were the issue?

He saw what other people were eating and it would come onto the

television and he wanted to be like his friends. Food is such an

integral part of our society that it forms the basis of our whole lives,

they are built around mealtimes. It's very difficult and does not

seem to be helping. Tim, your organisation is not helping mums

like Amanda. The watershed is an analogue solution for the digital

age. We know that kids spend more time online than they do watching

TV. Let's deal with the TV because millions sit down with their mums

and dads and watch X factor, or Britons got talent, or Hollyoaks,

for example. When those adverts come on. We have some of the tightest

restrictions on advertising of high-fat salts and sugar foods in

the world. Despite that, the adverts for the pizzas, fast-food and

whatever, it is not helping, is it? If you look at The X Factor, we

looked at this before Christmas when The X Factor was on and adverts for

Special K, Ritz crackers, milk Tray these are not targeted at children.

We have a system that works. We need to extend it to the online sphere

because that is where kids are increasingly moving. Are you not

going to address the specific issue of fast-food ads and junk food ads

that children will be attracted to? We have a system that works and

Ofcom said that in 2010 when it reviewed it. Not according to

parents. What would you say? Parents are terribly willing to find

anything to blame other and themselves for their children's

eating habits. You've got children, you are the one that goes and buys

the food, buy what you want them to eat and that is what there is to eat

in the house and it is as plans that. I'm a journalist and I was

editing an article the other day about a woman who had an overweight

son and she said there needs to be more help out there and so on so is

to blame and no one is doing this for me. I was editing it, why are

you giving him the money to buy fizzy drinks, why are you doing

this, take some responsibility, it is you. Do you agree? Absolutely,

parents have a big role, a major role to play and I'm sure there is

not apparent in the country that wants their children to grow up

obese the advertising is bothering us and it is another pressure on us.

Nobly wants an overweight sick child and it is just not helping us. --

nobody wants an overweight sick child. How much of an issue is it on

Netmums? It is a massive issue and chat around food attracts sometimes

half of our users in a day. One of the things we are aware of is people

come to us, sometimes under a anonymous names, because they feel

such shame attached to a child who may be overweight or struggling with

their weight in anyway. The key thing if we are to tackle this

problem, and we agreed it is a problem and we need to tackle it, we

need to bring parents with us. Tim doesn't necessarily agree that

advertising is part of the problem. I agree that obesity is a massive

problem. It is the biggest parenting site on the youth -- UK. We asked

people to rank the problems in order as to which were the most important

and of the ten things we laid out for them they put a ban on junk food

advertising before the watershed as fourth, so they think it's a

significant issue. What about the point that Tim makes that it is in a

digital age and what would be the point when kids are watching catch

up and online more than TV. It must extend into the digital space but we

cannot ignore TV, kids watch the TV as well as using tablets. A ban is

not necessary as far as you're concerned? I worry that it's another

way of parents not taking responsibility themselves. So they

can blame junk food advertising, they can blame whatever it is, but

the core thing to bring it back to is... And I'm not unsympathetic.

It's not that I'm saying people are bad mums if they have a slightly

overweight kid in anyway. But I'm interested to know, you said number

four was junk food advertising, what our number one, two and three? How

to help is to get their child exercising, and buy food that is

healthy for them. Those of us that read the government report that came

out recently that analysed the data on this showed an increase in

exercise will not tackle this problem alone, we need a

multifaceted, holistic, 360 approach to this. We need lots of measures.

We absolutely do. The ultimate response ability lies with parents

and the choices they make and the way they educate their children to

interact with food. Let's support parents in that. Part of the problem

we have is we have a generation of parents who only recently realised

that sugar is this massive problem. Mums raised with a bowl of Shreddies

and a sprinkling of sugar and a glass of sugary juice. The world is

a different place and we need to work together with parents to make

them take the right decisions. Blaming them over the will not help.

The Health Select Committee which I think you gave evidence to in

November called for junk food adverts to be banned from running in

shows like The X Factor and so on. How worried are your members that

this will be part of the Government's obesity strategy? We

don't know what will be in the strategy, we hope it will be the

holistic strategy we have talked about but people are of course

worried about the implications of that kind of intervention because

that is where forecasters get the money to produce their programmes.

There will be a trade-off if we take money away from commercial

broadcasters, of course that will have an implication for the kind of

programmes they can emission. Less quality X factor? Is that possible?

It is possible. This tweet says people do not have the money to buy

fast-food except when parents give them the money. Is that fair? Yes.

Yes. Neal says maybe parents should find better programmes to watch. Ban

adverts for junk food before 9pm but also at billboards at bus stops, on

YouTube. Banning TV adverts would not be enough. This tweet says: not

watching television, just me and the hordes of elderly trapped in their

homes, look to the apps and various websites. Sorry that doesn't make

sense, I know what she's saying. Joy says what is pressure not applied

onto advertisers who -- manufacturers who load food with

salt and sugar? There is pressure and the food industry and drinks

industry has made some efforts to reduce them. We need to go further,

definitely. The evidence shows that we formulating and changing the

recipes of these books to take the fat, salt and sugar out will make a

difference. We have already offered to take 20% more calories out of

soft drinks. I don't think there is a problem with junk food in itself.

A little of what you like does you good, everything in moderation, but

we are being bombarded from every angle. We don't like to say no.

Don't underestimate the power of pestering. They have removed sweets

from the checkout in supermarkets and it has made life a lot easier.

If we can bring down the amount of advertising, everything in

moderation and that goes for the advertising as much as what we are

eating. Jane says my child watches television con system to and I worry

about the number of junk food adverts. Obvious piece of advice.

Banning adverts won't stop parents buying junk food and feeding it to

their kids. Pete says banning adverts won't help much, families

need nutrition education, it is ignorance and laziness that causes

obesity. Keith says: junk food advert ban, sugar tax, fat tax, we

should ban opinionated control freaks who want to impose their

views on others. And this from Mary: junk food TV ban, it comes down to

parenting and nothing else. Thank you for those and thank you

for coming onto the programme to talk about this.

A former top family court judge tells this programme that family

breakdown is so damaging that the government should recognise

it as a public health issue - like smoking or obesity.

Sir Paul Coleridge, who set up the Marriage Foundation in 2012,

says the situation has got worse and worse.

He describes the pain caused by divorce as the scourge of society

If you're divorced you may be tired of hearing claims like that -

after all it's a debate that's been held regularly for decades now,

so we thought we'd take Sir Paul Coleridge to meet couples

who've divorced and their children to see what effect it had.

You're used to seeing a family environment,

the cooker going, the smells, the girls, the sounds.

And all you're left with is the silence.

So your great memory is, as it were, of the emptiness and the silence?

My whole world collapsed all in one go.

Basically, I wasn't there for the girls.

I went to social services to hand her in, because I said

The battle, it's just the two people.

Do you both admit that, whatever the rights and wrongs were,

They got involved, they got involved and they were used.

They never had the chance to be heard.

Mum would make comments to Maisie about Dad.

And you felt yourself pulled into the arguments?

I think they always wanted to stay together for us three,

for the sake of us three, but it weren't the right decision.

We would rather they'd broken up when we were a lot littler,

because we wouldn't have the memories that we have

I'd have wanted no arguments, them two just to get on.

Do you still have that kind of ideal wish, that your family could be...

Yeah, I probably do have that little wish that they were still together.

It wouldn't work, I know it wouldn't.

On a scale of one to ten, how bad would you describe

the emotional pain of going through a divorce?

The worst thing you've ever had to deal with?

With hindsight, taking everything into account,

I wouldn't have gone down the divorce road.

You would like to have the opportunity to do it differently

You feel you made the right decision and you've moved on?

Thank you, those of you who have got in touch. Helen, I agree the effect

on children, both short and long term, can be really damaging. It is

therefore imperative that there are structures in place to help children

and parents, including more tangible things like books and good support

through schools. The amount of children who experience parental

separation at some point in their childhood is clearly substantial. I

agree the Government needs to be concerned and make sure that

appropriate support, and education, is in place. This e-mail says I am

62, I still have nightmares about my parents' bitter divorce. They use

myself and my sisters as a weapon, and myself and my younger sister

went into a children's home for a week. I agree that children need

counselling. I never told children in school that my parents had

separated. Another e-mail, divorce is overstating come I never

considered my ex-husband's anger and the involvement of my children and

friends. I felt I was in a playground. Eight years after, my

ex-partner would not sit next to me and my son's graduation and will not

talk to or look at me. I dread their weddings, I fear it will always be

like this. Stephen says it is too easy to divorce these days, you can

petition with a divorce on fabricated evidence, the judge just

agrees with you. I think you should have to stand in front of a judge

and give evidence, letting them decide if the marriage can be saved.

That would be one heck of a response ability. Get in touch with your own

experiences. Sir Paul Coleridge is here,

and also with us is Vivienne Goldstein -

she and her husband worked through the problems

in their marriage and have now been And Natasha Brittan,

she got divorced and thinks it was the best decision

for her and her ex-husband. Thank you for coming on the

programme. A scourge of society, you have been saying this for a few

years. Why is it so damaging, in your opinion? Let's start with the

cost. ?47 billion is no small amount of money for the country to be

spending on this appalling problem. We don't face up to it. One of the

things that Marriage Foundation is about is keeping this serious

problem at the top of the agenda. It is painful, people do not like to

talk about it, it's fascinating, the anecdotal stuff, but it is anecdote.

If you want an anecdote, get into a taxi with me and come down to the

Royal Courts of Justice. You can stand outside one of the 100 courts

in London and listen to anecdotes all day long. Let's concentrate on

the data. The data is overwhelming. Family breakdown had a devastating

effect on children. By every measure of success, they do worse than

children from unbroken families. Children want, again, whenever you

look at the data, the children want parents to stay together, even when

there are quite high levels of conflict. Anecdote, always, the

wonderful thing about this subject is that everybody has a view on it.

Everybody has experience of family breakdown. You will not stop some

parents divorcing? You will not. Whatever the evidence suggests.

There are a number of cases, I have not sat in the courts for 40 years

without knowing that there are some cases where it is just as well the

parties separate. But there are two factors which I think are, to me,

absolutely clear. One is that, by and large, a significant portion of

people who separate wish they had not, five years down the line.

Secondly, and this is absolutely key, the reason we have this huge

upsurge in divorce since the 80s is the huge upsurge in unmarried

relationships producing children. Whether you like the date or not,

the fact is that marriage provides a very great deal of extra security to

a relationship, at a time of great stress, which is bringing up

children. Not in your case? Your children were nine and 11 when your

husband and yourself divorced. If we accept it is going to happen,

regardless of what the data suggests, you try to make it a

civilised and pain-free as possible. It can be done? It can be done. How

did you do it? Fundamentally, we cut our egos out of the whole process

and just thought, we were done with arguing and fighting, let's just

make our divorce a project where we can, and it sounds very functional,

we can just do it for the good of ourselves, our divorce does not

define the rest of our lives. For our children, really importantly,

for our parents, and for our friends and family. As Sir Paul said, the

ripple effect for society from the divorce, we thought, we can fight or

we can do this responsibly, as adults, and just be kind to each

other, mindful of the rest of our lives. With our new partners,

without children involved, our new partners. It took some work. It was

not a walk in the park. We had counselling, we thought, we are done

with arguing, let's just try and move on, kindly. Vyvyan, your story

is extraordinary, 25 years of marriage, then you separate, seven

years later you get back together and you have just celebrated your

40th wedding anniversary? Nearly 42. How did you do it? Well, I am so

special, says my husband! I agree with Natasha. You said you are

getting tired of arguing. It is the letting go. In retrospect, when I

think about everything we went through, I think there was, and the

man in your film, he said, in retrospect, yes, you have to let go.

You have to take responsibility for your part in it. Definitely.

Whatever has happened, generally speaking, it takes two to tango. Let

go of that, forget the entrenched speaking, it takes two to tango. Let

feelings and the blame? Say, we have been married a long

feelings and the blame? Say, we have each other originally, we

feelings and the blame? Say, we have the 25 years previously. So much of

it the 25 years previously. So much of

experience life if I go around the 25 years previously. So much of

pass. Sitting down, taking responsibility, sitting down and

discussing it like adults. Can I ask you both what you think of Sir

Paul's call that family breakdown should be treated by the Government

as a public health issue, as damaging as smoking or obesity? Does

that make any difference? Pardon the pun, I think it is quite judgmental.

Bad things happen in life. A degree of acceptance, I think if we start

looking towards divorce, it is something that happens in society.

To be positive, to support people, to give people information, for

people to be kinder. There is an enormous degree of shame, guilt,

anger, pain. Judgment, as well. enormous degree of shame, guilt,

you being too judgmental? I hope not, that is not what we are about

at all. We are about the public health point. Let us not forget the

basic statistic, half of children health point. Let us not forget the

aged 15 in this country, half the children aged 15 in this country,

will have experienced family breakdown and will not be living

with both of their birth parents. I don't think you can dismiss that as

it's just being in a way that we are now and we have to put up with it.

No, we haven't. We have had to understand the scale of the problem.

Two, we have to understand how to make things better and invest time

and money in it. Let's bring you this news, to do with the Deepcut

inquest. The father of the soldier who died 20 years ago is to give

evidence. Lawyers for the family of Private Cheryl James, one of the

young soldiers who died at deep Deepcut has said evidence shows that

the bullet which killed her may not have been self-inflicted. Tomorrow,

we will look at fracking and tell you about why you should care about

if planning permission in Lancashire is given the go-ahead. Have a good

day.