17/05/2017 Victoria Derbyshire

Hello. It's Wednesday.

It's 9am. I'm Joanna Gosling.

America's former FBI chief claims he was urged

to drop his inquiry into links between the President's ex-national

The Liberal Democrats will launch their manifesto today,

promising a new referendum on Brexit.

There's also more money for housing and education and a promise to lower

Today we're offering huge opportunities for young people where

they can get on the renting ladder for the first time because we'll

give them help with their deposits or they can rent-to-own with a

radical new scheme. We'll have all the details and we'll

be asking if the party has done enough to woo back voters

who abandoned them in 2015. One of Labour's biggest union

backers - Len McCluskey from Unite - says he cannot see Labour

winning the election. Also today, our panel of black

and Asian voters tell us Education, the economy and better

representation in Parliament are all on the list. We will speak to them

in just a moment. The former American

soldier, Chelsea Manning, who passed thousands of confidential

documents to Wikileaks, will be released from

a military prison today. We'll speak to someone

who campaigned for her release. Hello and welcome to the programme.

We're live until 11am. The bad news is there

may be no such thing. Some doctors now reckon it's

impossible to be overweight without increasing your risk

of future health problems. Do get in touch on all the stories

we're talking about this morning. Use the hashtag Victoria Live

and if you text, you will be charged In a moment we'll get the latest

on election campaign here. First, though to the US,

where the White House is denying reports that Donald Trump asked

former FBI director James Comey to stop an investigation into alleged

links between an advisor and Russia. Mr Comey, who was sacked last week,

is said to have made the claims in notes taken after a meeting

with the president in February. Following a meeting of his security

advisers back in February, President Trump waited for other

officials to leave the room before taking then FBI director

James Comey to one side. The previous day, his

National Security Advisor, Michael Flynn, had been forced

to resign amid allegations that he misled the vice-president

about conversations According to the New York Times,

the president then asked Mr Comey to shut down an FBI investigation

into General Flynn. But the FBI investigation

into Michael Flynn is still under way, along with one into possible

collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian government

to influence the outcome Last week, James Comey was removed

from his post by President Trump. The White House has denied

the New York Times allegations, saying the president never asked

for an end to any investigation, but the suggestion that

James Comey kept detailed notes of his conversations

with President Trump has left some Last week, President Trump

suggested he might have tapes of his conversations with James

Comey. If they exist, those, too,

could be called for, in order to establish whose account

of the discussions is correct. Some Democrats are already saying

this could amount to obstruction of justice on the part

of the president, an unproven allegation, certainly,

but the most serious yet to confront Donald Trump's beleaguered

administration. The Liberal Democrats

will focus on younger voters when they launch their general

election manifesto later. A promise to hold a second EU

referendum will be at the heart of the document but it will also

include pledges to restore housing benefit for younger people

and to make it easier to get Our political guru Norman Smith

is across everything It's a big day for the Lib Dems?

Yesterday, we had the Labour manifesto and today we get the

Liberal Democrats manifesto. Maybe it is a side bar because the Lib

Dems have made pretty clear they're one, big message for this election

is vote Lib Dem and we will have a referendum on the deal that Mrs May

negotiates. In other words, Brexit is their big pitch and they're

appealing to those people who voted Remain. The manifesto becomes not so

important, although, it will contain measures for more money for schools,

hospitals, social care, reversing some benefits, they will be looking

to see where that cash is going to come from. They'll also be a pitch

for younger voters, so they're suggesting there ought to be a

rent-to-own scheme to try and help first-time buyers, they're going to

bring back student grants, but Brexit remains their big theme as

Vicki Young now reports. The Liberal Democrats see this

general election as a chance to change Britain's future

and their message is clearly aimed at those who voted Remain

in last year's referendum. They want voters to have another say

on Brexit once any deal with the European Union has been

finalised and if people don't like it, they should be able

to reject it and keep the UK The Lib Dems hope their pro-EU

argument will encourage Remain voters to swing behind them,

especially in seats But in some of the other former

heartlands in the south-west of England, Brexit is much more

popular, so the party is trying to broaden the appeal

with new policy ideas. The Lib Dems have already

called for extra health and education spending,

paid for by higher income On housing, they want to introduce

a rent to own scheme for tenants and they've pledged to legalise

and regulate cannabis. The Lib Dem leader, Tim Farren,

has admitted his party isn't going to win the election

and says his aim is to replace Labour and be an effective

opposition to the Conservatives. Norman a development in the Labour

campaign? Yes, strange words from Len McCluskey, the leader of the

Unite union and Jeremy Corbyn's key right-hand man, a strong man in the

Labour Party. Suggesting that Labour seem to be on course to lose the

election, but also saying that if Jeremy Corbyn wins just 200 seats,

that would be a success. Now, 200 seats would be Labour's worst result

since the Second World War. Worse even than Michael Foot and yet Len

McCluskey is saying all things considered that would be OK. What is

going on here? Well, I think the truth is, Mr McCluskey, like many of

Mr Corbyn's key allies, is just trying to protect him if in the

aftermath of an election defeat there is a move to oust Mr Corbyn.

So he can turn around and say, "Well, look it has been a very

difficult election. The media were against me. The Parliamentary party

were always attacking me. I've had to deal with two leadership

elections. At least I won 200 seats. And thereby, ensure that Mr Corbyn

carries on as leader even if Labour go down to a pretty dismal defeat.

Thank you very much, Norman. Annita McVeigh is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary The idea that people can be fat

but medically fit is a myth, according to a study of the medical

records of more than Researchers say being obese

increases the risk of suffering heart disease, stroke

and heart failure. Our health correspondent

Dominic Hughes reports. So just keep your

hands on your hips. The idea that you can be obese,

but still healthy has Previous studies have suggested that

around a third of very They have normal blood pressure

and cholesterol levels despite being classed as obese

according to their Body Mass Index which is a measure of

height versus weight. But a new analysis of the medical

records of 3.5 million UK residents suggests the idea of healthy obesity

is a myth. Compared to those of a normal

weight, it suggests even outwardly, healthy obese people have a 49%

greater risk of developing coronary heart disease,

the risk of heart failure is increased by 96%

and stroke by 7%. What was new for me from this study

was that it showed that people who are overweight or obese

are at an increased risk of heart disease even though they may be

healthy in every other respect. Previously I rather thought that

obesity increased blood pressure and your cholesterol

and it was those factors which increased your risk

of cardiovascular disease. Just being overweight or obese puts

you at increased risk Rugby players are often used

as examples of people who might be classed as obese,

but are healthy. Their Body Mass Index would mean

they are technically overweight, but for the vast majority,

this research suggests being obese Lloyds Bank says the taxpayer has

made a profit of nearly ?900 million after the Government sold the last

of its shares in the banking group. It is almost nine years

since the bank was bailed out at In a statement, Lloyds confirmed

the group has been fully returned The former US soldier,

Chelsea Manning, who passed hundreds of thousands of confidential

diplomatic documents to the website Wikileaks,

will be released later today Born Bradley Manning, she announced

she would be living as a woman, She was expected to remain in jail

until 2045, but Barack Obama commuted her sentence before he left

the White House in January. A police drone has captured

the moment a controlled detonation was carried out

on a Second World War bomb discovered at a building

site in Birmingham. Around 180 people had to be

evacuated from their homes near Aston following its discovery

yesterday morning. The British Army said it was one

of the biggest unexploded devices A pair of diamond earrings have been

sold at auction in Geneva for a record-breaking price of more

than ?44 million. The pear-shaped jewels,

nicknamed Apollo and Artemis, The flawless stones mined

in South Africa are perfectly matched except for their colour -

Artemis is pink and Apollo is blue. That's a summary of

the latest BBC News. Thank you very much indeed. Let us

know this morning what you think about whether it is possible to be

fat and fit because experts are saying it is not. Get in touch with

us. All the usual ways, hashtag Victoria Live and remember texts

will be charged at the standard network rate.

We will be joined by our audience shortly to talk more about the

election and about what matters to them.

Groundbreaking news in horseracing with a first-ever

Yes, good morning, Joanna well, with many sportswomen are under

represented and it is the same in British horse racing. Almost 400

people were interviewed for this report, from all levels, and the BBC

had exclusive access to it. What did we find? A growing number of women

entering horse racing from clebleg courses and that's outnumbering men

by nearly 70-30, but the problem is that women are facing career

stagnation as the report puts it, once they try to progress. It also

found that because of how male dominated some areas of the sport

are, women are being denied certain opportunities and several of the

participants in the study have to deal with inappropriate behaviour

and banter culture. Now the report was commissioned by women in racing

which seeks to develop the profile of women in the sport. Here is their

committee member Suzanna Gill. Young women are coming into the sport, but

then what we're seeing and certainly what came out in the report is that

those women are not necessarily making it through to the middle and

top ranks. So, taking it through the career, if you look at who is on the

senior boards of organisations in race, the average is 16% and we have

several boards in the sport that don't have any women a the top level

at all. So we're seeing a stagnation of career progression and that's

something that certainly has been recognised in other industries as

well and I think we probably moan about it in racing, but it is the

first time we have seen it and talked about and hopefully can now

act upon it. I know you'll have more on this later in the programme with

our sports correspondent, Joe Wilson. Yes, we will be talking

about that later. If people watching at home have got any thoughts on it,

get in touch and let us know your thoughts.

Maria Sharapova is back in the headlines

after her doping ban, she's not having a smooth ride

No, she continues to be a divisive figure. Different tournament

organisers have shown different attitudes. She was given wildcards

to events in Stuttgart, Madrid and Rome, but for the next tournament,

which is the French Open, she will not be given the same privilege. She

is a two-time champion there, but the organisers said their

responsibility to protect the high standards of the game's played

without any doubt on the results, on the other hand, this morning, the

Chief Executive of the women's tennis federation has said that the

French Open had no grounds to penalise Maria Sharapova by denying

her a wildcard. Steve Simon said she already served her sanction. The

next tournament is Wimbledon. Sharapova will need to go through

qualifying because of her low ranking. Alternatively she could

receive a wildcard, but Pat Cash hopes the organisers will send out a

strong message. I would hope that they would stand strong and said no,

you've got to go through play and qualify. Look, Maria at qualifying,

she'll breeze through it on the grass. She is very experienced and

she will probably need some extra matches and she might welcome those

matches. Clearly, she's not physically ready 100% for hard

tennis. She hurt herself this week. I think it will be in the long run,

it might not be a bad thing for her, but I thinkle scat autopsy England

need to stand up and make a stand about this and say we're not

rewarding drug cheats. Well, it will be interesting to see which way the

All England Club go. It is a contentious issue with the fans and

broadcasters wanting the most high-profile names play k, but will

the All England Club want to stand up and be counted in the decision

against doping. An interesting decision to be made.

As politicians start to outline their policies in more

detail ahead of general election, we want to hear what issues

Over the course of the campaign, we're talking to voters

from all over the UK and hearing what different groups

Today, a group of black and Asian voters are here to tell us

what issues are most important to them.

Only about 6% of the politicians in Westminster, in the House

of Commons and the House of Lords are from a minority

That compares to 13% of the general population.

We have an audience of seven voters from different ethnic minority

backgrounds to talk about the issues that are important to

William, I know you feel quite wrongly about representation, we

start with you and tell us what your thoughts are. Yeah, of course. I

think representation is really, really important, especially because

issues pertaining to a certain demographic are never going to be

highlighted or pushed forward if people from that demographic are not

represented within politics at large. I also feel like it

highlights a wider issue around elitism, the fact that people from

certain demographics aren't presented as well so I think it is

very important. I am the chairman of the Asian business council. I am

here to talk about representation to the UK Parliament of the BAA me

community first I have looked at other parliaments, -- representative

of the BAME. The US or Australian parliaments is about two to 3%,

whereas at the UK at 6%, we are still better off. At least we have

those 41 MPs from ethnic minority backgrounds who are representing us,

who are voices in Parliament. More of the MPs from our backgrounds

would be much better. I would say we have people who are standing up and

down the country from the BAME community and we should go out and

vote for them and make sure we see them in Parliament in the coming few

days all week or two. Do any of you feel there should be a mechanism by

which the number of MPs from ethnic minority backgrounds is forcibly

increased? I don't think there needs to be a mechanism or a methodical,

mechanical method, but certainly there is an emerging trend, that

simply planting an ethnic minority face as a candidate is inadequate.

That person needs to be competent, needs to have credibility, needs to

have a track record. We have got up and down the country certain

constituencies where you have an ethnic minority face. Three

elections, still there now, safe seats, the local population gets fed

up with them. They don't reflect the real life, the young life of the

community that they tried to or seek to represent. Therefore, this sort

of somewhat oversimplistic connection that from the seek

community, if you put forward a steak

-- from the Sikh constituency. I am from Coventry. I am an active

campaigner in the Sikh community. There are no Sikh MPs at the moment

in the UK Parliament. That is a big topic in the Sikh community. We need

to have not just ethnic minority representation, which is

fundamentally important, but we need to have the right people, the right

quality of person, representing us. The rest of you, do you feel like

you're MPs are currently representing the issues that matter

to you? Personally, I feel my MP does represent me, however speaking

on the matter of having ethnic minorities in Parliament and

politics, I come from the point of view of educating people from the

ethnic minority backgrounds about ways to get involved in politics,

because in my opinion this is the most tolerant country in the world.

And I think people just need to know what to do, where to go, in order to

access those places. So you say it doesn't matter if the MP is from an

ethnic minority, as long as they are tuned with what is going on? Well, I

think it would be a good thing to have the good representation, so 6%

where there is 13% of the population is not that good. It should be

organic, but in doing that let's provide information from members of

that community to enable them to have access. I am a leadership

development coach. It really does come from education, I think it is a

wider community in society. If all young people were getting the right

education, good teaching, good schools, good opportunities,

naturally those doors would open and you would find a lot more black and

Asian politicians in place, and that is where the issue is. If you wait

until after you have graduated, it's too late. You need to go back when

you are in the school years, three or four years old, and giving them

the support they need. There has been I have found over previous

decades a cultural and political tokenism, in terms of black faces

for that constituency, Sikh faces for that constituency, Muslim faces

her that constituency. That has been purely superficial exercises. The

migrant communities in this country now include fourth and fifth

generation. They have gone through that first oversimplistic,

ineffective process. We are demanding more now. We are demanding

quality, we are demanding authentic representation. We want people from

amongst us to be coming forward to Parliament. So let's broaden it out,

the key issues you are thinking, the forefront of your mind to miss

election, what is of particular concern to you? There are quite a

few, to be honest. We couldn't go overall the things, but for me,

being a regular black woman, British woman, who is a professional, as

much as I know a little bit about politics, I don't really believe

that all the information I need to make really good informed choices

are readily available. And I don't think that is helpful for us to make

the best decision. Who's fault do you think that is? The media's, the

government's, I don't know. I am a regular woman, the person that gets

up in the morning and goes to work, has a family, has to do everyday

things, I represent the everyday British black woman, and I am fairly

intelligent, as I said, I am a professional, and I enjoy

information and I try to get as much information as I can, but the man

next door isn't necessarily the same as me. He isn't able to make certain

choices because the information you need to make from great choice is

just isn't there. The manifestos are coming out this week, would you take

a good look at those? Absolutely, but I am making a concerted effort

to do that. Does the regular man on the street do that, I don't think

so. Let's look at Brexit, people say that word and they don't know what

the actual term means. I think it means Britain's exit, but does it? I

do know, nobody has told me. I am somebody that works all over Europe,

and sometimes internationally, not just throughout Europe, I actually

don't know if Brexit is going to affect my work. I have been working

in Europe to 20 years, and I have been able to move freely and work in

whichever countries have needed to without any concerns. I actually

don't know if, when Brexit becomes our reality, if that will affect

that. It has been a recurring theme, always a recurring theme, voters

saying they don't feel they are necessarily hearing a clear,

factually -based picture, whether it is because of the media coverage or

coming from the politicians. How do the rest of you feel? Brexit is

quite plainly and simply a very grey area, there is no exact action plan.

I am just thinking more generally, we have the NHS, education, every

single issue we are facing, are you clear on which party is

representing? We need to look at who owns the media. That may be a wider

issue. A lot of the media is owned by the elite, by people that want to

perpetuate a certain argument. And I feel they are given the liberty to

push forward certain parties and represent them a bit unfairly. And a

lot of people in general, as she was saying, actually don't read into

policies and they themselves do the research so they just eat up

whatever the media give them that is a major issue. So let's focus on the

specific issues at the forefront of your minds. What is your key, going

into the selection? As you can see, I am a young person, unemployed at

the moment but I have a youth platform in Croydon that encourages

immunity engagement and empowers the voices of young people. For me, the

key thing is what is being done for young people, what is being done to

make them feel they can go out there until they are valued but what in

terms of things specifically? Things like education, dropping statistics,

and tuition fees, but what about things like PSA Chi education,

things that will take them into life skills going forward in life.

Talking about mental health. Talking about knife crime. Building a

respect for each other and that communication. The key thing about

knife crime is people don't always respect each other or respect their

lives, are able to communicate healthily, and just to find a way to

get to the root issues of that. There was a lot of talk about stop

and search, but what about getting to the root of it, working with

people on the ground, the community of organisations, helping them to

help those young people. Interesting you have gone into that, rather than

the bigger picture of the NHS, does that chime with the rest of you? It

is a really big thing. In 2008 I was part of a programme set up by the

Labour government, what they found was that young black men, young

black boys, were overrepresented in the prison system, they weren't

doing well in school, so they thought of what we could do to help

them. They found 20 different young black people in different issues you

were doing well and I was one of those 20. We got to speak to

students in schools, prisons, young offenders institutions, to help

raise their aspirations. When the Conservative government came into

power, that was scrapped, along with other community events and things.

Those are the type of things we need, we need to connect more, build

relationships, communities. It is all very well and good, because

obviously I don't want to pay lots of taxes, I want to do well and have

houses and all that stuff but if your basic community is struggling,

if people are not connected and don't see opportunities, it doesn't

matter if the 5% are doing well if the rest of the country are

struggling. So it is really important we start to

look at really need help, really need support. That should really be

a focus. You are only as good as your lowest common to nominate. If

the people at the bottom are struggling as a country, you are not

a successful country, and we need to look as a whole where do you want to

go to. Do you feel the politicians are talking about the issues that

matter to you? Yes, personally, they are to me. Education is a big one

for me. I have two children. My daughter is 15 and my son is nine.

It is important to me that I know that they have access to a

first-class education, without necessarily having to be rich to

provide that for them. But, beyond that, it is also how my children, as

black children, are treated in school. My daughter is in an

excellent school, so there are no problems there and I appreciate

that, but sometimes I kind of worry about how they place black children,

especially black boys, in a box. When you save a commune in the

schools. The education system, and the schools. They are not allowed to

flourish. That is a concern for me. Why do you think that is the case?

Four example with behavioural issues, a lot of times, they may not

understand the cultural behaviour of young black people. There are quite

a few studies on that. That is that everyone to see. And then they

labelled them immediately from a young age without helping to develop

them in their own truth, if you like. And it may be because there is

not a huge representation of ethnic minority educators who understand

why the children behave the way they do. But it is important to me that a

child is not held back simply because they are poor or they are

black, or their parents are not necessarily into their education. I

think the education system should cater for all. I am a Conservative

voter. Listening to what Mrs May is saying, I believe in her Britain,

that is a Britain that works everyone, regardless of where you

have come from. I don't think any of you have said the economy yet. Who

do you trust on that? What I wanted to say, our local mosque, it has a

volunteer group where we have teachers who come in to teach

children who cannot afford to go to maybe private schools or do not get

the right education. So they are making the housewives busy. That is

a local initiative. So are the politicians doing what you would

want on this? The politicians should encourage this to be rolled out in

other religious places. It could be in the temples. Coming back to the

economy, we need a very strong person to negotiate for Brexit. We

need Mrs May, a person like Mrs May, who will not crumble under the

pressure of 27 leaders of the European macro nations to get us

that good deal with the single market. We need those free trade

agreements with the world. The Commonwelfies able to us. I voted

remain. That bus has departed, we the thing about how we will progress

our economy now. I don't believe that this woman has

any interest in securing the lives, the economical lives, the financial

lives of anybody else in this country apart from those like her

that come from her world, from her financial background, from her

societal background. She does not have the interests of the regular

people like myself and my next door neighbours at heart. Absolutely not.

It shocks me that, I understand that everybody has different thoughts and

everybody has a right to think what they want and choose who they want

who best represents them. But I simply cannot fathom how anybody

could think that Theresa May has the best interests at heart of

everybody. The issue will be deciding your vote

when gu into the ballot box. So let's just in a word, please, we'll

start with you? NHS and economy. Education, those are the key things

for me. Economy and education. Education and investing in the

younger generation. Economy and enterprise and education. For me, UK

foreign policy, specifically in regards to Punjab and Kashmir.

Equality and access for all. Young people and hopefully something about

knife crime and mental health. Thank you very much. Let us know your

thoughts as well. Watching at home. We're going to be in Dunstable in

Bedfordshire on Monday, 29th May. If you've made up your mind who you're

going to vote for or still deciding or don't think you'll bother and

would like the chance to share your views and grill senior politicians,

get in touch to apply for a place at: There are more details on our

Facebook and Twitter pages. We'll speak to someone

who campaigned for the release of Chelsea Manning, the former

American soldier who passed thousands of confidential

documents to Wikileaks. She will be released

from a military prison today. Researchers have cast doubt

on the theory that some people can be healthy,

despite being overweight. We'll be talking to the scientist

behind the research. Here's Annita in the BBC Newsroom

with a summary of today's news. The White House is denying reports

that Donald Trump asked former FBI director James Comey to stop

an investigation into alleged links Mr Comey, who was sacked last week,

is said to have made the claims in notes taken after a meeting

with the president in February. The White House say the notes are

untrue. The Liberal Democrats are putting

a second EU referendum at the heart of their general election manifesto,

which is formally launched later. The party says it would

"let the people decide" whether Brexit happens once

negotiations have finished. It is also offering pledges to young

people, promising to restore housing benefit for 18 to 21-year-olds

and help people get The head of one of Labour's biggest

union backers has said the party is on course to lose

the general election. Len McCluskey of Unite claimed it

would be a successful campaign A spokesman for leader Jeremy Corbyn

said he was determined to lead Lloyds Bank says the taxpayer has

made a profit of nearly ?900 million after the Government sold the last

of its shares in the banking group. It's almost nine years

since the bank was bailed out at In a statement, Lloyds confirmed

the group has been fully returned That's a summary of

the latest BBC News. You Thank you very much. The

unemployment figures. Unemployment fell by 53,000 to 1.54 million in

the three months to March. Latest official figures just out.

With Manchester, Liverpool and Arsenal all battling

for the final two Champions League spots, the Gunners have

They beat Sunderland 2-0 to keep themselves in the battle for a top

four Premier League finish and qualification for

the Champions League which would be the 21st season

City need just a point from their final match to secure

third place to guarantee their spot after beating West

City are now unbeaten in their last 12 Premier League home games.

Andy Murray's difficult clay court season takes another

turn for the worse - beaten in his first match

at the Italian Open by Italy's Fabio Fognini.

It's likely to be the world number one's last match

before the French Open, which starts at

And Geraint Thomas showed few ill-effects from Sunday's crash

by finishing second in the Stage 10 time trial at the Giro D'Italia.

Holland's Tom Dumoulin now leads the race by over two minutes.

That's all the sport for now. I will have a full update for you at about

10am. Thank you very much, Jess. See you later.

Some time after dawn today at a barracks in Kansas the security

gates will open and Chelsea Manning will be released.

Earlier this week, her lawyer Nancy Hollander told our reporter

She's obviously excited. Erm, she's nervous.

Getting out of prison after a long incarceration is not as easy

It's a transition, there's a period of adjustment.

And it will take her some time to adjust.

But she'll be fine, and she's got a lot of resilience and a lot

that she wants to do, I'm sure.

And she will start doing it, as soon as she has a little bit

It was straight after she was sentenced, she announced

Then she started the transition process.

Ultimately, she was given the transition hormones,

but they continued to fight about her hair length,

which is a huge issue for her - she was not allowed

So, we're very relieved that she's going to be out of the prison

and can finish her transition without the anxiety

of constantly fighting, fighting for what she's entitled to.

What stage is that transition at now?

She has received hormones, I don't know when they started,

And I don't know exactly what happens next, but that will be

Let's speak now to Naomi Colvin who helped campaign

You have been campaigning for her release. So how are you feeling

today knowing that she is actually coming out? It is a really momentous

day. I'm thrilled for Chelsea and thrilled for my friends and

colleagues over the world who campaigned so relentlessly over the

past seven years. It is almost unbelievable. Do you think seven

years is a fair sentence for what she did? No. It's incredibly unfair,

. Serving almost seven years Chelsea will have served longer in prison

than any whistle-blower in US historiment for part of the time she

was treated incredibly poorly. The UN reported torture, it reported her

treatment amounted to cruel and unusual treatment and as Nancy

pointed out, she has not been able to live her life in the way she

should and identify in the way, you know, that she is entitled to. It

has been incredibly difficult for her and I think that, you know, I'm

thrilled that she is being released. It was the right thing for President

Obama to do commute her sentence, but she suffered so much and it is

unjust. White House said that what she did was harmful to national

security. She put out classified diplomatic information and military

records, 750,000 military records which, you know, some say did put

lives at risk? There is always a question of balance here and I think

when you say, "Put lives at risk." It is worth remembering at Chelsea's

trial nobody produced any evidence that was the case and they spent

concerted time looking for it. If military records are put out there,

it is identifying people in a public environment who perhaps should not

be identified in that way? There is always a balance and I think with

some of those military records some were kept back and there were

redactions made, but if you look at the balance between public benefit

and potential harm and Chelsea's release, the balance is very far in

the direction of public benefit in my opinion. So what would you say

has been the public benefit? When Chelsea, the words we have from

Chelsea before she was arrested from chat logs talk about wanting to

generate worldwide debates and reforms and if you look at the

impact what she released I think it goes beyond what she could have

imagined there. The release of the state department cables informed the

revolution in Tunisia which went on to spark off the Arab Spring and the

spate of democratic grass-roots movements which shook the world in

2010, 2011. It is hard to imagine impact on a greater scale I think.

One senator, military veteran, has said, she is a traitor and treated

like a martyr? This, you always see this with whistle-blowers because

the same thing came up with Snowdon as well, hero or traitor. I think

actually outside of the United States very few people think that

Chelsea is a traitor really. Within the United States, there are some

senior figures within the Republican Party who do see it very

differently. John McCain says it devalues the courage of real

whistle-blowers who use proper channels to hold Government

accountable and he also says that the actions endangered the lives of

US troops, diplomats and intelligence sources. But... So,

obviously people can disagree. As I say at Chelsea's trial nobody

managed to produce any evidence that lives had been put at risk by

Chelsea's disclosures and I think that history will judge her very

kindly. Whatever individuals think, she had a tough time going through

what she has been going through with gender dysphoria and being

incarcerated? She is incredibly brave and when you think about it,

she went through this incredible battle to maintain her intellectual

integrity against odds. She joined the military believing it was the

patriotic thing to do and believing what she was told about fighting

terrorism and fighting for democracy in the Middle East. And sort of when

she realised that wasn't quite what was going on, had the convictions to

get the message out the that's one enormous battle and thereafter, she

fought this very battle for transgender rights and for her

gender identity to be respected and you know that's another enormous

battle. Her bravery, I think, is astonishing and I think these a very

modern kind of hero really. Thank you very much.

It's one of the most serious allegations faced

Did he ask FBI chief James Comey to drop an inquiry into links

between his ex-national security adviser and Russia?

In a moment we'll be talking more about the latest twist

in the Trump-Comey tale - but first a reminder of why these

Probably illegal - we'll have to find out

what the FBI says about it - but certainly it was bad judgment.

I just read the report. It's devastating, the report.

Although we did not find clear evidence that Secretary Clinton

or her colleagues intended to violate laws governing

the handling of classified information, there is evidence

that they were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive,

Based on what was being said, she was guilty.

Today is the best evidence ever that we've seen that our system

The question of whether that amounts to gross negligence, frankly,

there's no way anyway the Department of Justice is bringing a case

The FBI is reopening their investigation.

That was so bad, what happened originally, and it took guts

for Director Comey to make the move that he made in light of the kind

What he did, he brought back his reputation.

The FBI, as part of our counterintelligence mission,

is investigating the Russian government's efforts to interfere

with the 2016 presidential election, and that includes investigating

the nature of any links between individuals associated

with the Trump campaign and the Russian government.

With respect to the President's tweets about alleged wiretapping

directed at him by the prior administration, I have

no information that supports those tweets.

Scott Lucas is a professor of American politics at the University

of Birmingham. We can talk to him now. How serious is this? Very

serious. Even given the day-to-day controversies of the Trump

administration, we have now crossed the line, that is because of

obstruction of justice, claimed in the FBI director's memo, is both a

legal defence, it could lead to criminal charges, and it is a

political offence that could lead to impeachment. So Republicans now

income west I think who have at least stayed back from pushing

against Trump so far will probably be reconsidering their positions. If

they don't, is there anyway that this could sort of the fatal for

Donald Trump? What we are going to see, whether or not the Republicans

shift immediately, is a steady diet of damaging memos, damaging

documents, both in the context, the specific context of Trump, the

investigation into Trump's associates's alleged links with

Russia, and now the specific issue of whether Trump is trying to block

that investigation. That will continue from the FBI, it will

continue from the CIA, the national security agency because Trump is

alienating those agencies. Now at some point, it is like you pull a

brick, each brick from under the White House, at some point the White

House collapses. Will it mean an impeachment immediately, no, but it

means the White House is paralysed. It will not be able to pursue its

domestic projects, such as repealing Obamacare. President Trump is tied

down like a lover but unlike calibre I don't think he will be able to

escape. You say that you are sure certain things emerge, but unless

they do from the FBI investigation that is continuing, we don't

actually know, do we? We have a body of circumstantial evidence, and

let's review, we know that Trump associates met with Russian

officials in 2016. The exact content of those and destinations is what

the FBI is investigating. We know the times of those meetings that

Russia was interfering at the time of the election through hacking and

interference. We know that Michael Flynn the security adviser was

dismissed because of his conversations with the Russian

ambassador, and we now know that President Trump tried to block the

investigation of flint by appealing to Director Comey to just stop. You

add all of that together and it at least makes a case that this is

serious, if indeed as you know it is not yet proven. And adding into this

as well is the conversation that Donald Trump had at the White House

with Russian representatives, where classified intelligence, it seems,

was shared. He says he did share stuff, in the national interest, for

the right reasons. What do you make of that row? To have one controversy

is unfortunate, to have multiple is very careless, and when Trump gave

that information to the Russians, Heerenveen Jude a sensitive

relationship between the US and the Middle Eastern country, probably

Israel, which may damage their intelligence sharing. He damaged US

alliances with other countries, such as European countries, who are

wondering whether they can trust the president, and he reinforced the

perception that he is far closer to Russia than he is the sum of

America's allies. Thank you very much.

A new study appears to suggest the idea that you can be both fat and

medically fit is a myth. Researchers from the University of Birmingham

say obese people who had no initial signs of heart disease, diabetes or

high cholesterol were not protected from ill health later in life. We

can talk to the man behind the study.

And joining me from Portugal is the man behind the study,

He joins us from the European Congress on obesity. That is where

the study is being unveiled. And Professor Tom Sanders from Kings

College London, who is more sceptical of the study. We are

joined in the studio by GPL E Cannon, who can offer us some

insight into -- we are joined in the studio by

Joining me in the studio is Dr Ellie Cannon, a GP.

first you, Rishi. This was a study that looked at people who were

obese, with no metabolic abnormalities, so without aid

history of diabetes or high fat in their blood. We looked at whether

they developed cardiovascular disease, specifically coronary heart

disease, stroke, heart failure, and something called peripheral vascular

disease first up we found that over an average follow-up of 50 years,

that people who were obese and did not have any metabolic abnormalities

were at increased risk of crony heart disease, heart failure and

stroke. That is compared to normal weight individuals with no metabolic

abnormalities. So in a nutshell you do not think it is possible to be

fat and fit? I don't use the term fit. In terms of cardiovascular

health, the study does suggest that it is not, according to the

findings, there is a significant proportion of people, which are

termed metabolically healthy obese that do go on to actually develop

some form of cardiovascular disease. Professor Tom Sanders, what do you

think of this? I think the bottom line is to maintain a healthy

weight, what you are in early adult life, throughout life. I think

people tend to put on weight through life. So if you measure them a long

time ago and then look at follow-up, you are not taking into account

people who are fat when they are young will be even fatter when they

are older. We know that fatness itself is associated with raised

blood pressure, raised blood fat, and diabetes. But the diabetes

normally doesn't manifest itself until people are in their 50s. So

measuring at outset doesn't really tell you that. So the key thing I

think is to keep your weight down and don't think there is a magic

cut-off point from when you can identify someone is having diabetes

or hypertension. We talk about people having pre-hypertension,

prediabetes, they are on that road to getting those disorders. They all

increase the risk. It is important not to be complacent about your

weight, get your weight down, even if you just lose a little bit of

weight, that helps, and take regular exercise. Ellie, you are a GP, is it

possible to think people to be overweight and ridden absolutely.

These are very old-fashioned measurements, looking at BMI, as

opposed to waste consultant -- waist circumference, which is much more

important long-term health. We need look at holistically peoples health,

you talk a lot about people's mental health and people being fit is not

just governed by cardiovascular health and whether you get diabetes,

whether you coronary artery disease. I don't want my overweight patients

to be put off trying to exercise, trying to be healthy, which they

really could be, even with a higher BMI. It is also really important to

point out that this study has not actually been published. It has not

been published in a peer-reviewed journal, so it means that it isn't

the quality of evidence that we have in terms of other scientific

studies. So, yes, we know that being fat is a risk factor, in terms of

disease, along with smoking and other things. But it might actually

still be fine for people to be slightly overweight, as long as they

are exercising and that BP is normal. So, Rishi, how would you put

it, in terms of clear guidance and advice to people, how overweight

would you say somebody could be before health starts to become an

issue, as a result specifically of the weight? I agree with some of the

comments made by Dr Cannon. BMI is a risk of developing cardiovascular

disease, depending on your weight, is along a continuum, that I agree

with. However, in clinical practice, we do tend to use cut-offs, and the

cut-offs we use from the WHO. And so I would be referring to the WHO

cut-offs, if I was practising in a hospital, in a GP practice in order

to give advice. Tell us what they are. The clear advice. For example,

the cut-off for obesity, the BMI that being obese is 30 kilograms per

metre squared, and that is according to the WHO. That is used across the

world, it is used in clinical practice as well as in research

studies, as well. So after that point you are OK, your weight isn't

going to impact on your health? Not necessarily. But these are the

cut-offs defined by the WHO. So there is a risk of developing for

example cardiovascular disease at lower BMIs. That would make all of

our rugby players classified as obese, so the entire rugby teams in

this country would be obese and unhealthy, yet they are quite

obviously very fit from a cardiovascular point of view. That

is why doctors don't use BMI any more, it is an old-fashioned way of

measuring. Thank you all very much. Let us know your thoughts at home on

that as well. Just a reminder, we will be in Dunstable in Beds on

Monday 29th made the big election audience debate. If you have made up

your mind already you will vote for, still deciding ordered think you

will bother, and want the chance to share your views, get in touch to

apply for a place. There are more details on our Facebook and Twitter

pages. Yesterday was a warm day. We saw the

UK top temperature of 26 degrees in Gravesend in the south-east.

Scotland also saw a woman's Day of the year, 22 in the Moray Firth.

Things a little bit cooler today. Still plenty of sunshine in the

north. I will show you this picture from our Weather Watchers. A fresher

feel the things, even a touch of frost across the north-east of

Scotland but compare that to the south-east, a very wet night. A lot

of rain falling, even reports of some localised flooding, minor

flooding across west London. You can see why, the bright colours

indicating that heavy rain, which swept up from the south-west and

more waiting in the wings, which will be driving its way northwards

through the course of this afternoon. We could see some

brightness developing through the south-east. Then temperatures will

really shoot up because it is warm here. Across Scotland and Northern

Ireland, a lovely day into the afternoon. The few heavy showers

getting in May be heavy with some hail and thunder. Eastern Scotland

tending to stay dry, feeling fresher but lovely in the sunshine. Maybe a

bit of brightness getting in towards the north and west of Wales, some

dry weather into the far south-west but the bulk of eastern Wales and

for much of the Midlands, heavy bursts of rain, feeling quite cool

too. Heat and humidity in the south-east means we could see some

heavy, thundery downpours across the south-east, the London area, in the

East Anglia as we head into this evening. Tom Prydie hazardous

driving conditions, lots of standing water around for stock that

continues to push off into the North Sea. It leaves a legacy of cloud and

murkiness through the night. But the south-east where you have clear

skies further north and west. The Thursday, once you lose the cloud

from the south-east, a fresher feel across-the-board. But at least

breakfast are plenty of sunshine around. A scattering of showers

developing and some could be quite heavy with hail and thunder,

potentially Northern Ireland, eastern Scotland, Wales.

Temperatures were they should be, mid to upper teens. This is the

pressure chart Friday, this area will be a player as we head into the

weekend. This weather front in the south-east could graze East Anglia

and the south-east, towards Kent, some patchy rain at times.

Elsewhere, there will be a mixture of sunshine and showers,

temperatures again in the mid-teen sells you. In the Saturday, a day of

sunshine and showers, an area of low pressure firmly in control. Some

showers fairly blustery and the north-west, but feeling pleasant in

the sunshine. For the weekend it feels like it will be a mixture of

sunny spells and showers, some of which will be heavy with hail and

thunder. With light winds and clear skies at night we can expect to

return to some chilly nights. Hello.

It's Wednesday. It's 10am.

and I'm Joanna Gosling. Our top story today -

the Liberal Democrats will launch their manifesto today,

promising a new referendum There's also more money for housing

and education and a promise to lower Today we're offering huge

opportunities for young people where they can get on the renting ladder

for the first time because we're going to give them help with their

deposits or they can rent-to-own with a radical new scheme.

We'll get reaction from liberal democrat voters and Baroness Kramer

from the Lib Dems will be here too to answer yours and their questions.

America's former FBI chief claims he was urged to drop his inquiry

into links between the Trump campaign and Russia

Donald Trump denies the claims. We will have the details.

The first survey into gender in horse racing shows that women are

under represented in the most prominent areas of the sport.

Here's Annita in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

The Liberal Democrats are putting a second EU referendum at the heart

of their general election manifesto, which is formally launched later.

The party says it would "let the people decide"

whether Brexit happens once negotiations have finished.

It's also offering pledges to young people, promising to restore housing

benefit for 18 to 21-year-olds and help people get

The head of one of Labour's biggest union backers has said the party

is on course to lose the general election.

Len McCluskey of Unite claimed it would be a successful campaign

A spokesman for leader Jeremy Corbyn said he was determined to lead

The head of one of Labour's biggest union backers has said the party

is on course to lose the general election.

The White House has denied reports that Donald Trump asked former FBI

director James Comey to stop an investigation into alleged links

Mr Comey, who was sacked last week, is said to have made the claims

in notes taken after a meeting with the president in February.

The White House says the notes are untrue.

The UK's unemployment rate has fallen to a 32-year low,

as a record number of people are in work, figures show.

The jobless total fell by 53,000 to 1.54 million

in the three months to March, a rate of 4.6%, the lowest

Average weekly earnings ex-excluding, bonuses increased by

2.1%. Lloyds Bank says the taxpayer has

made a profit of nearly ?900 million after the

Government sold the last It's almost nine years

since the bank was bailed out at In a statement, Lloyds confirmed

the group has been fully returned The former US soldier,

Chelsea Manning, who passed hundreds of thousands of confidential

diplomatic documents to the website WikiLeaks, will be released later

today from a military Born Bradley Manning, she announced

she would be living as a woman, She was expected to remain in jail

until 2045, but Barack Obama commuted her sentence before leaving

the White House in January. That's a summary of

the latest BBC News. The Chief Executive

of the Women's Tennis Association says that French Open organisers had

"no grounds to penalise" Maria Sharapova by denying her

a wildcard entry to the tournament, WTA chief Steve Simon says that

Sharapova has complied Shortly after learning

of her Roland Garros snub, Sharapova withdrew injured

from her second-round Italian Open Sharapova could still be given

a wild card to appear in the main draw at Wimbledon next month,

but former champion Pat Cash thinks I would hope that they would

stand strong and say no, you've got to go

through play and qualify. Look, Maria at qualifying,

she'll breeze through it on the She's very experienced and she will

probably need some extra matches and she might

welcome those matches. Clearly, she's not physically ready

100% for hard tennis. I think it will be in the long run,

it might not be a bad thing for her, but I think the All England Club

need to stand up and make a stance about this and say we're not

rewarding drug cheats. Andy Murray continues

to have a tough time He's now lost his Italian Open

title after being beaten It was a straight sets defeat

to Italy's Fabio Fognini, made all the more worrying

because the next major, And that is likely to be Murray's

next competitive match. His Coach Ivan Lendl flies to Europe

this weekend to join Murray's team. Clearly he still has

a lot of work to do. The three-way battle for the top

four in the Premier League will go down to the final day of the season

after Arsenal and Manchester City Arsenal have qualified

for the Champions League for the last 20 seasons and beat

Sunderland 2-0 to keep Alexi Sanchez scored both goals

in the second half to leave Arsene Wenger's side with an outside

chance of overtaking And talking of City,

they look the most likely to secure They had an straight forward 3-1 win

over West Brom last night. Yaya Toure scored

the pick of the goals. A point in their final match

at Watford will guarantee third Geraint Thomas has

moved up to eleventh in the Giro D'Italia

after an impressive second place His chances of winning the race

were ruined by a crash on Sunday, but he pulled some time back

on his rivals yesterday. Holland's Tom Dumoulin now leads

the race by over two minutes. That's all the sport for now,

Joanna. See you at 10.30am. The Lib Dems will launch

their manifesto later. It's their plan for the country

which has a series of pledges designed to attract young voters

and people who wanted They say if they win the election

they'll restore housing benefit to young people,

lower the voting age to 16, and hold a referendum

on the final Brexit deal. The party is hoping these plans

will help reverse the huge losses at the last election

when they went from Some voters felt let down

by the time they spent in coalition Here's a reminder

of what went wrong. And just a warning, there is some

flash photography in this report. Until pretty recently,

the Liberal Democrats were the strong third force

in British politics. In 2007, Nick Clegg, a young MP

who used to work in the EU, His personal popularity soared ahead

of the general election in 2010 So, don't let them tell

you that the only choice is between two old parties who've

been playing pass the parcel with your government for 65 years

now, making the same promises, Making the same old mistakes

over and over again. Despite losing a few seats,

the Lib Dems held the balance of power after the election and went

into joint government It all kicked off with

a love-in out in the back On the steps of Downing Street

yesterday evening, I said that Nick and I wanted to put aside party

differences and work together Coalition government was not kind

to Nick Clegg and his party. Forcing them to go back on some key

policies like cutting tuition fees. And forcing this out

of the party leader. We made a pledge.

We didn't stick to it. Come election night in 2015,

things were looking pretty bad. And so it turned out with the party

dropping from 57 MPs to just eight. Key figures like former

leader Charles Kennedy and Business Secretary Vince Cable

were booted out overnight, He had little choice

but to resign as leader. Clearly, the results

have been immeasurably more crushing and unkind

than I could ever have feared. For that, of course,

I must take responsibility. Therefore, I announce

I will be resigning as leader He eventually handed over to this

man, Tim Farron, whose job it now is to give his party

the Parliamentary boost it That was at rattle through the Lib

Dems fortunes. Let's talk to Baroness Susan Kramer,

a Liberal Democrat peer We're joined by two voters who say

they felt "let down" by the Lib Dems the last time they

were in government. Jess Bowyer voted for

the Lib Dems in 2010 after their promise to abolish

university tuition fees. Now, she says there's no point

in the Lib Dems having good policies Kate Pearson voted for

the Lib Dems in 2010. She says she was "seduced"

by Nick Clegg's charm, but was horrified after

the coalition government. Kate, you were seduced, but then

horrified, what happened? I don't knowment like millions of voters

across the country I watched Nick Clegg in the debates. He seemed to

be the kind of person that I could trust. What were you basing that on?

I live in leafy Kent. A vote for Labour seemed like a wasted vote and

I didn't have a huge amount for Gordon Brown as the leader at that

point. I had always been voting for the Labour Party until that point

and Nick Clegg seemed to be saying nothing but things that I agreed.

There was the hashtag trending, "I agree with Nick." So I gave him my

vote and frankly, was sat in a mask of horror two days later when he

stood in the Rose Garden next to David Cameron and they acted like

best of friends. I spent five years feeling nauseous that my vote in

some way had given value I hadation to the austerity cuts, and the work

capability assessments and the tuition fees and all the other

ghastly things, rising foodbanks and everything and I just felt as if my

vote had given legitimacy to that. I also felt that the Conservative side

of the coalition were doing it because they believed it was right

and I might dishave disagreed, but they were doing it because they

thought it was right and the Liberal Democrats knew that what they were

doing was wrong and they were doing it anyway because they wanted to

stay in power. Well, let's bring in Jess. You felt let down as well.

Tell us why? I voted Lib Dem because I grew up in a Tory-Lib Dem marginal

in Devon and it was very clear you voted Lib Dem to stop the Tories. I

was attracted to the Lib Dems because you know I was 18. It was my

first election. They billed themselves as the party of young

voters, with pledges on tuition fees and that was really attractive to

me. So, it was, it was a huge shock to find, you know, two days later

them going into power with the Conservatives in capitulating on

everything that they claimed to have stood for. The tuition fees for you,

was what, that was the final straw, was it? It was one of the big things

and I think tuition fees has become kind of emblematic with regards to

perceived Lib Dem failures, but for me it is more about the austerity

programme. We have had rises in child poverty, in homelessness and

desmation of the Welfare State and the NHS, all of which have been

facilitate bid the coalition Government and probably wouldn't

have happened without the Lib Dems. So, Susan, how do you feel when you

hear the Lib Dem voters talking like that? I suspect I will never win

back Jess or Kate and I'm sad about that. They are representative of a

lot of people. I'm sad about that. If we go back and look at the

coalition, we need to look forward, but I wouldn't change going into

coalition. I think people have forgotten the fragility of the

economy and the crisis that we faced at that point in time and if we

hadn't had a Government that had a majority to deliver in Parliament,

we would, I mean, the damage that would have happened to people with

their job losses, the collapse in communities, we have seen that in

the past and to have decided, it's good for our party to stay out, but

I'll let this happen to people, I couldn't have done that. So, I

understand the anger. I would ask them not to forget the good things

we did in Government, much of which have been claimed by the

Conservatives, but there are 23 million people who used to pay

income tax and don't. Pupil premium made a fantastic difference in

schools, the der ter ration in the NHS, you can see comes after the

coalition. We managed to hold the frontline services to a very

significant degree during that period. We stemmed the Tories from

savage cuts in welfare which you saw coming as soon as we were no longer

there. There were a lot of things we did. Equal marriage. There were all

kinds of things that were important in that period that I'm proud of,

but not everything, we were the smaller party in a coalition and the

reality, you do a programme for when you're in Government, but that means

you think you're going to be the Government. We were part of a

coalition. Let's see what Jess and Kate think. The bits that Susan is

proud of. Does that mitigate the bits that you don't like? You

mentioned the NHS. What about the massive top down reorganisation of

the NHS that was unmentioned in anybody's manifesto and was opposed

by every medical professional body in the country? That was on your

watch. I have a very dear friend who was a sister in A and she would

argue with you that cuts to National Health Service were going on long

before. Things like waiting lists. The

crunch seems to have come over the last couple of years. I think that

is because the cutting process has continued. So let's look forward. We

have the Lib Dem manifested today. Mental health finally on the agenda,

finally finally, where it has never been before. Yes, it has come

through. The manifesto launch today, trying to appeal to younger voters,

exactly voters like these two. But you said right at the beginning you

have no hope of winning people like back. What other policies that

might? I talk to people on the doorstep. There are some that will

always be disillusioned with us but I have found there are many that

actually are very excited. Satele than the policies. What has been

fascinating is our party membership, half of which under 35 and it is

younger people who have come and said as we look at Lib Dem

principles, we bond to join the party and shape the party, which I

find absolutely fascinating and crucially important. For many of the

young people I talk to, Brexit really is serious. They feel

European, their identity is being taken from them, they planned to do

internships in different places, engineering in Germany, fashion in

France, they thought they were free to work abroad. So Lib Dems is

giving a promise of a second referendum. Yes, that second

referendum will be their chance to see what is the actual deal Theresa

May has managed to negotiate and will you live with this or not. I

hope young people will see that as a really important opportunity to talk

about their feelings. Is that appealing? I would rather set myself

on fire than live through another EU referendum. I don't think results

would be any different. Don't give up, don't give up, we have to go to

the barricades and keep fighting this. I do have Brexit and I think

it can be avoided but I don't want another referendum. For me,

fundamentally, the problem as it is fine to have all these great

policies but why should voters trust you? I voted Lib Dem in 2010 on the

basis of your policies, which never came into action, and you reversed a

lot of things. We delivered a lot of that policy -based. The obvious one

being taking 23 million people at the lower end of income out of tax.

Instead of looking back it would be good on what is coming on the

manifesto. A pledge to allow people to vote from the age of 16. That is

something we really feel is so important because 16-year-olds

should have a voice. My daughter just turned 16, I would love it if

she had a voice, particularly with the European referendum last year. I

think it was absolutely appalling that so many of the younger

generation who would be the most affected by it, particularly people

who might want to study and a couple of years, were not allowed a vote.

Would it make you vote Lib Dem? Personally, I never ever thought I

would vote Lib Dem again. 2015, I swore I would never vote Lib Dem

again and two years later they have my vote. Delighted. They are the

only people representing my views on Brexit. Unfortunately if Theresa May

wants to say this is a Brexit election and this is her mandate to

go in and deliver a hard, Conservative style Brexit, stripping

away employee rights and equal protection under the law, if she

wants it to be a mandate for her hard Brexit, the only party

certainly south of the border whereby I can express my strong

opinion that that is not my mandate is by going to the Liberal

Democrats. What will success look like the Lib Dems in this election,

because you are down to eight MPs? Never I spend my time looking at

numbers. What I want us to do is to be that kind of voice that Kate

talked about. Because I think Theresa May, I will be honest,

Theresa May will get a substantial majority. She will see that as a

mandate to do whatever she chooses, and not just on the Brexit issue. We

have seen a lot of hard right policies being proposed. She is

being careful to shore herself up by bringing in the Ukip vote. You are

not going to give us a figure on what success would be for the Lib

Dems? We are the voice of the election, we will keep that voice

loud and clear, whatever our numbers. But the more people we

have, the more we can push for the second referendum. We are going to

listen to Theresa May right now, I will interrupt you because she is on

the campaign trail and speaking. The UK economy has grown at one of the

fastest rates in the developed world. Employment has increased by

.9 million since Labour were in power, and we should never forget

what those numbers mean for the Merhi working families. They mean a

better future and more security. They mean a better standard of

living for people and more tax revenue to spend on vital public

services, like our NHS, schools and defence. And just today, we have

seen that the work of fixing Labour's economic mess continues.

The government has sold its remaining shares in Lloyds banking

group, as we continue to repair the damage to our banking sector, and

today's employment figures show that our credible policies are delivering

greater security for families across the country. But none of this

happened by accident. Our economic progress has been dearly won, and

could easily be lost if the wrong policies were pursued in the years

ahead. It is frankly all at risk. Any party which asks the British

party to entrust to them the responsibilities of forming the next

government through the crucial years of our Brexit negotiations and

beyond must demonstrate that it has the credible economic plan and the

capable team to safeguard our economic security. Now one could

look at what Jeremy Corbyn and his Labour Party offered yesterday and

concludes that it passed the test. The risk which a Jeremy Corbyn

-based government would pose to our economy has been laid bare, that

manifestos are also a test of something else. They are a test of

leadership. Later this week, I will publish my party's manifesto for the

next five years. Unlike Jeremy Corbyn's fantasy wish list of easy

promises, paid for with imaginary money, I will set out in detail the

five great challenges our country faces over the next five years. And

lay out how we will tackle them. While Jeremy Corbyn and Labour

retreat into an ideological comfort certain, ducking the difficult

challenges which lie ahead, I will be straight with people. I won't shy

away from facing the challenges of our time. Rather, I will set out how

we will tackle them head-on. Because that is what leadership is about.

And on this key test, Jeremy Corbyn has failed once again. If he can't

show real leadership of his party now, how could he lead our country

through Brexit? How could he sit down with the Prime Minister 's,

president and chancellors of Europe and get a good deal for Britain? At

this election, only the strong and stable leadership of me and my team

can deliver the successful Brexit our country needs, face up to the

challenges which lie ahead, and improve the lives of everyone in our

country. It will be strong leadership and credible policies for

a better future. That starts with getting the right Brexit deal for

Britain, which locks in economic security for our country, the

weakness of Jeremy Corbyn and the chaos of the coalition which would

put him into Downing Street would put that at risk, and with it the

future prosperity of families across our country, and the Chancellor will

now say more about that. Thank you, Prime Minister. Yesterday, the

Labour manifesto confirmed what we already suspected, that they do not

have a credible plan for our country's future, and they cannot be

trusted with our country's finances. What we saw yesterday is only the

latest in a catalogue of chaos from Labour. Throughout this campaign,

Labour have shown time and time again that they lack the basic

competence and credibility the government this country. We have

seen Jeremy Corbyn and his closest lieutenancy exposed as being simply

not up to the job. The Shadow Chancellor, the self-confessed

Marxist John McDonnell, doesn't know how big the deficit is. The shadow

secretary Di Shadow Home Secretary at one stage was suggesting you

could employ a police officer to ?30 a year. The Shadow Education

Secretary Angela Rayner couldn't tell us how many children their

class size policy would affect, and yesterday, the Shadow Foreign

Secretary Emily Thornberry was unable to explain Labour's policy on

benefits. Labour have simply become a shambles, and as yesterday's

manifesto showed, their numbers simply do not add up. Now that

Jeremy Corbyn has published his manifesto in full, we have been able

to update the analysis, which David Davis and I published previously. We

can now set out the full damage his nonsensical plans would do to the

nation's finances by 2021-22. The new dossier of analysis we have

published today shows that there is a ?58 billion black hole in Jeremy

Corbyn's plans in just one year alone. Proposal after proposal in

Labour's manifesto mean more borrowing and more debt, two

unexplained threats to seize control of private companies stop these

plans, many of them extremely questionable in themselves, simply

do not add up. Any shred of economic credibility, which Labour had left,

has now been buried by Jeremy Corbyn and his acolytes. And this matters

to families across the United Kingdom. The economic chaos, which

would hit our country if Labour were in a position to implement the

shambolic package of policies they unveiled yesterday, would leave

every household in Britain counting the cost. The price of Labour's

chaos would be felt in higher taxes and steeper mortgage bills for

working families. This economic chaos would mean higher

unemployment, robbing families of the peace of mind and security,

which comes with a job. It would mean more borrowing, throwing away

all the hard earned progress of the last seven years, and take us right

back to square one with a growing deficit, growing debt, and

increasing financial uncertainty for the next generation. Labour's

manifesto is a plan for an ideological fuel, which would mean

economic chaos for the many. Only Theresa May and her Conservative

team have a plan to lock in economic security and built a better future

for our country. Dee Stakes at this election could not be higher. A vote

for any other party is simply too big a risk to take. Thank you.

Thank you, very much, Philip, we will now take some questions. Laura?

Thank you very much Prime Minister and Chancellor. You have attacked

the Labour plans, not surprisingly, but if increasing tax and increasing

spending overall is such a bad idea, why has it continued to happen under

a government that you have both been part of for seven years? You have

repeatedly missed your deficit target the new even still have a

black Colin Newell most recent budget, Chancellor. The Chancellor

this morning rather candidly admitted swearing occasionally in

rows with number ten. If after June you are re-elected, will you still

be next neighbours? First of all, I will ask the Chancellor to respond

as well, but first of all let's be clear about what we are saying about

the Labour Party manifesto. It simply doesn't add up. What we see

today is this ?58 billion black hole that we have identified in their

figures. These are large numbers, but what matters is the impact it

has on ordinarily working families, and it means that people will be

paying the price of labour. They will pay the price in higher taxes,

lower wages, higher prices, and an economy which will be in chaos. The

key thing is that over the last seven years we have shown we have

that credible economic plan and we have that credible economic plan for

the future to take us forward, to ensure that we get the right deal

from Brexit but also locked our economic security. And I think it is

true to say that the Chancellor and I and every other member of our team

are focused on the 8th of June. Our focus is on winning this general

election because it matters for the future of our country. What I

candidly admitted this morning, and my family will confirm this, is that

I do occasionally swear. I wasn't referring to any particular, session

but I do occasionally swear. The difference between us and Labour is

that Labour doesn't believe in balancing the budget. The Prime

Minister has said many times that as a country we have to get back to

living within our means, we have to do that in a sensible way, we have

to do that in a measured way that balances the needs of deficit

reduction with the needs for investment in our economy, and the

needs of our public services, but we do have to do it. Labour doesn't

believe in reducing taxes. Labour believes in increasing taxes. We are

a low tax party by instinct. Conservatives will always cost you

less in tax. Well, let's leave Theresa May and

Philip Hammond. Norman Smith is in Westminster.

Today, they are focussing on bashing Labour's offering yesterday. Yes,

this was just an attack press conference to gut and fillet

Labour's manifesto yesterday. Theresa May, Philip Hammond,

focussing on the issue of credibility, saying that Mr Corbyn's

plans simply did not add up. It was described as a catalogue of chaos. A

fantasy wish-list and at the heart of their argument is there is they

say ?58 billion of unfunded commitments made by Mr Corbyn

yesterday. Now, those mostly are the big nationalisations, he talked

about, Team Corbyn are saying we didn't include that because it's

capital spending so we can borrow. Mrs May, also again focus on the

credibility of Jeremy Corbyn's leadership. She wants to make it a

tussle about the strong and stable leadership of Theresa May as she

sees it versus Jeremy Corbyn and she accused him of retreating into an

edelogical comfort zone. So this was basically an attack press conference

by the Tories to try and take apart Labour's big manifesto launch

yesterday. And separately, Norman, today, one of Labour big backers is

expressing his doubts about Labour's prospects at the election. Tell us

more? Extraordinary really in a way because come election time normally

all the big political beasts come out and say how wonderful their side

is doing and it's all going very well. No so Len McCluskey who is

Jeremy Corbyn's main man in the union movement and he is political

muscle within the Labour Party. Len McCluskey said, it doesn't look like

we're going to winment in fact, we'll be doing well to win just 200

seats. That would be the worst result Labour have ever had since

the Second World War. Worse than mike al Foot and Len McCluskey seems

to be saying that would not be a bad result. This morning, a different

tune from Mr McCluskey listen. Well, first of all the interview I did was

a conversational piece and it was against the backdrop of if the

opinion polls are to be believed that I made those comments. Of

course, since then Labour have launched their manifesto. It's a

fantastic manifesto. A manifesto for workers, for ordinary working

people. A manifesto that will change Britain for the good. And the

response that we've had from Unite members has been incredible. That's

why I was checking our polls that we do constant polls and the response

has been like something we've never seen before. So I'm full of optimism

if I was having that interview today, I wouldn't be making those

comments. I think also the Labour campaign has been brilliant. It has

outshown the Tories. Jeremy Corbyn has come across as a real man of the

people and a real leader. I'm now full of optimism as to what will

happen in the next two to three weeks. I believe that the opinion

polls will start to move, if our members in Unite are anything to go

by, once people start looking at the policies that Labour have, in their

manifesto, then anything is possible and we believe now that everything

to fight for over the next three weeks and that's what we will be

doing. So you have not had a change of tune? Yes, in many respects I

have. Against the backdrop of the opinion polls, that was the

conversational interview I was having, but Labour's manifesto has

been received certainlily Unite members, very, very enthusiastically

and I think positively and I think if that spreads throughout the rest

of the nation then we could see something really dramatic happening

in the next two to three weeks and that's what we will be fighting for.

Every single vote, Unite, will be there, in every constituency

fighting for Labour to win this election.

You did say in the interview that 200 seats would be a successful

campaign, but that's almost 30 fewer... Yes, against a backdrop of

the current opinion polls and that's why it's always difficult in a

long-ranging interview to pick out specific comments because it's

always against the backdrop of what you were talking about and of

course, I was talking about the opinion polls and how massive a task

lies ahead for Labour. Now, what I'm saying now is, very evidencely, this

manifesto -- efficiently, this manifesto that's come out, the

Americans sometimes refer to it as a Christmas tree, there is a present

for everybody hanging from it and that's true. John McDonnell has been

brilliant in explaining where the cash will come from. And I think now

that that should start to alter things fairly dramatically both in

the polls and Labour's prospects so that's what I'm looking forward. But

if the polls don't change and you're still... Well, let's just wait to

see because I'm now convinced that the polls will change. I'm now

convinced that Labour are in with a real chance and that's what we are

hoping for the that's what the British people need if they could

only examine those particular policies that Labour have put

forward then I think things will begin to change and that's, I'm

ready for the fight. I'm up for the fight. So, there we are. Len

McCluskey had a conversion overnight. A shining light convinced

him that Jeremy Corbyn is now in fact on course for victory. OK,

Norman. Hold the thoughts. You may well know that every day until 8th

June we are highlighting the best gaffe or amaoudsing moment from the

election cal pawn with Norman. We need a general election and we

need one now. To every city, every village, every town. We state a

clear intention. About the future of this country. The big question here

is simply this... At what point... Are voters... Getting tired of

politicians. Let me finish if you don't mind. What have you got today,

Norman? I bring you beards! What do we think of beards? Well, vote, are

not terribly fond of politicians who have beards of the there is a survey

out today saying two-thirds of voters don't like their leaders to

have beards. They view them as unkept and looks as if you kind of

let yourself go, which is not good news for Westminster's famous beard

which belongs to Mr J Corbyn. He won the Beard Of The Year seven years on

the trot. This was him being asked a couple of years ago, how long he had

been growing a beard for? Well, the leader of the beard liberation front

quoted me as saying I wear my beard as my opposition to New Labour, but

that doesn't really work when John himself wears a beard! Look, there

are contradictions in the movement. Now, history is not necessarily on

Mr Corbyn's side, the last Prime Minister to have a beard was the

Marcus of Salisbury in 1900s, 1902, something like that. He had a bushy,

full beard, a bit like that character in Fools And Horses. He

has an uncle Albert beard! Karl Marx, yes he had another very full

beard! Other figures we can think of, well, of course, there was the

US President, Abraham Lincoln. Very successful leader, of course, he had

more of a goatee, I guess we'd call it now. Elsewhere on the range,

Gengis Khan. Beards have a chequered relationship. However, on matters

here, one Liberal Democrat is so enthused by his party, he has got

the words, "Lib Dem" Cut into his hair! Have a look! This is what he

has done on each side. That's how committed he is to the

cause! Maybe I could get the words, "BBC"

Cut into the sides of my hairment I don't think I've got enough hair.

Scrap that idea. Forget it. I think you should do it, Norman.

LAUGHTER So there is an election going on.

We are calling it What's The Chatter? Today we are talking about

echo chambers. What are they? Well, have a look at this.

He's the stats guy at the think-tank, Demos.

And his colleague Jamie Bartlett is here to tell us what the data means.

Welcome. I know that you enjoyed Norman's chat on beards a moment

ago! Let's talk more about the echo chamber because we heard the

principle, Josh and I know you wanted to know if that principle is

going on with the 200,000 supporters you followed. You generated a chart

and explain what we're looking at here? What you're looking, we're

interested in not only people were saying and who they were talking to

and what the conversations were and each of the dots on this graph is a

user on Twitter. And each line represents a conversation. So if I

tweet to you, you will get a notification that I've, I'm talking

to you, but you will be connected by a line on this graph. Now, the only

thing that determines where the users are on this graph is who

they're talking to and how much. We've coloured them by party, but

that's what is determining their position. The really interesting

thing that we have seen coming out here and this is 1.5 million tweets

over the election period is that people are generally grouping by

their parties. This affects kind of various, depending on the parties,

Labour and Conservatives are grouped together, but they're more spread

out than the three other parties that we have been looking at. So

that's specifically then where you're identifying the echo chamber

going on, the Lib Dems, the SNP and Ukip? That's where we have seen this

effect strongest. So you can see and if we remove Labour and Conservative

from the graph, you can see that while there are conversations going

on between these clusters, they're much, much denser within themselves.

So most of the chatter within each of the parties are to the party

faithful, are to people who kind of share the same views. Jamie, tell me

what you've identified about people in the three parties and what they

are sharing? Well, so taking our sort of little clusters and taking

our samples of 200 from each of the parties, we were looking at the

tweets that were the most shared within them. So, I think the first

one comes from the SNP here. So this was the most shared within the SNP

group. And as you can see this is fairly inward looking. Essentially

it is Nicola Sturgeon saying that Alex Salmond was right by saying

that the Labour manifesto is essentially a rip off of some SNP

policies. Very popular amongst SNP supporters. So that was

reverberating around about that, but what about the Liberal Democrats? A

sort of similar one. A self congratulatetry tweet from the

Liberal Democrats. This was the most shared within that cluster and it's