31/05/2017 Victoria Derbyshire


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31/05/2017

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Hello, it's Wednesday, it's nine o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

:00:07.:00:09.

A breast surgeon accused of playing God and carrying out unnecessary

:00:10.:00:20.

operations on patients is due to be sentenced at Nottingham Crown Court

:00:21.:00:21.

this morning. Paterson exploited me

:00:22.:00:24.

as a person for his own ends. There were hundreds of female

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victims. We'll be hearing from some

:00:32.:00:34.

of his other victims later. Also on the programme -

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the latest in our election On the picket line with banners,

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it's just not me, sorry! . And Wiltshire Police say they're

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hunting a "dangerous" prisoner - believed to be armed with a razor

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blade - who escaped from hospital Welcome to the programme,

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we're live until 11am. Any minute now Labour leader

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Jeremy Corbyn is due to give a speech in London focussing

:01:09.:01:11.

on the NHS and education - And a little later in the programme

:01:12.:01:14.

we'll talk about a rise in bullying for online gamers -

:01:15.:01:22.

if you've got expereince do get in touch - use the hashtag

:01:23.:01:25.

#VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

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at the standard network rate. Our top story today,

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police say a "dangerous" prisoner, believed to be armed with a razor

:01:35.:01:36.

blade, is on the run after escaping Michal Kisiel, who's 30,

:01:37.:01:42.

had been taken to hospital in Salisbury with a head injury

:01:43.:01:45.

before fleeing from guards Police are warning the public

:01:46.:01:47.

not to approach him. Greg Dawson is here

:01:48.:01:56.

with more details. What happened? Last night Michal

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Kisiel was found in his cell at HMP Erlestoke prison. They decided he

:02:07.:02:09.

needed hospital treatment so he was taken to a hospital in Salisbury.

:02:10.:02:17.

Police say they believe he overpowered two prison guards and he

:02:18.:02:21.

escaped with a razor blade. They are concerned he is dangerous and they

:02:22.:02:25.

are warning the public to stay away from him. If they see him to call

:02:26.:02:30.

999. We have a fuse still images, they say he's around five or six

:02:31.:02:38.

with noticeable tattoos on his neck. He was wearing grey tracksuit

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bottoms, a blue T-shirt and trainers. The most noticeable thing

:02:44.:02:47.

is he had a head injury. Police say he is not local to the area, he

:02:48.:02:51.

doesn't have any money or a phone, so there is a possibility he will be

:02:52.:02:55.

spotted by members of the public. Why was he in prison? He was

:02:56.:02:59.

sentenced last year after he held a mother and teenage daughter at

:03:00.:03:03.

knife-point in their own home and threatened them. He was sentenced to

:03:04.:03:08.

five years at HMP Erlestoke. Police are concerned he might encounter a

:03:09.:03:12.

member of the public so if anyone does see him, dial 999 and don't

:03:13.:03:18.

approach in. Thank you. Now the rest of the morning's news. A huge car

:03:19.:03:28.

bomb in Coble has killed at least 80 people and killed 350. It happened

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in the diplomatic quarter of the city -- Kabul. Our correspondent is

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at the scene and sent this report. This is the scene of today's attack

:03:47.:03:53.

here in Kabul the Afghan capital. Police have cordoned off this area.

:03:54.:03:58.

Nobody is allowed to go further than this. But, as you can hear,

:03:59.:04:08.

ambulances and police troops are arriving to the scene, some are

:04:09.:04:13.

leaving the scene. They are taking some injured people. SIRENS. You can

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see this vehicle has taken people who are hurt. It is a chaotic scene.

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It was a massive, massive blast. People tell me they haven't seen

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anything like this in many years. As you can see, all the windows and

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some doors are shattered. Nobody has yet taken responsibility for the

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attack. But in spite of several demands from the international

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community, the insurgents and the Taliban have not said yes to stop

:05:05.:05:08.

violence in the holy month of Ramadan.

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A 30-year old man has been arrested on suspicion of murder,

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after the bodies of a woman and two children were discovered

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The discovery was made by officers investigating reports of a fuel leak

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Police say they're not looking for anyone else.

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The NHS could have to raise an extra half a billion pounds a year,

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if British pensioners living in other EU countries have to return

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That's the warning from a health charity this morning.

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The Nuffield Trust says the cost of treating them on home soil rather

:05:35.:05:37.

than abroad could be almost a billion pounds, as

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For many British pensioners it is the appeal of retirement

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in the sunshine that attracts them to move to countries

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But having the same health care rights as the locals

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It's part of a reciprocal scheme which the UK pays around

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That covers nearly 200,000 British expatriates living

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But it's a deal potentially under threat when Brexit happens,

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People, if they had to return from countries where they live

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in the EU to here, retired people, could cost the NHS more money.

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Beyond that we probably would need more hospital beds and more nurses

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to give those people the standards of care they require.

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Unless a deal is struck the trust says pensioners

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If they will return to Britain for treatment it could cost

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Last year, spending on the NHS in England was around ?102 billion.

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The Nuffield trust estimates the NHS would need around 1600 more doctors,

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nurses, and other workers to provide this care.

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In response, the Conservative Party say protecting the rights of UK

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nationals in the EU is one of their priorities

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But the Liberal Democrats say this report is evidence that

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Theresa May's extreme version of Brexit will be a disaster

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for the NHS, putting huge pressure on hospitals.

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Labour are yet to comment but have previously accused the Conservatives

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For the first time, a British police force is to recruit people directly

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to become detectives - without them having to first work

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The Metropolitan Police hopes the scheme will fill some of the 600

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detective vacancies in the force, and attract people with different

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skills and backgrounds who might not otherwise want to join.

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Abuse and bullying in the online gaming world is a growing problem

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according to new research from anti-bullying

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Of the 2,500 young gamers they surveyed, half had been

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Here's our technology correspondent Rory Cellan-Jones.

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For 16-year-old Bailey, video games have been a big part

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of his life and were once an escape when he was getting

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He enjoys pitting his skills against other players online,

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but what he doesn't like is the abuse he sometimes

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He first experienced bullying in games when he was ten and it's

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If I'm playing a game and I score a goal, I've literally been

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If you're being bullied at home, you come home and play your computer

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and you are just getting more abuse thrown at you.

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It's just going to put you off doing anything social.

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The charity Ditch The Label surveyed 2,500 young gamers.

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57% said they had been subjected to hate speech in an online game.

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47% had received threats and 40% had had unwanted sexual contact.

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What's changed over the last decade is that more and more games

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are played online and that means young gamers are encountering

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anonymous people from around the world and chatting with them.

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That can of course, be very positive, but it also lays them open

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for the kind of dangers we've seen elsewhere in the online world.

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The anti-bullying charity worked with the online game

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Habbo Hotel to research young gamers' experiences.

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I think what's so shocking is the fact that it's

:09:10.:09:15.

We had gamers telling us this was just part

:09:16.:09:18.

Bailey says he has now learned not to let abuse get to him,

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but he wants the games companies to do more to watch over

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what happens online and to act to stop the bullies.

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And we'll have more on that story later in this programme

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when Victoria will speak to some young gamers who have

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been at the receiving end of bullying online.

:09:40.:09:43.

Olivia Newton-John has revealed she has breast cancer again,

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25 years after recovering from her original diagnosis.

:09:46.:09:48.

The Grease star has postponed her upcoming tour dates

:09:49.:09:50.

after discovering that the disease has spread to her spine.

:09:51.:09:56.

The singer and actress is undergoing treatment,

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and expects to return to the stage later this year.

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That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 9:30.

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Thank you for your messages already about bullying while gaming. This

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e-mail says "I've been an avid gamer for years, bullying and harassment

:10:16.:10:20.

is ever present. Where young children are playing 18 rated games,

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ultimately resulting in them being exposed to the behaviour when

:10:25.:10:27.

competition causes friction. However, the simple solution is to

:10:28.:10:31.

join a different game session where it may be friendly, or to block

:10:32.:10:37.

horrible people". "My 16-year-old brother is autistic and is often

:10:38.:10:41.

bullied online for his speech impediment". And this tweet, "The

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gaming community should be a place of togetherness, people who bully

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others online should be ashamed, it is deplorable". We are waiting for

:10:50.:10:54.

Jeremy Corbyn to attend an event where he will refer to the party's

:10:55.:10:58.

promises on the NHS and education. You can see he's being introduced,

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it looks like he's being introduced. You'll be there any second so we

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will bring you some of his speech live.

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Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

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use the hashtag #VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

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Let's get some sport now with Holly Hamilton,

:11:17.:11:19.

and it seems football's best-kept secret will finally

:11:20.:11:21.

We are just waiting for this to be rubber-stamped by the board today.

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As we were talking about yesterday it might not be a popular decision

:11:31.:11:35.

with some fans. He's faced so much criticism over the past season, a

:11:36.:11:41.

season that saw Arsenal fail to make the top four in 20 years. But

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remember they did beat Chelsea on Saturday to win the FA Cup.

:11:46.:11:50.

Now, here is Jeremy Corbyn. Our NHS, our children's schools is anything

:11:51.:11:59.

but strong and stable. Over the last seven years they've starved public

:12:00.:12:03.

services who rely on those resources because the Conservatives have

:12:04.:12:07.

chosen at every turn tax giveaways for the few over public services for

:12:08.:12:12.

the many. Patients are suffering ever longer waits and crowded wards.

:12:13.:12:16.

Those who need care are left without it. A and maternity units are

:12:17.:12:22.

threatened with closure. Children are crammed into overcrowded and

:12:23.:12:27.

crumbling classrooms. Schools are sending home begging letters to the

:12:28.:12:31.

parents. It has is to change. Together, we have the power to make

:12:32.:12:36.

it change on the 8th of June. Labour will invest in our people's schools

:12:37.:12:42.

and hospitals. We will cut school class sizes not cut schools. Take 1

:12:43.:12:47.

million people of the National Health Service waiting lists, not

:12:48.:12:50.

add millions more. Ensure that people get the care that they

:12:51.:12:55.

deserve, and guarantee the dedicated staff a pay rise. Another five years

:12:56.:13:02.

of the Conservatives would be disastrous for our public services.

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If they carry on as they are now, then by 2022, there could be 5.5

:13:08.:13:14.

million people on the NHS England waiting list. 1.5 million older

:13:15.:13:23.

people with an met care needs. 650,000 people crammed into primary

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classes of over 30. Families left almost ?450 worse off her child as

:13:29.:13:35.

the result of the Tories' plan to scrap free school meals to 1.7

:13:36.:13:41.

million of our children. That's the Conservative vision for Britain.

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Don't take my word for it. Last week, the IFF is made clear the

:13:45.:13:50.

Conservative manifesto promises no new money to the National Health

:13:51.:13:54.

Service, and a real terms cut in pupil funding for school. That

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vision doesn't have to become a reality. On the 8th of June, there's

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only one party that will improve our public services for the many, not

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the few. That is the Labour Party. We can do better than this. Labour

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will build an NHS and social care system for the many. We'll invest 37

:14:16.:14:22.

billion into our NHS, and take 1 million people off the waiting list

:14:23.:14:28.

by 2022. We'll invest 8 billion in social care over the next five years

:14:29.:14:33.

and lay the foundations for a National Care Service to integrate

:14:34.:14:39.

health and social care. Labour will build a national education service

:14:40.:14:43.

and invest in our children's futures. We will cap class sizes at

:14:44.:14:49.

34 five, six and seven-year-olds. Labour will provide free school

:14:50.:14:55.

meals to all primary school children. The Conservative Party

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will Take That away and replace it with a thimble full of rice crispies

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for each child. In the fifth Richards country of the world it's

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not acceptable to leave people languishing in A departments on

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trolleys in hospital corridors without care at all.

:15:11.:15:20.

We believe that those who can afford it should pay just a little bit more

:15:21.:15:28.

to fund care, dignity and opportunity for all. It now gives me

:15:29.:15:35.

great pleasure to introduce our Health Secretary, John Ashworth, to

:15:36.:15:40.

take you through the details of our concerns over the National Health

:15:41.:15:46.

Service. We will leave Jeremy Corbyn there, leader of the Labour Party,

:15:47.:15:48.

reiterating his party's promises ahead of the general election. Cut

:15:49.:15:55.

class sizes, from school meals for primary school children, take a

:15:56.:15:59.

million people of NHS waiting lists, and the paper that he will reverse

:16:00.:16:04.

cuts in corporation tax, and tax what Labour says will only be the

:16:05.:16:07.

top 5% of earners. More reaction to come later on. Next this morning,

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part two of our new series, election Blind dates.

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Every day this week, we'll be bringing you a blind date

:16:20.:16:21.

over lunch between two people with very different views -

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will they come to blows or walk away friends?

:16:25.:16:26.

Up today are Georgia Toffolo, better known as "Toff"

:16:27.:16:28.

from the Channel Four TV series Made in Chelsea, and anti-austerity

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One lives a champagne lifestyle, the other was once on the breadline.

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So this is how they got on - and there is the occasional strong

:16:36.:16:38.

There's an election on and people are talking politics.

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So, what happens when you send two people with opposing

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I'm, like, oh my God, this has been so long.

:16:54.:17:02.

You see people that are sat there that can go and work

:17:03.:17:12.

and choose not to, they choose to go and sign on, it angers me.

:17:13.:17:15.

When people stand at the dispatch box and tell me there's

:17:16.:17:28.

more money in education, I look around and I

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Because it's not in my children's school.

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How would I describe myself politically?

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I'm Jack Munro, and I'm a food writer

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And when I went back to work I couldn't work

:17:59.:18:11.

I ended up in quite a shoddy personal situation.

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It's something that never leaves you.

:18:18.:18:23.

Not eating for three days in a row so you can feed your child,

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or sitting opposite him, hoping he leaves some of his dinner

:18:29.:18:31.

We've been texting my friend about fox hunting.

:18:32.:18:39.

He's, like, belting, belting, marvellous.

:18:40.:18:42.

It's the number one issue facing Britain apart from inheritance tax.

:18:43.:18:47.

I'm best known for being on a TV programme called Made In Chelsea.

:18:48.:18:59.

I'm very lucky, I went to a nice school and I live

:19:00.:19:05.

But I'm not, I don't know, I'm not stuck up.

:19:06.:19:08.

But when people do think of me, and also my name,

:19:09.:19:11.

my nickname is Toff, which is, like, a joke

:19:12.:19:13.

So people have so many, you know, thoughts about me before

:19:14.:19:22.

I'm a member of the Conservative Party,

:19:23.:19:26.

and I have been for about eight years now.

:19:27.:19:28.

I can't comprehend why anyone my age would support a Labour Party.

:19:29.:19:31.

I'm trying to remember what I'm like on a date.

:19:32.:19:33.

I'm, like, oh my God, it's been so long, literally.

:19:34.:19:37.

Yeah, good, fine, quite nervous, but hungry.

:19:38.:19:45.

First things first, right, so, on the political spectrum

:19:46.:19:51.

So, centre, left-wing, right-wing, I'm about here.

:19:52.:20:01.

OK, so we're equally divergent from the centre.

:20:02.:20:06.

Yeah, not horribly right wing, but definitely not centre.

:20:07.:20:09.

OK, fine, we've established where we are.

:20:10.:20:13.

I'm awkwardly wriggling out of my coat for a second.

:20:14.:20:26.

I truly believe we should remain in the European Union.

:20:27.:20:42.

And I got to a point where the weight of the decision

:20:43.:20:45.

literally felt like it was entirely mine, so I thought, you know what,

:20:46.:20:48.

I'm just going to leave it to people who are either more qualified

:20:49.:20:51.

to make the decision, or think they're more qualified,

:20:52.:20:54.

to do it, and I'll just go with the will of

:20:55.:20:56.

Oh my goodness, but I think we're so lucky to have

:20:57.:21:00.

Referendums are, like, political engagement at their highest.

:21:01.:21:03.

I really regret it, I voted to remain, I wish that I'd have...

:21:04.:21:13.

Enough other people voted to leave that you've got what you wanted.

:21:14.:21:17.

I think it's a really positive thing for our country that we're leaving.

:21:18.:21:22.

Every time I go eat something, or make a point at the same time,

:21:23.:21:25.

I can imagine that our views on social

:21:26.:21:30.

I think what the Conservatives have done in the past seven years,

:21:31.:21:34.

with scaling back welfare payments, is overwhelmingly positive.

:21:35.:21:38.

And their support has been cut left, right, and centre.

:21:39.:21:46.

I've got friends who are in bed 23 hours a day, cannot

:21:47.:21:53.

look after themselves, and have to rely on two separate

:21:54.:21:55.

care appointments where someone turns up for ten minutes

:21:56.:21:57.

Imagine being locked in your bedroom for 22 hours a day.

:21:58.:22:04.

I completely understand, but this is where I think

:22:05.:22:06.

No, that's the result of Conservative cuts.

:22:07.:22:10.

There's only a certain amount of welfare that they

:22:11.:22:16.

I watch television programmes and you see people that are sat

:22:17.:22:22.

there who, you know, are clever, you know,

:22:23.:22:24.

I think with any system, every system is open to abuse.

:22:25.:22:33.

Until I was actually in that situation myself,

:22:34.:22:35.

physically freezing, starving, heating turned off,

:22:36.:22:38.

not eating for three days in a row, trying to top myself and my bathroom

:22:39.:22:42.

because I didn't want to carry on, basically.

:22:43.:22:48.

Yet, but does not and you also that some of the funding that could have

:22:49.:22:51.

gone to you when you were really in need was going to people

:22:52.:22:54.

I think less than 1% of benefit payments are fraudulent.

:22:55.:22:58.

I'd have brought it, but I didn't think...

:22:59.:23:02.

Yeah, but you're not going to own up to being a benefits cheat, are you?

:23:03.:23:05.

Why watch benefit cheats, if you think that's the right term

:23:06.:23:08.

for them, carefully, and not people who are avoiding large amounts

:23:09.:23:11.

of tax, scribbling their money in the Cayman Islands?

:23:12.:23:13.

I agree, but I think all of it needs to be watched.

:23:14.:23:16.

It's not just, like, a one issue kind of thing.

:23:17.:23:25.

I think a flat rate of tax is a lot better.

:23:26.:23:32.

And you work really hard for what you earn.

:23:33.:23:41.

If you tip over a tax bracket, it's as though the government

:23:42.:23:44.

Do you think we all just need a certain amount to live on,

:23:45.:23:50.

I think in this country, right, if you work hard

:23:51.:23:53.

You don't agree that in the UK right now if you work your EXPLETIVE off

:23:54.:24:01.

No, I know loads of people who work their EXPLETIVE off,

:24:02.:24:04.

cleaning shops, cleaning trains, driving trains.

:24:05.:24:06.

I also know people who've got their jobs through family connections,

:24:07.:24:09.

you basically swan around drinking in private members

:24:10.:24:12.

It's not a stereotype, I know these people.

:24:13.:24:16.

And you think, why should the health care assistant

:24:17.:24:18.

wipe their EXPLETIVE on 11 grand a year, and the guy

:24:19.:24:21.

who was basically born into the banking role the earning

:24:22.:24:23.

who was basically born into the banking role be earning

:24:24.:24:25.

I don't think hard work and income are equivalent in this country.

:24:26.:24:29.

And if I see, you know, when I look at my accounts,

:24:30.:24:38.

if I think, oh gosh, if I earn more next month

:24:39.:24:42.

I'm going to have pay even more to the taxman, it angers me.

:24:43.:24:45.

Do you ever turn jobs down just because you don't

:24:46.:24:48.

Of course not, but it doesn't make me think, oh, God,

:24:49.:24:52.

I think we do all need a certain amount to live on.

:24:53.:24:57.

And if you learn more you should contribute.

:24:58.:24:59.

You see, that's where our political ideologies are so different.

:25:00.:25:01.

So, tell me, what are your views on fox hunting?

:25:02.:25:04.

I think if somebody came up with it now as a sport, and went, I know,

:25:05.:25:09.

we're going to get a pack of dogs to chase an animal through

:25:10.:25:12.

the woods, they'd be, you know, they'd be tried and sent

:25:13.:25:14.

These foxes need to be culled anyway.

:25:15.:25:19.

Because they're out of control in the countryside.

:25:20.:25:23.

Come on, people like fox hunting because it's a chance to put

:25:24.:25:29.

all the gear on and get on your horse and have a good

:25:30.:25:33.

It's a great, old, British tradition.

:25:34.:25:35.

But there are a lot of great old British...

:25:36.:25:38.

Slavery was a great, old British tradition.

:25:39.:25:39.

I just think that it's disingenuous to suggest that people are partaking

:25:40.:25:43.

in fox hunting to help the farmers out.

:25:44.:25:45.

But do you agree that, you know, in the democracy that we live in,

:25:46.:25:48.

Theresa May is not wrong for putting it to the House of Commons?

:25:49.:25:52.

You know, it's a free vote, all the MPs can vote on it.

:25:53.:25:55.

People who vote on it, and I'd like to think

:25:56.:25:57.

So, I read somewhere this morning the Lib Dems,

:25:58.:26:04.

They were, like, sorry, that was mean.

:26:05.:26:08.

But, they were talking about legalising cannabis.

:26:09.:26:13.

For me, you know, smoking cannabis is an addiction.

:26:14.:26:18.

It is definitely true that it does cause mental problems if you smoke

:26:19.:26:27.

So, for me, I think I'd find it deeply distressing

:26:28.:26:30.

I don't know, because, cards on the table, I'm

:26:31.:26:36.

Yeah, stone cold sober, I was drinking a bottle

:26:37.:26:48.

But I could go into my local corner shop and buy a bottle of whiskey

:26:49.:26:56.

and the guy behind the counter would joke about how much I drank,

:26:57.:26:59.

I think I would have done myself a lot less damage if I could have

:27:00.:27:07.

Than downing a bottle of whiskey to go to bed.

:27:08.:27:12.

You know, drugs are drugs for a reason.

:27:13.:27:17.

I know, I'm not saying I have a spliff in the evening,

:27:18.:27:20.

but I think I would've done myself a lot less damage.

:27:21.:27:23.

What's your views, then, you said on security,

:27:24.:27:27.

surveillance, the fact that, apparently, the government can hack

:27:28.:27:29.

into our mobiles at any time, how do you feel about that?

:27:30.:27:33.

If it's helping to keep us safe, I think, go ahead.

:27:34.:27:38.

I don't think I'd want Theresa May looking through my selfies.

:27:39.:27:42.

I don't think I'd want Diane Abbott being head of MI5, but, you know,

:27:43.:27:45.

Quick, let's find something else we agree on.

:27:46.:27:55.

I was mortified, the first time I saw the picture of her,

:27:56.:28:05.

have you seen her Russell and Bromley shoes...

:28:06.:28:08.

I nearly wore them today, actually, but they didn't go with my trousers.

:28:09.:28:14.

I love that, you and Theresa May have got the same shoes.

:28:15.:28:18.

Oh, my God, it's worse than that, we've got about four or five

:28:19.:28:21.

I know it's awful for me to say that, but, it's a shame

:28:22.:28:33.

that he is the leader of the Labour Party.

:28:34.:28:35.

I think he was a very good campaigner.

:28:36.:28:37.

It's great for me, as a Tory, I'm loving it, they're

:28:38.:28:44.

getting away with murder, but, you know, in the Commons,

:28:45.:28:55.

the standing party that's in power must be scrutinised and questioned.

:28:56.:28:58.

And I worry Jeremy Corbyn isn't doing that.

:28:59.:29:00.

I think my vote for Labour is for good Labour MPs who deserve this.

:29:01.:29:03.

Have you got any other political heroes, historically?

:29:04.:29:06.

I know, I was looking at your badge, and I thought, rude,

:29:07.:29:13.

It's such a shame that I wasn't around then.

:29:14.:29:19.

See, I take the opposite view of that.

:29:20.:29:21.

I skipped school on the day of her funeral so that I could go.

:29:22.:29:24.

Yeah, I went, yeah, amazing, amazing lady.

:29:25.:29:32.

I'm what's known as non-binary transgender.

:29:33.:29:40.

I was born a woman, and I'm a female, but I went through a phase

:29:41.:29:48.

of taking testosterone to basically make myself more masculine.

:29:49.:29:50.

I'm in a really girly phase at the moment,

:29:51.:29:54.

so it's really hard to, kind of, like, explain.

:29:55.:29:56.

It really is day to day, how you feel?

:29:57.:30:00.

It's been a bit of an odd one when, like, with people and dating

:30:01.:30:08.

because they've started dating, like, a really feminine version

:30:09.:30:11.

of me, and then I wander downstairs one morning with,

:30:12.:30:13.

like, a chest binder on, and, like, a suit and a waistcoat and a tie.

:30:14.:30:17.

Oh, by the way, sometimes I like to dress up as a man.

:30:18.:30:22.

Yeah, yeah, it's fine, it's, like, nine quid, it's fine.

:30:23.:30:29.

And you're not horribly left wing, and I'm not horribly right-wing.

:30:30.:30:41.

But, where we at now, have I moved you along a bit?

:30:42.:30:47.

I've shuffled a bit more to the centre.

:30:48.:30:57.

And actually, I must say, I hate to admit it, maybe

:30:58.:31:01.

you have a little bit, because you said a few

:31:02.:31:03.

things and I thought, wow, I've never thought of that.

:31:04.:31:06.

If we go out again, we might end up somewhere in the centre.

:31:07.:31:09.

Go and see my friends, and they'll be, you've changed.

:31:10.:31:13.

Yeah, they'll be, like, what happened to you?

:31:14.:31:15.

I feel like I'm sending a personal hero of yours.

:31:16.:31:23.

If you could just put your arms over each other.

:31:24.:31:29.

I didn't know what to expect, because I was, like,

:31:30.:31:36.

super, super nervous, and, yeah, I had a nice time.

:31:37.:31:39.

You said a few things that I'm a kind of, hit home a bit,

:31:40.:31:45.

because I hadn't given some of the things you brought

:31:46.:31:48.

So, it's quite thought-provoking for me.

:31:49.:31:50.

Because I think often you can be quite ignorant,

:31:51.:31:53.

politically, I think, and I think I'm guilty of that.

:31:54.:31:55.

I've got friends were quite conservative,

:31:56.:31:56.

They are, like, my Nan and her friends, something like,

:31:57.:32:01.

So, it was quite nice for me to meet a young person

:32:02.:32:06.

When I think about, I don't know, kind of, benefits, I think,

:32:07.:32:12.

bearing in mind what you said, that's really stuck in my head.

:32:13.:32:16.

Do you think you're going to come out hunting

:32:17.:32:18.

I'm not sure I'm ready to go out on horseback.

:32:19.:32:23.

And then go right some awful piece for the Guardian about how terrible

:32:24.:32:31.

I like that, though, I like that about you.

:32:32.:32:36.

You'll never find me on one of those.

:32:37.:32:40.

See, I was going to say, I would take you to volunteer

:32:41.:32:43.

at a food bank, but now you said a march, I'm going to

:32:44.:32:46.

paint you a placard, and we can go out writing.

:32:47.:32:48.

No, over the picket line, with banners, that's just not me.

:32:49.:32:51.

Do you think, would you go for lunch again?

:32:52.:33:02.

It is, will have a Made In Chelsea, lefty spin off, or something?

:33:03.:33:11.

And they are friends, extraordinary! This USA's "Election blind dates is

:33:12.:33:43.

genius is great. A viewer says "She is showing herself up here". Another

:33:44.:33:47.

viewers a survey agree with Jack Munro. Another viewer says I pay

:33:48.:33:58.

around 30 K and still play a lot of tax and National Insurance. I don't

:33:59.:34:02.

think hard work and income are equivalent in this country. Nurses

:34:03.:34:07.

would agree. Your posh guest is so far aloof of reality, this is

:34:08.:34:12.

embarrassing. Another viewer says, much more enlightening breakfast

:34:13.:34:16.

conversation than yesterday with Nigel Farage. That posh girl needs a

:34:17.:34:22.

dose of real life. And tomorrow, strip club owner

:34:23.:34:24.

Peter Stringfellow has lunch with TV historian and vocal feminist

:34:25.:34:27.

Mary Beard...here's a sneak Later in the week we'll bring

:34:28.:34:31.

you dates between Labour MP Jess Phillips and Conservative MP

:34:32.:34:55.

John Whittingdale and Gina Miller who led the Brexit court case

:34:56.:34:58.

against the govt and Godfrey Bloom Still to come, Ian Paterson -

:34:59.:35:01.

the breast surgeon who carried out multiple unnecessary operations -

:35:02.:35:04.

is due to be sentenced today. We'll be talking to some

:35:05.:35:07.

of his victims in a moment. And we'll be discussing the reported

:35:08.:35:11.

rise in abuse and bullying in online A huge car bomb in the Afghan

:35:12.:35:14.

capital Kabul has killed at least 80 The huge explosion happened

:35:15.:35:35.

in the diplomatic quarter of the city near the German embassy

:35:36.:35:39.

during morning rush hour. Last month, the Taliban announced

:35:40.:35:41.

the start of a major spring offensive, saying their main focus

:35:42.:35:44.

would be foreign forces. Police say a dangerous prisoner

:35:45.:35:53.

believed to be armed with a razor blade is on the run after escaping

:35:54.:35:59.

offices in Wiltshire. Michal Kisiel, 30, had been taken to hospital in

:36:00.:36:03.

Salisbury with a head injury before overpowering prison guards. Police

:36:04.:36:06.

are warning the public not to approach him.

:36:07.:36:09.

A 30-year old man has been arrested on suspicion of murder,

:36:10.:36:11.

after the bodies of a woman and two children were discovered

:36:12.:36:14.

The discovery was made by officers investigating reports of a fuel leak

:36:15.:36:18.

Police say they're not looking for anyone else.

:36:19.:36:25.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10:00.

:36:26.:36:28.

We now know he is staying and the decision has been getting a mixed

:36:29.:36:39.

response. We'll be getting reaction from Arsenal fans ahead of an

:36:40.:36:43.

official announcement confirming at least two more years of Arsene

:36:44.:36:47.

Wenger. And how's this for a welcome? The British and Irish Lions

:36:48.:36:52.

have arrived in Auckland for their tour of New Zealand, receiving a

:36:53.:36:57.

traditional Maori welcome. Their first four matches this Saturday.

:36:58.:37:02.

And, he needs their help, Jack Nicklaus has been speaking out about

:37:03.:37:06.

Tiger Woods after the former world number one was arrested on a charge

:37:07.:37:09.

of driving under the influence on Monday. And it was a good start Andy

:37:10.:37:14.

Murray at the French Open yesterday, he faces world number 50 in the

:37:15.:37:20.

second round at Roland Garros tomorrow. Thank you for joining us.

:37:21.:37:28.

A breast surgeon - accused of playing God and carrying

:37:29.:37:30.

out unnecessary operations on patients - is due to be sentenced

:37:31.:37:33.

at Nottingham Crown Court today, for intentionally wounding nine

:37:34.:37:35.

Lawyers say it's possible that hundreds of Ian Paterson's patients

:37:36.:37:39.

could have undergone surgery for no medical reason.

:37:40.:37:48.

Some victims are calling for him to be given the maximum punishment -

:37:49.:37:51.

Over a hundred more women have come forward since April to say he may

:37:52.:37:55.

have exaggerated or invented cancer risks in them.

:37:56.:38:01.

We can talk now to three of those women affected,

:38:02.:38:04.

Bethan Waite and Lynn Rollinson, who're outside the Crown Court

:38:05.:38:06.

in Nottingham, waiting for that sentencing,

:38:07.:38:07.

Sarah Jane Downing is in Birmingham this morning, all three women

:38:08.:38:12.

And in the studio is solicitor, Tom Jones, from Thompson's,

:38:13.:38:15.

the firm who represent the majority of Paterson's victims.

:38:16.:38:18.

Jane, Paterson has been found guilty of 17 counts of wounding with

:38:19.:38:24.

intent. What would be an appropriate sentence for this man? Victoria,

:38:25.:38:31.

it's so difficult. I don't know how we could ever really measure what he

:38:32.:38:37.

did to so many people. And it quite that to a sentence. I think it has

:38:38.:38:40.

to be the maximum but I'm not even sure if that's enough, to be honest.

:38:41.:38:48.

He performed an unnecessary lumpectomy or new, wider you think

:38:49.:38:57.

he did that? I don't know. He knew how terrified I was of the idea of

:38:58.:39:02.

surgery, he knew how I absolutely didn't want to have an operation,

:39:03.:39:07.

and then he spent a lot of time convincing me and terrifying so

:39:08.:39:13.

that, well, I agreed, against my better judgment. He said that if I

:39:14.:39:19.

left it much longer the lump was growing really rapidly. It would be

:39:20.:39:22.

a huge problem. And it would be so much worse to fix and reconstruct if

:39:23.:39:29.

it was about to get much bigger. So, have it done quickly and have a

:39:30.:39:34.

smaller operation, all white and have something much worse. So I felt

:39:35.:39:38.

the only option was to go for the smaller one. Of course. How

:39:39.:39:45.

difficult has it been to try and rationalise the fact you had been

:39:46.:39:51.

put through surgery for no reason? I can't rationalise it. It's too much

:39:52.:39:59.

to be able to process. I've been distracting myself by thinking about

:40:00.:40:03.

the campaign and starting the support group, and trying to do

:40:04.:40:08.

something adjacent, rather than actually address it because I don't

:40:09.:40:13.

know how to address it. Tom James, you represent many of his victims.

:40:14.:40:18.

What do you want to see, what do they want to see when it comes to

:40:19.:40:23.

sentencing today? I think in terms of sentencing it's part of the

:40:24.:40:30.

closure process for those who have had their lives devastated by this

:40:31.:40:34.

man. It's important he is punished in a way that is appropriately

:40:35.:40:38.

dramatic. It isn't a light sentence, that's absolutely right, because

:40:39.:40:42.

hundreds of women and men have been affected by his absolute callousness

:40:43.:40:48.

against them. It is quite unfathomable what he did. What's

:40:49.:40:55.

your view about why he did it? It's difficult to gauge. I wonder whether

:40:56.:40:59.

it was money, he was being paid for these operations privately. Whether

:41:00.:41:03.

it was him being in charge, he was apparently charming but bullying. I

:41:04.:41:07.

think there's a whole host of factors, but whatever it was, he got

:41:08.:41:12.

away with it for a very long period of time. Your firm is launching a

:41:13.:41:17.

campaign called patients before profits, because you claim through

:41:18.:41:22.

this case there is a divide between how NHS patients are treated and

:41:23.:41:25.

private patients are treated. There is a very clear divide. The NHS in

:41:26.:41:32.

these cases, they basically put their hands up, said there was a

:41:33.:41:37.

mistake and suspended him as soon as there were suspicions. They have

:41:38.:41:41.

paid compensation where it is appropriate and those cases are now

:41:42.:41:49.

closed. The private health provider, Spire, simply hasn't done that. We

:41:50.:41:52.

are now in a situation where they say that they rented him a room and

:41:53.:41:56.

have no responsibility and they are not going to pay. We have a

:41:57.:42:04.

situation in which the -- they advertised as being available, they

:42:05.:42:07.

promoted him, the after-care was carried out on those premises and

:42:08.:42:10.

yet they are saying they will not pay out for those people butchered

:42:11.:42:14.

by him. What levels of compensation had been paid out by the NHS? It

:42:15.:42:19.

varies depending on how the women were dealt with. It may be a futile

:42:20.:42:23.

and, it can be potentially tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands.

:42:24.:42:30.

There are women who have died as a result of his failures. The scandal

:42:31.:42:36.

is huge. The issue has to be that the private health care sector has

:42:37.:42:38.

to have the same responsibilities and deal with patients in the same

:42:39.:42:44.

way as the NHS. It is true to say that you've had another 100 patients

:42:45.:42:49.

come forward since his trial began in April. That's right. A lot of

:42:50.:42:54.

people wouldn't necessarily have realised, you are treated by a

:42:55.:42:57.

doctor, you wouldn't necessarily have thought it was him. Then you

:42:58.:43:01.

see his face and you think, he did me. That's why we have people coming

:43:02.:43:07.

forward even today as a result of this. Sarah Jane, I've spoken to a

:43:08.:43:12.

number of patients previously who said they would like to see a public

:43:13.:43:17.

enquiry into how this happened, how it was allowed to go on for so long

:43:18.:43:21.

and affect so many women and men. Would you like to see that?

:43:22.:43:27.

Absolutely. I think it really is necessary to know just exactly who

:43:28.:43:30.

did what and why they turned a blind eye for so long. I think people were

:43:31.:43:37.

probably colluding because they were making a lot of profit. But profit

:43:38.:43:43.

was going to Spire health care. We want to know exactly what was done

:43:44.:43:48.

and how and why. We know some people's bills were padded with

:43:49.:43:51.

things they didn't have a have. There is a lot there to be looked

:43:52.:43:56.

at, I think. How do you feel today as you awake this sentence? Very,

:43:57.:44:03.

very emotionally on edge, very stressed. It's so difficult to know

:44:04.:44:08.

what's going to happen. I'm deeply worried that it won't be anywhere

:44:09.:44:13.

near enough. I deeply worried everyone will be really upset. It's

:44:14.:44:24.

difficult today. I understand. Thank you for talking to us. Thank you

:44:25.:44:30.

very much, Sarah Jane Downing and Tom Jones from Thompsons. That

:44:31.:44:33.

sentencing is at Nottingham Crown Court today and we will bring it to

:44:34.:44:37.

you and BBC News as soon as it happens.

:44:38.:44:38.

Caroline Lucas is next to go for a drive with me in my white van. Hear

:44:39.:44:53.

her talk about drugs, tears and bath before 10:30am. I suppose the Green

:44:54.:45:00.

Party and the broader Green movement, I think we haven't done

:45:01.:45:04.

nearly as well as we needed to do. That is that about 10:15am. Every

:45:05.:45:10.

Wednesday we are looking at how the election is playing out on twitter.

:45:11.:45:15.

Every Wednesday up until the election, we're looking at how

:45:16.:45:17.

it's playing out on Twitter, with data crunchers from think tank,

:45:18.:45:20.

Demos, who've been analysing millions of tweets since

:45:21.:45:22.

Let's talk now to our two chaps from Demos - Josh Smith -

:45:23.:45:26.

he's the techy one - and Carl Miller - he'll look

:45:27.:45:28.

beneath the data to tell us what it all means.

:45:29.:45:31.

We have been interested in opening up the Democratic Abeid, letting

:45:32.:45:43.

people contact politicians who want to represent them. Then we found

:45:44.:45:47.

there is 1400 candidates we have been following on twitter since the

:45:48.:45:51.

campaign started. From conservatives, labour, Lib Dems,

:45:52.:45:56.

Ukip and the SNP. We have been looking at the way they have been

:45:57.:45:59.

tweeting and engaging people, but this potential for people to contact

:46:00.:46:02.

candidates and say I am not sure about this policy, I thought you

:46:03.:46:07.

were really good. To actually talk to people it only works if it is a

:46:08.:46:13.

two-way street. What we are looking at is the candidates from those

:46:14.:46:15.

parties who have been the best at replying to people on the platform,

:46:16.:46:19.

who have got back to people's concerns, and we have a top five of

:46:20.:46:25.

the top candidate from each party who was replying the most. Let's

:46:26.:46:27.

have a look. So Richard Gadsden is the top reply,

:46:28.:47:25.

the number one on the list. That's right, Richard Gadsden, the most

:47:26.:47:30.

prolific reply of all, a Liberal Democrat candidate in Manchester. It

:47:31.:47:32.

was that perhaps one of the reasons he replies so much is that he uses

:47:33.:47:37.

Twitter to talk to his mates. He is outspoken isn't he? Very. We looked

:47:38.:47:46.

at his tweets, if we have a second general election this year, I

:47:47.:47:52.

getting I can stand, will have some sort of a breakdown. This was 11

:47:53.:47:58.

hours ago, this is a tired candidate, is it not? I need a

:47:59.:48:01.

break. I have no clue about anything any more. Exactly, this is Twitter

:48:02.:48:07.

showing as the man behind the candidate, someone who has ran

:48:08.:48:11.

ragged on the campaign trail, is exhausted, nervous, fighting for

:48:12.:48:14.

history of being a politician. It is really showing us something you just

:48:15.:48:21.

wouldn't see in the airbrushed PR releases of the past. And it has

:48:22.:48:25.

definitely not gone through Lib Dem HQ Kamui thing. These are the best

:48:26.:48:31.

at replying on Twitter. Dr Teck Khong from Ukip is interesting. He

:48:32.:48:39.

is a recent defector from the Conservatives. You can see him

:48:40.:48:43.

laying into his former party. What is interesting about the way he

:48:44.:48:47.

engages with people, the replies here sending on twitter, is very

:48:48.:48:52.

much toeing the party line. He sees it as a platform to get the hashtags

:48:53.:48:56.

wants to get out there, to use the official party hashtags, and a lot

:48:57.:49:01.

of his replies are just people saying thank you for the follow,

:49:02.:49:05.

please vote for me. So much more formal. Much less personal. Carl,

:49:06.:49:17.

Will Quince is the top Tory twitter. He does get into arguments on big

:49:18.:49:24.

issues. Will Quince, our top Tory reply. But what really Bill -- Will

:49:25.:49:41.

Quince has been engaging in the rough-and-tumble world of digital

:49:42.:49:44.

politics, a world that is in the sense of poorer and more immediate.

:49:45.:49:50.

It only takes a second to send a tweet. Candidates perhaps tired like

:49:51.:49:56.

Richard Gadsden can also sometimes lose their temper and get stuck into

:49:57.:50:00.

the issues and debates with candidates and members of the

:50:01.:50:02.

public, many of whom disagree with them from all over the country.

:50:03.:50:07.

Next, Jess Phillips from Labour, tell us about her. We have talked a

:50:08.:50:12.

bit about disagreements, one of the interesting things about social

:50:13.:50:17.

media com you get trolled. Especially if you are a public

:50:18.:50:23.

figure. People occasionally lay into you. Jess Phillips is interesting

:50:24.:50:28.

because she responds to those attacks, she tells people to get

:50:29.:50:33.

back under your rock, she is very verbose. We looked at the tweets she

:50:34.:50:37.

was sending that aren't retweets, and seven Dibusz under the tweets

:50:38.:50:39.

she sent herself are actually replies to people. We will see some

:50:40.:50:45.

hopefully. What does this tell us about her? That she is not afraid on

:50:46.:50:52.

social media to show us a side of what her personality is. Looking

:50:53.:50:55.

through her Twitter feed get an idea of what she might be like as a

:50:56.:50:57.

person and that is another really interesting thing that people

:50:58.:51:00.

haven't necessarily been able to do. Let's have a look. Hi Jess, are you

:51:01.:51:06.

able to do anything to project this? OK, you can see her personality

:51:07.:51:34.

coming through, clearly they have not been through Labour HQ. Full VSM

:51:35.:51:40.

PE, John Nicolson is the most engaged. He is interesting because

:51:41.:51:50.

he is the link between social and mainstream media. He often replies

:51:51.:51:56.

to shows that cover politics. He is a candidate chipping in. This is a

:51:57.:51:59.

tweet from your show itself on Monday.

:52:00.:52:12.

This is representing how social and mainstream media is mixing in

:52:13.:52:20.

strange and sometimes mysterious ways to both come together to

:52:21.:52:23.

produce the kind of public debate we are having in the country. So which

:52:24.:52:28.

candidates exist in a social media desert? We looked at people who are

:52:29.:52:35.

tweeting a lot but never replying, never using this ability to directly

:52:36.:52:40.

reach out to people and to respond to things. We had our top guns,

:52:41.:52:44.

these are the five worst candidates. So I think the big difference

:52:45.:53:44.

between the top and bottom five is the top five early understand

:53:45.:53:49.

something about five don't, that social media is a new kind of two

:53:50.:53:53.

-ish treat, a place to listen and a place to talk, as well as a place to

:53:54.:53:57.

broadcast. That is probably a good thing. We did research back in 2015

:53:58.:54:02.

in the height of the last election in the UK. We did a poll of social

:54:03.:54:06.

media users and we found that over 70% of them thought the Democratic

:54:07.:54:13.

debate was being in some way improved by what was happening on

:54:14.:54:16.

social media, they could understand the candidates on the issues and

:54:17.:54:19.

then you better what the party stood for. About half of social media

:54:20.:54:24.

expected and wanted their candidates to be on social media. Replying to

:54:25.:54:30.

candidates and engaging with constituents. That is the big

:54:31.:54:36.

question between the bottom five. Why does it matter if they are all

:54:37.:54:38.

not putting all our war on replying? As Carl said, they are potentially

:54:39.:54:52.

missing an opportunity to engage with people straight into the own

:54:53.:54:56.

timelines to respond to issues being raised. It is about whether politics

:54:57.:55:02.

is a conversation or a pin board. Is it about politician shouting out and

:55:03.:55:05.

trying to frame issues as they want or is this a channel that can be

:55:06.:55:12.

used to wield power better too, for politicians to be a bit too listen

:55:13.:55:16.

more easily and readily to people all over the UK and respond to the

:55:17.:55:20.

issues and concerns we have got? That is the heart of what we are

:55:21.:55:24.

trying to talk about today. You have talked about the abuse some

:55:25.:55:28.

politicians get. A Jeremy Corbyn tweet last night didn't go down too

:55:29.:55:32.

well with plenty of Conservatives. Yes, the reaction to this tweet

:55:33.:55:39.

perhaps explains why people are reticent to put themselves out there

:55:40.:55:43.

on social media, especially if you are in a position like Jeremy

:55:44.:55:51.

Corbyn. Here we have a tweet. The response to this has been really

:55:52.:55:56.

interesting, in that people have replied saying, surely we don't need

:55:57.:56:00.

Jeremy Corbyn in order to further these people's, to unlock these

:56:01.:56:06.

people's talents? So the potential for putting that message out there

:56:07.:56:09.

and it being just laid upon and kind of attack is always there. It is

:56:10.:56:17.

quite a dangerous potentially environment for especially

:56:18.:56:23.

politicians. OK, we are going to show James cleverly's response and

:56:24.:56:28.

some other responses. James cleverly is a Conservative candidate and what

:56:29.:56:32.

he has done is effectively taken photographs of many other black

:56:33.:56:37.

Asian and minority ethnic candidates and said for example here a

:56:38.:56:41.

Conservative MP and a conservative assembly member waiting for our

:56:42.:56:45.

potential to be unlocked by Jeremy Corbyn. All of these are obviously

:56:46.:56:50.

sarcastic. Shaun Bailey, another candidate potentially. Said Kemal,

:56:51.:56:56.

leader of the Conservatives reformist group. And so it goes on.

:56:57.:57:02.

Gentlemen, thank you very much. You are

:57:03.:57:06.

Jeremy Corbyn has been claiming the future of the NHS and England's

:57:07.:57:13.

schools are at stake in this election. Let's talk to Norman

:57:14.:57:20.

Smith. Mr Corbyn actually looking pretty relaxed this morning as he

:57:21.:57:23.

was setting up what he claims are the risks patients and the elderly

:57:24.:57:29.

will face from another five years of Conservative government. They have

:57:30.:57:32.

produced this dossier here which they think details the fact that

:57:33.:57:37.

something like 1.5 million people will be waiting for care if the

:57:38.:57:43.

Tories win, and there will be 1.8 million people more waiting for

:57:44.:57:47.

hospital treatments, and something like 650,000 schoolchildren in

:57:48.:57:51.

classes over 30 or so. Labour by contrast, he says, would plough 37

:57:52.:57:56.

billion into the NHS, 8 billion into social care, and really you sense it

:57:57.:58:01.

is trying to crank this election back on the Mr Corbyn's favoured

:58:02.:58:06.

territory, which of course is public services. Labour will invest in our

:58:07.:58:13.

people, schools and hospitals. We will cut school class sizes, not

:58:14.:58:18.

schools. Take a million people off the National Health Service waiting

:58:19.:58:22.

list, not add millions more. Ensure that people get the care they

:58:23.:58:28.

deserve, and guarantee the dedicated staff a pay rise. Another five years

:58:29.:58:33.

of the Conservatives would be disastrous for our public services.

:58:34.:58:39.

If they carry on, as they are now, then by 2022 there could be 5.5

:58:40.:58:44.

million people on the NHS England waiting lists. 1.5 million older

:58:45.:58:53.

people with unmet care needs. 650,000 people crammed into primary

:58:54.:58:59.

school classes of over 30. Families left almost ?450 worse off per child

:59:00.:59:05.

as a result of the Tories's plan to scrap free school meals to 1.7

:59:06.:59:13.

million of our children. One of the tricks in an election is to talk

:59:14.:59:16.

about what you want to talk about but not necessarily what the media

:59:17.:59:20.

want you to talk about. I guess a lot of us this morning wanted to

:59:21.:59:24.

press Mr Corbyn about that leak of the discussion paper, which was put

:59:25.:59:28.

for Mr Corbyn, setting out some proposals on immigration, and one of

:59:29.:59:32.

them was this idea of allowing unskilled workers in from outside

:59:33.:59:36.

the EU. Now that is currently blocked, the so-called Tier three

:59:37.:59:40.

access is blocked, but this is cash and paper was apparently put before

:59:41.:59:45.

Mr Corbyn. Team Corbyn say it is not part of their policy but they

:59:46.:59:49.

wouldn't really engage with what were their policies this afternoon.

:59:50.:59:53.

In contrast, Theresa May, of course, when she was pressed about this

:59:54.:59:56.

leaked document was more than happy to talk about it. Just listen. From

:59:57.:00:01.

day one as Prime Minister, I'd been clear that I want to ensure we are

:00:02.:00:04.

supporting and looking after British people, and if we look at people who

:00:05.:00:08.

are living in the European Union, I'm clear that I want to see an

:00:09.:00:11.

agreement where their rights are protected. Of course it's reciprocal

:00:12.:00:16.

for EU citizens living here in the UK. That's why it's so important. We

:00:17.:00:21.

haven't just given those rights to EU citizens here in the UK, we are

:00:22.:00:26.

looking after UK citizens living in the European Union. I want to see

:00:27.:00:30.

reciprocal arrangements so we can look after them. As British Prime

:00:31.:00:35.

Minister I have a care for British people living in the EU. It is a

:00:36.:00:41.

funny thing, we are now immigration is a massive issue but trying to get

:00:42.:00:44.

detailed answers from either of the main parties about what they will

:00:45.:00:49.

draft a freedom of movement has ended is proving a hopeless cause.

:00:50.:00:53.

But I want to be seen to spell out the details, even though it is such

:00:54.:00:54.

a huge election issue. Now the latest weather. I know you

:00:55.:01:04.

are fascinated by my domestic heating arrangements, I am in limbo

:01:05.:01:10.

at the moment, what's going on? Keep your heating off just now because

:01:11.:01:16.

temperatures are rising. These are the current temperatures we have.

:01:17.:01:21.

Look at that already, in London it is 17. Temperatures set to rise over

:01:22.:01:25.

the next few days and we will see a fair bit of sunshine. This Weather

:01:26.:01:31.

Watchers picture is from King frankly. -- Kings Langley. The

:01:32.:01:38.

forecast for today is a bit of a mixture. Mostly dry with one or two

:01:39.:01:46.

showers and some sunny spells. This morning we have just that, a real

:01:47.:01:50.

variety of weather. In the south we've got this cloud and also some

:01:51.:01:54.

sea fog in the English Channel and the Irish Sea. We've got the cloud

:01:55.:01:58.

melting away across Northern Ireland and Scotland. A fair bit of sunshine

:01:59.:02:02.

here as we go through the course of the day. If you are out of the

:02:03.:02:08.

breeze it will feel quite pleasant. We'll see some brighter breaks in

:02:09.:02:11.

the cloud and we will see showers from mid Wales down towards South

:02:12.:02:21.

Kent. Some of that sea fog that is in the Irish Sea may lap onshore in

:02:22.:02:32.

the far south-west of Scotland. It will not make a lots of inland

:02:33.:02:37.

penetration. Still some cloud around with the odd shower. Sunny spells

:02:38.:02:42.

across south-west England. Temperatures are beginning to climb

:02:43.:02:46.

into the high teens. As we drift through Gloucestershire, if you

:02:47.:02:51.

showers in the Midlands towards Kent. It will be cloudy at times but

:02:52.:02:54.

will break and we will see some sunny spells or at worst, some

:02:55.:03:03.

sunshine. Highs of 23-25. Somewhere like Glasgow could hit 19-20.

:03:04.:03:08.

Through this evening and overnight will see cloud across Scotland,

:03:09.:03:12.

northern England, Northern Ireland. It won't be such a chilly start to

:03:13.:03:17.

the day. Fog in the English Channel moving in sure. Fog patches forming.

:03:18.:03:22.

Then another weather front coming in from the West. That will drift

:03:23.:03:26.

slowly south east accompanied by gusty winds. The heaviest rain will

:03:27.:03:30.

be on the hills. At lower levels it's more likely to be drizzly in

:03:31.:03:34.

nature but the cloud will build ahead of it. For England and Wales

:03:35.:03:39.

we are at sunny skies and dry conditions. Temperatures tomorrow

:03:40.:03:45.

could hit 26 in the south-east but we have fresher conditions coming

:03:46.:03:54.

into the Northwest. Ahead of it quite a muggy feel and with so much

:03:55.:03:59.

energy in the atmosphere we could see one or two thunderstorms

:04:00.:04:02.

developing. Especially in the south-east and East Anglia. Behind

:04:03.:04:06.

that, back to bright spells, sunshine and showers.

:04:07.:04:12.

Hello, it's 10:00am, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

:04:13.:04:14.

Ian Paterson - the breast surgeon who carried out multiple

:04:15.:04:17.

unnecessary operations - will be sentenced later today.

:04:18.:04:21.

He knew how terrified I was of the idea of surgery. He knew how I

:04:22.:04:29.

absolutely didn't want to have an operation. Then he spent a lot of

:04:30.:04:35.

time convincing me and terrifying me, so that I agreed, against my

:04:36.:04:43.

better judgment. A new report finds that half of all online gamers are

:04:44.:04:47.

believed. -- bullied. Well be talking to a victim

:04:48.:05:00.

of online gaming abuse in a moment. We'll hear from Caroline

:05:01.:05:03.

Lucas just after 10:30. What do you think sets you apart

:05:04.:05:10.

from other middle-class, privately educated MPs in their 50s? LAUGHTER

:05:11.:05:20.

That's a very good question! We will hear from Caroline Lucas at around

:05:21.:05:27.

10:15am. Good morning. Now the latest news with Joanna.

:05:28.:05:31.

A huge car bomb in the Afghan capital Kabul has killed at least 80

:05:32.:05:35.

The huge explosion happened in the diplomatic quarter

:05:36.:05:38.

of the city near the French embassy during morning rush hour.

:05:39.:05:40.

It's unclear who carried out the attack.

:05:41.:05:42.

In a statement, the Taliban denied involvement.

:05:43.:05:50.

People tell me they haven't seen anything like this in many years.

:05:51.:06:08.

As you can see, all the windows and some doors are shattered.

:06:09.:06:12.

Nobody has yet taken responsibility for the attack.

:06:13.:06:16.

But in spite of several demands from the international community,

:06:17.:06:18.

the insurgents and the Taliban have not said "yes" to stop violence

:06:19.:06:23.

Police say a "dangerous" prisoner, believed to be armed with a razor

:06:24.:06:33.

blade, is on the run after escaping officers in Wiltshire.

:06:34.:06:36.

Michael Kisiel, who's 30, had been taken to hospital

:06:37.:06:38.

in Salisbury with a head injury before overpowering prison

:06:39.:06:40.

Police are warning the public not to approach him.

:06:41.:06:54.

Tens of thousands of expat pensioners may return to the UK

:06:55.:06:57.

to use the NHS after Brexit - unless a deal can be done to let

:06:58.:07:00.

them keep receiving care abroad, a health charity has warned.

:07:01.:07:03.

The Nuffield Trust estimates the cost of treating them on home

:07:04.:07:05.

soil, rather than abroad - could double to ?1 billion pounds.

:07:06.:07:08.

At the moment, the UK gives around 500 million a year to EU

:07:09.:07:11.

countries that care for Brits who have retired overseas.

:07:12.:07:24.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10:30.

:07:25.:07:32.

We will be talking about bullying and a report that suggests more than

:07:33.:07:40.

half of online gamers are bullied. It's unbelievable.

:07:41.:07:43.

Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

:07:44.:07:45.

use the hashtag #VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

:07:46.:07:48.

Good morning. We are still waiting for this to be rubber-stamped by the

:07:49.:07:54.

board today. We heard yesterday that Arsene Wenger will be staying put as

:07:55.:07:59.

manager of Arsenal for another two years. He's received a lot of

:08:00.:08:02.

criticism throughout the season, so what do fans make of the decision?

:08:03.:08:08.

Let's speak to an Arsenal supporter and vlogger. What was your initial

:08:09.:08:18.

reaction when you heard yesterday? Not a surprise. I think it's been

:08:19.:08:22.

the worst kept secret that he was going to sign a new deal. Not a

:08:23.:08:29.

surprise, just wondering to myself why it's taken so long and has been

:08:30.:08:34.

so drawn out, for them to announce it now. Not a surprise. We had seen

:08:35.:08:40.

the banners, we've heard all the criticism. I think even Arsene

:08:41.:08:44.

Wenger himself had been quite surprised by how much criticism it's

:08:45.:08:50.

received -- he has received throughout the season. Did he

:08:51.:08:57.

deserve it? INAUDIBLE The performances this season in the

:08:58.:09:00.

Premier League and in the Champions League were, to be quite frank, very

:09:01.:09:06.

poor. In the Premier League we lost nine games, we finished way off

:09:07.:09:11.

Chelsea, and out of the top four, didn't make the Champions League. In

:09:12.:09:18.

the Champions League itself, we suffered two humiliating defeats to

:09:19.:09:23.

Bayern Munich 5-1. The team we were told we were moving to the Emirates

:09:24.:09:27.

Stadium to become the new Bayern Munich. We realised how far away and

:09:28.:09:32.

how far off we were. I think, compounded on that, the fact there

:09:33.:09:37.

was no announcement, nothing was said, every time the club was asked

:09:38.:09:43.

about what was happening, so I think people who wanted him out so it has

:09:44.:09:48.

an opportunity to really do a lot of protests and lots of banners, and

:09:49.:09:54.

trying to put as much pressure on as possible to try and get him to

:09:55.:09:58.

leave. I think the indecisiveness and performances have all led to the

:09:59.:10:04.

criticisms and have made it worse. Those fans aren't going anywhere,

:10:05.:10:07.

there is still a level of anger, they aren't going to change their

:10:08.:10:14.

minds, are they? Results change minds. Even at the weekend, the

:10:15.:10:21.

victory over Chelsea in the FA Cup, I wouldn't say it's changed people's

:10:22.:10:25.

minds. But it makes people feel a bit better about the club. There

:10:26.:10:30.

were fans who were very pleased with the performance, not just the fact

:10:31.:10:33.

we beat Chelsea but the manner of how we did it. If the season gets

:10:34.:10:40.

underway and we are putting in good performances and playing good

:10:41.:10:46.

football, you know, the fans will warm to that. However, the problem

:10:47.:10:51.

is is that those fans won't go away. If on the other hand you have three

:10:52.:10:55.

bad performances and bad losses, the banners and things like that might

:10:56.:11:00.

come back out again. But, for me, is the big fear for next season. Thank

:11:01.:11:09.

you. The British and Irish Lions squad have arrived in New Zealand

:11:10.:11:13.

for their tour which takes in three Test matches. The first matches this

:11:14.:11:18.

Saturday. How is this for a welcome? The Lions were treated to a

:11:19.:11:24.

traditional Maori welcome at Auckland airport. The squad

:11:25.:11:28.

responded by singing a Welsh hymn. Apparently they were practising for

:11:29.:11:58.

weeks! That's all the sport for now, the latest in the next half an hour.

:11:59.:12:03.

Thank you for your many, many comments about election on blind

:12:04.:12:07.

dates. Broadly speaking most of you absolutely love it. "That Was so

:12:08.:12:14.

good, we have totally different political views and we have been

:12:15.:12:20.

friends for over 20 years". "Big Up for showing people can calmly and

:12:21.:12:24.

politely debate with the other side". "Exceptional Blind dates

:12:25.:12:29.

today, a stroke of genius". "This Is genius, opposing views being shown

:12:30.:12:38.

respectfully and light-heartedly". "I Quite enjoyed this edition of

:12:39.:12:46.

election blind dates, that is how to do civil political discussion". "

:12:47.:12:53.

Brave to do the programme and you fought the blue corner well". "This

:12:54.:12:58.

Is winding me up, I don't need this so early in the morning! " "It Shows

:12:59.:13:04.

we have more in common than divides us, please keep this going after the

:13:05.:13:09.

election!" OK, we'll try! Almost three quarters of young

:13:10.:13:14.

people say they've been trolled while playing an online game and one

:13:15.:13:16.

in two say they've either been bullied, sent hate messages

:13:17.:13:19.

or threats by other online gamers. The figures have been described

:13:20.:13:24.

as "shocking" by anti bullying charity Ditch The Label,

:13:25.:13:27.

here's our reporter Chi Chi Izhundu. Young people are being bullied

:13:28.:13:32.

online and it is in a place where they should be having fun

:13:33.:13:35.

and engaging in different conversations with people

:13:36.:13:37.

from all around the world. To explain exactly how

:13:38.:13:39.

and what it is, let's leave Broadcasting House

:13:40.:13:46.

for just a minute. Here we are on the edge

:13:47.:13:48.

of our virtual city. It is places like this that exist

:13:49.:13:51.

on online video games. In gaming, other users

:13:52.:13:55.

can access this space, but it is also the place

:13:56.:13:57.

where bullying and abuse can happen. This abuse is coming from another

:13:58.:14:01.

gamer, and they can be absolutely Because they are hiding behind

:14:02.:14:04.

the screen, they can say Luckily, here in my virtual world,

:14:05.:14:14.

I can get rid of them. But for a lot of people,

:14:15.:14:23.

that is just not possible. A new report shows the scale

:14:24.:14:26.

of bullying young people face when it comes to online gaming

:14:27.:14:28.

and how widespread it is. The charity Ditch The Label spoke

:14:29.:14:32.

to 2,500 people aged between 12 and 26 and found they were regularly

:14:33.:14:36.

subjected to hate The report also found the problem

:14:37.:14:38.

is exacerbated because a lot of the virtual games are based

:14:39.:14:44.

on high levels of They also found that seven out

:14:45.:14:46.

of ten young people say online-gaming bullying is an issue

:14:47.:14:53.

that needs to be taken more seriously, and they want

:14:54.:14:55.

more human moderators. The charity's aim is to bring

:14:56.:14:59.

the gaming community together to stop malicious trolling

:15:00.:15:01.

and bullying online. Let's talk to Daniel Moran,

:15:02.:15:07.

who's 16 and received homophobic Zane Morris, a gamer who has

:15:08.:15:10.

received racial abuse. Liam Hackett, CEO of charity Ditch

:15:11.:15:14.

the Label who published this report. Also Aofie Wilson, a gaming

:15:15.:15:16.

journalist for Eurogamer. Thank you for coming on the

:15:17.:15:26.

programme. Tell us about the kind of abuse you've received. I'm 23 now

:15:27.:15:34.

but this happened when I was 15, 16, that age range. I was playing online

:15:35.:15:40.

competitively. Great environment to meet new people, have conversations.

:15:41.:15:44.

But in one particular case I started to receive racial slurs. I had my

:15:45.:15:53.

social media in my description. They didn't really bother me as such.

:15:54.:15:57.

Then I started to receive torrents of e-mail saying that my account had

:15:58.:16:02.

been reported for spam and for abuse and eventually my account got close

:16:03.:16:04.

down and there was nothing I could do about it. Now, as someone who has

:16:05.:16:10.

been a game of all my life, this obviously annoyed me but I had other

:16:11.:16:13.

options, I could go out and play with my band, be with friends, there

:16:14.:16:18.

were so many other opportunities. I worry for my nieces and nephews now,

:16:19.:16:23.

the roles have switched, they are now whether you're watching the

:16:24.:16:29.

cultural differences, gaming has exploded. Nowadays there is a lot

:16:30.:16:33.

more casual gamers, people who wouldn't normally get involved and

:16:34.:16:39.

now they are. I just really hope that the internet can stay safe with

:16:40.:16:43.

them as well because they are the most impressionable, the people that

:16:44.:16:46.

take the swear words and the racial slurs they hear on their headsets

:16:47.:16:50.

and go forth and said. As adults we are less at risk but it is a worry.

:16:51.:16:57.

Leon, as Zane says, it has exploded, so in that sense it is a microcosm

:16:58.:17:01.

representative society. The more some people get involved, the more

:17:02.:17:09.

abuse there will be, do we have to accept it? No. We see bullying as a

:17:10.:17:13.

societal behaviour, it is a behaviour. We know that they usually

:17:14.:17:21.

are experiencing stressful and traumatic experiences. In this

:17:22.:17:24.

research we found that one in five had admitted to bullying somebody in

:17:25.:17:28.

the game, and we had a lot of kids telling us that if they were being

:17:29.:17:34.

bullying Orton pollute themselves or they were going something -- they

:17:35.:17:42.

were being bullied themselves. We absolutely should not accept this.

:17:43.:17:46.

This is a cultural thing. Gamers were telling us that this is normal

:17:47.:17:49.

behaviour, they would go into games at expect to be treated this way.

:17:50.:17:54.

Look at uniting this way. The unfortunate thing of this research

:17:55.:17:57.

is that it is completely unsurprising to be. Yes, a lot of

:17:58.:18:02.

people will look at this and say it is not bullying, it is just the way

:18:03.:18:07.

it is. I think it is a cultural issue in gaming. Unfortunately it is

:18:08.:18:12.

a very vocal minority, the majority of experience in my gaming has been

:18:13.:18:15.

overwhelmingly positive but there is more we can do to make sure young

:18:16.:18:19.

people especially aren't being desensitised to this kind of

:18:20.:18:23.

language. It has very real impacts, kids were telling us it was making

:18:24.:18:26.

them feel depressed, giving them anxiety, and we never people who are

:18:27.:18:30.

being bullied off-line are more likely to play games to escape it,

:18:31.:18:36.

and then if they are being abused on that as well it amplifies the

:18:37.:18:41.

impact. Can I ask you what you think of this research from Liam's charity

:18:42.:18:45.

that people who are doing the bullying online are often not always

:18:46.:18:48.

being bullied themselves, do you buy that? I do. I haven't necessarily

:18:49.:18:54.

thought about it with such depth as I am now, but me personally, I grew

:18:55.:19:00.

up with my mum working long hours. For myself, gaming as an escape, not

:19:01.:19:05.

escaping bullying but it was a way I could entertain myself and to myself

:19:06.:19:09.

engaged for those hours. I also know I had friends who went through

:19:10.:19:13.

similar things but they were not being bullied. We have grown out of

:19:14.:19:21.

it. But without doubt sometimes you don't have anywhere else to put it.

:19:22.:19:25.

These people don't have anywhere else to go out. There is definitely

:19:26.:19:30.

a worry online. From my experience, a fairly visible person within the

:19:31.:19:37.

gaming industry and my pocket of the gaming industry, so I find that the

:19:38.:19:40.

challenging and engaging these people often you will find that they

:19:41.:19:45.

don't really think that far ahead. And if they see their words are

:19:46.:19:49.

having an impact, actually they will think more about it. What abuse have

:19:50.:19:54.

you experienced doing your job? Explain your job. Iamb eight games

:19:55.:19:59.

journalist but I am also quite visible on YouTube and I write a lot

:20:00.:20:03.

of articles about gaming, hopefully celebrating games for the most part.

:20:04.:20:09.

But people think that gamers look a certain way, I'm very aware I don't

:20:10.:20:13.

fit that mould. As a woman, sometimes people think that you

:20:14.:20:20.

don't quite belong there. So you get some misogynistic abuse but I

:20:21.:20:24.

personally find it quite easy to let that slide. But I am very aware that

:20:25.:20:30.

I want to make it clear to young women that they don't have to pick

:20:31.:20:34.

it up with that. My best tools for dealing with trawls is humour for

:20:35.:20:42.

one, but also disinterest will completely disarmed them as well. So

:20:43.:20:48.

don't respond? Don't respond, or if they know they are getting the year

:20:49.:20:52.

that is a win in their book. If I am ever playing over and watch and I

:20:53.:20:57.

say, "No one cares, broken". That will shut them up. Here is a tweet,

:20:58.:21:04.

anyone who has played Fifa online has been abused by some uppity

:21:05.:21:08.

American five-year road. With all due respect, it is not news. That

:21:09.:21:12.

someone who thinks it happening. This one says I am amused by the

:21:13.:21:17.

lack of comments from the gaming companies who irresponsibly design

:21:18.:21:19.

systems to allow online communication to take place during

:21:20.:21:24.

gaming with zero monitoring. We are getting better at that actually. I

:21:25.:21:31.

mentioned Over watch, an online game I play a lot, and Blizzard have done

:21:32.:21:35.

a lot to tackle negative communities and environment springing up. That

:21:36.:21:44.

is one way to curb IM better venue, the competitiveness that comes out,

:21:45.:21:50.

but also they added a tool not long back that turned a derogatory

:21:51.:21:53.

message into something completely different. Which people can find

:21:54.:21:59.

ways around that but it means they are taking a stance on that

:22:00.:22:03.

language. It is such an interesting discussion because of course the

:22:04.:22:07.

games titles are a huge stakeholder in this and they have a jerky of

:22:08.:22:10.

care to their users but what we are looking at is how users are -- a

:22:11.:22:20.

duty of care. But if you say children who play 18 rated games, it

:22:21.:22:25.

is their parents's responsibility on whether there child can handle

:22:26.:22:28.

certain types of content and bullying. And that most online games

:22:29.:22:33.

are competitive in nature. When that is the environment, there will be

:22:34.:22:39.

trash talk. On that topic, there has technically been a huge shift in

:22:40.:22:42.

gaming culture towards competitive gaming. There was a lot more focus

:22:43.:22:45.

on cooperative gameplay, which I have a lot of memories playing with

:22:46.:22:50.

my brother. The whole split screen side of thing is gone, everyone

:22:51.:22:57.

against each other. Now you have almost a football type mob behaviour

:22:58.:23:01.

where you have the key stars saying swear words. Tribal behaviour, in a

:23:02.:23:10.

way. This e-mail from Brian says Victoria, I have a 13-year-old son,

:23:11.:23:15.

an online gamer, a Facebook user, I have a feeling he is experiencing

:23:16.:23:18.

some kind of bullying and peer pressure but he puts on a front that

:23:19.:23:22.

everything is OK. I wish he would talk about it and not get angry or

:23:23.:23:26.

keep it in. I dislike this new technology generation, it is

:23:27.:23:32.

changing society. I always say it is so important for parents and

:23:33.:23:35.

guardians to have fully open and honest relations with their

:23:36.:23:39.

children. But this online life is very real. It is important to talk

:23:40.:23:42.

about are just as you would off-line, talk about it around the

:23:43.:23:46.

dinner table, ask what they are doing online, what they enjoy about

:23:47.:23:50.

the internet but also we have the largest online support hub for

:23:51.:23:53.

anyone experiencing bullying. They can speak to one of our mentors

:23:54.:23:57.

anonymously and get advice and support. That is a resource for

:23:58.:24:01.

anyone impacted by these issues. There are games getting better at

:24:02.:24:08.

providing resources. Life is strange, when it dealt with stories

:24:09.:24:12.

of suicide and bullying, at the end of the game it actually provided

:24:13.:24:17.

websites the kids to check out. So I think games are aware now of the

:24:18.:24:21.

reach they have, and also the difficulty is that a lot of their

:24:22.:24:25.

players have. Though Di Stefano list rent in the message of telling kids

:24:26.:24:30.

that if they are being bullied it is because the person they are

:24:31.:24:33.

bullying, their dad could be beating up their mum, then and could have

:24:34.:24:36.

passed away come you don't know what is going on in that young person's

:24:37.:24:42.

life. The result is a root cause. I am not sure there is always a root

:24:43.:24:48.

cause. No we have the data that says it is. OK. Some of it is so casual

:24:49.:24:52.

though, that they don't even seem to know they are doing it. These nice

:24:53.:24:57.

middle-class kids with nothing to complain about being vile online. It

:24:58.:25:04.

is the anonymity that allows people to say anything they like. You get

:25:05.:25:10.

some taunts meant in jest. I am not saying people who are doing that I

:25:11.:25:13.

going through something difficult by people who are obsessively

:25:14.:25:15.

perpetrating these behaviours, to the extent where it is unhealthy,

:25:16.:25:20.

there is a lazy root cause. Thank you very much for a really

:25:21.:25:26.

interesting discussion, let's hope it -- there was always a root cause.

:25:27.:25:30.

Wiltshire Police say they are looking for a dangerous prisoner

:25:31.:25:36.

believed to be armed with a razor blades. Let's talk to our

:25:37.:25:40.

correspondent, Andy Moore. The latest information is that the

:25:41.:25:43.

police perhaps think this was preplanned? We have just had an

:25:44.:25:48.

updated press release from the police, and they are saying this may

:25:49.:25:53.

have been preplanned, and he may have had assistance. So the more we

:25:54.:25:56.

hear about this, the more serious the case becomes. We heard last

:25:57.:26:00.

night he had escaped from hospital about 7pm last night. At the time,

:26:01.:26:05.

we were told that he had given his guards the slip. Now we have heard

:26:06.:26:08.

in fact that he overpowered his guards. Two guards was it? I am not

:26:09.:26:14.

sure, but he overpowered his guards and made his escape. He was taken to

:26:15.:26:18.

hospital for a head wound sustained somehow or other in his cell. So

:26:19.:26:30.

there is now the possibility that the head wound was deliberately

:26:31.:26:32.

inflicted in some way so he could get the hospital, and then perhaps

:26:33.:26:34.

with some sort of assistance escape. We are now hearing more about his

:26:35.:26:37.

background. The police and the Ministry of Justice won't comment at

:26:38.:26:40.

all on his background. But in fact he was jailed for five years last

:26:41.:26:44.

year in Luton for a terrible attack on a mother and her daughter. He

:26:45.:26:50.

actually tied up both victims for eight hours, and he threatened to

:26:51.:26:55.

kill the mother, holding a large knife to her throat. And we now know

:26:56.:27:02.

that he has a blade of some sort with him as he is on the loose, and

:27:03.:27:05.

police say he is dangerous, and there is a very large operation

:27:06.:27:10.

underway to find him. We have been showing images of him but give us

:27:11.:27:13.

the description and what the advice to members of the public is if they

:27:14.:27:19.

think they spot. He is white, five tall with blonde hair, originally

:27:20.:27:24.

from Poland. Of medium build with very distinctive tattoos on his

:27:25.:27:27.

neck. He was wearing grey tracksuit items and the black T-shirt with

:27:28.:27:32.

blue trainers. He didn't have any idea on him or any money, but if he

:27:33.:27:36.

has assistance of course, that may not be such a big problem. The

:27:37.:27:42.

advice from the police is not to approach, just call immediately.

:27:43.:27:50.

Thank you very much. Next to Kabul, let's get the latest on that car

:27:51.:27:57.

bomb that has exploded in the diplomatic quarter, killing at least

:27:58.:28:03.

80 people and wounding 300 others. Our correspondence from the BBC

:28:04.:28:06.

Afghan service, tell us what you know at this stage. The latest is

:28:07.:28:11.

that we now no that about 80 people have been killed and 350 are

:28:12.:28:20.

injured. Four of our staff have also had minor injuries, and

:28:21.:28:25.

unfortunately we lost one of our support staff, who was a driver. Oh

:28:26.:28:30.

my goodness, I didn't realise that, as well. What do we know about who

:28:31.:28:40.

might be behind this car bomb? The Afghan president, he has been asking

:28:41.:28:43.

that in the month of Ramadan there should not be explosions, let's stop

:28:44.:28:49.

violence but nobody responded to that, insurgent group. This

:28:50.:28:55.

particular attack will be difficult for the insurgents to take

:28:56.:29:00.

responsibility because of the level of civilian casualties. This is

:29:01.:29:09.

normally the case when civilian casualties are high. Insurgent

:29:10.:29:14.

groups don't take responsibility for it. If it is the security forces

:29:15.:29:24.

casualties are high, then the response is instant. Apart from

:29:25.:29:29.

spreading terror, what is it that the insurgents want, ultimately? At

:29:30.:29:36.

the end of 2017, they announce that this year at least, the Taliban at

:29:37.:29:40.

least, announced they will be targeting foreign troops and

:29:41.:29:46.

pressurising the Afghan government. So I guess it is that operation,

:29:47.:29:51.

that think they are carrying on. They want foreign soldiers out of

:29:52.:29:55.

the country? That's right, and we see evidence from that at the start

:29:56.:29:59.

of this year, we have had one incident like this almost every

:30:00.:30:02.

month. Thank you very much, thank you. It is half past ten, let's

:30:03.:30:06.

bring you the latest news. A huge car bomb in Kabul has

:30:07.:30:18.

happened in the diplomatic quarter of the city near the French Embassy

:30:19.:30:22.

in morning rush-hour. It's unclear who carried out the attack. In a

:30:23.:30:27.

statement, the Taliban in tick-macro denied involvement. Police say a

:30:28.:30:31.

prisoner on the run may have had assistance in a preplanned escape.

:30:32.:30:40.

Michal Kiesel had been taken to hospital before overpowering prison

:30:41.:30:44.

guards yesterday evening. Police are warning the public not to approach.

:30:45.:30:48.

Tens of thousands of pensioners in the EU may return to the UK to use

:30:49.:30:52.

the NHS after Brexit, unless a deal can be done to let keep receiving

:30:53.:30:56.

care abroad. The Nuffield Trust estimates the cost of treating them

:30:57.:31:02.

on home soil could double to ?1 billion. At the moment the UK gives

:31:03.:31:08.

around ?500 million a year to EU countries that care for British

:31:09.:31:12.

pensioners. A 30-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of murder

:31:13.:31:15.

after the bodies of a woman and two children were discovered in a flat

:31:16.:31:20.

in Liverpool. The discovery was made by officers investigating reports of

:31:21.:31:23.

a fuel leak in Toxteth. Police say they aren't looking for anyone else.

:31:24.:31:28.

That's a summary of the latest news, join me for BBC Newsroom

:31:29.:31:31.

Good morning. We now know he's staying put, a decision that has

:31:32.:31:44.

divided opinion among Arsenal fans. We are expecting an official

:31:45.:31:48.

announcement from the club in the next half an hour confirming that

:31:49.:31:51.

Arsene Wenger will remain at Arsenal for another two years. How's this

:31:52.:31:58.

for a welcome? The British and Irish Lions have arrived in Auckland,

:31:59.:32:01.

receiving a traditional Maori welcome. They will play three tests

:32:02.:32:06.

against the all Blacks, their first four matches on Saturday. He needs

:32:07.:32:11.

our help, Jack Nicklaus has spoken out about his friend Tiger Woods

:32:12.:32:13.

after the former world number one was arrested on a charge of driving

:32:14.:32:18.

under the influence on Monday. It's been a good start for Andy Murray at

:32:19.:32:23.

the French Open, he faces world number 50 Martin Klizan in the

:32:24.:32:26.

second round at Roland Garros tomorrow. I'll have all that and

:32:27.:32:28.

more in the next half an hour. This morning the joint leader

:32:29.:32:35.

of the Green Party tells this programme she'll cry if the Greens

:32:36.:32:37.

only return one MP after next In a wide ranging interview

:32:38.:32:40.

Caroline Lucas also tells us why she believes some drugs should be

:32:41.:32:44.

legalised and prostitution She joined me in an electric

:32:45.:32:46.

white van for part of our van share series -

:32:47.:32:49.

with different politicians from some In this interview -

:32:50.:32:52.

which was recorded before the manchester terror attacks -

:32:53.:32:56.

she also says talks should happen with so-called Islamic State,

:32:57.:33:01.

but she's not naive enough to think IS will send a representative

:33:02.:33:03.

to any talks. Let's start by talking

:33:04.:33:25.

about your manifesto. You want to scrap

:33:26.:33:29.

university tuition fees. And you want to write off

:33:30.:33:34.

all existing student debt. We think it is wrong that young

:33:35.:33:39.

people get saddled with this huge amount of debt as they are starting

:33:40.:33:42.

in their working lives, and also that we think education

:33:43.:33:46.

should be a public good, Our guarantee about tuition fees

:33:47.:33:49.

would cost between 8 billion, according to the IFS,

:33:50.:33:59.

or 11 billion, according to other aspirational estimates

:34:00.:34:02.

that have been done. We would not be spending money,

:34:03.:34:05.

for example, on Trident nuclear weapons, HS2,

:34:06.:34:11.

the Hinckley nuclear-power station. We would say that people

:34:12.:34:16.

with the broadest shoulders Why do you want to use the taxes

:34:17.:34:18.

from low-income families to pay the tuition fees of wealthy

:34:19.:34:23.

students, and ultimately to pay off We would not be addressing

:34:24.:34:27.

our tax rises to people We have policies like the universal

:34:28.:34:33.

basic income that would help people on the lowest incomes

:34:34.:34:38.

and on no income. We say that we want a country

:34:39.:34:43.

where we can afford good public services for everybody,

:34:44.:34:47.

and those are the political We the fifth-biggest

:34:48.:34:50.

economy in the world, and so it is up to us how

:34:51.:34:55.

we make those choices. You are happy to pay the tuition

:34:56.:34:58.

fees of wealthier students If they are wealthy, they will pay

:34:59.:35:01.

more into the tax system ultimately. Yes, because they will pay

:35:02.:35:06.

more ultimately through You want to give a citizens'

:35:07.:35:11.

income to everybody. I am not sure you

:35:12.:35:17.

are calling it that. We need to have a debate

:35:18.:35:19.

about the future of work. That would be a payment

:35:20.:35:32.

you would want to pay to everybody, including Premier League

:35:33.:35:35.

footballers, property For people earning more,

:35:36.:35:36.

like your football players, But there will be some people

:35:37.:35:49.

who think that is just bonkers, because that will cost,

:35:50.:35:53.

if it is 80 quid a week, You would also not be paying

:35:54.:35:56.

lots of the benefits. It would not be on top

:35:57.:36:01.

of existing benefits. You scrap existing benefits, 160

:36:02.:36:05.

billion, it is still 140 billion, It will be a pilot, and combined

:36:06.:36:07.

with more-progressive taxation. As a result, those people who do not

:36:08.:36:22.

need it will pay more anyway, It guarantees basic

:36:23.:36:26.

security to people. People might think this is not

:36:27.:36:29.

the right answer, and that is fine, but at least the question

:36:30.:36:32.

is being asked by us, how is it that in the fifth-richest

:36:33.:36:34.

country in the world we have a situation where 4 million

:36:35.:36:37.

kids are living in poverty, where people are dependent on food

:36:38.:36:41.

banks, nurses, because they cannot have enough money to

:36:42.:36:44.

put food on the table? In that context, it is right

:36:45.:36:49.

to ask the questions. One challenge is

:36:50.:36:53.

protecting the planet. You have failed to get people

:36:54.:36:56.

talking about the environment. Nobody is talking about the green

:36:57.:36:59.

agenda in this election. I suppose the Green

:37:00.:37:06.

movement has not done I don't think the fault

:37:07.:37:16.

is entirely ours. We launched an environment

:37:17.:37:22.

manifesto ten days ago, and although we had some journalists

:37:23.:37:25.

there and TV cameras, none of it cut through,

:37:26.:37:27.

you would not have seen it on your TV screens,

:37:28.:37:30.

so it is an enormous challenge. It feels as if the whole political

:37:31.:37:45.

debate now is being so stifled We are not going to be

:37:46.:37:48.

the next Government, I hope we will have some more Green

:37:49.:37:54.

MPs who will put pressure on the next Government,

:37:55.:37:58.

but what we can do is broaden the terms of the debate,

:37:59.:38:00.

having the debate about how we cope with a future where fewer people

:38:01.:38:03.

are going to be having the kind of nine-to-five secure jobs

:38:04.:38:06.

that they might have expected Do you accept that voters do

:38:07.:38:08.

like to know how things are going to be costed and need

:38:09.:38:16.

a credible answer? Voters will be pleased

:38:17.:38:18.

to know that somebody is thinking about the future,

:38:19.:38:20.

about what the world of work Why do you think the loudest

:38:21.:38:23.

anti-Brexit parties are plummeting I don't think it is as a result

:38:24.:38:28.

of saying that we believe the people should have the final say

:38:29.:38:40.

on the referendum. I do not think we are saying,

:38:41.:38:43.

"Don't get on with it," but when you come back with a final

:38:44.:38:46.

deal, does that go to Parliament It was the people that

:38:47.:38:49.

started off the debate, and given the magnitude

:38:50.:38:54.

of the decision that we are taking, given the fact that so much

:38:55.:38:59.

of what we were promised has proved not to be the case, ?350 million

:39:00.:39:02.

to the NHS, Turkey joining, the fact we are supposed

:39:03.:39:06.

to the keeping the same economic arrangements now as we had

:39:07.:39:11.

when we were part of the EU, all of that has

:39:12.:39:17.

unravelled spectacularly. If people voted no to that final

:39:18.:39:20.

deal, Britain would stay in the EU? Would you set a limit for the number

:39:21.:39:24.

of immigrants allowed into Britain? We are standing up for free

:39:25.:39:30.

movement, we would not The economy sets how

:39:31.:39:33.

many people come here, and we think it is the most-precious

:39:34.:39:40.

gift that people can work and retire and study and live and love

:39:41.:39:43.

and learn in 27 other member states. It is amazing, and I feel so sad

:39:44.:39:48.

that my kids now will not have the benefits that

:39:49.:39:51.

I did from that. Should people who support so-called

:39:52.:39:54.

Islamic State or become a member of Al-Qaeda,

:39:55.:39:59.

should they be prosecuted? Previously you have

:40:00.:40:07.

said they should not. Natalie once misspoke

:40:08.:40:12.

on a BBC politics programme, but the Green Party is clear,

:40:13.:40:17.

any kind of involvement in any kind of violence like that is utterly

:40:18.:40:20.

a criminal offence and should be Talking is normally what gets

:40:21.:40:23.

solutions, as it was in Ireland. It is hard to think

:40:24.:40:35.

who your interlocutor is. So, yes to talks, but not to be

:40:36.:40:41.

naive that IS will nominate You are happy for Green candidates

:40:42.:40:44.

to stand aside in some seats if it is going to split the vote

:40:45.:40:50.

and therefore potentially allow Is that not skewing

:40:51.:40:53.

democracy somewhat? Labour, Lib Dems, Greens and no

:40:54.:41:02.

party are coming together to say, come on, let's try to just be a bit

:41:03.:41:07.

more savvy about this voting system, which we know is on course to be

:41:08.:41:13.

handing, if the polls are right, How can we ensure that

:41:14.:41:16.

different voices are heard, how can we put aside narrow tribal

:41:17.:41:23.

interests just for once? It is a difficult thing

:41:24.:41:29.

to ask parties to do, but there was a huge appetite for it

:41:30.:41:31.

at a local level, including at It was not reciprocated

:41:32.:41:35.

at a national level, but I still feel it was the right

:41:36.:41:40.

thing to do. On your website you say

:41:41.:41:43.

you are not a typical MP. What do you think sets you apart

:41:44.:41:47.

from other middle-class, I think it is a combination

:41:48.:41:52.

of being prepared to think the unthinkable as part

:41:53.:42:05.

of the Green Party, I think it is willing to put your body

:42:06.:42:08.

where your mouth is, the preparedness to take non-violent

:42:09.:42:13.

direct action when other That sense of being prepared

:42:14.:42:18.

to stand up for what you believe in without compromising

:42:19.:42:25.

is relatively rare. We want an evidence-based drugs

:42:26.:42:30.

policy, and what we have under this Government and the successive ones

:42:31.:42:35.

has been an evidence-free policy. There is such an

:42:36.:42:40.

ideological reaction. Even if it were the case to be

:42:41.:42:43.

proven that a different policy could keep far more people safe

:42:44.:42:46.

from drugs, it's not What we are saying is,

:42:47.:42:49.

let's start with cannabis, let's start by making that

:42:50.:42:55.

available, if you are over 18 The parents I have spoken

:42:56.:42:58.

to in Brighton support this issue. It is one I have stood up

:42:59.:43:08.

for in Brighton very strongly. They will be pleased that once

:43:09.:43:13.

they are 18 their children can turn around to their parents and say,

:43:14.:43:16.

"Look, it is regulated now, Many people under 18 are already

:43:17.:43:19.

getting hold of those drugs, becoming addicted,

:43:20.:43:27.

and because we have a criminal-justice system that treats

:43:28.:43:29.

addiction as a criminal offence rather than as a health

:43:30.:43:34.

problem, there is no way We believe, again,

:43:35.:43:37.

a decriminalisation, both of the buyer of sex

:43:38.:43:46.

and of the seller, is a way Would you describe

:43:47.:43:51.

yourself as a feminist? Are you pleased we have a second

:43:52.:44:05.

female Prime Minister? Only because I hate her policies,

:44:06.:44:09.

but of course we need whoever is doing the policies,

:44:10.:44:20.

I would rather more women Your most-expensive purchase,

:44:21.:44:22.

not including a car or a home? I think I cried last week, just out

:44:23.:44:41.

of exhaustion and frustration. If you only return one MP again

:44:42.:44:54.

this time, yourself... I want Molly to be elected

:44:55.:45:04.

in Bristol West, I want Vix Lowthion It would be brilliant,

:45:05.:45:09.

and it would not just be tears because I am sad,

:45:10.:45:13.

I would be heartbroken that we have not managed to get people

:45:14.:45:16.

like them into Parliament, How much is the PiP disability

:45:17.:45:32.

benefit? Hole I can't remember now. Is it ?80 from something like that?

:45:33.:45:39.

It is about ?65. To be honest, that is a nice way of catching me out,

:45:40.:45:43.

but the most important thing is to make sure that people with

:45:44.:45:46.

disabilities are looked after. The most embarrassing thing you have

:45:47.:45:53.

done when you were drunk? It is not necessarily when I am drunk, but I

:45:54.:45:56.

figured people's names and faces. Do you sing in the shower,

:45:57.:46:08.

and if so, what? I assume it is a shower

:46:09.:46:11.

rather than a bath? We like our occasional

:46:12.:46:13.

baths as well! My favourite singer

:46:14.:46:15.

is Regina Spektor, I would try to sing some of her songs,

:46:16.:46:17.

she is wonderful. I don't know her, can

:46:18.:46:19.

you sing to me a little bit? I so wish I had my son's Keita with

:46:20.:46:48.

me, and then she may have had to sing, although I cannot play it.

:46:49.:46:50.

And more van share with other politicians to come

:46:51.:46:52.

The Metropolitan Police is going to recruit people directly

:46:53.:46:55.

as detectives without them spending time in uniform.

:46:56.:47:10.

We can speak now to Her Majesty's Inspector of Constabulary,

:47:11.:47:12.

Zoe Billingham, and Leroy Logan who is a former Metropolitan Police

:47:13.:47:15.

Superintendent and retired after 30 years' service

:47:16.:47:16.

How bad is the shortage of detectives? Very bad. We put in our

:47:17.:47:20.

most recent report there is a national crisis in the shortage of

:47:21.:47:23.

detectives and we have called on forces to take all sorts of

:47:24.:47:27.

innovative action, like the Met are doing, to make sure that skilled

:47:28.:47:30.

people are investigating very serious crimes. OK, but you are now

:47:31.:47:35.

going to have people with skills in other areas but not policing.

:47:36.:47:39.

Someone who has never arrested someone, someone who has never

:47:40.:47:45.

sought a crime, going straight in as a detective? What you wouldn't

:47:46.:47:48.

believe that the moment is that we have people who have no detective

:47:49.:47:53.

experience at all who are police officers investigating rapes and

:47:54.:47:55.

even in one incident a homicide. What we want to be happening is a

:47:56.:48:00.

proper training course for people necessarily coming in from outside

:48:01.:48:04.

of policing if that is what the Met thinks is important, they get the

:48:05.:48:08.

appropriate training, they learn how to investigate a crime, they used

:48:09.:48:11.

their forensic intelligence well and they bring offenders to justice.

:48:12.:48:17.

That is preferable to forces using a patchwork approach and not having

:48:18.:48:21.

the right skilled people investigating very, very serious

:48:22.:48:24.

crimes against people. OK, Leroy Logan, what do you think about this?

:48:25.:48:31.

There are certain things you can't learn from a book or online. There

:48:32.:48:35.

are certain skills that you develop through on-site learning. Sorry to

:48:36.:48:42.

interrupt, Zoe Billingham says there are people investigating crimes as

:48:43.:48:48.

serious as murder and rape because of the shortage. It is because there

:48:49.:48:52.

is a shortage, and I think it is really near-sighted that they

:48:53.:48:55.

haven't understood when you have a high caseload of officers, and the

:48:56.:48:58.

fact that they are leaving in their droves, and it is so difficult to

:48:59.:49:03.

get into the tech -- the detective system that it has left a crisis. It

:49:04.:49:07.

feeds into the narrative that it is just one crisis after another.

:49:08.:49:13.

People are sensing they are not getting the service they deserve.

:49:14.:49:17.

OK, why couldn't a graduate with a degree in, I don't know, English

:49:18.:49:23.

literature take a course to learn some of the skills to become a

:49:24.:49:28.

detective, and then go on to become a successful detective? I'm not

:49:29.:49:31.

saying that they can't do it, the only thing is the time between them

:49:32.:49:35.

being a graduate - I was a graduate when I joined the net but there were

:49:36.:49:38.

certain skills are developed, interacting with the public, knowing

:49:39.:49:42.

when someone is lying to you, getting an understanding of how you

:49:43.:49:45.

map out the process of investigation. That doesn't come

:49:46.:49:50.

just online or through a website. So I believe there is going to be a bit

:49:51.:49:56.

of a risk when it comes to this transition to them being effective

:49:57.:50:00.

detectives. Briefly, Zoe Billingham, what about those skills you pick up

:50:01.:50:03.

that Leroy Logan has just talked about? These folks are not going to

:50:04.:50:08.

be thrown in at the deep end, they will be recruited, they will have

:50:09.:50:12.

the right skills, they will go through intensive training, they

:50:13.:50:15.

will work alongside other very senior detectives for a period of

:50:16.:50:19.

time working on perhaps less complex crimes to start with and then

:50:20.:50:23.

working at the more conflicts crime areas. If they have the right skills

:50:24.:50:27.

and qualities in order to be to do so. The public must be kept safe, at

:50:28.:50:30.

the end of the day, and this training needs to be intensive and

:50:31.:50:35.

conference. They have to be properly supervised, that is key. If they are

:50:36.:50:40.

not, and not the current situation where you have a higher ratio of

:50:41.:50:44.

constables, Detective constables and detective sergeants. They won't have

:50:45.:50:49.

the intrusive supervision to ensure it is not just a rubber stamp, go

:50:50.:50:52.

on, move on, they actually have the skills that they speak about. Will

:50:53.:50:58.

they be properly supervised? Absolutely, supervised all the way

:50:59.:51:01.

through their training and for many years into their qualifications as

:51:02.:51:05.

well. Does that reassure you, briefly? The jury's out. Thank you

:51:06.:51:09.

both of you. Tens of thousands of expat

:51:10.:51:17.

pensioners may return to the UK to use the NHS after Brexit,

:51:18.:51:22.

unless a deal can be done to let them keep receiving care abroad,

:51:23.:51:25.

a think tank has warned. The Nuffield Trust estimates

:51:26.:51:29.

the cost of treating them on home soil, rather than abroad,

:51:30.:51:32.

could double to ?1 billion. Currently, the UK gives around

:51:33.:51:35.

?500 million a year to EU countries that care for Brits

:51:36.:51:37.

who have retired abroad. Jean Moore originally

:51:38.:51:47.

from the West Midlands is one of the 190,000 pensioners living

:51:48.:51:49.

in the EU. I spoke to her in Spain a short

:51:50.:51:54.

time ago about the care I get excellent care here,

:51:55.:51:57.

and I am frightened. I didn't vote for Brexit,

:51:58.:52:03.

because I couldn't vote. And I'm frightened if I come back

:52:04.:52:05.

now, or when Brexit occurs, My arthritis has flared up

:52:06.:52:08.

really badly lately, and the hospital were worried,

:52:09.:52:17.

so they are going to start me on a new treatment,

:52:18.:52:20.

but they have to get permission I feel if I come back to the UK,

:52:21.:52:23.

I will not get this treatment. I'm 74 on June 10th, and if I have

:52:24.:52:30.

a seizure, I can't walk. My sons in England

:52:31.:52:38.

are worried about me. Fortunately, for me,

:52:39.:52:50.

I have a wonderful carer in my husband, who is 83 in August,

:52:51.:52:53.

and he helps me an awful lot. So the reason we're talking

:52:54.:52:57.

to you today, obviously, is because this report from a think

:52:58.:53:02.

tank suggesting that people like yourself might have to come

:53:03.:53:04.

back to the UK to use the NHS after Brexit, unless a deal can be

:53:05.:53:08.

done that allows you to continue receiving your care abroad,

:53:09.:53:11.

in Spain where you are right now. How hopeful are you that that sort

:53:12.:53:19.

of deal can be done? Well, I always look on the bright

:53:20.:53:23.

side and think, well, Britain will come through for us,

:53:24.:53:26.

because there's a lot of people in Spain who work in the UK,

:53:27.:53:29.

a lot of Spanish people. They will want their treatment

:53:30.:53:38.

the same, so if the UK and Spain reciprocate one another,

:53:39.:53:41.

we'll get on well. But if they go for a hard Brexit,

:53:42.:53:47.

and they refuse this NHS thing, I'm done for, I might as well go

:53:48.:53:51.

and get the funeral plan out Oh, Jean, you don't

:53:52.:53:54.

mean that, do you? I tell you what it is,

:53:55.:54:02.

I can't tell you how painful this It's like a silent disease,

:54:03.:54:05.

you look really healthy, but it's a crippling disease

:54:06.:54:14.

on the joints, and I'm just frightened that

:54:15.:54:17.

if I go back to the UK, Well, that was Jean, God bless her,

:54:18.:54:19.

her husband is her carer. He is 83. With me is Mark Dayan,

:54:20.:54:42.

who carried out the research, he's from the health charity

:54:43.:54:45.

the Nuffield Trust. Hello to you, Mark. So how real is

:54:46.:54:50.

this possibility that somebody like gene might have to come back to the

:54:51.:54:55.

UK for treatment? I hope a deal can be done, but we are some how going

:54:56.:55:00.

into the unknown with this. There are some countries outside the EU

:55:01.:55:05.

that have set up a reciprocal arrangement with the UK, Australia

:55:06.:55:08.

is one. When you consider how many countries there are across the EU to

:55:09.:55:12.

come to some sort of arrangement with. Yes, exactly, how many

:55:13.:55:17.

countries, and also a reciprocal arrangements are foreigners who are

:55:18.:55:22.

living here. Although relatively few EU migrants refuse to retire to

:55:23.:55:26.

Britain for reasons of cost and perhaps the weather, but certainly

:55:27.:55:30.

we would want that to be seen as a priority in Brexit negotiations. I

:55:31.:55:34.

think that is one of a range of issues where the NHS will be

:55:35.:55:37.

affected by Brexit, and what we want to see is it remaining at the centre

:55:38.:55:41.

of the government's minds as they come to these difficult

:55:42.:55:45.

negotiations. If a deal is reached, how much of an impact will it have

:55:46.:55:50.

on the NHS? There are a number of things that might be tricky for the

:55:51.:55:54.

NHS. Firstly, you would have these pensioners potentially having to

:55:55.:55:56.

return to Britain to get the care they need. That will cost a bit of

:55:57.:56:00.

extra money. Perhaps more importantly, added pressure on beds

:56:01.:56:04.

and nurses which are very stretch at the moment, it has been very

:56:05.:56:07.

inconvenient for pensioners like gene who probably like living where

:56:08.:56:11.

they are, and getting the care they do. Then there is the impact on

:56:12.:56:15.

staffing. At the moment the NHS is quite reliant on migrants from the

:56:16.:56:19.

EU to fill but unfortunately due to bad planning has become a big gap

:56:20.:56:23.

particularly around nursing. Lastly there is the market for medicine. At

:56:24.:56:27.

the moment the NHS really benefits from being able to buy medicine from

:56:28.:56:33.

across the EU, because it is all under the same pricing scheme.

:56:34.:56:38.

Right, and in terms of the nursing shortage, what is the situation

:56:39.:56:42.

right now? We already have a shortage of tens of thousands of

:56:43.:56:47.

nurses. An analysis by the Department of Health which was

:56:48.:56:49.

leaked show they think that could widen to as much as 20 to 50,000

:56:50.:56:56.

more unfilled posts by 2025, if all nursing migration was cut off after

:56:57.:56:59.

Brexit, which I don't think we want to see. And that is unlikely to see,

:57:00.:57:03.

because pretty much all the parties have said whether they want to bring

:57:04.:57:07.

net migration down or not, most of them have said it depends on the

:57:08.:57:11.

needs of the economy. So if we need nurses, you would like to think we

:57:12.:57:13.

would encourage nurses from abroad if we haven't got them here. That's

:57:14.:57:19.

what we are saying, and we are encouraged by the both main parties

:57:20.:57:24.

showing signs they have heard that concern. What I would say is in the

:57:25.:57:28.

past when there was a crackdown from migration from outside the EU, that

:57:29.:57:32.

really did push down the numbers, and the salaries weren't quite high

:57:33.:57:35.

enough to meet some of the standards. I am in Carriage Gate

:57:36.:57:39.

will be addressed but it is quite a real concern. Thank you very much.

:57:40.:57:44.

-- I am encouraged that it will be addressed. Thank you for your many

:57:45.:57:51.

comments on election blind dates. Mark on Facebook says I love these

:57:52.:57:56.

election dates, listening to normal people having sensible, constructive

:57:57.:57:59.

political discourse. What I love most is that the participants are

:58:00.:58:03.

actively listening to each other and having a normal conversation. Our

:58:04.:58:08.

political class should take note. John on Facebook, as an interesting

:58:09.:58:12.

follow-up, the right wing young lady should go on a life swap with a

:58:13.:58:18.

carer or somebody similar. Dawn on Facebook says this is the way me and

:58:19.:58:24.

my friends are. We don't agree on

:58:25.:58:32.

Made in Chelsea's Georgia Toffolo and austerity blogger Jack Monroe are the latest political polar opposites to take part in our Election Blind Dates.

Victoria speaks to one of the victims of breast surgeon Ian Paterson, as he is sentenced for carrying out multiple unnecessary operations.

And the Green Party's Caroline Lucas gets a lift in Victoria's white van and talks drugs, tears and prostitution.