24/10/2017 Victoria Derbyshire


24/10/2017

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Hello, it's Tuesday, it's 9 o'clock, I'm Tina Daheley,

:00:09.:00:11.

Criminal gangs are trafficking thousands of children from London

:00:12.:00:19.

around the country to sell drugs - a leading charity has

:00:20.:00:22.

Kids as young as 12 are used to transport and sell the drugs -

:00:23.:00:27.

a practice known by the police as County Lines, or cuckooing.

:00:28.:00:30.

We've spoken exclusively to two young people

:00:31.:00:31.

It could have led to me being arrested, getting kill, I felt lucky

:00:32.:00:44.

Disabled people are losing out on jobs because a government support

:00:45.:00:48.

scheme, aimed at helping disabled people with physical and mental

:00:49.:00:51.

health conditions work is no longer fit for purpose,

:00:52.:00:53.

campaigners and recipients have told this programme.

:00:54.:00:55.

They say the Access to Work programme is beset by errors,

:00:56.:00:57.

The thought of having to cut my hour, I could feel me shrinking,

:00:58.:01:13.

becoming a small person and feeling quite terrified about what my future

:01:14.:01:15.

In his latest film, Breathe, Andrew Garfield plays

:01:16.:01:21.

Robin Cavendish, who became tethered to a breathing machine in order

:01:22.:01:24.

to stay alive after contracting polio in the 1950s aged just 28.

:01:25.:01:27.

With the love and support of his wife Diana, played by Claire Foy,

:01:28.:01:30.

Robin broke free and changed not only his life, but that of disabled

:01:31.:01:33.

We will be speaking to Diana, and her and Robin's son Jonathan,

:01:34.:01:37.

who is the producer of this moving true story.

:01:38.:01:45.

I don't want to go on living here... What are we waiting for?

:01:46.:01:59.

Welcome to the programme, we're live until 11 this morning.

:02:00.:02:13.

Also, as hundreds of teachers, support staff and parents join

:02:14.:02:16.

a mass lobby of parliament today, in a bid to persuade the government

:02:17.:02:19.

to give schools more funding, we talk to parents who say

:02:20.:02:22.

And we'd love to hear what you've got to say -

:02:23.:02:25.

have you been asked to pay for something that used to be

:02:26.:02:28.

Or do you feel the opposite and that your school

:02:29.:02:32.

Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning -

:02:33.:02:37.

use the hashtag Victoria LIVe, and if you text, you will be charged

:02:38.:02:40.

Hospitals in England could carry out 280,000 extra operations a year

:02:41.:02:53.

just by making better use of operating theatres.

:02:54.:02:55.

Analysis by the watchdog NHS Improvement, due

:02:56.:02:57.

out later this week, suggests that an average of 2 hours

:02:58.:02:59.

a day are lost in operating theatres because of late starts

:03:00.:03:02.

Waiting lists for routine operations are growing and there's a continuing

:03:03.:03:10.

debate over whether more money is needed for the NHS or whether it

:03:11.:03:13.

Now analysis by a health regulator seen by the BBC suggests that more

:03:14.:03:18.

patients could be treated in operating theatres.

:03:19.:03:22.

NHS Improvement looked at non-urgent surgery at 100 trusts

:03:23.:03:25.

It says 1.64 million operations were carried out,

:03:26.:03:29.

but an extra 280,000 more could have taken place and on average,

:03:30.:03:32.

there was about 140 minutes of unused operating theatre

:03:33.:03:34.

Reducing late starts, early finishes and last minute

:03:35.:03:45.

cancellations would have made a big difference according to

:03:46.:03:48.

the regulator, but the Royal College of Surgeons says it's

:03:49.:03:51.

I think the NHS can always be more efficient and I think people have

:03:52.:03:56.

worked very hard to try to make it more efficient and I think we should

:03:57.:04:00.

continue to work very hard to make it more efficient,

:04:01.:04:02.

but I don't think those efficiency savings are going to resolve

:04:03.:04:05.

the ever increasing demand that is being put

:04:06.:04:07.

NHS Improvement says it hopes the research will enable hospitals

:04:08.:04:13.

to identify bottlenecks in their system, to ensure

:04:14.:04:15.

operations are scheduled more appropriately and more patients

:04:16.:04:17.

These figures sound pretty bad, what is the full picture? Tina, it is a

:04:18.:04:42.

very varied picture, this analysis by NHS improvement suggests that a

:04:43.:04:46.

lot more operations could be done, but thaw is the average, 280,000

:04:47.:04:53.

more at 100 trusts that were looked at last year. There are some example

:04:54.:04:57.

of good practise, where they have worked to try to fit in more

:04:58.:05:01.

patient, that is what it is about, patients who have waited a long time

:05:02.:05:06.

for routine surgery and often it is delayed further and yet more

:05:07.:05:10.

operations could carried out but it seems it is down to late start,

:05:11.:05:14.

early finish, often the surgical team system there but the patient

:05:15.:05:18.

isn't ready, hasn't been brought in at the beginning of the operating

:05:19.:05:22.

list or there could be a last minute cancellation and that go back to

:05:23.:05:25.

preparing the patients more. What they are saying is they could do

:05:26.:05:28.

better and there are ways of doing better to maximise the amount of the

:05:29.:05:34.

time they use. What response can we expect? The Royal College of

:05:35.:05:38.

Surgeons was tentative they are anxious not to be seen to be the

:05:39.:05:43.

recipient of criticism, it is not surgeons who are not criticised for

:05:44.:05:47.

working hard enough, they know there could be more efficiency, they are

:05:48.:05:52.

saying it's a wired problem you have beds occupied by medically fit

:05:53.:05:55.

patients and they can't leave because of social care problems so

:05:56.:05:58.

the beds aren't available for the patients coming out of the operating

:05:59.:06:03.

theatres so they say it a wired problem and demand is rising and

:06:04.:06:06.

more money is needed. With all the talk of more money being needed for

:06:07.:06:11.

the NHS, and also could it be more efficient, this is an interesting

:06:12.:06:15.

contribution, waiting lists are rising, it is all about getting

:06:16.:06:19.

patients the care they need. Thank you Huw.

:06:20.:06:21.

Reeta is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

:06:22.:06:24.

Police in England and Wales have been accused of letting down victims

:06:25.:06:29.

of modern slavery at every stage - in a scathing report

:06:30.:06:31.

The Inspectorate found that cases had been closed without any

:06:32.:06:35.

enquiries being made, and in some instances detectives

:06:36.:06:37.

Police say they fully accept the recommendations in the report

:06:38.:06:45.

The police have got lots of techniques, lots of methods,

:06:46.:06:48.

When they deal with drug dealing, for example,

:06:49.:06:52.

They need to start using the resources they have got and find

:06:53.:06:57.

out who's doing this, who is the master mind behind it

:06:58.:06:59.

We will have more on that few minutes when we hear how children

:07:00.:07:13.

will being exploited and trafficked by gangs.

:07:14.:07:15.

The reporting of crimes such as cyberbullying,

:07:16.:07:18.

trolling and online harassment has increased by 85% in the last two

:07:19.:07:21.

years, according to figures obtained by the BBC.

:07:22.:07:23.

More than 200 malicious communication offences are recorded

:07:24.:07:25.

every day by Police forces in England and Wales,

:07:26.:07:27.

but the officer leading the fight against digital crime says

:07:28.:07:29.

This is live.me, a video streaming app.

:07:30.:07:43.

Victoria from Leeds uses it to chat online, but last year she started

:07:44.:07:46.

Photos of her home were posted online and she was dared to try

:07:47.:07:50.

One user threatened to force himself on her.

:07:51.:07:53.

She was even told "go kill yourself" and her address was posted

:07:54.:07:56.

Like I used to be an outgoing person and now I'm just getting there,

:07:57.:08:12.

With more people using smartphones and social media, police

:08:13.:08:21.

are getting more reports of malicious

:08:22.:08:23.

That can include threats sent by online trolls,

:08:24.:08:26.

abusive text messages, pornographic images

:08:27.:08:31.

Research by the BBC has found more than 200 offences are being recorded

:08:32.:08:41.

by police in England and Wales every day.

:08:42.:08:43.

The number has risen by 85% over the past two years.

:08:44.:08:48.

I think this is the tip of an iceberg.

:08:49.:08:52.

I think as policing and society changes into the digital age,

:08:53.:08:54.

this is only going to increase and providers, government,

:08:55.:08:57.

law enforcement and users all need to get ready how we protect people

:08:58.:09:00.

more effectively and then how we bring the criminals to justice.

:09:01.:09:02.

With the support of her family, Victoria is slowly getting

:09:03.:09:05.

So far no one has been arrested over the threats she received.

:09:06.:09:17.

Disability campaigners have criticised a key government scheme

:09:18.:09:19.

which helps deaf and disabled people in the workplace

:09:20.:09:21.

The scheme provides support for people with disabilities

:09:22.:09:24.

beyond what employers are obliged to do by law.

:09:25.:09:27.

But a new report seen by this programme says Access to Work -

:09:28.:09:30.

once hailed as the most successful programme of its type -

:09:31.:09:32.

is beset by errors, delays and is being hit by a government

:09:33.:09:35.

The Government says it's "committed to supporting disabled people to get

:09:36.:09:39.

A 53-year old man is due in court today charged in connection

:09:40.:09:53.

with an armed siege that lasted 4 hours at a bowling alley in Nuneaton

:09:54.:09:56.

David Clark is charged with false imprisonment, criminal damage,

:09:57.:10:04.

and possessing a blade and an imitation firearm.

:10:05.:10:08.

The President of the European Commission, Jean Claude Juncker,

:10:09.:10:11.

has said that he believes the EU and Britain will reach

:10:12.:10:14.

He's been speaking in the last few minutes in Strasbourg.

:10:15.:10:21.

What should I say about Brexit? I would like to say that the

:10:22.:10:31.

Commission is not negotiating in an hostile mood. We want a deal. Those

:10:32.:10:36.

who don't want a deal, the no dealer, they have no friends in the

:10:37.:10:41.

Commission, we want a fair deal. And we will have a fair deal with

:10:42.:10:45.

Britain. The no deal is not our working assumption. Thank you.

:10:46.:10:49.

A British former assistant of Harvey Weinstein says

:10:50.:10:53.

she was paid ?125,000 to keep quiet after accusing the movie mogul

:10:54.:10:55.

Zelda Perkins told the Financial Times she signed

:10:56.:10:58.

a non-disclosure agreement in 1998 after making the accusations.

:10:59.:11:00.

She said Weinstein asked her to give him massages and tried

:11:01.:11:03.

Weinstein has denied any allegations of non-consensual

:11:04.:11:06.

Two women charged with killing Kim Jong-nam, the half-brother

:11:07.:11:19.

of North Korea's leader, are revisiting the crime

:11:20.:11:20.

Indonesian Siti Aisyah and Vietnamese Doan Thi Huong

:11:21.:11:23.

were at Kuala Lumpur airport on Tuesday.

:11:24.:11:26.

The pair are accused of rubbing the highly toxic VX nerve agent

:11:27.:11:29.

on Mr Kim's face as he waited for a flight.

:11:30.:11:31.

They have pleaded not guilty to murder, saying it was a TV prank

:11:32.:11:34.

and they were tricked by North Korean agents.

:11:35.:11:42.

The Labour MP who defeated Nick Clegg in this year's general

:11:43.:11:45.

election, Jared O'Mara, has apologised for using what's been

:11:46.:11:47.

described as "vile" and "horrendous" language in the past.

:11:48.:12:00.

Mr O'Mara said he was a sexist and homophobic young man

:12:01.:12:02.

when he made the comments posted online in 2002 and 2004, but says

:12:03.:12:05.

He's not been suspended from the party but has stood down

:12:06.:12:09.

from the Women and Equalities Committee.

:12:10.:12:11.

An extremely rare ?1.5 million supercar was badly damaged after it

:12:12.:12:13.

smashed into a crash barrier in West Sussex.

:12:14.:12:15.

The Pagani Zonda, which has a top speed of more than 200mph,

:12:16.:12:18.

crashed on the A27 at Tangmere on Saturday morning.

:12:19.:12:20.

Sussex Police said the driver was not injured but the "one-off"

:12:21.:12:23.

Italian-made car was left with "significant damage".

:12:24.:12:25.

It is thought the car was travelling in a convoy of sports cars

:12:26.:12:28.

at the time and police have appealed for witnesses.

:12:29.:12:35.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 9.30.

:12:36.:12:56.

Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

:12:57.:12:59.

use the hashtag Victoria LIVE and if you text, you will be charged

:13:00.:13:02.

Let's get some sport with Jessica Creighton.

:13:03.:13:05.

Jess, Cristiano Ronaldo picked up more silverware last night.

:13:06.:13:11.

Yes, good morning. Ronaldo must be running out of space. As you say

:13:12.:13:19.

another award for the Real Madrid and Portugal star. This time it was

:13:20.:13:24.

the best awards, the best male Player of the Year. Voted for by

:13:25.:13:28.

international player, the coaches, fans and the media. What a year he

:13:29.:13:33.

has had. He has won the Champions League and the cup and league double

:13:34.:13:39.

in Spain, he beat Messi of Barcelona to the award and Neymar of PSG who

:13:40.:13:44.

he thanked in his accept tan speech. Thank you a lot, the guys who are

:13:45.:13:52.

voting on me, I mention Neymar. APPLAUSE

:13:53.:13:56.

I am really glad this is a great moment for me, I know I have fans

:13:57.:14:02.

all over the world, so thank you a lot for the support.

:14:03.:14:07.

APPLAUSE The women's award was won by a Dutch

:14:08.:14:10.

player. They won the European Championships of course this summer

:14:11.:14:14.

and she was the top goal scorer, so very well deserved to her.

:14:15.:14:19.

In terms of British success Celtic won the best fans award.

:14:20.:14:26.

Let us talk jobbed. A few names in the frame for the vacant Everton

:14:27.:14:33.

manager's job. My man whose has kick add football is often linked. We

:14:34.:14:38.

they that David Unsworth in charge of the under 23s will take temporary

:14:39.:14:43.

charge. He has a big first match against the Premier League champions

:14:44.:14:46.

Chelsea, that is in the League Cup tomorrow. Let us look at the other

:14:47.:14:51.

names in the frame. Could there be a return for David Moyes? He had a

:14:52.:14:55.

successful period at the club but a pretty hard time since he left. He

:14:56.:15:01.

is well-known to the fans and the hierarchy, Sean Dyche, another name

:15:02.:15:05.

in the frame. Thought to be one of the hot favourites. He has done a

:15:06.:15:09.

brilliant job at Burnley. They are up to eighth. Sam Allardyce, he

:15:10.:15:15.

didn't last long as England manager just one game, he is known for

:15:16.:15:20.

getting teams out of sticky situations, and finally, Carlo

:15:21.:15:23.

Ancelotti. Probably the biggest name linked to this job. He is a three

:15:24.:15:26.

time Champions League winner and more importantly, he is not in a job

:15:27.:15:31.

at the moment, after leaving Bayern Munich. Whoever takes charge they

:15:32.:15:35.

have a massive it is aing on their hands. Everton are bottom of their

:15:36.:15:39.

group in the Europa League, in the bottom three in the Premier League

:15:40.:15:42.

and they are without a win in five. So whoever comes in has serious work

:15:43.:15:44.

to do. Thousands of children from London

:15:45.:15:48.

are being exploited and trafficked around the country by gangs to sell

:15:49.:15:54.

drugs - that's according The police call this 'county lines'

:15:55.:15:57.

- gangs use children as young as 12 to traffic drugs,

:15:58.:16:01.

using dedicated mobile Speaking to this programme,

:16:02.:16:03.

the government's anti-slavery commissioner has described those

:16:04.:16:09.

figures as "shocking" - and the Home Office has announced

:16:10.:16:11.

a ?300,000 fund to help charities provide support to young people

:16:12.:16:14.

caught up in county lines activity. Last year, the National Crime Agency

:16:15.:16:17.

described it as a 'national problem', with around 70% of forces

:16:18.:16:19.

reporting they were dealing We've been speaking to two former

:16:20.:16:22.

teenage drug runners We've disguised their

:16:23.:16:25.

identities and their voices I got involved through friends,

:16:26.:16:28.

seeing friends come back They were telling me about it like,

:16:29.:16:33.

they were like, "It's an easy way of making

:16:34.:16:45.

money", things like that. Feeling, having a family

:16:46.:16:47.

that you ain't got. Being around people that are older

:16:48.:16:50.

than you and they're Inner-city gangs are using

:16:51.:16:53.

children to move drugs to Kids as young as 12 set up

:16:54.:17:01.

in a vulnerable drug They sell drugs worth

:17:02.:17:07.

thousands of pounds a day. This is the story of two former

:17:08.:17:16.

teenage drug runners. We have protected their identities

:17:17.:17:29.

because their lives are still The first time was like,

:17:30.:17:32.

I think it was like a week, The longest was

:17:33.:17:51.

probably like a month. All I did was stay in the house,

:17:52.:17:56.

then people came to me. You could have like three

:17:57.:18:01.

at the door at the And managing the money,

:18:02.:18:05.

managing drugs, it was hectic. The first night I was a bit,

:18:06.:18:12.

"OK, this is different." But from the time you see the money,

:18:13.:18:24.

you're thinking, "OK, I can just bear a bit more like,

:18:25.:18:34.

I can just turn and hold a bit Probably about two grand

:18:35.:18:37.

a month, probably. I actually didn't have

:18:38.:18:47.

a place to stay, where I had to stay in a graveyard

:18:48.:19:00.

for a whole night. I remember looking at the stars and

:19:01.:19:05.

I saw a question mark, literally. The first house I was

:19:06.:19:08.

in was all right. So like yeah, it

:19:09.:19:12.

kept me preoccupied. But the two houses I was

:19:13.:19:17.

in the other time, no, The second two times

:19:18.:19:20.

I was hesitant with the money and stuff, just

:19:21.:19:30.

in case they took it. That's one of the reasons

:19:31.:19:35.

why I never slept. Some people had like knives

:19:36.:19:38.

and things like that. I had a knife with me,

:19:39.:19:40.

so I felt all right, Yeah, yeah, there's

:19:41.:19:42.

always a risk every day. I remember once I had drugs

:19:43.:19:45.

and also I had a knife, a That probably could put me

:19:46.:19:49.

in like a minimum of two years. With my family, I told them

:19:50.:19:54.

I was staying with a friend because Sometimes I used to come back

:19:55.:20:03.

for like a couple of But sometimes I would come back,

:20:04.:20:08.

probably go to school and do what I But then straightaway

:20:09.:20:14.

I would go back again. It would get to a point

:20:15.:20:17.

where I just disappeared. I thought I was slick enough

:20:18.:20:24.

to get away with it. But looking back on it now,

:20:25.:20:27.

I probably wouldn't have. But at the time I don't

:20:28.:20:30.

really think of it. I was thinking in

:20:31.:20:35.

the house no one will My background wasn't

:20:36.:20:37.

like as wealthy. You know, I had things

:20:38.:20:51.

I needed, not wanted. So all the things

:20:52.:20:54.

I wanted, yeah, but I Bought myself some

:20:55.:20:56.

new trainers and that. I was young so I didn't

:20:57.:21:06.

really know what to do. I just wanted clothes,

:21:07.:21:11.

money and things like that. And did you ever feel

:21:12.:21:14.

like you are being exploited? That age I didn't really recognise

:21:15.:21:18.

the risks, do you know I mean? Other druggies bringing

:21:19.:21:27.

in other druggies. It could be any moment

:21:28.:21:30.

and they could take And in that situation

:21:31.:21:33.

what can you really do? They want to be touched

:21:34.:21:40.

by that needle. There is a time where obviously

:21:41.:21:50.

you do make a mistake, where you're there, you're kind

:21:51.:21:55.

of worried, you're paranoid. It can be a loss of money,

:21:56.:21:58.

a loss of whatever. But when that happens

:21:59.:22:04.

you have to stay. You got to make sure

:22:05.:22:10.

that you make that money back.

:22:11.:22:13.

There's a point that happened to me. Like most of the time

:22:14.:22:15.

you get sent back. No one wanted to kill

:22:16.:22:19.

you because that says you're not Cos knowing what

:22:20.:22:21.

happens to like some weak kind of people,

:22:22.:22:28.

that can mess up their whole life. Once you do this kind

:22:29.:22:31.

of thing, like you can't be like, "Yeah,

:22:32.:22:37.

I want to stop now." They're still talking to me,

:22:38.:22:43.

they're trying to get at me and But I moved away from the area.

:22:44.:22:53.

So I think that helped me a lot to actually think about other

:22:54.:22:58.

things as well. And trying to make my life

:22:59.:23:01.

something else, not just being another number,

:23:02.:23:03.

do you know what I mean? It could have led to me getting

:23:04.:23:08.

arrested, me getting killed, So I felt lucky getting

:23:09.:23:11.

out when I could have. Earlier, I spoke to Kevin Hyland -

:23:12.:23:19.

the government's I asked him how big a problem county

:23:20.:23:21.

lines and cuckooing were. Well what we are finding is that we

:23:22.:23:33.

are starting to discover this more and more each day. I think it is a

:23:34.:23:38.

serious issue for the United Kingdom, where we have young

:23:39.:23:42.

children being used by organised criminals to traffic drugs or for

:23:43.:23:45.

sexual exploitation. We are starting to identify it, but I don't think we

:23:46.:23:50.

understand or are responding to the prevalence of this and we need to

:23:51.:23:55.

see more done. Do we have any idea of the scale of the problem and how

:23:56.:23:59.

many children are involved? Well that is the issue. Because we have

:24:00.:24:04.

not been looking at nit a collective way and looking at it for what it

:24:05.:24:09.

is, witch is serious -- which is serious crime. So we don't

:24:10.:24:14.

understand the scale. The issue of modern slavery we are starting to

:24:15.:24:18.

understand and this is a form of slavery. There could be many

:24:19.:24:22.

hundreds of county lines across the United Kingdom. Until we investigate

:24:23.:24:27.

them and the children who have been exploited are supported properly, we

:24:28.:24:29.

won't start to understand it in a way that can respond to the risks

:24:30.:24:35.

this creates. Why hasn't it been looked at, is it because it is

:24:36.:24:40.

something new? Partly it is something new, but it has been going

:24:41.:24:44.

on for a long while and it has been ignored in as much as many of the

:24:45.:24:49.

young people who are exploit rd just seen as problem children and they

:24:50.:24:53.

turn up in other parts of the country from where they live,

:24:54.:24:59.

carrying drugs or involved in sexual exploitation and they're just seen

:25:00.:25:03.

as problem children, instead of being seen as part of the gang's

:25:04.:25:10.

tools. They're being used as a commodity to move drugs and when you

:25:11.:25:17.

think of it as a crime group f you can get young people to move drugs,

:25:18.:25:23.

the chances of you getting caught are reduced. This is something that

:25:24.:25:30.

is making tens of millions for those who exploit children. Some people

:25:31.:25:37.

may be thinking, young drugs traffickers should be treated as

:25:38.:25:43.

criminals not victims. What would you say? No, that is not looking at

:25:44.:25:52.

theish issue, we have young British nationals who are being groomed. We

:25:53.:25:56.

have young children and it is our responsibility tolike after those

:25:57.:25:59.

children -- to look after those children who are being controlled by

:26:00.:26:06.

serious criminals to traffic drugs or other crime. It is our duty to

:26:07.:26:11.

look after the children and to actually pursue those who trade in

:26:12.:26:14.

suffering of young children. So we need to look at these children in

:26:15.:26:18.

the way that they need to be supported, the way they need to be

:26:19.:26:23.

diverted from these gangs and to take the fight to the criminals.

:26:24.:26:29.

Where do you draw the line, where do they stop becoming vulnerable and

:26:30.:26:33.

become criminals? You have to look at each case and see if they have

:26:34.:26:37.

the real ability to buy the drugs. When they go somewhere else and

:26:38.:26:41.

they're trading drugs for someone else, what is the control measures

:26:42.:26:45.

over those individuals. The issue of modern slavery in the wider context

:26:46.:26:52.

is about people being used as a commodity and these are young people

:26:53.:26:56.

who are vulnerable in the first place, often they're in care, they

:26:57.:26:59.

haven't got families that support them or they haven't got the

:27:00.:27:02.

opportunities that many of us have. And then the criminals move in and

:27:03.:27:07.

groom them. Once you meet these young people face to face and I

:27:08.:27:11.

have, and they come out of the other side, you realise for years we have

:27:12.:27:15.

been letting these people down. What is your response to a highly

:27:16.:27:19.

critical report out today which says police forces are failing to tackle

:27:20.:27:23.

modern slavery and trafficking, because the cases are too difficult

:27:24.:27:27.

and victims are unprotected, despite a rise in cases and also that senior

:27:28.:27:33.

officers believe there is a lack of sympathy for victims. That s. That

:27:34.:27:40.

report is very critical, things have moved on somewhat. But because of

:27:41.:27:44.

the issues that we are seeing with this, the police and the agencies

:27:45.:27:49.

are not seeing it for what it is. We are not seeing victims supported,

:27:50.:27:53.

not seeing the criminals pursued. That report identifies the fact that

:27:54.:27:59.

this has been looked upon as some sort of issue, a marginalised issue

:28:00.:28:03.

that is something outside of the criminal justice system. So it is

:28:04.:28:07.

the prejudices of police officers when it comes to the victim and

:28:08.:28:11.

their backgrounds. It is not just the police, sometimes it is that,

:28:12.:28:15.

sometimes it is the lack of understanding and sometimes the

:28:16.:28:17.

services that are available to victims. In the wider issue of

:28:18.:28:23.

slavery, the support for victims has been insufficient to meet their

:28:24.:28:28.

needs. That is something I have been pushing for. Even those that come

:28:29.:28:35.

forward, if you look at the over 3,000 cases last year we were only

:28:36.:28:39.

seeing one in four ever recorded as a crime and something I brought to

:28:40.:28:43.

the attention in my report was about how we needed to see more crimes and

:28:44.:28:48.

we did see an increase, because it was not even ending up in an

:28:49.:28:53.

investigation. So we need to see processes that are there for other

:28:54.:28:59.

crimes and other vulnerability and when we see that and the victims the

:29:00.:29:04.

supported and looked after not just for the period the national referral

:29:05.:29:09.

mechanism says, that is the Government-supported agencyings but

:29:10.:29:13.

if we see them supported until their recovery and we see the police

:29:14.:29:19.

pursue the criminals, we will see this report, the issues address. If

:29:20.:29:25.

it is just a marginal issue we won't see them addressed. Are there

:29:26.:29:30.

parallels with cases of child exploitation such as in Rotherham,

:29:31.:29:34.

are these children being groomed in the same way but for drugs? It is

:29:35.:29:39.

exactly the same. If we look at cases where there have been

:29:40.:29:43.

prosecutions, in Northumbria, where we saw the high profile case, where

:29:44.:29:49.

the Chief Constable there dealt with as serious organised crime and got

:29:50.:29:53.

some criticism for the tactics he used, but he looked at it as serious

:29:54.:29:58.

organised crime and his aim was to protect the children and pursue the

:29:59.:30:02.

criminals. So I think we need to take that learning, from the child

:30:03.:30:08.

sexual exploitation and domestic violence, look at how long it took

:30:09.:30:13.

us to respond to that. And let's take that and not make the same

:30:14.:30:20.

mistake and miss the victims. Are there similarities where police

:30:21.:30:25.

officers like in the Rotherham and agencies there, maybe reluctant to

:30:26.:30:30.

take action, because they're fearful of being accused of being racist?

:30:31.:30:39.

If we start talking about this for what it is, it is serious org

:30:40.:30:48.

organised crime of abuse, let us forget about the immigration status,

:30:49.:30:54.

the arguments about race, let us look at this vulnerable people, they

:30:55.:30:59.

are being traded as a commodity and we are talking about children, and

:31:00.:31:05.

what we need do is see the police respond to that as serious organised

:31:06.:31:09.

crime. The other issues round the political arguments whether this is

:31:10.:31:14.

a race issue or not, we need to pursue the criminals no matter where

:31:15.:31:17.

they are from, the UK is taking leadership on the issue of modern

:31:18.:31:20.

slavery, it doesn't matter where they come from, whether they come

:31:21.:31:23.

from the UK or they come from somewhere else in the world, let us

:31:24.:31:27.

pursue them for what they are, criminals, let us look after the

:31:28.:31:31.

victims. What should police do if they come across a child who is

:31:32.:31:36.

caught selling drugs, hundreds of miles away from home, what should

:31:37.:31:40.

they do? They need to make sure that child is safe. At the moment are

:31:41.:31:44.

they communicating with where that child is from. You know, sometimes

:31:45.:31:50.

it is very plain, can that child organise that kind of activity, can

:31:51.:31:55.

a child say that it originates from London and ends up in Yorkshire, can

:31:56.:32:02.

they raise that -- arrange that themselves, where would they have

:32:03.:32:05.

bought the drugs from. That is beyond their ability, so look at

:32:06.:32:10.

that, and then as the police, you make the decisions, you are the

:32:11.:32:13.

adults, you are the authorities and then work with you know, social

:32:14.:32:18.

service, child protection, look at the background of how that child got

:32:19.:32:23.

there, and then, see who is organising, organising it, work with

:32:24.:32:26.

the police force where that child is from, start to see if will is a

:32:27.:32:30.

picture, how many children are is turned up in your police force area,

:32:31.:32:34.

build a picture up that isn't relianten a child telling you the

:32:35.:32:40.

story, the police have got lots of technique, lots of methods, tactic,

:32:41.:32:44.

to gather evidence, when they deal with drug dealing for example, they

:32:45.:32:48.

don't have a victim. They need to start using the resources they have

:32:49.:32:52.

got and find out who is doing this, who is the mastermind behind it and

:32:53.:32:54.

prosecute them. We approached the Home Office

:32:55.:33:08.

for an interview but Minister for Crime, Safeguarding

:33:09.:33:10.

and Vulnerability, Sarah Newton, And you can hear much more this

:33:11.:33:13.

story on File on 4 - A report on how the Government's

:33:14.:33:27.

scheme to help disabled people into work has been criticised

:33:28.:33:36.

as being unfit for purpose. We have been talking to sop of those

:33:37.:33:41.

who rely on programme. And we speak to Jonathan Cavendish

:33:42.:33:47.

whose father needed a breathing machine after contracting polio

:33:48.:33:50.

in the 50s, and went on to change the lives of disabled

:33:51.:33:53.

people around the world. Jonathan has now produced a film

:33:54.:33:54.

bringing his father's Time for the latest

:33:55.:34:02.

news - here's Reeta. Hospitals in England could carry out

:34:03.:34:13.

280,000 extra operations a year just by making better use

:34:14.:34:16.

of operating theatres. Analysis by the regulator NHS

:34:17.:34:18.

Improvement suggests more than twohours a day on average

:34:19.:34:20.

are lost because of late Police in England and Wales have

:34:21.:34:22.

been accused of letting down victims of modern slavery at every stage -

:34:23.:34:29.

in a scathing report The Inspectorate found that cases

:34:30.:34:31.

had been closed without any enquiries being made,

:34:32.:34:36.

and in some instances detectives Police say they fully accept

:34:37.:34:38.

the recommendations in the report A British former assistant

:34:39.:34:44.

of Harvey Weinstein says she was paid ?125,000 to keep quiet

:34:45.:34:46.

after accusing the movie mogul Zelda Perkins told

:34:47.:34:49.

the Financial Times she signed a non-disclosure agreement in 1998

:34:50.:34:52.

after making the accusations. She said Weinstein asked her to give

:34:53.:34:54.

him massages and tried Weinstein has denied any

:34:55.:34:57.

allegations of non-consensual That's a summary of

:34:58.:34:59.

the latest BBC News. Ronaldo has been crowned

:35:00.:35:16.

the greatest player in the world He beat his great rival Lionel Messi

:35:17.:35:21.

of Barcelona and PSG's Neymar to the trophy,

:35:22.:35:25.

in a ceremony in London. David Unsworth is expected to take

:35:26.:35:28.

tempoarary charge of Everton Names in the frame to take the job

:35:29.:35:31.

permanently include Carlo Ancelotti Scotland flanker John Hardie's

:35:32.:35:42.

suspension from Edinburgh and Scotland duty is because of

:35:43.:35:44.

alleged cocaine use, He'll be out of Scotland's squad

:35:45.:35:46.

for the autumn Tests on Tuesday. And Rob Greenwood, the coach accused

:35:47.:35:53.

of creating a "climate of fear" within the British para-swimming

:35:54.:35:56.

setup, has been given the "full support and backing"

:35:57.:35:58.

of the British Swimming More on all those

:35:59.:36:00.

stories just after ten. Plans have been announced

:36:01.:36:10.

for a special memorial service to commemorate the lives

:36:11.:36:13.

of the 80 people who died The service will take place exactly

:36:14.:36:15.

six months to the day at St Paul's Cathedral on 14th

:36:16.:36:19.

December. Here to tell us more

:36:20.:36:21.

are Shahin Sadafi, a Grenfell resident and survivor,

:36:22.:36:23.

and Graham Tomlin, the Welcome both to the programme. I

:36:24.:36:39.

want to come to you first, why did you decide collectively to hold a

:36:40.:36:47.

memorial service? Good morning. The reason for holding the memorial

:36:48.:36:53.

service, it was first and foremost to bring some more attention in

:36:54.:36:57.

regards to the needs of the brave families and to remember the lives

:36:58.:37:03.

lost on the tragic day on 14th June, unfortunately it was a devastating

:37:04.:37:07.

and traumatic event that took place, within this community, and it was an

:37:08.:37:13.

opportunity for us to gather the perked families and remember the

:37:14.:37:16.

lives of our friends, neighbours and family members that were lost on

:37:17.:37:21.

that day. Graham, how will something like this, a memorial service help

:37:22.:37:30.

the survivors of the Grenfell Tower fire, the families of those lost

:37:31.:37:34.

come to terms with what happened? Our hope is by bringing the nation

:37:35.:37:38.

together, there will be a sense that those who have died have not been

:37:39.:37:42.

forgotten, that the nation gathers around those who have been bereaved

:37:43.:37:45.

and are continuing to struggle with all kinds of issues since the fire,

:37:46.:37:50.

and offer support. This is not just a local event, although it has

:37:51.:37:53.

affected the local community massively but it is a national event

:37:54.:37:57.

so it is vital we do that as a nation, the other thing is there is

:37:58.:38:00.

something about a Cathedral when you cross the door, we are all the same,

:38:01.:38:05.

we are all the same before God, doesn't matter whether you are a the

:38:06.:38:12.

Queen, the Prime Minister, a resident of Kensington, our hope is

:38:13.:38:16.

this service will bring dignity to all those who are involved. Will

:38:17.:38:21.

this be a multi-faith service? It will be held and hosted by St Paul's

:38:22.:38:26.

Cathedral so clearly it will be something which has a Christian

:38:27.:38:30.

framework but one which has space for different faiths in it. We have

:38:31.:38:35.

been working with local faith leaders in the community ho are

:38:36.:38:39.

behind the venue and the concept of the service, we will be working on

:38:40.:38:42.

the content of the service over the coming weeks and months with the

:38:43.:38:46.

local community here, in mind, so it is something we hope that everyone

:38:47.:38:50.

of all faiths and none can take part in and feel they have a stake in it.

:38:51.:38:54.

Are you hoping to feed into that process along with other people from

:38:55.:39:03.

the community? Absolutely. When Graham first approached Grenfell

:39:04.:39:06.

United and myself to make sure that we first looked at the needs and

:39:07.:39:11.

viewpoints of the bereaved families, and then obviously the survivors of

:39:12.:39:15.

the tower, so what we will be doing, we have done already and what we

:39:16.:39:19.

will continue to do is make sure we set up sort of meetings, and

:39:20.:39:23.

opportunities for the local community, the bereaved families and

:39:24.:39:27.

the survive, to be able to feedback into us and St Paul's in regards to

:39:28.:39:31.

what they would like the see and have in the memorial service.

:39:32.:39:36.

Thank you both very much for joining us this morning.

:39:37.:39:37.

Coming up. . The story of a man who fought

:39:38.:39:38.

for a life outside hospital after being tethered to breathing

:39:39.:39:42.

equipment in the 1950s - brought Disability campaigners have

:39:43.:39:45.

criticised a key government scheme which helps deaf and disabled people

:39:46.:39:50.

in the workplace as The scheme provides support

:39:51.:39:52.

for deaf and disabled people beyond what employers are obliged

:39:53.:39:55.

to do by law. But a new report seen by this

:39:56.:39:58.

programme says Access to Work - once hailed as the most successful

:39:59.:40:01.

programme of its type - is beset by errors, delays

:40:02.:40:03.

and is being hit by a government Campaigners are calling

:40:04.:40:06.

on ministers to "restore and refit" the programme,

:40:07.:40:13.

which they say should be the cornerstone of the Government's

:40:14.:40:15.

drive to get one million more Just last month charities

:40:16.:40:18.

warned that more disabled people were leaving

:40:19.:40:24.

the workplace than joining. We've been to talk to some of those

:40:25.:40:26.

who rely on what was once called, I'm a human b I just don't

:40:27.:40:59.

understand how or why they think we are a problem. The thought of having

:41:00.:41:08.

to cut my hourers, I could feel, me Janet shrinking, because this small

:41:09.:41:13.

person and feeling quite terrified. Panic I was being abandoned. She had

:41:14.:41:19.

been there for a few months then it was ending next week I was going to

:41:20.:41:23.

different workplaces and seeing people at the end of their tenter,

:41:24.:41:28.

not knowing what do because their access to work support was being

:41:29.:41:33.

cut. It supporting deaf and disabled people at work, a new report claims

:41:34.:41:39.

it is no longer fit for purpose. It points to unacceptably poor

:41:40.:41:44.

customer service, shocking levels of delay, error, and a damaging drive

:41:45.:41:49.

to bear down on costs. Access to work was always described

:41:50.:41:53.

by deaf and disabled people as the Government's best kept secret. When

:41:54.:41:58.

access to Working Tax Credits it works really well, it enables us not

:41:59.:42:02.

just to get jobs gou have a choice of jobs, to go into the same range

:42:03.:42:06.

of professions as non-disabled people. So there will be different

:42:07.:42:12.

support provided, that could be a sign language interpreter, it could

:42:13.:42:15.

be ongoing support needs for a person with a learning difficulty,

:42:16.:42:19.

to be able to understand written information that comes to them, it

:42:20.:42:23.

could be support for someone with a physical impairment if they need to

:42:24.:42:27.

go to meetings and carry thing, it could be support with travel costs

:42:28.:42:30.

if you are not able to travel independently.

:42:31.:42:35.

From 2014 we noticed changes coming in. They weren't announced but there

:42:36.:42:40.

were changes that were impacting on the way people were receiving their

:42:41.:42:46.

support, from access to work, so more frequent review, people being

:42:47.:42:50.

denied support, more often than not. People being told by their advisers

:42:51.:42:55.

they needed to reduce the amount of support they were getting, there was

:42:56.:43:00.

a noticeable increase in hostile attitudes from advisers so

:43:01.:43:03.

accusations that people were a burden on the taxpayer, and the

:43:04.:43:08.

level of errors that we are seeing as making the scheme unworkable for

:43:09.:43:18.

people. My name is Gerald dine, my sign name

:43:19.:43:24.

is Geraldine. I am a project manager. Every time I receive a

:43:25.:43:31.

brown envelope, I get nervous. My budget has been cut twice this year.

:43:32.:43:39.

And only because of administrative errors, the administration the

:43:40.:43:43.

system doesn't work for deaf and disled people How important is it to

:43:44.:43:49.

work? It is an interesting question! Because when I look back, over my

:43:50.:43:57.

working life, I started, I left school, in the early 770s where we

:43:58.:44:01.

never had interpreters there and life was really difficult. Now I am

:44:02.:44:05.

in control, I have had a good career, I have been a director of an

:44:06.:44:13.

organisation, I have managed big budget, I worked for health and

:44:14.:44:17.

Social Services, I'm a project manager now. And it has given me a

:44:18.:44:21.

career, it has given meaning to my life. It is such an important

:44:22.:44:27.

resource and it has meant I can face the world with pride and respect for

:44:28.:44:33.

myself as well. The Government say they would want

:44:34.:44:36.

more people to be in your position and bearing down on costs so they

:44:37.:44:40.

can bring it to more people and let more people do what you have done.

:44:41.:44:45.

That is a reasonable thing to do isn't it isn't I don't think it is

:44:46.:44:51.

up to tell a disabled or deaf people you need this support. How do they

:44:52.:44:56.

know? We are the experts of our impairment. We know what we need to

:44:57.:45:03.

do our jobs well, the resource is brilliant, when it works well, it is

:45:04.:45:07.

brilliant. I just want the system to be better.

:45:08.:45:14.

Urnt currently access is awarded to individuals, for a time limited

:45:15.:45:18.

period of six months, the problem with that is that many people their

:45:19.:45:21.

support needs are not simply going to go away, after six month, they

:45:22.:45:23.

are going to continue. I'm jewel Julia. Julia has Aspergers

:45:24.:45:45.

syndrome and anxiety disorder. What it is like being in a work place

:45:46.:45:50.

with your condition? When nothing obviously has gone wrong, you can go

:45:51.:45:55.

from being completely calm and happy to being just unable to function

:45:56.:46:03.

within minutes. I use the word "word blindness", because I was looking at

:46:04.:46:08.

a document and I was in panic mode, I could see the word, I had the

:46:09.:46:14.

ability to read, but panic meant I couldn't read it. The frustration of

:46:15.:46:19.

knowing that you're capable of doing so much more, because I had done

:46:20.:46:22.

highly responsible jobs in my previous job. I couldn't understand

:46:23.:46:29.

why I had this mental block on doing simple tasks. I realised it was to

:46:30.:46:35.

do with the Aspergers, because I couldn't see the big picture. The

:46:36.:46:40.

support from access to work enabled me to continue throughout many

:46:41.:46:45.

periods when without the support I probably would have to just... There

:46:46.:46:50.

was a couple of points where I would have just have had to walk out and

:46:51.:46:59.

say, I can't do this any more. Last June Julia was told the support was

:47:00.:47:03.

ended and she had a heart attack the next day. Did you feel when you

:47:04.:47:09.

heard the support was ending? Panic, that I was being abandoned, it was a

:47:10.:47:17.

feeling that she'd been there for a few months and suddenly it was like

:47:18.:47:22.

the support is ending next week. When I look at the amount of things

:47:23.:47:26.

I was trying to do within a short period of time, I was a heart attack

:47:27.:47:28.

waiting to happen. Investing access to work has wider

:47:29.:47:59.

societal benefits and there has never been an upper limit on the

:48:00.:48:03.

budget that has been set. Disabled people are confused about this idea

:48:04.:48:07.

of advisors contacting them and telling them that they need to

:48:08.:48:11.

reduce the amount of support that they're receiving.

:48:12.:48:19.

I'm Jenny, I'm a director and Executive of grey eye theatre. I

:48:20.:48:30.

have learned my trade and how to cope in big meetings.

:48:31.:48:36.

So without all of that, my confidence to become the deaf woman

:48:37.:48:47.

I am, the director I am, I would never have thought to say, I want to

:48:48.:48:55.

be the codirector of the Paralympic opening ceremony. It gave me the

:48:56.:49:00.

confidence to do that. It is vital. I think for the importance of

:49:01.:49:06.

ceremony, many deaf were involved, many deaf, disabled people, all with

:49:07.:49:10.

support, full support from access to work, that is the time when they

:49:11.:49:16.

were awesome and some of the access to work people came to watch

:49:17.:49:22.

rehearsals and met the deaf people that were benefitting from the

:49:23.:49:29.

money. So it felt... Really, really linked and aware and an

:49:30.:49:32.

understanding and then when he were all like, we were rocking, we have

:49:33.:49:34.

done it. Then gone. The cap means literally half of my

:49:35.:49:53.

hours gone. After 2012, going from 35 hours a week, they said I could

:49:54.:50:00.

have 72 hours a month. A massive reduction. It is my right-to-work

:50:01.:50:06.

full-time. And having to cut my hours, I could feel me, Jenny,

:50:07.:50:11.

shrinking, becausing this small person, feeling quite terrified

:50:12.:50:16.

about what my future is. I can't believe it is going to happen. So I

:50:17.:50:21.

can't think beyond April, because it makes me feel quite sick. I have

:50:22.:50:31.

thought what am I going to do. Government say the changes and the

:50:32.:50:35.

cap is about widening the reach of the scheme to enable more people

:50:36.:50:39.

like yourself to achieve the things that you have achieved. That is

:50:40.:50:47.

BLEEP. I know you can't say that. What we are seeing is people who

:50:48.:50:52.

receive small amounts of support are still having their hours cut and it

:50:53.:50:57.

seems to be driven by an ideology that people shouldn't depend for

:50:58.:51:01.

support and they need to reduce support at all costs. I'm Nicky and

:51:02.:51:12.

I'm a sign language interpreter. Access to work is one of most

:51:13.:51:17.

important scheme, because it allows deaf and disabled people to smash

:51:18.:51:22.

through the glass ceiling. Before there was not deaf professionals in

:51:23.:51:26.

any kind of job you can imagine. They were limited in what they could

:51:27.:51:30.

do. People just want to be able to do their jobs. And they just... Feel

:51:31.:51:37.

like they're doing something wrong. Like you're asking for a favour,

:51:38.:51:44.

would you mind giving me some money for support. They would say they

:51:45.:51:49.

have a pledge to half the employment gap between disabled and

:51:50.:51:52.

non-disabled people. The changes to access to work are about closing

:51:53.:51:57.

that gap and getting a million more disabled people into work. Well, I

:51:58.:52:03.

hope they will have one more million people into work, deaf and disabled

:52:04.:52:10.

people, but we all need the full amount of access and independence to

:52:11.:52:13.

get to work. Of course we want to work. There is a myth that deaf and

:52:14.:52:18.

disabled people don't want to work. We do. We really, really do and my

:52:19.:52:25.

God we are good. Through education we have the best, so there is a

:52:26.:52:30.

real... You know hunger to be there. But the Government need to realise

:52:31.:52:35.

that they still have to pay to support our access. They do. And I'm

:52:36.:52:40.

sorry, where some of the other money goes... Put that money writ really

:52:41.:52:44.

matters. The Department for Work and Pensions

:52:45.:52:47.

didn't have a minister available to talk to us but the department

:52:48.:52:50.

told us: In one of the most moving

:52:51.:53:13.

roles of his career, Andrew Garfield plays

:53:14.:53:16.

Robin Cavendish, a man who was paralysed from the neck down

:53:17.:53:18.

in 1958, but refused to live out his days in an iron

:53:19.:53:21.

lung in hospital. With the love and support of his

:53:22.:53:24.

wife Diana, played by Claire Foy, Robin broke free and changed not

:53:25.:53:27.

only his life, but that of disabled Their real story has been brought

:53:28.:53:30.

to the big screen by their son I'll be speaking to Jonathan

:53:31.:53:37.

and Diana in a moment, but first let's take a look

:53:38.:53:43.

at a scene where Jonathan - as a little boy - is introduced

:53:44.:53:46.

to his father at home What happens if there

:53:47.:53:48.

is a power cut? Sadly Robin died in 1994

:53:49.:54:04.

before the film was made, but I'm pleased to say Jonathan

:54:05.:54:48.

and Diana are with me now. You were watching that clip with me.

:54:49.:54:58.

How does it feel to watch yourself, as a baby, meeting your father for

:54:59.:55:03.

the first time? Well, it is a slightly strange thing. In this clip

:55:04.:55:08.

here in the film, my father's just broken out of hospital with my

:55:09.:55:12.

mother. Because he didn't want to live the rest of his life lying down

:55:13.:55:19.

in bed in a hospital. He wanted to live free. When he was in hospital

:55:20.:55:22.

for the first year or so after he got pel polio, he was depressed and

:55:23.:55:29.

he didn't want to see me as a baby. As a reminder of what he might have

:55:30.:55:34.

lost. Did you wander why he was older. He had seen me, but not

:55:35.:55:37.

wanted to connect. This was the first time he had really connected

:55:38.:55:43.

with me. Out of hospital, living free with my mother and about to

:55:44.:55:48.

have an amazing life. That must be difficult for you to know and to

:55:49.:55:52.

hear about later on? Not at all difficult, because what my parents

:55:53.:55:56.

fashioned was this extraordinary joyous, wonderful existence that I

:55:57.:56:01.

was a part of, I tagged alongside it and we had a wonderful time. It was

:56:02.:56:08.

very funny and my father was two minutes from death at any time,

:56:09.:56:12.

because he relied on a breathing machine. But as a child, I never

:56:13.:56:16.

realised that, because my parents dealt with it so elegantly. What was

:56:17.:56:21.

that moment like, it sounds dramatic, having to break out of the

:56:22.:56:26.

hospital? Well, I mean the point was they didn't want Robin to go,

:56:27.:56:29.

because they liked people, they said, we do not know what the

:56:30.:56:36.

long-term effect of operation is and Robin said I would rather die out of

:56:37.:56:41.

hospital than stay here for the rest of my life. And he was right of

:56:42.:56:46.

course. And the... Did you resist at any point? No. No, what was the

:56:47.:56:52.

point? You could see he didn't want, it would have been ridiculous. No

:56:53.:56:58.

life at all. I suppose looking back on it I suppose it was quite

:56:59.:57:03.

adventurous, I am not sure we thought like that at the time. But

:57:04.:57:09.

we had a lot of help from friends and family and actually we stole one

:57:10.:57:13.

or two of the nurses from the hospital! They were not very

:57:14.:57:18.

pleased! It is an extraordinary story. Why did you decide to bring

:57:19.:57:22.

your father's story to the big screen? I'm a film producer and I'm

:57:23.:57:28.

always looking for stories, but it took me time to realise I was

:57:29.:57:33.

sitting on this amazing story. The reason for the telling it was first

:57:34.:57:41.

of all I work with a great writer Bill Nichol and a great director and

:57:42.:57:46.

this amazing cast. So we could be accurate about the life that was

:57:47.:57:51.

led. Because I was there and there are lots of lines of dialogue that I

:57:52.:57:55.

remember being spoken or were handed down. Such as when my parents did

:57:56.:57:58.

break out of hospital, the consultant looking after them

:57:59.:58:02.

shouted after them, you will be dead in two weeks. That is what my

:58:03.:58:07.

parents told me. I wanted to make a film about how you can laugh

:58:08.:58:12.

disaster in the face and joer come difficulties -- overcome

:58:13.:58:15.

difficulties and my parents and this Willem bar -- will embarrass my

:58:16.:58:28.

mother, it was a great love story. They set up an independent life and

:58:29.:58:33.

helped others do the same. Robin changed the rights of disabled

:58:34.:58:39.

people forever. How concerned were you about authenticity when it comes

:58:40.:58:49.

to telling a real story? Very concerned, so everything in the film

:58:50.:58:53.

happened. A lot of the dialogue was dialogue spoken. But it is, it is a

:58:54.:58:59.

very funny film, there is a huge amount of comedy in it. My memory of

:59:00.:59:04.

my parents' life and my life with them and their friends was a

:59:05.:59:13.

constant adventure. My father's enemy was boredom. There was no

:59:14.:59:18.

internet, no television and he created tasks and project and they

:59:19.:59:22.

would travel all over the place. He had a van adapted so he could

:59:23.:59:28.

travel. We went to Spain and broke down there and for 36 hours while

:59:29.:59:35.

the inventor of the machine rebuilt a breathing machine back in London,

:59:36.:59:41.

we sat hand pumping my father. I can remember my mother saying you must

:59:42.:59:47.

not fall asleep. It was very funny and people came from the village and

:59:48.:59:53.

gave us food. But the whole thing was an adventure and fun and amazing

:59:54.:59:59.

to be part of. How big a role did you have in casting. Claire Foy

:00:00.:00:05.

plays you. I had no role. You didn't get a say on who plays you? I'm

:00:06.:00:10.

happy, because Andrew is brilliant and Claire is wonderful and I mean I

:00:11.:00:15.

don't know whether she is like me, but she is marvellous. She is very

:00:16.:00:20.

like you! And Andrew and Claire took so much trouble and you know I met

:00:21.:00:26.

up with them beforehand and told them the story about Andrew ringing

:00:27.:00:27.

you up. 123450 bit by lit learned more.

:00:28.:00:44.

Three weeks before we started filming I got a phone call, picked

:00:45.:00:48.

up a message from my dead father, talking to me exactly as he would,

:00:49.:00:53.

and I was in shock, at the end of it Andrew's voice said who is the voice

:00:54.:00:58.

doing, how am I getting on? By the end, it is not on an extraordinary

:00:59.:01:02.

performance, he takes on the personality and the spirit and the

:01:03.:01:06.

voice and look of my father in an amazing way. When is the film out?

:01:07.:01:12.

This Friday in cinemas near you. Thank you for talking to us.

:01:13.:01:16.

Breaking news just in, it has just been confirmed a British man has

:01:17.:01:22.

been killed in Syria, while clearing landmines in Raqqa, Jack Holmes

:01:23.:01:27.

within an IT worker who left the UK and joined the main Kurdish force

:01:28.:01:35.

fighting so-called Islamic State. Let us get the latest weather update

:01:36.:01:40.

with Carol. This morning we have seen a lot of cloud, some mist, fog

:01:41.:01:44.

round, murky conditions and rain and the rain currently across Wales and

:01:45.:01:48.

north-west England pushing over towards the Wash and Norfolk through

:01:49.:01:51.

the course of the day. It will clear Cumbria. The rain in Scotland and

:01:52.:01:56.

Northern Ireland will clear, leaving sunny spells and few showers and in

:01:57.:02:00.

southern County, although it's a murky start it's a mild one, what we

:02:01.:02:05.

will find it is brighten up. Any sunshine will be a premium. We

:02:06.:02:08.

continue with the rain, edging from the west towards the east, a lot of

:02:09.:02:13.

showers across Scotland. Once again, like the night just gone, it is

:02:14.:02:17.

going to be a mild one with temperatures not falling lower than

:02:18.:02:20.

nine or 13 degrees defending on which part of the country you are.

:02:21.:02:26.

Tomorrow it sinks southwards. Murky in the south-west, but behind it, it

:02:27.:02:30.

will brighten up nicely and for many of us tomorrow, we will see a lot of

:02:31.:02:33.

sunshine, but still, a peppering of showers in the north and the west.

:02:34.:02:38.

Temperatures still hiring than they should be in October, we are looking

:02:39.:02:42.

at 11 to 18. It cools down as we head through Friday and into the

:02:43.:02:43.

weekend. These exploiters have more control

:02:44.:03:15.

of your own children than you do, to the point where you become the

:03:16.:03:19.

outsiders, and children view them as the family.

:03:20.:03:19.

We'll also hear from those who are involved in tackling

:03:20.:03:23.

Campaigners have told us that disabled people are losing out

:03:24.:03:28.

on jobs because a government scheme to help them into work

:03:29.:03:30.

is not fit for purpose - we've been talking to some of those

:03:31.:03:33.

The thought of having to cut my hours, I could feel me,

:03:34.:03:42.

Janet, shrinking, becoming a small person and feeling quite terrified

:03:43.:03:44.

Have you applied for Access to Work what was your experience?

:03:45.:03:51.

And the Supreme Court will consider whether Northern Ireland law

:03:52.:04:00.

breaches women's rights by not allowing abortions in cases

:04:01.:04:02.

of sexual crime and fatal foetal abnormalities.

:04:03.:04:16.

Here's Reeta in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

:04:17.:04:21.

Police in England and Wales have been accused of letting down victims

:04:22.:04:24.

of modern slavery at every stage - in a scathing report

:04:25.:04:26.

The Inspectorate found that cases had been closed without any

:04:27.:04:30.

enquiries being made, and in some instances detectives

:04:31.:04:32.

Police say they fully accept the recommendations in the report

:04:33.:04:42.

The police have got lots of techniques, lots of methods,

:04:43.:04:44.

When they deal with drug dealing, for example,

:04:45.:04:48.

They need to start using the resources they have got and find

:04:49.:04:52.

out who's doing this, who is the master mind behind it

:04:53.:04:54.

In a few minutes time, we'll be hearing from some of those

:04:55.:05:05.

involved in the fight against modern slavery including a former gang

:05:06.:05:07.

Hospitals in England could carry out 280,000 extra operations a year

:05:08.:05:13.

just by making better use of operating theatres.

:05:14.:05:15.

Analysis by the watchdog NHS Improvement, due

:05:16.:05:17.

out later this week, suggests that an average of 2 hours

:05:18.:05:20.

a day are lost in operating theatres because of late starts

:05:21.:05:22.

The European Council President, Donald Tusk, has urged the remaining

:05:23.:05:31.

EU member countries to stick together as negotiations

:05:32.:05:33.

If we fail it the negotiations will end in our defeat. We must keep our

:05:34.:05:57.

unity regardless on the direct hundred of the talk, the EU will be

:05:58.:06:03.

able to rise to every scenario as long as we are not divided. It is in

:06:04.:06:10.

fact up to London how this will end, with a good deal, no deal, or no

:06:11.:06:18.

Brexit. But in each of these scenarios, we will protect our

:06:19.:06:21.

common interest only be being together.

:06:22.:06:29.

A British man has been killed while clearing landmines in Raqqa. Jack

:06:30.:06:37.

Holmes had been fighting with the Kurdish militia the YPG since 2015.

:06:38.:06:41.

Kurdish representatives in the UK said they had been told by YPG

:06:42.:06:45.

officials that the former IT workers was killed while he was clearing an

:06:46.:06:49.

area of landmines to make it safe for civilians.

:06:50.:06:54.

A 53-year old man is due in court today charged in connection

:06:55.:06:57.

with an armed siege that lasted 4 hours at a bowling alley in Nuneaton

:06:58.:07:00.

David Clark is charged with false imprisonment, criminal damage,

:07:01.:07:03.

and possessing a blade and an imitation firearm.

:07:04.:07:10.

A British former assistant of Harvey Weinstein says

:07:11.:07:12.

she was paid ?125,000 to keep quiet after accusing the movie mogul

:07:13.:07:15.

Zelda Perkins told the Financial Times she signed

:07:16.:07:18.

a non-disclosure agreement in 1998 after making the accusations.

:07:19.:07:20.

She said Weinstein asked her to give him massages and tried

:07:21.:07:23.

Weinstein has denied any allegations of non-consensual

:07:24.:07:26.

Disability campaigners have criticised a key government scheme

:07:27.:07:31.

which helps deaf and disabled people in the workplace

:07:32.:07:34.

The scheme provides support for people with disabilities

:07:35.:07:37.

beyond what employers are obliged to do by law.

:07:38.:07:44.

But a new report seen by this programme says Access to Work -

:07:45.:07:47.

once hailed as the most successful programme of its type -

:07:48.:07:49.

is beset by errors, delays and is being hit by a government

:07:50.:07:52.

The Government says it's "committed to supporting disabled people to get

:07:53.:07:56.

And some of those who use the Access to Work scheme will be telling us

:07:57.:08:05.

about their experiences a little later on - that's at around

:08:06.:08:08.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.30.

:08:09.:08:19.

Breaking news, Stuart Bingham the 2015 World Snooker champion has been

:08:20.:08:34.

banned for six months for breaching the WWSA betting rules. Three months

:08:35.:08:39.

and one day will be suspended if he complies with any treatment

:08:40.:08:43.

recommended to him, for his gambling, and if he commits no

:08:44.:08:48.

further rule breach, Bingham still has the option to appeal but he will

:08:49.:08:52.

miss the three most lucrative tournaments outside of the World

:08:53.:08:53.

tournaments outside of the World Championship.

:08:54.:08:55.

Ronaldo has been crowned the greatest footballer

:08:56.:08:57.

of the year, at the 2017 Best Fifa Awards in London.

:08:58.:09:03.

His Real Madrid coach Zinedine Zidane was named best coach too.

:09:04.:09:06.

Ronaldo beat Lionel Messi of Barcelona and PSG's

:09:07.:09:08.

Neymar to the honour, after helping Real

:09:09.:09:09.

to a Champions League and La Liga double last season.

:09:10.:09:12.

Leeka Martens of Barcelona and the Netherlands won

:09:13.:09:14.

Lieke Martens of Barcelona and the Netherlands won

:09:15.:09:25.

She was Player of the Tournament at Euro 2017 this summer,

:09:26.:09:29.

Her manager Sarina Veegman was named 'Best Female Coach'.

:09:30.:09:33.

David Unsworth will take temporary charge of Everton,

:09:34.:09:34.

following the sacking of Ronald Koeman yesterday.

:09:35.:09:36.

Unsworth will lead the team their league cup game

:09:37.:09:38.

Names in the frame to take the job permanently are David Moyes,

:09:39.:09:42.

who enjoyed a successful spell at the club, had a tough time

:09:43.:09:45.

with other teams since leaving including that Premier League

:09:46.:09:47.

He's done a brilliant job at Burnley to keep them in the Premier League

:09:48.:09:55.

and they've had a good start to the season.

:09:56.:09:57.

Sam Alladyce, granted he last just one game as England manager,

:09:58.:10:00.

he is know for getting teams out of sticky situations,

:10:01.:10:02.

although currently in retirement since quitting Crystal Palace four

:10:03.:10:04.

And Carlo Ancelotti, the biggest name linked to this job,

:10:05.:10:16.

three-times Champions League winner, he is free after leaving

:10:17.:10:19.

Whoever takes charge, they'll have some serious work

:10:20.:10:22.

to do, with Everton bottom of their group in the Europa League,

:10:23.:10:26.

bottom three in the Premier League and without a win in five games.

:10:27.:10:34.

Rob Greenwood, the coach accused of creating a "climate of fear"

:10:35.:10:36.

within the British para-swimming setup, has been given

:10:37.:10:38.

the "full support and backing" of the British Swimming Coaches

:10:39.:10:41.

This comes despite British Swimming issuing an apology to athletes

:10:42.:10:44.

and admitting some of their swimmers needed counselling after being

:10:45.:10:46.

"visibly distressed" recounting their experiences.

:10:47.:10:51.

Greenwood resigned from his position before the investigation began

:10:52.:10:53.

and is yet to comment publicly about the findings.

:10:54.:11:00.

England forward Sam Burgess says the squad for the 2017 World Cup has

:11:01.:11:03.

more "X Factor" than the team that got to

:11:04.:11:05.

England play their first match against holders Australia

:11:06.:11:22.

Burgess also said that Rob Andrew doesn't know the full story

:11:23.:11:25.

about his role at the 2015 rugby union World Cup, for

:11:26.:11:28.

The RFU's former director of professional rugby called his

:11:29.:11:31.

Rob went round the camp. He didn't see the work I had put in, he didn't

:11:32.:11:39.

see how I contributed to the squad, he didn't see how I hard I worked,

:11:40.:11:44.

whatsoever, he is not in the trench, he doesn't see what happened. I

:11:45.:11:50.

disagree with him. I am proud of my performance for England, what I

:11:51.:11:55.

contributed to the team. Unfort theyly the results didn't go as we

:11:56.:11:58.

planned. He is entitled to his opinion and he is trying to sell his

:11:59.:12:05.

book, so fair play to him. That is all the sport for now.

:12:06.:12:07.

A leading charity says thousands of kids from London

:12:08.:12:11.

are being trafficked around the country by gangs to sell drugs.

:12:12.:12:14.

The Modern Slavery commissioner says the stats are shocking

:12:15.:12:16.

and they are only starting to get to grips with it now.

:12:17.:12:19.

The police call this 'county lines' - and it's sometimes

:12:20.:12:21.

known as 'cuckooing' - because the teenagers travel

:12:22.:12:23.

from inner city areas across county lines to other towns to sell

:12:24.:12:26.

the drugs, often from the home of a vulnerable drug user.

:12:27.:12:29.

Last year, the National Crime Agency described it as a "national

:12:30.:12:32.

problem", with around 70% of forces reporting they were dealing

:12:33.:12:45.

Yesterday, Chloe Tilley spoke to the mum of one boy

:12:46.:12:48.

who was groomed by gangs in his early teens.

:12:49.:12:51.

We've protected her identity because her son is still at risk.

:12:52.:12:58.

When did you notice things were going wrong for your son? Roughly,

:12:59.:13:07.

aren't year eight. A year after starting secondary school. Just

:13:08.:13:14.

changes in behaviour. Very extreme changes, and a lot of it, you can

:13:15.:13:24.

expect to happen round that age. But this was something that was quite

:13:25.:13:32.

stark, and it was, it wasn't gradual. A real personality

:13:33.:13:39.

transformation, quite quickly. Using real course language and kiss

:13:40.:13:46.

playing real bad anger -- displaying real bad anger issues and there was

:13:47.:13:51.

no reason for it, so it was all very difficult to deal with. It was

:13:52.:13:56.

almost like it wasn't your own son. It was a little bit later on that he

:13:57.:14:02.

started to go missing. Yes. There was about 18 months of activity,

:14:03.:14:10.

which was very out of character. Behavioural indicators that were not

:14:11.:14:15.

quite right, and he then went missing. The first episode was for a

:14:16.:14:20.

substantial number of days, totally out of the blue. And he came home of

:14:21.:14:25.

his own accord? No, he was found by police and we were told that he had

:14:26.:14:31.

been groomed by a gang that were well-known to police for extreme

:14:32.:14:36.

violence during the missing episode, which obviously was just

:14:37.:14:40.

jaw-dropping a as parent, to have to hear those words. Because you are

:14:41.:14:45.

not expecting anything like that to be the cause of all those

:14:46.:14:51.

behaviours, all the missing episode, and that takes quite a lot of

:14:52.:14:57.

getting used to, to hear your son's name being mentioned around that

:14:58.:15:03.

sort of setting. It, it is a really bizarre thing to get your head

:15:04.:15:07.

round, really the trouble started after the missing episode because

:15:08.:15:14.

they were still ongoing suspicions, around his activities an behaviour,

:15:15.:15:19.

in other words, it didn't stop, after the initial missing episode.

:15:20.:15:25.

There were suspicious activity, or mobile phones, things that went

:15:26.:15:31.

missing from the house. You know, presence of things in a school bag

:15:32.:15:35.

you wouldn't associate with a child. Like what? Digital scales for

:15:36.:15:41.

weighing out drugs and it was clear, despite that horrific missing

:15:42.:15:46.

episode when weer with told what was going on, we were were to all

:15:47.:15:49.

intents an purposes left to it. He was give an youth worker, but if

:15:50.:16:00.

you're a groomed or exploited child, then it's clear that intervention is

:16:01.:16:05.

it not going to succeed. And it didn't succeed. He promptly refused

:16:06.:16:10.

to engage with them and it is now clear that is a common feature of

:16:11.:16:17.

county lines exploitation. The children are taught, influenced to

:16:18.:16:21.

hate police and authority figures. So you're not going to be answerable

:16:22.:16:28.

to engage with them. They have almost been taken over mentally. I

:16:29.:16:34.

use the word brainwash, because that is how it looks. They have these...

:16:35.:16:40.

Exploiters have more control over your own children than you do. To

:16:41.:16:44.

the point where you become the outsiders and the children view them

:16:45.:16:53.

as the family. We then moved on to a nine-month spell, continuous of

:16:54.:16:58.

missing episodes on a daily basis. That was roughly just shy of 200 odd

:16:59.:17:07.

missing episodes and it's very difficult to explain to somebody

:17:08.:17:12.

what that looks like in reality. Because you have the police camped

:17:13.:17:16.

in your house, but life is going on at the same time. You know, looking

:17:17.:17:23.

back now, there should have been more support than there was, but

:17:24.:17:31.

it's not not even as if that wasn't made known to the agencies at the

:17:32.:17:34.

time. There was a lack of recognition that he was involved in

:17:35.:17:42.

gangs. Or that he'd been exploited. What effect did it have on you and

:17:43.:17:47.

your family? It is difficult, because the nature of the missing

:17:48.:17:51.

episodes being as they were, for hours and hours, and sometimes going

:17:52.:17:56.

into two days, you just don't sleep you know? Because you have got

:17:57.:18:02.

contact with the police throughout the night. Whilst he has gone

:18:03.:18:06.

missing you're going to get the call to say that he has been stabbed or

:18:07.:18:11.

killed in some sort of altercation. So it is a different alien world,

:18:12.:18:16.

because whilst you're sitting in in the late hours waiting, you're

:18:17.:18:21.

completely aware that the world that he is mixing in isn't the same one

:18:22.:18:28.

as you're sitting in. Let's talk about the interventions, what could

:18:29.:18:32.

have been done differently? So many things could have been done

:18:33.:18:40.

differently. My son divulged to a profebgssal fessional that he was in

:18:41.:18:43.

contact with a 27-year-old male. But nothing was done. That was at the

:18:44.:18:47.

start of the professional intervention. We thought that

:18:48.:18:51.

someone would be at our door to gain more information about that

:18:52.:18:57.

statement. Nothing happened. You know, if you have got one family who

:18:58.:19:03.

is making phone calls five days in a row, that is excessive. When you

:19:04.:19:08.

have got somebody doing it for nine months, it is just inexcusable.

:19:09.:19:13.

Somebody should have got in touch with us and said, what's going on

:19:14.:19:19.

here? How can we help so you're not having to do this every day? For any

:19:20.:19:25.

parent watching, who might be concerned about their own children,

:19:26.:19:30.

what would you say? Trust your instincts. Know your child. Most

:19:31.:19:34.

parents know when there is something wrong. That is why they're thinking

:19:35.:19:39.

something is not right, because they have noticed a change. I would say

:19:40.:19:44.

go with your gut instinct. How is your son now? He is on a slightly

:19:45.:19:50.

different more positive trajectory, but it has come after a long time

:19:51.:19:54.

and we have still got a lot of work to do and we have still got a lot of

:19:55.:19:59.

time to catch up and we still don't know what the future's going to look

:20:00.:20:06.

like for him. I've had to work really hard personally to achieve

:20:07.:20:11.

what we have got now and it shouldn't be down to the parent to

:20:12.:20:15.

do that. It should be down to the professionals. Unfortunately with my

:20:16.:20:21.

situation, it was very close that the experts on country lines were

:20:22.:20:23.

not the professionals. We can chat about this more

:20:24.:20:27.

now with Junior Smart, a former gang member who now works

:20:28.:20:30.

for St Giles Trust - which helps people leave gangs -

:20:31.:20:33.

and is one of the charities that has won funding from the

:20:34.:20:36.

Home Office today. councillor responsible for child

:20:37.:20:40.

safeguarding and who recently led a cross party group of MPs who met

:20:41.:20:44.

the Home Office minister responsible How big a problem this is, county

:20:45.:21:05.

lines, cuckooing, in Islington? We have found 75 young people involved

:21:06.:21:09.

in this. We are not a big area and so it is likely there are other

:21:10.:21:13.

local authorities where there are far more young people involved.

:21:14.:21:15.

There could be thousands of young people involved in this. How

:21:16.:21:20.

worrying is that for you and is this something that is new? It is not

:21:21.:21:28.

new, it has been going on for about 20 year, but it has just become

:21:29.:21:32.

visible. We are told we have to safeguard children and we want to do

:21:33.:21:36.

that, but we don't have to tools to do that, because we can't work cross

:21:37.:21:40.

boundary with every local authority and police force where young people

:21:41.:21:44.

may be, without leadership from national level and a national

:21:45.:21:48.

strategy I don't think we are going to get to grip with this on our own.

:21:49.:21:53.

You had a meeting at the Home Office with other councillors about trying

:21:54.:21:58.

to develop a national strategy, because it does involve people

:21:59.:22:01.

travelling to different parts of the country to sell drugs. How did that

:22:02.:22:06.

go? Not as well as I would have liked it. The minister will not

:22:07.:22:11.

introduce a national strategy and believes we should do things in

:22:12.:22:15.

other ways. I argued that I think because this is a national problem

:22:16.:22:18.

it needs a national solution and without that leadership, if we

:22:19.:22:21.

become effective at working in some areas, the gangs will move

:22:22.:22:25.

elsewhere. The reason they started doing this was they knew services

:22:26.:22:29.

were bad at working with each other. So without that national response we

:22:30.:22:32.

can't do it and I urge the minister to think again. Gina, we don't know

:22:33.:22:40.

the true scale of the problem, but the charities for London estimate

:22:41.:22:44.

about 4,000 children in London could be victims of this. How do children

:22:45.:22:51.

get involved in the first place? There is many different ways. Quite

:22:52.:22:59.

commonly people like too think this is the deprived communities, sink

:23:00.:23:05.

estates, but I have received many phone calls like the mother we have

:23:06.:23:11.

heard from and from dual part households -- parent households, the

:23:12.:23:17.

criminality attaches itself to what ever is missing from that person's

:23:18.:23:25.

family. One kid was getting good pocket money, but he wanted to be

:23:26.:23:29.

that guy. You can point the finger at messages on social media, the

:23:30.:23:39.

videos that glamorise the lifestyle. Be But the reality is anything but

:23:40.:23:45.

that. Does a young person know they're being exploiteded when you

:23:46.:23:51.

end up in scare situations with drugs you're often in a crack house

:23:52.:23:55.

or in a property and actually you're in an area you don't know anybody.

:23:56.:23:58.

The young people tell us the reality is sairy. -- scary. It can affect

:23:59.:24:07.

not only deprived children, but middle class kids. What are the

:24:08.:24:12.

signs, how do these gangs lure children in to the point where they

:24:13.:24:17.

don't realise it is happen something Well from a parent, from they're

:24:18.:24:24.

saying is they see drastic changes in the child's behaviour, new

:24:25.:24:29.

possessions, additional mobile phones, things they can't account

:24:30.:24:33.

for. The young people say they're looking for escapism and it depends

:24:34.:24:37.

what that young person wants or needs, if it is respect, the group

:24:38.:24:44.

tends to provide, if it is finance. To deal with with this requires a

:24:45.:24:49.

joined up approach across all the services, police, probation and

:24:50.:24:54.

charities, but it requires that organisations to communicate with

:24:55.:25:00.

each other. We are lucky the work we do in schools with St Giles trust

:25:01.:25:07.

provides that consistent one-to-one support and we have that cultural

:25:08.:25:11.

currency, we know what the reality is. Young people tend to trust us.

:25:12.:25:18.

Now let's get the police perspective. How big a problem is

:25:19.:25:23.

this for you, where you are? Yes this is a big problem that we are

:25:24.:25:27.

dealing w it is something we are familiar with over a number of years

:25:28.:25:31.

sadly. The reports you have heard are shocking for people to hear. But

:25:32.:25:36.

it is something that day in, day out any officers are dealing as they are

:25:37.:25:41.

trying to deal with the problems of drug abuse. There is a highly

:25:42.:25:46.

critical report which says that police forces are failing to tackle

:25:47.:25:52.

modern slavery and fail being victims at every level and officers

:25:53.:25:59.

believe the public lack of simp thif for victim -- sympathy for victims

:26:00.:26:04.

is partly to blame. How do you respond to that? The report today is

:26:05.:26:08.

something that we as a police service need to respond to and look

:26:09.:26:14.

at how we can develop and improve. However, by way of reassurance it is

:26:15.:26:17.

fundamental that our staff do put victims at the heart of everything

:26:18.:26:23.

that we do. It is key to us in Suffolk here in terms of our

:26:24.:26:26.

policing style and response. The report that you're talking about

:26:27.:26:30.

refers to modern day slavery, but as you will be aware there is a range

:26:31.:26:34.

of tactics that we use as a police service to tackle the problem around

:26:35.:26:38.

county lines and vulnerability and the use of modern day slavery

:26:39.:26:43.

legislation is just one of those. I want to come back to you, what ages

:26:44.:26:49.

are we talking about here? Is this just children, is it adults? By the

:26:50.:26:55.

nature, we are talking about children and I see every one of

:26:56.:27:01.

those as children with real hopes and aspirations, but just going

:27:02.:27:05.

about it in the wrong way. The youngest on our case load is 11 and

:27:06.:27:11.

that is a young person that has been caught up with it and I believe that

:27:12.:27:18.

crucial recruitment age we are looking at happens between primary

:27:19.:27:22.

and secondary school, is the first point of entrapment by the young

:27:23.:27:27.

people. And you know, it is not, what is a shame about this, it is

:27:28.:27:32.

not the lack of will, but it is that it requires intensive work. This is

:27:33.:27:35.

intensive work that requires long-term funding to do the work

:27:36.:27:41.

properly. And frequently we come across agencies that just don't know

:27:42.:27:45.

enough about the reality of gangs, enough about how these criminal

:27:46.:27:51.

operations work and so what you tend to find is they're giving piece meal

:27:52.:28:01.

help. But that needs to be tailor made and ongoing. Thank you for

:28:02.:28:03.

speaking us to today. And you can hear much more this

:28:04.:28:07.

story on File on 4 - We approached the Home Office

:28:08.:28:10.

for an interview but Minister for Crime, Safeguarding

:28:11.:28:14.

and Vulnerability, Sarah Newton, We have passed legislation, allowing

:28:15.:28:35.

the police to crackdown on drug dealing gangs. It sends a message we

:28:36.:28:39.

will not tolerate this criminal activity. Still to come: An

:28:40.:28:49.

assistant to Harvey Weinstein said she was paid to keep quiet about a

:28:50.:28:51.

sexual assault. Disability campaigners have

:28:52.:28:54.

criticised a key government scheme which helps deaf and disabled people

:28:55.:28:56.

in the workplace as The scheme provides support

:28:57.:28:58.

for deaf and disabled people beyond what employers are obliged

:28:59.:29:04.

to do by law. But a new report seen by this

:29:05.:29:08.

programme says Access to Work - once hailed as the most successful

:29:09.:29:11.

programme of its type - is beset by errors, delays

:29:12.:29:14.

and is being hit by a government Campaigners are calling

:29:15.:29:17.

on ministers to "restore and refit" the programme,

:29:18.:29:21.

which they say SHOULD be Just last month charities warned

:29:22.:29:29.

that more disabled people We've been to talk to some of those

:29:30.:29:33.

who rely on what was once called This is the Jenny's story. My names

:29:34.:29:51.

Jenny, I'm the artistic director and Chief Executive of grey eyes

:29:52.:29:55.

theatre. Because I have had access to work, I have learned my trade and

:29:56.:29:59.

how to cope in big meetings. I would never have thought to say I

:30:00.:30:24.

want to be the co-artist director of the par Paralympic Opening Ceremony.

:30:25.:30:27.

It Gays me that confidence to do that. It is vital I think for the

:30:28.:30:34.

importance of the ceremony. Many deaf were involved. Many deaf

:30:35.:30:39.

disabled people, all with support, full support from access to work,

:30:40.:30:44.

that is the time when they were awesome and some of the access to

:30:45.:30:49.

work people, they came the watch rehearsal, they met the deaf people

:30:50.:30:55.

that were benefitting from the money, so it felt, really really

:30:56.:31:01.

linked and aware of the understanding, when we were all

:31:02.:31:06.

like, we're rocking, we've done it. Boof, gone. From April the am of

:31:07.:31:13.

help will be capped for all users at 1.5 times the average salary. The

:31:14.:31:23.

cap means literally half of my hour, boof, after 2012 going from 35 hours

:31:24.:31:29.

a week, they said I could have 72 hours a month, that is a massive

:31:30.:31:33.

reduction, it is my right to work full-time. The thought of having to

:31:34.:31:40.

cut my hour, I could feel, me, Jenny shrinking, become this small person

:31:41.:31:44.

and feeling quite terrified about what my future is. I can't believe

:31:45.:31:49.

it is going to happen, so I can't think beyond April because it makes

:31:50.:31:57.

me feel quite sick, you know, and I have a, I thought what am I going to

:31:58.:31:59.

have a, I thought what am I going to do?

:32:00.:32:04.

Let's talk now to Miro Griffiths - Government advisor on disability

:32:05.:32:06.

We can also speak to David Buxton - Chief Executive of Action

:32:07.:32:11.

Adrian Bailey is here as his interpreter.

:32:12.:32:13.

Penny Pepper is a writer and John Kelly is a self-employed

:32:14.:32:16.

musician who both use Access to Work.

:32:17.:32:19.

Thank you for joining the programme today. David, I want to come to you

:32:20.:32:28.

first of all, the Government says the scheme is tailored to

:32:29.:32:33.

individuals' needs and can include travel to work, support workers and

:32:34.:32:38.

specialist equipment, but are people struggling to gain access to

:32:39.:32:46.

everything that is on off to them? Yes e certainly the situation now is

:32:47.:32:51.

very different from twenty years ago when I first started using Access to

:32:52.:32:55.

Work. I was able to have full access and able to progress from entry

:32:56.:32:59.

level position to chief executive officer, which is remarkable. These

:33:00.:33:05.

cuts are causing a lack of understanding, a lack of knowledge

:33:06.:33:12.

of what is to come. Now I face a restriction of three days of Access

:33:13.:33:14.

to Work support which means I don't know if I am going to be stable in

:33:15.:33:20.

my job. The Government ministers, if we imagine, if we say that the

:33:21.:33:24.

Government ministers who are negotiating with foreign Governments

:33:25.:33:30.

say over Brexit, had to have restrictions on their foreign

:33:31.:33:33.

language translation, and interpretation in dealing with

:33:34.:33:36.

foreign Government, surely that would have a negative impact on our

:33:37.:33:41.

relations initially. That would be a similar example for what we are

:33:42.:33:46.

going through as deaf and disabled people, having this support removed

:33:47.:33:50.

is having a negative impact on our work through no fault of our own. In

:33:51.:33:56.

report suggests Access to Work is creating problems that

:33:57.:33:57.

disproportionately affect deaf people. Can you explain to us what

:33:58.:34:04.

they are? TRANSLATION: Yes, so there is two

:34:05.:34:10.

areas, so, firstly, people who require high levels of support like

:34:11.:34:15.

myself, are affected by the cap and 90% of those people affected by the

:34:16.:34:22.

cap are deaf people, so, that means access to support is significantly

:34:23.:34:26.

reduced, the Government is talking about widening the scheme to have as

:34:27.:34:30.

many deaf and disabled people who require the support to have access

:34:31.:34:35.

to out, which is clearly very welcome, but, even those from the

:34:36.:34:40.

deaf and disabled people we are speaking to, say that they are

:34:41.:34:45.

negatively being impacted by the levels 06 support which means this

:34:46.:34:51.

is highly discriminateliry. You recently finished writing a book but

:34:52.:34:55.

it almost didn't happen because of issues Penny. What were the problems

:34:56.:35:01.

you faced? Well I thought this was would give context to of the issues

:35:02.:35:06.

to access to work, this happened because of it but despite is. I

:35:07.:35:10.

could not have written this book, which was published in September, so

:35:11.:35:15.

it is a lovely new baby, I am very proud of it but every step of the

:35:16.:35:21.

way with Access to Work, it is fraught with incompetence, loss of

:35:22.:35:27.

paperwork, loss of named support on their end, you get a different

:35:28.:35:34.

person each time, there is also the culture now seeping into Access to

:35:35.:35:39.

Work of you asking for something that isn't genuine, it feeds into

:35:40.:35:46.

the scrounger attitude that you so often, is thrown at disabled people,

:35:47.:35:53.

I can say when it began, I have been an activist for 30 year, which is

:35:54.:35:59.

partly detailed in my book, but we thought it was going to be a

:36:00.:36:04.

wonderful thing, and we have to ask the Government do they want us to

:36:05.:36:08.

work? They do, the Government says they are trying to get a million

:36:09.:36:13.

more people into work, and they are... It won't happen's they are

:36:14.:36:18.

spending no that are... It is available to people who need

:36:19.:36:24.

support. This may then help more people instead of being able to give

:36:25.:36:27.

more money to individuals if you see what I mean. What do you think about

:36:28.:36:34.

that? Is it better, to help a larger number of people.

:36:35.:36:37.

TRANSLATION: There is no evidence to suggest that would be the case. What

:36:38.:36:41.

we need to do is get away from the rhetoric that the Government

:36:42.:36:46.

constantly spouts out, and look at the reality of every disabled

:36:47.:36:49.

person's lived experience, you know, this is a scary time because we have

:36:50.:36:53.

already seen them tinkering round with things like the independent

:36:54.:36:57.

living fund to the point where they close it. DLA and PIP we know that

:36:58.:37:04.

that, the cumulative effect of the changes that are happening to

:37:05.:37:07.

disabled people are slowly taking away all the building blocks we need

:37:08.:37:12.

to be able to contribute and participate to society, so the

:37:13.:37:15.

rhetoric the Government is spouting out, is just not the reality, you

:37:16.:37:21.

know I have been using Access to Work for the last ten years and I

:37:22.:37:26.

have seen just this terrible, terrible increase in the

:37:27.:37:30.

bureaucracy, the misunderstanding, the inaccuracy. In that time, it

:37:31.:37:34.

would be interesting to know what has changed practically on a day to

:37:35.:37:40.

level for you. It has move to being a system that supports you in work,

:37:41.:37:44.

to a system where you have to justify every single thing you do,

:37:45.:37:49.

and actually, if you don't give them the right answer, sorry I have had

:37:50.:37:53.

an example where they said we think there is a cheaper taxi company that

:37:54.:37:57.

can get you to your job, you will have to use this one, then when we

:37:58.:38:05.

used that taxi company they didn't have any wheelchair accessible taxi,

:38:06.:38:09.

disabled people know best who their needs are and you have probably

:38:10.:38:13.

worked out the best and cheapest want toy do it. So the reality is,

:38:14.:38:20.

that, that this is a cut and Britain needs to work up and rise against

:38:21.:38:25.

these kinds of changes that are taking on the fabric of society that

:38:26.:38:30.

isn't supporting disabled people. I want to get a quick word from Mira

:38:31.:38:36.

as well. You are a government adviser to the department for work

:38:37.:38:39.

and pension, you say they are committed to supporting disabled

:38:40.:38:42.

people to get into employment, would you say that is accurate? No, I

:38:43.:38:49.

wouldn't. I think what we are seeing is a reinforcement of this narrative

:38:50.:38:55.

of people being deserving is of support and people being undeserving

:38:56.:39:00.

is. It goes along with the political ideology of Government which states

:39:01.:39:04.

that the support will be reduced over time and people should get on

:39:05.:39:08.

with it. If we want to commit to people being valued members of the

:39:09.:39:12.

community and society, then it requires an effective support

:39:13.:39:19.

scheme, which is funded but which is also run by and afforded people, it

:39:20.:39:25.

will require people have more of a voice and a presence within those

:39:26.:39:30.

discussions. Have you been approached by the Department for

:39:31.:39:32.

Work and Pensions? For this scheme? No, I haven't. Not for some time

:39:33.:39:39.

now, as an Access to Work user, who has, I would echo what Penny and

:39:40.:39:44.

John say which is over time I have seen the scrutiny increase, the

:39:45.:39:48.

emphasis on medical labels, on medical diagnosis to justify support

:39:49.:39:51.

hand is never what Access to Work was about. I suppose my

:39:52.:39:56.

recommendations for the DWP and Government would be release the

:39:57.:39:59.

statistics which show how many people have had their support cut

:40:00.:40:03.

after being reassessed which I don't think is out there, and opposition

:40:04.:40:07.

parties need to demand that as. We I also think that the Government needs

:40:08.:40:13.

to recognise what the UN CRPD committee said when they said they

:40:14.:40:19.

recognise the support systems are causing human catastrophe. I also

:40:20.:40:23.

think people need to be in positions of political power, and need to have

:40:24.:40:28.

a political voice in order to run and develop and design access to

:40:29.:40:33.

work. OK. Thank you all for. Coming in today. Department for Work and

:40:34.:40:36.

Pensions didn't have a minister available to talk to us but said

:40:37.:41:05.

Stuart Bingham - the 2015 World Snooker champion -

:41:06.:41:07.

has been banned for 6 months for breaching WPBSA betting rules.

:41:08.:41:10.

Three months and one day of the ban will be suspended.

:41:11.:41:14.

David Unsworth will take temporary charge of Everton,

:41:15.:41:16.

following the sacking of Ronald Kooman yesterday.

:41:17.:41:20.

following the sacking of Ronald Koeman yesterday.

:41:21.:41:22.

They play Chelsea in the League Cup fourth round tomorrow.

:41:23.:41:24.

Rob Greenwood, the coach accused of creating a "climate of fear"

:41:25.:41:28.

within the British para-swimming setup, has been given

:41:29.:41:30.

the "full support backing" of the British Swimming Coaches

:41:31.:41:32.

and is yet to comment publicly about the findings.

:41:33.:41:39.

And twelve-time Grand Slam champion Novak Djokovic is set

:41:40.:41:41.

to play his first match since Wimbledon at the World Tennis

:41:42.:41:44.

The world number seven, whose season ended early in August

:41:45.:41:48.

because of an elbow injury, is set to play in the Abu

:41:49.:41:50.

Dhabi exhibition event at the end of December.

:41:51.:42:01.

Redundancies, cutting the subjects on offer,

:42:02.:42:02.

asking for extra money from parents, teachers bringing in their own

:42:03.:42:07.

They're all ways that schools have coped with cuts

:42:08.:42:10.

in their budgets from central government.

:42:11.:42:11.

This morning parents, teachers and school support workers

:42:12.:42:13.

are gathering at Parliament this morning to protest.

:42:14.:42:15.

Schools in England have been promised an extra ?1.3 billion over

:42:16.:42:18.

two years but the Institute for Fiscal Studies says it means

:42:19.:42:21.

a real-terms freeze on school budgets for two years.

:42:22.:42:26.

We can now speak to two people attending today's rally.

:42:27.:42:29.

Michelle Sheehy is the head teacher of a primary school

:42:30.:42:31.

in the West Midlands who says her staff do bring

:42:32.:42:35.

in their own supplies, and in the next two years she's

:42:36.:42:38.

faced with making at least one teacher redundant.

:42:39.:42:42.

She's also a member of the head teachers union.

:42:43.:42:44.

Flora Page is a mother whose daughters aged 5 and 13 went

:42:45.:42:47.

She says she's seen big differences because of funding cuts.

:42:48.:42:57.

Thank you both for coming in. How bad is it? Think it is much worse

:42:58.:43:05.

than anybody realises. I have, I am the head teacher for a primary

:43:06.:43:09.

school, I am the head teacher a junior school as well, and I had the

:43:10.:43:13.

opportunity to do that because I was faced with a situation where I did

:43:14.:43:18.

have to make somebody redundant or I had to think of something innovative

:43:19.:43:25.

to do, so I am now head teach over two schools which means my salary is

:43:26.:43:30.

shared, which means it is put off any redundancies possibly for a year

:43:31.:43:35.

or two. But you foe, we are protected to have a deficit of

:43:36.:43:40.

100,000 in two years' time, so we are going to have to think again. So

:43:41.:43:44.

what things have you, up to this point what have you had to cut?

:43:45.:43:48.

Well, what we have tried to do is protect the children as much as

:43:49.:43:53.

possible, so it is the teachers really that have, they have given

:43:54.:43:59.

extra time without being paid. For example, we took some children on

:44:00.:44:05.

residential, two of our staff stayed camping for two weeks, straight,

:44:06.:44:09.

doing all the cooking, and looking after the children, as they were, we

:44:10.:44:13.

kept changing the cohorts that were staying there. And they are

:44:14.:44:18.

prepareded that for no extra money at all. It is things like that and

:44:19.:44:24.

staff are bringing in things to give the ching new e pences and unless I

:44:25.:44:29.

tell them, you really must charge this to school they don't. What do

:44:30.:44:33.

you say to staff? They shouldn't really be doing it? I think that

:44:34.:44:37.

shouldn't and I tell them they shouldn't. When all is said and done

:44:38.:44:40.

they are there for the children, it is no hike a business, it is a

:44:41.:44:44.

school, it is little people, and it is is really important to give

:44:45.:44:50.

children such a wide range of activities, you know, there is no

:44:51.:44:53.

point in sitting them in a class room and filling their heads with

:44:54.:44:57.

knowledge, they can go and look anything they want to, up on Google

:44:58.:45:01.

for example. We need to have children of the future who are

:45:02.:45:07.

resilient who are able to problem solve, invent thing, you know, and

:45:08.:45:11.

think for themselves basically, that is why we try hard to keep such a

:45:12.:45:14.

wide range. Why are you taking part today? For

:45:15.:45:22.

the same reasons really, it is about making sure that the next generation

:45:23.:45:27.

of children are fit for the future world. Just sort of taking things

:45:28.:45:34.

back to basics, keeping kids in classrooms in rows, doing things

:45:35.:45:38.

because they're cheap is not the way that will build a society that is

:45:39.:45:42.

able to cope with everything that the future's going to throw at them.

:45:43.:45:49.

Your two youngest children are eight years apart, but attend the same

:45:50.:45:54.

primary school. How have things changed. Where schools have faced

:45:55.:46:02.

cuts it is obvious that some of the vacancies that have come up through

:46:03.:46:06.

staff leaving haven't been readvertised. The PTA at our primary

:46:07.:46:15.

school is very active and they raise money, but the increasingly the

:46:16.:46:19.

school without perhaps wanting to directly ask, is looking for ways to

:46:20.:46:25.

try to fill their problems from the PTA coughers and -- coffers. To

:46:26.:46:33.

asking for money? Yes. Which is, the PTA is part of that full enrichment

:46:34.:46:37.

about giving children opportunities to see, to explore the world, to be

:46:38.:46:44.

inventive and creative, all the things that will be important for

:46:45.:46:48.

them in adult lie, but yet it costs money.

:46:49.:46:51.

The Minister for School Standards Nick Gibb said:

:46:52.:46:57.

"The fact is that under this government, there are 1.8m more

:46:58.:47:00.

children being taught in good or outstanding schools than in 2010.

:47:01.:47:02.

The claims being made by the trade union about school funding

:47:03.:47:05.

There are no cuts in funding - every school will see an increase

:47:06.:47:09.

in funding through the formula from 2018."

:47:10.:47:20.

Nineteen years ago after years of sexual harassment

:47:21.:47:22.

as Harvey Weinstein's assistant, Zelda Perkins decided

:47:23.:47:23.

She quit after another colleague told her she had been sexually

:47:24.:47:27.

Solicitors advised both women to seek damages from Weinstein

:47:28.:47:34.

and the sum of ?250,000 was split between them on the proviso

:47:35.:47:37.

they signed a Disclosure Agreement forbidding them from

:47:38.:47:39.

Since the many Weinstein allegations of rape,

:47:40.:47:46.

sexual assault and harassment have come to light, Zelda Perkins has

:47:47.:47:49.

Refusing to be silenced, she has spoken to the Financial Times

:47:50.:47:55.

journalist Matthew Garrahan about the pressure these

:47:56.:47:57.

Can I ask you first of all, how you both made contact? We had a mutual

:47:58.:48:14.

friend who approached me and we spoke a couple of times and then at

:48:15.:48:19.

length again in the last few days. We put the story together over the

:48:20.:48:25.

weekend and it ran, it is running in the newspaper this morning. But it

:48:26.:48:29.

took a long time to get the story for her to talk about, to go through

:48:30.:48:33.

the background of what happened to her and the result is this big

:48:34.:48:41.

disclosure by her. She is breaking this non-disclosure agreement that

:48:42.:48:50.

has kept her silent for 19 years. Non-disclosure doesn't mean

:48:51.:48:52.

liability, but what are the implications of breaking that

:48:53.:48:57.

agreement? Well, I mean, the big one is she could be sued. She has broken

:48:58.:49:02.

a contract she signed with Harvey Weinstein and there are all sorts of

:49:03.:49:07.

obligations she made to him and his company that he ran about keeping

:49:08.:49:11.

quiet. But the big issue here and why this is so interesting, is

:49:12.:49:15.

because she was asked to keep quiet about lots of different things. She

:49:16.:49:21.

had to promise never to tell any friends or relatives or give the

:49:22.:49:26.

names of any relatives she spoke to. She had to promise in the event of a

:49:27.:49:31.

criminal investigation about Harvey Weinstein she would say nice things

:49:32.:49:36.

about him. The other bombshell is the biggest law firm in London

:49:37.:49:40.

representing Harvey Weinstein, it is the firm that put together this

:49:41.:49:45.

water tight agreement. I think nearly 20 years on, she shies it is

:49:46.:49:55.

the right -- she feels it is the right time that talk. Have you spoke

:49:56.:50:01.

on the her today? Yes, she is feeling a range of emotions. This is

:50:02.:50:05.

something she didn't talk about for such a long time. She wants to shine

:50:06.:50:12.

a light on the process, the non-disclosure agreement process and

:50:13.:50:15.

the complicity of law firms and the way the rich and powerful can use

:50:16.:50:20.

them to keep people quiet. We will have to leave it. And breaking a

:50:21.:50:28.

non-disclosure agreement does not mean liability. Harvey Weinstein all

:50:29.:50:36.

along has denied any allegations of nonconsensual sexual activity.

:50:37.:50:50.

The law on abortion is under review in Northern Ireland.

:50:51.:50:54.

This Friday marks 50 years since the Abortion Act,

:50:55.:50:56.

when termination became a legal option for women not

:50:57.:50:58.

wanting to continue their pregnancy, up to 24 weeks.

:50:59.:51:00.

But unlike the rest of the UK, abortion is illegal in almost all

:51:01.:51:03.

circumstances in Northern Ireland and women can face up

:51:04.:51:06.

It's estimated that 12 women travel from the country to the UK every

:51:07.:51:12.

day to access a safe and legal termination.

:51:13.:51:13.

Our reporter Catrin Nye went to Belfast earlier this year

:51:14.:51:16.

A few weeks after Sarah's wedding, she found out she was pregnant.

:51:17.:51:20.

It was all planned, she was delighted, but then

:51:21.:51:22.

There was nothing above the baby's eyes basically, there was no

:51:23.:51:26.

Sarah's baby had anencephaly, which occurs in about six

:51:27.:51:37.

There is no treatment, and babies with it die

:51:38.:51:41.

before they are born, or shortly after birth.

:51:42.:51:45.

To not have a baby at the end of it, I felt like I couldn't...

:51:46.:51:48.

We didn't call it an abortion, we said we wanted a medical

:51:49.:51:52.

termination, and that's all it is, and they said, "Sorry we can't help

:51:53.:51:56.

you, you would have to go abroad, go across the water".

:51:57.:52:00.

Unlike the rest of the UK, abortion is illegal here

:52:01.:52:02.

in Northern Ireland, in almost all circumstances.

:52:03.:52:07.

That meant that at 21 weeks pregnant Sarah had to travel to London

:52:08.:52:10.

It is that experience that means she is involved in this court case.

:52:11.:52:17.

Grainne Teggart is Campaigns Manager for Northern Ireland

:52:18.:52:19.

Sarah Ewart had to travel to England for a termination after her baby

:52:20.:52:24.

Alban Maginness recently left the Social Democratic

:52:25.:52:34.

and Labour Party in Northern Ireland as a member of the legislative

:52:35.:52:37.

assembly - he is anti-abortion and says people may only be

:52:38.:52:39.

"for or against" and there is no in between.

:52:40.:52:46.

Thank you for joining us. This is day one, the Supreme Court will

:52:47.:52:54.

examine whether Northern Ireland's strict abortion laws breach human

:52:55.:52:56.

rights. What are you hoping will happen? We're hoping that the court

:52:57.:53:01.

will do what our politicians have pailed to do and -- failed failed to

:53:02.:53:11.

to do and bring about a change in the law. It is very important that

:53:12.:53:15.

we acknowledge the difficult circumstances that women in Northern

:53:16.:53:21.

Ireland find themselves in. When the law makes abortion illegal that

:53:22.:53:27.

doesn't mean that abortion doesn't happen. It just makes it difficult

:53:28.:53:30.

for women. In what circumstances is it legal? It is legal in theory

:53:31.:53:36.

where there is a substantial risk to the life and the mental health of

:53:37.:53:40.

woman. But we know from our work that it is very difficult to get a

:53:41.:53:44.

lawful termination in Northern Ireland. Only 16 women were able to

:53:45.:53:56.

access termination for 2015/2016 and 600 travelled to the rest of the UK.

:53:57.:54:01.

Sarah, how do you feel about what is happen something We have been going

:54:02.:54:05.

at this for four years, it has been a very long time. I'm just hoping

:54:06.:54:10.

that the Supreme Court with help us and change the law for women who end

:54:11.:54:15.

up in circumstances that I found myself in. Why was a termination

:54:16.:54:22.

right for you? I had many conversations with my consultant and

:54:23.:54:26.

they assured me the condition my baby had, it was never going to have

:54:27.:54:31.

a chance of surviving. I felt I couldn't continue with my pregnancy.

:54:32.:54:35.

For me, I just wanted the process over, the pregnancy, the end as soon

:54:36.:54:40.

as possible. As someone knowing the outcome and what happened next would

:54:41.:54:43.

be different because of where you live, how did you feel about that

:54:44.:54:47.

and what was the process from then? It was very scary to find out we had

:54:48.:54:55.

the travel abroad. The extra stress emotionally and financially... It

:54:56.:54:58.

wasn't needed. We should have had this done at home with our own

:54:59.:55:05.

medicals. It is a medical procedure. Alban, how significant in Northern

:55:06.:55:09.

Ireland politics is today's appeal? I think it is very significant

:55:10.:55:16.

indeed, the Northern Ireland court of appeal decided that there was no

:55:17.:55:26.

right, no human right to abortion in any circumstance in relation to the

:55:27.:55:30.

pregnancy of a woman in Northern Ireland. They did so on the basis of

:55:31.:55:40.

the rights of European court and said the local Assembly has a

:55:41.:55:43.

discretion as to whether or not to introduce that sort of legislation.

:55:44.:55:49.

So I think that the Supreme Court will have a constitutional issue to

:55:50.:55:54.

address today, as much as the issue of abortion itself. And I think that

:55:55.:55:58.

the Northern Ireland court of appeal got it right, because it totally is

:55:59.:56:03.

consistent with the European convention on human rights. 700

:56:04.:56:08.

women a year are travelling from Northern Ireland to England, Wales

:56:09.:56:13.

and Scotland for the procedure, the abortion act was legalised in

:56:14.:56:18.

England Wales and Scotland. Isn't it time to bring Northern Ireland

:56:19.:56:24.

up-to-date. And you have had 8 million abortions. That is a sad

:56:25.:56:30.

reflection on the people of Britain that such a terrible tool of life of

:56:31.:56:36.

babies in the womb has taken place. But what I say is this, we should be

:56:37.:56:42.

looking after those women who feel, who have a crisis pregnancy, we

:56:43.:56:46.

should be investing money in supporting them and giving them the

:56:47.:56:49.

best possibility medical treatment. I would like you to talk directly to

:56:50.:56:58.

Sarah, what would you have to say to Sarah. I have talked to her before

:56:59.:57:06.

and I believe it is a matter of the human right of the infant that the

:57:07.:57:15.

mother is in fact carrying that the infant is entitled to protection,

:57:16.:57:20.

the human rights protection as in the European convention of human

:57:21.:57:25.

life, article two of that convention. I think Sarah should

:57:26.:57:28.

have been given the proper support that she required in order to

:57:29.:57:34.

deliver the baby. The baby and... Many mothers have had their babies

:57:35.:57:39.

delivered in similar circumstances. Sarah, your response to that? I had

:57:40.:57:44.

many, well four scans and I was offered another and at one meeting

:57:45.:57:49.

with my consultant, he said the baby I was carrying was like a baby on a

:57:50.:57:53.

life support machine and when its you turn that off. I don't think it

:57:54.:57:57.

is fair for me to be forced to carry a baby that has no chance of living

:57:58.:58:03.

life independently and I totally admire the women who can go through

:58:04.:58:07.

with the pregnancies and carry on, but I just felt I couldn't do that

:58:08.:58:11.

and it needs to be that option there for women who can't do it. What do

:58:12.:58:14.

you think the outcome of this will be? We hope the Supreme Court will

:58:15.:58:21.

correct the human rights abuse against women and this is the 50

:58:22.:58:27.

years of Abortion Act. Thank you we are out of time.

:58:28.:58:32.

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