10/01/2018 Victoria Derbyshire

Hello.

It's Wednesday, it's 9am,

I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

welcome to the programme.

These men have all taken

spice in Manchester -

charities tell us a new,

more potent strain of the synthetic

form of cannabis is having

a devastating impact on drug users.

He was resuscitated. He went to A&E

and three hours later he was back in

town buying more spice. That will

give you an indication of how

serious the addiction is.

That

exclusive report in 15 minutes time.

If you have used spice or are

affected by people who use it, tell

us what difference the two year ban

has made? Does the law do enough to

protect free speech at university?

We will hear from both sides.

People

are saying will I feel vulnerable?

You will feel uncomfortable,

vulnerable. Everything will be

scary, guess what, ideas that have

changed the world historically over

many years have fought racism.

Plus:

There is more one way than to

be the best. Apply now.

No more of

your country needs you and be the

best, the Army is changing the way

it advertising for new recruits. It

is moving to a more emotional style.

Your reaction to this very welcome -

particularly if you serve

in the Armed Forces.

Or if you are an Army family.

Hello and welcome to the programme,

we're live until 11am.

Throughout the programme we'll bring

you the latest breaking news

and developing stories and as always

keen to hear from you.

A little later we'll discuss

the letter written by legendary

French actor, Catherine Deneuve,

who says men have the right to "hit

on women" without being

forced out of their jobs.

In the wake of the Harvey Weinstein

scandal she's one of 100 prominent

French women to complain

about a new "puritanism".

Your thoughts welcome,

use the #Victoria LIVE

and If you text, you will be charged

at the standard network rate.

Our top story today.

At least 13 people have died

in mudslides and floods

in southern California.

At least 163 people have

been taken to hospital

and hundreds more are trapped.

Our North America Correspondent,

James Cook reports from Los Angeles.

The rains came suddenly

just before dawn.

Torrential and terrifying.

They coursed over the slick,

scorched earth, gathering speed

until mud was roaring down

to the sea like an express train.

The deluge smashed into the very

homes which had just

survived California's

biggest recorded wildfire.

The result - utter devastation.

We had a very difficult time

assessing the area and responding

to many of those areas

to assist those people.

The only words I can really

think of to describe

what it looked like,

was it looked like a

World War I battlefield.

The communities hardest hit

were Montecito and Carpentaria

on the Pacific coast north of

Los Angeles.

These are some of the most exclusive

neighbourhoods in the United States.

Home to stars like Oprah Winfrey

and the actor Rob Lowe.

But no amount of money

could stop this torrent.

Well, the mud roared down

here with terrifying speed,

sweeping everything in its path.

The firefighters won't let us go

up there any further,

they say the situation could change

in the blink of an eye

and as you can see, this

is how dangerous it is.

Rescue workers are still scouring

scores of damaged and demolished

homes, searching for survivors.

Police say the number of dead

here is certain to rise.

Reeta is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary

of the rest of the day's news.

The Army is launching a new

recruitment campaign which

emphasises the emotional and

physical support given to soldiers.

A series of radio and online adverts

addresses concerns that potential

recruits might have. There has been

criticism from some former officers

who have accused the Army of bowing

to political correctness.

The new ads pose

a series of questions.

Growing up, I really had my heart

set on joining the army.

Another reassures would-be

recruits that religious

faith will be respected.

The Army embraces the fact that

you can come from a different faith.

Even on exercise, there's always

a quiet moment to go into a cabin

and just sort of find a little

corner and do your prayers there.

Recruiting for the Army

is a constant battle.

Every year, for seven years now,

more soldiers have left

the Army than signed up.

There's a lot of internal debate

about how best it should be done.

I love the idea of the Army...

The Army says its belonging

campaign has already sparked

a significant surge in interest,

but others say this

new series of ads panders

to to political correctness

and the so-called

"snowflake generation."

Last month, the new Defence

Gavin Williamson, halted plans

to ditch the Army's Be the Best

slogan which has been

used for decades.

An internal report had

claimed it was datist,

elitist and non-inclusive.

This new campaign does include

the slogan, but it's not given

the prominence it once had.

100 well-known French women have

signed an open letter

defending the right of men

to make sexual advances.

The actress Catherine Deneuve is one

of the signatories who say

the recent wave of denunciations

of sexual harassment

following the Harvey Weinstein

affair is creating a new feminism

defined by hatred

of men and sexuality.

In the open letter published

in Le Monde, the women say

there is a new puritanism

afoot in the world.

Passengers on Thameslink,

Southern and Great Northern services

have suffered the worst disruption

of any rail franchise according

to a highly critical report.

The Government's spending watchdog,

the National Audit Office,

says the country's largest rail

operator has failed

to provide value for money.

It also criticises

the Department for Transport.

Our Business correspondent,

Theo Leggett reports.

Thameslink, Southern and great

northern are the large of largest of

Britain's rail services. It provides

services along the South Coast and

into London. Since 2016 the company

has been embroiled in a bitter

dispute with the RMT union, over its

plans to use trains on which the

driver, rather than the conductor,

is in charge of opening and dlosing

the doors. Over the past two years,

there have been regular strikes on

Southern Rail ways trains. This

week, great northern services have

also been affected. In fact,

according to the National Audit

Office, since it was created, the

franchise as experienced worst

disruption than any other part of

the network. 146,000 trains have

been cancelled, or delayed for more

than half an hour since July 2015.

That's 7.7% of services. Across the

UK as a whole, the figure is 2.8%.

The report claims that although most

of the delays were down to

industrial action, the Department

for Transport should shoulder some

of the blame. When it awarded the

franchise, it didn't check that

Govia had enough drivers and didn't

pay enough attention to the possible

impact of industrial action and

wasn't aware of poor state of the

network. All that means the

Government has not been

getting value more money. A new

strain of spice has emerged in

Manchester in the last few weeks.

Charities who work with drug users

in the city say the illegal drug is

causing devastation and even death

among the homeless community. Spice

was previously known as oning of the

so-called legal highs before being

banned along with other substances

in May 2016.

The Chancellor, Philip Hammond,

and the Brexit Secretary,

David Davis, have told a German

newspaper that any trade deal

with the EU must include

the financial services industry.

The two Cabinet Ministers will make

separate visits to meet business

leaders in Germany today,

where they will both stress

the importance of not erecting

new barriers to trade.

A body has been found in a garden

after a woman walked into a police

station and told officers she had

killed and buried a man

"a number of years ago".

Greater Manchester Police

confirmed that human remains

have been discovered

at a house near Stockport.

A 63-year-old woman has been

arrested on suspicion of murder.

A 16-year old boy will appear

in court today charged

with the murder of a shop assistant

in north London.

Vijay Patel was attacked in a row

over the sale of cigarette papers

outside his shop in Mill Hill

on Saturday night.

He later died in hospital.

New measures to clamp down on

plastic waste are to be extended by

the Government. Retailers with fewer

than 250 staff are exempted from the

levy. The idea is part of a 25 year

plan to improve the environment. All

retailers in Scotland and Wales are

already required to charge for

plastic bags.

The search for Malaysia Airlines

flight MH370 will resume today,

nearly a year after efforts

to locate the plane

were officially suspended.

The search for the aircraft,

which went missing with 239 people

on board in March 2014,

was the largest in aviation history.

It will now be resumed

by a an American company

using unmanned submarines.

A Japanese astronaut has

apologised after claiming he'd

grown 9cm since arriving

at the International Space

Station three weeks ago.

Nori-shige Kanai said

he had in fact grown 2cm -

and blamed a measurement error.

His original claim sparked

global fascination among

social media users.

Astronauts can grow

between 2cm to 5cm in space

because the lack of gravity

allows vertebrae in

their spines to expand.

That's a summary of the latest BBC

News. More at 9.30am. Thank you,

Reeta. Anthony on Facebook, we will

bring you a film, which shows there

is a dangerous strain of spice

circulating on the streets of

Manchester. This is despite the fact

that spice was banned a couple of

years ago. Anthony says, "When it

was the so-called legal high, and

available in shops, we didn't see

the same problems. Maybe this is the

reason to legalise some drugs,

control what's in them, the strength

and put a tax on them at the same

time." Scottie on Facebook says,

"The war on drugs created the market

for spice." One viewer tweets this,

"Just one time, that's all it takes

to go wrong. People don't listen."

Ebony says, "Stop the dealers

approaching them and get them locked

up. No dealers, equals no spice."

Get in touch if you have used spice

or affected by people who use it.

Let me know your experience and what

the difference has been since the

ban on legal highs came into this

country.

There was almost a great result for

Bristol City?

Yes, two minutes.

That's how close Bristol City came

to holding high flying Manchester

City. That's in the first leg of

their League Cup semifinal, the

runaway Premier League leaders

needed a stoppage time winner from

Sergio Aguero for their 2-1 win at

home and Bristol City boss Lee

Johnson believes his team can still

topple City when they come to Ashton

Gate in a fortnight. Pep Guardiola

was full of praise for how Bristol

City approached the game. The

visitors led before the break. A

strong City side was named and after

the break, City were level and just

when you thought that the under dogs

would leave with a draw and away

goal, Aguero popped up to score

their winner in stoppage time.

Wow, there is always Aguero there.

Now this growing feud between Jose

Mourinho and Conti carries on,

doesn't it?

It does, indeed. He

seems to be feuding with anybody,

really, Victoria. Victoria we are

talking about Jose Mourinho, the

Manchester United boss, ahead of the

match. There is not much love lost

between him and any other manager

and in particular Conti. This is the

to and froa starting in 2016 when

Jose Mourinho was back at Stamford

Bridge with Manchester United. They

were hammered 4-0 by Chelsea.

Chelsea and Conti celebrated wildly

and Jose Mourinho was furious and

hit out. This back and forth thing

continued. Conti hit back in

November, questioning Jose

Mourinho's selection and Victor

Moses who went on to play a big part

in Chelsea's title winning season.

Plenty more digs and last July it

got personal, Jose Mourinho claiming

that Conti had a hair transplant. On

Saturday, he called Jose Mourinho a

little man after some jibes about

Conti's match-fixing suspension.

This is what Chelsea boss had to say

yesterday.

This looks a person

that's great, I don't think so. But

I think we both said things and we

will see what happens in the future.

I think that he said a series of

words and used serious words and I

won't forget this. This is not a

problem from the club. This is a

problem between me and him. I stop.

Stop.

Let's cheer ourselves up from

the feud, shall we? Nottingham

Forest FA Cup hero on Sunday was

Eric. He scored twice to knockout

Arsenal. This is his present. His

wife Catherine said they could get a

dog if he scored a hat-trick. He

only got two on Sunday! It was a

special two. Everyone on social

media agreed it was good enough and

this is them.

What are they,

Labradors or spaniels?

Guess what he

called them?

I missed that

Gunner!

For knocking out Arsenal.

It could

have been a pug. More from Sarah

throughout the morning.

People who work with drug users

in Manchester have told this

programme they're concerned there's

a strong new strain of a synthetic

form of cannabis known as Spice -

and it's having a devastating impact

on those who use it.

Spice was banned along with other

psychoactive substances known then

as so-called "legal highs" in May

2016 - but critics say that ban

hasn't made it any harder to get

hold of but instead has put it

into the hands of drug dealers.

Spice was officially linked to 27

deaths in 2016 but many

believe the true figure

could be much higher.

Experts have told us that some

strains are so strong taking

it is like playing Russian Roulette

and putting a loaded

gun to your head.

Our reporter John Owen has spent

some time in Manchester.

I mean, I smoke half an ounce a day.

It's early evening in

Piccadilly Gardens on the edge

of Manchester's Northern Quarter.

Outside the chain stores and fast

food restaurants men and women

are collapsed in doorways,

slumped forward or

slurring incoherently.

These are the human consequences

of the potent psychoactive

substance known as Spice.

A highly addictive synthetic

cannabinoid that has taken a cruel

toll on the homeless community here.

And now two front line charities

have expressed fears that

a new and much stronger strain may

have entered circulation,

with potentially

life-threatening consequences.

So-called legal highs like Spice

were made illegal in May of 2016.

But it's clear that among the rough

sleeper and homeless communities

here, they are as prevalent as ever.

Almost everybody we speak to has

a story to tell about Spice.

They describe how it compounds

the already intensely complex lives

of people stranded on the streets.

About how it's being pushed by gangs

of unscrupulous dealers

preying on desperation.

And about how for people living

through winter on the streets,

its most valuable effect is numbness

and its ability to pass the time.

It's very, very unusual to find

a young person who is Street

homeless in the city centre

of Manchester, who

isn't taking Spice.

I would say between 95 and 98%

of those young street homeless

people are smoking Spice

on some level.

Far from any perception that these

are soft drugs like cannabis,

these chemicals are,

in fact, extremely

dangerous, often leading

to hospitalisation, even death.

It's almost like putting

a loaded gun to your head

and playing Russian roulette.

An organisation here

that's distributing food

to the rough sleeping community.

As you walk past, you can

really smell that very

distinctive Spice smell.

It's almost an acrid,

really chemical smell,

and it's all around that area

where the food is being distributed.

Manchester Metropolitan University

is one of the only facilities

in the country licensed to test

new psychoactive

substances like Spice.

Dr Oliver Sutcliffe is one

of the UK's foremost

authorities on the drug.

He explained that the samples

they test vary widely

in their potency, but that the most

recent generation are by far

the strongest they've seen.

We've seen probably a couple

of hundred different

variations that have appeared.

And the most recent ones,

the third-generation

synthetic cannabinoids,

which have been classified

in the UK, they are significantly

more potent than the other previous

generations that have been seen.

He went on to say that since the ban

there was no way to tell in advance

how strong any given strain

of Spice is.

Historically, before the ban,

the samples used to come in packets

which were very brightly

manufactured, collared,

they were manufactured

very professionally,

they had information

on the back of them.

They seemed to demonstrate some idea

of what was actually in the samples.

Now what you are seeing now

on the street are samples

that look like this,

and they are all in very

nondescript snap bags,

so there's no way to discriminate

between product to product,

and because of that you don't know

potentially what synthetic

cannabinoid you've got present

in the sample, but also,

you don't know how strong they are.

Oliver's MMU colleague, Dr Rob

Ralph, agrees that a ban hasn't

helped to reduce the problem,

as dealers exchange small quantities

of Spice for the money that

users have been able

to raise whilst begging.

Now it's actually easier to access

Spice than it was before.

Dealers will actually

come up now we're here.

Homeless people say they've been

woken up in the morning by dealers,

waking them up, giving them

a bag or two.

And then they come back a few hours

later, when they've managed

to earn some money begging,

and get the money from them.

So it's actually easier now

than before for psychotic

substances, to actually access it.

Amongst the samples that

Manchester Metropolitan University

has received for testing

from police, the strength

of cannabinoids being smoked

on the street seems

to have stabilised recently.

But speaking to people who are daily

interactions with Spice users,

there are fears that a stronger

strain may now have

re-entered circulation.

At Life Share, a charity that works

with vulnerable young people,

Julie has been seeing the effects

of this drug up close for some time.

And she has no doubt

that the strength of what's

being smoked has increased

in recent weeks.

It's horrendous.

We got people coming

in absolutely white as a ghost.

They can't string

a sentence together.

We've had a young lad who actually

died outside in an alleyway.

We put him into an ambulance,

he was resuscitated.

He went to A&E, three

hours later, he was back

in town buying more Spice.

So it's dying doesn't put

people off, that will give

you an indication of how serious

the addiction is.

So that guy, in that case,

he was medically dead?

Yeah, medically dead.

And he was lucky enough to be

resuscitated and he went

to buy more Spice?

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's how scary it is.

And that's one of, you know,

I could name a number of incidents.

We've had people woken up things

happening around the back end

of them that they weren't aware of.

We have had people who have

been gang raped, people

forced into sex work.

And this new strain,

you could literally be

talking to somebody,

and you turn around and they're

just literally gone.

They're not there.

Obviously we make sure

they are breathing, but an hour

later they are all back to normal.

In your mind that all very clear

evidence that there is a new,

more potent strain around

the streets at the moment?

Yeah, absolutely, because we deal

with 16 to 25-year-old

young homeless people.

We see the Spice addiction

on a daily basis.

It's normally quite a bonding

experience, being around

the homeless community.

But the ones who are on Spice,

we find now, will steal from each

other, they will beat each other up.

It's just completely changes

the whole persona of people.

But this one around at the minute

is really, really worrying.

Back on the streets we spoke

to one man who didn't

want his face to be shown.

He told us that after taking

a drag on what he thought

was an ordinary roll-up,

you completely lost

control for several hours.

The tobacco had been mixed with

an ultra-strong strain of Spice.

And that was after just

a couple of drags?

Just one.

One.

One pull.

One pull?

One pull, yeah.

And you'll just

completely out of it?

I was out of it for five hours.

I couldn't get myself back.

Really?

That must have been

really scary, was it?

It was, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Like almost everyone else

we spoke to, he also told us

about individuals who he believes

had lost their lives

as a direct result of the drug.

The most recent official figures say

that in 2016 there were just 27

cases in which synthetic

cannabinoids were mentioned on death

certificates in England and Wales.

But many suspect the real figure

could be much higher.

We spoke to to Risha.

And as we spoke, she pointed out

several Spice dealers

and users in the square.

Yes, I've known people who you

suspect have died taking Spice.

But because the medical professions

don't know what's in it,

they can't pinpoint that

as a cause of death.

They have to say that the thing

that's actually killed them

is their heart has stopped,

or pneumonia or something like that.

So that's on the cause of death.

We knew a particular

gentleman who is alcoholic,

and he was passed a joint.

He didn't realise Spice was in it.

He took a couple of puffs

and fell to the ground.

And he ended up dying a week later.

They had to turn the

life-support machine off.

One particular gentleman,

who we have known for a very long

time, is now in a nursing home.

He can't talk, can't sort of get up,

he can't live his own life,

through taking Spice.

Spice can sometimes stop

time and take you away

from the circumstances that

you are within.

Sometimes I can't blame people

for wanting to get away

from the desperate situation

they are in.

And it's having

a devastating effect.

I've seen people who can,

I can have a chat with and speak

to, and they're really coherent,

just take such a nosedive

and their health has deteriorated

so much that I'm scared they might

die on the streets.

It's awful.

It remains far from clear how many

people have died from using Spice.

But evidence of this drug leaving

ruined lives in its wake

is all too abundant here.

And the fact is that these chemicals

and their physiological effect

on users are poorly understood.

Manchester is far from

unique in this respect.

But conditions here can only be

described as epidemic.

With strains like the one now said

to be at large in Manchester,

it's hard to believe that more lives

won't be destroyed before

the situation is reversed.

Really keen to hear from you -

if you've used Spice or you're

affected by people who do use it -

has the legislation

banning it worked?

Do get in touch in the usual ways.

We have had a text message from

Carol who says she is a probation

officer in London, she's not sure

why it's trying comparisons to

cannabis because it vastly different

and has much more devastating

effects. Cannabis is a relatively

safe drug with minimum long-term

effects on users compared to alcohol

and Spice. Hence why cannabis has

been realised in many American

states. Spice has horrendous effects

causing temporary paralysis, heart

problems and psychotic episodes. I

have had clients in their 20s, says

Carol, who have had heart attacks

after taking Spice. I have also had

clients say that when it was legal

prison officers would bring it into

the jail for them and that is why

the offenders got addicted to it. I

have multiple offenders who have

entered prison having never tried

Spice only to come out with a

serious addiction to it. It's a

horrendous drug and something

drastic needs to be done to educate

people on the dangers and get it off

the streets. And Julia on e-mail

says Spice is more readily available

and cheaper than cannabis and that

is an outrage. Why can't the

government follow the lead of

Amsterdam and either legalise

cannabis or create exemptions for

the use of cannabis and bring in

cafe shops like Amsterdam and

regulate them as well as collecting

tax on them. We will talk more about

Spice and the effect of this new

strain, more dangerous strain on

users on the streets of Manchester

in the second hour of the programme.

Really interesting to hear from

people like Carol who is a probation

officer and comes across the effects

of this drug. If you have relevant

experience let me know, get in touch

on the e-mail, and we will feed that

into the conversation.

The trial continues of former

Crewe Alexandra and Man City

football coach Barry Bennell.

The 63-year-old is accused of 48

counts of child sexual abuse

against 11 complainants,

who were aged between eight and 14

at the time of the alleged offences.

Every day on this programme

at around this time we'll be

bringing you up to date

with the evidence in court.

We can speak now to our sports news

reporter, David Ornstein,

who's outside Liverpool Crown Court.

David, tell us what happened

yesterday?

Victoria yesterday was

essentially the first day of this

trial, Barry Bennell is facing now

known as Richard Jones. The

prosecuting barrister set out the

case against Barry Bennell and he

appeared on video link winning a

grey jumper and he is now known as

Richard Jones. Mr Johnson QC

described Barry Bennell as a

predatory and determined paedophile

with pretty much unfettered access

to young boys dreaming of life in

professional football who had the

particular predilection to

prepubescent boys and is alleged to

have abused one boy on more than 100

occasions. Victoria the jury were

told that Barry Bennell worked as a

youth coach in Cheshire, Manchester

and Derbyshire in the late 70s and

early 1990s. The jury would hear

evidence over this eight-week trial

that concerned allegations against

Barry Bennell by boys in England and

Wales and also the United States and

that Mr Bennell had served prison

sentences in both jurisdictions.

They will hear that some of the

abuse took place at the ground of

Crewe Alexandra where he was a coach

and on tours and that many incidents

occurred at his home. While he was a

skilled and relatively successful

football coach though was a much

darker side. The jury were told that

while listening to the evidence they

must decide whether this is a group

of men, the alleged victims, are a

group of men that Barry Bennell says

are jumping on the bandwagon and

making up false and malicious

allegations for financial gain,

essentially compensation, or if this

is a series of serious allegations

by Ed Davey is paedophile against a

very vulnerable lads.

What are we

expecting today?

Today we expect to

hear from the first witness, Barry

Bennell is 63 years old, we should

remember, and faces 48 charges of

sexual abuse involving 11 alleged

victims between eight and 14. The

date ranges between 1979 and 1991.

Before the trial started Barry

Bennell redid guilty to seven

charges involving three boys aged

between 11 and 14 between 1981 and

1991. He is not here in person

because of ill-health we are told.

He is fed through a chip. But if he

is to give evidence he will need to

attend court and as I said it is

expected to last eight weeks, this

trial.

David Ornstein outside

Liverpool Crown Court. Thank you.

The trial continues.

We'll bring you coverage of that

trial every day on this programme.

An investigation into the death of a

baby girl in Nottingham has

concluded that her death was

preventible. Do university students

need to be protected from free

speech on their cam us? MPs are

going to be discussing the issue

today. We'll hear from both sides.

Time for the latest

news, here's Reeta.

The BBC News headlines this morning:

At least 13 people have died

in flash floods and mudslides

in southern California.

Witnesses say torrents raged

through the streets and boulders

the size of cars rolled

down the hillsides.

Hundreds of people remain

trapped in their homes.

Emergency services said

they expected the number

of deaths to rise.

The Army is launching

a new recruitment campaign

which emphasises the "emotional

and physical support"

given to soldiers.

A series of radio, television

and online adverts addresses

concerns potential recruits might

have about issues such

as their sexuality or religion.

There's been criticism

from some former officers,

who've accused the army of bowing

to political correctness.

But the Ministry of Defence

says its "belonging campaign" has

already sparked significant

from people interested

in joining up.

100 well-known French women have

signed an open letter

defending the right of men

to make sexual advances.

The actress Catherine Deneuve is one

of the signatories who say

the recent wave of denunciations

of sexual harassment

following the Harvey Weinstein

affair is creating a new feminism

defined by hatred

of men and sexuality.

In the open letter published

in Le Monde, the women say

there is a new puritanism afoot

in the world.

Passengers on Thameslink,

Southern and Great Northern services

have suffered the worst disruption

of any rail franchise according

to a highly critical report.

The National Audit Office says the

country's largest rail operator has

failed to provide value for money.

It says industrial action has been a

major factor for delays, but the

Department for Transport has also

made decision which have negatively

impacted on passengers. The

Government has admitted the

disruption has been unacceptable and

has called on the RMT union to end

what it calls needless strike

action.

New measures to clamp down

on plastic waste are to be

announced by the government.

They include the extension

of the five-pence charge on plastic

bags to all shops in England.

Retailers with fewer

than 250 staff are currently

exempted from the levy.

The idea is part of a 25-year plan

to improve the environment.

All retailers in Scotland and Wales

are already required

to charge for plastic bags.

Here's some sport now with Sarah.

Bristol City were two minutes away

from holding Premier League leaders

Manchester City in the first leg

of their League Cup semifinal.

The sides were level at 1-1 before

Sergio Aguero popped up in stoppage

time to give Pep Guardiola's side

a slim advantage going

into the second leg

at Ashton Gate in a fortnight.

The war of words continues between

Antonio Conte and Jose Mourinho.

The Chelsea boss called Mourinhno

a "little man" and says

"he won't forget this"

after the Manchester United manager

brought up Conte's "match-fixing

suspension" last weekend.

And England prop Joe Marler

will miss the first two Six Nations

games after being

suspended for six weeks.

And that's your sports headlines.

Baby Harriet Hawkins was born, dead,

at Nottingham City Hospital

on 17th April 2016.

She died as a result of a mismanaged

labour and an independent

investigation has just concluded

that her death was "almost

certainly preventable".

Harriet's father Jack

is a hospital consultant.

Her mother Sarah is

a senior physiotherapist.

Both work for the hospital

trust responsible for

the death of their baby -

their first child.

Since that day, the couple have

campaigned to force the Trust

to acknowledge it made mistakes,

mistakes which they believed

had been covered up.

You might remember them

telling us such last year,

but it has taken almost two years

for an independent report to reach

the same conclusion.

Sarah had been in

labour for six days.

The couple had made ten phone

calls and two visits

to the hospital.

By the time she was finally admitted

in the late stages of labour,

their daughter had died.

It took another nine hours before

Sarah was able to give birth.

Sarah Hawkins is here

and so as Jack.

We can speak to them both now

and their solicitor, Janet Baker.

How did you respond?

It was a

mixture of feelings really. It was

relief to actually be heard and for

there to be official acknowledgement

that, you know, Harriet's death was

almost certainly preventible. It was

just brilliant to be, for the

external rerue team to be open and

honest and transparent and that's

all we had asked from anyone since

Harriet died. But obviously with

that, it brings great sadness

because as you say it is a trust we

work for. Minutes after Harriet's

death all we had been saying, there

were problems, they hadn't been open

and they hadn't been honest or

transparent and we wouldn't be sats

here today if they had and it was,

it is just... It's, it has been a

very hard time.

How did you respond,

Jack?

Really very much the same.

It's very difficult when you know

the truth and other people are

telling you that you've got it

wrong. It feels like we've been

accused of lying. I think it is

worth mentioning that nobody from

the hospital has listened to our

story which we've made copious notes

on at the time. Nobody has sat down

and said, "What actually happened?"

What they have done is listened to

reports from other members of staff

involved in her case that don't

match with reality and that's, so

it's been very tough, but having

this report, I mean it gives

Nottingham no further opportunity to

try and wriggle out of what actually

happened. We are deeply concerned

that in the 21 months or so since

Harriet died the problems have

persisted and they shouldn't and

they didn't need to.

OK, we'll talk

about that in a moment.

It is worth reminding our audience

that initially the hospital did its

own internal investigation without

your involvement.

Correct.

And

concluded that staff made no errors

and that Harriet had died from an

infection. You know a bit about

infections Jack, don't you, so you

were able to challenge that and the

pathologist's report, saying that

had there been an infection serious

enough to kill Harriet you would

have been extremely unwell as her

mother and probably required

intensive care treatment. Also for

the benefit of our audience, an

external review was carried out by a

medical professional who the trust

then offered a job to and the draft

report she had done said Harriet's

death was contributed to by five

things. When you got the final

report, it had been changed to say

what?

That Harriet's death might

have been prevented, but certainly,

might. So...

Might have been

avoided.

Thank you. We felt, so we

thought that directly contributed to

by was only just strong enough

anyway, but it was a definite

improvement on the internal report,

but might, I am afraid is political

speak.

I think the thing there is

between the draft and the final

report, it was only given for

factual accuracy change and that's

not a factual accuracy change.

And

we asked the hospital to change it

back and they said it is not our

policy to change back reports and we

ask them to explain why it had

changed and they never responded.

I

want to ask you about the impact of

your baby's death on you since then?

It is so hard to put into words. I

don't think we have been able to

grieve yet because we have had this

fight. All we have asked for is to

be listened to and for the trust to

be open. We want Harriet, you know,

to be worth something and for an

improvement into the safety of their

service, that was all we were asking

and we didn't get that and we

haven't got answers. We've got

apologies, but apologies don't bring

back our dead daughter.

We're not

sure what they're apologising for

either. It feels like a platitude

rather than a direct apology about

the various problems that we have

faced with them.

That's the

statement that I have from the Chief

Executive of Nottingham university

Hospitals trust trust. I offer my

deepest sympathy to Sarah and

deepest sympathy to Sarah and Jack

for the stress of their death

daughter Harriet caused them. It is

likely that Harriet would have

survived had it not been for several

shortcomings in care. Why do you say

it is a platitude from your point of

view?

We are disturbed that the

report said almost certainly and

that the Chief Executive has chosen

to use the word, "Likely" again it

feels like an attempt to turn down

the volume of what is a very clear

report. To be fair to the Chief

Executive, that is a step up from

the previous apologies. So we don't

want to be dismissive of that. But

How many apologies have you had by

now?

They might as well signed off

their e-mails with, "Sorry for

adding to your distress."

They say

they have made steps to address the

shortcomings that arose from the

death of Harriet and strengthened

the maternity leadership structure

and improved the voment of parents

and strengthened governance

processes. Should that be reassuring

to other parents in the area, other

pregnant women?

We don't know the

detail and they should have served

the detail. Strengthening maternity

leadership is positive. That's not

the only criticism. There are lots

of criticism about the way the two

maternity departments operate and

communicate. We know because it has

been in the news they were

criticised by the coroner in 2014

for conducting a cofully inadequate

internal investigation. We're

shocked in 2016 they are still con

dicting woefully inadequate internal

investigations because it has taken

so long to get the hospital to

believe us, we have, we're concerned

what has been happening in the last

two years and there is a recent

coroner's inquest that has concluded

natural causes contributed to by

neglect and that is a very

significant...

For a baby?

Yes.

At

that same hospital?

Yes.

I think one of my concerns there is

that they haven't actually addressed

any clinical practise and we asked

why some of the clinicians who have

been highlighted in the report as

failing to deliver appropriate care

haven't been referred to their

governing bodies. The trust

responded with they didn't feel like

they met the threshold for referral

and I'm not sure, our daughter

dying, I'm not sure what their

threshold is for the referral.

A

number of midwives have been

retrained or sent on courses or

whatever. 18 months you have been

fighting for this. You both work

there, worked there. How difficult

has that been?

We haven't, I went

back to work for three months, but

my job is not just at the hospital,

that was very tough. But they have,

I got my P45 between Christmas and

New Year, so I am now unemployed.

I'm from next month I'm not getting

paid because I'm unable to return to

work. And Harriet is still in the

hospital because we have been, we

still haven't been able to have her

funeral.

What?

Yes.

How?

It is only

because we have got official

acknowledgement in this report that

her death was almost certainly

preventible that we can now have it,

but before with the previous

reports, they have always tried to

blame a weakness in us, a weakness

in Harriet like the infection so we

haven't been able to have her

funeral.

Right. Was that, was that

your choice that you wanted to wait

for a report that vindicated you so

you were going to leave the body of

your baby there?

We were so shocked

by their correlation between what

actually happened and the pathology

report that we didn't want to do

something permanent that would

provide useful information and we

were right. So, the final report has

been helped by us not having

Harriet's cremation.

I understand.

Now that we have this, we wanted to

wait for this to be published. It

has been slightly delayed in being

published, but not by the team who

wrote it.

Having your daughter lying

in a mortuary for 20 months is not a

pleasant feeling.

Janet Baker is the solicitor. What

next?

We're going to refer the

matter to the Crown Prosecution

Service because we feel that there

have been breaches of the health

care Act 2008 in relation to the

duty of candor. As can be seen,

there was no

You are alleging criminal offences

may have been committed when it came

to the hospital being open and

transparent about what actually

happened?

Yes, initially they did

not undertake an investigation it

was only after pressure from jack

and say that that they did anything

although their own protocol required

them to investigate this matter as a

serious untoward incident. When they

did investigate the incident Jack

and Sarah were not involved and it

was concluded there was no fault by

anyone at the hospital and the death

of Harriet was caused by infection.

The latest report has found that

that was certainly not the case and

that the pathologist was given

information which led him to

conclude it was probably infection

and not given the full clinical

picture which probably would have

led him to a different conclusion.

So we feel that is sufficient ground

for us to refer the matter to the

CPS to investigate under the health

and social care act. Under

regulations which came into force in

2014. We are also going to refer to

the Health and Safety Executive

because the most recent report

highlights patient safety issues in

systemic errors which we are not

convinced have been put right and

certainly were in existence at the

time of Harriet's death and at least

five months later when the other

baby died in similar circumstances.

Thank you for talking to us, Janet

Bakker solicitor, and Sarah and Jack

Hawkins, thank you for coming on the

programme.

Nottingham University Hospitals

Trust told us they've already made

substantial changes to address

the shortcomings in their systems

of clinical care and governance that

arose from this case and have

completed a broader review

of maternity services.

They say they've strengthened

the maternity leadership structure,

improved involvement of parents

in the investigation

process, and strengthened

governance processes.

They also say they've

completed a full review

of patient safety and outcomes

in its maternity service.

While areas of improvement

have been identified,

they say outcomes in their maternity

services are no different to those

in other similar units

in England and Wales.

Let's read some messages about Spice

coming from you after seeing are

some little earlier, Jacob says I am

a recreational drug user and tried

Spice when I was 16 because it was

easier to get than cannabis and it

was one of the most potent drugs I

have ever tried and one of the worst

experiences I have had mentally and

physically. Vastly different to

cannabis. I possibly could see the

appeal to homeless people as you

become so detached from reality. I

had hoped the ban would make it less

readily available but it's done the

opposite as I know more and more

dealers are selling it. Cameron said

I have been inside and seen the

effect on people in jail and it's

the worst thing I have ever seen.

People smoke it because they think

it is safe like cannabis when it is

the opposite. Since I have been out

of jail I have seen people smoking

Spice in the town centre, sleeping

on the floor and it is awful. Keep

those coming in, we will talk more

about Spice in the remaining part of

the programme.

Coming up, he was diagnosed

with depression as a teenager

and despite taking anti-depressants

realised he was still depressed.

We'll speak to Johann Hari

about his new book -

which questions what we know

about mental health.

To what extent is free speech

being suppressed in universities?

MPs are hearing evidence later today

about whether the law does enough

to protect freedom of speech

on university campuses.

In recent years there have been

a number of high profile cases

in which speakers with controversial

views have been prevented

from appearing at campuses,

a practice known as 'no

platforming'.

Supporters say it prevents hate

speech and stops vulnerable

people being harmed.

Opponents say it stops debate.

Last year the then Universities

Minister Jo Johnson said

Universities could be fined

if they fail to protect free speech.

It's an issue we first

looked at two years ago.

The policy is a policy that

says in our building -

and I'm talking the four walls

that we have in the Students Union,

that is for students -

we want to make it

accessible for everyone.

We're also making sure that

all voices, whether they are

LGBT, disabled, black, women,

trans, have a voice,

because we know in society

that they are marginalised

and don't have a voice.

That's the key thing.

We're not saying -

we don't live in a false bubble.

It's a place where you'd expect

to hear dangerous ideas,

not be frightened of them,

to actually go in...

I mean, people were saying,

"I might feel vulnerable."

I think that you will feel

uncomfortable, vulnerable,

everything will be scary,

because guess what?

Ideas that have changed the world

historically over many years -

have fought racism,

have got us equality -

they were offensive,

dangerous, scary to those

people who heard them.

Let's speak to Patrick Kilduff,

president of the University

of Edinburgh's student association,

who is giving evidence

at the inquiry today.

The University banned Robin Thicke's

'Blurred Lines' from being played

at student union events

because the lyrics "undermine

and degrade women".

Owl Fisher is a transgender

filmmaker and campaigned

to stop Germain Greer from speaking

at International Women's

Day in Brighton.

And Linda Bellos was 'no platformed'

by a Cambridge student society

because of her views about trans

women - that they aren't the same

as women who were born female.

Thank you all of you for talking to

us, I would like to hear you talking

to each other about the issue of

freedom of speech, not the subject

of views. Let me ask you to start

off with, Linda is free speech being

suppressed at universities?

It looks

like it, I don't want to hype it

but... The difficulty is if what was

said to me is widespread then we

have a problem. I don't think

students should be protected, I put

that in inverted commas, from ideas

they might disagree with. I think

they should develop robust arguments

in response, that is what we go to

university for, I did, as a mature

student.

No

student.

No Owl?

It is beyond

differing opinions and disagreement,

it is opinions which are hateful and

stigmatising towards a group of

people which is why I think

universities say they are there to

protect students and they did want

them to be exposed to views which

could harm them and people in that

situation. I think the discussion

needs to be about what sort of

opinions are being expressed, we can

differ on certain topics but when we

are speaking about people's lives it

has real consequences and

ramifications towards people and

especially minorities and we need to

be careful about what we put out

there and what is allowed to be

said.

Go-ahead Linda. I can see

wanted to respond? Could you hear

what Owl said?

Yes I did, I did not

realise you were addressing me,

sorry. I heard it and I think about

the hurt I have experienced in these

67 years of my life in Britain. I

was not protected, what I did do was

I think develop responses in order

to cope. I was not intending to

speak to students in ways that would

be hurtful or disrespectful of where

they wear or where they thought they

were, I wanted and I still want to

explore with other human beings

ideas, thoughts, I happen to think

that gender is very much a man-made

notion, just like a race is. There

is only one race, the human race,

yet there is racism because others

are treated less favourably because

of the colour of their skin. There

is the same stuff with gender.

I

would say it does look like it's all

about perception getting ahead of

reality. Almost everyone who is

seeing free speech is under attack

at universities spends no time in

higher education institutions. The

comments were ignorant because we

know free speech is alive and well,

we host almost five and a half

thousand events, the largest arts

festival in the world, and only a

few events are referred to the

compliance group by virtue of

government legislation and nothing

to do with the students Association.

Is it right there are some speakers

who will be invited would-be no

platform to because you want to

protect a group of students?

I think

it's right we take security

seriously.

What do you mean?

Their

risk elements to inviting certain

speakers so we have to account for

that.

What do you think would

happen, go on Linda?

I wonder if

they being black might hurt some of

them because most of them are white?

Is a risk? Spice I think that is

quite an inflammatory statement. The

security risks I am talking about

are the general health and safety of

people attending an event which is

why no speakers have been....

why no speakers have been....

I am

telling you what I believe you refer

to as now platforming is as you

know, you were disinvited. Why that

definition I have been no platform

by thousands of TV programmes this

morning but I don't get an platform

to stand in the media and say I was

no platform. You are currently on

one of the larger TV programmes in

the country talking about...

As are

you.

Yes but I'm not demonising a

false notion of now platforming.

Am

I? In what way?

I think the reasons

people might be disinvited is their

views are harming a vulnerable group

in society. It is not because people

are not allowed to speak because of

who they are it is because of the

views which have severe consequences

towards people and I am sorry that

that makes you side but it has real

consequences upon the lives of

people.

My views include my

experience of racism, that is part

of my view my experience and

analysis of power and during

construction, of systems that are

created usually by men, white men,

to highlight and create a hierarchy

in which some of us are given some

status and others are not. Those are

my views, is that dangerous to you?

It is dangerous when it starts

advocating against my rights and

these views are advocating against

my rights, the campaign you have

aligned ledger southward does.

That

is untrue. I support the 2004 gender

recognition act. I disagree with

some of the proposed changes to that

act which will have a

disadvantageous impact upon those of

us who remain female women.

Owl can

you explain what harm it does you to

hear the kind of use Linda has about

trans women, what specific harm?

The

main consequence of people denying

trans people their humanity and what

they are contributes to a very De

Vanna today and the scrum and today

discourse and we can see this when

we look at suicide rates for trans

people and how vulnerable they are

in society because these views

contribute to it and the reasons

trans people are often discriminated

against or cannot get access to

services is because of

discrimination and stigma.

Why do

you believe the best way to overcome

those views which you find offensive

is to silence them and not hear

them?

I would not say silence them,

I think Linda has every platform to

see her views, I just think in this

case it's not about her being

silenced it is about a specific

university not wanting to invite her

to speak at a specific event and it

is the right because they are taking

a stand against use she has

portrayed.

I am objecting to some

proposals the government for making

which will be disadvantageous to

those of us who are women, that is a

matter, it is not a matter of

matter, it is not a matter of the

view but I'm allowed to have them, I

think it is right in a free society,

we don't all have to agree with each

other but we do and can and should

be able to disagree with each other.

Again I think we have a right to

disagree and I think view's should

be challenged but it's about doing

it in a secure environment and now

platforming and those things you

speak of, the people on the no

platform realists are terrorist

organisations, people arrested for

inciting violence and racial hatred

and those other things we take into

account when we invite speakers,

like any organisation.

Am I1 of

them? I am asking you, I am one of

these people?

You are not on the now

platforming list.

But in this case I

was disinvited?

Yes, and that is one

institution 's decision not to

invite you to something.

Six

organisations are banned from

campuses including national action,

the BNP. Critics of bands like that

point to the fact, you will all

remember neck Grabban the leader of

the BNP, the then leader of the BNP

on question Time whose support seems

to fall away after he was able to

hear his views.

That is someone who

was put on a stage in the BBC studio

in a secure setting to air his

views. Most universities don't have

the resources to put on that I am

sure Broadcasting House had to put

on to accommodate for neck Griffin

that night.

Thank you all very much

for coming on the programme. Many

thanks for your time.

The latest news and sport in a

moment.

Let's get the latest weather

update - with Carol.

Better late than never, this morning

we have had a variety of weather,

mist and fog, beautiful pictures

sent in from Dorset by one of our

weather Watchers, this one of line

Regis shows a lovely sunrise and

clearer skies. For many of us a band

of rain moving east but behind it it

will be much whiter than it has been

the last couple of days with

sunshine coming through. Mist and

fog patches lifting from all but

Northern Ireland where we still do

have quite a bit of fog and that

will slowly left into low at cloud

and it won't lift for many at all.

At the same time we've also got rain

pushing over towards the east,

lingering across Yorkshire and

Lincolnshire into East Anglia to the

course of the afternoon but move

away from that and there is a

handbag of cloud with the cloud

continually breaking up and we will

see sunshine, some of us already

have the sunshine. Temperatures this

afternoon in Plymouth night breezes

will feel nice and across Wales,

vastly improved compared to last few

days, more bright spells and

sunshine and higher temperatures.

Northern Ireland will hang on to the

low cloud with fog through the day

for some, but it will be breaks it

will be bright rather than sunny,

western and central Scotland seeing

sunshine, rain across the far

north-east and also the Northern

Isles. Through this evening and

overnight we will so have some of

this rain but with all the moisture

in the atmosphere we are looking at

some fog forming quite widespread

tonight compared to the night just

gone across Northern Ireland, parts

of Wales, the Midlands and southern

counties, there will also be patchy

frost as well. Tomorrow the fog will

take its time to clear for some it

will lift into low cloud, for others

it will not clear at all, it will

have an adverse impact on the

temperatures, it will feel cold if

you're stuck underneath it but where

it left and we expect that to be

towards the West and the north we

are looking at sunshine but tempered

just that bit more low, the max

temperature in Glasgow only three

Celsius. Friday morning starts off

on a grey note, once again with some

patchy fog, touch of frost here and

they are but the further east you

are the brighter it will be because

by then we will have another weather

front waiting in the wings in the

West which will bring in rain and

some strengthening winds. Through

the course of ready into Saturday it

will move slowly from the west

towards the east. The timing of this

weather front could change so at the

moment what we think Saturday is it

will be wet across western Scotland

and into West Wales and south-west

England but if this slows up

obviously it will be drier in some

of those areas. The driest

conditions once again will be the

further east that you do travel.

Hello, it's Wednesday, it's 10

o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

Charities who work with drug users

in Manchester have told this

programme that a new strain

of the synthetic drug "spice"

is having a devastating

affect on the city.

We knew a particular gentleman who

is alcoholic and he was passed a

joint. He didn't realise spice was

in it. He took a couple of puffs and

fell to the ground and he ended up

dying a week later.

We'll be speaking to people directly

affected by the drug.

f you've used spice

or you're affected

by people who use it,

do get in touch and tell us what

kind of difference the ban has made.

No more macho "Your country needs

you" and "Be the best" -

the army is changing the way it

advertises for new recruits in

an attempt to demonstate it welcomes

people from all backgrounds.

I thought the Army was dominated by

men.

We'll speak to people who have

served in the Armed Forces.

Your reaction to this

is very welcome.

A French actress has said men should

be allowed to "hit on women"

without being forced out

of their jobs.

Catherine Deneuve is one of 100 well

known french women to sign

a letter in the wake

of the Harvey Weinstein scandal.

We;ll speak to one

of the signatures.

Reeta is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary

of the rest of the day's news.

At least 13 people have died

in mudslides and floods

in southern California.

Witnesses say that torrents raged

through the streets. Hundreds of

people remain trapped in their

homes. Emergency services said they

expected the number of deaths to

rise.

The Army is launching

a new recruitment campaign

which emphasises the emotional

and physical support

given to soldiers.

A series of radio and online adverts

addresses concerns that potential

recruits might have.

There has been criticism from some

former officers who have

accused the Army of bowing

to political correctness.

The Ministry of Defence says its

campaign has sparked significant

interest from people in joining up.

100 well-known French women have

signed an open letter

defending the right of men

to make sexual advances.

The actress Catherine Deneuve is one

of the signatories who say

the recent wave of denunciations

of sexual harassment

following the Harvey Weinstein

affair is creating a new feminism

defined by hatred

of men and sexuality.

In the open letter published

in Le Monde, the women say

there is a new puritanism afoot

in the world.

Two Burmese journalist have been

charged in officialth court

charged in officialth court with

breaking Myanmar's official secrets

act. The arrest of the two

journalists, who work for the

righters news agency, has been

widely condemned.

Passengers on Thameslink,

Southern and Great Northern services

have suffered the worst disruption

of any rail franchise according

to a highly critical report.

The Government's spending watchdog,

the National Audit Office,

says the country's largest rail

operator has failed

to provide value for money.

It says industrial action has been a

factor for delays.

The Government admitted

the disruption has been unacceptable

and called on the RMT to cancel

needless strike action.

New measures to clamp down

on plastic waste are to be

extended by the Government.

Retailers with fewer than 250 staff

are exempted from the levy.

The idea is part of a 25 year plan

to improve the environment.

All retailers in Scotland and Wales

are already required