26/02/2018 Victoria Derbyshire


26/02/2018

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Hello, it's Monday,

it's nine o'clock,

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I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

welcome to the programme.

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This morning, in a TV first,

we're broadcasting live

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from a primary school for children

who've been excluded from or can't

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be taught in mainstream education.

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It's called a pupil referral unit.

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No, no!

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Well, I did really bad stuff

like pushing on people

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and punching some people

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and sometimes kicked them.

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I don't...!

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That's Kayden.

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This morning, we'll see how

children like him are given

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the help to turn their behaviour

and their lives around.

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And we'll meet

some of their parents.

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It's hard to accept that your child

is not actually that lovable.

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Erm, so I used to say

like I love him,

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but how the hell is anyone else

going to love him or even like him?

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Almost every child here successfully

returns to mainstream school -

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so how do the teachers do it?

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The stigma is that it's a place

for naughty children.

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They're not naughty children.

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They're wonderful, bright,

intelligent, just amazing children,

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but they've made poor choices,

and that's a big, big difference.

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This morning, we've been given

incredible access to this school,

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some of its pupils,

some of their mums and dads

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and to the teachers here.

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And the reason we're here

is because we can exclusively reveal

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that there's been a big rise

in the numbers of primary school

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children being educated

in pupil referral units.

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Morning, welcome to Hawkswood

Primary Pupil Referral Unit

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in Waltham Forest,

North East London.

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We're broadcasting to you live

here all morning.

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This is where children come

when they're kicked out

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of mainstream school or in danger

of being kicked out.

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It is a pretty small screw, this is

the main corridor, the main

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thoroughfare, 40 pupils, and it is

at capacity, and this is a place

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where children come when they have

been kicked out of mainstream

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education, or where they are in

danger of being kicked out of

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mainstream education. Children as

young as four come to this pupil

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referral unit, or PRU, as it is

known. Often they children have

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emotional problems, a history of

aggressive or violent behaviour

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towards siblings, parents, teachers

and other pupils in their class. We

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have been given exclusive access to

this cool to meet the pupils and the

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staff whose job it is to turn around

of the children here. -- the school.

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As you'd expect, we very much

want your input too.

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Does your child go to

a pupil referral unit?

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Did you go to one?

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Tell us your own experience.

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We will be concentrating on PRUs

throughout the week, and tomorrow we

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will be taking your calls on this

subject. So do get in touch in the

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usual way. First, the news with

John. --

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Joanna.

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Jeremy Corbyn will set

out Labour's position

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on Brexit this morning

after months of demands

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that the party clarify its plans.

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In a speech later, he'll say the UK

should negotiate a bespoke agreement

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with the EU on a customs union,

and a strong new relationship

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with the single market.

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The Conservatives say his proposals

would breach promises made

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at the last general election.

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You can watch Mr Corbyn's

speech on this programme.

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It's expected at about 10:30.

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Four people have been killed

in an explosion in Leicester,

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which destroyed a building

in the middle of a parade of shops.

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Another four people

remain in hospital,

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one with serious injuries.

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Emergency teams are still searching

through the wreckage

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in the Hinckley Road area

of the city.

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Andy Moore reports.

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The immediate aftermath of an

explosion that destroyed a shop and

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a two storey shop above it. Police

say there were four confirmed

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fatalities and four people remain in

hospital, one with serious injuries.

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The search and rescue operation

continued overnight for any more

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victims. Police say there may be

other people and accounted for. --

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unaccounted four.

We still think

this is a rescue operation, we using

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shoring techniques to try to rescue

anyone who may be alive in the

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building.

Local people spoke about

the force of the explosion and the

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fierceness of the fire that

followed.

We heard a low explosion,

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and it felt like a tremendous shock

through the house, like it was going

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to bring the ceiling down.

I live

here, I rang the police, 999, and

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they said what services, I said

everything you can send.

Police say

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they don't know what caused the

blast, a joint investigation with

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the Fire Service will get under way

once the site has been made safe.

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There's been a big rise

in the number of primary school

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children being educated in pupil

referral units, according

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to a freedom of information

request by this programme.

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Children are referred to the units

when they've been excluded,

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or are close to being excluded,

from their mainstream school.

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Over the last four years,

a third more children in England

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are being schooled in the units.

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New legislation to cap

poor-value energy tariffs

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and save consumers money

is being introduced

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to Parliament later.

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The Government says

it will protect 11 million

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people from higher bills.

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The industry has warned the cap

could stifle competition.

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Nigeria says it's deploying

more airplanes to assist

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in the search for the girls

missing after an Islamist attack

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on their school last week.

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More than 100 girls are feared

to have been abducted

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by Boko Haram militants in Yobe

state in the northeast.

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The authorities said police

and security officials had been sent

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to schools there to deter

new attacks by the insurgents.

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Parts of the UK will feel colder

than the Arctic Circle

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this week with widespread snow

and bitterly cold winds.

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Rail companies in East Anglia

say their services

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will end early tonight.

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C2C and Greater Anglia

have also cancelled services

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on Tuesday and Wednesday.

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They urge customers

to check before travelling.

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That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

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Now the sport with Hugh.

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Good morning.

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Manchester City have won their first

trophy under manager Pep Guardiola

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with a comfortable 3-0 win

over Arsenal.

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City captain Vincent Kompany

was on the scoresheet

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as the Premier League's runaway

leaders secured the first domestic

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title of the season.

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Afterwards, Guardiola thanked

the club for its support

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during his trophy-less first season.

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A good win too for the red

half of Manchester.

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United came from behind to beat

Chelsea 2-1 at Old Trafford

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in the Premier League.

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After Willian's opener, United

striker Romelu Lukaku

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levelled things before crossing

in for substitute Jesse Lingard

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to nod in the winner

which takes United back into

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second place in the table.

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Chelsea, though, slip out

of the Champions League spots.

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Six Nations Rugby say they'll

investigate an alleged melee before

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Scotland's Calcutta Cup victory

over England on Saturday.

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As the teams returned

to the dressing rooms

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after warming up, England back

Owen Farrell and Scotland forward

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Ryan Wilson appeared to clash.

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The Six Nations said it would be

writing to the unions to request

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clarification on what happened

in the tunnel.

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That is all the sport for now,

Victoria, back to you. Good morning,

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hello, welcome to our programme.

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This morning, we're broadcasting

live from a pupil referral unit

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or PRU in Waltham Forest

in North East London.

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It is the first time a live TV

programme has come from a school

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like this, a primary school in

north-east London, 40 pupils between

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the ages of four and 11. This is

where they come when they are kicked

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out of mainstream education or are

in danger of being kicked out. 351

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PRUs across England. Aspiration is

really important in this particular

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school, have a look at this, some

artwork on one of the wars, Martin

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Luther King had a dream, and the

children are photographed holding up

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their own posters - I have a dream,

if I could make a difference and

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become PM. I have a dream I could

save millions of dogs, cats and

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animals in the world. The reason we

are here today is because we have

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discovered there has been a big rise

in the numbers of primary

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schoolchildren being educated in

places like this, in PRUs. The

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question is, why? That is what we

are going to explore this morning.

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In a few minutes, we are going to

show you an incredible film which

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shows you the kind of techniques

that they used here. After you, if

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you want to go through. The kind of

techniques that they use here,

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including restraint, that help turn

a child's life around. They have

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given us such transparent, open

access, it is a real insight. First,

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I have been told it is OK to go into

one of the lessons,

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one of the lessons, so this is Ms

Mwaniki's class one. Hello! Good

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morning, Ms Mwaniki, how are you?

Good morning, everybody!

Morning!

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Thank you for having us in your

lesson, don't let me interrupt, go

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on, carry on.

So we know what

happened to him, what did he do?

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happened to him, what did he do? And

then what else? What did we learn in

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that story? Yes?

He was on the hard

floor.

Fantastic, we are going to

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think about how we can fracture

that, because he did not fall. Yes?

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Shall we change it? Jayden T?

Maybe

you could change it and say Ampadu

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do the felt off the wall...

Stop

there, remember, what do we have to

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do...

I am going to pause you, if

that is all right, just so we can

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have a chat. This is obviously a

literacy lesson, can we take a seat

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here?

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here? Hi, how are you, I am

Victoria, we have met before. Hi,

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Andrew, Jacob, how are you? Thank

you very much for allowing me to

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interrupt your literacy lesson, take

a seat, of course. What is it like

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here?

What it is like here is that

you are very caring people around

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you who really help you, so Ms

Mwaniki, because she helps most of

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the children here, and they kind of

get that you are in a safe

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environment, and it helps mentally

and physically, basically, because

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it helps you integrate into

mainstream school, because when, say

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me, when I was of age to be in a

mainstream school, I used to keep

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coming out and getting excluded, but

this cool gives you extra help, it

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is helping me understand how it is

better to go into Andrea Tiberi. --

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this school.

Andrew, what is it like

for you?

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for you?

It is nice and safe, and it

has helped me a lot, when I first

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came here, I didn't like it, but now

I do, and especially Ms Mwaniki, she

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has helped me through everything,

and it is a very disciplined school.

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And that is good, is it?

Yes.

Jacob,

how long have you been here?

About a

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year, and when I first started here,

I was having trouble behaving and

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making loads of wrong choices...

That is what you use to be like?

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Yeah, but now if there is somebody,

like, annoying me or something, I

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will just ignore them. And I would

just stay away from them if I know

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they are going to create trouble or

something, and if one of my friends

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is trying to tell me to do something

wrong or something like that, I

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would ignore him and say no, I know

that is the wrong thing and I

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shouldn't do that.

And that is the

kind of thing you can teach them?

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And this is your last week, isn't

it?

Yes.

You are going back to your

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old primary school?

Yes, Monday is

my last day.

How does it feel?

I am

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a little anxious, but I have come

very far, and I have worked hard to

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reach this point.

We are going to

talk more in a moment, thank you

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very much for having me in your

classroom, I really want to urge you

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to watch this film.

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Do you know why you came here?

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Because I was being bad

at my other one...school.

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I think there is a stigma attached

to pupil referral units.

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He pinched me!

0:14:220:14:23

Nicholas.

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The stigma is that it's a place

for naughty children.

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Good boy, Nicholas.

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SCREAMING.

0:14:290:14:31

I mean, I don't like that

terminology at all.

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No, no!

0:14:340:14:35

I used to swear a lot.

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I used to be mean to

the teachers a lot.

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Did you have a good weekend?

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No.

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You do get really attached to them.

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The time you spend with them,

the things you go through

0:14:460:14:49

together, it's just...

0:14:490:14:51

There's nothing like it, really.

0:14:510:14:53

They're not naughty children.

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They're wonderful, bright,

intelligent, just amazing children

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but they've made poor choices,

and that's a big, big difference.

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It's a big day for Kayden.

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His first with a new class

at Hawkswood pupil referral unit.

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He's only six, yet he is in danger

of being permanently excluded

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from his mainstream school.

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Well, I did really bad stuff.

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Like pushing other people

and punching some people

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and sometimes kicked them.

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Kayden, you are very good at that.

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He's recently, from

what we understand, been

0:15:520:15:55

on a reduced timetable,

so he wouldn't be in class all day.

0:15:550:15:58

Do you know why you did that?

0:15:580:15:59

I don't know.

0:15:590:16:01

I think they got me

in a really bad mood.

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People do that sometimes.

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So our aim would be to get him back

into a mainstream classroom

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where he can be there all day

and accessing the curriculum

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like all of his peers.

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He's in a class with four other

children in the same boat.

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Today's the first time

they've all been together.

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OK.

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Hey!

0:16:270:16:28

That's it.

0:16:280:16:30

When they all first came in,

I think they were a bit bubbly

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and a bit jumpy because they just

needed to feel secure in this

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space and they needed

to feel secure with me.

0:16:370:16:39

And the new environment is testing

one of Kayden's triggers.

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Noise.

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She called me a baby!

0:16:430:16:44

No, I didn't!

0:16:440:16:45

Yes, you did.

0:16:450:16:46

Liar, liar, pants on fire.

0:16:460:16:47

Nicholas.

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You don't like noise, do you?

0:16:480:16:50

No.

0:16:500:16:57

Your hands to yourself,

and you were hurting people.

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That's why I have got

the ear defenders, to block

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off every single noise.

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You need to speak nicely to your

friends and if you can't do that...

0:17:080:17:11

Scared by the noise,

Kayden has started to act up.

0:17:110:17:14

Kayden, we're going to move

you out of this area.

0:17:140:17:20

Look what you've done.

0:17:200:17:26

What do you want me to do?

0:17:260:17:27

Look what, you made me...

0:17:270:17:28

Show me.

0:17:280:17:29

No, no!

0:17:290:17:30

Are you done?

0:17:300:17:32

Wait there.

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Come here.

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Leave me alone!

0:17:340:17:35

I just want to be left alone!

0:17:350:17:41

Kayden, I can take

you to the blue chair.

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I want to just be left alone.

0:17:430:17:47

Why can't I be left alone?

0:17:470:17:53

You want to be left alone?

0:17:530:17:54

It's not safe for me

to leave you here.

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I want to.

0:17:560:17:57

I can leave you alone, but not here.

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Yes.

0:17:590:18:00

Here is not the place.

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I can leave you alone inside

the classroom on the blue chair.

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I don't...!

0:18:050:18:07

You know you're not

allowed to hit me.

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I don't even care!

0:18:080:18:10

OK, well, I do care.

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I don't care!

0:18:110:18:13

It's not nice for me.

0:18:130:18:17

Kayden, why are we

here on the floor?

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Are you able to use your words

and tell me what's happened?

0:18:190:18:22

OK, that's fine but this isn't

a very safe place to be,

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in the middle of the corridor.

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I don't care!

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Oh, you don't need to care.

0:18:270:18:28

You just need to know that we do.

0:18:280:18:30

He almost ran from

the noise, and it...

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I would say it distressed

him and then that led

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on to undesired behaviour.

0:18:350:18:37

I know that he wanted a little bit

of peace and quiet to calm down.

0:18:370:18:41

Yeah.

0:18:410:18:42

Kayden, can we go to a safer

place than the corridor

0:18:420:18:44

where it's a bit quieter?

0:18:440:18:46

He was kind of stuck in the moment.

0:18:460:18:47

And so you try a few

different tactics.

0:18:470:18:49

Can I show you something

before we go?

0:18:490:18:51

I'm going to show you something.

0:18:510:18:53

In here.

0:18:530:18:56

And I said, "Oh, have

you seen our new library?

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Do you want to go in?"

0:18:590:19:00

And that was it.

0:19:000:19:01

He came right out of it.

0:19:010:19:02

And that's my favourite book.

0:19:020:19:04

Oh, no way!

0:19:040:19:05

That's your favourite book?

0:19:050:19:06

Are you serious?

0:19:060:19:07

Oh, my goodness, right.

0:19:070:19:08

That's Lego Batman.

0:19:080:19:09

Do you know what we're going to do?

0:19:090:19:11

That was distraction.

0:19:110:19:12

In that moment, that's

what brought him down again.

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Kayden's one of 40

pupils at Hawkswood.

0:19:170:19:20

Some are as young as five.

0:19:200:19:24

They all have different needs

but they are all here

0:19:240:19:27

because they've struggled

to manage their behaviour.

0:19:270:19:30

A typical intervention

is approximately 15-20 weeks.

0:19:300:19:33

It's really important that we build

attachments with the children

0:19:330:19:37

from a very early stage and we do

that via utter consistency.

0:19:370:19:44

For the juniors, the first lesson's

PE, every single morning.

0:19:440:19:49

She said scientifically,

when you do PE, it helps your

0:19:490:19:52

brain work properly.

0:19:520:19:57

And I don't know if that's

true or not but if it's

0:19:570:20:00

scientifically, then count me in.

0:20:000:20:02

At my old school, yeah,

I was spitting, I was punching,

0:20:020:20:05

I was hitting and I was

throwing chairs about.

0:20:050:20:10

It was really bad.

0:20:100:20:12

The worst time was when six

or seven people had to hold

0:20:120:20:15

me down on the floor.

0:20:150:20:16

I spent eight months

without being in school.

0:20:160:20:18

It wasn't good.

0:20:180:20:20

It wasn't good because it

made my brain hurt.

0:20:200:20:22

I didn't even learn anything.

0:20:220:20:27

My sister had to teach me.

0:20:270:20:32

Do you know, nursery,

nursery, nursery, four add

0:20:320:20:34

four, two add two, yeah?

0:20:340:20:35

She had to learn me that.

0:20:350:20:36

Why do you think Jo

was kicked out of school?

0:20:360:20:39

Because she was naughty?

0:20:390:20:40

Do we say naughty?

0:20:400:20:41

No, bad.

0:20:410:20:46

What do we say?

0:20:460:20:47

Do we say bad?

0:20:470:20:48

No.

0:20:480:20:49

What do we say?

0:20:490:20:51

She made what?

0:20:510:20:52

The wrong choices.

0:20:520:20:53

She made the wrong choices.

0:20:530:20:55

We teach the children

that they have a choice

0:20:550:20:58

when they feel frustrated,

they have a choice when they feel

0:20:580:21:00

anxious or angry and we teach them

that they are in control

0:21:000:21:03

of those choices.

0:21:030:21:04

Well done for doing the right thing.

0:21:040:21:06

She broke it.

0:21:060:21:07

Jamal, hands in your lap.

0:21:070:21:08

But Miss!

0:21:080:21:09

If you interrupt me again, Kayden,

you're going to go on the time out

0:21:090:21:13

chair to think about it.

0:21:130:21:14

And I don't want that.

0:21:140:21:15

But you need to make a good

choice and we're not

0:21:150:21:18

interrupting when I'm speaking,

do you understand?

0:21:180:21:19

Good boy.

0:21:190:21:23

We've got two minutes

till lunchtime.

0:21:230:21:24

Strict rules are always enforced.

0:21:240:21:28

Nicholas is refusing

to wash his hands before lunch.

0:21:280:21:31

Nicholas, you need to hurry up

and wash your hands.

0:21:310:21:34

Don't do that, Nicholas.

0:21:340:21:38

You'll be on the time out chair.

0:21:380:21:40

Is he going to the time out chair

or is he going to go

0:21:400:21:43

and wash his hands?

0:21:430:21:44

He's going to come

to the time out chair.

0:21:440:21:46

OK, that's fair enough.

0:21:460:21:47

Come on, Nicholas.

0:21:470:21:48

No, no!

0:21:480:21:49

You have to, Nicholas.

0:21:490:21:50

At times, occasionally, that can

lead to a physical intervention,

0:21:500:21:53

to keep the child safe.

0:21:530:21:54

Well done.

0:21:540:21:55

You know the meaning of restraining?

0:21:550:21:57

Basically, when they hold you down

because you're being unsafe.

0:21:570:21:59

I understand it here

because they explain it

0:21:590:22:01

in a more specific way.

0:22:010:22:02

No, I have to to make

sure everybody's safe.

0:22:020:22:04

We need to teach them from very

early on that we can keep them safe,

0:22:040:22:08

we can keep them emotionally

and physically safe and that

0:22:080:22:12

undesired behaviours won't be

tolerated but positive behaviours

0:22:120:22:17

will be rewarded with

attention or incentives

0:22:170:22:18

or whatever that may be.

0:22:180:22:20

Excellent.

0:22:200:22:21

Well done, Nicholas.

0:22:210:22:23

That's fine...

0:22:230:22:24

That's OK, but you have

to stay on the chair.

0:22:240:22:30

It's basically, like,

if you're being unsafe, like,

0:22:300:22:32

say if I came into this room

and I threw the table,

0:22:320:22:35

then one of the staff,

Miss Gentles would call assistance

0:22:350:22:37

and they will start holding me down

because I'm being unsafe.

0:22:370:22:40

No, no, no!

0:22:400:22:41

No, no, no!

0:22:410:22:44

Nicholas, we're going to hold

you again because we need

0:22:440:22:46

to make sure you are safe.

0:22:460:22:47

No, no!

0:22:470:22:48

And you're staying on the chair.

0:22:480:22:50

No, no!

0:22:500:22:51

SCREAMING.

0:22:510:22:52

Didn't we, Nicholas?

0:22:520:22:53

Do you remember?

0:22:530:22:54

Yes.

0:22:540:22:55

Stop it.

0:22:550:22:56

I've seen it before,

while I'm in class, some

0:22:560:22:59

children have been held.

0:22:590:23:00

I don't know the reason why.

0:23:000:23:01

It's none of my business.

0:23:010:23:03

I've just kept staying out of it.

0:23:030:23:05

You know, we need to wash our hands

before we have our lunch.

0:23:050:23:08

If we had said, oh, never mind,

hey-ho, after five minutes,

0:23:080:23:12

then the next day, when it came

to wash his hands, he could have

0:23:120:23:15

potentially showed us that same

behaviour because he would have

0:23:150:23:18

learned that that behaviour got him

out of washing his hands.

0:23:180:23:26

Some of the children,

potentially their families

0:23:320:23:35

are struggling with housing,

and are in quite cramped

0:23:350:23:37

living conditions.

0:23:370:23:43

Some children have come

from a background of some form

0:23:430:23:45

of abuse but not all children have

and I think that's really

0:23:450:23:48

important to stress.

0:23:480:23:52

That's a slight misconception,

that all the children who attend

0:23:520:23:54

the pupil referral unit have come

from an abused home

0:23:540:23:57

and that is incorrect.

0:23:570:24:02

The majority of parents are working,

trying really hard to provide

0:24:020:24:07

for their children but somewhere

along the line, something's

0:24:070:24:08

gone slightly wrong.

0:24:080:24:16

It's home time now and we've

collected these items out

0:24:170:24:20

of two of the new pupils' pockets.

0:24:200:24:23

But this isn't completely uncommon

and we find that children who have

0:24:230:24:26

got attachment issues

and they are trying to form

0:24:260:24:30

new attachments with the staff here,

they need to, or feel

0:24:300:24:34

that they need to take something

from here and take it home with them

0:24:340:24:37

so they feel connected to here,

a place where they felt safe

0:24:370:24:40

and contained today,

and take it back home,

0:24:400:24:42

to another place where they feel

safe and contained.

0:24:420:24:50

But there's another issue for staff.

0:24:510:24:52

It's spitting.

0:24:520:24:57

For the staff who weren't

here yesterday, we discussed...

0:24:570:25:00

The child in Katie's

room and spitting.

0:25:000:25:04

Something amazing happened.

0:25:040:25:07

Sit back on your bottom, please.

0:25:140:25:15

I don't like it.

0:25:210:25:23

Mrs Tubridy, I'm so sorry

to stop your lovely story.

0:25:230:25:25

Would you ask Miss Sinclair to come

and support me, please?

0:25:250:25:28

Anaya is five years old.

0:25:280:25:29

She's currently in reception but has

been permanently excluded

0:25:290:25:33

from her mainstream setting.

0:25:330:25:34

Where did the parcels go, Anaya?

0:25:340:25:36

It's quite unusual for a reception

child to be permanently

0:25:360:25:38

excluded but it does happen.

0:25:380:25:40

This behaviour is not acceptable.

0:25:400:25:41

No!

0:25:410:25:42

And we won't be

having that tomorrow.

0:25:420:25:44

No!

0:25:440:25:45

Anaya, Anaya.

0:25:450:25:46

Do the right thing.

0:25:460:25:47

Oh, dear.

0:25:470:25:49

That's a shame, isn't it,

because you started off

0:25:490:25:51

so well this morning.

0:25:510:25:53

She had the best morning.

0:25:530:25:55

We think that she's probably

spitting because it's a habit.

0:25:550:25:57

She knows that adults

will repel from that

0:25:570:26:01

so as hard as that is for us,

we need to make sure that we don't

0:26:010:26:05

pull away or whatever it may be

when she's doing that.

0:26:050:26:08

You had then started to spit

in my face and on my clothes

0:26:080:26:12

and on my arms and that's

not appropriate behaviour.

0:26:120:26:14

No, no.

0:26:140:26:15

If we need to hold her securely,

we're holding her securely,

0:26:150:26:18

putting your hand, one hand at each

side on the child's face.

0:26:180:26:22

If you continue to make that choice,

you will stay here.

0:26:220:26:24

But we really want you to

come back into class.

0:26:240:26:27

Katie and I did that

and she was spitting

0:26:270:26:29

still on Katie's hand.

0:26:290:26:33

But we talked about the fact that

Katie needed to not, you know,

0:26:330:26:36

put her head back or whatever

it was because what did she say

0:26:360:26:39

to you when you put your head back?

0:26:390:26:41

I know you're moving your head away

but I can still get you.

0:26:410:26:44

Yeah, OK.

0:26:440:26:45

Until this afternoon,

this little blip, she has been such

0:26:450:26:47

a superstar so it would

be really nice to...

0:26:470:26:50

I'm taking my hand away

because I know you can

0:26:500:26:52

control your spitting.

0:26:520:26:55

You have an apology to make to me

and the children for spitting

0:26:550:26:58

in our classroom and when you've

done that, you've got

0:26:580:27:00

ten minutes of payback.

0:27:000:27:01

When you've done that payback,

you can join everybody else

0:27:010:27:04

for after-school club.

0:27:040:27:05

We cannot wait to play with you.

0:27:050:27:12

Careful.

0:27:150:27:16

Careful.

0:27:160:27:24

Kayden lives with his

nan and grandad.

0:27:240:27:25

Sometimes we do family game night.

0:27:250:27:27

What do you play

on family game night?

0:27:270:27:30

We play Jenga and

Pie-face, the new one.

0:27:300:27:33

You play better than grandad.

0:27:330:27:34

Grandad?

0:27:340:27:35

Yes.

0:27:350:27:36

Next, after this, when I win...

0:27:360:27:40

When Kayden came into our life,

then I realised there were more

0:27:400:27:43

issues going on than just

a typical little boy.

0:27:430:27:47

The darkest point I think for us

was knowing that he was having

0:27:470:27:50

really bad meltdowns in school

and the school was

0:27:500:27:52

unable to manage that.

0:27:520:27:53

He was climbing up on furniture.

0:27:530:27:57

He was lifting up tables, throwing

objects around the classrooms.

0:27:570:28:00

It was just really disturbing

for other children to see.

0:28:000:28:04

We never had family game night.

0:28:040:28:09

So he's been in education

for two and a half years

0:28:090:28:12

and still can't read and write.

0:28:120:28:13

He would never have done that.

0:28:130:28:21

He can just about write his

name and maybe single

0:28:210:28:23

words but that's only

0:28:230:28:24

since he's been at Hawkswood.

0:28:240:28:25

There's been a drastic

change in Kayden.

0:28:250:28:27

He can sit down now for at least

five or ten minutes

0:28:270:28:30

and actually play a game.

0:28:300:28:31

He can do a little bit

of reading with us now.

0:28:310:28:34

He can sit, you know,

and just eat his dinner.

0:28:340:28:36

Wow, it sounds like you had

lots of fun at school today.

0:28:360:28:39

We don't take Kayden out very often.

0:28:390:28:41

We struggle with the fact that we're

worried that Kayden's going to run

0:28:410:28:44

off or he has meltdowns and then

we've got to try and explain

0:28:440:28:47

that to parents or people that

are staring and looking and I think

0:28:470:28:50

that's the hardest thing

is to try and explain

0:28:500:28:52

to someone that actually,

I'm really sorry that my child has

0:28:520:28:55

done this to your child or done

this to you or whatever,

0:28:550:28:58

but you can't label a child.

0:28:580:28:59

Kayden is not diagnosed

so until that diagnosis has been

0:28:590:29:02

made, I will not put a label on him.

0:29:020:29:08

OK, lovely, lovely.

0:29:090:29:11

Well, we'll see you on Wednesday.

0:29:110:29:12

OK, bye.

0:29:120:29:14

OK.

0:29:140:29:15

Who's that?

0:29:150:29:23

That's the father of a potential

new referral.

0:29:240:29:31

Dad did not want initially, did not

want his son to come here.

0:29:310:29:36

They can be very, very resistant,

and to be fair, it's

0:29:360:29:42

completely understandable

because when your child starts

0:29:420:29:44

school, you don't expect

for them to be referred

0:29:440:29:46

to a pupil referral unit.

0:29:460:29:49

Can go up as high as the 35 degrees?

0:29:490:29:51

They think they are going to walk

in and there's children fighting

0:29:510:29:54

in the corridors and all sorts,

and then they walk in,

0:29:540:29:56

it's really calm, they go

into the classrooms,

0:29:560:29:58

the children are working.

0:29:580:30:00

So, Baz, what's your place?

Japan?

0:30:000:30:03

Once we found this school,

it was just a big impact.

0:30:030:30:06

Now I'm in school, now I'm learning

and now, if I keep behaving,

0:30:060:30:09

I can reintegrate back

into a mainstream school.

0:30:090:30:11

Is that what you want?

Yeah, and it will happen.

0:30:110:30:19

Kayden's been here six weeks.

0:30:250:30:28

In a couple of months,

if all goes well, he'll

0:30:280:30:30

be back at his mainstream

school full-time.

0:30:300:30:35

You may choose something

from the prize pot.

0:30:350:30:37

I'm so proud of your behaviour

for the last few weeks.

0:30:370:30:42

All my favourite stuff is in here.

0:30:420:30:44

All your favourite stuff in there!

0:30:440:30:48

Remember when we were on the carpet

this morning, when you were doing

0:30:480:30:52

beautiful sitting and you said to me

that you love coming to this school?

0:30:520:30:56

Because I do.

0:30:560:30:57

So tell me some of the things

that you do

0:30:570:30:59

when you're making good choices.

0:30:590:31:00

Like, I'm tidying

up my room at home.

0:31:000:31:02

You do but thinking about what good

things do you do at school?

0:31:020:31:05

Oh, OK.

I do good writing.

0:31:050:31:07

Very good writing.

0:31:070:31:10

Where did we go on a

special trip last week?

0:31:100:31:12

The mime!

The pantomime, good boy!

0:31:120:31:16

Now, that's something

that could have been

0:31:160:31:19

quite tricky, couldn't it?

0:31:190:31:20

Yeah, do you know what

made me laugh in there?

What?

0:31:200:31:23

That wicked witch.

Yeah, that made me laugh.

0:31:230:31:25

She turned into a baby!

0:31:250:31:27

She did turn into

a baby, didn't she?

0:31:270:31:31

Kayden, normally, when you go

to places like theatres and cinemas,

0:31:310:31:34

what do you need to use to help you?

0:31:340:31:37

The ear defenders.

Your ear defenders.

0:31:370:31:39

Did you need them at the theatre?

No.

0:31:390:31:41

No way!

0:31:410:31:43

Because it wasn't noisy.

Well, actually, it was really noisy.

0:31:430:31:46

Yeah, but I didn't even need it.

You didn't.

0:31:460:31:50

Because I just ignored it.

You did ignore it.

0:31:500:31:52

Give me a high ten.

0:31:520:31:53

I love that word.

0:31:530:31:56

Very, very proud of you,

0:31:560:31:57

and I'm really proud of the teachers

that he's got there.

0:31:570:32:00

Knowing the difficulties

we are still going through

0:32:000:32:02

and they are still supporting us.

0:32:020:32:04

There's a light

at the end of tunnel.

0:32:040:32:08

Good girl.

0:32:080:32:12

Anaya had her best day.

0:32:120:32:13

She made good choices.

0:32:130:32:15

She managed her own behaviour

but primarily, she was just so proud

0:32:150:32:18

of herself and I think that rubs

off on everybody.

0:32:180:32:21

It was just a happy buzz all day.

A really, really good day.

0:32:210:32:24

This is for Kayden.

0:32:240:32:25

APPLAUSE

0:32:250:32:26

We boost children's confidence.

0:32:260:32:29

We show children what they can do.

0:32:290:32:34

You've got your certificate today

for that amazing writing last week.

0:32:340:32:40

Yes.

0:32:400:32:41

So if we do more amazing

writing, more certificates.

0:32:410:32:43

We teach them that they can have

aspirations and they can think big.

0:32:430:32:47

I just want to be a vet

when I'm older.

0:32:470:32:51

I love animals, and I love

taking care of them

0:32:510:32:53

and making sure they are healthy.

0:32:530:32:58

Today actually, funnily

enough, we have been

0:32:580:33:01

learning about mammals,

amphibians, reptiles, insects.

0:33:010:33:03

There's this special

word for a jellyfish.

0:33:030:33:05

I don't know what it is.

0:33:050:33:08

So I picked a leopard

because they are just,

0:33:080:33:10

they are just my spirit animal,

really.

0:33:100:33:13

What do you want to be?

Police.

0:33:130:33:18

You want to be a policeman?

Yeah.

0:33:180:33:20

Kayden.

0:33:200:33:23

Nice hands, because you're

a nice police officer.

0:33:230:33:24

Because they catch people

that are doing really bad stuff.

0:33:240:33:28

And we sometimes come to arrest you.

0:33:280:33:34

We need to work as a team

with the firefighters

0:33:340:33:39

because we're friends.

0:33:390:33:47

Well, as you saw, that film gave

a real insight into daily life

0:33:530:33:58

at this school and into how

they manage to turn round pupils.

0:33:580:34:03

Deputy head and classroom

teacher Leah Mwaniki,

0:34:030:34:10

and some of her pupils - Barrington,

age ten, Andrew, age nine,

0:34:100:34:13

and Jacob, who is also

nine, are still here.

0:34:130:34:17

Turn!

Sorry, ten!

Almost turned.

And

I am 11.

Zero points for!

0:34:170:34:33

Natalie on Facebook -

0:34:350:34:36

My daughter spent sometime

in a PRU last year

0:34:360:34:38

after a permanent exclusion.

0:34:380:34:39

She is now in a specialist

behavioural school

0:34:390:34:41

and she's slowly improving.

0:34:410:34:42

She has complex behavioural issues,

awaiting a complete

0:34:420:34:44

diagnosis and support.

0:34:440:34:45

The children are not

always naughty children.

0:34:450:34:52

Anonymous text - there's your answer

straightaway, small class sizes!

0:34:520:34:54

Trying to teach a class of 30

plus children at the same

0:34:540:34:57

time is impossible.

0:34:570:34:58

It's been like this for decades now.

0:34:580:35:00

I think what is really clear from

that film, you are absolutely

0:35:000:35:05

consistent with the rules, and I

could hear, and I felt that myself,

0:35:050:35:11

parents are bad than the country

going, that is the answer, you have

0:35:110:35:15

to keep doing the same thing. -- up

and down the country.

What ever you

0:35:150:35:21

are doing, you have to follow it

through, and we give them a routine,

0:35:210:35:24

and we give them the choice of

following instructions or face the

0:35:240:35:29

consequence, and we have to repeat

that over and over again until a

0:35:290:35:33

child understands this is the

expectation. Whatever I am expecting

0:35:330:35:40

the child to do, however long it

takes, that child will eventually do

0:35:400:35:45

it, so we are very consistent with

our boundaries, very tight and firm

0:35:450:35:51

boundaries, as well as the

principles of nurture, because we

0:35:510:35:55

fully understand behaviour is

communication, so whenever a child

0:35:550:36:00

behaves in a particular way, they

are trying to communicate something.

0:36:000:36:04

So we follow the natural principles,

and we believe every child, I am so

0:36:040:36:09

passionate about every child, every

child must have an opportunity to

0:36:090:36:14

progress. If they have been kicked

out of school, where the teachers

0:36:140:36:22

could not control them, whether they

are not making progress, but most of

0:36:220:36:26

the children, 98%, after

intervention, they go away, having

0:36:260:36:33

made accelerated progress in their

learning and their behaviour as

0:36:330:36:37

well.

Jacob, how do you think the

teachers here help you make the

0:36:370:36:43

right choices, good choices?

Well,

sometimes I am having trouble or

0:36:430:36:51

something. They would help me...

Sometimes, when I first came here,

0:36:510:37:02

they would sometimes take me out of

class and help me calm down. But now

0:37:020:37:09

I don't really need that any more,

but I used to have to be taken out

0:37:090:37:16

of class sometimes.

What about you,

Barrington? How do teachers help you

0:37:160:37:23

make the right choices? How long

have you been here, by the way

30

0:37:230:37:29

months.

13 months? Well, all the

time I have been here, by the time I

0:37:290:37:35

first came here, I was in Mr

Milligan's class, my first class

0:37:350:37:44

with Andrew, and a few other kids,

and I was the sort of kid that

0:37:440:37:49

sometimes, throughout the weeks, I

kind of slipped into bad behaviour,

0:37:490:37:55

kept on slipping. But at first I

really like the school, because I

0:37:550:38:00

felt I was safe in this kind of

place, and it was much better than

0:38:000:38:04

my other schools, my past schools.

And I made a lot

0:38:040:38:16

And I made a lot of friends, and the

first friend was Andrew, he is my

0:38:160:38:19

best friend.

He is smiling away at

that! You two are best friends?

I

0:38:190:38:25

was in the first class with him.

And

when do you hope to go back to

0:38:250:38:31

either your old school or another

mainstream primary?

Well, now I am

0:38:310:38:39

in year six, my family, I am going

to go to a secondary school, and

0:38:390:38:45

that school is going to be a

mainstream school.

Is that important

0:38:450:38:50

to you?

Very important to me.

Why?

I

care a lot about my future, work, I

0:38:500:38:58

care more about my education,

because education, someone said to

0:38:580:39:03

me, education is the key and you

need to follow it, because if you

0:39:030:39:07

don't, and you are missing out on

your learning, it is really bad. So

0:39:070:39:12

say before I was really missing out

on my learning, I kept being pulled

0:39:120:39:16

out of the class, and I was missing

a whole bunch of learning. And all

0:39:160:39:21

the other kids were learning, but I

wasn't, I was outside the classroom.

0:39:210:39:25

You said in the film that your

sister was having to teach you. Can

0:39:250:39:29

I ask you, Ms Mwaniki, if it is all

boys here?

It is not all boys, but

0:39:290:39:36

the majority of boys. We do have

girls, and that the minute I think

0:39:360:39:42

we have...

Three.

No, two.

Three

girls at the minute, but the

0:39:420:39:50

majority of them is boys. But as the

year progresses, especially around

0:39:500:39:54

July, we will be having more kids.

But at the minute, the boys are the

0:39:540:39:59

majority.

Listen, thank you very

much for having me in your class and

0:39:590:40:06

interrupting your literacy lesson,

very good to see you again,

0:40:060:40:10

Barrington, Andrew, Jacob, and good

luck when you go to your old primary

0:40:100:40:13

on Monday.

What you say to Victoria?

Thank you, Victoria!

And the people

0:40:130:40:22

at home?

Thanks for watching!

Thank

you so much, bye.

0:40:220:40:28

Schools like Hawkswood are becoming

increasingly important,

0:40:280:40:30

because we can reveal for the first

time this morning that the number

0:40:300:40:33

of younger children attending units

like this one across England

0:40:330:40:35

has significantly increased

over recent years.

0:40:350:40:38

Many - including this one -

are operating at full capacity

0:40:380:40:41

as demand increases.

0:40:410:40:47

We've also found similar

schools in other areas

0:40:470:40:51

even have a waiting list,

because there aren't enough places

0:40:510:40:53

for excluded students to go.

0:40:530:40:55

We're about to meet the school

head teacher, Marie Gentles.

0:40:550:41:00

The success of this school is,

in no small part, down to her

0:41:000:41:05

and the methods she's introduced.

0:41:050:41:11

Hi! Hoops, hang on, I need a fob,

don't I? How are you? Thanks so much

0:41:110:41:23

for having us here, take a seat, I

am telling you to take a seat in

0:41:230:41:29

your own office! I am getting above

myself! How are you?

I am very well,

0:41:290:41:35

thank you.

Was it a big decision to

let us in?

Yes, a very big decision,

0:41:350:41:41

because what we do is so precious to

us and to the area, what we do here,

0:41:410:41:45

and we have worked long and hard

with the schools here to build up

0:41:450:41:52

our reputations, and it is very

important that the right message is

0:41:520:41:56

sent across, which is these children

are amazing, we just need to

0:41:560:42:00

understand what behaviour is and

what it means.

I have got a text

0:42:000:42:04

from a chap called Simon, who says,

quote, they are not naughty

0:42:040:42:11

children, they have just made bad

choices, he says, are you serious?!

0:42:110:42:18

OK! LK, interesting. Children are

children. They are so young, so

0:42:180:42:24

mouldable, we have got to give them

a chance, this is our future

0:42:240:42:28

generation, so we cannot write

children off at primary school-age,

0:42:280:42:32

I do not think that is right or

fair. We not saying their

0:42:320:42:40

behavioural choices are OK, but we

are saying they need help and

0:42:400:42:43

additional support, and that is what

we do for them. And once they have

0:42:430:42:49

affected change, they need to have

the chance to be able to be part of

0:42:490:42:53

society, the same way every other

child has that chance.

Is there, in

0:42:530:43:00

your view, always an explanation for

poor behaviour?

Yes, there is. So

0:43:000:43:05

there are many reasons. We say there

is always a trigger, behaviour is

0:43:050:43:10

communication, so there is always a

reason why. The reasons may not be

0:43:100:43:15

seen as desirable to people, but

there is always a reason.

Like what?

0:43:150:43:19

It could be a learning need, it

could be that they are on a spectrum

0:43:190:43:24

and not yet diagnosed, it could be a

parental issue, something that has

0:43:240:43:29

affected their home life. There are

some in the different issues, but we

0:43:290:43:33

need to drill down to what is going

on for this child, for these

0:43:330:43:37

children, and try to help and

support them.

And not just them,

0:43:370:43:42

their parents.

Absolutely,

absolutely.

You must come across

0:43:420:43:47

some sad stories.

We do, many sad

stories, but actually that just

0:43:470:43:53

motivates us to work harder. We

cannot write these children off, we

0:43:530:43:57

cannot give up on them. We are

supposed to be a community, not just

0:43:570:44:03

a school, but as a borough, as a

country, you know, we have got to

0:44:030:44:06

come together and support each

other.

How many children in care are

0:44:060:44:12

in your school?

At the moment, not

many. We have got one coming up at

0:44:120:44:16

the moment currently.

And that is

out of 40? And how many children

0:44:160:44:22

live with just one parent?

0:44:220:44:28

Probably about half the pupils.

Is

that relevant?

Yes and no. Some

0:44:330:44:39

people assume that it is and it may

not be. You could be the most

0:44:390:44:43

fantastic single parent or you can

be a fantastic single parent who

0:44:430:44:47

need additional support. Either way,

it is neither here nor there.

How do

0:44:470:44:51

you react to the figures that show

that there is a rise of a third of

0:44:510:44:57

primary school age children now

being educated in pupil referral

0:44:570:45:00

units across England over the last

four years?

I am not surprised.

0:45:000:45:05

There is so much pressure on schools

at the moment. Financial restraints.

0:45:050:45:09

So much pressure on schools.

Actually I can talk for the schools

0:45:090:45:14

and Waltham Forest, and the primary

schools we work with, the majority

0:45:140:45:17

of them are doing an amazing job. If

they have a pupil or pupils who they

0:45:170:45:23

have tried many techniques with, but

they are not able to manage their

0:45:230:45:27

behaviour, that is when they call

upon us, and that is when we step in

0:45:270:45:31

and support them with this

intervention.

Do you think

0:45:310:45:36

politicians should worry about this

right?

Yes, in the sense that we

0:45:360:45:39

need to send more support to

schools. What else can we do to make

0:45:390:45:43

sure that more educational

professionals have the skills to be

0:45:430:45:46

able to support these children? What

else can we do to support not just

0:45:460:45:51

the mainstream schools, but schools

like ourselves, to make sure that

0:45:510:45:56

just as it is happening and Waltham

Forest, we have this rolling

0:45:560:46:00

programme so that people come into

intervention and then successfully

0:46:000:46:03

integrate back into mainstream

schools?

Your success rate is 96%.

0:46:030:46:09

Not all PRUs are like that. The

picture across England is

0:46:090:46:13

inconsistent from our

investigations, anyway. Why are some

0:46:130:46:19

think Laurel not successful at

helping children reintegrate?

I

0:46:190:46:23

think there are number of issues.

Each borough has a number of issues.

0:46:230:46:31

In Waltham

0:46:310:46:36

In Waltham I can say confidently

that we have an amazing system. An

0:46:360:46:41

amazing referral panel. A great

understanding of what we do in

0:46:410:46:44

Waltham Forest with this pupil

referral unit and so everybody buys

0:46:440:46:47

into it so it is used as it should

be used. I think that could

0:46:470:46:53

potentially be the difference.

Let

me read the messages for you. This

0:46:530:46:57

tweet from Scott. I am watching the

work of teachers and staff at the

0:46:570:47:00

pupil referral unit. It is an

eye-opener. What is the definition

0:47:000:47:05

of a hero these days? I would say

these teachers fit the brief,

0:47:050:47:10

especially in this tricky

environment.

0:47:100:47:16

environment. Larry says the PRU

staff are angels. And Carrie says

0:47:160:47:19

well done to the pupils and teachers

in your referral unit on the

0:47:190:47:23

programme today. The teachers have

shown how much hard work it is that

0:47:230:47:27

how rewarding the job is as well. It

shows that if the bin, consistency

0:47:270:47:30

and being calm during different

difficult situations and what it can

0:47:300:47:36

create. I take my hats off the

teachers and well done to everybody

0:47:360:47:40

involved.

Wow.

You used to work in a

mainstream school. What made baited

0:47:400:47:47

you to work here?

When I was in a

mainstream school, a select number

0:47:470:47:52

of children would be sent to my

class, many moons ago, and I always

0:47:520:47:56

used to wonder why. When they came

to my class they behaved

0:47:560:48:00

differently, better. I started to

realise that maybe there was

0:48:000:48:06

something within me. Maybe I had

some natural skills that needed to

0:48:060:48:09

be honed a little bit to be able to

work with children who just need a

0:48:090:48:14

little bit more. I am very

passionate about children anyway. I

0:48:140:48:19

loved the previous schools I worked

in but I wanted to do something that

0:48:190:48:22

will challenge me a little bit more.

Even though it is a challenge, I

0:48:220:48:28

know that at the end of the day we

have made a significant difference

0:48:280:48:32

to day.

I want to ask you about the

cost. To be educated in a mainstream

0:48:320:48:37

state school costs from £4000 to

£5,000 per pupil per year and there

0:48:370:48:43

are 30 in a class, as we know. In a

PRU there are seven or eight in the

0:48:430:48:49

class and the cost varies. In

Kirklees in Yorkshire they have told

0:48:490:48:53

us it costs £48,000 per pupil per

year. That is nine times the cost of

0:48:530:48:59

a mainstream state school per pupil.

Like as it is £12,000 per year and

0:48:590:49:04

in Nottinghamshire it is just under

£7,000. -- in Lancashire it is

0:49:040:49:10

£12,000. Some people might ask why

children who make poor decisions

0:49:100:49:14

deserve this money being spent on

them when good kids get so much

0:49:140:49:18

less?

I don't agree that good kids

get so much less.

But I have read

0:49:180:49:22

you the figures, they do, it costs

less.

But in terms of what they are

0:49:220:49:26

getting as a whole school

experience, it isn't less. Those

0:49:260:49:32

children who remain in mainstream

primary school, who can regulate

0:49:320:49:35

their emotions and manage their

behaviour, they have a very rich

0:49:350:49:39

curriculum in the school and they

are receiving quite a lot. However

0:49:390:49:42

these children are not able to. This

is our future generation, our future

0:49:420:49:48

children. If we don't invest in them

now, and we don't help them now, the

0:49:480:49:53

government will still need to spend

later on to support these young

0:49:530:49:56

people if we don't do it now.

There

is an incredible statistic from an

0:49:560:50:01

exclusion experts that we have

spoken to. 6500 pupils were

0:50:010:50:05

permanently excluded last year.

There organisation has calculated

0:50:050:50:08

that they will go on to cost the

state £2.1 billion in extra health

0:50:080:50:14

costs, criminal justice costs,

welfare and education, throughout

0:50:140:50:17

their lifetime. OK, thank you. Shall

we go round to class five? We are

0:50:170:50:23

going to talk more about the

techniques that you use for

0:50:230:50:27

controlling and ultimately changing

children's behaviour. I came here a

0:50:270:50:31

few weeks ago and I met quite a lot

of the children and we had lunch

0:50:310:50:34

together. After you. It is worth

saying that they were so polite. So

0:50:340:50:42

polite! So articulate as well. This

way?

It is important because we are

0:50:420:50:50

trying to teach them life skills. It

is important that they are able to

0:50:500:50:55

be part of society.

Class five.

Hello. Hello, everybody. Let me grab

0:50:550:51:04

a chair. Thank you. Thank you,

Barrington. Thank you so much. Where

0:51:040:51:12

are you going to sit? Hello. Let me

introduce lots more people. You

0:51:120:51:20

already know Andrew, Jacob,

Barrington, Mrs Gentles. And Jane

0:51:200:51:26

Harris. She is headteacher at

Edinburgh primary school. Kerry

0:51:260:51:30

Scott is headteacher at Ainslie

Wood, both based in nearby Waltham

0:51:300:51:33

Forest. And actually I just

mentioned your incredible fact that

0:51:330:51:44

6500 children excluded last year

will cost the state over £2 billion

0:51:440:51:47

over their lifetime. Incredible. I

wonder if you could just talk us

0:51:470:51:53

through behaviour. Please don't go

through the restraining techniques

0:51:530:51:58

and why you use them?

Restraint is a

last resort. If a child becomes a

0:51:580:52:06

danger to themselves or somebody

else, we have all been trained in

0:52:060:52:09

positive handling to handle them in

a safe way. If it is used

0:52:090:52:14

appropriately, which it is here all

the time, then it can be extremely

0:52:140:52:17

effective. It helps children to feel

emotionally and physically safe.

0:52:170:52:23

Could you ever use restraint in a

mainstream school?

Yes, if you are

0:52:230:52:30

trained but not all staff are.

At my

school, only a couple of members are

0:52:300:52:34

trained to use restraint. I don't

want people using it in the wrong

0:52:340:52:38

way. If a child needs restraint, and

it would be very unusual for a child

0:52:380:52:43

to need to be restrained, they would

call me or somebody else who has

0:52:430:52:49

been restraint trained and we would

go and break the decision about

0:52:490:52:51

whether they need to be restrained.

-- make the decision.

If a primary

0:52:510:52:58

school age people comes to a pupil

referral unit, does that mean the

0:52:580:53:02

mainstream primary school has failed

them?

It has and if the mainstream

0:53:020:53:07

school then works in partnership

with the PRU. One of the really,

0:53:070:53:14

really significant things about

Hawkswood is that it is to do with

0:53:140:53:16

partnership with the mainstream

school. There used to be an ethos

0:53:160:53:23

that by going to a PRU, even in

Waltham Forest a few years ago, that

0:53:230:53:28

that child was being sent away and

would never be seen again. But in

0:53:280:53:32

Waltham Forest, where the practice

is best, and in most schools it is

0:53:320:53:36

best, the child goes back to the

same school. There is a very strong

0:53:360:53:42

communication. We come up to the PRU

and visit throughout the child's

0:53:420:53:46

time in school.

Parents and people

wonder how a mainstream primary

0:53:460:53:51

school can be excluding permanently

children as young as four.

It is

0:53:510:53:57

rare for them to be permanently

excluded. The children here are not

0:53:570:54:02

permanently excluded mostly. It is a

process whereby they are referred by

0:54:020:54:06

a fairer access panel which we are

members.

Temporarily excluded then,

0:54:060:54:12

a four -year-old?

Add a question we

are always asking on the fairer

0:54:120:54:17

access panel is whether the school

is doing everything to support the

0:54:170:54:21

child.

This is the panel that refers

the child or not?

Yes. We can sit

0:54:210:54:27

and look. There can be times when a

school is thinking too rigidly and

0:54:270:54:31

the child is not fitting into that.

That is when it is our

0:54:310:54:36

responsibility to say you are not

thinking about the child here. Let's

0:54:360:54:40

but other techniques in place before

we would move the child onto the

0:54:400:54:43

PRU.

Let's talk about the effect of

exclusion on a child as they grow up

0:54:430:54:50

and their life chances.

It is clear

that here there is some brilliant

0:54:500:54:55

work going on which means that

students can be re-integrated back

0:54:550:54:58

into mainstream and be really

successful. The reason I started my

0:54:580:55:02

charity is because I am concerned

about the majority of people that

0:55:020:55:06

don't get reintegrated. We know that

increasingly more and more students

0:55:060:55:10

don't return to mainstream school

and their long-term outcomes are

0:55:100:55:13

really poor. The children who

finished their secondary school

0:55:130:55:16

education in a pupil referral unit,

how much likely to get the GCSE is

0:55:160:55:21

that they need to access further

education and one in two are

0:55:210:55:25

immediately unemployed after school.

That is the frightening statistic

0:55:250:55:28

because everybody deserves their

chance to get their dream career. We

0:55:280:55:32

need to reduce the numbers are

permanent exclusion and increase the

0:55:320:55:36

partnership working, the effective

early doors referral, when you

0:55:360:55:39

recognise there is something that

the school needs extra help with,

0:55:390:55:43

and you ask a brilliant pupil

referral unit to help you do that.

0:55:430:55:46

But as we have discussed they are

not all brilliant. The costs vary in

0:55:460:55:51

terms of how much it costs per pupil

in a pupil referral unit and the

0:55:510:55:55

length of stay varies. It is an

average 15 weeks in Bury and in

0:55:550:56:02

Camden it is just over two years, so

that doesn't make sense, doesn't it?

0:56:020:56:07

Maybe the mainstream school won't

take the child back. That can

0:56:070:56:11

happen.

It can do. In Waltham Forest

we have great partnerships with the

0:56:110:56:16

schools but yes, it can happen,

absolutely. We all need to work

0:56:160:56:20

together to work out what the best

next step is for that child. Is a

0:56:200:56:25

fresh start best?

I think it happens

when leaders don't know what the

0:56:250:56:29

stakes are. It is easy to think it

is just one pupil but over the whole

0:56:290:56:34

country it is more and more students

every year and the cost can be so

0:56:340:56:38

awful personally and as you

mentioned earlier £2.1 billion over

0:56:380:56:43

the lifetime of the population who

are excluded last year. That is a

0:56:430:56:48

huge cost nationally. We need more

leaders who are sensitised to the

0:56:480:56:52

risks of permanent exclusion who

know how to stop it from happening

0:56:520:56:56

and are passionate about taking on

these children.

But how can we do

0:56:560:57:00

that?

0:57:000:57:07

that?

There are pressures on

headteachers and when we get caught

0:57:070:57:09

up in the my school, my results,

league table situation, there is

0:57:090:57:14

huge pressure coming down on

headteachers. That squeaky wheel can

0:57:140:57:19

be a huge threat to the school.

However when you have got a good

0:57:190:57:23

partnership and there is an

excellent PRU doing excellent work

0:57:230:57:27

with the children, then we can be

confident that what is coming back

0:57:270:57:30

to us is a child that is ready to

reintegrate into mainstream

0:57:300:57:35

education and wants to. And just

remember that no child wants to

0:57:350:57:39

behave like this. They need the

intervention to support them and

0:57:390:57:44

ultimately what we want is to have

them back.

Shall I read you some

0:57:440:57:47

comments from people watching you

around the country is Mark Linda

0:57:470:57:51

says hats off to the wonderful staff

there.

0:57:510:57:57

there. Tasman says that Barrington

is amazing.

Yes, he is!

Brilliant

0:57:580:58:05

programme on PRUs. Amazing work. We

wish all the tools and all the best

0:58:050:58:09

and a brilliant future. A tweet from

Jane. If all the people I have met

0:58:090:58:17

in prison had experienced this

amazing care and patience they would

0:58:170:58:19

not be in prison. More investment in

fantastic teachers who need to be

0:58:190:58:24

trained will stop and this one,

watching Hawkswood primary pupil

0:58:240:58:29

referral unit. What an inspirational

place and inspirational staff. These

0:58:290:58:37

people need better pay and more

respect. The behaviour was

0:58:370:58:42

distressing but let's support these

people and offer the children hope.

0:58:420:58:45

Very briefly before we get the

weather forecast which is important

0:58:450:58:48

because it has been snowing all

morning but now it has stopped, I

0:58:480:58:52

know what you want to be when you

grow up. We were talking about life

0:58:520:58:58

chances. You want to be a vet. What

about Jacob?

I don't really know

0:58:580:59:04

because I have all my life ahead of

me to choose.

Absolutely. And what

0:59:040:59:09

about you?

A footballer.

Who is your

idol?

0:59:090:59:18

idol?

My favourite footballer? Paul

Pogba.

He isn't getting on well with

0:59:180:59:22

his manager at the moment! Thank you

so much. It is really good to see

0:59:220:59:28

you. Much more from this PRU in the

next hour of the programme. At first

0:59:280:59:32

order of the weather. Good morning.

0:59:320:59:34

next hour of the programme. At first

order of the weather. Good morning.

0:59:340:59:34

You are quite right. It has been

snowing in London and other parts of

0:59:340:59:38

the UK as well. This week we have

disruptive snow on the cards from

0:59:380:59:42

tonight. It wins, and a wind chill

that you will notice, and frost and

0:59:420:59:49

icy conditions. -- bitter winds. We

have showers coming in across the

0:59:490:59:54

east, not all of seeing them, and

drifting across to the west, which

0:59:540:59:59

will remain largely dry. Very cloudy

with the odd sunny spell.

0:59:591:00:03

Temperatures between freezing and

plus three in towns and cities and

1:00:031:00:06

lower than that in rural areas.

Overnight we have this line of snow

1:00:061:00:11

showers coming in through East

Anglia and Kent and the Channel

1:00:111:00:15

Islands, and significant snow in

eastern Scotland and North East

1:00:151:00:18

England, and it will be called

tonight with a widespread frost and

1:00:181:00:21

a risk of ice an untreated circuses.

-- cold tonight. Through the early

1:00:211:00:27

hours of Tuesday and into tomorrow

there is an amber weather warning

1:00:271:00:32

for snow. This is where those areas

are, the North East and the

1:00:321:00:36

south-east.

1:00:361:00:40

Hello, it's Monday, it's ten

o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

1:00:401:00:42

Good morning, in a TV

first, we're broadcasting live

1:00:421:00:44

from a pupil referral

unit in London.

1:00:441:00:46

It's where primary

school children come

1:00:461:00:47

when they've been kicked

out their mainstream school.

1:00:471:00:52

We've discovered

there's been a big rise

1:00:521:00:54

in the numbers of young children

being educated in PRUs,

1:00:541:00:56

up 34% in England in the

past four years.

1:00:561:01:04

When I used to be in my mainstream

school, I used to keep coming out

1:01:061:01:10

and getting excluded and stuff, but

now I am in this special school, it

1:01:101:01:15

gives you extra help, it has helped

me more to understand how it is

1:01:151:01:19

better to go back into a mainstream

type of school.

1:01:191:01:24

The children who come

here are as young as four

1:01:241:01:26

and often have emotional problems

and a history of violent

1:01:261:01:29

and aggressive behaviour

towards teachers and other pupils.

1:01:291:01:37

Children are children, and they are

so young, so mouldable still, we

1:01:381:01:42

have got to give them a chance, this

is our future generation, so we

1:01:421:01:47

cannot write them off at primary

school-age.

1:01:471:01:50

The aim of these schools,

of course, is to turn that

1:01:501:01:53

challenging behaviour around,

so that kids can go back

1:01:531:01:55

to their mainstream schools

1:01:551:01:56

and hopefully go on to have a happy

and successful education.

1:01:561:02:01

When I first started here, I was

having trouble behaving, and I was

1:02:011:02:08

making loads of wrong choices.

That

is what you used to be like?

Yeah,

1:02:081:02:14

but now if there is somebody, like,

and oil in me or something, I will

1:02:141:02:19

just ignore them. -- annoying me.

And I would just stay away from them

1:02:191:02:26

if I knew they were going to create

trouble or something.

1:02:261:02:29

We've heard lots from the teachers

and pupils here, but there's another

1:02:291:02:32

group of people whose feelings

are often overlooked

1:02:321:02:34

in all this - the parents.

1:02:341:02:36

No parent ever thinks their child

is going to be the one that's

1:02:361:02:39

excluded from mainstream school.

1:02:391:02:46

He has made life difficult, not just

for me, but for himself, for whole

1:02:461:02:50

family. But try and do everything

you can, but you often find nothing

1:02:501:02:59

is enough.

1:02:591:03:01

We'll hear the experiences

of a group of parents

1:03:011:03:04

with children here at Hawkswood.

1:03:041:03:04

And as you'd expect,

we'd welcome your experiences -

1:03:041:03:07

does your child go

to a pupil referral unit?

1:03:071:03:09

Did you go to one?

Get in touch in the usual ways.

1:03:091:03:17

Just let me read a couple of

comments from you, this is from Ian,

1:03:251:03:29

what a lovely school for these

Japan, caring staff much needed to

1:03:291:03:33

give children a good start, so

heart-warming. -- for these

1:03:331:03:37

children. And says, what an amazing

head teacher, her compassionate

1:03:371:03:43

stance is amazing, incredibly

article at and sincere in her words.

1:03:431:03:48

And this one, students and staff at

Hawkswood PRU are on my hero list,

1:03:481:03:58

finding a way to engage is key, no

child is bad at heart, if they are

1:03:581:04:02

failing, it is because we are

failing. Much more of that to come,

1:04:021:04:06

let's bring you the news with Joanna

.

1:04:061:04:10

Jeremy Corbyn will set

out Labour's position

1:04:101:04:12

on Brexit this morning,

after months of demands

1:04:121:04:15

that the party clarify its plans.

1:04:151:04:16

In a speech later, he'll say

the UK should negotiate

1:04:161:04:19

a bespoke agreement with the EU

on a customs union,

1:04:191:04:21

and a strong new relationship

with the single market.

1:04:211:04:23

The Conservatives say his proposals

would breach promises made

1:04:231:04:26

at the last general election.

1:04:261:04:27

You can watch Mr Corbyn's

speech on this programme.

1:04:271:04:29

It's expected

in about half an hour.

1:04:291:04:31

Four people have been killed

in an explosion in Leicester,

1:04:311:04:34

which destroyed a building

in the middle of a parade of shops.

1:04:341:04:37

Another four people remain in

hospital, one with serious injuries.

1:04:371:04:40

Emergency teams are still searching

through the wreckage

1:04:401:04:42

in the Hinckley Road area

of the city.

1:04:421:04:44

Andy Moore reports.

1:04:441:04:48

The immediate aftermath

of an explosion

1:04:481:04:53

that destroyed a shop

and a two-storey shop above it.

1:04:531:04:55

Police say there were four

confirmed fatalities and four

1:04:551:04:58

people remain in hospital,

one with serious injuries.

1:04:581:05:01

The search and rescue

operation continued overnight

1:05:011:05:03

for any more victims.

1:05:031:05:08

Police say there may be other

people unaccounted for.

1:05:081:05:10

We still think this is a rescue

operation, we're using shoring

1:05:101:05:12

techniques to try to rescue anyone

who may be alive in the building.

1:05:121:05:20

Local people spoke about the force

of the explosion and the fierceness

1:05:231:05:26

of the fire that followed.

1:05:261:05:30

We heard a low explosion,

and it felt like a tremendous

1:05:301:05:32

shock through the house,

like it was going to

1:05:321:05:35

bring the ceiling down.

1:05:351:05:36

I rang the police, 999,

and they said, "What services?"

1:05:361:05:40

I said, "Everything you can send."

1:05:401:05:43

Police say they don't know

what caused the blast -

1:05:431:05:45

a joint investigation

with the Fire Service will get

1:05:451:05:48

under way once the site has

been made safe.

1:05:481:05:56

There's been a big rise

in the number of primary school

1:05:571:06:00

to a freedom of information

request by this programme.

1:06:001:06:03

Children are referred to the units

when they've been excluded,

1:06:031:06:05

or are close to being excluded,

from their mainstream school.

1:06:051:06:11

Over the last four years,

the number of children in England

1:06:111:06:13

being schooled in the units

has increased by a third.

1:06:131:06:16

The headteacher of one unit said

the figures underlined the pressure

1:06:161:06:18

primary schools are under.

1:06:181:06:25

The primary schools we work with,

the majority of them are doing an

1:06:251:06:29

amazing job, but if they have a

pupil or pupils who they have tried

1:06:291:06:33

many techniques with, but they are

not able to manage their behaviour,

1:06:331:06:39

that is when they call upon

ourselves, and that is when we step

1:06:391:06:42

in and we support them with this

intervention.

1:06:421:06:45

New legislation to cap

poor-value energy tariffs

1:06:451:06:46

and save consumers money

is being introduced

1:06:461:06:48

to Parliament later.

1:06:481:06:49

The Government says it will protect

11 million people from higher bills.

1:06:491:06:52

The industry has warned the cap

could stifle competition.

1:06:521:06:55

Parts of the UK will feel colder

than the Arctic Circle

1:06:551:06:58

this week with widespread snow

and bitterly cold winds.

1:06:581:07:01

Rail companies in East Anglia

say their services

1:07:011:07:02

will end early tonight.

1:07:021:07:05

C2C and Greater Anglia have

also cancelled services

1:07:051:07:07

on Tuesday and Wednesday.

1:07:071:07:08

They urge customers

to check before travelling.

1:07:081:07:15

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

1:07:151:07:20

Hello again.

1:07:211:07:22

Manchester City have won their first

trophy under manager Pep Guardiola

1:07:221:07:25

with a comfortable 3-0 win

over Arsenal.

1:07:251:07:27

City captain Vincent Kompany

was on the scoresheet

1:07:271:07:30

as the Premier League's runaway

leaders secured the first domestic

1:07:301:07:34

title of the season.

1:07:341:07:38

Afterwards, Guardiola thanked

the club for its support

1:07:381:07:40

during his trophy-less first season.

1:07:401:07:41

A good win too for the red

half of Manchester.

1:07:411:07:43

United came from behind to beat

Chelsea 2-1 at Old Trafford

1:07:431:07:46

in the Premier League.

1:07:461:07:47

After Willian's opener,

United striker Romelu Lukaku

1:07:471:07:49

levelled things before crossing

in for substitute Jesse Lingard

1:07:491:07:53

to nod in the winner,

1:07:531:07:59

which takes United

back into second place

1:07:591:08:01

in the table.

1:08:011:08:02

Chelsea, though, slip out

of the Champions League spots.

1:08:021:08:05

Six Nations Rugby say they'll

investigate an alleged melee before

1:08:051:08:07

Scotland's Calcutta Cup victory

over England on Saturday.

1:08:071:08:10

As the teams returned to the

dressing rooms after warming up,

1:08:101:08:13

England back Owen Farrell

and Scotland forward

1:08:131:08:15

Ryan Wilson appeared to clash.

1:08:151:08:17

The Six Nations said it would be

writing to the unions

1:08:171:08:21

to request clarification on

what happened in the tunnel.

1:08:211:08:29

Finally, British boxer Scott

Westgarth has died in hospital at

1:08:301:08:33

the age of 31. He fell ill after his

light heavyweight win in Doncaster

1:08:331:08:40

on Saturday. More on that story on

the BBC Sport website. That is all

1:08:401:08:45

the sport for now, back to you in

London, Victoria. We will be

1:08:451:08:49

bringing you the Jeremy Corbyn

speech live, do not worry about

1:08:491:08:52

that.

1:08:521:08:55

Welcome back to Hawkswood PRU.

1:08:551:08:57

It's a pupil referral unit

for children as young as four.

1:08:571:09:01

Thank you for your many messages, a

lot of you are finding the staff and

1:09:011:09:04

the techniques they used to turn a

child's life around inspiring.

1:09:041:09:08

Kids are sent here because they've

been violent or disruptive

1:09:081:09:11

and their mainstream school can't

cope with them.

1:09:111:09:16

This is obviously the kitchen area,

Theresa is making lunch, morning!

1:09:161:09:19

The smell in here is freshly baked

bread, there is bred in the oven of

1:09:191:09:26

there, and we are having vegetarian

chilli with nachos, cheese plant,

1:09:261:09:30

jacket potato, pictures and custard

or fresh fruit. This PRU is rated as

1:09:301:09:37

of -- outstanding, but they are not

all like this, we have seen parts of

1:09:371:09:45

the system at breaking point, and we

have seen worrying inconsistencies,

1:09:451:09:50

which means that what happens to

excluded pupils of all ages depends

1:09:501:09:53

heavily on where they live is. --

where they live.

1:09:531:10:00

(VT NEXT) School exclusions

are rising significantly but why?

1:10:001:10:02

It's like a maths problem,

where the numbers don't add up.

1:10:021:10:05

It is really, really shocking

that we are seeing so many

1:10:051:10:09

students being excluded.

1:10:091:10:10

And it's about geography, too.

1:10:101:10:11

Whether it be funding or how good

the provision is that is available

1:10:111:10:15

to them in their area.

1:10:151:10:16

It is all down to a postcode

lottery, eventually.

1:10:161:10:19

We've spoken to teaching

professionals who say schools cook

1:10:191:10:21

the books to remove problem pupils.

1:10:211:10:27

They just referred them

to the pupil referral unit,

1:10:271:10:29

so that the exclusions didn't

show up on the books.

1:10:291:10:32

And we've heard about excluded

children going months

1:10:321:10:34

without any schooling.

1:10:341:10:35

You need full-time education,

a full curriculum.

1:10:351:10:40

This boy is 14.

1:10:401:10:48

We're calling him Jay,

but it's not his real name.

1:10:521:10:56

He was permanently excluded

for serious misconduct months ago,

1:10:561:10:59

and his family says the council

still hasn't found him

1:10:591:11:02

an appropriate school.

1:11:021:11:07

Well, all they turned round and said

1:11:071:11:08

is they've got nowhere

for the likes of him to go.

1:11:081:11:12

Nowhere they can offer him a place?

Nowhere. Nowhere.

1:11:121:11:16

But they said they might,

they could offer him one-to-one

1:11:161:11:21

in a library or recreation centre.

1:11:211:11:24

How long for?

For an hour.

1:11:241:11:28

An hour?

One hour a week.

1:11:281:11:30

I just turned around

and said no way.

1:11:301:11:32

He needs full-time education,

a full curriculum.

1:11:321:11:36

There are specific reasons

1:11:361:11:38

why the council says it has

struggled to find Jay a school.

1:11:381:11:42

We are not identifying him.

1:11:421:11:44

What has it been like?

1:11:441:11:46

But he says he's bored

out of his mind.

1:11:461:11:48

All he wants is school.

1:11:481:11:51

He has learning needs.

1:11:511:11:53

What kind of needs does he have?

1:11:531:11:55

He's got ADHD, dyspraxia,

Tourette's, anxiety disorder.

1:11:551:12:00

After six days, when a child

has been out of education,

1:12:001:12:06

they should have somewhere for them

to go - and that's by law.

1:12:061:12:10

And now it's been two months.

1:12:101:12:18

More than 6500 pupils like Jay

were permanently excluded in England

1:12:191:12:23

last year, but far more than that,

48,000, are being educated

1:12:231:12:26

in schools for excluded children.

1:12:261:12:29

That's about one

in every 200 pupils.

1:12:291:12:33

The number's on the rise,

and it's a costly problem.

1:12:331:12:37

Kieran Gill has studied

the exclusion statistics.

1:12:371:12:39

She set up a charity

to try to deal with the issue.

1:12:391:12:43

We calculated that for every year's

worth of excluded pupils,

1:12:431:12:49

so last year, 6,500

permanently excluded students,

1:12:491:12:52

they will go on to cost

the state 2.1 billion in extra

1:12:521:12:56

health costs, criminal justice,

welfare and education costs

1:12:561:12:58

through their lifetime.

1:12:581:13:01

What about figures

for younger pupils?

1:13:011:13:03

We wanted to find out

about primary school exclusions,

1:13:031:13:06

so we made a Freedom

of Information request.

1:13:061:13:10

Out of 150 councils, 130 responded.

1:13:101:13:16

They said this many 4-11-year-olds

were educated in schools

1:13:161:13:19

for excluded children

in the last recorded year.

1:13:191:13:21

That's a rise of 34%

in just four years.

1:13:211:13:27

We did some more maths.

1:13:271:13:29

In those council areas,

the number of children under five

1:13:291:13:32

being temporarily excluded

rose by 29% in just one year.

1:13:321:13:34

So why?

1:13:341:13:39

Some of the children are more

complex, that we are seeing now,

1:13:391:13:42

that we probably didn't have before,

so they aren't necessarily a quick

1:13:421:13:46

turn around and back into schools.

1:13:461:13:48

They are highly complex children

who need some specialist

1:13:481:13:50

provision and probably need

long-term specialist provision.

1:13:501:13:54

But what happens to those

children who are excluded?

1:13:541:13:57

That is a geography lesson.

1:13:571:14:05

Jay lives in Gateshead

in the North East.

1:14:061:14:08

Exclusion rates here

are double the national average.

1:14:081:14:11

It's a big problem.

1:14:111:14:14

There is a pupil referral unit here,

and the council says

1:14:141:14:17

they mentioned it to Jay's family

as a possible solution.

1:14:171:14:19

The children who have been

excluded in Gateshead,

1:14:191:14:22

there is a pupil referral unit.

1:14:221:14:24

Would you want him to go there?

Nope.

1:14:241:14:26

Why not?

1:14:261:14:28

Because it hasn't got a good

reputation, so I don't really

1:14:281:14:32

want to send him to a place

that is going to put him back

1:14:321:14:35

instead of going forward.

1:14:351:14:39

And she might have a point.

1:14:391:14:41

This is the pupil referral unit,

1:14:411:14:43

and the last time Ofsted came here,

they rated it inadequate.

1:14:431:14:49

In some local authorities

in the country, if you are excluded,

1:14:491:14:52

you have no option but to go

to an inadequate provision.

1:14:521:14:55

What inadequate means is essentially

that it's not a safe

1:14:551:14:59

learning environment and one

where students can thrive.

1:14:591:15:05

In the North East, where Jay lives,

excluded students are eight times

1:15:051:15:08

more likely to be sent

to an inadequate pupil referral unit

1:15:081:15:10

than the England average.

1:15:101:15:12

Because it was rated inadequate,

1:15:121:15:14

the unit in Gateshead

had to become an academy.

1:15:141:15:18

The council said it worked

very hard to improve it

1:15:181:15:20

before it was taken over.

1:15:201:15:22

Gateshead Council also said

they are doing everything they can

1:15:221:15:25

to resolve Jay's situation

but that his family has so far

1:15:251:15:28

refused all the offers put to them.

1:15:281:15:35

The Gateshead unit ended up rated

inadequate because it had to cope

1:15:351:15:38

with far more people

than it was set up for.

1:15:381:15:46

It seems that is a pretty

common situation.

1:15:461:15:48

We met with someone who,

until recently, was running a pupil

1:15:481:15:51

referral unit in a city in England.

1:15:511:15:52

They did not want to be on camera

so an actor is speaking their words.

1:15:521:15:57

The schools didn't exclude,

they just referred them to the pupil

1:15:571:16:02

referral unit so that the exclusion

didn't show up on the books.

1:16:021:16:05

Effectively, mainstream schools

in the city were palming off

1:16:051:16:09

the students they didn't

want to the pupil referral unit.

1:16:091:16:11

What went through your mind

when things got tough?

1:16:111:16:13

What were you worried about?

1:16:131:16:18

Just that there was too many

kids and that we would

1:16:181:16:21

suffer as a result of it.

1:16:211:16:25

So many pupils were sent to the unit

that they were four times

1:16:251:16:30

over capacity, hundreds

and hundreds of children.

1:16:301:16:35

Yeah, yeah, they were coming out

of mainstream at a rate of,

1:16:351:16:38

I think it was just over

one per day.

1:16:381:16:40

So if you spread that

out over a school year,

1:16:401:16:43

that would be 100, 200 per year.

1:16:431:16:44

Coming out as in going

into your school?

1:16:441:16:46

Yeah, yeah.

1:16:461:16:48

Coming out of school, to us,

about 200 per year and none of those

1:16:481:16:51

kids would go back in.

1:16:511:16:57

So you'd have a residue of kids

each year and each year

1:16:571:17:00

those numbers would get bigger

and bigger and bigger.

1:17:001:17:05

The Wellspring Academy Trust runs

pupil referral units

1:17:051:17:07

in five council areas,

including here in Barnsley.

1:17:071:17:10

The head here is really

worried about reports

1:17:101:17:12

of overcrowding across England.

1:17:121:17:16

Strategically, how do you plan

a school if you're supposed to be

1:17:161:17:20

planning for 100 and then you end up

having 200, 300, 400?

1:17:201:17:24

So there's obviously real concerns

about that and I think that's just

1:17:241:17:27

a real pressure in the system.

1:17:271:17:28

You know, there are children coming

out of mainstream education

1:17:281:17:30

into alternative provision

and it is putting a massive

1:17:301:17:33

pressure on the system.

1:17:331:17:34

This is a pattern that we've seen,

year-on-year, more and more

1:17:341:17:37

children being excluded.

1:17:371:17:43

And actually, the sector hasn't been

given the attention it needs to cope

1:17:431:17:46

with this huge influx of students.

1:17:461:17:49

I guess the question is how does

that increase impact

1:17:491:17:52

on the pupil referral units that

some of the kids will end up in?

1:17:521:17:55

Well, some have buckled under

the sheer weight of numbers.

1:17:551:18:00

The former head we met

had so many children

1:18:001:18:05

he had no choice but to send them

across the city for tuition

1:18:051:18:08

at more than ten different

education companies.

1:18:081:18:10

Pupils even had

lessons in libraries.

1:18:101:18:12

His unit was rated

inadequate by Ofsted.

1:18:121:18:14

They just couldn't keep

the children safe.

1:18:141:18:17

Well, I agreed

safeguarding was an issue.

1:18:171:18:21

Seeing these kids every day

going into the local

1:18:211:18:28

libraries or wherever,

and then turning up

1:18:281:18:30

at their placements like they did,

well, that was a safeguarding

1:18:301:18:34

plus point but it wasn't adequate.

1:18:341:18:42

But ultimately, because you

didn't have the space,

1:18:421:18:44

you were sending them

1:18:441:18:45

to libraries across the city?

1:18:451:18:46

Yeah.

1:18:461:18:47

The rising number of

exclusions is an issue.

1:18:471:18:50

To many, an even

bigger one is money.

1:18:501:18:52

Explain to me how the funding

for a place in a pupil

1:18:521:18:55

referral unit works.

1:18:551:18:56

What we do is we work

to a model where you get

1:18:561:18:59

the first £10,000 paid.

1:18:591:19:00

From the government?

1:19:001:19:01

From the government, yeah.

1:19:011:19:03

So in the case of this particular

pupil referral unit,

1:19:031:19:11

we would get £10,000 for every child

that we planned to have in the unit,

1:19:131:19:17

and then whoever commissioned

the places, in this case,

1:19:171:19:19

the council, they pay

what we call a top up.

1:19:191:19:22

But the size of that top up again

comes down to where you live.

1:19:221:19:25

The variations are huge.

1:19:251:19:26

Kirklees Council in Yorkshire says

a primary pupil referral unit place

1:19:261:19:29

costs £4000 per month.

1:19:291:19:31

In Lancashire, it is

just £1000 per month.

1:19:311:19:37

Next door in Blackpool,

it is way lower still.

1:19:371:19:40

And the cost of a referral

unit in Nottinghamshire

1:19:401:19:42

is just £565 per month.

1:19:421:19:44

In other words, children in some

council areas get tens

1:19:441:19:46

of thousands of pounds more

towards their education every

1:19:461:19:49

year than in others.

1:19:491:19:51

So how is that going

to affect your life chances?

1:19:511:19:58

Well, you can imagine that

that is huge because everything

1:19:581:19:59

revolves around the money you can

put into the provision,

1:19:591:20:07

so from staffing, resourcing,

buildings, premises,

1:20:081:20:09

it is highly significant.

1:20:091:20:12

So as an executive head yourself,

working in different local

1:20:121:20:15

authorities, how does it

work for you?

1:20:151:20:16

Do you have different

challenges in different areas?

1:20:161:20:18

Absolutely, yeah.

1:20:181:20:19

The Wellspring Trust works in five

local authorities and the funding

1:20:191:20:22

is different in all five.

1:20:221:20:23

So how do you maintain

consistency across the board?

1:20:231:20:25

That is the challenge.

1:20:251:20:26

What you have to do is you have

to do different staffing structures.

1:20:261:20:30

You have to do different models

of pastoral support and care.

1:20:301:20:33

So it is all down to a postcode

lottery, essentially.

1:20:331:20:35

So a problem of numbers.

1:20:351:20:37

Too many excluded children

for the system to cope with.

1:20:371:20:39

Too few good quality

pupil referral units.

1:20:391:20:42

This is a real injustice

because we are talking

1:20:421:20:50

about the most vulnerable

children who often...

1:20:501:20:51

Well, they are four times

1:20:511:20:53

more likely to grow up in poverty,

they are ten times more likely

1:20:531:20:56

to have a mental health need.

1:20:561:20:58

They are seven times more likely

to have a learning need.

1:20:581:21:01

And a question of geography.

1:21:011:21:02

Being schooled in some areas

means your life chances are far

1:21:021:21:04

worse than in others.

1:21:041:21:06

He's not allowed outside

while he is excluded.

1:21:061:21:10

So in school hours, he's

in the house all day, every day.

1:21:101:21:14

Are you worried about the future

for these kind of children?

1:21:141:21:17

Yeah, yeah, very worried,

and particularly when you talk

1:21:171:21:25

about the discrepancies in funding

and actually it's just not fair.

1:21:251:21:28

It needs to be fair and equal,

right across the country,

1:21:281:21:31

to give at least the provision

a chance of getting it right.

1:21:311:21:37

Because if your funding is not

right, and it's different,

1:21:371:21:40

and it's not enough,

then you haven't even got a chance

1:21:401:21:42

of getting it right.

1:21:421:21:50

Let me read you this text message

from Vanessa. My son was sent to

1:21:501:21:54

Hawkswood last year after being

permanently excluded in reception,

1:21:541:21:58

aged four. They do a brilliant job

and with their help my son is back

1:21:581:22:02

in the mainstream school and doing

well. They do amazing work at

1:22:021:22:06

Hawkswood, which is where we are

spending the morning. All through

1:22:061:22:09

this week we are focusing on what

they do here. The headteacher of

1:22:091:22:13

Hawkswood is back with us and Tom

Bennett is the government's

1:22:131:22:21

behaviours tsar. Why are so many

more children being taught in PRUs?

1:22:221:22:31

I need to do more research but my

gut feeling is that it comes down to

1:22:311:22:35

money and the wraparound care tends

to go. One of the biggest reasons

1:22:351:22:40

for children going to PRUs is

because teachers and school leaders

1:22:401:22:42

tended not to get efficient formal

training in de-escalation techniques

1:22:421:22:48

and dealing with children's

behaviour before it gets to that

1:22:481:22:53

point.

As she said, you get one week

on behaviour in formal teacher

1:22:531:22:59

training.

I got 45 minutes.

After

how long in training?

You're

1:22:591:23:03

supposed to pick it up on the job.

Formal training was 45 minutes,

1:23:031:23:10

which was inadequate and I am trying

to change that. We need to reduce

1:23:101:23:14

the incidents so that we don't get

to that point rather than just

1:23:141:23:17

reacting to misbehaviour but we also

need to create an atmosphere where

1:23:171:23:20

children can flourish and be

nourished. Coming here isn't a

1:23:201:23:24

negative thing. It is where children

can unlock the services they need to

1:23:241:23:27

help them. This is intensive care,

emphasis on intensive and an care,

1:23:271:23:33

but most schools don't have those

provisions.

You talked about one of

1:23:331:23:38

the reasons being budgetary

constraints, as you put it

1:23:381:23:45

diplomatically. You are the

government's behaviour tsar.

I am

1:23:451:23:52

independent, not paid by them.

One

of the things that is going

1:23:521:23:57

classroom assistants. People who

help the teachers in a class of 30,

1:23:571:24:02

really hard job anyway. That could

be relevant.

It could be relevant

1:24:021:24:07

and the devil is in the detail. Some

classroom assistants are worth their

1:24:071:24:11

weight in gold and if they are

properly trained and they can deal

1:24:111:24:13

with interpersonal issues with the

children involved and work with a

1:24:131:24:17

teacher, that can be fantastic. But

it is a varied picture.

How worried

1:24:171:24:22

are you about the totally

inconsistent provision of PRUs and

1:24:221:24:25

the standards they set across

England?

To be fair, we can judge

1:24:251:24:29

PRUs in the same way that we judge

schools in general. Some are

1:24:291:24:33

outstanding and some are not and

that is a very loaded term. There

1:24:331:24:36

are many areas of the UK where the

needs and the challenges are greater

1:24:361:24:40

with things like poverty and so on.

Obviously we see schools in those

1:24:401:24:45

circumstances doing their best, and

most schools do, but really

1:24:451:24:48

struggling with the level of

challenge that the demographics are

1:24:481:24:52

providing for them. These are the

areas where we should be targeting

1:24:521:24:56

resources and funding.

And finally,

teacher training, when it comes to

1:24:561:25:00

behaviour, instead of one week out

of four years, how much should it be

1:25:001:25:05

in a teacher training course?

If you

do a one year PGCE, which is very

1:25:051:25:09

common, it should be threaded

throughout the

1:25:091:25:21

throughout the year and revisited,

not just something you get in a 45

1:25:211:25:23

minute session and it should be done

mostly in schools as well because

1:25:231:25:26

teacher training and behaviour

management is a practical craft.

1:25:261:25:28

Thank you. John Bennett, the

government's behaviour tsar, but he

1:25:281:25:30

is independent. -- Tom Bennett. Now

we are going back to classroom five.

1:25:301:25:35

Can I read some more messages from

our audience watching across the

1:25:351:25:39

country? Angela has emailed and that

this headteacher and her staff are

1:25:391:25:45

inspirational. Their approach is

just amazing. All MPs and policy

1:25:451:25:48

makers should watch this programme.

Naomi Tweed that this school is

1:25:481:25:53

phenomenal and mainstream schools

and parents don't take time to

1:25:531:25:57

understand children and their needs.

An email from Harry. Absolutely

1:25:571:26:01

open-minded attitudes shown by the

staff on the programme today. Such

1:26:011:26:05

passion from teachers. I recall

similar wrong choices from children

1:26:051:26:09

in primary and we all thought the

children were just naughty or some

1:26:091:26:15

beyond that. It goes to show what

can be achieved. This programme has

1:26:151:26:20

opened my mind. How do you react to

that?

Very overwhelming. Thank you.

1:26:201:26:26

That is true. We will go in and

introduce you to some parents.

1:26:261:26:35

We have heard a lot from teachers

and headteachers and pupils and now

1:26:401:26:44

it is time to hear from parents.

1:26:441:26:50

Anne-Marie Barbaris,

mum of nine-year-old Kyra,

1:26:511:26:51

Kerri Wooden,

mum of seven-year-old Logan,

1:26:511:26:53

Shelley Porter,

mum of eight-year-old Cruise,

1:26:531:26:54

Joe James-Moore,

dad of ten-year-old Harry.

1:26:541:27:00

He came to Watford last year that he

is now back in mainstream education.

1:27:001:27:04

-- to Hawkswood. How do you feel

with your son being taught in a

1:27:041:27:16

pupil referral unit?

I was quite

quiet about it at first. Not that

1:27:161:27:21

anyone necessarily says anything to

me that you can feel the pressure.

1:27:211:27:31

And Cruz is the odd one out, the

troublemaker. I didn't talk to other

1:27:311:27:36

parents about it but I felt the

stigma attached to him.

What about

1:27:361:27:39

you? There is a stigma for your

child?

Definitely. You do feel

1:27:391:27:48

singled out, your child feels

singled out. Because it has been

1:27:481:27:58

dealt with, parents look at you in a

certain way.

As though you are a bad

1:27:591:28:03

parent?

Yes. They might come to you

and say your child has done this or

1:28:031:28:09

that. I get that a lot. I did at the

mainstream school. It is really

1:28:091:28:18

heartbreaking. Trying to explain to

them as well. There are other things

1:28:181:28:28

prior to that.

1:28:281:28:37

prior to that. Education was more

needed and that is why the behaviour

1:28:371:28:39

side of things was out there. It is

really hard to try and say that.

Did

1:28:391:28:44

you feel a stigma for Logan?

Definitely. I was lucky with the

1:28:441:28:52

parents that school. Everybody knew

Logan.

What was he doing in class?

1:28:521:28:59

He would throw chairs, kick, lie

down on the floor kicking and

1:28:591:29:05

screaming. He had to be taken out of

class because of it. He would be

1:29:051:29:10

very aggressive.

Why do you think

that was?

Lack of structure. Lack of

1:29:101:29:17

understanding for him as well. When

he was in nursery they said that

1:29:171:29:21

Logan was having behavioural

problems and is there anything we

1:29:211:29:24

can do? I said this is what we do at

home and then fermented what I said,

1:29:241:29:29

they listened. But -- they

implemented what I said. But when we

1:29:291:29:37

went to school, they didn't listen,

they said they had other children to

1:29:371:29:41

look after.

Tell us about Cruz and

his behaviour at mainstream school.

1:29:411:29:47

You have other children and

presumably brought them up the same

1:29:471:29:50

way.

I feel that Cruz is wired

differently and they can conform and

1:29:501:29:55

he can't. A class of 30 kids sends

him... He struggles. He struggles

1:29:551:30:02

with sitting down on his own and I

understand the pressure on the

1:30:021:30:05

teacher and I feel for them but they

are not trained as the staff here

1:30:051:30:09

are to know what to do. They did not

know what to do with him. They would

1:30:091:30:14

ignore him and say they had given up

so he felt like nobody. When his

1:30:141:30:19

self-esteem was low, how do you get

a kid back?

1:30:191:30:25

least five how often have you

thought, as parents, this must be

1:30:251:30:30

down to me?

If he was my only kid, I

would have felt 100% responsible and

1:30:301:30:36

be questioning what the hell I have

done wrong. Because I have

1:30:361:30:41

fortunately got the comparison with

an older girl in university, they

1:30:411:30:46

are doing great, at the same school

as Cruz, fortunately I didn't feel I

1:30:461:30:53

have necessarily done anything

wrong, but people may well judge me

1:30:531:30:58

for that, I don't know. You still

feel responsible for your child.

1:30:581:31:02

Being a single parent as well, I

felt very low. My confidence and

1:31:021:31:07

that went really low as well, so I

really judge myself, you know.

You

1:31:071:31:16

judge yourself?

Of course, you do,

it is just so stressful as well, and

1:31:161:31:20

then you have got all that worries

and then try and be normal the next

1:31:201:31:25

day for your child.

Start afresh,

yeah. What is it like when you get

1:31:251:31:31

continual phone calls from your

child's school saying you will have

1:31:311:31:34

to come and pick them up? You have

been at work on many occasions when

1:31:341:31:38

you have had to come.

Yeah, I have

given myself a year out to be able

1:31:381:31:46

to... Still in mainstream school for

a year, it wasn't doing very well,

1:31:461:31:54

the dread, the phone call, even now

when the phone goes I say, what has

1:31:541:32:01

he done? And it is stressful, it is

very...

Joe, Harry is your youngest

1:32:011:32:09

of four sons, do you think you have

brought up your sons all the same

1:32:091:32:14

way?

I believe that we haven't made

any changes because of Harry being

1:32:141:32:19

the youngest, we have tried numerous

things, we have gone through all the

1:32:191:32:25

processes. We believe that nothing

we could do, and we thought...

What

1:32:251:32:40

sort of things was he doing?

Anything would kick him off, he

1:32:401:32:47

would start arguing, being

aggressive, he was just nasty - for

1:32:471:32:53

no real reason. We thought that it

may be was us, maybe was doing

1:32:531:33:00

something wrong. We took him to

specialists, and we had him tested.

1:33:001:33:05

They couldn't find anything wrong.

When the referral come here, my wife

1:33:051:33:12

was argument we were not going to

bring him here.

Because of the

1:33:121:33:19

stigma?

Yes, the feeling, the dread

that this would be his life, that

1:33:191:33:23

this would be where he would be

long.

Because you have the view, and

1:33:231:33:28

maybe this is true of all of you,

but I don't want to put words in

1:33:281:33:33

your mouth, if your child ends up in

a PRU, that is it for their future,

1:33:331:33:38

their life chances.

Exactly.

Not

necessarily yours?

I was in a

1:33:381:33:43

fortunate position because Cruz was

still at mainstream for a few days,

1:33:431:33:49

but the funding for that programme

has ended, and now he's back in

1:33:491:33:53

mainstream, and I am seeing the

signs of of going back to his old

1:33:531:33:58

ways. The mainstream school are

trying, but they are not equipped

1:33:581:34:01

like the staff here.

Were you

thinking that, Kerry, that if my son

1:34:011:34:06

comes to way PRU...?

It makes you

look at their life in a different

1:34:061:34:12

way, when you have a child, you have

their future set out, not directly,

1:34:121:34:17

but you think they will have a good

future, and because my eldest was so

1:34:171:34:20

easy to bring up, it was difficult

to come to terms with the fact that

1:34:201:34:25

this is a problem that can go on for

the rest of his life, something that

1:34:251:34:29

needs to be looked at, and descends

into a PRU, I was all for it when it

1:34:291:34:35

came to the nurturing group, because

Logan was here for that two years

1:34:351:34:39

ago, but when it comes to telling me

that it would be a permanent

1:34:391:34:44

fixture, that was something that was

really hard to come to terms two,

1:34:441:34:47

telling the these problems are not

just going to pass. This is

1:34:471:34:53

something that is lifelong, and he

will have to deal with for the rest

1:34:531:34:56

of his life.

And now what do you

think?

It is fantastic, it is

1:34:561:35:01

brilliant! All the problems, he has

still got them, he is very reserved,

1:35:011:35:06

and I can see the triggers, his jaw

will go tens when he gets anxious,

1:35:061:35:10

but now, if we go shopping, and he

says I want to throw the clothes all

1:35:101:35:15

over the floor and hide, I go, don't

do that, hold my hand, squeeze my

1:35:151:35:20

hand. You learn different

techniques. This morning he was

1:35:201:35:24

swimming, and he used to cling onto

me, and I took him swimming

1:35:241:35:28

yesterday, and he was jumping in the

water, actually swimming, opening

1:35:281:35:32

his eyes under the water, like a

completely different world that has

1:35:321:35:36

opened up, a new future, you know.

They really make them feel like they

1:35:361:35:42

are somebody who can achieve,

whereas in mainstream they are

1:35:421:35:45

failed, they will never get

anywhere. They come here and they

1:35:451:35:49

are somebody. Cruz has started to

run and play football. He would

1:35:491:35:53

never join in at school, he was

literally on the sidelines of

1:35:531:35:59

everything, assemblies,

performances, he wouldn't do it, and

1:35:591:36:02

now he is starting to believe,

because the staff here are amazing.

1:36:021:36:05

They tell them every day, you can do

this. They celebrate their

1:36:051:36:10

differences, rather than push them

to one side.

I am just going to have

1:36:101:36:14

a quick word, back with you in a

second, at any moment we're going to

1:36:141:36:18

cross to Jeremy Corbyn's speech, the

labour leader's speech on Brexit,

1:36:181:36:23

but I just want to make sure we get

these children in before the end of

1:36:231:36:28

the programme, P4 we hear from Mr

Corbyn. Jacob, Barrington, Andrew -

1:36:281:36:35

what is it like with your mum now

you have come here, in terms of your

1:36:351:36:39

relationship with your mum?

We have

never really had anything wrong, but

1:36:391:36:45

now that I am here, she is happy,

because before we are looking for a

1:36:451:36:55

long time, and now that she knows I

am in a nice place, she knows that I

1:36:551:37:00

am safer for when I grow up.

She

must be a lot happier.

Yeah.

What

1:37:001:37:07

about you, Jacob?

Well, my mum is

very pleased that I am integrating

1:37:071:37:12

back into a newsgroup.

Is it a new

skill?

Yes, a new one. -- a new

1:37:121:37:26

school. And she is just... Because

most of the time, I am making, all

1:37:261:37:32

of the time I am making good

choices, so she is very pleased

1:37:321:37:40

about that, and she is just happy

that I am having a good time there.

1:37:401:37:46

What about your family, Andrew? What

do they think of how you are getting

1:37:461:37:50

on here?

Good. Good and... My mum

likes that I have good reports. At

1:37:501:38:04

my old school, I never. And that I

am improving my work, and now I like

1:38:041:38:11

maths. Before, I never used to do.

And I am good at maths. That I have

1:38:111:38:18

changed my behaviour Twardzik, and

that is it.

Thank you. I am going to

1:38:181:38:27

go back to the parents, so thank you

so much for having us here, you are

1:38:271:38:32

amazing, thank you. Anne-Marie is

the mum of Keira. Thank you, cheers,

1:38:321:38:39

darling. Kerry is the mother of

Logan, Shelley is mother of Cruz,

1:38:391:38:46

and Joe is the dad of Harry, who is

now back in mainstream school. Do

1:38:461:38:53

you think that when a child goes to

a PRU, they mess about all day, do

1:38:531:39:00

you think people think it is a bit

of a holiday camp?

I think they do

1:39:001:39:04

think they must get away with

murder, because they have seen such

1:39:041:39:10

behaviour in mainstream school and

at home that they do not understand

1:39:101:39:13

how these children can be

controlled. Not controlled, you

1:39:131:39:17

know, but they don't understand how

they can sit in such a structured

1:39:171:39:20

setting.

There is a lot of

ignorance, because before this

1:39:201:39:25

programme, who would know what

happens in here? As a parent, before

1:39:251:39:29

I met the head teacher, I didn't

have a clue, I didn't know.

The head

1:39:291:39:36

teacher here, who has been so

accommodating over so many weeks,

1:39:361:39:39

and we are very grateful, given US

Open and transparent access, what

1:39:391:39:45

you think of how she has been with

her children.

It is amazing.

1:39:451:39:52

Literally life changing.

It is not

just the children, it makes a

1:39:521:39:58

difference to our lives, we can

relax, it helps us.

I have so much

1:39:581:40:08

to say about this lady, when I rang

up, I was in tears, very emotional,

1:40:081:40:12

and she made the time, brought me

into have a look around, and I sat

1:40:121:40:19

in her office, and everything came

out.

My favourite fact is that here

1:40:191:40:24

everybody listens to you.

She

listened.

Do you know what? She gave

1:40:241:40:30

me hope, she reassured me, don't

worry, we will help you.

And you are

1:40:301:40:36

very emotional hearing this!

I

really feel like, literally, I wish

1:40:361:40:43

I could say more, she gave me hope.

When I first came, I was literally

1:40:431:40:47

at the end of my tether.

I think

when I first came here, the first

1:40:471:40:54

thing that was said was, don't

worry, we won't be calling you

1:40:541:40:58

everyday! I was so confident, not in

myself, I can take my daughter in

1:40:581:41:06

now, I don't have to worry about it,

the stress is just...

Let me read

1:41:061:41:13

this e-mail from Christine, I am

watching this programme today with a

1:41:131:41:16

heavy heart and tears in my eyes. I

have worked in primary schools as a

1:41:161:41:21

teaching assistant, and sometimes

the unjustifiable results of a child

1:41:211:41:25

flying off the handle through no

fault of their own are sad. Children

1:41:251:41:28

who see a weakness in another child

often deliberately provoke them, and

1:41:281:41:31

the child with the weakness ends up

was off. I have seen it happen so

1:41:311:41:35

many times to the point where I have

gone home and cried. Another says,

1:41:351:41:42

such an inspirational PRU, the staff

are amazing, how fortunate are the

1:41:421:41:46

children who attend there? Abigail

says, I went to a wonderful PRU when

1:41:461:41:52

I was 14, but the school was

specifically for young people with

1:41:521:41:56

health problems that prevented them

from attending mainstream schools,

1:41:561:41:59

rather than for excluded pupils. The

school changed my life around when I

1:41:591:42:03

was too anxious to go into school,

when I was depressed and sell having

1:42:031:42:07

daily. The school has pupils with a

range of health problems, the

1:42:071:42:15

classes were much smaller than

mainstream, side and feel as anxious

1:42:151:42:18

in class. It was a quieter place to

do work if you are having a bad day

1:42:181:42:23

and couldn't cope. Jake says, I have

attended a unit since I was in year

1:42:231:42:27

nine, and I am currently in year 11.

I see petty violence, stabbings and

1:42:271:42:33

15-year-old addicts. Staff are

dedicated but are fighting a losing

1:42:331:42:36

battle. My damage was done earlier,

when I was refused support because

1:42:361:42:43

I, quote, didn't meet the criteria.

And this one, what a marvellous

1:42:431:42:47

school, I didn't really know PRUs

existed, and to such an extremely

1:42:471:42:50

high standard. The head teacher and

her staff are amazing and deserve

1:42:501:42:55

that in the medals. The children are

amazing too. To be able to learn to

1:42:551:43:00

make the right choices, albeit at an

additional cost at this stage of

1:43:001:43:03

their lives, is well worth it in my

opinion. They all seem to be very

1:43:031:43:08

bright and it will make a huge

difference in their adult lives.

1:43:081:43:11

Well done, everyone at Hawkswood, I

applaud you. What about the work you

1:43:111:43:15

do with parents like this? It is not

just about their children, is it?

1:43:151:43:20

Yeah, absolutely, we don't have a

huge amount of resource to do as

1:43:201:43:24

much parental work as we would like

to, but what we do try and do is

1:43:241:43:29

keep the communication going with

the parents. And actually just

1:43:291:43:31

giving them their confidence back,

because their confidence has been

1:43:311:43:35

knocked as well. And actually

helping them do understand that we

1:43:351:43:40

can see in their child what they can

see in that child, their child,

1:43:401:43:44

which some other people struggle to

sometimes see in their child because

1:43:441:43:49

the behaviour blocks that.

Right.

How much did you worry before your

1:43:491:43:53

children came here about your

child's future?

Because of his

1:43:531:44:01

behaviour, we were in fear, of its

escalating, you could only see one

1:44:011:44:05

path forward, and it could have got

worse. You know, there was no tunnel

1:44:051:44:10

to go through to see, and we have

hit a brick wall now, nowhere to go.

1:44:101:44:21

All you were seeing was bad, and

with Logan, he went down and down

1:44:211:44:25

and down, got worse and worse and

worse.

His self-esteem got to the

1:44:251:44:32

point where he always wanted to work

with animals, PA vet, and one day he

1:44:321:44:37

said, I can't be a vet, and I said,

of course you can, but he said, I

1:44:371:44:43

can't read or write, and I'm never

going to be able to learn. I said to

1:44:431:44:48

him, no, you will, we will find a

way to get you there.

I am going to

1:44:481:44:54

pause there, because we are told

Jeremy Corbyn is on his way to do is

1:44:541:44:57

Brexit speech. Thank you so much for

being so candid with us, we really

1:44:571:45:02

appreciate it. We need to thank you

so much, we are so grateful, thank

1:45:021:45:06

you for letting us into your school.

Children, thank you very much for

1:45:061:45:11

having us here bye! OK, we're going

to cross now to Norman Smith, who

1:45:111:45:19

was waiting for Jeremy Corbyn's

speech.

1:45:191:45:25

Thanks very much indeed, a big

moment today for Jeremy Corbyn,

1:45:291:45:32

putting more flesh on the bones of

Labour's Brexit strategy, and what

1:45:321:45:37

seems to be emerging is a clear

divide between Labour on the Tories

1:45:371:45:41

over Brexit with Jeremy Corbyn

outlining a much softer approach to

1:45:411:45:45

Brexit, saying, for example, we

should stay in a customs union, and

1:45:451:45:49

we know Theresa May has ruled that

out, but also warm words about

1:45:491:45:53

staying close to the single market.

Again, something that Theresa May

1:45:531:45:58

has ruled out, and that could pave

the way for Jeremy Corbyn to work

1:45:581:46:06

with Conservative Remainers and

potentially De Vita Mrs May in the

1:46:061:46:09

Commons over Brexit. So the stakes

are high today, because we do have,

1:46:091:46:15

perhaps for the first time now, a

clear divide between the two parties

1:46:151:46:21

over Brexit, with Mr Corbyn setting

out a sort of Brexit light, a much

1:46:211:46:25

softer version of Brexit. The key is

how will those Brexit supporting

1:46:251:46:34

Labour MPs and voters, mainly in

traditional Labour seats, how will

1:46:341:46:36

they react to this? Will they turn

away from Labour? Also unknown, how

1:46:361:46:44

will the EU react? Mr Corbyn has not

said anything about freedom of

1:46:441:46:48

movement, whether we will keep

paying money into the EU, the sorts

1:46:481:46:52

of things you have got to do if you

want a close arrangement with the

1:46:521:46:55

single market.

1:46:551:47:00

single market. Now this will be the

first time we have rarely heard from

1:47:021:47:05

Jeremy Corbyn in this amount of

detail. At the moment Labour has

1:47:051:47:11

adopted a somewhat ambiguous

approach to Brexit, in part because

1:47:111:47:15

they have been trying to keep the

different wings of their party

1:47:151:47:22

together and so Mr Corbyn has not

wanted to be too specific. But now

1:47:221:47:26

we are moving to the nitty-gritty

Brexit, the sharp end of those

1:47:261:47:30

negotiations, when the government is

having to spell out their detailed

1:47:301:47:34

policies. So Labour are having to

spell out their detailed policies as

1:47:341:47:40

well. The time for airy fairy waffle

is beginning to pass. Interestingly,

1:47:401:47:46

on Friday we are expecting Theresa

May to set out a detailed approach

1:47:461:47:49

to Brexit. We are getting to the

sharp end of the whole process. As I

1:47:491:47:56

say, that will be followed by some

knife edge voting in the Commons.

1:47:561:48:02

Tory Remainers are threatening to

vote against Mrs May on the issue of

1:48:021:48:06

a customs union. Exactly the issue

that Jeremy Corbyn will today is

1:48:061:48:10

say, yes, we agree we should remain

in a customs union. The government

1:48:101:48:16

has pushed back the timetable for

that vote. It may not happen until

1:48:161:48:21

after Easter. Let's listen to what

Mr Corbyn has got to say.

We send

1:48:211:48:26

our condolences to those who have

lost their lives in Leicester last

1:48:261:48:29

night. We thank the emergency

services, the police, the fire and

1:48:291:48:35

ambulance and local residents for

all the help and support they gave

1:48:351:48:38

to the victims of that tragedy last

night. I have got to also say a big

1:48:381:48:44

thank you to Coventry University for

allowing us this space this morning.

1:48:441:48:49

Ultrahigh tech all around us. The

modern Labour Party! Ultrahigh tech!

1:48:491:48:54

You are meant to laugh at that

point! Thank you. And the work that

1:48:541:49:00

Coventry University does in

cutting-edge technology, research

1:49:001:49:04

technology, and ensuring that the

skills of decades in Coventry that

1:49:041:49:09

built aircraft, and cars, and so

much else, are developed into the

1:49:091:49:16

high-tech that we want for the 21st

century of sustainable industries

1:49:161:49:19

and sustainable technology. And I

thank the shadow ministers who are

1:49:191:49:25

here today. Rebecca Long-Bailey he

was doing an incredible job on

1:49:251:49:29

business and trade. Mary Garda is

doing a great job on trade itself.

1:49:291:49:32

Thank you. And Keir Starmer who has

done such a brilliant job in holding

1:49:321:49:39

the government to account and

forcing them to retreat time after

1:49:391:49:43

time on the issue Brexit

negotiations. Thank you very much

1:49:431:49:45

for being here. And welcome the

commentary MPs for being here today.

1:49:451:49:51

Thank you very much indeed. The city

of Coventry. And also Geoffrey

1:49:511:49:56

Robinson for the incredible work you

did on Friday on the organ donors

1:49:561:50:00

bill in Parliament. It has made an

incredible difference to the lives

1:50:001:50:03

of many people.

1:50:031:50:08

of many people. Britain's industrial

heartland is where we are now. It is

1:50:131:50:16

now set to be our next City of

Culture. Well done, Coventry, on

1:50:161:50:21

that. I look forward to joining in

the City of Culture celebrations. I

1:50:211:50:25

was given a book of photography

within the Asian community this

1:50:251:50:28

morning by the university which I

will treasure. Thank you. Next month

1:50:281:50:33

the government will embark on the

second and most crucial phase of

1:50:331:50:37

negotiations to leave the European

Union, to set the terms of Britain's

1:50:371:50:40

relationship with the EU for the

long-term. We are now 20 months on

1:50:401:50:45

from the referendum that voted to

leave, and a year on from the

1:50:451:50:49

triggering of Article 50. But the

country is still in the dark about

1:50:491:50:54

what this divided Conservative

government actually wants out of

1:50:541:50:56

Brexit. They cannot agree amongst

themselves on what their priorities

1:50:561:51:03

are or what future they want for

Britain after Brexit. They have got

1:51:031:51:08

no shortage of sound bites and

slogans of course. The Foreign

1:51:081:51:11

Secretary says it will be a liberal

Brexit. The Prime Ministers says it

1:51:111:51:15

will be a red, white and blue

Brexit. On other days it is a

1:51:151:51:20

bespoke economic partnership. The

Brexit Secretary at least now

1:51:201:51:23

promises it will not be a Mad Max

style dystopia. You might think that

1:51:231:51:30

is setting the bar a little low! The

trade secretary cannot contain

1:51:301:51:34

himself at the prospect of putting

Britain into a spiral of

1:51:341:51:38

deregulation in rights and

standards. The Cabinet seems to have

1:51:381:51:42

agreed at Chequers to leave the door

open to that while there are

1:51:421:51:45

ambitious managed version goes on,

whatever that means. The truth is we

1:51:451:51:52

really don't know much more about

where they are actually heading in

1:51:521:51:55

these talks. Workers, businesses and

everybody who voted in a referendum

1:51:551:51:58

just wants to know what the

government's approach to Brexit is

1:51:581:52:03

likely to mean for their future and

the future of the country. As the

1:52:031:52:09

opposition, we have been trying to

hold this government to account. We

1:52:091:52:12

have a duty to do that. Our message

has been consistent since the vote

1:52:121:52:16

to leave 20 months ago. We respect

the result of the referendum. Our

1:52:161:52:22

priority is to get the best deal for

people's jobs, living standards and

1:52:221:52:26

the economy, as Becky was explaining

in her opening remarks. We reject

1:52:261:52:30

any race to the bottom in worker'

rights, environmental safeguards,

1:52:301:52:36

consumer protections and food safety

standards. And we have pushed the

1:52:361:52:40

government to act, to guarantee the

rights of European Union citizens

1:52:401:52:43

living here and of UK citizens who

have made their homes elsewhere in

1:52:431:52:49

Europe. I want to thank all those EU

nationals who have made their homes

1:52:491:52:55

here, made such an incredible

contribution to our communities, our

1:52:551:52:58

lives and our public services, and

say to the government it is a shame

1:52:581:53:02

on them they have been through 20

months of uncertain horror because

1:53:021:53:06

there have been no guarantees of

their future. We will protect their

1:53:061:53:11

rights by legislating immediately to

guarantee permanent residence for EU

1:53:111:53:14

nationals living here and the right

to bring their families here.

1:53:141:53:21

APPLAUSE

1:53:211:53:23

We also want to ensure a transition

period on the existing terms.

That

1:53:261:53:31

was a very strong point that Keir

and other colleagues put in

1:53:311:53:35

Parliament that would minimise

disruption and avoid an economic

1:53:351:53:37

cliff edge. To avoid any return to a

hardboard in Northern Ireland. And

1:53:371:53:43

to guarantee Parliament a meaningful

vote on the final deal. The

1:53:431:53:53

Conservative government has dithered

and delayed. Their incompetence and

1:53:531:53:58

deregulation obsession has risked

putting jobs and living standards at

1:53:581:54:01

risk as we leave the European Union.

This is an economy that has already

1:54:011:54:05

been damaged by eight years of

Conservative austerity. Where wages

1:54:051:54:10

are still lower today than they were

a decade ago, where productivity

1:54:101:54:15

lags dangerously behind other major

economies, where the government has

1:54:151:54:19

failed to invest and modernise.

Where more people are living in

1:54:191:54:24

poverty. And where closing the

deficit that was due to be

1:54:241:54:28

eradicated in 2015, then 2016, then

2017, then 2020, has now been put

1:54:281:54:39

back to 2025. After years of Tory

blast and slogans, the Conservatives

1:54:391:54:45

have been found out. They have no

economic plan and they have no

1:54:451:54:51

Brexit plan. Every so often they

wheel out Boris Johnson to promise

1:54:511:54:56

once more that they will cough up

more money for the NHS after Brexit.

1:54:561:55:03

And they have spent the last eight

years not giving money to the

1:55:031:55:07

National Health Service that so

desperately needs it. Even while

1:55:071:55:12

they have been able to find billions

of pounds, billions, to cut taxes

1:55:121:55:18

for the richest corporations, to cut

capital gains tax for the super-rich

1:55:181:55:22

elite, and to scrap the 50% rate for

the richest as well. And found

1:55:221:55:28

billions more to cut inheritance tax

on the wealthiest estates, and to

1:55:281:55:34

slash the bank levy. Yet the

National Health Service has been

1:55:341:55:37

subjected to the longest financial

squeeze in its history. This is a

1:55:371:55:44

government that failed our NHS

pro-Brexit and during Brexit, and

1:55:441:55:49

certainly cannot be trusted with the

NHS post-Brexit. Labour will give

1:55:491:55:55

the NHS the resources it needs. We

will raise tax on the top 5% and big

1:55:551:56:00

businesses. Those with the broadest

shoulders to pay, not by making up

1:56:001:56:05

numbers and parading them on the

side of a bus. We will use the funds

1:56:051:56:11

returned from Brussels after Brexit

to invest in our public services and

1:56:111:56:15

the jobs of the future. Not tax cuts

for the richest.

1:56:151:56:20

APPLAUSE

1:56:201:56:27

Today I want to set out Labour's

approach to Brexit in more detail,

1:56:281:56:32

how we would do things differently,

what our priorities are for the

1:56:321:56:37

Brexit negotiation and the values

that underpin it. The first is our

1:56:371:56:43

overriding mission that whatever is

negotiated must put people's jobs

1:56:431:56:47

and living standards first. The

Brexit process must not leave our

1:56:471:56:52

people and country worse off. We are

committed to building a more

1:56:521:56:57

prosperous and more equal Britain.

In which every region, every region,

1:56:571:57:06

benefits and no community,

absolutely no community is left

1:57:061:57:10

behind. As we set out in our

manifesto, and that is what

1:57:101:57:14

underpins our approach to Brexit.

The second is unity. Most people in

1:57:141:57:21

our country, regardless of whether

they voted leave or remain, want

1:57:211:57:25

better jobs, more investment,

stronger rights and greater

1:57:251:57:30

equality. So we will not let those

who want to sow divisions drive this

1:57:301:57:37

process. No scapegoating of

migrants. No setting when generation

1:57:371:57:42

against another. And no playing of

the nations of the UK.

1:57:421:57:45

APPLAUSE

1:57:451:57:47

No one should be willing to

sacrifice the Good Friday Agreement,

1:57:551:57:58

the bases of 20 years of relative

peace and development and respect

1:57:581:58:02

for diversity in Northern Ireland.

The Good Friday Agreement was a huge

1:58:021:58:13

achievement and on this anniversary

of it, let's respect that and the

1:58:131:58:16

achievements that went behind it and

not allow that to be undermined

1:58:161:58:19

during the Brexit process. The third

is our global perspective. We are

1:58:191:58:27

leaving the European Union but we

are not leaving Europe. We are not

1:58:271:58:32

throwing up protectionist barriers,

closing the borders and barricading

1:58:321:58:35

ourselves in. And we want a close

and cooperative relationship with

1:58:351:58:40

the whole of Europe after Brexit. We

are a party of internationalists. We

1:58:401:58:49

know that our interests are bound up

with millions of others all across

1:58:491:58:52

the globe. Whether that is in order

to tackle the huge challenges of

1:58:521:59:00

climate change, build a more

peaceful world, or clamp down on the

1:59:001:59:04

tax dodging elite who think by

bestriding the clothes they can

1:59:041:59:11

avoid paying their share for vital

public services. -- the globe. I

1:59:111:59:18

want to address each of these

principles today because together

1:59:181:59:22

they define Labour's approach to

Brexit. The Labour Party's values

1:59:221:59:27

and what the next Labour Party

government will seek to deliver in

1:59:271:59:30

office. So many of the areas that

voted to leave the same areas that

1:59:301:59:39

have lost out from years of chronic

underinvestment. Areas where too

1:59:391:59:44

many people are held back by the

lack of opportunities. Where people

1:59:441:59:53

fail. The system is rigged against

them will stop because they can't

1:59:531:59:58

get a decent, secure job, can't

afford to buy a home, can't get more

1:59:582:00:03

hours or higher pay, can't afford to

retire or are not able to escape the

2:00:032:00:08

spiral of debt. You can't replace

jobs like mining with Sports Direct

2:00:082:00:22

and jobs like that. We are

determined to change that.

2:00:222:00:25

Our priority is to get the best jobs

and living standards, upgrade the

2:00:302:00:37

economy and invest in every

community and region and shift it

2:00:372:00:41

away from the low paid, low skilled,

low investment economy it has become

2:00:412:00:46

under the Tories and the balance

that investment across the country

2:00:462:00:51

so no longer will some regions get a

mere one sixth of the capital

2:00:512:00:56

investment that goes to London.

That's why Labour were once the

2:00:562:01:01

Brexit for all our people, one that

offers security to workers in the

2:01:012:01:05

car industry worried about their

future, hope to families struggling

2:01:052:01:09

to pay the bills and opportunities

to young people wanting a decent job

2:01:092:01:14

and the home of their own. These are

the people we are thinking of and

2:01:142:01:20

working for. It is a very different

story around the mahogany table in

2:01:202:01:29

Chequers. The Government seems much

more concerned about cutting deals

2:01:292:01:34

with each other for their friends

and funders from the City of London.

2:01:342:01:40

Labour is looking for a Brexit that

puts the working people first

2:01:402:01:44

leaving the EU, whatever that exit

the ends, risks delivering a shock

2:01:442:01:50

to the economy and less the right

plans and protections are in place.

2:01:502:01:56

To allow the kind of investment and

economic transformation programme

2:01:562:02:00

the country needs and that Labour is

committed to. For 45 years of

2:02:002:02:07

economy has become increasingly

linked to the European Union and

2:02:072:02:11

many of our laws and regulations set

and monitored by a joint European

2:02:112:02:16

authorities, from implementing rules

on the use of pesticides to

2:02:162:02:19

assessing levels of fluoride in

drinking water. The EU food safety

2:02:192:02:24

authority plays a vital role in

monitoring the substances used in

2:02:242:02:29

manufacturing or growing our food.

Using the latest scientific evidence

2:02:292:02:33

to assess what the substances are

likely to have harmful effects on

2:02:332:02:39

humans or animals. The European

chemicals agency carries out the

2:02:392:02:42

vital task of evaluating and

authorising chemicals as safe for

2:02:422:02:46

use. Many businesses up supply

chains and production processes

2:02:462:02:51

interwoven throughout Europe. Take

the UK car industry, which supports

2:02:512:02:59

169,000 manufacturing jobs. 52,000

of which in the West Midlands. If we

2:02:592:03:04

look at the example of one of

Britain's most iconic brands, the

2:03:042:03:10

mini. We begin to see how reliant on

automotive industry is on the

2:03:102:03:16

friction was interwoven Supply

train. A Mini will cross the Channel

2:03:162:03:21

three times in the 2000 mile journey

before the finished car rolls off

2:03:212:03:26

the production line. Starting in

Oxford it will be shipped to France

2:03:262:03:31

to be fitted for key components

before being brought back to BMW's

2:03:312:03:37

plant in Warwickshire where it is

drilled into shape. Once that

2:03:372:03:42

process is complete, it will be sent

to Munich to be fitted with its

2:03:422:03:46

engine before ending its journey

back at the Mini plant in Oxford for

2:03:462:03:51

final assembly. If that car is to be

sold on the continent many of which

2:03:512:04:00

components will have crossed the

Channel four times. The sheer

2:04:002:04:03

complexity of this demand we are

practical and serious about this

2:04:032:04:07

next stage. I want to pay tribute to

those grappling with these issues on

2:04:072:04:19

my, they are serious and United. I

do not do personal in politics but

2:04:192:04:24

let me simply say it is in a bit of

a contrast to what is going on the

2:04:242:04:27

other side of the House of Commons

chamber, I will leave it at that. It

2:04:272:04:33

makes no sense for the UK to abandon

EU agencies and tariff free trading

2:04:332:04:41

rules that have served us well,

supporting other industrial sectors

2:04:412:04:45

and protecting workers and consumers

and safeguarding the environment. If

2:04:452:04:48

that means negotiating to support

individual EU agencies, rather than

2:04:482:04:54

paying more money to duplicate those

agencies here, that should be an

2:04:542:05:01

option, not something ruled out

because of some phoney jingoistic

2:05:012:05:06

posturing by the Foreign Secretary.

We well want to remain a part of

2:05:062:05:11

agencies that regulate nuclear

materials and, crucially, and health

2:05:112:05:17

sectors as well. Programmes like in

Rasmus, from which this university

2:05:172:05:22

benefits greatly assurance from

Britain survey across Europe and

2:05:222:05:27

vice versa, that enriches the lives

of students on both sides of the

2:05:272:05:31

Channel and across the continent. It

serves our interests and interests

2:05:312:05:35

of young people all across Europe to

maintain membership of that

2:05:352:05:40

programme. We are leaving the EU but

we are still working with European

2:05:402:05:45

partners in the economic interests

of our country. When 44% of our

2:05:452:05:50

exports are to the EU countries and

50% of our imports come from the EU,

2:05:502:05:56

it is an both our interests, both

our interest, for that to remain

2:05:562:06:02

tariff free. It would damage

businesses that export to Europe and

2:06:022:06:06

the jobs depend on those exports for

there to be the additional costs of

2:06:062:06:11

tariffs. It would damage consumers

here, already failed by stagnant

2:06:112:06:16

wages and rapidly rising housing

costs. So, we will remain close to

2:06:162:06:23

the EU, that is obvious, every

country, Turkey, Switzerland and

2:06:232:06:28

Norway, that is geographically close

to the EU without being a member

2:06:282:06:32

state has some sort of close

relationship with the EU. Some are

2:06:322:06:37

more advantageous than others and

Britain will need a bespoke

2:06:372:06:41

negotiated relationship of its own.

During the transition period, which

2:06:412:06:45

was proposed by Labour in the first

place, we would seek to remain an a

2:06:452:06:52

customs union with the EU and within

the single market. That means we

2:06:522:06:57

would abide by existing rules of

both during transition. That the

2:06:572:07:03

Saudi Government, businesses and

workers only have to make one

2:07:032:07:06

adjustment from that -- that is so

the Government and businesses and

2:07:062:07:11

workers only have to make one

adjustment. We spelt out the need

2:07:112:07:15

for a stable transition period last

summer and both the TUC and CBI

2:07:152:07:20

agree on that. We thought the

Government had accepted that but now

2:07:202:07:24

they seem to be very surprisingly,

in disarray on this issue yet again.

2:07:242:07:29

Time after time with this Government

is anything aggrieved at breakfast

2:07:292:07:33

is being briefed against by lunch

and abandoned by tea-time --

2:07:332:07:38

anything agreed at breakfast. This

agreement, it seems, is the new

2:07:382:07:44

strong and stable. The Government's

division risks costly adjustments

2:07:442:07:49

for both Government and business

from the current terms to the

2:07:492:07:53

transitional terms and begin to the

final terms. Labour would seek a

2:07:532:07:57

final deal giving full access to

European markets and maintains the

2:07:572:08:01

benefits of the single market and

customs union as the Brexit

2:08:012:08:06

secretary David Davis promised in

the House of Commons, with no new

2:08:062:08:10

impediments to trade or reductions

in rights, standards and

2:08:102:08:13

protections. We long argued a

customs union is a viable option for

2:08:132:08:18

the final deal so we would seek to

negotiate a new, comprehensive UK EU

2:08:182:08:24

customs union to ensure there are no

tariffs with Europe and help avoid

2:08:242:08:29

any needs whatsoever for the hard

border in Northern Ireland.

2:08:292:08:34

APPLAUSE but we are also clear up

the option of a new customs union

2:08:342:08:45

with the EU would need to ensure we

have a say in new trade deals, it

2:08:452:08:55

would require us to be able to

negotiate new trade deals and the

2:08:552:08:59

national interest.

We would not countenance a deal

2:08:592:09:03

living Britain a passive recipient

of rules decided by others that

2:09:032:09:08

would mean is ending up as a rule

taker. In contrast, the Government

2:09:082:09:13

has ended up seeing -- move from

saying it wanted trade with the EU

2:09:132:09:19

to be tariff free to then saying it

wanted it to be as having as

2:09:192:09:24

possible, quite a change. In which

governments area as the Government

2:09:242:09:29

think it would be acceptable for

there to be tariffs? They should let

2:09:292:09:32

us know, like so much else, they

have not spelt that out. That is the

2:09:322:09:39

consequence of ruling out the option

of a customs union, which the

2:09:392:09:44

Government has done. I appealed to

MPs of all parties, be prepared to

2:09:442:09:49

put the people's interest ahead of

ideological fight disease and join

2:09:492:09:54

us in supporting the option of a new

customs union with the EU. Labour

2:09:542:10:01

respects the referendum result and

Britain is leaving the EU but we

2:10:012:10:06

will not support any Saudi deal that

would do lasting damage to jobs,

2:10:062:10:11

writes -- we would not support any

Tory deal that would reduce rights

2:10:112:10:18

and standards. We do not believe

deals with the USA China would be

2:10:182:10:23

likely to compensate for a

significant loss of trade with our

2:10:232:10:28

neighbours in the European Union and

the Government's or leaked

2:10:282:10:32

assessment is sure exactly that.

Both the United States and China

2:10:322:10:37

have much weaker standards and

regulations. Those deals with risk

2:10:372:10:43

dragging Britain into a race to the

bottom on vital protections and

2:10:432:10:50

other rights at work. Environment,

consumer and rights at work are very

2:10:502:10:55

central to everything the Labour

Party believes in. Let me make this

2:10:552:11:01

clear, we are implacably opposed to

our NHS or any other public services

2:11:012:11:06

being part of a trade deal with

Donald Trump's America or a revived

2:11:062:11:14

transatlantic trade investment

partnership deal with the EU which

2:11:142:11:17

would open the door to a flood of

further privatisations of public

2:11:172:11:22

services and our NHS.

APPLAUSE and we are not prepared to

2:11:222:11:34

ask the British public to eat

chlorinated chicken and lower the

2:11:342:11:38

standards of British farming.

We would ensure there will be no

2:11:382:11:44

reduction in rights, standards

protections and instead seek to

2:11:442:11:47

extend them. EBay -- the like

relation -- deregulation and a race

2:11:472:11:55

to the bottom with damage standards

and we would renegotiate a view

2:11:552:12:02

tariff free access to the single

market and protections of existing

2:12:022:12:09

standards. That would need to ensure

we can deliver our ambitious

2:12:092:12:14

economic programme to take essential

steps to intervene, upgrades and

2:12:142:12:19

transform our economy, to build an

economy for the 21st-century that

2:12:192:12:24

works for the many, not just the

few. Labour has set out how we will

2:12:242:12:30

create a national investment bank to

drive investment in every community

2:12:302:12:36

through a network of regional

development banks. So every area has

2:12:362:12:41

an industrial strategy based on

investments in a high skill, high

2:12:412:12:48

wage, high productivity economy, and

through our 500 billion national

2:12:482:12:53

transformation fund, we would invest

in a decade-long programme of

2:12:532:12:58

renewal so Britain has the

infrastructure that matches, if not

2:12:582:13:02

exceeds that, of other major

economies. An hour transport

2:13:022:13:07

networks, energy markets and our

digital infrastructure too often

2:13:072:13:11

Britain is well behind. We would

also seek to negotiate protections

2:13:112:13:17

and publications or exceptions,

where necessary, in relation to

2:13:172:13:22

privatisation of public service

competition directives. State aid

2:13:222:13:25

procurement rules and the workers'

directive. We cannot be held back

2:13:252:13:34

inside or outside the EU from taking

these steps we need to support

2:13:342:13:38

cutting edge industries and local

businesses and stop the tide of

2:13:382:13:43

privatisation and outsourcing. Or

for preventing employers being able

2:13:432:13:48

to import cheap agency labour to

undercut existing pay and conditions

2:13:482:13:55

and resulting in a grotesque levels

of exploitation of vulnerable

2:13:552:13:59

workers and loss of jobs to others

and the huge profits to the employer

2:13:592:14:04

in the middle of that. We would deal

with that.

2:14:042:14:08

APPLAUSE.

It was alarming that after the

2:14:082:14:16

Brexit vote there was a clear rise

in xenophobic and racist attacks on

2:14:162:14:21

our streets. The referendum campaign

was divisive and some politicians on

2:14:212:14:28

the leaves side with top fears and

division to further their cause.

2:14:282:14:34

That built on a shameful fans

telling arrogance to go home that

2:14:342:14:38

the then Home Secretary instructed

to trundle around the country,

2:14:382:14:44

stirring up division. I remember

just after the referendum result

2:14:442:14:47

receiving a text from a young person

and my constituency who had been

2:14:472:14:51

subjected to abuse in the state for

the first time in his life for being

2:14:512:14:57

abused for what he is and he was

very afraid. Our immigration system

2:14:572:15:03

will change and freedom of movement

will end when we leave the EU but we

2:15:032:15:08

have also said in the trade

negotiations priorities, growth,

2:15:082:15:16

jobs and living standards for

people. We make no apologies were

2:15:162:15:20

putting those games before bogus

immigration targets. Labour would

2:15:202:15:24

design our immigration policy based

on fair rules and reasonable

2:15:242:15:33

management of migration. Our

national health is suffering and

2:15:332:15:43

large EU staff numbers have gone

home already but we want to turn

2:15:432:15:47

that around. They are welcome to

stay and work here because we need

2:15:472:15:52

them here and we need their skills

and dedication and other labour we

2:15:522:15:57

will make sure that happens.

APPLAUSE.

2:15:572:16:03

Not starting from rigid and work out

what that means afterwards. Diane

2:16:062:16:11

Abbott said last week, we do not

begin with how we reduce immigration

2:16:112:16:18

and to hell with the consequences,

these are Tory policies and values.

2:16:182:16:23

Part of the reason net migration has

been relatively high in recent years

2:16:232:16:27

is because of the skills shortage in

the UK labour market. At the general

2:16:272:16:33

election Labour set out plans to

invest in a national education

2:16:332:16:37

service with free college,

university training places to tackle

2:16:372:16:42

those shortages and not drive young

people into debt just because they

2:16:422:16:46

want to get a university education.

APPLAUSE

2:16:462:16:52

People also feel frustrated when

they are denied opportunities to

2:16:522:16:59

re-train or improve their skills and

employers instead import skilled

2:16:592:17:02

labour from elsewhere. We will also

restore free English as a second

2:17:022:17:07

language courses so people who come

here whether as migrants or refugees

2:17:072:17:11

can learn and -- English and

participate in their workplaces. And

2:17:112:17:22

tighten labour regulations,

strengthen trade union rights,

2:17:222:17:25

tackle insecurity and exploitation

of all workers. When migrant workers

2:17:252:17:31

come to Britain they must not be

exploited or used to undercut or

2:17:312:17:33

suppress better working conditions

or higher pay. Those issues can only

2:17:332:17:38

be tackled by stronger employment

law to stop employers being able to

2:17:382:17:43

import cheap agency labour to

undercut existing pay and

2:17:432:17:46

conditions. Collective agreements

and central bargaining must become

2:17:462:17:51

the norm. Labour stands for the rate

for the job not a race to the

2:17:512:17:57

bottom.

APPLAUSE

2:17:572:17:57

. It is not migrants who drive down

wages, it is bad employers who can't

2:17:572:18:08

pay and bad Government to allow

workers to be divided and

2:18:082:18:11

undermined.

APPLAUSE

2:18:112:18:12

And what -- they want unions to be

weak and passive. We will strengthen

2:18:122:18:20

our employment law. Invest in the

skills of workers in Britain so they

2:18:202:18:24

can progress. And oppose all those

who instead of seeking to solve

2:18:242:18:29

problems seek to scapegoat instead.

The evolution of the last Labour

2:18:292:18:35

Government completed the peace

process in Northern Ireland which we

2:18:352:18:38

must cherish. -- devolution. And I

pay tribute to Tony Blair and all

2:18:382:18:51

those who worked so hard on the Good

Friday Agreement. We must continue

2:18:512:18:56

to support the restoration of the

Northern Ireland assembly and made

2:18:562:19:01

sure -- make sure we maintain the

border. Established Scotland and

2:19:012:19:12

Wales Parliament and assembly.

Labour believes powers of a devolved

2:19:122:19:17

policy areas currently exercised by

the EU should go directly to the

2:19:172:19:21

relevant body involved after Brexit.

That power is closer to the people.

2:19:212:19:27

That is the same principle that

involves the regional development

2:19:272:19:32

backs that the next Labour

Government will develop. Including a

2:19:322:19:39

commitment to support the United

Nations, and a promise to secure

2:19:392:19:49

peace, freedom, democracy, economic

freedom and environmental protection

2:19:492:19:50

for all. Some want to use Brexit to

turn Britain on itself, seeing

2:19:502:19:59

everyone has a feared competitor.

Others want to use Brexit to put

2:19:592:20:02

rocket boosters under our current

economic systems, insecurities and

2:20:022:20:08

inequalities was the turning Britain

into a de-regulated corporate tax

2:20:082:20:13

haven with low wages, limited rights

and cut-price public services in

2:20:132:20:18

what would be a destructive race to

the bottom. Labour stands for a

2:20:182:20:24

completely different future. Drawing

on the best internationalist

2:20:242:20:28

traditions of the labour movement

and of this country. We want to see

2:20:282:20:32

close cooperative relations with our

neighbours outside the EU based on

2:20:322:20:39

values of internationalism,

solidarity and a quality. As well as

2:20:392:20:43

mutual benefit and Eritrea. --

equality. Fair trade. 1948 human

2:20:432:20:55

rights, and the Human Rights Act in

showing that in law so Labour will

2:20:552:21:01

continue to work with other European

allies including through Europe to

2:21:012:21:07

ensure our country and others uphold

our international obligations. We

2:21:072:21:11

must work with other countries to

advance the cause of human rights.

2:21:112:21:14

To confront the four greatest

interconnected threats facing our

2:21:142:21:21

common humanity. First, the growing

concentration of unaccountable

2:21:212:21:28

wealth and power in the hands of a

tiny global corporate elite. We must

2:21:282:21:37

challenge that, working with our

European neighbours to stop those

2:21:372:21:41

who play one country off and other

or those who hide their wealth

2:21:412:21:46

offshore in order to avoid paying

their dues to fund the public

2:21:462:21:54

services that they all use at some

point in their lives. Second,

2:21:542:21:58

climate change, which is creating

instability and fuelling conflict

2:21:582:22:02

across the world. And threatening

all of our futures. No matter how

2:22:022:22:07

much we inform them pollution,

stubbornly, dishes factory --

2:22:072:22:15

disrespectfully refuses to respect

borders. We can only improve

2:22:152:22:21

environmental degradation and

pollution by working together as

2:22:212:22:25

many of our closest allies in that

struggle are in Europe. The Green

2:22:252:22:29

Alliance estimates trade in

low-carbon goods and services

2:22:292:22:33

contributed over 42 billion to the

economy in 2015. The UK low carbon

2:22:332:22:39

and renewable energy sector was it

-- inspected to increase by four by

2:22:392:22:45

2030 potentially bringing 2 million

jobs and contributing more than 8%

2:22:452:22:49

to the UK's national output. That

needs us to maintain our standards

2:22:492:22:54

and ensure barrier free trade in

low-carbon goods. Those include

2:22:542:23:02

eco-design and energy labelling

standards, greenhouse gas emission

2:23:022:23:05

standards for vehicles and internal

energy market product standard

2:23:052:23:13

services, chemical radiation and

nuclear safety and safeguards. The

2:23:132:23:16

importance of getting our Brexit

settlement right is vital in this

2:23:162:23:20

area both in terms of the industrial

role of Britain in reducing climate

2:23:202:23:25

change and protecting jobs and

industry. Third, there are

2:23:252:23:31

unprecedented numbers of people

fleeing conflict, persecution,

2:23:312:23:37

social breakdown, humans rights

abuses and climate disaster. The

2:23:372:23:42

global refugee crisis is huge. There

are 65 million refugees across the

2:23:422:23:48

world. That is the equivalent of the

entire population of Britain. That

2:23:482:23:53

crisis is a challenge, much of which

is on the borders of Europe. That

2:23:532:23:57

challenge can be met by coordinating

with neighbours both to crack down

2:23:572:24:03

on people smugglers who put men,

women and children in and vessels.

2:24:032:24:10

Operations have tried to rescue

those from BC seas as too many

2:24:102:24:15

desperate people are drowning in

pursuit of the century. These are

2:24:152:24:19

people -- rescue from the seas. They

suffer from cruelty, but want to

2:24:192:24:27

make a contribution. For an active

birth it could be any of us. Let's

2:24:272:24:37

help humanity, not like them with

the problems they are fleeing from.

2:24:372:24:44

-- not played them. -- plague them.

I want to address the use of

2:24:442:24:59

intervention by the Linda diplomacy.

Let's learn the lessons of Iraq,

2:24:592:25:06

Libya and Afghanistan. And not go

down the regime change wars route

2:25:062:25:11

again. International cooperation

confronts the root causes of

2:25:112:25:19

conflict, persecution and

inequality. We will continue to play

2:25:192:25:21

a role in partnership with the EU in

that effort. We live in a globalised

2:25:212:25:28

world. The lives we lead our

dependent on the work of others and

2:25:282:25:32

our trade with those from around the

world. Many of us have friends and

2:25:322:25:38

family from or who live in many

other parts of the world. In

2:25:382:25:43

contrast to the Prime Minister, who

said if you believe you are a

2:25:432:25:46

citizen of the world, you are a

citizen of nowhere. We believe, in

2:25:462:25:51

fact, that we can only fully achieve

what we want as citizens of Britain

2:25:512:25:59

by also recognising we are citizens

of the world.

2:25:592:26:01

APPLAUSE

2:26:012:26:03

I have long opposed embedding a

free-market orthodoxy and the

2:26:072:26:14

Democratic deficit in European

Union. That is why I campaigned to

2:26:142:26:20

remain and reform in the referendum.

Scepticism is healthy especially

2:26:202:26:24

when dealing with politicians. And

there is plenty of them here today.

2:26:242:26:32

Or the received wisdom of the

political and media establishment.

2:26:322:26:36

Plenty of those here as well today.

Being a Eurosceptic in reality

2:26:362:26:46

became synonymous with

anti-European. I am not

2:26:462:26:49

anti-European. I want close

cooperation with the whole of Europe

2:26:492:26:54

after Brexit. Labour is the party of

the new common-sense on the economy,

2:26:542:26:59

public services and Brexit. The only

party which recognises the world has

2:26:592:27:04

changed these last ten years. And,

no, we cannot continue with widening

2:27:042:27:12

elite -- inequality, deregulation of

industry and privatisation of public

2:27:122:27:14

services. We are in a country with

Tory run councils collapsing because

2:27:142:27:21

of cuts, where homeless people are

dying on the streets. In the shadow

2:27:212:27:25

of Parliament. Good jobs are being

lost because we have a Government

2:27:252:27:30

who will not get a grip on the

casino economy. In or out of the

2:27:302:27:36

European Union, we have to deal with

that reality, the reality of market

2:27:362:27:42

failure and austerity. Free-market

has not worked in the banking

2:27:422:27:52

sector, water industry, energy

utilities and has crashed in

2:27:522:27:55

outsourcing. It has failed our

fragmented railways and has led to a

2:27:552:28:01

labour market where abuse is rife.

The European Union is not the root

2:28:012:28:06

of all our problems and leaving it

will not solve all of our problems

2:28:062:28:11

who is likewise, the EU is not the

source of all enlightenment and

2:28:112:28:15

leaving it does not inevitably spell

doom. Some will tell you Brexit is a

2:28:152:28:19

disaster for this country and some

will say it will create a land of

2:28:192:28:23

milk and honey. The truth is more

down to earth, it is in our hands.

2:28:232:28:27

It is what we make of it, together,

the priorities and choices we make

2:28:272:28:33

in negotiations. The Conservatives

are damaging our country and their

2:28:332:28:38

priorities for Brexit risk

increasing and exacerbating the

2:28:382:28:42

damage. I also know what a Labour

Government could do for this

2:28:422:28:48

country. Our priorities for Brexit

negotiations are the right ones - to

2:28:482:28:53

create a country that works, really

does work, for the many, not the

2:28:532:28:58

few. Thank you very much.

APPLAUSE

2:28:582:29:03

Applause for Jeremy Corbyn's speech

in Coventry. Local MP beside him. We

2:29:142:29:24

are expecting a question and answer

session at which we will bring life

2:29:242:29:27

to you.

We will do the questions in

groups. We should have roving

2:29:272:29:39

microphones. Two on the go. The

gentleman with the glasses.

2:29:392:29:46

Fantastic. Channel 4 News. In a

customs agreement, if you went into

2:29:462:29:53

one, please say you have might just

be a right to be heard, not a right

2:29:532:29:57

to a vote for a veto. Would you live

with that?

Say that again.

Is it the

2:29:572:30:07

microphone? If you go into a customs

agreement, you might just have a

2:30:072:30:13

right to be heard, not a right to a

vote of veto on any trade agreements

2:30:132:30:19

the EU might have. Could you live

with that? You point out it has been

2:30:192:30:24

20 months since the referendum. You

say the Tories have been playing

2:30:242:30:28

politics. Why have you suddenly now

come round to the idea of a customs

2:30:282:30:32

agreement? Some people might think

you have got a political game on

2:30:322:30:36

your mind.

2:30:362:30:37

The ladies sat doubtlessly blue

dress on, a little further along.

2:30:432:30:52

Someone pointed out a number of

European countries spend more on

2:30:522:30:56

state aid per head than the UK and

also Scandinavian style economies

2:30:562:31:00

are possible within the single

market because they exist, what

2:31:002:31:05

specific Labour policies do you hope

to implement that you believe

2:31:052:31:09

requires an exemption from those

single market rules?

One more from

2:31:092:31:15

this site, the gentleman with the

lovely blue jumper there.

2:31:152:31:21

Thank you. Nick Watts, BBC

Newsnight. It is often said because

2:31:212:31:26

we do not see you at these set piece

interventions and Brexit very often

2:31:262:31:33

you are keen for Theresa May to own

a Brexit's success or failure but in

2:31:332:31:38

the last week you raised it at Prime

Minister's Questions and here we are

2:31:382:31:43

today. I am wondering if you see an

opportunity to shape Brexit or an

2:31:432:31:49

opportunity to ship out Theresa May?

Well, I love your blue sweater, it's

2:31:492:31:56

very nice.

We have a team, I know it's a bit of

2:31:562:32:04

a difficult concept for the Tory

party to understand, we have a team,

2:32:042:32:10

are Brexit negotiating team, the

Shadow Cabinet, and we have

2:32:102:32:14

travelled far and wide. I have

travelled over many parts of Europe,

2:32:142:32:18

maintained a very close relationship

with colleagues in Europe and

2:32:182:32:23

developed that understanding because

we want an alliance in the future. I

2:32:232:32:29

have attended more meetings of the

party of European Socialists that

2:32:292:32:33

any Labour leader in the past and

our team is part of that. I raised

2:32:332:32:37

these matters with the Prime

Minister at question Time last week,

2:32:372:32:41

and you would have heard all that.

And we will continue making these

2:32:412:32:47

interventions. Listen, it was only

two weeks or so after the referendum

2:32:472:32:53

in 2016 and Burnham, then our Shadow

Home Secretary before becoming the

2:32:532:32:59

mayor of greater Manchester,

proposed an amendment to Parliament

2:32:592:33:04

resolution to Parliament to

guarantee EU citizens rights of

2:33:042:33:08

residency in Britain. We have been

on this since the very beginning, of

2:33:082:33:12

the late with the consequences of

the decision. -- of dealing with the

2:33:122:33:17

consequences. On the points from the

Guardian journalist, the issues are

2:33:172:33:25

of competition rules and are of the

rules on state aid. For example, the

2:33:252:33:33

nationalisation of RBS, in order to

accommodate European rules, was

2:33:332:33:37

accompanied by the selling off of

some of the best part of RBS and the

2:33:372:33:42

public was left with the remainder.

Royal Mail is a natural monopoly,

2:33:422:33:47

mail delivery is a natural monopoly.

I do not agree with or accept the

2:33:472:33:52

idea there has to be competition in

mail delivery, we all have one

2:33:522:33:57

letterbox and it's much more

efficient to have one postal

2:33:572:34:00

delivery person coming down the

street rather than different ones

2:34:002:34:05

from competing companies. The idea

of competition in water supply is a

2:34:052:34:10

little odd when only one water pipe

goes to each house. The idea

2:34:102:34:15

competition rules work for the

benefit of all we do not believe to

2:34:152:34:19

be the case and we set out in our

manifesto is received a huge degree

2:34:192:34:23

of support, was public ownership of

water and a meal and train operating

2:34:232:34:28

companies. The point raised by

Channel 4, I set it out in the

2:34:282:34:35

speech, what we want to achieve and

what we will achieve is our right to

2:34:352:34:40

be able to negotiate and consults at

the same time with the EU on the

2:34:402:34:47

sort of trade agreements we make and

also confront them on the sort of

2:34:472:34:50

trade deal made with the rest of the

world. For example, you trade

2:34:502:34:55

agreements have a human rights

clause in them, very seldom

2:34:552:34:59

enforced, they also have what I

hoped would be much stronger clauses

2:34:592:35:06

on workers' rights and opportunities

in third World countries or

2:35:062:35:10

non-European countries from which

gives an important. I would want to

2:35:102:35:15

see those things stronger and we

would be committed to that. Does

2:35:152:35:18

that mean we have to be passive? No,

come we are a large economy and

2:35:182:35:25

important part of the world trade

system and we would negotiate to

2:35:252:35:30

achieve that and Barry has clearly

set the Stoke in many directives in

2:35:302:35:33

Parliament. -- set this out.

That is a strange question because I

2:35:332:35:45

spent a lot of time travelling

around the country doing campaigning

2:35:452:35:50

meetings and the issues are a Brexit

come up all the time and we thought

2:35:502:35:53

it would be helpful to set out our

reviews here today.

2:35:532:36:01

Any more questions? The lady in a

blue dress.

You mentioned about the

2:36:012:36:14

automotive industry in Coventry,

Jaguar Land Rover last week said

2:36:142:36:17

they would suffer dire consequences

from Brexit and thousands losing

2:36:172:36:22

their jobs. What do you say to that

and would Europe plan reassure them

2:36:222:36:27

of those fears? -- and Woods Europe

plan.

2:36:272:36:32

Jeremy Corbyn, you spoke of the need

to maintain a softer border in

2:36:362:36:42

Northern Ireland and you admitted

staying in the customs union would

2:36:422:36:45

only help that game but the EU

repeatedly said the only way to

2:36:452:36:52

guarantee no higher order would

staying in the single market. Are

2:36:522:36:56

you saying they are wrong with that

or would you countenance the idea of

2:36:562:37:01

staying in the single market?

The

gentleman further back with the

2:37:012:37:06

trendy beard.

That was the new

campaign group formed in a few weeks

2:37:062:37:16

ago, a youth campaign group and

their main purpose was to persuade

2:37:162:37:19

you to back a second referendum on a

membership of the EU. You believe in

2:37:192:37:25

the power of grassroots campaigns,

is there any chance they could ever

2:37:252:37:30

change your mind on this?

On the question of jobs in Coventry,

2:37:302:37:38

yes, Coventry is a manufacturing

centre, research Centre and is part

2:37:382:37:43

of the whole West Midlands

industrial strength and clearly that

2:37:432:37:47

relies very heavily on trade with

Europe as this university relies on

2:37:472:37:53

overseas students, not just from

Europe but all over. I want to

2:37:532:37:57

protect those jobs and to ensure the

universities can carry on recruiting

2:37:572:38:04

large numbers of overseas students

and likewise I also want to make

2:38:042:38:08

sure UK students do not go into debt

in order to get an education. Our

2:38:082:38:14

proposals are we have that effective

trading relationship with Europe and

2:38:142:38:17

I think what we have said all to be

good news for people in Coventry and

2:38:172:38:23

in the West Midlands. On the

question of the border with Northern

2:38:232:38:31

Ireland, we are a very, very clear

at the Good Friday Agreement was an

2:38:312:38:37

enormous step forward in which both

traditions in Northern Ireland and

2:38:372:38:41

across the island of Ireland were

respected and that historic movement

2:38:412:38:45

came because of very brave people

being prepared to negotiate it.

2:38:452:38:50

Nobody wants to lose that and every

meeting I have been to in Brussels

2:38:502:38:54

and anywhere else, the border issue

comes up. That means there has to be

2:38:542:39:01

a customs union that guarantees no

border between the Republic of

2:39:012:39:07

Ireland and Northern Ireland. That

is our priority and we have made

2:39:072:39:10

that very clear time and time again.

On the question of decision on the

2:39:102:39:17

outcome, what we pushed for is a

number of red lines in the House of

2:39:172:39:21

Commons, one of which is the points

clear star has made many times,

2:39:212:39:27

there should be a meaningful vote in

Parliament on the final deal, as

2:39:272:39:33

there will be a decision made by the

27 member states in the EU plus the

2:39:332:39:39

European Parliament. There is a lot

of discussion and negotiation to go

2:39:392:39:43

on and we are not doing negotiations

but we are setting out what we would

2:39:432:39:47

do if we were in office. We are not

proposing a second referendum what

2:39:472:39:52

we are proposing is the final

meaningful vote in parliament.

Let

2:39:522:39:56

mix it up, haven't we got any

non-journalists who want to ask a

2:39:562:40:05

question? The lady with the blonde

hair.

I want to say, please, will

2:40:052:40:15

you hurry up and be our Prime

Minister.

2:40:152:40:18

APPLAUSE

.

2:40:182:40:24

We have time for another two

questions. The gentleman there.

2:40:272:40:33

Following on from that, with this

new shift in policy, is it your

2:40:332:40:47

hope, your intention, that Labour

MPs will now be able to join with

2:40:472:40:53

Conservative rebels, defeated the

Government and parliament and maybe

2:40:532:40:56

precipitates an election?

One more

before we go home. I will go for

2:40:562:41:04

that side, gentleman with the

glasses and the beard.

2:41:042:41:10

Thank you. In Coventry we have got

an issue, the police shortage on the

2:41:102:41:17

streets. My war which I represent --

my ward. It is up and down the

2:41:172:41:29

country, police are starved of

resources. There's the possibility

2:41:292:41:32

labour can look into it and make

sure there is adequate policing on

2:41:322:41:37

the streets and no vigilantes on

streets?

2:41:372:41:41

Thanks for the last question, I will

answer the other two. We pledge to

2:41:412:41:47

increase police numbers by 10000 and

10,000 more officers there. I was

2:41:472:41:53

with David Jamieson on Saturday, the

police and crime commission in

2:41:532:41:57

Stourbridge, and we were talking to

police officers and community. They

2:41:572:42:01

are losing their PCS alls, as are

other parts of the country. So that

2:42:012:42:09

sense of cooperation between police

and citizens is lost and police only

2:42:092:42:13

come in when there is a major crime

or dire emergency and that is not a

2:42:132:42:18

good way forward. If we are to deal

with anti-social behaviour,

2:42:182:42:22

low-level abuse, high level abuse,

knife crime and serious issues like

2:42:222:42:27

that, you do not achieve it by

reducing police numbers, you cannot

2:42:272:42:31

solve it all at a computer. It is

only achieved by PSCOs who

2:42:312:42:39

understand the community and are on

the streets. I was in Great Yarmouth

2:42:392:42:43

last week and spent some time

talking to two local police officers

2:42:432:42:47

who had been in the same area for

ten years, they knew everybody in

2:42:472:42:52

the community, they knew all the

strains and stresses and were able

2:42:522:42:55

to relate to that community and the

community related to them. The

2:42:552:43:00

points they made an effort that

makes, if you cut police numbers,

2:43:002:43:04

close youth clubs, this method use

workers, -- this method -- dismiss

2:43:042:43:14

youth workers, is it surprising you

end up with more and more

2:43:142:43:17

anti-social behaviour and more and

more levels of crime: us -- we are

2:43:172:43:24

saying it is a false economy to cut

police numbers and we would invest

2:43:242:43:30

in the community infrastructure

providers. That is why we're the

2:43:302:43:33

local election and why austerity is

so wrong.

2:43:332:43:37

APPLAUSE

Thank you for your question, Andy

2:43:372:43:43

we're putting our views to

Parliament, we are not in a

2:43:432:43:47

majority, we have our results and we

are determined to win the next

2:43:472:43:54

election whenever it comes.

We are fighting to protect jobs,

2:43:542:43:58

protect living standards, consumer

rights, environmental standards and

2:43:582:44:03

above all, the rights people have at

work. I try to set out what I

2:44:032:44:09

believe is the more global view all

our place in the world than that set

2:44:092:44:14

out by the Tories. There is no

future in turning this country into

2:44:142:44:19

a xenophobic offshore island that

sees everybody as a rival. No, we

2:44:192:44:26

are open, multicultural and

multilingual society, let's achieve

2:44:262:44:30

that and also say to people in every

community that a Labour Government

2:44:302:44:36

will not let your industries

disappear and be replaced by nothing

2:44:362:44:41

other than short-term, insecure,

zero-hours contract type work. We

2:44:412:44:47

are serious, very serious about

investing in every community in the

2:44:472:44:51

country. Surely the political class

should learn a lesson from the

2:44:512:44:57

referendum result, that sense of

anger at left behind communities. We

2:44:572:45:02

will not walk by on the other side

and let towns and cities dive for

2:45:022:45:07

the lack of investment, it is our

duty to achieve something very

2:45:072:45:12

different and, yes, we are

campaigning very hard all over the

2:45:122:45:15

country to when local elections and

then a general election when it

2:45:152:45:19

comes and so you will get a Labour

Government that way. Is that OK?

2:45:192:45:23

APPLAUSE

.

2:45:232:45:31

Thank you everybody. Safe journey to

wherever you are heading. Contact

2:45:322:45:41

Victoria is live from a Pupil Referral Unit, which is where children go when they're kicked out of mainstream school or in danger of being kicked out. She sees how pupils are given the help they need to turn their behaviour and lives around. She also meets parents and headteachers who share their experiences.


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