12/03/2018 Victoria Derbyshire


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12/03/2018

Victoria talks to a parent who lost her baby to sudden infant death syndrome and wants to warn other families of the dangers. And tributes are paid to the late Sir Ken Dodd.


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Transcript


LineFromTo

Hello, it's Monday,

it's nine o'clock,

0:00:040:00:05

I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

welcome to the programme.

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The top story today... Tributes are

pouring in for a Sir Ken .com or one

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of the last great musical acts of

his time, who has died at the age of

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90 and will be best remembered for

jokes like this.

Tickled I am by all

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this goodwill. What about you Mrs,

have you been tickled by goodwill?

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Freud said a laugh was a sudden

explosion of psychic energy. The

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trouble with Freud was he never

played second house Friday night at

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Glasgow Empire.

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We'll pay tribute to the man best

known for his tickling stick

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and epic performances.

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Also on the programme -

the Prime Minister will meet

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the National Security Council

to hear the latest intelligence

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on the nerve agent attack

on the Russian father employed

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by Britain as a spy.

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It comes as Salisbury residents

voice concern they're

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being kept in the dark.

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I'd like to know what precautions I

personally can take rather than just

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watching my clothes. What long-term

implications are there to me and my

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wife.

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--?

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We'll get reaction.

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And it has been described as the

worst grooming scandal in the

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country. 1000

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country. 1000 young girls abused in

Telford.

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We bring you details.

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Hello.

Welcome to the programme,

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We're live until 11.

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Throughout the morning,

the latest breaking news

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and developing stories.

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A little later we'll

talk about these

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popular baby sleep products,

which are sold on the high street

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but can pose a risk to babies

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- we'll tell parents

what to look out for.

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We are having that conversation

about 20 minutes to ten.

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And we'll bring you more

on former England

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and Liverpool defender

Jamie Carragher's applogy,

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after a video showed him spitting

towards a 14-year-old girl.

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Do get in touch on all the stories

we're talking about this morning -

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use the hashtag Victoria Live.

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And if you text, you will be charged

at the standard network rate.

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Our top story today -

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Sir Ken Dodd, the much loved

comedian, has died at the age of 90.

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Described by his publicist as "one

of the last Music Hall greats",

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Sir Ken was known for his marathon

stage performances and the creation

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of the Diddy Men and

the tickling stick.

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The performer from Liverpool had

recently spent six weeks in hospital

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with a chest infection.

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On Friday, he married his partner

of 40 years, Anne Jones.

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Caroline Davies looks

back at his life.

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Tickling sticks and Diddy Men -

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Ken Dodd was a variety performer

with a gift for the surreal.

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What a brilliant day for going up

to Count Von Zeppelin

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and saying, "You'll never sell

a sausage that size!"

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And the love of a

catchphrase or three.

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How tickled I am!

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How tickled I am

by all this goodwill.

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What about you, Missus?

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Have you been tickled by goodwill?

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# Knick-knocky, knick-knock,

knick-knocky knick-knack!

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# Knick-knocky, knick-knock,

knicky-knacky-noo!

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Proud of his Merseyside roots,

the coal merchant's son

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from Knotty Ash became

a chart-topping singer, a television

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star, and a ventriloquist.

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Doddy!

Hi-ya, Doddy!

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Although silly on stage,

Dodd was serious about his craft.

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Freud said that a laugh is a sudden

explosion of psychic energy.

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Of course, the trouble with Freud

was he never played second house

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Friday night at Glasglow Empire.

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He still lived in the home he grew

up in, and guarded his

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private life carefully.

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In 1989, that was shattered

when he faced charges

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of massive tax evasion.

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He had 20 offshore bank accounts,

and more than £300,000

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hidden around his house.

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He was acquitted and

continued performing.

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Last year, he was given

a knighthood in recognition

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of his charity and comedy work.

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We shall have one or two

glasses of tickle tonic,

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and then we shall go back

to Knotty Ash up north,

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Knotty Ash on Merseyside,

and I shall see the Diddy Men there,

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so I'll give your regards to them.

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Aged 90, Dodd was recently

hospitalised with a chest infection,

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but he still wanted to go

back on stage.

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I look forward to getting

back to doing my job -

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the only job that I have ever had,

the only job that I know.

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# Happiness, happiness.

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After more than 60 years

of making others laugh,

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it was performing to the British

public that Dodd said

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gave him enormous happiness.

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Happiness!

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And Caroline Davies is here now.

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Caroline, in the final few days

he married his long term partner?

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He did, yes, to his partner of the

40 years, and Jones. She wasn't just

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his partner but one of his

supporting acts. She was a singer

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and dancer. We have heard from his

publicist that apparently after he

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left hospital yesterday she would

like to get married. They had had a

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very Long engagement. That was on

Friday.

So many tributes?

There have

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been many. One was from comedian

Gary Delaney, who made reference to

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the fact that Ken Dodd's show tended

to go on for a while. He said one of

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the great of all time, the funeral

will be held on Wednesday, Thursday,

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Friday and most of Saturday. Dara

O'Briain called him an education to

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watch. Fellow Liverpudlian

remembered him fondly and said your

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city will miss you terribly.

-- Claire Sweeney.

Thank you.

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Joanna Gosling is in

the BBC Newsroom

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with a summary of the rest

of the day's news.

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Good morning.

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The Government's National

Security Council will meet

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today, to discuss the nerve agent

attack in Salisbury of a former

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Russian intelligence

officer and his daughter.

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The group, chaired

by the Prime Minister,

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will be given the latest evidence

and intelligence on the attack,

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before deciding what

action should be taken.

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Yesterday, hundreds of people

who were in the same pub

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and restaurant as the victims

were warned to wash their clothes

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and other belongings they had

on them at the time.

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There are claims that up

to 1,000 children may have

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been abused in the Shropshire town

of Telford over a 40 year period -

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and MPs are now calling

for an inquiry.

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Seven men have already

been convicted,

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but it's thought others

have escaped charges.

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It's thought the unfolding scandal

in Telford could be the worst

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the country has ever seen.

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At least five people were killed

after a helicopter crashed into the

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East River in New York last night.

The pilots -- pilot managed to free

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himself. The helicopter, chartered

for a photo shoot. An investigation

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will be held to determine the cause

of the crash.

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A bitter row has broken out

at the top of the Labour Party,

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with a shadow cabinet minister

being removed from her post,

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apparently against her will.

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The Labour Party says

Debbie Abrahams stepped down

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as the spokeswoman on Work

and Pensions, while what is

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described as an "employment

issue" is investigated.

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But Mrs Abrahams claims she's

the victim of a bullying

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culture in the party.

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Jamie Carragher has apologised,

after a video showed

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the former England and Liverpool

defender spitting at a girl in a car

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The footballer, who's

now a TV pundit,

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had been covering his

former side's 2-1 defeat

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by Manchester United on Saturday.

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Footage has emerged of Mr

Carragher spitting toward

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the vehicle from his own car.

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On Twitter, he said he'd been

provoked, but described his actions

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as "totally out of order"

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Almost two thirds of doctors in some

parts of the UK say they feel

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patient safety has deteriorated over

the past year, according to a new

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report. The Royal College of GPs is

and has found growing pressures on

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NHS staff has led to some concerns

about patient care. Adina Campbell

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reports.

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With the NHS coming out one of the

toughest winters on record, a new

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report by the Royal College of GPs

is and is claims most of care have

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got worse over the past 12 months.

More than 1500 doctors in England,

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Wales and Northern Ireland replied

to the same questions they were

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asked during a similar period a year

ago. 64% said they felt patient care

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had deteriorated. 10% higher than

last year. 93% said they had

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experienced staff shortages, up

again by almost 10%. And 85% said

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they had seen a rising demand for

their service, 7% higher than 12

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months ago. Doctors crying on their

way home or distress calls to older

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patients because of substandard care

were delays in social care, were

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some of the anonymous stories

reported to the Royal College of

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physicians. The government says it

is absolutely committed to making

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the NHS the safest health care

system in the world. With nearly £3

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billion in extra funding allocated

to ordered over the next two years.

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But some doctors say they often feel

they are having to do more for less.

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Senior Conservatives have

criticised an attack made

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by the Liberal Democrat leader,

Sir Vince Cable, on Brexit voters.

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Sir Vince accused them

of being mainly older people,

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who'd blighted the hopes of younger

people because they felt nostalgic

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about the days when Britain's

population was largely white.

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The Communities Secretary,

Sajid Javid, described his

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remarks as disrespectful.

0:09:280:09:36

A police investigation as an honest

after people across the country

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received anti-Muslim letters in the

post. The document caused for --

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calls for a punishing Muslim Day in

October and suggests a number of

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violent acts.

0:09:470:09:48

A council facing financial

problems, has been accused

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of using millions of pounds of money

ring-fenced for public health

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to prop up other services.

0:09:520:09:53

The BBC's Inside Out East

programme has learned

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Northamptonshire County Council

may have to return

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as much as £10 million

to Public Health England.

0:09:580:10:02

The BBC is urging the

United Nations to support

0:10:020:10:04

the staff and families

of its Persian television service,

0:10:040:10:07

which broadcasts from London

into Iran and the region.

0:10:070:10:10

The UN's Human Rights Council

in Geneva will discuss

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a report describing how relatives

of BBC staff in Iran

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have been detained and

subjected to travel bans.

0:10:150:10:21

Future students will be able

to make consumer-style

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comparisons of degree courses

when choosing their university.

0:10:230:10:28

Under government plans,

universities in England would be

0:10:280:10:33

graded on areas such as the chances

of employment, potential

0:10:330:10:34

earnings and drop-out rates.

0:10:340:10:36

The Department for Education says

the new system would expose poor

0:10:360:10:39

teaching and help students get

value for money.

0:10:390:10:42

The annual Crufts dog show had

to be temporarily halted,

0:10:420:10:46

after two protesters

stormed the venue.

0:10:460:10:48

As this year's winner,

a two and a half year old whippet

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called Tease, made her way

to the podium, this happened.

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Two demonstrators from

the animal rights group Peta

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emerged from the audience.

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They were quickly chased down

and subdued by security staff.

0:11:010:11:04

You can see here the quick

reaction of Tease's owner,

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moving him out of harm's way.

No animals or owners were harmed.

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That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

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More at 9.30.

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Thank you.

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Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning.

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You can send us an e-mail and

message was on Facebook.

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Time for sport now with Will

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and let's talk about

the Winter Paralympics

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because Britain's snowboarders have

made their debut but it wasn't

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a great start, was it?

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No, it wasn't the best start. They

have had a nightmare at the Winter

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Paralympics. Temperatures were up at

18 degrees. They have had to

0:11:400:11:49

reschedule some of the events,

especially the events on snow. The

0:11:490:11:53

Snowboard Cross was moved forward as

they tried to get that out of the

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way with better snow in the morning.

It didn't go that way. They have a

0:11:570:12:02

metal release date. James

Barnes-Miller got out. This metal

0:12:020:12:09

gate wasn't working. They stuck a

bungee jump caught on the side. That

0:12:090:12:19

is the snowboarders coming out. This

caused huge delays. It said everyone

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back. We can see Owen Pick, the flag

bearer for a Team GB at the opening

0:12:220:12:29

ceremony. This is him. Losing his

first eliminator in Snowboard Cross.

0:12:290:12:39

All three Britons not making the

semifinal. Owen Pick said the delay

0:12:390:12:46

affected his performance.

There were

talks of the coaches cancelling it

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and doing it another day. It was

like, guys, come on, this is the

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Paralympics. It was tough. It was

really tough. It was a shame that

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today has gone the way it has gone

in general, because we wanted to put

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on a good show.

Not great news. But they will all

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get another chance in the slalom.

Paralympic GB curling team is doing

0:13:120:13:20

pretty well and they have an

interesting fan?

They do. Mr T. He

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is a huge curling fan. He really got

into it during the Winter Olympics

0:13:270:13:31

in February. He has tweeted today,

saying, wheelchair curling...

0:13:310:13:44

He says he has so much respect and a

lot of admiration for the

0:13:480:13:51

paralympian 's. The Paralympics GB

curlers dominated their second game

0:13:510:13:57

of the day against Finland, beating

the 9-2. They were beaten earlier in

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the day by Switzerland. Defeat and

two wins for them. Tomorrow they

0:14:010:14:08

take on Sweden and Canada.

Safe to say Mr T will be watching.

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Thank you.

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Good morning. Welcome.

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There are calls for an inquiry

into child sexual exploitation

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in Telford in Shropshire, where it's

thought up to 1,000 children

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could have been abused

there over a 40-year period.

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The stories we'll hear this

morning are horrific.

0:14:300:14:31

Girls as young

as 11 who were drugged,

0:14:310:14:36

beaten and raped.

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MPs are calling for an inquiry,

with claims the scandal could be

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the worst the country has ever seen.

0:14:400:14:43

To give you a sense of the scale,

Telford has a population of around

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170,000 people - 1,000 of those

young girls - are thought

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to have been abused.

0:14:500:14:52

Sex grooming gangs in Rotherham

are thought to have

0:14:520:14:54

targetted around 1,400.

The population there is 260,000.

0:14:540:15:02

There are also allegations

that the abuse could be linked

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to three murders and two deaths

in the town.

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As with other grooming

scandals, we've seen

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the victims are mainly white,

and the abusers mainly British

0:15:120:15:14

Pakistani or Bangladeshi men.

0:15:140:15:22

Seven men have been convicted,

but it's thought others

0:15:230:15:25

have escaped charges.

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We can speak now to Kathleen

Hallisey, who is a lawyer

0:15:270:15:30

specialising in child abuse.

0:15:300:15:35

Thank you for talking to us.

0:15:350:15:38

You've worked on similar

abuse scandals.

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What do you draw from what we know

of this one?

It's a disgrace and

0:15:420:15:47

essentially it means there's no end

to the sexual abuse scandals we are

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going to see in this country.

Why do

you say that?

Just when we think we

0:15:510:15:57

have reached the tip of the iceberg,

most recently it is football abuse,

0:15:570:16:06

we seem to think that is the end and

it isn't the end and I think we will

0:16:060:16:11

continue to seek more sexual abuse

scandals. -- to see more.

0:16:110:16:19

In your experience, how does

the abuse of so many victims stay

0:16:190:16:22

covered up for so long?

0:16:220:16:24

We see that people in positions of

authority don't take these

0:16:240:16:29

allegations seriously, they blame

the victims and that allows the

0:16:290:16:32

cover-up and the abuse to carry on

for decades.

We have learned so much

0:16:320:16:37

in terms of how victims present.

Presumably in the future those in

0:16:370:16:44

authority would not necessarily

treat alleged victims in similar

0:16:440:16:51

ways to the past?

I hope so, but

looking at information from the

0:16:510:16:56

abuse scandal we have in Telford,

those lessons don't seem to have

0:16:560:17:00

trickled down to social workers and

police. We are talking about very

0:17:000:17:06

recent allegations.

In terms of some

of the men convicted, that was in

0:17:060:17:10

2013, and what is new now is the

scale of abuse in Telford. The

0:17:100:17:19

figures estimate up to 1000 children

could have fallen victim to abuse

0:17:190:17:29

gangs in Telford.

Yes, looking at

people who were unfortunately

0:17:290:17:33

victimised and abuse, they are very

recent allegations.

The local MP

0:17:330:17:42

Lucy Allen says there has to be an

independent inquiry into what's

0:17:420:17:46

happened in Telford, would you agree

with that?

Absolutely, I don't think

0:17:460:17:50

we can end it here. We definitely

need a public inquiry, the victims

0:17:500:17:56

need justice. Many of these victims

will not come forward. Again, I am

0:17:560:18:02

extremely concerned that have been

continued failings by police and

0:18:020:18:05

social workers and I think a broader

inquiry needs to look in depth at

0:18:050:18:09

those issues. We need to be

educating people in positions of

0:18:090:18:13

authority

0:18:130:18:18

authority of how to deal with these

and that victims should not be seen

0:18:190:18:22

as criminals.

I don't mean this

flippantly but why don't people read

0:18:220:18:25

the Rotherham inquiry outcome? The

lessons are there.

Absolutely they

0:18:250:18:30

are there but they don't seem to

have been learned so maybe we need

0:18:300:18:34

another inquiry with more attention

on that inquiry.

OK, thank you for

0:18:340:18:39

talking to us. We will have plenty

more on this story tomorrow on the

0:18:390:18:46

programme.

0:18:460:18:49

The number of rough sleepers

in the UK has more than doubled

0:18:490:18:53

in the last eight years -

in every major British town or city

0:18:530:18:56

you will see someone

sleeping on the streets.

0:18:560:18:58

In London it's estimated that one

in every 59 people is homeless

0:18:580:19:06

or living in inadequate housing

like bed and breakfast,

0:19:060:19:08

rooms or hostels.

0:19:080:19:09

Now one group of homeless people

in London have decided to take

0:19:090:19:13

matters into their own hands.

0:19:130:19:18

They've taken over

an empty four-storey

0:19:180:19:20

building in the heart

of the capital's West End and say

0:19:200:19:22

anyone without a home is welcome.

0:19:220:19:24

On Wednesday the group,

calling themselves

0:19:240:19:26

the Sofia Solidarity Centre,

will go to court to fight

0:19:260:19:28

a possession order from

the landlord in a bid to stay.

0:19:280:19:31

We gained access to the building

and spoke to some of the volunteers

0:19:310:19:34

and people living there.

0:19:340:19:37

Heavy snowfall has hit

many parts of the UK,

0:19:400:19:42

with the south east and north-east

of England seeing up

0:19:420:19:45

to 13 centimetres of snow

and temperatures of minus 12.

0:19:450:19:48

For people living on the streets,

these conditions are treacherous.

0:19:480:19:53

You see it in doorways.

0:19:530:19:54

People just look at

you like you're scum.

0:19:540:19:59

You're stuck in a position

where you're going to be lost

0:19:590:20:02

in the system for a very long time.

0:20:020:20:08

During the cold weather, it became

apparent that people are dying.

0:20:120:20:17

We had to do something about it,

so an empty building was found

0:20:170:20:22

and it now has 100 or more

residents, who are eating, sleeping

0:20:220:20:25

and being comfortable and not dying.

0:20:250:20:29

We're kind of happy with that.

0:20:290:20:37

OK, so when we have

somebody new come in,

0:20:410:20:43

they come in the front door,

they'll be greeted here.

0:20:430:20:46

We'll ask them what they need, how

they are, what their priority is,

0:20:460:20:51

whether they want to go straight

to sleep, to eat, and we have

0:20:510:20:54

the kitchen down the end there.

0:20:540:20:57

We can provide and are providing

hot, nutritious food all the time.

0:20:570:21:00

There's tea and coffee,

some medical supplies,

0:21:000:21:03

and we have people who know how

to look after people.

0:21:030:21:07

So if somebody needs

some attention to wounds

0:21:070:21:09

or infections, we can do that.

0:21:090:21:11

We have been donated a huge amount

of clothing, bedding,

0:21:110:21:14

so whatever the people need

and whatever their priorities are,

0:21:140:21:17

we can look after them.

0:21:170:21:25

We've got sleeping areas

on the ground floor here

0:21:250:21:27

and on the first floor.

0:21:270:21:33

There was electricity

already in the building,

0:21:330:21:35

and the water was already on.

0:21:350:21:37

We just tidied up the plumbing

where there were leaks and stuff,

0:21:370:21:40

made sure everything

is safe and secure.

0:21:400:21:41

We have qualified

electricians helping us.

0:21:410:21:43

I'm a plumber-builder as well, so...

0:21:430:21:44

We do safety checks every day,

make sure there's nothing dangerous,

0:21:440:21:47

no cables to trip over,

everything's lit properly,

0:21:470:21:49

so people don't...

0:21:490:21:50

Yeah, we're keeping people safe.

0:21:500:21:51

Do you worry that you might attract

the wrong kind of attention

0:21:510:21:54

and people that don't necessarily

need help might come here?

0:21:540:21:57

It becomes quite obvious very

quickly and, yes, it may happen.

0:21:570:22:03

But that, as a percentage

of the whole of what we're doing,

0:22:030:22:06

I think it's worth it.

0:22:060:22:08

Some people might argue that

you guys aren't able to give

0:22:080:22:11

the support that a lot of the people

coming through the doors

0:22:110:22:18

need that a shelter,

a regular shelter, might be able to.

0:22:180:22:22

I'll counter that with the fact that

a lot of people who are supposedly

0:22:220:22:25

psychologists and mental health

workers have learnt it from a book.

0:22:250:22:31

We've all learned it the hard way

and we can actually give more

0:22:310:22:34

support because we've all been

down the road.

0:22:340:22:36

If any person comes

in with a particular issue,

0:22:360:22:39

there is someone here who has

already been through that issue.

0:22:390:22:43

We can actually guide people

through our own experiences,

0:22:430:22:45

empathy and listening,

so we're actually better qualified

0:22:450:22:47

than most people who are qualified.

0:22:470:22:52

What about others who might say that

you've got no business being here,

0:22:520:22:55

you don't own the building,

that you're not paying

0:22:550:22:57

rent for the building.

0:22:570:22:58

What would you say to that?

0:22:580:23:02

Our brothers and sisters

have no business being

0:23:020:23:04

on the street, freezing, dying.

0:23:040:23:07

And there are ten empty

commercial buildings for every

0:23:070:23:09

person that is registered

as street sleeping.

0:23:090:23:15

Ten empty commercial buildings

for every person who is registered

0:23:150:23:17

as sleeping on the streets.

0:23:170:23:19

I'm sorry.

0:23:190:23:20

What business model is that?

0:23:200:23:23

So, yeah, no business being here,

with 100 people here, eating,

0:23:230:23:25

sleeping, comfortably?

0:23:250:23:28

We're saving lives here.

0:23:280:23:31

I'm sorry.

0:23:310:23:32

Property?

0:23:320:23:36

I have disregard for that.

0:23:360:23:38

When the building's been empty 15

years and we can save lives with it,

0:23:380:23:41

it's our moral duty

to save those lives.

0:23:410:23:46

I left home at 15 years of age.

0:23:460:23:48

I started going into

the hostel system.

0:23:480:23:51

There was a big battle

because of social services and,

0:23:510:23:53

like, a lot of things happened

in a short amount of time.

0:23:530:23:58

And I've been homeless recently due

to having a lot going on in my life.

0:23:580:24:02

There was no help being given.

0:24:020:24:03

There was nothing available.

0:24:030:24:06

No services wanted to, obviously,

understand or were willing to help,

0:24:060:24:10

so I had no choice but to have

nowhere to go, because there

0:24:100:24:13

is nowhere for us to go.

0:24:130:24:16

I mean, it is hard out there.

0:24:160:24:19

People are breaking down as it is,

with other problems in life.

0:24:190:24:25

Having to worry about this as one

for a long time is just even more

0:24:250:24:30

worse and there is no way that...

0:24:300:24:32

No way of them helping me out.

0:24:320:24:34

They would put me in

shelters and nowadays,

0:24:340:24:36

not any help for shelters.

0:24:360:24:39

So I found, like, a link

to the squat and now I'm

0:24:390:24:42

in a squat situation.

0:24:420:24:44

Like, I have a lot of issues.

0:24:440:24:46

I have a daughter that

I don't get to see.

0:24:460:24:50

I don't get to see

none of my family.

0:24:500:24:57

When you are this low in life, like,

you take everything for how

0:24:570:25:00

it is and you appreciate it

a lot more.

0:25:000:25:02

How does it feel to not

have a permanent home?

0:25:020:25:05

It destroys your brain.

0:25:050:25:08

Yeah, man.

0:25:080:25:09

It makes you think a lot.

0:25:090:25:10

You start, like, deteriorating

inside and, yeah, you start

0:25:100:25:13

breaking down slowly.

0:25:130:25:14

There's not a lot

you can do, really.

0:25:140:25:16

You are stuck in a position

where you are going to be lost

0:25:160:25:19

in the system for a very long time.

0:25:190:25:21

I mean, right now I'm doing

three days' work a week,

0:25:210:25:24

which ain't a lot but I'm

doing my best to save money

0:25:240:25:27

for a deposit to get my own place

and move on with my own life

0:25:270:25:30

but it's very hard.

0:25:300:25:32

I was just on my way to work

and then I see you lot and I had

0:25:320:25:36

a phone call from my boss just,

like, two minutes ago,

0:25:360:25:39

and he's saying there's no work

available and so now I've got

0:25:390:25:43

to stress about whether I'm even

able to work tomorrow

0:25:430:25:44

or throughout the week.

0:25:440:25:46

A lot of people wouldn't want to go

down the official channels

0:25:460:25:49

for various reasons.

0:25:490:25:51

Some have maybe run away

from home or social care.

0:25:510:25:57

Some are avoiding

being part of the...

0:25:570:25:59

They don't want to be recognised.

0:25:590:26:01

Here, no human is illegal.

0:26:010:26:03

If you need food, you need

shelter, we have it.

0:26:030:26:07

And we're dealing with people

who can be very vulnerable,

0:26:070:26:11

very frightened, sometimes quite

aggressive, because fear

0:26:110:26:13

creates aggression.

0:26:130:26:17

Everyone on the team

knows what it's like.

0:26:170:26:20

We all have some experience,

some of us with mental health

0:26:200:26:23

issues, homelessness.

0:26:230:26:27

We're all able to see,

when somebody comes in,

0:26:270:26:29

who they might relate to best.

0:26:290:26:32

I will see someone come in,

I will pick up on something,

0:26:320:26:35

you know, and go, "Oh,

I see myself, I see my

0:26:350:26:38

story, in that person".

0:26:380:26:45

And this is where us,

sitting round as we do,

0:26:450:26:48

socialising, gets people

to relax, unwind, unburden.

0:26:480:26:50

So there's a lot of,

I wouldn't say counselling,

0:26:500:26:52

but camaraderie, empathy,

and the shedding of

0:26:520:26:54

the weight and baggage.

0:26:540:26:56

It is perfectly legal in the sense

that if you find an empty building,

0:26:560:27:00

an empty commercial building,

and you can get in without doing any

0:27:000:27:03

damage, which happened,

you can use this space as your home

0:27:030:27:07

until such time as a repossession

order, an order possession,

0:27:070:27:09

is obtained by the owners.

0:27:090:27:12

It is a legal thing.

0:27:120:27:14

It is lawful.

0:27:140:27:16

This place has saved my life

and the community spirit

0:27:160:27:18

in there is wonderful.

0:27:180:27:20

Everybody is so helpful,

it is unbelievable.

0:27:200:27:22

It is like Xanadu.

0:27:220:27:23

I've been on the

streets three weeks.

0:27:230:27:25

I was a subletting a flat

and the landlord just

0:27:250:27:28

threw me out, no warning.

0:27:280:27:31

Threw us out, no warning at all.

0:27:310:27:32

Turned up with three of his mates.

0:27:320:27:34

Threw us out.

0:27:340:27:38

Not a lot of people are willing

to be understanding.

0:27:380:27:41

There's not a lot of

people out there that

0:27:410:27:43

actually want to help or...

0:27:430:27:45

Everyone is just, like,

in London in general,

0:27:450:27:47

everyone's worried about themselves,

about their own life.

0:27:470:27:50

I mean, that's cool,

but you've got to be understanding

0:27:500:27:52

about others as well.

0:27:520:27:53

You feel like a

second-class citizen.

0:27:530:27:55

You just feel worthless.

0:27:550:27:56

Your self-confidence and everything

just sinks down to nothing.

0:27:560:28:01

You are sitting in doorways

and people just look

0:28:010:28:03

at you like you are scum.

0:28:030:28:04

You know what I mean?

0:28:040:28:06

I'm not.

0:28:060:28:07

I've worked all my life.

0:28:070:28:08

You know what I mean?

0:28:080:28:10

And that's what it

makes you feel like.

0:28:100:28:12

It makes you feel like scum.

0:28:120:28:14

I'm young.

0:28:140:28:15

There's a lot of things I'm

still understanding till now,

0:28:150:28:18

at my age, and it's a lot harder

for me to understand them

0:28:180:28:21

things when I've got this

going on in my life.

0:28:210:28:23

We're not doing any

harm in that place.

0:28:230:28:26

I've fixed the toilets,

I've fixed the basins.

0:28:260:28:28

I clean the stairs,

I clean the toilets.

0:28:280:28:30

Everyone mucks in.

0:28:300:28:31

It's sanitary, you know?

0:28:310:28:35

To see them wake up having

had their first decent

0:28:350:28:39

night's sleep for months,

and to see the difference in them,

0:28:390:28:46

their weight fall off them, it's...

0:28:460:28:48

It is a passion for life,

for humanity, for our

0:28:480:28:51

brothers and sisters.

0:28:510:28:52

We couldn't leave them out there,

so we had to do this.

0:28:520:28:55

Now, it's a shameful situation

when we have to do this.

0:28:550:29:02

Rough sleeping in England

has increased for the

0:29:050:29:07

seventh year in a row.

0:29:070:29:09

There were 4751 people counted

or estimated to be bedding down

0:29:090:29:13

outside in autumn 2017.

0:29:130:29:18

That's a 15% rise on a year before.

0:29:180:29:23

The figures provide a snapshot

of rough sleeping on a typical

0:29:230:29:26

night, and shows about a quarter

were in London.

0:29:260:29:29

The Government says it is investing

£1 billion to tackle rough sleeping.

0:29:290:29:37

Without an address, finding

work is very difficult.

0:29:370:29:40

Without a change of clothes,

finding work is very difficult.

0:29:400:29:42

Without the sleep...

0:29:420:29:44

Because sleep deprivation

is one of the major

0:29:440:29:46

problems of being homeless.

0:29:460:29:48

You might see people bedding down

in cardboard boxes in the doorway.

0:29:480:29:51

Are they really asleep?

0:29:510:29:53

Is that real rest?

0:29:530:29:56

A lot of them are sleeping with one

eye open because of the amount

0:29:560:30:00

of times that people

are attacked, abused.

0:30:000:30:02

So is that rest?

0:30:020:30:06

Here, they're getting

a good night's sleep

0:30:060:30:08

and you can see the difference.

0:30:080:30:11

Steve, why is it you do what you do?

0:30:110:30:13

Because I know what it's like.

0:30:130:30:15

I know every person in here has

a very, very unique story.

0:30:150:30:20

Everyone's different, and everyone

needs a different approach.

0:30:200:30:24

So, why do I do what I do?

0:30:240:30:26

It makes a difference.

0:30:260:30:34

Westminster Council told us

they have "well-established routes

0:30:530:30:55

to help people who may be sleeping

rough or homeless via Streetlink.

0:30:550:31:01

Over 400 bed spaces are available

each night to help people"

0:31:010:31:09

Your messages on this. This of your

says, totally agree with what has

0:31:100:31:16

been said about whether the people

who are helping homeless people are

0:31:160:31:19

qualified to do so. There is no one

better equipped to help understand

0:31:190:31:24

that people with the same extremes.

Stevie says, what I am seeing right

0:31:240:31:29

now about people being empowered to

take over empty buildings and use

0:31:290:31:32

them for the homeless is amazing.

Cancels all over the UK should take

0:31:320:31:36

note. Cancels all had empty

buildings that can help people. Neil

0:31:360:31:42

says building -- breaking the law is

not the way to do with this issue.

0:31:420:31:47

And Paul says, completely agree with

the homeless squatters. If buildings

0:31:470:31:50

are empty for years, it should be

made legal to take possession.

0:31:500:31:55

Councils should be doing it. Thank

you.

0:31:550:31:57

Still to come...

0:31:570:32:02

A row has broken out at the top of

the Labour Party as one of Jeremy

0:32:020:32:06

Corbyn's top team says she has been

removed from her post against her

0:32:060:32:08

will. More shortly.

0:32:080:32:16

will. More shortly. And a charity is

warning that these do not meet sleep

0:32:160:32:20

safety guidelines and could increase

the risk of cot death.

0:32:200:32:24

Time for the latest news -

here's Joanna Gosling.

0:32:240:32:26

The BBC News headlines this morning:

0:32:260:32:28

Hello again.

0:32:280:32:34

The comedian Sir Ken Dodd has

died at the age of 90.

0:32:340:32:42

# Happiness, happiness...

0:32:420:32:46

Described by his publicist as "one

0:32:460:32:48

of the last music hall greats,"

Sir Ken was known for his

0:32:480:32:51

marathon stage performances

and the creation of the 'Diddy Men'

0:32:510:32:53

and the 'tickling stick'.

0:32:530:32:54

The Government's National

Security Council will meet

0:32:550:32:58

today, to discuss the nerve agent

attack in Salisbury of a former

0:32:580:33:01

Russian intelligence

officer and his daughter.

0:33:010:33:03

The group, chaired

by the Prime Minister,

0:33:030:33:05

will be given the latest evidence

and intelligence on the attack,

0:33:050:33:07

before deciding what

action should be taken.

0:33:070:33:09

Yesterday, hundreds of people

who were in the same pub

0:33:090:33:14

and restaurant as the victims

were warned to wash their clothes

0:33:140:33:16

and other belongings they had

on them at the time.

0:33:160:33:24

A plane has crashed at Kathmandu

International airport in Nepal. It

0:33:240:33:29

crashed on the side of the runway,

according to the Kathmandu Post. An

0:33:290:33:33

airline spokesman said dazzled his

were expected. A bitter row has

0:33:330:33:39

broken out of the top of the Labour

Party, with a Shadow Cabinet

0:33:390:33:42

minister being removed from her

post, friendly against her will.

0:33:420:33:51

post, friendly against her will. The

Labour Party says Debbie Abrahams

0:33:510:33:53

stepped down as spokesperson on work

campaigns and is. She says she is

0:33:530:33:57

the victim of a bullying culture in

the party.

0:33:570:34:03

At least five people

were killed after a helicopter

0:34:030:34:05

crashed into the East River

in New York last night.

0:34:050:34:07

The pilot managed to free

himself and was rescued

0:34:070:34:09

by a passing tugboat.

0:34:090:34:10

The helicopter, which had been

chartered for a photo shoot,

0:34:100:34:13

crashed near Roosevelt Island.

0:34:130:34:14

An investigation will be held

to determine the cause of the crash.

0:34:140:34:17

There are claims that up

to 1,000 children may have

0:34:170:34:19

been abused in the Shropshire town

of Telford over a 40 year period.

0:34:190:34:22

MPs are now calling for an inquiry.

0:34:220:34:27

Seven men have already been

convicted, but it is thought others

0:34:270:34:30

have escaped charges. It is thought

the unfolding scandal could be the

0:34:300:34:34

worst the country has ever seen.

0:34:340:34:35

Jamie Carragher has apologised

after a video showed

0:34:350:34:37

the former England

and Liverpool defender

0:34:370:34:38

spitting at a girl in a car.

0:34:380:34:40

The footballer, who's

now a TV pundit,

0:34:400:34:42

had been covering his

former side's 2-1 defeat

0:34:420:34:44

by Manchester United on Saturday.

0:34:440:34:47

Footage has emerged of Mr

Carragher spitting toward

0:34:470:34:49

the vehicle from his own car.

0:34:490:34:50

On Twitter, he said he'd been

provoked, but described his actions

0:34:500:34:53

as "totally out of order".

0:34:530:34:56

A police investigation has been

launched after people

0:34:560:34:58

across the country received

anti-muslim letters in the post.

0:34:580:35:02

The document calls for a "Punish

a Muslim" day in April

0:35:020:35:05

and suggests a number of violent

acts

0:35:050:35:07

That's a summary

of the latest BBC News.

0:35:070:35:13

Thank you very much. Some more

messages from you about the homeless

0:35:130:35:16

film that we just showed, where some

people took over an empty building

0:35:160:35:21

in the West End, in the heart of the

capital. Debra says, well done for

0:35:210:35:26

that brave man standing up against

homelessness. If I had a spare home

0:35:260:35:31

were empty building I would give it

to them. Are we still the sixth

0:35:310:35:34

richest country in the world? We

must win support for this movement

0:35:340:35:38

because surely it can lead to real

sustained change for the better.

0:35:380:35:41

Fiona says what they are doing is

wonderful. Why can't more of these

0:35:410:35:46

empty buildings be utilised? Lee

says, what a marvellous scheme of

0:35:460:35:51

self-help, a sure sign of government

failure. The authorities don't care

0:35:510:35:55

about single men and they find it

hard to get housed, whilst wealthy,

0:35:550:35:59

greedy landowners sit on empty

buildings to make more profit. I

0:35:590:36:02

hope they win a landmark case.

Something has to be done to help

0:36:020:36:06

them. These are genuine people in

need of help.

0:36:060:36:08

Now the sport. It has not been a

great day for Britain at the Winter

0:36:080:36:14

Paralympics. James Barnes-Miller,

Ben Moore and Owen Pick have all

0:36:140:36:16

been knocked out of the Snowboard

Cross. Pick went out in the first

0:36:160:36:21

eliminator after the metal start

gate broke this morning, which meant

0:36:210:36:23

they had to use a piece of rope to

ensure the athlete started at the

0:36:230:36:27

same time. Harry Kane will have a

scan on his ankle today after he was

0:36:270:36:32

injured during their 4-1 win over

Bournemouth. They move into third in

0:36:320:36:37

the Premier League. There was a

brilliant old firm derby in the

0:36:370:36:41

Scottish premiership. Rangers went

ahead after three minutes. 2-2 at

0:36:410:36:45

half-time before Celtic snatched

victory through Odsonne Edouard. And

0:36:450:36:51

Tiger Woods came so close to winning

his first title in more than four

0:36:510:36:54

years. He needed to sink this putt

but ended up finishing one shot

0:36:540:37:00

behind Paul Casey at the Valspar

Championship.

0:37:000:37:03

A row has broken out at the top

of the Labour Party, as one

0:37:030:37:07

of Jeremy Corbyn's top team says

she's been removed from her

0:37:070:37:09

post against her will.

0:37:090:37:10

On Sunday, Labour said

Debbie Abrahams MP had stepped down

0:37:100:37:13

as spokeswoman on Work and Pensions

while an "employment

0:37:130:37:16

issue" is investigated.

0:37:160:37:19

But she claims she is the victim

of a "bullying culture

0:37:190:37:22

of the worst kind".

0:37:220:37:29

Ben Wright joins me now. What is

going on?

It is an extraordinary

0:37:290:37:35

row. Interrupted pretty late

yesterday evening, when the Labour

0:37:350:37:40

Party issued a short statement

saying Debbie Abrahams has stepped

0:37:400:37:43

aside while these employment issues

are being investigated. I understand

0:37:430:37:47

they concerned a number of

complaints around the issue of

0:37:470:37:51

bullying. And that this now will be

investigated by the party itself,

0:37:510:37:56

not just the whips to enforce

discipline at the House of Commons.

0:37:560:38:00

Almost as soon as that statement had

been put out, Debbie Abrahams hit

0:38:000:38:05

back with a blistering attack on

Jeremy Corbyn's office, saying the

0:38:050:38:09

treatment she has experienced by

certain individuals in the leader's

0:38:090:38:14

office has been aggressive,

intimidating and wholly

0:38:140:38:17

unprofessional. She says the

treatment has shown a bullying

0:38:170:38:20

culture of the worst kind, and she

is now making a formal complaint to

0:38:200:38:24

the Labour Party and to the

Parliamentary authority. An

0:38:240:38:29

extraordinary war of words. Debbie

Abrahams has been in the leader's

0:38:290:38:32

team since Jeremy Corbyn took the

top job. She has been Shadow Work

0:38:320:38:37

and Pensions Secretary. She is in

the inner circle. They have

0:38:370:38:40

obviously had a colossal falling

out. Debbie Abrahams completely

0:38:400:38:44

denies the allegations against her,

saying she has completely not been

0:38:440:38:50

bullying her staff.

The allegation

is she has been bullying people, and

0:38:500:38:53

now she says she has been bullied by

the top people in Labour?

Yes. I

0:38:530:39:00

understand there was a meeting on

Friday between Debbie Abrahams and

0:39:000:39:03

people from Jeremy Corbyn's office,

where this was discussed. During the

0:39:030:39:08

course of the weekend, both sides

are worked out what should happen

0:39:080:39:11

next. Clearly it is the hope of the

Labour Party that Debbie Abrahams

0:39:110:39:16

would step aside sort of quietly and

allow the investigation to happen.

0:39:160:39:19

For whatever reason, the manner in

which that conversation happened and

0:39:190:39:24

the action decided, clearly upset

Debbie Abrahams. She feels she has

0:39:240:39:27

been treated unjustly and this has

exploded. It is in the context of

0:39:270:39:33

rumbling, deep concerns at

Westminster, about a culture of

0:39:330:39:37

harassment, bullying more broadly

over the last few months. It has

0:39:370:39:41

produced a quickly put together new

code of conduct which the government

0:39:410:39:44

announced last month, which will

come into effect shortly. This is a

0:39:440:39:49

very pertinent issue right now in

Westminster. Labour clearly feel

0:39:490:39:54

they have acted appropriately.

We asked Debbie Abrahams to come

0:39:540:39:58

onto the programme. She declined to

do so. She said she put a statement

0:39:580:40:03

out and she wants to leave it there.

I want to this tweet. This is from a

0:40:030:40:10

woman called Sarah Louise. She says,

Debbie Abrahams, one of the few

0:40:100:40:15

reasonable and nice Labour MPs,

struggling to justify Labour's

0:40:150:40:19

destructive direction. What might

that mean?

I'm not sure what that

0:40:190:40:28

means, to be honest. She has been, I

think, pretty harmonious member of

0:40:280:40:37

the top team. She had a grilling on

the Labour Party's Brexit policy on

0:40:370:40:46

the Andrew Marr Show the other day.

This is quite a surprise. What I

0:40:460:40:51

find so surprising is the vehemence

and the strength of Debbie Abrahams'

0:40:510:40:55

own rebuttal and how the Labour

Party has treated her.

0:40:550:41:00

Thank you very much, Ben.

0:41:000:41:03

Many popular sleeping products

for babies don't meet safer sleep

0:41:030:41:05

guidelines, and could increase

the risk of cot death

0:41:050:41:07

or Sudden Infant Death Syndrome,

a baby charity is warning.

0:41:070:41:10

Items such as cushioned

sleeping pods,

0:41:100:41:13

nests, baby hammocks,

cot bumpers, pillows,

0:41:130:41:19

duvets and anything that wedges

or straps a baby in place, can pose

0:41:190:41:23

a risk to children under 12 months.

0:41:230:41:27

The Lullaby Trust says at the moment

there are no safety standards

0:41:270:41:30

which relate specifically

to Sudden Infant Death

0:41:300:41:32

Syndrome, which can make

it difficult for parents to know

0:41:320:41:35

which products are safe to use.

0:41:350:41:39

We've got some examples

in the studio of the many different

0:41:390:41:42

kinds of sleep pods and nests

available to buy, and we've

0:41:420:41:45

also got examples of

what meets safety guidelines.

0:41:450:41:48

Let's speak to Francine

Bates, chief executive

0:41:480:41:54

of the Lullaby Trust.

0:41:540:42:01

To Rupal Kantaria, who lost her baby

to Sudden Infant Death

0:42:010:42:04

Syndrome, and is working

with the Lullaby Trust to warn other

0:42:040:42:06

parents of the dangers.

0:42:060:42:07

And we also have Jayde Edwards,

who slept with her baby

0:42:070:42:10

on the sofa when he was born,

and now works to educate other young

0:42:100:42:13

parents about better sleeping

practices with their children.

0:42:130:42:15

Thank you for coming on the

programme. Francine, let's look at

0:42:150:42:17

some of these products and tell us

which meet safety guidelines and

0:42:170:42:20

which don't.

OK. We have got a Moses

basket. This absolutely does meet

0:42:200:42:26

the safety guidelines in terms of

savers sleep. We have got a firm,

0:42:260:42:31

flat mattress. It is waterproof.

This is portable. You can carry it

0:42:310:42:37

around the house with you. And

always keep an eye Macron the baby.

0:42:370:42:42

We recommend a cot or a Moses basket

to sleep a baby safely. This is

0:42:420:42:49

good. You have to be careful about

soft bedding. Duvas and pillows

0:42:490:42:55

Arieh no no. We advised to use a

sleeping bag. Put the baby in the

0:42:550:43:02

sleeping bag in the Moses basket or

the card. And you will undoubtedly

0:43:020:43:07

reduce the risk of Sudden Infant

Death Syndrome.

0:43:070:43:14

Death Syndrome.

Obviously, the baby

neatly slots in there. I can't do it

0:43:140:43:18

now because the zip is broken! Oh,

it is there! When it is zipped up,

0:43:180:43:24

the baby's head cannot be covered?

Absolutely. It is designed so the

0:43:240:43:29

sleeping bag fits over the

shoulders. It can never go over the

0:43:290:43:33

baby's head, which is key. The other

products we are not so keen on. As

0:43:330:43:40

you can see, they are much softer.

They have raised padded cushion and

0:43:400:43:46

sides. The big concern here is that

this will increase a baby's risk.

0:43:460:43:58

Primarily to do with overheating. On

a flat surface, a baby will not

0:43:580:44:03

overheat. But on a soft surface,

there is a risk the baby could

0:44:030:44:09

overheat. And of course overheating

is a risk. We are also concerned

0:44:090:44:20

about the pads. Even small babies,

as you know, can wiggle and move.

0:44:200:44:24

They can turn their heads, they can

squished their face against this

0:44:240:44:29

padded surface. And they may not be

able to move back. The other issue

0:44:290:44:36

we are concerned about is they can

actually put their heads over the

0:44:360:44:42

sides.

0:44:420:44:50

sides. We do not recommend these

products.

OK. But if you are a new

0:44:500:44:56

parent, you would not necessarily

know that this is not recommended by

0:44:560:45:00

you?

I think that's true. We have

become very much aware from parents

0:45:000:45:05

calling the helpline every day, that

these products are becoming much

0:45:050:45:08

more popular. In fact, we did a

survey and it was clear that 40% of

0:45:080:45:14

parents were either thinking of, had

bought, one of these products. That

0:45:140:45:19

gave it a lot of concern to us

because they don't conform to safer

0:45:190:45:22

sleep guidelines. So we produced a

guide. We produced a brochure in

0:45:220:45:28

conjunction with the leading

paediatricians, researchers and

0:45:280:45:33

Public Health England, which sets

out safer sleep advice, what to look

0:45:330:45:37

for in products, and to give

information about the risks

0:45:370:45:43

associated, not just with these

products, but also hammocks, Duvas,

0:45:430:45:49

pillows, these things should not be

used near a baby.

0:45:490:45:56

Thank you for coming on the

programme. Your baby boy was found

0:45:560:46:01

not breathing and an inquest said it

was sudden infant death syndrome.

0:46:010:46:10

What did you take from that in terms

of when you had another child?

I had

0:46:100:46:17

my third child in 2014 and these

nests and pods have risen in

0:46:170:46:29

popularity. I still bought something

very similar to this for my child

0:46:290:46:38

now it was almost four to sleep in

because it was not clear to me that

0:46:380:46:41

it didn't comply with safer sleep

guidelines. All of my friends use

0:46:410:46:47

this sort of product because again I

think there's huge confusion out

0:46:470:46:51

there amongst mothers and parents as

to what and what doesn't comply,

0:46:510:46:58

particularly because these products

are fairly new. That is something I

0:46:580:47:02

feel strongly to make sure parents

are making an informed choice and I

0:47:020:47:06

don't think that's happening

currently.

When you said you were

0:47:060:47:09

looking at this kind of stuff and

buying it, it wasn't clear whether

0:47:090:47:13

it met these guidelines, were you

actually looking for some kind of

0:47:130:47:18

recommendation or guidelines or just

thinking, what can the possible harm

0:47:180:47:24

be?

The fact it was available from a

trusted retailer in the UK on the

0:47:240:47:32

high street, I wrongly assumed it

must comply with all of the

0:47:320:47:35

guidelines out there, not only the

British safety standards but also

0:47:350:47:39

safer sleep guidelines because

otherwise how could it possibly of

0:47:390:47:42

the available in a trusted retailer?

I wasn't buying it second hand from

0:47:420:47:47

an internet site from another

country so that was my assumption.

0:47:470:47:50

Then on top of that, all of these

mothers out there are saying how

0:47:500:47:56

fantastic they are because their

babies sleep better in them. I have

0:47:560:48:00

no comment on that but we need to

separate out the marketing and

0:48:000:48:04

parental opinion from the research

and science, such that mothers and

0:48:040:48:09

parents can make their own informed

decisions.

Jade, how are you?

Fine,

0:48:090:48:18

thank you.

You are only 18, still

incredibly young, were you aware of

0:48:180:48:26

safety guidelines?

Not at all, you

would assume there would be more

0:48:260:48:30

initiatives involved to make sure me

as a young parent provides the best

0:48:300:48:35

safety for my child but I have no

idea about safer sleep, let alone

0:48:350:48:40

how to place a child down. A year

and a half later, getting involved

0:48:400:48:47

with the Lullaby Trust and getting

involved in information that was

0:48:470:48:53

shocking, because a lot of the

information was provided for

0:48:530:48:56

children under the age of one, my

child was a year and a half so I

0:48:560:49:02

feel like what a lot of young

parents or organisations would think

0:49:020:49:07

is, if it's a young parent maybe

they need much more care or a lot

0:49:070:49:12

more. In reality it is just sitting

down with us and saying this is how

0:49:120:49:18

you place a baby. My main job I

would say is to ensure every young

0:49:180:49:23

parent that I do get in contact with

could have been all around London

0:49:230:49:28

with the Lullaby Trust explaining to

them you are no better or worse than

0:49:280:49:32

a parent who is 35, it's just

ensuring you know how to put your

0:49:320:49:37

baby to sleep because all it takes

is for you to sleep on a sofa or a

0:49:370:49:42

bed with your child which I did from

the age of newborn to be honest so I

0:49:420:49:46

feel what the Lullaby Trust is doing

is really good.

Explain why it's not

0:49:460:49:51

advised to sleep with a newborn

either in your bed or on the sofa.

I

0:49:510:49:57

think for numerous reasons, and a

lot of times as a young parent I

0:49:570:50:03

study, I also work, I'm trying to

build a career, your sleeping on a

0:50:030:50:07

bed with your child, you could

potentially roll over, you could not

0:50:070:50:12

realise your child is there and

that's not to say you are bad parent

0:50:120:50:18

but you get exhausted.

Old parents

get exhausted too!

I look back and

0:50:180:50:32

think what if something went wrong

but there are numerous things that

0:50:320:50:35

can happen if you do that.

And the

biggest

0:50:350:50:42

biggest risk, Francine, is

suffocation.

We don't know exactly

0:50:420:50:48

why Sids happens, but the risk is 50

times greater so it is extremely

0:50:480:50:55

dangerous. With these new products

on the market, there is concerned

0:50:550:51:02

they could the risk for Sids. These

products do not have a British

0:51:020:51:09

standard.

What does that mean, what

does it look like?

The symbol will

0:51:090:51:15

be on the packaging of any product

on the market.

And that means it's

0:51:150:51:22

OK?

It means it complies with

certain standards so it is well

0:51:220:51:27

constructed, the chemicals that have

been used in the products are safe,

0:51:270:51:30

it complies with fire regulations.

The Moses basket has a British

0:51:300:51:36

standard. The sleep bag has a

British standard, the pods, the

0:51:360:51:43

nests and the hammock do not. We

would say to parents to only buy

0:51:430:51:48

products where there is a British

standard, make sure the surface your

0:51:480:51:51

baby will sleep on is flat and is

waterproof and firm, and ensure you

0:51:510:52:00

place your baby on its back which is

the biggest, strongest factor in

0:52:000:52:04

terms of reducing Sids.

I appreciate

that parents are exhausted and

0:52:040:52:13

sometimes people say my baby sleeps

better on its tummy so I'm going to

0:52:130:52:17

put baby on its tummy and I think

that's just understanding it is an

0:52:170:52:21

informed risk you are taking if you

choose to do those things, which I

0:52:210:52:26

think the Back To Sleep campaign has

been successful with, making parents

0:52:260:52:33

aware of that, but there is not the

awareness with nests.

"Our parents

0:52:330:52:41

may do, but today's products are

fantastic but there will always be

0:52:410:52:46

an element of risk". Pat says, or

new babies are given a baby box by

0:52:460:52:51

the Scottish Government which helps

keep babies safe, perhaps the

0:52:510:52:58

British government would consider

that" so what do you think?

Going

0:52:580:53:08

back to an earlier comment, what I

would say is we have been really

0:53:080:53:13

successful in reducing the numbers

of Sids.

You have, I've got the

0:53:130:53:19

figures here, over 25 years...

Over

25 years we have reduced the rate of

0:53:190:53:29

Sids by 80%. It is phenomenal but

the reason we have done that is

0:53:290:53:35

because we have developed our safer

sleep guidelines, based on detailed

0:53:350:53:40

research which enables us to tell

parents how to sleep their baby

0:53:400:53:44

safely. While he first listener was

clear that in the old days people

0:53:440:53:53

used to spoil things onto babies and

people used to sleep in different

0:53:530:53:59

ways, yes that is true but the cot

death rate was so much higher and I

0:53:590:54:04

think that is the key point.

People

often say, well I used them and my

0:54:040:54:11

baby is fine. That's fine but your

baby is one baby, that's not what

0:54:110:54:15

the research is saying. I don't fall

into any of the risk categories in

0:54:150:54:21

terms of a parent of a baby with

Sids, but it happened to me. As I

0:54:210:54:27

keep saying, parents need to make an

informed choice.

Thank you very

0:54:270:54:31

much. Thank you for your many

comments about the film we played

0:54:310:54:38

earlier which involved some people

taking over an empty four story

0:54:380:54:43

building in London and inviting

anyone who was homeless to stay

0:54:430:54:48

there for shelter. Sarah says we all

need to listen to the amazing man

0:54:480:54:52

and your film who knows what support

these homeless need, what compassion

0:54:520:54:55

he has for the individuals who find

themselves in this position. David

0:54:550:55:00

says, we have farmers all over the

country crying out for workers and

0:55:000:55:04

sometimes they even provide housing.

It's an idea to offer people a

0:55:040:55:09

chance of a fresh start, a wage, a

purpose, a chance to restart life.

0:55:090:55:15

Bill says I have huge sympathy for

homeless people and used to have

0:55:150:55:19

some sympathy for squatters until

the terraced house next door was

0:55:190:55:24

squatted. They were worse than

animals, shouting and screaming all

0:55:240:55:28

day and night, abusive behaviour and

serious damage to the property. It

0:55:280:55:35

might be reasonable to allow formal

charities to take over buildings if

0:55:350:55:38

they have been unused for a period

but they should also be required to

0:55:380:55:41

leave on demand, not by going to

court. Joyce says, I believe the

0:55:410:55:45

people organising the squat need a

knighthood. There's no point in huge

0:55:450:55:52

commercial buildings being empty for

years and is not a people to use

0:55:520:55:58

them.

The latest sport at ten o'clock but

0:55:580:56:03

them.

The latest sport at ten o'clock but

0:56:030:56:03

first the weather with Matt. The

best of the weather is to be found

0:56:030:56:07

in parts of Scotland. We have

already seen sunshine around, and

0:56:070:56:11

some sunshine here and in Northern

Ireland throughout but a different

0:56:110:56:18

story elsewhere, particularly in

northern England. Heavy rain in the

0:56:180:56:21

Midlands and south east too, linked

to an area of high pressure. The

0:56:210:56:27

tell-tale sign that the cloud is

swirling around in the anticlockwise

0:56:270:56:31

fashion. The further north you are,

the further away from it, hence the

0:56:310:56:37

drier conditions. Let's focus on

what is happening in England and

0:56:370:56:40

Wales because we continue to see

outbreaks of rain coming and going

0:56:400:56:44

throughout the day. Heavy bursts

through the Midlands and towards the

0:56:440:56:48

south-east. The showers in the

south-west will push through smartly

0:56:480:56:51

on the strong breeze and there will

be brightness around in between

0:56:510:56:55

those rain bands, the best of which

will be in Northern Ireland and

0:56:550:56:59

western parts of Scotland.

Temperatures today, even with the

0:56:590:57:04

rain, still at 11 degrees, but in

eastern parts of Scotland with a

0:57:040:57:09

gentle breeze it will feel rather

chilly. Tonight we will see the

0:57:090:57:14

cloud and occasional rain across

England becoming more confined to

0:57:140:57:17

East Anglia and the south-east with

some showers in the west. More

0:57:170:57:21

breaks in the cloud tonight and into

tomorrow morning night than the one

0:57:210:57:25

just gone with a touch of frost and

for one or two maybe a bit dicey as

0:57:250:57:34

well. This area of low pressure is

waiting in the wings for Wednesday,

0:57:340:57:39

we are in between the ridge of high

pressure and that means fewer

0:57:390:57:41

showers around during the day. Maybe

wetter in parts of East Anglia and

0:57:410:57:48

some showers drifting eastwards but

very few in number. Most will have a

0:57:480:57:53

dry day, if not completely,

predominantly dry. Once the March

0:57:530:57:58

sunshine is on your back it will

feel quite pleasant with

0:57:580:58:01

temperatures in some spots into

double figures. Into Wednesday it

0:58:010:58:05

turns more breezy but the best of

drier weather limited to eastern

0:58:050:58:08

parts of the country. Later in the

day, the cloud will thicken in the

0:58:080:58:15

west, outbreaks of rain into the

evening become persistent across

0:58:150:58:18

Ireland, western Wales and into

parts of Devon and Cornwall.

0:58:180:58:22

Temperatures between ten and 14

Celsius. Things will change by the

0:58:220:58:28

time we get to the weekend, could we

see cold air on the way back? With

0:58:280:58:33

high pressure across Scandinavia is

set to drag in, it looks like cold

0:58:330:58:37

air back to our shores is so

temperatures will take a dip,

0:58:370:58:41

night-time frosts will then. How

cold it will get is uncertain at the

0:58:410:58:45

moment but we will keep you updated

here on BBC News. Goodbye for now.

0:58:450:58:55

Hello it's Monday, it's 10 o'clock,

I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

0:58:550:58:57

Our top story today -

tributes have been pouring

0:58:570:58:59

in for Sir Ken Dodd,

one of the last great Music

0:58:590:59:02

Hall acts of his time,

who's died at the age of 90

0:59:020:59:05

and is best remembered

for jokes like this.

0:59:050:59:07

Tickled, I am, by all this goodwill.

0:59:070:59:09

What about you Missus -

have you been tickled by goodwill?

0:59:090:59:11

Freud said a laugh was a sudden

explosion of psychic energy.

0:59:110:59:14

The trouble with Freud was he never

played second house Friday

0:59:140:59:16

night at Glasgow Empire.

0:59:160:59:20

We'll carry on paying tribute

to the man best known

0:59:200:59:23

for his tickling stick

and epic performances,

0:59:230:59:24

and hear from former Brookside

actress Claire Sweeney,

0:59:240:59:26

who knew him well.

0:59:260:59:28

Also on the programme -

the Prime Minister will meet

0:59:280:59:30

the National Security Council

to hear the latest intelligence

0:59:300:59:32

on the nerve agent attack

on the Russian father employed

0:59:320:59:34

by Britain as a spy.

0:59:340:59:35

It comes as Salisbury residents

voice concern they're

0:59:350:59:37

being kept in the dark.

0:59:370:59:43

I'd like to know what precautions I

personally can take rather than just

0:59:430:59:46

washing my close, having personally

been exposed, and what of the

0:59:460:59:52

long-term medications for me and my

wife?

0:59:520:59:55

We hear from the leader of the

council.

0:59:550:59:58

And we're talking

about Jamie Carragher,

0:59:580:59:59

filmed spitting at

the occupants of a car.

0:59:591:00:02

He's apologised.

1:00:021:00:10

2-1. 2-1, made! Unlucky, Jamie

Latta. 2-1.

1:00:101:00:21

Good morning.

1:00:211:00:22

Here's Joanna Gosling

in the BBC Newsroom

1:00:221:00:24

with a summary of today's news.

1:00:241:00:25

The comedian Sir Ken Dodd has

died at the age of 90.

1:00:251:00:28

Described by his publicist as "one

of the last Music Hall greats",

1:00:281:00:32

Sir Ken was known for his marathon

stage performances and the creation

1:00:321:00:34

of the Diddy Men and

the tickling stick.

1:00:341:00:36

The Liverpool-based perfomer had

recently been treated in hospital

1:00:361:00:39

for a chest infection.

1:00:391:00:41

The Government's National

Security Council will meet

1:00:411:00:44

today, to discuss the nerve agent

attack in Salisbury of a former

1:00:441:00:49

Russian intelligence

officer and his daughter.

1:00:491:00:50

The group, chaired

by the Prime Minister,

1:00:501:00:53

will be given the latest evidence

and intelligence on the attack,

1:00:531:00:57

before deciding what

action should be taken.

1:00:571:00:58

Yesterday hundreds of people

who were in the same pub

1:00:581:01:02

and restaurant as the victims,

were warned to wash their clothes

1:01:021:01:04

and other belongings they had

on them at the time.

1:01:041:01:07

A Bangladeshi plane with more

than 70 people on board, has crashed

1:01:071:01:10

at Kathmandu's International Airport

in Nepal.

1:01:101:01:14

The plane from US-Bangla

Airline went off the runway

1:01:141:01:16

while landing, and crashed

on the side of the runway,

1:01:161:01:18

according to the Kathmandu Post.

1:01:181:01:19

An airport spokesperson

told the paper that

1:01:191:01:21

casualties were expected.

1:01:211:01:25

A bitter row has broken out

at the top of the Labour Party,

1:01:251:01:28

with a shadow cabinet minister

being removed from her post,

1:01:281:01:31

apparently against her will.

1:01:311:01:33

The Labour Party says

Debbie Abrahams stepped down

1:01:331:01:36

as the spokeswoman on Work

and Pensions, while what is

1:01:361:01:38

described as an "employment

issue" is investigated.

1:01:381:01:42

But Mrs Abrahams claims she's

the victim of a bullying

1:01:421:01:44

culture in the party.

1:01:441:01:52

There are claims that up

to 1,000 children may have

1:01:541:01:56

been abused in the Shropshire town

of Telford over a 40 year period -

1:01:561:02:00

and MPs are now calling

for an inquiry.

1:02:001:02:02

Seven men have already

been convicted,

1:02:021:02:03

but it's thought others

have escaped charges.

1:02:031:02:06

It's thought the unfolding scandal

in Telford could be the worst

1:02:061:02:07

the country has ever seen.

1:02:071:02:09

Jamie Carragher has apologised

after a video showed

1:02:091:02:11

the former England

and Liverpool defender

1:02:111:02:12

spitting at a girl in a car.

1:02:121:02:14

The footballer, who's

now a TV pundit,

1:02:141:02:15

had been covering his

former side's 2-1 defeat

1:02:151:02:19

by Manchester United on Saturday.

1:02:191:02:20

Footage has emerged

of Mr Carragher spitting toward

1:02:201:02:22

the vehicle from his own car.

1:02:221:02:24

On Twitter, he said he'd been

provoked, but described his actions

1:02:241:02:26

as "totally out of order".

1:02:261:02:29

That's a summary of the latest BBC

News - more at 10.30.

1:02:291:02:33

Thank you. Many comments from you

about the film we showed earlier,

1:02:331:02:41

where people have taken over an

empty four-storey building in the

1:02:411:02:44

centre of London and homeless people

are being invited to share it.

1:02:441:02:50

Rachel says, I live in Manchester

and bypass scores of homeless people

1:02:501:02:54

every day, mostly men. I also pass

scores of empty buildings every day.

1:02:541:02:57

Surely that is an obvious answer?

This from someone who does not

1:02:571:03:01

please -- leave their name. What

about using church halls for

1:03:011:03:06

homeless people? The majority have

under utilised halls which could be

1:03:061:03:09

used to house homeless people, even

if only during the winter. Is this

1:03:091:03:13

not what churches are for, to give

comfort to the vulnerable? Sarah

1:03:131:03:20

says, God bless that mantra standing

up for the homeless. Dean says it is

1:03:201:03:25

disgusting that a building in

central London has been left empty

1:03:251:03:29

for 15 years. This is so wrong. Paul

completely agrees with the squatters

1:03:291:03:34

will stop it should be made legal to

take temporary possession for

1:03:341:03:37

emergency housing. This person

doesn't leave their name. A lot of

1:03:371:03:42

these people choose to sleep off and

I are too lazy to get a job. Be fair

1:03:421:03:46

for couples who want to start a

family to go to back of the queue

1:03:461:03:50

when it comes to housing. Steve Lee

says, what I am seeing today is

1:03:501:03:55

people being empowered to take over

empty buildings for the homeless. It

1:03:551:03:58

is amazing. And Gay says

homelessness in this day and age is

1:03:581:04:04

an Oak Ridge. We should be going

forward is not you.

1:04:041:04:08

Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning -

1:04:081:04:10

use the hashtag Victoria live.

1:04:101:04:11

And if you text, you will be charged

at the standard network rate.

1:04:111:04:15

Now the sport. Great Britain's

snowboarders made their Winter

1:04:151:04:21

prolix debut Jeong Jang today but it

didn't quite go according to plan.

1:04:211:04:26

-- Winter Paralympics. The event was

held up by technical problems. Kate

1:04:261:04:31

Grey can tell us more.

Yes, all

sorts of problems at the

1:04:311:04:36

snowboarding. The event was moved

forward due to the increasing

1:04:361:04:39

temperatures. It was about 18

degrees in the middle of the day.

1:04:391:04:42

They had to move the event earlier.

When the event started they had

1:04:421:04:46

problems with the start gate. They

were not dropping down and athletes

1:04:461:04:51

were falling over them. They had to

replace it with a rope. Not ideal.

1:04:511:04:58

Britain did have three athletes

competing. None of them made it

1:04:581:05:03

through to the final stages. When I

spoke to Owen Pick, he told me he

1:05:031:05:08

was not happy with how the event had

unfolded.

1:05:081:05:11

There was talk that there were going

to cancel it and do it another day.

1:05:111:05:17

It was just like, guys, this is the

Paralympics, we want to race. It was

1:05:171:05:24

tough. It was really tough. It was a

shame that today has gone the way it

1:05:241:05:29

has gone in general, because we

wanted to put on a good show.

1:05:291:05:33

No medals for Great Britain. The

snowboarders will get another chance

1:05:331:05:36

later in the week in the slalom.

There was success for the wheelchair

1:05:361:05:41

curlers. They won their match

against Sweden 6-1. They will go

1:05:411:05:47

against Canada later today. They are

the Paralympic champions.

1:05:471:05:53

Tottenham Mandem than fans will be

waiting for the result of a scan

1:05:531:05:56

today on Harry Kane's ankle. He was

forced off against Bournemouth

1:05:561:06:00

yesterday. Heung-Min Son found the

net twice as Spurs won 4-1.

1:06:001:06:09

Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger says

his team need to get the fans back

1:06:091:06:13

on site after their recent poor

form. The players did their bit

1:06:131:06:17

yesterday, beating Watford 3-0, but

still plenty of empty seats at the

1:06:171:06:21

Emirates.

There was a cracking old firm derby

1:06:211:06:24

in the Scottish premiership. Josh

Windass putting Rangers ahead after

1:06:241:06:27

three minutes. It was 2-2 at

half-time before Celtic snatched

1:06:271:06:30

victory thanks to Odsonne Edouard.

Tiger Woods came so close to winning

1:06:301:06:37

his first event for more than four

years at the Valspar Championship in

1:06:371:06:41

Florida. The 14 times major winner

has slipped to 388th in the world

1:06:411:06:48

rankings. He needed this putt on the

final hole to force a play-off with

1:06:481:06:52

Englishman Paul Casey. It came up

just short. That is Casey's first

1:06:521:06:57

tournament victory for nearly four

years.

1:06:571:07:02

There was a really disappointing

defeat for the British number one

1:07:021:07:05

Kyle Edmund at the Indian Wells

open. It was his first match since

1:07:051:07:12

reaching the final stages of the

Australian open. He was beaten in

1:07:121:07:16

straight sets. That is all the sport

for now. Headlines at half

1:07:161:07:21

past ten.

1:07:211:07:24

Theresa May will meet

the National Security Council today,

1:07:241:07:27

who are looking at the latest

evidence of the suspected poisoning

1:07:271:07:29

of a former Russian double

agent and his daughter.

1:07:291:07:33

An assessment will be made

of who might have carried out

1:07:331:07:35

the nerve agent attack.

1:07:351:07:38

Sergei and Yulia Skripal remain

critically ill in hospital.

1:07:381:07:43

People in Salisbury

are concerned about possible

1:07:431:07:45

contamination, and say

advice from officials has been slow.

1:07:451:07:47

Yesterday up to 500 Salisbury

members of the public

1:07:471:07:50

who were in a pub and restaurant

at the same time as the Skripals,

1:07:501:07:53

were told to wash their possessions

as a precaution after traces

1:07:531:07:56

of the nerve agent were found there.

1:07:561:07:59

Leila Nathoo is in Salisbury.

1:07:591:08:06

What is the latest? What is

happening today?

There are still a

1:08:061:08:12

number of locations still in play in

the best occasion. The bench behind

1:08:121:08:16

me remains cordoned off. The

restaurant, Zizzi, and the pub are

1:08:161:08:22

key sites in the investigation

because traces of the nerve agent

1:08:221:08:25

have been found at both locations.

Police are still carrying out

1:08:251:08:28

searches there. We know the table at

the Zizzi restaurant were surrogate

1:08:281:08:34

and Yulia had their lunch has been

contaminated so much it has been

1:08:341:08:39

destroyed. We know the police are

still examining Sergei Skripal's car

1:08:391:08:44

and his home. Clearly a number of

locations still of interest to the

1:08:441:08:48

police. They are trying to ascertain

exactly when and how they were

1:08:481:08:53

exposed to this deadly chemical.

Police do know the nature of the

1:08:531:08:59

nerve agent, the precise chemical

that was used in this attack. They

1:08:591:09:02

are not revealing that publicly.

Clearly that will give them an

1:09:021:09:06

understanding of exactly how fast

acting this chemical was, and will

1:09:061:09:09

likely help them identify the exact

time and place the two were exposed

1:09:091:09:15

to that substance. This morning,

Theresa May is going to chair the

1:09:151:09:19

meeting of the National Security

Council. She's been kept updated on

1:09:191:09:23

the investigation. We know the Cobra

emergency committee has met to

1:09:231:09:26

discuss this at the highest level.

Clearly there is interest now to try

1:09:261:09:32

to pin some blame on who was

responsible. Although Amber Rudd has

1:09:321:09:37

been urging caution in jumping to

conclusions, the possibility that

1:09:371:09:41

the Russian state is involved in

some way in this incident is clearly

1:09:411:09:45

been considered quite strongly.

And

some people cross because they were

1:09:451:09:50

told, wash your possessions if you

were in that pub or restaurant, but

1:09:501:09:55

they were told seven days after the

poisoning happened?

Yeah, all along

1:09:551:10:01

there has been some concern about

the wider risk to the public about

1:10:011:10:04

this. This was a deadly chemical

used. The bench was cleared last

1:10:041:10:12

Sunday night by police and officers

in huge protective suits. There has

1:10:121:10:17

been reassurance from public health

officials that there was no wider

1:10:171:10:20

risk to the public and no reason to

be alarmed. Yesterday, a full week

1:10:201:10:25

on from the incident itself, we get

this warning to around 500 people

1:10:251:10:30

who dined at Zizzi and had been to

the Mill Pub, as a precaution, to

1:10:301:10:34

say, wash clothes, wiped down any

phones, any objects, as a precaution

1:10:341:10:42

in case Tupe don't -- to prevent

repeated exposure. There has been

1:10:421:10:46

anger and confusion among residents

who say, if we are at risk, why are

1:10:461:10:52

we only told this far on? If we are

not, why are we being told at all?

1:10:521:10:56

We spoke to one man who was at the

Mill Pub.

1:10:561:11:00

I have been more worried as the week

has gone on and the gravity of the

1:11:001:11:06

event that has taken place in a

small city has unravelled. The last

1:11:061:11:10

few days have become more

concerning. Certainly because they

1:11:101:11:14

haven't revealed what the nerve

agent was. And what the effect, the

1:11:141:11:19

long-term effect, on anyone's health

could be. I'd like to know what

1:11:191:11:24

precautions I personally can take,

rather than just washing my clothes,

1:11:241:11:29

having potentially already been

exposed, what other long-term

1:11:291:11:31

indications are there for me and my

wife?

1:11:311:11:34

We can talk now

to Matthew Dean, Conservative Leader

1:11:341:11:38

of Salisbury City Council.

1:11:381:11:42

Also with us, Marina Litvinenko, the

wife of Alexander Litvinenko, a

1:11:421:11:47

former Russian agent killed in 2006

after defecting to the UK. And Harry

1:11:471:11:54

Ferguson, a former MI6 officer.

Matthew Dean, why did it take so

1:11:541:11:57

long to warn people?

I think that

was because of emerging science,

1:11:571:12:03

actually. You will recall that when

this incident happened last Sunday,

1:12:031:12:07

the original speculation was that

the casualties had taken a heroin

1:12:071:12:13

substitute. It took some days for

Public Health England to ascertain

1:12:131:12:17

it was a nerve agent, and then some

further science has been done and

1:12:171:12:22

they issued this very much

precautionary advice yesterday,

1:12:221:12:28

saying that only if you were in the

Mill Pub or Zizzi's restaurant on

1:12:281:12:34

Sunday or Monday, you may wish to

wash your clothes to eliminate any

1:12:341:12:41

possible long-term risk of public

health contamination.

1:12:411:12:51

health contamination.

You don't

think the warning...

Without

1:12:511:12:57

exposure you have no risk

whatsoever. If you are in the city

1:12:571:12:59

going about your normal business,

there is no risk.

Why didn't the

1:12:591:13:05

warning, earlier? We knew earlier in

the week it was a deadly nerve

1:13:051:13:08

agent, potentially?

Well, we could

only go on what Doctor Jane Harries,

1:13:081:13:14

the deputy public health director of

Public Health England, said

1:13:141:13:19

yesterday. She said in her statement

that the reason the advice was

1:13:191:13:24

forthcoming yesterday was because

they had done some more research.

1:13:241:13:27

And they had reached the conclusion

that there was a very small risk

1:13:271:13:31

that if you are in that restaurant

or that public house at the time,

1:13:311:13:38

that any substance was administered

to Mr Skripal or his daughter, but

1:13:381:13:43

possibly, over weeks and months, if

you continue to wear the same

1:13:431:13:46

clothes without washing them,

conceivably you may have some public

1:13:461:13:52

health consequences. That was it. Of

course, I think they just took the

1:13:521:13:58

view that any advice is important to

give out as soon as they have

1:13:581:14:01

ascertained exactly what the risk

was.

1:14:011:14:05

Thank you very much, Matthew Dean.

Let's talk to Marina Litvinenko and

1:14:051:14:09

Harry Ferguson. Marina Litvinenko,

what were your emotions when you

1:14:091:14:14

heard what was happening in

Salisbury?

My first emotion was I

1:14:141:14:20

was absolutely shocked. I couldn't

believe something similar to me

1:14:201:14:23

happened again. But when I hear what

you already said in this programme,

1:14:231:14:30

and even you ask why after just one

week you need to protect yourself

1:14:301:14:34

wash your clothes, remember, it was

mustered 23 days just after my

1:14:341:14:41

husband all these protections were

done. Only after them. People didn't

1:14:411:14:48

know. They were sitting in a place

contaminated by radioactive

1:14:481:14:51

material. They didn't know in

hospital they were in contact with a

1:14:511:14:57

person who was poisoned by

radioactive material. In this case,

1:14:571:15:00

I would like to say that after one

week to receive this action is good.

1:15:001:15:04

If you remember what happened in

2006, everything was so much

1:15:041:15:08

delayed.

1:15:081:15:13

But you are shocked this could

happen again on British soil?

Yes,

1:15:171:15:22

because there was a very serious

investigation after what happened to

1:15:221:15:26

my husband. There was a lot of money

paid for this investigation. After

1:15:261:15:32

ten years we provided a public

inquiry, which was not easy as well,

1:15:321:15:36

but we did it and people who wanted

to understand what actually happened

1:15:361:15:44

in 2006 could see evidence and

facts, and even more Russia was

1:15:441:15:47

named after this public inquiry as a

state behind this crime. And even

1:15:471:15:55

more, president Putin was named, who

has probably approved this crime.

1:15:551:16:01

And I believed after this public

inquiry verdict was released in 2016

1:16:011:16:08

something would be done and what

happened one week ago, it looks like

1:16:081:16:16

nothing changed.

Next week is the

Russian presidential election,

1:16:161:16:22

Vladimir Putin will probably be

re-elected, I do think the killing

1:16:221:16:32

of Sergei Skripal and his daughter

is related to this?

I don't think it

1:16:321:16:39

does any harm. President Putin plays

to his domestic audience which is

1:16:391:16:43

Russian nationalists. If you ever

have the chance to get at one of

1:16:431:16:50

them come you take it and that

appears to be what's happened in

1:16:501:16:53

this case.

Does that mean you think

it is from Vladimir Putin's point of

1:16:531:16:59

view, it is something that he

1:16:591:17:05

view, it is something that he might

be behind or just a freelancer?

1:17:051:17:10

That's where it gets interesting and

this is one of the reasons the

1:17:101:17:14

Government has been cautious in

attributing blame. It is hard to

1:17:141:17:18

imagine who it could be other than

the Russians, who else would want to

1:17:181:17:25

kill him? But finding out who it is

in Russia is very challenging. It

1:17:251:17:35

has become rather like the wild

west. There is an organisation of

1:17:351:17:41

former KGB officers who are ultra

nationalists who have sworn to get

1:17:411:17:44

people like Sergei Skripal because

they view traitors as the worst

1:17:441:17:50

criminals possible. They are quite

capable of doing something of their

1:17:501:17:55

own back because they have the

contacts. One thing that strikes me

1:17:551:18:01

about this assassination attempt is

that it is incredibly clumsy,

1:18:011:18:05

particularly if it has come through

the post. There's no reason the

1:18:051:18:10

Russian intelligence services should

do that and you've seen the

1:18:101:18:13

long-term effects locally. It also

killed a police officer which would

1:18:131:18:17

have elevated the whole event which

makes me wonder whether it is the

1:18:171:18:21

intelligence services behind it or

wannabes equally powerful groups who

1:18:211:18:24

have a great deal of control in

Russia today.

OK, thank you, both.

1:18:241:18:35

The letters started

to arrive on Friday.

1:18:361:18:40

Printed on a side of A4

paper with the title,

1:18:401:18:48

'Punish a Muslim Day' -

it lay out a points based system

1:18:511:18:56

for certain acts of violence

towards Muslims living in the UK,

1:18:561:18:58

from 25 points for removing

a woman's headscarf to 500 points

1:18:581:19:01

for murdering a Muslim.

1:19:011:19:02

"Are you a sheep like the vast

majority of the population?"

1:19:021:19:05

the letter reads.

1:19:051:19:06

"Sheep follow orders

and are easily led.

1:19:061:19:07

They are allowing the white-majority

nations of Europe and north America

1:19:071:19:10

to become overrun by those

who would like nothing

1:19:101:19:12

more than to do us harm

and to turn our democracies

1:19:121:19:15

into Sharia-led police states."

1:19:151:19:18

The letters were received by people

in Bradford, Leicester, London,

1:19:181:19:22

Cardiff and Sheffield.

1:19:221:19:27

Counter-terrorism police,

1:19:271:19:28

co-ordinated in the North East,

are investigating.

1:19:281:19:33

We can speak now to Riaz Ahmed,

Lib Dem councillor

1:19:331:19:35

in Bradford, who received

one of the letters.

1:19:351:19:38

Also Fiyaz Mughal,

of Tell Mama UK, who monitor

1:19:381:19:40

anti-Muslim hate crime.

1:19:401:19:41

And Dr Paul Jackson,

a far right expert at

1:19:411:19:43

the University of Northampton.

1:19:431:19:51

Welcome all of you.

1:19:531:19:58

Mr Ahmed, when you opened this

and read it, what did

1:19:581:20:01

you think?

1:20:011:20:05

I thought it was something that

should go in the rubbish bin, an

1:20:051:20:10

advertisement or something. When I

read through it I was shocked and

1:20:101:20:13

amazed that some of the wording

used, which you mentioned earlier.

1:20:131:20:18

Especially throwing acid. With the

incidents that have happened around

1:20:181:20:24

the country recently it was very

shocking. The first reaction was to

1:20:241:20:29

take the letter down to the police

station.

How worried are you?

I am

1:20:291:20:38

just over 60 years old.

Nope, sorry,

how worried are you?

I wasn't

1:20:381:20:46

worried about it myself, but the

more I thought about it the more

1:20:461:20:51

shocking it became because the

intention is to terrorise people and

1:20:511:20:54

caused discord in the community.

Will it work?

No, I'm proud to say

1:20:541:21:01

it hasn't worked and will not work

because the people in Britain have

1:21:011:21:07

come beyond that. Very few people

still hold those extreme views.

1:21:071:21:15

Iman, how many reports of letters

has your charity received?

1:21:151:21:21

Approximately 15 cases of these

letters which have gone to people

1:21:221:21:26

across the country, so there's been

about 15 of these letters but they

1:21:261:21:30

are very random. Clearly someone has

looked at or found Muslim sounding

1:21:301:21:35

names and sent them off so it is

targeted in the sense it is Muslim

1:21:351:21:39

individuals receiving it, but there

are 15 today. A similar campaign was

1:21:391:21:46

run from Sheffield postal area to

mosques in America so this is the

1:21:461:21:53

second part of a campaign and

whether they are linked or not, the

1:21:531:21:56

police will only know. The reality

is this is not the first campaign

1:21:561:22:02

that has taken place targeting

Muslim communities whether in the UK

1:22:021:22:07

or the US.

What impact is it having?

It is elevating a sense of fear,

1:22:071:22:13

particularly within Muslim women.

They have already felt fear in

1:22:131:22:17

relation to hate crimes and

incidents may have seen in the press

1:22:171:22:20

and other areas so it has raised

elevation of fear in some parts of

1:22:201:22:25

the community but certainly as a

society we see this for what it is.

1:22:251:22:31

It is a group of individuals trying

to be malicious and we won't fall

1:22:311:22:34

into that trap.

Paul Jackson, you

were an expert in the far right from

1:22:341:22:41

the University of Northampton. Who

might be behind these letters?

I

1:22:411:22:47

don't know, possibly an individual

or a small group of people. Many

1:22:471:22:54

extreme groups are in a

marginalised, weak position and this

1:22:541:22:59

letter campaign is very low-tech, it

is very easy to do in various ways

1:22:591:23:04

but it doesn't suggest a super well

resourced group behind this, yet

1:23:041:23:08

they are also able to spread a lot

of fear, but maybe inspire some

1:23:081:23:13

other people to carry out some of

these attacks too.

And these kind of

1:23:131:23:19

tactics have been used before?

I

don't want to go too much into the

1:23:191:23:23

detail of the letter itself but some

of the types of attacks that have

1:23:231:23:26

been listed are things we have seen

in the last few years, like acid

1:23:261:23:32

attacks, and the Finsbury Park

mosque attack, so it is chiming with

1:23:321:23:35

something that could be seen as

tangible in terms of the ways Muslim

1:23:351:23:39

people have been attacked in recent

years.

What is the state of the far

1:23:391:23:45

right in this country at the moment

in terms of numbers and strength and

1:23:451:23:49

so on?

I think it has declined, in

the sense larger organisations have

1:23:491:23:55

waned like the British National

Party and the English Defence

1:23:551:23:58

League. Now we have a larger range

of either small groups or

1:23:581:24:03

individuals who can be very extreme,

can have the most extreme views you

1:24:031:24:08

can possibly imagine, and feel they

are under a sense of existential

1:24:081:24:14

threat to their white identities and

that was communicated in part of

1:24:141:24:19

this letter in a way. They may feel

they really do need to carry out

1:24:191:24:24

violent attacks in order to be able

to defend themselves. So the state

1:24:241:24:29

is small and fragmented but

sometimes quite dangerous.

Thank

1:24:291:24:34

you, I'm sorry, I called you buy a

different name, I expected your

1:24:341:24:40

colleague.

It's fine.

We are going to talk about Ken Dodd

1:24:401:24:47

now.

1:24:471:24:49

Sir Ken Dodd, creator

of the Diddy Men and one of the most

1:24:491:24:53

popular comedians of his time,

has died at the age of 90.

1:24:531:24:55

The Liverpool legend -

famous for his tickling stick -

1:24:551:24:58

had recently been released

from hospital after six weeks

1:24:581:25:00

of treatment for a chest infection.

1:25:001:25:01

He'd been a comedian since 1954,

and made it into the Guinness Book

1:25:011:25:05

of Records in the 1960s

for telling 1,500 jokes

1:25:051:25:07

in three and a half hours.

1:25:071:25:15

Geronimo!

1:25:321:25:36

Happiness!

1:27:161:27:18

We can speak now to

the actress Claire Sweeney,

1:27:181:27:20

a friend of Ken Dodd who grew up

working with him.

1:27:201:27:26

How will you remember him?

He was a

one-off, wasn't he? A lot of people

1:27:261:27:36

didn't know much about his personal

life but from my point of view he

1:27:361:27:41

was the most generous and kind man.

What he gave me was more precious

1:27:411:27:45

than anything, he gave me time as --

he gave me time. As a 14-year-old

1:27:451:27:54

girl I used to support him, and I

remember watching him record a

1:27:541:27:59

television show. In the Green room

afterwards, I was there with my

1:27:591:28:03

parents, and it was a room full of

stars and television executives and

1:28:031:28:07

he spent the majority of the time

talking to me and my parents,

1:28:071:28:11

advising me and giving me pearls of

wisdom about the business. Even last

1:28:111:28:18

year, we were at a party and he was

asking me about my three-year-old

1:28:181:28:21

son, and he said, do you think he

has any inclinations about the

1:28:211:28:26

business? He said, if he has funny

bones tell me to spend the day with

1:28:261:28:31

me, and I will teach him everything

he needs to know. The workshop. He

1:28:311:28:37

lived and breathed the business but

behind every successful man there's

1:28:371:28:43

a wonderful woman, and Ann was with

him every step of the way. She would

1:28:431:28:51

be with a notebook writing down the

jokes he did, she was always there

1:28:511:28:56

for him.

And it's very moving to

read they actually got married on

1:28:561:29:03

Friday, didn't they?

Yes, a

wonderful woman.

You were at his

1:29:031:29:09

90th birthday party which must have

been amazing.

Last night I heard the

1:29:091:29:15

news, I sat reflecting and thought

what a great sendoff for him when he

1:29:151:29:22

was here. All of his friends and

family were there, and all of the

1:29:221:29:27

comics, people got up and paid

tribute to him, told jokes. He did

1:29:271:29:33

his turn at the end and everyone was

there to adore him and tell him how

1:29:331:29:37

much he loved him -- we loved him

before he left us.

Will there ever

1:29:371:29:45

be anyone like him again?

Times have

changed. I was speaking to someone

1:29:451:29:49

this morning, and they said, the

thing about Ken is he didn't need

1:29:491:29:55

television or press exposure. Not

like nowadays, he was a legendary

1:29:551:30:00

status without doing an interview or

any television he could fill

1:30:001:30:04

theatres. And his respect, I worked

with Jason Manford last year, and he

1:30:041:30:10

adored Kent. It was the younger

generation of comics who completely

1:30:101:30:15

adored him and respected him.

1:30:151:30:21

Thank you for coming on the

programme.

1:30:221:30:24

We appreciated. Thank you for your

many comments we have had a better

1:30:241:30:29

film we played at the beginning of

the programme involving a group of

1:30:291:30:33

volunteers taking over a four-storey

empty building in the centre of

1:30:331:30:37

London, in the West End, and

effectively inviting anybody who is

1:30:371:30:41

homeless to share it with them.

Allison says, while I think that

1:30:411:30:45

what the people in London are doing

is admirable, this is not fair on

1:30:451:30:49

landlords who have Depay business

rates on empty properties and

1:30:491:30:53

utility bills to keep services

running. It also means the landlords

1:30:531:30:57

will not be able to advertise their

properties is available for letting.

1:30:571:31:02

It is unfair that landlords have to

go to the extremes and costs of

1:31:021:31:05

getting an eviction order to get the

squatters out of their property. It

1:31:051:31:10

is not the responsibility of

landlords to subsidise social

1:31:101:31:13

welfare, nor should this be the

case. Leslie is a private landlord.

1:31:131:31:17

She has a little house standing

empty while advertising a tougher

1:31:171:31:21

rent. She had a lot of viewings. The

quality of the applicants was not

1:31:211:31:26

good. After three or four months she

had a letter from the local council

1:31:261:31:29

threatening to take it over from

this use. The shock of this was

1:31:291:31:33

terrible. This is my investment, my

income, my future. David says that

1:31:331:31:40

as a child he, together with his mum

and sister, were harmless and were

1:31:401:31:47

accommodated in workouts in

Camberwell. His mum worked in the

1:31:471:31:50

kitchen and all unemployed adults

were working in the building to run

1:31:501:31:53

and maintain it. Is it time to bring

back such hostels? There are many

1:31:531:31:58

old mills and warehouses that could

be converted and made habitable.

1:31:581:32:02

Lilly says, what a fantastic man the

volunteer was, providing such

1:32:021:32:07

essential, life-saving helper rough

sleeper is in London. Stuff the

1:32:071:32:11

building, it has been vacant for 15

years. They should be commended and

1:32:111:32:16

supported. This could be a new

scheme by the government. The power

1:32:161:32:21

of peer support, I love it.

Coming up, Jamie Carragher has

1:32:211:32:27

apologised... I will start that

again. Jamie Carragher has said he

1:32:271:32:31

will apologise again properly over

spitting at a 14-year-old girl,

1:32:311:32:35

which has left him facing talks with

his Sky Sports bosses. More in the

1:32:351:32:40

next half an hour. And new

allegations about controversial

1:32:401:32:43

bowel surgery. A leading pioneer of

mesh surgery at the centre of an NHS

1:32:431:32:51

investigation in Bristol. The full

story in the next few minutes.

1:32:511:32:56

Time for the latest news -

here's Joanna Gosling.

1:32:561:33:02

Comedian Sir Ken Dodd has died at

the age of 90. Described as one of

1:33:021:33:06

the last musical greats, he was

known phrase marathon stage

1:33:061:33:10

performances and the creation of the

Diddy Men and the tickling stick.

1:33:101:33:14

The Liverpool performer had been

recently treated for chest

1:33:141:33:17

infection.

1:33:171:33:17

The Government's National

Security Council will meet

1:33:171:33:19

shortly, to discuss the nerve agent

attack in Salisbury of a former

1:33:191:33:22

Russian intelligence

officer and his daughter.

1:33:221:33:24

The group, chaired

by the Prime Minister,

1:33:241:33:25

will be given the latest evidence

and intelligence on the attack,

1:33:251:33:28

before deciding what

action should be taken.

1:33:281:33:31

Yesterday hundreds of people

who were in the same pub

1:33:311:33:34

and restaurant as the victims,

were warned to wash their clothes

1:33:341:33:37

and other belongings they had

on them at the time.

1:33:371:33:45

Many people are feared to -- feared

to have died in a plane crash in

1:33:451:33:49

Kathmandu. Several bodies have been

recovered.

1:33:491:33:53

The plane from US-Bangla

Airline went off the runway

1:33:531:33:55

while landing, and crashed

on the side of the runway,

1:33:551:33:58

according to the Kathmandu Post.

1:33:581:33:59

It failed to land and ended up on

fire on a football pitch.

1:33:591:34:04

There are claims that up

to 1,000 children may have

1:34:041:34:06

been abused in the Shropshire town

of Telford over a 40 year period -

1:34:061:34:09

and MPs are now calling

for an inquiry.

1:34:091:34:11

Seven men have already

been convicted,

1:34:111:34:13

but it's thought others

have escaped charges.

1:34:131:34:14

It's thought the unfolding scandal

in Telford could be the worst

1:34:141:34:17

the country has ever seen.

1:34:171:34:25

Jamie Carragher has apologised,

after a video showed

1:34:251:34:27

the former England

and Liverpool defender

1:34:271:34:28

spitting at a girl in a car.

1:34:281:34:30

The footballer, who's

now a TV pundit,

1:34:301:34:31

had been covering his

former side's 2-1 defeat

1:34:311:34:33

by Manchester United on Saturday.

1:34:331:34:35

Footage has emerged of Mr

Carragher spitting toward

1:34:351:34:37

the vehicle from his own car.

1:34:371:34:38

On Twitter, he said he'd been

provoked, but described his actions

1:34:381:34:41

as "totally out of order".

1:34:411:34:44

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

1:34:441:34:49

This is what you say about the

spitting incident involving Jamie

1:34:491:34:53

Carragher. Ridgers says watching

spitting at a teenage girl an

1:34:531:34:56

absolute disgrace. While the FA

tries to clean up football, this

1:34:561:35:02

sort of behaviour is shocking to see

from an adult in a public arena. I

1:35:021:35:06

hope Sky Sports remove him from

their channel. John says, the driver

1:35:061:35:09

of the car in the character incident

should be arrested. He was driving

1:35:091:35:14

using his phone to film the

incident, not paying attention to

1:35:141:35:18

what he was doing and putting his

daughter at risk. He has broken the

1:35:181:35:22

law. Pete says it is clear from the

video that character was driving

1:35:221:35:26

dangerously and behaving violently

because his team had lost. He should

1:35:261:35:30

be prosecuted. If it was done on the

pitch he would be banned.

1:35:301:35:33

Now let's get some sport with Will.

1:35:331:35:36

It has been a morning to forget for

Britain's snowboarders at the Winter

1:35:361:35:42

Paralympics. All three were knocked

out. Owen Pick was eliminated in the

1:35:421:35:45

first race. The metal start gate

broke, which meant they had to use a

1:35:451:35:51

piece of rope. Harry Kane will have

a scan on his ankle today after he

1:35:511:35:56

was injured during Tottenham's 4-1

win over Bournemouth. Wales move

1:35:561:36:04

into second in the Six Nations table

after victory over Italy in Cardiff.

1:36:041:36:10

George North scored two of their

five tries, securing the bonus point

1:36:101:36:15

win. And Tiger Woods came so close

to winning his first title in more

1:36:151:36:20

than four years. He needed that putt

but ended up finishing just one shot

1:36:201:36:27

behind Englishman Paul Casey at the

Valspar Championship. The trial of

1:36:271:36:30

Ben Stokes will start at Bristol

Crown Court on the 6th of August,

1:36:301:36:34

which means he will miss the Lord's

test against India.

1:36:341:36:36

Thank you. Let's talk about Jamie

Carragher. He has said he will

1:36:361:36:45

apologise again properly over him

spitting, basically, which is left

1:36:451:36:52

him facing talks with his Sky Sports

bosses. He will need them today

1:36:521:36:56

after he spat at a 14-year-old girl

at the weekend.

1:36:561:36:59

Here is the video recording.

I will

speak to the family again. Yes.

1:36:591:37:13

speak to the family again. Yes.

Is

out of character?

Of course.

1:37:131:37:19

No response to, are you going to be

sacked? Is Sky Sports spokesman said

1:37:401:37:46

they will address it with Jamie.

Here is the video of the spitting.

1:37:461:37:52

2-1, lad! Unlucky.

Then the girl

said, he spat at me. We will see

1:37:591:38:07

what happens. You can follow

developments on BBC News.

1:38:071:38:11

Next, mesh. Excruciating pain, loss

of bowel control, these are various

1:38:111:38:16

outcomes for patients who had a

controversial type of bowel surgery

1:38:161:38:21

done by a surgeon who is now under

investigation by the NHS, and

1:38:211:38:25

suspended from two hospitals. It is

an issue we have covered on this

1:38:251:38:31

programme many times. Tony Dixon,

working privately and for the NHS in

1:38:311:38:36

Bristol, used synthetic mesh in

operations designed to help people

1:38:361:38:38

with bowel problems like

constipation and prolapse. A BBC

1:38:381:38:45

investigation led to more than 50

women are getting in touch. And new

1:38:451:38:50

allegations coming to light.

Matthew Hill reports. A group of

1:38:501:38:54

women brought together by the BBC.

They had surgery to help fix a

1:38:541:38:59

sagging bowel, or prolapse, and

relieve constipation. Last year, I

1:38:591:39:05

revealed major concerns about the

mesh used in this procedure and

1:39:051:39:10

about one pioneering surgeon, Tony

Dixon. After the film went out,

1:39:101:39:13

around 50 people got in touch. I

invited them to Bristol to hear

1:39:131:39:18

their stories.

Chop me that people

were having issues. I thought I was

1:39:181:39:23

an individual case. -- it shocked

me. Obviously not. There were calls

1:39:231:39:29

for the mesh to be banned after the

documentary.

The mesh can erode

1:39:291:39:35

become infected.

It failed within

three weeks. I felt everything

1:39:351:39:40

dropping. It was very uncomfortable.

Most of the patients we have spoken

1:39:401:39:46

to came to see Mr Dixon here in

Bristol. Many paid thousands of

1:39:461:39:51

pounds for private operations. Some

were seen on the NHS. They were

1:39:511:39:53

attracted to him because he built up

an international reputation in bowel

1:39:531:40:00

surgery using the mesh. Mr Dixon

also works at Southmead. He has been

1:40:001:40:08

suspended from operating at both

hospitals while they investigate. He

1:40:081:40:12

couldn't comment on specific

allegations because of patient

1:40:121:40:14

confidentiality.

Joe Howard mesh before she saw Mr

1:40:141:40:22

Dixon in 2012. It didn't work.

I explained I was still in pain and

1:40:221:40:28

he asked me about my intimate

relationship with my husband and how

1:40:281:40:31

that was at the time.

What did you

say?

I said at the time that six was

1:40:311:40:36

still a bit painful, to be honest.

-- sex. He said, surely it's good

1:40:361:40:43

when sex is a bit painful?

What did

you think of that?

I was just

1:40:431:40:49

shocked.

She said she wanted a new

biological mesh, but I heard that Mr

1:40:491:40:54

Dixon used plastic.

The previous

specialist recommended no more

1:40:541:40:58

synthetic mesh be put in because of

the problems I had had. I was under

1:40:581:41:03

the impression that biological mesh

would be used.

What happened?

I had

1:41:031:41:09

the operation. A short while after I

was experiencing pain, ex-specially

1:41:091:41:16

when passing stills. My bowel felt

like it was on fire at times.

Mr

1:41:161:41:22

Dixon said he could not comment on

specific allegations because of

1:41:221:41:27

patient confidentiality, but has

apologised in the past when a

1:41:271:41:30

patient complained about his

behaviour. Many of his patients are

1:41:301:41:35

now travelling to London for help.

And there is one surgeon they want

1:41:351:41:44

to see, whose services have bidding

huge demand in recent months,

1:41:441:41:48

specifically for mesh removal. There

is no way of knowing how many people

1:41:481:41:51

it happen too.

A lot of patients are

now aware that the symptoms they

1:41:511:41:55

have had for many years may be

related to the complications with

1:41:551:41:59

the mess. They have come to seek

help. We had at the beginning around

1:41:591:42:04

two or three a month. We are now

getting at least one patient every

1:42:041:42:09

other third or fourth day.

1:42:091:42:15

other third or fourth day.

I used to

perform live regularly in different

1:42:171:42:19

bands. Things have not been right

for me since I had that procedure

1:42:191:42:26

because I feel like it's changed me

on some level.

David Rowlands

1:42:261:42:33

suffered years of bowel pain before

coming to see a specialist in

1:42:331:42:36

Bristol.

He explained a little about

what he thought the problem was and

1:42:361:42:44

he said, "I am going to put you in a

taxi immediately." Before I knew it

1:42:441:42:50

I was being ferried to a

consultation room with Mr Dixon. My

1:42:501:42:56

head was spinning, thinking, what on

earth is going on?

What happened?

1:42:561:43:01

Hull he said he would need to do a

consultation. Now this examination

1:43:011:43:07

was simply a digital examination. Of

my back passage. And that lasted for

1:43:071:43:15

maybe five minutes. It was very

quick, really. He sort of described

1:43:151:43:22

it as a vast amount of prolapse

inside there. Just weeks later,

1:43:221:43:29

David had the mesh. It didn't work.

Experts told me it is harder to

1:43:291:43:35

diagnose a small prolapse without a

scam. David would have known if it

1:43:351:43:39

had have been severe. The speed of

events has left him doubting whether

1:43:391:43:43

he needed mesh at all.

I mean, it's

looking very much like that that

1:43:431:43:49

might be the case. I'm not a doctor.

I don't know.

That is how you feel?

1:43:491:43:55

Gosh, yeah.

Mr Dixon has previously said any

1:43:551:44:02

surgery could have complications and

that his operations were done in

1:44:021:44:05

good faith and the majority were

successful. Mesh does work for some

1:44:051:44:10

people. It did for Emily.

I had the

operation fully explained, what it

1:44:101:44:18

was, the reason for it.

Did that

include publications?

Yes.

Like

1:44:181:44:26

many, she had a prolapse and is one

of a handful of people to contact us

1:44:261:44:30

in support of Mr Dixon. She says he

was always professional.

It was

1:44:301:44:35

really a massive change. I felt like

I had felt before I had the

1:44:351:44:41

children. Continence was fine. All

the discomfort was gone.

I have

1:44:411:44:53

always been told mesh complication

rates are very low, and it should

1:44:531:44:57

work for most people. But where is

the evidence for this? This from the

1:44:571:45:02

pelvic floor society. Tony Dixon was

a founder member. They have only

1:45:021:45:10

just started collecting data but

admitted poor quality.

1:45:101:45:17

How can you quote those rates when

it is poor data you are basing it

1:45:211:45:28

on?

It is the only data we have. The

criticism is the same for any

1:45:281:45:37

medical research.

Back in Bristol,

the hospital said they could not

1:45:371:45:44

comment on individual cases. Spire

saved he no longer worked there.

1:45:441:45:56

Guidance is now tightening on mesh

but only after many patients

1:45:561:46:00

suffered and Tony Dixon made his

name.

I am getting by, but I have

1:46:001:46:08

lost a part of myself in that I am

not doing the performing and writing

1:46:081:46:16

because it has knocked me back.

Sometimes you look at the prognosis

1:46:161:46:21

ahead of you and it can become very

daunting. I have been told if the

1:46:211:46:28

methods I use now to continue with

my life don't work, I will have to

1:46:281:46:34

have a bag. It is something I don't

think about at my age.

You can watch

1:46:341:46:45

the report on the iPlayer after

8:30pm tonight.

1:46:451:47:03

Let's get more on the breaking news

from Nepal that there has been a

1:47:051:47:11

crash near Kathmandu airport. The

plane reportedly became unstable as

1:47:111:47:19

it descended and skidded off the

runway. Let's talk to our reporter

1:47:191:47:25

in Kathmandu. What more can you tell

us?

What we are hearing from the

1:47:251:47:33

airport authorities is that there

were 67 passengers, and it overshot

1:47:331:47:42

the runway and crashed in the

eastern part of the runway and

1:47:421:47:45

immediately caught fire. The fire

has been contained and according to

1:47:451:47:52

the authorities, 25 people have been

rushed to hospital and there are

1:47:521:47:59

some reports of casualties. The

rescue operation is ongoing.

1:47:591:48:14

rescue operation is ongoing.

What

weather conditions like as this

1:48:141:48:15

plane came in?

The weather was a bit

cloudy but not exceptional. The

1:48:151:48:28

plane just skidded off the runway

and overshot, according to the

1:48:281:48:34

general manager of the airport.

Currently the flights are all

1:48:341:48:39

cancelled.

Thank you very much.

1:48:391:48:47

cancelled.

Thank you very much. A

big reaction from you two-hour film

1:48:471:48:49

about a group of homeless people in

London who have settled on a

1:48:491:48:52

building that has been empty for

many years and they have effectively

1:48:521:48:57

invited any homeless person in to

share the shelter.

1:48:571:49:07

On Wednesday the group,

calling themselves

1:49:071:49:08

the Sofia Solidarity Centre,

will go to court to fight

1:49:081:49:11

a possession order from

the landlord in a bid to stay.

1:49:111:49:13

We gained access to the building

and spoke to some of the volunteers

1:49:131:49:16

and people living there.

1:49:161:49:19

We played you the full film earlier,

here is a short extract.

1:49:191:49:29

OK, so when we have

somebody new come in,

1:49:341:49:36

they come in the front door,

they'll be greeted here.

1:49:361:49:39

We'll ask them what they need, how

they are, what their priority is,

1:49:391:49:42

whether they want to go straight

to sleep, to eat, and we have

1:49:421:49:45

the kitchen down the end there.

1:49:451:49:47

We can provide and are providing

hot, nutritious food all the time.

1:49:471:49:50

There's tea and coffee,

some medical supplies,

1:49:501:49:51

and we have people who know how

to look after people.

1:49:511:49:54

So if somebody needs

some attention to wounds

1:49:541:49:56

or infections, we can do that.

1:49:561:49:57

We have been donated a huge amount

of clothing, bedding,

1:49:571:49:59

so whatever the people need

and whatever their priorities are,

1:49:591:50:02

we can look after them.

1:50:021:50:04

We've got sitting areas

on the ground floor here

1:50:041:50:07

and on the first floor.

1:50:071:50:14

There was electricity

already on in the building,

1:50:141:50:16

and the water was already on.

1:50:161:50:17

We just tidied up the plumbing

where there were leaks and stuff,

1:50:171:50:20

made sure everything

is safe and secure.

1:50:201:50:22

We have qualified

electricians helping us.

1:50:221:50:23

I'm a plumber-builder as well, so...

1:50:231:50:25

We do safety checks every day,

make sure there's nothing dangerous,

1:50:251:50:27

no cables to trip over,

everything's lit properly,

1:50:271:50:29

so people don't...

1:50:291:50:30

Yeah, we're keeping people safe.

1:50:301:50:32

Do you worry that you might attract

the wrong kind of attention

1:50:321:50:34

and people that don't necessarily

need help might come here?

1:50:341:50:39

It becomes quite obvious very

quickly and, yes, it may happen.

1:50:391:50:46

But that, as a percentage

of the whole of what we're doing,

1:50:461:50:48

I think it's worth it.

1:50:481:50:52

Some people might argue that

you guys aren't able to give

1:50:521:50:54

the support that a lot of the people

coming through the doors

1:50:541:50:58

need that a shelter,

a regular shelter, might be able to.

1:50:581:51:05

I'll counter that with the fact that

a lot of people who are supposedly

1:51:051:51:08

psychologists and mental health

workers have learnt it from a book.

1:51:081:51:14

We've all learned it the hard way

and we can actually give more

1:51:141:51:17

support because we've all been

down the road.

1:51:171:51:23

If any person comes

in with a particular issue,

1:51:231:51:25

there is someone here who has

already been through that issue.

1:51:251:51:27

We can actually guide people

through our own experiences,

1:51:271:51:30

empathy and listening,

so we're actually better qualified

1:51:301:51:32

than most people who are qualified.

1:51:321:51:34

What about others who might say that

you've got no business being here,

1:51:341:51:37

you don't own the building,

that you're not paying

1:51:371:51:39

rent for the building.

1:51:391:51:40

What would you say to that?

1:51:401:51:45

Our brothers and sisters

have no business being

1:51:451:51:47

on the street, freezing, dying.

1:51:471:51:51

And there are ten empty

commercial buildings for every

1:51:511:51:53

person that is registered

as street sleeping.

1:51:531:51:58

Ten empty commercial buildings

for every person who is registered

1:51:581:52:00

as sleeping on the streets.

1:52:001:52:02

I'm sorry.

1:52:021:52:03

What business model is that?

1:52:031:52:06

So, yeah, no business being here,

with 100 people here, eating,

1:52:061:52:09

sleeping, comfortably?

1:52:091:52:12

We're saving lives here.

1:52:121:52:13

I'm sorry.

1:52:131:52:14

Property?

1:52:141:52:16

I have disregard for that.

1:52:161:52:21

When the building's been empty 15

years and we can save lives with it,

1:52:211:52:24

it's our moral duty

to save those lives.

1:52:241:52:32

I have loads of comments here, I'm

just going to find them. Bear with

1:52:381:52:43

me on second. Alan says, I agree

unused buildings should be used for

1:52:431:52:49

homeless sleeping, however I don't

agree with stealing utilities.

1:52:491:52:53

Perhaps there could be away the

utility companies could provide

1:52:531:52:57

services at a nominal or for free as

most rough sleepers received money

1:52:571:53:08

from begging.

Christopher says, would the viewers

1:53:081:53:15

be so keen if they owned these

properties? Some say is what's

1:53:151:53:21

unfair is buildings being bought and

then left an empty, as their value

1:53:211:53:27

increases. Town centres lookalike

dumps because of it. Karen says most

1:53:271:53:33

cities have empty buildings and

thousands of homeless people, it is

1:53:331:53:38

not rocket. Thank you for those.

1:53:381:53:41

Tory MPs have labelled as "wrong"

and "unwise" comments

1:53:411:53:43

made by Sir Vince Cable,

that older Brexit voters

1:53:431:53:45

were "driven by nostalgia".

1:53:451:53:46

The Lib Dem leader said too many

older people who voted

1:53:461:53:49

Leave longed for a world

where "faces were white".

1:53:491:53:57

So, what motivated you to vote

Leave?

1:55:001:55:05

We can speak now to Ash

Sarkar, Senior Editor

1:55:051:55:07

at Novara Media, and Conservative

activist Aman Singh Bhogal -

1:55:071:55:15

What do you say to Vince Cable?

Bite

is wrong and disrespectful, and he's

1:55:261:55:33

not trying to unite the country with

what he has said. To make things

1:55:331:55:38

worse, I think Vince Cable has

doubled down this morning on calling

1:55:381:55:43

so many people racist.

That's not

what he said, he said I didn't say

1:55:431:55:48

that at all.

I have travelled the

country knocking on doors and the

1:55:481:55:54

overwhelming majority of people I

spoke to who wrote for Brexit was to

1:55:541:56:00

take back control of laws, money and

our borders, and to build a liberal,

1:56:001:56:06

democratic and more reclusive United

Kingdom which is fair to immigrants

1:56:061:56:09

whether they are from Eastern Europe

or India.

What would you say, Ash?

I

1:56:091:56:22

voted Remain but I was not a Remain

supporter, and I don't think all

1:56:221:56:28

Leave voters are racist. However I

do think all racists voted Leave

1:56:281:56:34

because the campaign material was so

racialised. The non-EU migrants,

1:56:341:56:39

Brown faces, stood in for the figure

in terms of Nigel Farage's breaking

1:56:391:56:44

point posters. You cannot reduce

everything to do with Leave to those

1:56:441:56:49

moments but also imperial nostalgia

is now shaping vision for a

1:56:491:56:53

post-Brexit Society. Upcoming

African trade deals have been

1:56:531:57:01

described as Empire 2.0.

I am an

older voter, I voted to leave Europe

1:57:011:57:14

and quite frankly it doesn't matter

how you dress it up, any words used

1:57:141:57:22

by Sir Vince Cable to say we are

nostalgic for white faces is

1:57:221:57:28

accusing us of being racist, there's

no other way to describe it.

And how

1:57:281:57:33

do you react to that, Harry?

I am

thoroughly offended by it because I

1:57:331:57:40

and the majority of shall we call

them grey voters are not racist at

1:57:401:57:47

all. We, if we voted back in the

70s, joined what we thought was just

1:57:471:57:55

going to be a trading market. What

we have now got is a move to some

1:57:551:58:01

sort of federalised Europe, which we

have had no consultation over.

OK,

1:58:011:58:08

I'm going to pause you there because

it is the end of the programme.

1:58:081:58:12

Thank you for your time, it was

short but sweet.

1:58:121:58:18

On the programme tomorrow -

Noel Edmonds on why he's trying

1:58:181:58:20

to sue a bank after falling victim

to a multi-million pound

1:58:201:58:23

fraud a decade ago.

1:58:231:58:24

Thank you for your company

1:58:241:58:25

Victoria talks to a parent who lost her baby to sudden infant death syndrome and wants to warn other families of the dangers.

Tributes are paid to Sir Ken Dodd - one of the last great music hall acts of his time - who has died at the age of 90.

Plus a special film about a group of homeless people in London who have set up a squat in an abandoned building where any homeless person is welcome.