15/03/2018 Victoria Derbyshire


15/03/2018

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LineFromTo

Hello, it's 9 o'clock,

I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

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welcome to the programme.

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Our top story today...

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President Trump comes out in support

of the UK's decision to expel 23

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Russian diplomats from Britain

after the nerve agent

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attack in Salisbury.

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The United States stands in absolute

solidarity with Great Britain.

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The United States

believes that Russia

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is responsible for the attack on two

people in the United Kingdom, using

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a military grade nerve agent.

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We will get reaction. Also coming up

on the programme...

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Sherry Denness was 17

when she attempted to take her own

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life nine times in ten

days at the end of last

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year before she got

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the help she needed.

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Her dad's video seeking

support for her went viral.

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Sherry Denness and her mum and dad

wll be here shortly.

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And working repeated

shifts, but for free,

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with no offer of a job

at the end of it.

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There are calls to ban the practice

of unpaid trial shifts

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and it will be debated

in Parliament.

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Did your unpaid shifts

lead to a job, or not?

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Let us know.

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Hello.

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Welcome to the programme.

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We're live until 11 this morning.

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Later, we'll be talking about beer

yoga - where you can enjoy sipping

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a nice, cold lager while

doing the downward dog.

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Can you believe that?

That is after

10am.

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Also, we definitely want to hear

your own experiences of children

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with mental health problems and how

difficult, or otherwise,

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it was to get the right help.

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We've got a searing example of how

it didn't work early

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enough for one teenager.

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We'll be talking to her

at 9.15am.

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Our top story today...

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The White House has given

its backing to Britain's decision

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to expel Russian diplomats

in retaliation for the nerve

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agent attack on Sergei

Skripal and his daughter.

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The US said it was a just response

and America stood in solidarity

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with its closest ally.

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And in a hardening of

President Trump's tone on Russia,

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his spokeswoman accused it

of undermining the security

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of countries worldwide.

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23 staff at the Russian embassy

in London have been given

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a week to leave the UK.

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However, the Kremlin continues

to deny any involvement

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in the attempted murder.

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Keith Doyle reports.

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Late-night comings and goings

at the Russian embassy

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in London - 23 diplomats considered

to be undeclared spies will be

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making preparations to leave Britain

after the decision yesterday

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to expel them.

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While Russia remains defiant

that it was not involved

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in the nerve agent attack,

other major world powers

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are backing Britain.

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Now one member stands accused

of using chemical weapons

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on the sovereign soil

of another member.

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The credibility of this council

will not survive if we fail

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to hold Russia accountable.

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"Russia was to blame,"

the Prime Minister told MPs,

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and that's why action

is being taken.

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So, Mr Speaker, there is no

alternative conclusion other

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than that the Russian state

was culpable for the attempted

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murder of Mr Skripal

and his daughter.

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This represents an unlawful use

of force by the Russian state

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against the United Kingdom.

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The Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn,

said the response should be

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based on clear evidence.

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Russia insists it was not involved

and it will retaliate.

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Prime Minister May is destroying

international law and is destroying

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the international relationship.

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Last night, Britain asked

the International Chemical Weapons

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Watchdog to verify Moscow is behind

the attack in Salisbury.

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There is now a fully-blown

diplomatic row,

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a row that looks likely to escalate

with expected tit-for-tat actions.

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And as this goes on,

Sergei Skripal and his daughter

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remain critically ill in hospital.

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Keith Doyle, BBC News.

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Our correspondent Richard

Galpin is in Moscow.

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Norman Smith is in Westminster.

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Richard, what reaction in Russia to

what President Trump has said?

There

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has been another briefing by the

Foreign Ministry spokeswoman in

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which she has said that the idea

that Russia is behind the poisoning

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is insane and she is saying the

truth behind the Skripal poisoning

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is being hidden by the British

authorities and she is of course

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saying they are working on

retaliatory measures, we do not know

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when they will be implemented, but

certainly they are working on them,

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and the widespread assumption is

they will be tit-for-tat, 23 spies,

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Russian spies, are going to be

expelled from London and the

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expectation is British diplomats in

Moscow and those deemed to be spies

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are likely to be expelled. And

possibly further measures mirroring

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what the British Government has

announced. It is interesting the

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development of the international

community, Western powers, rallying

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behind Theresa May and Britain. We

have seen the UN, a lot of

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statements expressing solidarity,

including from Nato, and the key

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question for the Russian government

is whether those countries will do

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something concrete. For example,

whether they would themselves will

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impose more sanctions. That would be

very troubling for the Kremlin.

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Norman at Westminster, 19 Labour MPs

have signed a Commons motion

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supporting the decision of the Prime

Minister to expelled the diplomats,

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spies. Why are they doing that?

Because of widespread anger among

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Labour MPs at Mr Corbyn's response

to the Salisbury attack, in the

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Commons yesterday, he appeared to

question and challenge the evidence

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pointing towards Russia. It was not

just that many Labour MPs thought he

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got the tone wrong, he also attacked

the Government for cuts to the

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police and the National Health

Service, taking Russian money. There

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was not just they thought that was

an inappropriate line to take, it is

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because they felt he failed to live

up to the moment, that at a time

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when people are being attacked, in

Britain, that, they felt, was a

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moment when he needed to stand up as

a national leader and show he was

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ready to stand up to foreign

aggression. More than that, a view

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among some Labour figures he is

betraying the history of the Labour

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Party which has, they say, always

been very patriotic, going back to

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the likes of Clement Attlee, and

there are clear signs of tension

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even right at the very top of the

party with senior figures like the

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Shadow Defence Secretary and the

Shadow Foreign Secretary, Emily

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Thornberry, both uneasy with the

stance Mr Corbyn has taken.

More

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reaction to come of course through

the morning.

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Annita McVeigh is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary

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of the rest of the day's news.

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The labratory where scientists

helped identify the nerve agent used

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in Salisbury is to get more funding

from the government

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as part of a defence

modernisation programme.

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An extra £48 million

for a new Chemical Weapons Defence

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Centre at Porton Down,

will be announced by Gavin

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Williamson in his first major speech

as Defence Secretary later today.

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The Brexit Secretary,

David Davis, has said he's prepared

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to accept the EU's offer

of a shortened transition period,

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after the UK leaves

the European Union in March, 2019.

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He said he would agree to a call

for the transition to end

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in December, 2020, if that

helped to secure a deal at

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next week's EU summit.

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Ministers are being called

on to introduce a faster phase-out

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of petrol and diesel cars,

currently set for 2040.

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The MPs have also demanded

a new Clean Air Act,

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and they say the motor industry

should finance a clean air fund.

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The Government says it'll

publish its own proposals on air

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pollution later in the year.

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Here's our environment

analyst, Roger Harrabin.

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The air in many of Britain's cities

is officially unfit to breathe.

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And the MPs are angry that,

despite a series of court cases,

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the Government hasn't cleaned it up.

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The young are particularly at risk,

and the MPs' report has drawn

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support from UN children's

organisation, UNICEF,

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which says that Britain's children

deserve to breathe clean air.

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The Government aims to end the sales

of diesel and petrol

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only vehicles by 2040,

but the MPs say that is inadequate.

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India will do it ten years earlier.

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They say government must work

with local councils to stop

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pollution-related deaths.

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This really needs to be stamped out.

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We need to improve it.

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And that's why the whole report

talked about bringing government,

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local authorities together,

so we can work across,

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not just here in London,

but across the whole country.

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The Government says it's looking

beyond cars to smokeless fuel

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and wood stoves in its strategy,

due later in the year.

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Roger Harrabin, BBC News.

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The World Health Organization

is to carry out a review

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of the potential impact of plastic

on human health.

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It follows the release

of a new study by US researchers -

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the largest of its kind -

which discovered plastic particles

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in popular brands of bottled water.

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Scientists say that there is no

evidence yet to suggest

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it is a cause for concern.

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In the past three years,

parents across England and Wales

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have been fined about £24 million

for failing to send

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their children to school.

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A BBC investigation also shows some

councils are issuing penalties

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at rates five times higher

than the average.

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Some parents say they now actively

budget for the cost of fines

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when planning holidays.

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While some councils admit

they have become stricter,

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they say they are protecting

the education of children.

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The use of food and medical

supplies as a weapon of war

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by the Syrian regime has

been branded as utterly

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abhorrent by the Foreign

Secretary, Boris Johnson,

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and International Development

Secretary Penny Mordaunt.

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In a joint statement to mark

the seven years of conflict

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which has gripped the country,

they are branding the war

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as one of the longest

and bloodiest in recent history.

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A 20-year-old woman has been

jailed for six months

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in the American state of Minnesota

for fatally shooting her boyfriend

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in a botched YouTube video

they hoped would go viral.

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Pedro Ruiz convinced Monalisa Perez

to shoot him at close range

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with a powerful pistol,

believing that a thick

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book he held in front

of his chest would shield him.

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He died at the scene.

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Some MPs and lawyers have

called for a blanket ban

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on unpaid shift work.

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Companies can currently invite

prospective employees to do trial

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shifts with the carrot of a job

at the end.

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But there has been a six-fold

increase over three years

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in complaints over unpaid shifts,

according to the trade union Unite.

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On Friday, a Private Members'

Bill which seeks to make

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unpaid trials illegal

will get its second

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parliamentary reading.

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That's a summary of the latest BBC

News - more at 9:30.

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Good morning. Get in touch with us,

you're very welcome. You can use

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Twitter, e-mail or message us on

Facebook.

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In a moment, a pretty heartbreaking

story from a teenager, a young

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woman, who attempted to take her own

life nine times in the space of ten

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days. She is here with her mum and

dad and she will talk specifically

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about the care she found difficult

to access. They want to improve the

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mental health care teenagers and

young people get. Your expenses

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really welcome. We would like to

feed those into the conversation

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with Sherry and her mum and dad. Do

get in touch.

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Let's get some sport with Hugh.

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Most wanted five English sides in

the Champions League, but it is just

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two.

Just two. We saw Man United go

out in such a disappointing way, as

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tough as we thought it would be for

Chelsea last night in the Champions

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League.

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They went away to Spanish League

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leaders Barcelona and had some

confidence after a 1-1 first leg

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draw and the fact they hadn't

lost at the Nou Camp

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on their last four visits.

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However, the were stung

by the five-time Ballon D'or

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winner Lionel Messi.

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Having gone his first eight games

against Chelsea without a goal,

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he scored the equaliser in the first

leg and scored two while setting up

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the other last night.

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And it was a case of the nutmeg!

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The first came after just

a couple of minutes,

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deceiving Thibaut Courtois

in the Chelsea goal.

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His second,

different end, different

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foot, same result.

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In fact it finished 3-0 on the night

to Barca, and means Liverpool

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and Manchester City will be the two

British clubs in the

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quarter-final draw tomorrow.

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There were better scenes

for Arsenal's Women last night -

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they stunned favourites

Manchester City to win

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the Continental Tyres Cup

for a record fifth time -

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1-0 - thanks to

Vivianne Miedema's goal.

0:13:490:13:53

Eddie Jones, disappointing Six

Nations, apologising for offending

0:13:530:13:56

some other home nations.

Not great

for Eddie Jones. England head coach.

0:13:560:14:01

You might remember the pictures of

him being verbally abused by

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Scotland rugby fans and the sport

was left disgusted, but once again

0:14:040:14:09

braced against words from Jones

himself at a port last summer, he

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described the Irish as... And Wales

as not very nice place, shall we

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say. He has apologised unreservedly,

saying he was very sorry for any

0:14:200:14:27

offence, no ski since, he said he

should not have said what he did,

0:14:270:14:30

but added motivation for the Ireland

team -- no excuses.

And no Ruby

0:14:300:14:40

Walsh for the rest of the Cheltenham

Festival. Awful fall for the top

0:14:400:14:44

jockey rest Tony McRae yesterday.

--

awful fall for the top jockey

0:14:440:14:51

yesterday. The serious injury

yesterday, he went to hospital with

0:14:510:14:55

a suspected broken leg, he found

that the second last fence and it

0:14:550:14:59

seems he has broken the same local

four months ago, only just made a

0:14:590:15:05

return to racing, and he will miss

the rest of the festival including

0:15:050:15:11

Freddie's Gold. The Big Race Was The

Queen Mother Champion Chase

0:15:110:15:21

Queen Mother Champion Chase Altior

Easley came home first. Finally,

0:15:240:15:27

some bad news from South Korea. GB

cannot win a medal in the curling.

0:15:270:15:34

They lost Korea in the penultimate

round Robin Knoche. In the

0:15:340:15:43

afternoon's session, Norway's

victory over Slovakia, it means the

0:15:430:15:48

Brits are out, even if they beat

China, some disappointment for

0:15:480:15:53

Paralympics GB in Pyeongchang.

More

through the morning.

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When she was 17, Sherry Denness

tried to kill herself

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nine times in 10 days.

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That was last November.

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Now 18, Sherry's been

diagnosed with a number

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of mental health conditions,

including borderline personality

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disorder and attention deficit

hyperactivity disorder or ADHD.

0:16:160:16:23

On seven of her nine attempts,

Sherry went to A&E,

0:16:230:16:26

where she was patched up and deemed

well enough to be sent home

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with no further help.

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Things came to a head

when she was found near the local

0:16:300:16:33

train station and was eventually

sectioned under

0:16:330:16:35

the Mental Health Act.

0:16:350:16:36

BBC Stories has been

following Sherry.

0:16:360:16:43

She's doing better now.

0:16:430:16:46

We will talk to her in a moment.

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She and her parents

feel she was badly

0:16:510:16:52

let down by mental health services

over a period of many years

0:16:520:16:55

and they feel places like hospitals

should be better equipped to cope

0:16:550:16:58

with children in crisis.

0:16:580:16:59

Sherry's dad posted this

online to help raise

0:16:590:17:01

awareness of their campaign.

0:17:010:17:03

PIANO PLAYS

0:17:030:17:10

The video has had more

than 5.5 million views

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and the campaign hashtag

"wecaresherry" has

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been shared widely.

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Sherry and her mum Andi and dad

Chris are here now...

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Good morning to all of you. Thank

you for coming on the programme. How

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are you, first of all?

I was

nervous, but I'm OK.

We will look

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after you. Tell us about the

campaign and what it's been like to

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have this incredible support from

millions of people, most of whom are

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strangers.

I can't even... I have

always had the mindset that I am not

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a very liked person because the

issues I have gone through. I was

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bullied at school. I had quite a

rough time with it. I have always

0:19:190:19:24

been of the mindset that not a lot

of people care about me apart from

0:19:240:19:28

the people who have to do, like my

parents! So seeing it exposed, that

0:19:280:19:36

I was under section, when it was

launched, and I had phoned time. I

0:19:360:19:41

saw it, and I thought, wow.

You were

sectioned at that time?

I was in the

0:19:410:19:47

hospital, yes. I was 200 miles away

from my parents. I checked on my

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Facebook and the video that you just

played has come up on there. I was

0:19:510:20:00

like... Where are all these people

coming from?

How did it make you

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feel to know people did care?

Very

important, it made me feel a lot

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better. A lot better.

I know you are

comfortable talking about some of

0:20:110:20:19

your diagnoses, including borderline

personality disorder and ADHD. Can

0:20:190:20:22

you give any insights to our

audience into the kind of voices you

0:20:220:20:28

have heard in your head in the past?

I've had delusions since I was quite

0:20:280:20:33

young. My first delusion was when I

was 12. They come in the forms of

0:20:330:20:40

site, and they come in the forms of

hearing as well. The site is really

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scary because it's, how can you look

at me right now and see in perfect

0:20:450:20:51

detail because I'm right here? --

the sight is really scary. You are

0:20:510:20:57

scared because everyone else tells

you it's not real. The voices are

0:20:570:21:01

the same. Sometimes they can be

inner thoughts. And it will just

0:21:010:21:06

come from within. But sometimes you

will actually hear it as if is

0:21:060:21:09

external. Again, people tell you

nothing is there. It's a really

0:21:090:21:16

dark, scary and lonely place.

There

will be people watching who can

0:21:160:21:20

relate to this. I want to let our

audience know that we will talk in

0:21:200:21:24

detail about the kind of things you

have experienced and perhaps if you

0:21:240:21:28

have young children you might not

want them to hear, but it's your

0:21:280:21:31

decision. What kind of things would

you see and what kind of things with

0:21:310:21:36

the voices say to you?

I used to

have three delusions. They sometimes

0:21:360:21:43

come back when I am in a really bad

state. Or I am emotionally

0:21:430:21:49

regularised. One is called Ciaran,

one is Anna and one is Alice. Ciaran

0:21:490:21:57

is a really horrible man who would

stand outside my window at night and

0:21:570:22:02

wave at me. He would speak to me as

well. Alice was a little girl who

0:22:020:22:09

didn't say anything. She would just

walk around my room. And Anna, when

0:22:090:22:14

I had anorexia, I developed another

voice called Anna, and it was that

0:22:140:22:21

voice who was always telling me,

don't eat. But Ciaran would say

0:22:210:22:26

things like, if you don't hurt

yourself, or if you don't do this to

0:22:260:22:34

yourself, or tell lies, or whatever,

then I will kill your family. It was

0:22:340:22:42

very real. So I would do it because

I was scared for my family. It would

0:22:420:22:49

be visions. When I am in that state,

I'm thinking, he is showing me

0:22:490:22:54

visions, he can actually do this.

It

must have been terrifying.

It was,

0:22:540:23:00

it was horrible. He told me one

night to sit in the garden at three

0:23:000:23:04

in the morning. And not come out,

and cover myself in a black blanket.

0:23:040:23:10

I was cold, I wanted to go in

because I was cold, and he would

0:23:100:23:18

say, no, you don't deserve to. That

kind of stuff.

And this led to last

0:23:180:23:25

November when you are tempted to

take your own life multiple times in

0:23:250:23:29

a short period of time, in ten days.

You were taken to A&E a number of

0:23:290:23:34

times. And then you would be

released when the physical side of

0:23:340:23:40

things had been cleared up, is that

correct?

Yes.

What were you thinking

0:23:400:23:46

when you were discharged?

At that

point in time, I was not in the

0:23:460:23:50

right mindset. I was thinking, good,

because I can do it again.

Really?

0:23:500:23:56

Speaking to your mother now, what

were you thinking when she was

0:23:560:23:59

discharged?

God, yeah, what on

earth?! From our point of view, once

0:23:590:24:07

is enough. We have had to hold

Sherry's hand when she has done

0:24:070:24:14

things to herself and she is in a

coma, and to nurse your child that

0:24:140:24:21

your bedside, watching, no response

to every single pressure point and

0:24:210:24:26

every single thing they do to class

you in a coma, and to see your child

0:24:260:24:33

in that fragile state, it's a bit

like today, it's surreal. Is this

0:24:330:24:39

really happening? This can't really

be happening. And when they let your

0:24:390:24:43

child go, you're just like, what?!

Do you know what I mean? So we were

0:24:430:24:54

just left thinking, what the heck,

literally, what the heck.

And what

0:24:540:24:59

was it like for you as Sherry's dad,

knowing the potentially the physical

0:24:590:25:05

side of things had been treated, but

mentally, clearly, there was so much

0:25:050:25:10

going on.

It was a difficult time

for everyone. It was try to get the

0:25:100:25:14

nurses or somebody on our side, to

say, will you listen to what we are

0:25:140:25:19

saying to you, because if you

release her, she will try and do the

0:25:190:25:23

worst. It kept happening and

happening.

But what you were saying

0:25:230:25:28

would happen, it would happen, and

yet she would still be released.

0:25:280:25:33

Exactly, and this was a pattern that

happened not only in that ten days,

0:25:330:25:37

but since she came onto the radar,

if you like, of mental health, when

0:25:370:25:43

she was 11. I remember the first

time she self harm that 13. We

0:25:430:25:47

looked at each other and thought,

where did that come from? It was a

0:25:470:25:55

progression we never ever

anticipated. And that was really

0:25:550:25:57

tough.

You say Sherry was 11 when

she was first assessed by CAMS.

She

0:25:570:26:13

said -- they said she was naughty

and attention seeking and her

0:26:130:26:15

delusions were fake.

They said that

within earshot of me when I was 11

0:26:150:26:20

years old. They took me in for an

assessment for ADHD and I heard the

0:26:200:26:24

person who assessed me saying to my

mother that she was an attention

0:26:240:26:31

seeker, and it was a behavioural

thing.

That she was looking for

0:26:310:26:36

attention. We have had to fight for

her every step of the way. There

0:26:360:26:39

hasn't been a day gone by that we

haven't been exhausted by the fight.

0:26:390:26:42

You get to the end of it and think,

I can't take any more, and then

0:26:420:26:47

something else happens. And every

day you think, this is the bottom,

0:26:470:26:51

we will get up now, because we are

really positive people. But no,

0:26:510:26:57

there is a new bottom. This kept

happening and happening, over and

0:26:570:27:02

over again. We have always wanted to

launch a campaign, because we have

0:27:020:27:05

always felt there is no help for

young people. We are saying between

0:27:050:27:11

the age of 10-25. Because even

though you are an adult at 18,

0:27:110:27:18

really, what makes you one day a

child and 1-dayer adult?

That's

0:27:180:27:26

normality transition for somebody

with mental health, at 17 you are

0:27:260:27:30

still a child, but at 18 you have

adult responsibilities. For somebody

0:27:300:27:35

with mental health, who doesn't fit

into the category of normal, it's a

0:27:350:27:38

very stressful and hard time. There

should be more support.

But you were

0:27:380:27:43

not getting that support when you

are 17 either really. Until you

0:27:430:27:48

section, which is what you wanted,

which is after the ninth time you

0:27:480:27:51

are tempted to... You were found at

a train station. The police found

0:27:510:27:58

you, and they took the decision to

section you, which you were relieved

0:27:580:28:02

about.

The legs nearly went from

under me. I was gobsmacked.

0:28:020:28:12

under me. I was gobsmacked. PCP

Turcotte and Dan Ayrton are our

0:28:120:28:14

heroes, without a shadow of a doubt.

-- PC Peter Coe. We can't thank

0:28:140:28:23

those individuals enough.

You say

you were seen in that period of ten

0:28:230:28:30

days by 18 different health care

professionals. That's quite

0:28:300:28:32

extraordinary. Are you saying that

nobody was joining the dots up

0:28:320:28:37

effectively?

I don't think it was a

case of them not joining the dots

0:28:370:28:43

up. It was more a case of them not

wanting to. I have been dealt with a

0:28:430:28:47

lot in hospitals, main hospitals,

paediatric wards, and there is a

0:28:470:28:55

massive taboo about it. Nobody

really wants to talk about it,

0:28:550:29:00

nobody really wants to help. That's

why I am continuing with this

0:29:000:29:04

campaign.

There are people who do

want to help and organisations,

0:29:040:29:09

because we have had them on this

programme. It seems really sad you

0:29:090:29:12

were not put in touch with one of

those. Chris Conley you did this

0:29:120:29:18

video that went viral. It's very

poignant, I have to say. -- Chris,

0:29:180:29:25

you did this video. What is the

point of this, it has been seen

0:29:250:29:29

millions of times, so what do you

want to change as a result of your

0:29:290:29:33

family's experience?

All the bad my

family has gone through, we want to

0:29:330:29:38

make a positive change and help

young people, give them support and

0:29:380:29:41

let them know there are people

there. The reason for doing the

0:29:410:29:44

video was to give an insight into

what it is like for Sherry, what she

0:29:440:29:53

was suffering, and give people an

insight on what it is like for

0:29:530:29:57

parents who have children who suffer

with mental health. I did the video

0:29:570:30:01

thinking maybe a couple of hundred

people would watch it, and every

0:30:010:30:05

couple of days it would go up more

and more.

I have some messages.

0:30:050:30:11

There is one I have left over there

from a young woman called Georgina,

0:30:110:30:15

who is 21. She talked about being

diagnosed with mental health

0:30:150:30:20

issues... I can't find it. I have

just printed it out... It is so

0:30:200:30:24

pertinent to you. Let me find it.

0:30:240:30:31

I would like to share my

experiences. I'm 21, diagnosed with

0:30:310:30:37

clinical depression at 13 after a

series of self harm issues. After

0:30:370:30:41

visiting my school nurse and GP, it

took eight months for me to be

0:30:410:30:46

referred to talking therapy with a

child and adolescent mental health

0:30:460:30:50

service. The quality of the therapy

was so poor it worse and my mental

0:30:500:30:54

health and I was under the age of 18

I was refused any appropriate

0:30:540:30:58

medication. I was patronised and

dismissed by the person I was told

0:30:580:31:02

to speak to.

0:31:020:31:12

Discharged and then relapsed, it

took a further five months to get an

0:31:150:31:18

appointment with a psychologist. It

was only when I reached 18 and 20

0:31:180:31:21

university I receive treatment I

needed. I have been on medication

0:31:210:31:22

for over three years now and I am

better than ever. Some of that, you

0:31:220:31:26

can relate to?

Terrible. I can

totally relate to that.

That is what

0:31:260:31:28

struck us, it was not an isolated

case, we knew that, but we did not

0:31:280:31:32

realise just how many people are

just like us and it gave us hope as

0:31:320:31:38

well.

Why don't you explain what

this is, Sherry? Such a wonderful

0:31:380:31:44

idea, you send this out to people

who are feeling like nobody cares.

0:31:440:31:48

On our website, we have at the

bottom of the page a button that

0:31:480:31:53

says, apply for a recovery box. I

make them myself from scratch,

0:31:530:31:59

handmade. I do absolutely

everything.

0:31:590:32:05

everything. There is a little

inventory slip and a message that is

0:32:050:32:13

always personalised, a poem, some

sweet treats, a diary for thoughts,

0:32:130:32:19

colouring, for destruction, stressed

toys -- colouring for distraction,

0:32:190:32:27

stress toys.

This is going to a girl

in Essex.

Yes.

Age?

We're not sure.

0:32:270:32:42

The Government promised in 2015 £1.4

billion over five years to transform

0:32:420:32:49

child and adolescent mental health

services and they are committed to

0:32:490:32:56

employing more therapists and

supervisors, what do you say?

A

0:32:560:33:00

little bit too late, really. The

help needs to happen now, it is

0:33:000:33:05

disgusting, when you look at primary

school, you can start to see

0:33:050:33:09

patterns of children's behaviour, we

are talking about as young as year

0:33:090:33:16

three, four, five, and, really, for

us, it is not websites that are

0:33:160:33:21

needed, paper information, ring this

number, it is face to face. People

0:33:210:33:25

need early intervention. Schools

need to have a person, whether a

0:33:250:33:32

specialist teacher or another type

of classroom assistant, that is

0:33:320:33:37

trained in recognising early-onset

adolescent mental health issues.

0:33:370:33:45

Because if Sherry had received the

help at 11, just before crossing

0:33:450:33:51

over to senior school, then she

would have been on the right track

0:33:510:33:54

and we may not have gone down the

road of self harm and all of the

0:33:540:33:59

other stuff. Actually, research

shows, self harm is a cry because

0:33:590:34:10

they get so far with their mental

health, there is nowhere to go in

0:34:100:34:15

their head, nowhere to go, and then

you get self harm. We have heard

0:34:150:34:21

stories of parents being given safe

self harming kits, that is

0:34:210:34:26

ludicrous. I do not understand, why

would we be reactive sea society

0:34:260:34:32

when we should be proactive and that

means getting children the help they

0:34:320:34:38

desperately need -- a reactive

society. We are working so hard to

0:34:380:34:45

help other parents, we have a secret

group for parents, carers, foster

0:34:450:34:51

carers, adoptive parents, whoever is

caring for a young person, and we

0:34:510:34:56

help them with different topics,

Q&As weekly, they can ask whatever

0:34:560:35:03

they like, we're not experts, we do

not claim to be experts, but what we

0:35:030:35:09

are is we are experienced in this

through our own experience. If we

0:35:090:35:15

can help, which they say we are

helping, it does not feel like we

0:35:150:35:19

are, but they say massively we are

helping, and if we can help one set

0:35:190:35:25

of parents, then, great. And Sherry

has come on board with the campaign

0:35:250:35:30

recently and she does more live

things on the site and interacts

0:35:300:35:36

with her audience and stuff like

that. That has been really positive

0:35:360:35:41

as well.

Thank you. Well done. Thank

you very much for being on the

0:35:410:35:47

programme. If you want help or

advice on mental health issues,

0:35:470:35:53

please go to the BBC action line

website and I have got some messages

0:35:530:35:59

from you and a lot of love for you

as well, Sherry. I will read some of

0:35:590:36:04

those through the programme.

0:36:040:36:06

Still to come...

0:36:060:36:08

It's seven years since

the war in Syria began.

0:36:080:36:10

We'll speak to people living

through the conflict.

0:36:100:36:12

And could more than 100 homeless

people seeking shelter

0:36:120:36:18

in an empty commercial building

in central London be

0:36:180:36:20

forced to leave?

0:36:200:36:25

Time for the latest news.

0:36:250:36:26

Here's Annita.

0:36:260:36:28

The BBC News

headlines this morning.

0:36:280:36:30

The White House has given

its backing to Britain's

0:36:300:36:33

decision to expel Russian diplomats

in retaliation for the nerve

0:36:330:36:37

agent attack on Sergei

Skripal and his daughter.

0:36:370:36:40

The US said it was a just response

and America stood in solidarity

0:36:400:36:44

with its closest ally.

0:36:440:36:46

And in a hardening of

President Trump's tone on Russia,

0:36:460:36:50

his spokeswoman accused it

of undermining the security

0:36:500:36:52

of countries worldwide.

0:36:520:36:54

23 staff at the Russian embassy

in London have been given

0:36:540:36:57

a week to leave the UK.

0:36:570:36:59

However, the Kremlin continues

to deny any involvement

0:36:590:37:00

in the attempted murder.

0:37:000:37:04

The labratory

where scientists helped identify

0:37:040:37:07

the nerve agent used in Salisbury

is to get more funding from

0:37:070:37:10

the Government as part of a defence

modernisation programme.

0:37:100:37:13

An extra £48 million

for a new Chemical Weapons Defence

0:37:130:37:16

Centre at Porton Down

will be announced by Gavin

0:37:160:37:19

Williamson in his first major speech

as Defence Secretary later today.

0:37:190:37:26

The investigation into the fire

at Grenfell Tower has

0:37:260:37:28

found the fire doors may not have

been as effective as they

0:37:280:37:31

were supposed to be.

0:37:310:37:32

The Metropolitan Police tested

a door designed to resist

0:37:320:37:34

fire for half an hour and found

that it only lasted 15 minutes.

0:37:340:37:37

The investigation is ongoing.

0:37:370:37:44

The Brexit Secretary, David Davis,

has said he's prepared

0:37:440:37:48

to accept the EU's offer

of a shortened transition period,

0:37:480:37:50

after the UK leaves

the European Union in March, 2019.

0:37:500:37:54

He said he would agree to a call

for the transition to end

0:37:540:37:57

in December, 2020, if that

helped to secure a deal at

0:37:570:38:01

next week's EU summit.

0:38:010:38:04

The World Health Organization

is to carry out

0:38:040:38:05

a review of the potential impact

of plastic on human health.

0:38:050:38:13

It follows the release

of a new study by US researchers -

0:38:130:38:17

the largest of its kind -

which discovered plastic particles

0:38:170:38:19

in popular brands of bottled water.

0:38:190:38:21

Scientists say that there is no

evidence yet to suggest

0:38:210:38:23

it is a cause for concern.

0:38:230:38:26

In the past three years,

parents across England and Wales

0:38:260:38:29

have been fined about £24 million

for failing to send

0:38:290:38:32

their children to school.

0:38:320:38:34

A BBC investigation also shows some

councils are issuing

0:38:340:38:36

penalties at rates five times higher

than the average.

0:38:360:38:42

Some parents say they now actively

budget for the cost of fines

0:38:420:38:44

when planning holidays.

0:38:440:38:46

While some councils admit

they have become stricter,

0:38:460:38:48

they say they are protecting

the education of children.

0:38:480:38:52

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

0:38:520:38:58

We will bring you more detail on the

story reported on them, the flat

0:38:580:39:05

doors in Grenfell Tower could only

hold back a blaze for half the time

0:39:050:39:10

they were supposed to, according to

investigators. Messages from Europe

0:39:100:39:14

at the interview with Sherry, Marine

A says, I'm so pleased she is

0:39:140:39:20

receiving the treatment she

deserves. Incredibly brave. From an

0:39:200:39:26

18-year-old who does not wish us to

use her name, I'm 18, struggling

0:39:260:39:31

with depression and an eating

disorder after turning 16, in my

0:39:310:39:35

area, the way to be seen by a mental

health specialist was just under

0:39:350:39:40

three months. For someone struggling

a lot. But someone struggling a lot,

0:39:400:39:45

this time period was extensive and

unsuitable. Once I was finally seen,

0:39:450:39:50

it was difficult not to feel guilty

because you were constantly told how

0:39:500:39:54

many children were on waiting lists.

I felt like saying, you may as well

0:39:540:39:58

give it to them if they needed than

me. When I turned 18, I was going to

0:39:580:40:03

be discharged from the service. I

was at my worst in terms of my

0:40:030:40:10

mental state. Because of me becoming

an adult, it was overnight by mental

0:40:100:40:14

health team were no longer

interested in treating me. I had to

0:40:140:40:18

wait a further eight weeks to be

reviewed by a and adult dental

0:40:180:40:24

health team -- by an adult mental

health team.

0:40:240:40:29

Here's some sport now.

0:40:290:40:30

Chelsea were the latest British

team to be knocked out

0:40:300:40:33

of the Champions League last night

after a 3-0 defeat

0:40:330:40:35

awat at Barcelona.

0:40:350:40:36

Lionel Messi scored

twice on the night.

0:40:360:40:38

It means Manchester City

and Liverpool are the only domestic

0:40:380:40:40

sides in the hat for

Friday's quarterfinal draw.

0:40:400:40:47

Good news for Arsenal fans -

the club secured its first piece

0:40:470:40:49

of silverware this season

as they shocked Manchester City

0:40:490:40:52

to win the Continental Tyres Cup -

it finished 1-0 thanks

0:40:520:40:54

to Vivienne Miedema's winner.

0:40:540:40:55

The Cheltenham Festival's all-time

leading rider Ruby Walsh will miss

0:40:550:40:58

the rest of this week's

event after a fall.

0:40:580:41:01

Walsh has a suspected leg fracture

to the same leg with which he has

0:41:010:41:05

just spent four months away from the

sport with injury. Great Britain

0:41:050:41:08

cannot win a medal in the wheelchair

curling. Defeat to South Korea

0:41:080:41:14

earlier and Norway's victory over

Slovakia means the Brits cannot

0:41:140:41:18

reach the medal play-offs. More

sport in the next hour.

0:41:180:41:23

Seven years ago today, the first

deaths happened in what has

0:41:230:41:25

become the war in Syria.

0:41:250:41:28

It started as a peaceful uprising,

and no-one expected the full-scale

0:41:280:41:30

conflict that unfolded.

0:41:300:41:32

Since then, more than half

a million have been killed.

0:41:320:41:35

6 million people have been forced

to leave their homes.

0:41:350:41:37

And 13 million have

needed humanitarian aid.

0:41:370:41:39

It's a conflict that has

demonstrated both the best

0:41:390:41:41

and the worst of humanity.

0:41:410:41:48

Allegations of a leader using

chemical weapons on his own people

0:41:480:41:50

and starvation and malnutrition

in the harsh winter conditions.

0:41:500:41:52

The Syrian people remain caught

in an international power struggle

0:41:520:42:00

between those that support and those

that oppose President

0:42:000:42:02

Bashar Al-Assad.

0:42:020:42:03

This film is a snapshot of where

we are today in Syria's history.

0:42:030:42:11

It's complicated, so

you might want to sit

0:42:110:42:14

down and take it all in.

0:42:140:42:17

Syria has now been at

war for seven years.

0:42:170:42:19

And if anything, it's getting worse.

0:42:190:42:27

Peaceful protests turned

into a civil war, but,

0:42:270:42:30

and this is the key to understanding

what's really going on,

0:42:300:42:33

that civil war has now morphed

into something else,

0:42:330:42:35

a conflict of global dimensions

playing out within Syria.

0:42:350:42:42

In a second, we'll explore why,

but first, who is involved?

0:42:420:42:45

Well, you've still got the forces

of President Bashar al-Assad.

0:42:450:42:50

He's backed up by Russia,

as well as Iran and various

0:42:500:42:53

powerful Shia militias.

0:42:530:42:54

Then you've got the rebels.

0:42:540:42:57

Now, they've been taking

an absolute battering,

0:42:570:43:00

but they are still fighting on.

0:43:000:43:02

Two of the biggest are called Jaysh

al-Islam and Ahrar al-Sham.

0:43:020:43:05

Up in the north are the Kurds.

0:43:050:43:08

They're an ethnic group that

are spread right across the region,

0:43:080:43:11

and now hold large areas

of the north of the country.

0:43:110:43:14

They're allies of the US.

0:43:140:43:17

There's also Turkey,

which is fighting Kurdish forces.

0:43:170:43:20

And Israel, which is launching air

strikes in the South.

0:43:200:43:26

And finally, the Islamic State

group, the fanatical jihadists

0:43:260:43:28

who took over large parts of Syria

and Iraq, grabbing the world's

0:43:280:43:31

attention with their brutality.

0:43:310:43:33

They've lost almost

all their territory,

0:43:330:43:37

but they are still a threat.

0:43:370:43:40

But if you really want to understand

what's going on in Syria,

0:43:400:43:43

you need to know why

people are fighting.

0:43:430:43:51

Since the very start,

President Assad has had one

0:43:520:43:55

objective - staying in power.

0:43:550:43:57

And he's been prepared to do pretty

much anything to achieve it.

0:43:570:44:04

Although he denies it, the West has

accused him of war crimes.

0:44:040:44:09

From indiscriminate bombing,

to using chemical weapons,

0:44:090:44:11

his forces are thought to have been

responsible for most

0:44:110:44:14

of the conflict's deaths.

0:44:140:44:17

Assad's main target has always been

the groups that he calls terrorists,

0:44:170:44:19

but most others call rebels.

0:44:190:44:21

They share one aim -

to overthrow him.

0:44:210:44:23

But in truth, that's

really all they have

0:44:230:44:26

in common in many cases.

0:44:260:44:28

They started fighting

after the government's brutal

0:44:280:44:32

crackdown on peaceful protests

back in 2011.

0:44:320:44:37

And at first, they included army

defectors, members of civil society.

0:44:370:44:40

But as the war has ground

on and got more brutal,

0:44:400:44:42

many of them have been pushed

out or killed.

0:44:420:44:45

Lots of the groups still fighting

are now hardline Islamists.

0:44:450:44:52

Finally, as I mentioned before,

you've got the Kurds in the north.

0:44:520:44:56

There is more than 20 million

of them across the region,

0:44:560:44:59

but they've never had

their own state.

0:44:590:45:03

Understanding that is crucial

to understanding the Kurds.

0:45:030:45:05

Soon after the start of the war,

Kurdish forces took control

0:45:050:45:08

of the area they call Rojava.

0:45:080:45:11

That's after the

government pulled out.

0:45:110:45:15

Their main fight is for

autonomy and against IS.

0:45:150:45:20

But one of the reasons

Syria is such a mess

0:45:200:45:23

is because it's become a proxy war

for international powers.

0:45:230:45:26

So why did they get involved?

0:45:260:45:30

Well, President Assad is Russia's

closest ally in the region.

0:45:300:45:34

If he fell, Russia would lose

its key foothold in the Middle East.

0:45:340:45:38

It would also lose Tartus,

its only Mediterranean port.

0:45:380:45:41

It could not let that happen.

0:45:410:45:45

For Iran, this was partly

about supporting an old ally,

0:45:450:45:48

but more than that,

it was about countering

0:45:480:45:50

the influence of their regional

rivals, Saudi Arabia,

0:45:500:45:52

and spreading their own

influence across the region.

0:45:520:45:56

The consensus is that

in achieving their goals,

0:45:560:45:59

both Russia and Iran have

outplayed everyone else.

0:45:590:46:02

While the US, Turkey and the Gulf

states offered some support

0:46:020:46:05

to various rebel groups,

Russia and Iran decided not only

0:46:050:46:08

that they wanted Assad to win,

but that they would make

0:46:080:46:11

sure he did.

0:46:110:46:13

Against Russian air power

and Iranian-backed militias,

0:46:130:46:15

the rebels have been badly

outmatched.

0:46:150:46:19

Now no one is seriously

talking about Assad being

0:46:190:46:21

forced to give up power.

0:46:210:46:24

The US always said it

wanted him to leave,

0:46:240:46:27

but never took decisive action

to actually make it happen.

0:46:270:46:31

Maybe as it feared

what would replace him.

0:46:310:46:39

The rise of IS, with their gruesome

propaganda, was a far more

0:46:400:46:43

straightforward enemy,

and became the focus.

0:46:430:46:45

The US worked with, trained

and armed a group called

0:46:450:46:47

The Syrian Democratic Forces.

0:46:470:46:49

Although they're mostly made up

of Kurdish fighters called the YPG.

0:46:490:46:52

They were crucial in driving IS out

of north-eastern Syria.

0:46:520:46:56

One of Turkey's main roles has been

giving shelter to millions

0:46:560:47:00

of Syrians fleeing the conflict,

but they've also supported

0:47:000:47:03

the rebel group called

the Free Syrian Army,

0:47:030:47:08

and are accused

of funding jihadists.

0:47:080:47:11

Turkey also fears Kurdish autonomy

in Syria, as it thinks it would fuel

0:47:110:47:14

separatism in Turkey.

0:47:140:47:15

And so it's launched

a war against the YPG,

0:47:150:47:17

who it says are terrorists.

0:47:170:47:20

Although remember, the YPG

are the same fighters who are armed

0:47:200:47:22

by and allied with the US.

0:47:220:47:25

As a consequence, Turkey,

a member of Nato, is now working

0:47:250:47:28

closely with Russia.

0:47:280:47:34

Down south, Israel's main concern

has been the growing

0:47:340:47:37

influence of its arch foe,

Iran, and high-tech weaponry getting

0:47:370:47:40

in the hands of Hezbollah.

0:47:400:47:45

And so a global conflict plays out

within Syria's borders,

0:47:450:47:48

with Russia now calling the shots.

0:47:480:47:51

The war in Syria is as complicated

and bloody as ever.

0:47:510:47:55

People are still dying.

0:47:550:47:56

Lives are still being torn apart.

0:47:560:47:59

And the nation, global powers

and, most importantly,

0:47:590:48:01

the people of Syria,

are being drawn further

0:48:010:48:04

into a situation that it's hard

to see a way out of.

0:48:040:48:12

Let's talk now to Ishmael Hamoud.

0:48:130:48:17

He is the first unaccompanied child

to enter the UK under

0:48:170:48:21

the Dubs Amendment -

that's a tweak to a piece of EU law

0:48:210:48:24

which means a number of children

with no family in the UK have been

0:48:240:48:27

able to come here to live.

0:48:270:48:31

Ahmad Khanshour lives

in Eastern Ghouta where thousands

0:48:310:48:33

of people have been killed over

the past three weeks.

0:48:330:48:37

Lina Shamy left Eastern Aleppo

during the violence

0:48:370:48:40

with her husband.

0:48:400:48:47

Bissan Fakih is a human rights

activist - she escaped from Syria

0:48:470:48:50

to neighbouring Lebanon.

0:48:500:48:51

Thank you for talking to us. We

spoke to you a couple of weeks ago

0:48:510:48:57

in Eastern Ghouta, and our audience

knows it has been bombarded by your

0:48:570:49:02

government. What's it been like

since then?

Good morning, and thank

0:49:020:49:07

you for having me again.

0:49:070:49:12

you for having me again. Assad

exaggerates his violence, using

0:49:130:49:18

another attempt, and his friends

have made it clear they disrespect

0:49:180:49:24

the whole world and international

community. 600 civilians have been

0:49:240:49:31

killed since the resolution in the

UN was passed. I can read to your

0:49:310:49:36

message from a doctor in a recently

surrounded town in Eastern Ghouta.

0:49:360:49:43

We heard last from him yesterday and

nobody knows what has happened there

0:49:430:49:49

since. He says, this town is being

eliminated. The regime army has

0:49:490:49:57

entered the town from the East. I

tried to flee out but couldn't. Our

0:49:570:50:03

whole family was killed in front of

me by an air strike. I returned my

0:50:030:50:11

children to the shelter and came out

alone to tell our story. The army is

0:50:110:50:15

advancing from different points.

Tens of people have been killed,

0:50:150:50:19

more than 5000 people in the town

are threatened with elimination.

0:50:190:50:25

Please send our message to the rest

of the world. This may be the last

0:50:250:50:29

message I can send. The wounded are

on the streets and cannot be

0:50:290:50:33

transferred. They are targeting any

moving object. Families are trying

0:50:330:50:42

to flee under shelling. We don't

know what has happened to them. The

0:50:420:50:48

regime army is shelling the town

with all sorts of weapons and we

0:50:480:50:52

don't know what happened to the

family that fled under the shelling.

0:50:520:50:56

There are many casualties on the

streets, nobody is aiding them.

0:50:560:51:02

Their fate is unknown. We don't know

what will happen to us. There are

0:51:020:51:10

machine guns, artillery shelling and

air strikes targeting people who are

0:51:100:51:13

trying to flee. Please help the town

by bringing our voices to the world.

0:51:130:51:23

We know we only have God, and this

might be the last message from me

0:51:230:51:27

and people in this town.

And you

don't know if the man who posted

0:51:270:51:34

that message is alive or dead?

No,

we have no news about 5000 people in

0:51:340:51:41

that town from last night. We hear

all kinds of weapons are used there.

0:51:410:51:47

It's very close to us but surrounded

by the regime army. We are expecting

0:51:470:51:52

the worst.

0:51:520:51:57

the worst.

Lina, you got out of

Syria. What do you remember about

0:52:000:52:03

the conflict beginning?

Hello and

thank you for having me here. First,

0:52:030:52:12

let me put things in context. The

situation in Syria is compensated

0:52:120:52:20

just as the international community

wants it to be complicated. -- is

0:52:200:52:25

complicated. What happened was a

revolution against the dictatorship.

0:52:250:52:35

It's a brutal dictatorship, like

Nazis in the Middle East.

0:52:360:52:45

Nazis in the Middle East. The world

and international community wants it

0:52:450:52:47

to stay. What happened in Syria was

a revolution against this

0:52:470:52:53

dictatorship who is exterminating

its people, doing a war against them

0:52:530:52:59

with the help of the Russians and

Iran, the help of Iranians militias,

0:52:590:53:06

underground. And also with the help

of the silence of the international

0:53:060:53:09

community. These terrorist

countries, Russia, the Assad regime,

0:53:090:53:17

and Iran, were violating the

international community resolutions.

0:53:170:53:25

All these seven years. And there was

no action at all. This is why the

0:53:250:53:33

international community contributed

in killing the Syrian people and

0:53:330:53:39

violence, the depths of thousands

and thousands of civilians, millions

0:53:390:53:44

of them.

0:53:440:53:49

of them.

Let me ask for a reaction

to that. Lina is right, the

0:53:500:53:55

international community has past few

resolutions and hasn't done a thing.

0:53:550:53:59

This is the pattern we have seen

since the absolute beginning of the

0:53:590:54:02

uprising. Activists from the first

day were risking their lives, images

0:54:020:54:12

of the beautiful protest they were

holding. They were disappeared for

0:54:120:54:16

trying to communicate to the outside

world that they were protesting for

0:54:160:54:19

freedom and being shot at. The

international community has shown so

0:54:190:54:24

much indifference. You are right in

saying earlier that this is the best

0:54:240:54:28

and worst of humanity we are seeing

in Syria. We have witnessed people

0:54:280:54:33

fending for each other in the

country. We have witnessed

0:54:330:54:36

protesters risking their lives to

tell the truth. We have witnessed

0:54:360:54:40

doctors trying to treat patients

under the lights of flashlights

0:54:400:54:43

because there is no electricity. We

have witnessed White helmets saving

0:54:430:54:47

civilians from bombs. All this time

we have known exactly what is

0:54:470:54:51

happening because people risk their

lives to show us, but we have let

0:54:510:54:55

them down miserably. The

international community has had

0:54:550:54:58

absolutely no backbone and frankly

we should be ashamed, particularly

0:54:580:55:03

compared to the stunning bravery

shown by the Syrian people in the

0:55:030:55:06

last few years.

How long do you

think this war will go on for?

Thank

0:55:060:55:13

you for having me here. This war,

after seven years of fighting and

0:55:130:55:21

killing and the conflict in Syria,

we hope it will finish soon, as soon

0:55:210:55:27

as is because the international

community should now move and work

0:55:270:55:30

together. We want to build hope,

British, French and American people,

0:55:300:55:37

should try to stop the war there

because Russia, the first

0:55:370:55:41

responsible country of what is

happening in the Syria now, with the

0:55:410:55:44

support of the Iranians people, it's

eight criminal and chemical

0:55:440:55:50

government.

You were 11 when the

conflict started and you are now a

0:55:500:55:55

young man. The conflict continues,

despite your president crossing what

0:55:550:56:01

was called a red line by then US

president Obama by using chemical

0:56:010:56:06

weapons against his people. What

should happen?

They should work

0:56:060:56:09

together. Russia has used its vote

more than ten times in the UN

0:56:090:56:20

Security Council, creating problems

for the Syrian people. They built

0:56:200:56:23

their hope on the western war.

Thank

you so much for coming on the

0:56:230:56:33

programme. We appreciate it, and

will continue to report on it. We

0:56:330:56:39

will see how and when it ends.

0:56:390:56:44

We will bring you the latest news

and sport in a moment.

0:56:440:56:49

In the past half hour,

we've had an update

0:56:490:56:52

from the Metropolitan Police

about the Grenfell

0:56:520:56:54

Tower fire last June.

0:56:540:56:55

Our correspondent,

Lucinda Adam, is here.

0:56:550:56:58

Tell us what they have told us.

Witnesses to the Grenfell Tower Fire

0:56:580:57:05

and emergency services were shocked

by how quickly the fire spread

0:57:050:57:08

around the building. We know 71

people died and dozens were injured

0:57:080:57:14

when the fire happened last June in

a tower block. Now a door from the

0:57:140:57:19

Grenfell Tower, it has been found it

could only hold backfire for half

0:57:190:57:22

the time it was meant to. The

Metropolitan Police told us that

0:57:220:57:26

this morning. They have done tests

on the door, it was designed to hold

0:57:260:57:30

back a fire for 30 minutes, but

after expert tests, they found it

0:57:300:57:34

only held it back for 15 minutes,

and the Metropolitan Police describe

0:57:340:57:38

it as a much shorter period than

expected.

How does this lead into

0:57:380:57:42

the wider enquiries as to how the

fire happened and how it spread so

0:57:420:57:47

rapidly?

The Metropolitan Police are

still in the middle of looking at

0:57:470:57:51

that, carrying out forensic

examinations at the scene and also

0:57:510:57:55

expert tests off-site. They say they

will not say at the moment whether

0:57:550:57:59

any test results will have any

implications on an overall criminal

0:57:590:58:04

investigation, but they have said

that officers have shared their

0:58:040:58:06

findings with the Ministry of

Housing and Department for

0:58:060:58:10

Communities and Local Government,

for them to take any action

0:58:100:58:13

required.

Housing Secretary Sajid

Javid is going to make a statement

0:58:130:58:18

on the subject from 11:30am which

people can watch here on BBC news.

0:58:180:58:23

No information yet on who made the

doors, who manufactured them, who

0:58:230:58:27

supplied them and who put them into

Grenfell Tower. The news and sport

0:58:270:58:32

is coming up at 10am.

0:58:320:58:33

Let's get the latest

weather update with Alina.

0:58:330:58:36

I thought I would start with some

sunshine, there has been some around

0:58:380:58:42

today. For large parts of the

country it has looks like this, a

0:58:420:58:48

lot of rain around. Northern Ireland

has seen 50 millimetres in the last

0:58:480:58:51

24 hours with more to come. Rain in

the short-term, but over the next

0:58:510:58:57

24-48 hours it will turn colder.

Picking up an easterly wind, and it

0:58:570:59:02

will feed into some snow across the

weekend. The band of rain this

0:59:020:59:06

afternoon clearing away eventually

in Northern Ireland and its way

0:59:060:59:11

north east across northern ingot and

south-west Scotland. North-east

0:59:110:59:14

Scotland will stay largely dry but

it's very windy with wind extending

0:59:140:59:19

down the east coast. Some rain

showers could be heavily heavy and

0:59:190:59:23

thundery. We will keep the strength

of the wind. Snow over higher ground

0:59:230:59:32

in Scotland. Another band of showery

rain pushing in from the south-west

0:59:320:59:35

affecting parts of England and Wales

and temperatures overnight between

0:59:350:59:40

three and seven Celsius. Colder air

coming into Scotland could see icy

0:59:400:59:44

stretches tomorrow morning and

further snow, both the other high

0:59:440:59:48

ground but extending to lower parts

in northern England. Sunshine and

0:59:480:59:53

showers in the south, but they could

be heavy and thundery with some hail

0:59:530:59:56

thrown in. Mild across central and

southern England but colder further

0:59:561:00:03

north and a sign of what's to come

over the weekend because we will

1:00:031:00:06

once again pick up an easterly wind.

The blue colours indicating the cold

1:00:061:00:13

temperatures, not as cold as earlier

in the month, but a dip in

1:00:131:00:17

temperature and a sharp shock to the

system on Saturday. We could see

1:00:171:00:22

snow overnight. Sunny spells and

snow showers. Adding on the strength

1:00:221:00:25

of the wind and it will feel

bitterly cold. Temperatures dropping

1:00:251:00:29

in places by 8-10d. The monitor

might read 2 degrees, but given the

1:00:291:00:36

strength of the wind it will be

bitterly cold. On Sunday, this

1:00:361:00:39

feature will be pushing up from the

south and it could potentially bring

1:00:391:00:44

some significant snow to parts of

southern England and Wales. In

1:00:441:00:51

uncertainty to the timings but we

will likely see some snow around on

1:00:511:00:54

Sunday and it will feel really cold

with temperatures struggling to get

1:00:541:00:58

above freezing. Adding on the

strength of the wind and it will

1:00:581:01:01

feel subzero.

1:01:011:01:08

Hello, it's 10am, I'm

Victoria Derbyshire.

1:01:231:01:25

President Trump comes out in support

of the UK's decision to expel 23

1:01:251:01:28

Russian diplomats from Britain

after the nerve agent

1:01:281:01:30

attack in Salisbury.

1:01:301:01:31

The United States stands in absolute

solidarity with Great Britain.

1:01:311:01:33

The United States

believes that Russia

1:01:331:01:35

is responsible for the attack on two

people in the United Kingdom, using

1:01:351:01:38

a military grade nerve agent.

1:01:381:01:39

We will get reaction.

1:01:391:01:40

Also coming up on the programme...

1:01:401:01:42

Sherry Denness was 17

when she attempted to take her own

1:01:421:01:45

life nine times in ten

days at the end of last

1:01:451:01:47

year - before she got

the help she needed.

1:01:471:01:50

She told us about the problems

she and her family faced

1:01:501:01:52

in getting the right support.

1:01:521:01:55

I have been dealt with a lot in

hospitals, paediatric wards, and it

1:01:551:02:05

is just... There is this massive to

do about it and no one wants to talk

1:02:051:02:09

about it, no one wants to help. One

viewer says the entire mental health

1:02:091:02:15

system in our country needs a

complete overhaul and it is not fit

1:02:151:02:18

for purpose in its current state.

More messages from you so why will

1:02:181:02:24

read those in the next hour. Also...

1:02:241:02:29

Working repeated shifts for free -

and with no offer

1:02:291:02:31

of a job at the end.

1:02:311:02:33

As calls to ban the practice

of unpaid trial shifts are debated

1:02:331:02:36

in Parliament, do let us

know your experiences.

1:02:361:02:38

And we'll hear about the latest

fitness craze - beer yoga -

1:02:381:02:41

where you can enjoy sipping a nice

cold lager while doing

1:02:411:02:43

the downward dog.

1:02:431:02:50

Good morning.

1:02:511:02:53

Here's Annita McVeigh

in the BBC Newsroom

1:02:531:02:54

with a summary of today's news.

1:02:541:02:58

Good morning.

1:02:581:02:59

The White House has

given its backing to Britain's

1:02:591:03:01

decision to expel Russian diplomats

in retaliation for the nerve

1:03:011:03:03

agent attack on Sergei

Skripal and his daughter.

1:03:031:03:06

The US said it was a just response

and America stood in solidarity

1:03:061:03:10

with its closest ally.

1:03:101:03:12

Russia says it is working

on retaliatory measures

1:03:121:03:15

after 23 of its diplomats

were expelled from Britain.

1:03:151:03:21

The labratory where scientists

helped identify the nerve agent used

1:03:211:03:27

in Salisbury is to get more

funding from the Government

1:03:271:03:29

as part of a defence

modernisation programme.

1:03:291:03:31

An extra £48 million

for a new Chemical Weapons Defence

1:03:311:03:35

Centre at Porton Down

will be announced by Gavin

1:03:351:03:40

Williamson in his first major speech

as Defence Secretary later today.

1:03:401:03:46

The investigation into the fire

at Grenfell Tower has

1:03:461:03:48

found the fire doors may not have

been as effective as they

1:03:481:03:51

were supposed to be.

1:03:511:03:52

The Metropolitan Police tested

a door designed to resist fire

1:03:521:03:54

for half an hour and found that it

only lasted 15 minutes.

1:03:541:03:57

The investigation is ongoing.

1:03:571:03:59

The Brexit Secretary,

David Davis, has said he's prepared

1:03:591:04:01

to accept the EU's offer

of a shortened transition period,

1:04:011:04:04

after the UK leaves

the European Union in March, 2019.

1:04:041:04:06

He said he would agree to a call

for the transition to end

1:04:061:04:09

in December, 2020, if that

helped to secure a deal at

1:04:091:04:12

next week's EU summit.

1:04:121:04:18

The World Health Organization

is to carry out a review

1:04:181:04:22

of the potential impact

of plastic on human health.

1:04:221:04:24

It follows the release

of a new study by US researchers -

1:04:241:04:29

the largest of its kind -

which discovered plastic particles

1:04:291:04:31

in popular brands of bottled water.

1:04:311:04:38

Scientists say there is no evidence

yet to suggest it is a cause for

1:04:381:04:42

concern.

1:04:421:04:45

A 20-year-old woman has been

jailed for six months

1:04:451:04:47

in the American state of Minnesota

for fatally shooting her boyfriend

1:04:471:04:50

in a botched YouTube video

they hoped would go viral.

1:04:501:04:52

Pedro Ruiz convinced Monalisa Perez

to shoot him at close range

1:04:521:04:55

with a powerful pistol,

believing that a thick

1:04:551:04:57

book he held in front

of his chest would shield him.

1:04:571:05:00

He died at the scene.

1:05:001:05:07

In the past three years, parents

across England and Wales have been

1:05:071:05:11

fined around £24 million for failing

to send their children to school. A

1:05:111:05:16

BBC investigation shows some

councils are you issuing penalties

1:05:161:05:19

at rates five times higher than the

average and some parents say they

1:05:191:05:23

now actively budget for the cost of

fines when planning holidays. Some

1:05:231:05:27

councils admit they have become

stricter but they say they are

1:05:271:05:31

protecting the education of

children. Some MPs and lawyers have

1:05:311:05:35

called for a blanket ban on page

shiftwork. Companies currently

1:05:351:05:38

invite prospective employees to do

trial shifts. But there has been a

1:05:381:05:45

sixfold increase over three years in

complaints about unpaid shifts

1:05:451:05:49

according to the trade union Unite.

On Friday a Private Members' Bill

1:05:491:05:55

seeking to make unpaid trials

illegal will get its second

1:05:551:06:00

parliamentary reading.

1:06:001:06:01

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

1:06:011:06:03

More at 10.30am.

1:06:031:06:05

This tweet, I have borderline

personality disorder, I often

1:06:051:06:09

describe it as the angel on one

shoulder, the devil on the other. I

1:06:091:06:13

eventually received the right

treatment. I hope the beautiful

1:06:131:06:18

young woman on your programme today,

Sherry, gets the right help.

1:06:181:06:22

Caroline says, I was 45 and had of

short-term psychotic breakdown. My

1:06:221:06:27

brother-in-law took me to A&E with

hallucinations and flashing lights

1:06:271:06:32

at 3:30am, I asked her sleeping

tablets, they sent me home with

1:06:321:06:37

nothing. At 9pm the next night, I

attempted to take my own life. A&E

1:06:371:06:42

have failed me. There are a number

of those which I will read through

1:06:421:06:47

the next hour of the programme. If

you want to send us an e-mail, you

1:06:471:06:51

do not have to use your name, you

can use Twitter, and if you text,

1:06:511:06:56

you will be charged that the

standard network rate.

1:06:561:07:01

Here's some sport now with Hugh.

1:07:011:07:03

Well, we knew it was a sizeable

task for Chelsea in

1:07:031:07:05

the Champions League,

away at Spanish League leaders

1:07:051:07:07

Barcelona, and as some may have

predicted, a great performance

1:07:071:07:11

from five-time Ballon D'or winner

Lionel Messi was the difference.

1:07:111:07:19

He scored two and set the other

up in their 3-0 win.

1:07:201:07:22

The first came after just

a couple of minutes,

1:07:221:07:25

deceiving Thibaut Courtois

in the Chelsea goal,

1:07:251:07:26

before his second -

different end, different

1:07:261:07:28

foot, same result.

1:07:281:07:36

A 4-1 aggregate win for Messi

and Barca which means

1:07:361:07:38

Liverpool and Manchester City

1:07:381:07:39

will be the two British

clubs in the quarterfinal

1:07:391:07:42

draw tomorrow.

1:07:421:07:43

Our start was terrible, to concede a

goal after only two minutes, but

1:07:431:07:49

after this, I think we tried to play

football. For a long time, we

1:07:491:08:00

dominated, we created chances to

score.

1:08:001:08:03

There were better scenes

for Arsenal's Women last night.

1:08:031:08:05

They stunned favourites

Manchester City to win

1:08:051:08:07

the Continental Tyres Cup

for a record fifth time

1:08:071:08:09

1-0, thanks to Vivianne

Miedema's goal.

1:08:091:08:11

England Rugby Union head coach

Eddie Jones has apologised

1:08:111:08:15

for making derogatory comments

regarding Ireland and Wales.

1:08:151:08:19

At a sponsors' talk last summer,

it's emerged he described the Irish

1:08:191:08:24

as "scummy" and Wales as, well,

not a very nice little

1:08:241:08:29

place, shall we say?

1:08:291:08:32

Well, Jones has apologised

unreservedly, adding, "No excuses,

1:08:321:08:34

I shouldn't have said what I did."

1:08:341:08:39

England host Ireland

in the Six Nations at

1:08:391:08:41

Twickenham on Saturday.

1:08:411:08:42

It's day three of the Cheltenham

Festival but it'll be missing one

1:08:421:08:45

of racing's biggest stars.

1:08:451:08:46

That's after a serious injury

to jockey Ruby Walsh yesterday.

1:08:461:08:49

He went to hospital with a suspected

broken leg when he fell

1:08:491:08:52

at the second last fence.

1:08:521:08:53

He broke the same leg four months

ago and had only just

1:08:531:08:56

made his return to racing.

1:08:561:08:58

Now he'll miss the rest

of the festival, including

1:08:581:09:00

Friday's Gold Cup.

1:09:001:09:02

But on a difficult day

for the Walsh family,

1:09:021:09:07

there was some success

for Ruby's sister, Katy.

1:09:071:09:15

She won on board the

25-to-1 shot Relegate

1:09:171:09:18

in the final race of the day.

1:09:181:09:21

The big race of the day, though,

was the Queen Mother Champion Chase.

1:09:211:09:24

It was billed as a straight fight

between the British trained Altior

1:09:241:09:27

and Irish horse Douvan.

1:09:271:09:28

But after Douvan fell

with four fences to jump,

1:09:281:09:30

the evens favourite Altior ridden

by Nico de Boinville easily came

1:09:301:09:33

home first in the end.

1:09:331:09:34

And Great Britain can't win a medal

in the wheelchair curling

1:09:341:09:37

at the Winter Parlympics.

1:09:371:09:38

Earlier they lost to hosts Korea

in their penultimate

1:09:381:09:40

round-robin match.

1:09:401:09:41

That result meant they had to rely

on others to see if they could make

1:09:411:09:45

the medal playoffs.

1:09:451:09:47

But in the afternoon session,

Norway's victory over Slovakia means

1:09:471:09:51

that Britain are out,

even if they win their final pool

1:09:511:09:53

match against China.

1:09:531:09:56

More sport later on. Thank you.

1:09:561:10:01

The United States says it stands

in solidarity with the UK

1:10:011:10:04

following the Prime Minister's

decision to expel 23 Russian

1:10:041:10:06

diplomats after Moscow refused

to explain how a Russian-made nerve

1:10:061:10:08

agent was used in a murder

attempt on a former spy.

1:10:081:10:11

Theresa May has also

revoked an invitation

1:10:111:10:15

to Russia's foreign minister

and said the royal family would not

1:10:151:10:17

attend the Fifa World

Cup later this year.

1:10:171:10:22

The Russian Embassy

said the expulsions

1:10:221:10:25

were "unacceptable,

unjustified and short-sighted".

1:10:251:10:27

In a hardening of President Trump's

tone on Russia, his spokeswoman

1:10:271:10:29

accused it of undermining

the security of countries worldwide.

1:10:291:10:32

The White House's comment

were echoed by the US

1:10:321:10:35

Ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley,

during an emergency meeting

1:10:351:10:37

of the Security Council.

1:10:371:10:43

The United States stands in absolute

solidarity with Great Britain. The

1:10:431:10:49

United States believes Russia is

responsible for the attack on two

1:10:491:10:52

people in the UK using a military

grade nerve agent but this is not an

1:10:521:10:57

isolated incident. The assassination

attempt in Salisbury is part of an

1:10:571:11:02

alarming increase in the use of

chemical weapons. Russia must fully

1:11:021:11:06

cooperate with the UK's

investigation and come clean about

1:11:061:11:11

its own chemical weapons programme.

Russia is a permanent member of the

1:11:111:11:16

Security Council. It is entrusted in

the United Nations Charter with

1:11:161:11:21

upholding international peace and

security. It must account for

1:11:211:11:24

exceptions.

We have a lot of people

to speak to. Let us introduce them.

1:11:241:11:32

Let's speak now to Mark Lyall-Grant,

a former National Security Adviser

1:11:321:11:34

and UK Ambassador to the UN.

1:11:341:11:38

Oliver Miles, Ambassador to Libya

when PC Yvonne Fletcher

1:11:381:11:40

was killed and Britain severed

diplomatic ties with them,

1:11:401:11:42

and Hamish De Bretton Gordon,

who is the former commanding officer

1:11:421:11:44

of the British Army's Chemical,

Biological, Radiological

1:11:441:11:46

and Nuclear Regiment.

1:11:461:11:54

Chris Bryant -

1:11:551:11:56

Labour MP, Chair of

the all-party group on Russia

1:11:561:11:58

and member of the Foreign

Affairs Select Committee.

1:11:581:12:00

The significance of Donald Trump

racking Theresa May.

It is very

1:12:001:12:05

significant, there were some

concerns he had not been as

1:12:051:12:09

forthright as he might have been --

racking Theresa May. Following

1:12:091:12:13

comments by the ambassador at the UN

last night, extremely strong, the

1:12:131:12:18

White House itself has come out and

echoed those comments and I think

1:12:181:12:21

that is really important because

part of the purpose behind last

1:12:211:12:26

night's emergency meeting of the UN

Security Council was to secure

1:12:261:12:30

messages of support from our allies

and friends around the world and to

1:12:301:12:35

bring to the attention of the

international community the facts of

1:12:351:12:39

this horrendous case.

Oliver Miles,

what should happen now?

I think

1:12:391:12:45

there are two points I would like to

make about the Libyan affair which I

1:12:451:12:50

was involved in in 1984 when I was

responsible for breaking off

1:12:501:12:53

relations with the Libyan

government. One which struck me when

1:12:531:12:57

I read recently, I did not know at

the time, was Mrs Thatcher, the

1:12:571:13:01

Prime Minister at the time, very

reluctant at first to break off

1:13:011:13:05

relations because she could see the

consequences were literally

1:13:051:13:09

incalculable, unforeseeable. The

second point I want to make, the

1:13:091:13:15

consequences were in fact very bad

for Britain because it was after we

1:13:151:13:18

broke off relations that Gaddafi

gave some text of the IRA which was

1:13:181:13:22

I think the most damaging thing he

ever did --

1:13:221:13:31

ever did -- gave Semtex. The lesson

I would draw in a word from that

1:13:311:13:34

event to be applied in the present

crisis is, think carefully before

1:13:341:13:40

you act, take it slowly.

Let me

bring in Chris Bryant, Labour MP,

1:13:401:13:44

that is potentially what your leader

is saying, some believe he is, but

1:13:441:13:50

there are Labour MPs criticising him

for not condemning Russia, for not

1:13:501:13:55

apportioning blame to Russia?

I do

not think the important point at

1:13:551:13:59

this stage is what the Labour Party

thinks, if I'm honest.

The Leader of

1:13:591:14:04

the Opposition, he wants to be in

Number 10.

I fully understand that,

1:14:041:14:08

but I think this is really about how

Britain make sure we in this country

1:14:081:14:13

are safe, it is about how the

international community comes

1:14:131:14:17

together to say to Russia that we

will not put up with this. I think,

1:14:171:14:22

for instance, removing 23 diplomats

from the UK will seriously degrade

1:14:221:14:29

their ability to gather intelligence

in the UK and that is an important

1:14:291:14:32

factor. I do not think Theresa May

has over at the pudding, if

1:14:321:14:37

anything, she has gone admirably

steadily and there may be further

1:14:371:14:43

things she wants to do, I would be

slightly critical of her in that it

1:14:431:14:48

has taken quite a long time for us

to get here. Actually, Putin's track

1:14:481:14:52

record is very clear of readily and

repeatedly using excessive violence,

1:14:521:14:56

whether in the Moscow State siege or

Ukraine, bringing down of the MH17

1:14:561:15:05

plane, we have a track record here,

a clear motive for Russia to be

1:15:051:15:10

involved in this, and having read

quite a lot... I am not a chemist,

1:15:101:15:15

but having read quite a lot of the

international chemists experts in

1:15:151:15:22

this field, their reading of the

situation, it seems to point very

1:15:221:15:26

clearly to Putin.

I will ask you

again, why won't your leader, Jeremy

1:15:261:15:31

Corbyn, condemn Russia for this

chemical weapons attack?

As I

1:15:311:15:35

understand it, he has.

He has called

it an appalling attack, he has not

1:15:351:15:40

apportion blame to Russia.

I

understand he has. The story has

1:15:401:15:45

moved on and Emily Thornberry, and

the Shadow Defence Secretary, they

1:15:451:15:51

were clear we as a party stand full

square...

What has Jeremy Corbyn

1:15:511:15:55

said?

I have not seen the statement

himself, I have only seen reports of

1:15:551:16:01

it. You saw in the House of Commons

yesterday, and the leader of the

1:16:011:16:06

Welsh Labour Party on the Scottish

Nationalists and the Welsh

1:16:061:16:08

Nationalists, everybody is very

clear that this is a question of

1:16:081:16:12

national security and the country

has to stand together.

1:16:121:16:19

Hamish, can I ask you about the new

1:16:201:16:22

Hamish, can I ask you about the new

facility at Porton down being

1:16:221:16:24

announced today, there were plans in

the pipeline and it has been

1:16:241:16:30

hastened on British soil, what

difference will it make for people

1:16:301:16:33

in Britain from eight chemical

weapons attack?

First of all we

1:16:331:16:37

recognise there is a gap in

capability. We were blindsided by

1:16:371:16:48

the attack in Salisbury. Now the

threat is apparent we need to make

1:16:481:16:51

sure our military have the

capability to be able to defend this

1:16:511:16:56

country on our shores and outside

with the right capability.

If

1:16:561:17:02

somebody's food or drink is spiked

or a droplet of stuff sprayed in

1:17:021:17:05

their face can kill them, how can

this new facility potentially stop

1:17:051:17:10

that happening again?

I expect it is

part of a range of capabilities. Now

1:17:101:17:17

we know the threat exists, and I

would say that the only people...

1:17:171:17:22

The only tiny doubt the Russians are

involved, only the Russians can help

1:17:221:17:27

with that. We know they are the only

ones who make this agent, and the

1:17:271:17:36

Russians confirmed that yesterday.

There is only one place where

1:17:361:17:41

Novichok is made, and that is in

Russia. If the Prohibition of

1:17:411:17:46

chemical weapons envoy can go to

Russia, at the moment it looks Irish

1:17:461:17:59

is the only explanation. We will

develop capabilities to keep people

1:17:591:18:02

safe in this country.

The Russian

Foreign Ministry says Russia will

1:18:021:18:05

expel British diplomats soon, we are

just hearing. You would expect that.

1:18:051:18:11

You would expect that, it see

standard Russian response.

1:18:111:18:21

standard Russian response. That was

fully expected and factored into the

1:18:211:18:24

government's original decision, I'm

sure.

Chris Bryant...

I do agree,

1:18:241:18:30

incidentally, that was obvious.

Is

that it for diplomatic relations

1:18:301:18:34

between us and pressure for a period

of time? Do we now enter potentially

1:18:341:18:40

a second Cold War?

No, because if we

were to send the whole diplomatic

1:18:401:18:45

team back, and suspend diplomatic

relations, which we are clearly not.

1:18:451:18:50

Incidentally, there are some

questions that are not quite

1:18:501:18:52

answered yet. It's not quite clear

what the government's intention is

1:18:521:19:01

with regard to people who are very

close to the Putin regime who has

1:19:011:19:04

significant assets in the UK on the

basis of unexplained wealth. I hope

1:19:041:19:07

we will freeze those assets as soon

as possible. It's not quite clear

1:19:071:19:10

what we will be doing about the

Magnitsky Act or quite what the

1:19:101:19:17

government intends. And it's not

clear if we are suspending all

1:19:171:19:20

operations with regard security for

the World Cup. We did not suspend it

1:19:201:19:26

with Sochi, meaning the Sochi

Olympics could proceed safely. My

1:19:261:19:31

anxiety, and I'm a Welshman, so it's

none of my business whether England

1:19:311:19:34

goes to play football in the World

Cup, but my anxiety is whether it

1:19:341:19:38

will actually be safe in Russia. We

have often seen that Russian fans

1:19:381:19:45

are sometimes inspired by Russian

government activity and have been

1:19:451:19:50

engaged in pretty violent attacks on

other fans. My anxiety about the

1:19:501:19:54

World Cup is whether it will be

safe, simply.

Thank you to all of

1:19:541:19:57

you.

1:19:571:20:01

Still to come, could it be possible

to introduce individualised cancer

1:20:011:20:07

vaccines? We will hear about major

trials planned on both sides of the

1:20:071:20:11

Atlantic that will start next year.

1:20:111:20:18

Now a group of activists who have

taken over a four-storey building

1:20:181:20:23

that has been reportedly empty for

15 years in the centre of London. In

1:20:231:20:27

order to give shelter to 100

homeless people. In their own words,

1:20:271:20:30

they say they are saving people's

lives because they have nowhere else

1:20:301:20:33

to go.

1:20:331:20:36

OK, so when we have

somebody new come in,

1:20:361:20:38

they come in the front door.

1:20:381:20:40

They will be greeted here.

1:20:401:20:41

We'll ask them what they

need, how they are.

1:20:411:20:44

What the priority is,

whether they need to go

1:20:441:20:46

straight to sleep, to eat.

1:20:461:20:48

We have the kitchen

down the end there.

1:20:481:20:51

And we are providing hot,

nutritious food all the time.

1:20:511:20:53

There's tea and coffee.

1:20:531:20:56

We have some medical supplies,

and we have people who know how

1:20:561:20:59

to look after people,

so if somebody needs

1:20:591:21:01

some attention to wounds

or infections, we can do that.

1:21:011:21:05

The sleeping area's on the ground

floor here, and on the first floor.

1:21:051:21:09

There was electricity

already on in the building,

1:21:091:21:11

and the water was already on.

1:21:111:21:14

We just tidied up the plumbing

where there were leaks and stuff,

1:21:141:21:17

made sure everything

was safe and secure.

1:21:171:21:19

We have qualified electricians

helping us, and I'm

1:21:191:21:21

a plumber-builder as well,

so we do safety checks every day,

1:21:211:21:24

make sure there's nothing dangerous,

no cables to trip over,

1:21:241:21:27

everything's lit properly,

so people don't...

1:21:271:21:28

Yeah, we are keeping people safe.

1:21:281:21:31

I left home at 15 years of age.

1:21:311:21:33

I started going into

the hostel system.

1:21:331:21:36

There was a big battle

because of social services,

1:21:361:21:39

and a lot of things happened

in a short amount of time.

1:21:391:21:43

And I've been homeless recently due

to a lot going on in my life.

1:21:431:21:47

There was no help being given.

1:21:471:21:49

There was nothing available,

no services wanting to obviously

1:21:491:21:54

understand or were willing to help,

so I had no choice but to have

1:21:541:21:58

nowhere to go, because there's

nowhere for us to go.

1:21:581:22:01

I mean, it's out there.

1:22:011:22:04

I mean, it's hard out there.

1:22:041:22:06

What about others that might say

you've got no business being here,

1:22:061:22:09

you don't own the building,

that you're not paying

1:22:091:22:11

rent for the building.

1:22:111:22:12

What would you say to them?

1:22:121:22:16

Our brothers and sisters have no

business being on the street.

1:22:161:22:19

Freezing, dying.

1:22:191:22:23

And there are ten empty commercial

buildings for every person who's

1:22:231:22:25

registered street sleeping.

1:22:251:22:27

Ten empty commercial buildings

for every person who's registered

1:22:271:22:29

as sleeping on the streets.

1:22:291:22:31

I'm sorry.

1:22:311:22:33

What business model is that?

1:22:331:22:36

So, yeah, no business being here?

1:22:361:22:38

We've a hundred people here.

1:22:381:22:39

Eating, sleeping, comfortable.

1:22:391:22:41

We're saving lives here.

1:22:411:22:45

I'm sorry.

1:22:451:22:48

Property.

1:22:481:22:50

I've a disregard for that.

1:22:501:22:55

When the building's been

empty for 15 years,

1:22:551:22:57

and we can save lives with it?

1:22:571:22:58

It's our moral duty

to save those lives.

1:22:581:23:02

Here's an update: there

was a legal hearing yesterday

1:23:021:23:08

and the company that owns

the building - W1 Properties -

1:23:081:23:11

was issued with a possession order -

meaning the firm has the legal right

1:23:111:23:14

to evict those living the building.

1:23:141:23:16

Lets talk now to Steve Broe

who has been volunteering

1:23:161:23:19

at the centre.

1:23:191:23:27

Stush, who has been using the Centre

since it opened on the 1st of March.

1:23:271:23:31

And joining us from the Centre

1:23:311:23:39

are Freddie and Rose,

two of the Centre's users.

1:23:391:23:43

How are you feeling this morning?

It

was kind of disappointing, but we

1:23:431:23:48

did expect it. There's always a

possibility to get more time to help

1:23:481:23:52

people and get them relocated.

Do

you mean a bit of extra time in that

1:23:521:23:56

building, or do you mean you have

found another building?

The thing

1:23:561:23:59

about that is, we need a certain

amount of notice. We had 160 people

1:23:591:24:05

there last night. In what way can we

just send them out to the streets?

1:24:051:24:11

We are hoping to get a bit of leeway

and time. Yes, there might be

1:24:111:24:17

alternatives.

It could be as early

as tonight, is my understanding, if

1:24:171:24:24

officials or bailiffs turn up and

ask 160 people to leave, will they

1:24:241:24:28

leave?

...

Will you leave?

That's a

very good question and one I can't

1:24:281:24:36

answer until it happens.

And would

you leave?

As Steve says, we will

1:24:361:24:42

not know until the time occurs. But

in general, if the bailiffs turn up,

1:24:421:24:47

as they do, and a lot of time they

are mob handed, for a better turn of

1:24:471:24:53

phrase, they may leave us no choice

in the matter. And depending if

1:24:531:25:00

people do resist, because some

people have literally fought tooth

1:25:001:25:03

and nail their entire lives. Some of

the people in the building have

1:25:031:25:08

experience of homelessness that goes

well beyond just sleeping on the

1:25:081:25:11

street. If you had a guest on

earlier who is suffering from the

1:25:111:25:20

mental issues that she has, and a

lot of people, if they didn't have

1:25:201:25:25

one before, they've certainly got

one now. And they will potentially

1:25:251:25:29

fight tooth and nail just not to be

put in potentially the same

1:25:291:25:33

position. You can understand why

somebody wouldn't want to be made

1:25:331:25:38

homeless ahead of the weekend that

is showing signs of having whether

1:25:381:25:44

by you need to be inside. In a

building that has been empty for a

1:25:441:25:48

very long time, and was of no

interest to the owner until this

1:25:481:25:51

time.

But it doesn't belong to you,

that's what people say, it belongs

1:25:511:25:57

to them.

It's perfectly valid that

it might belong to somebody, but if

1:25:571:26:02

they are not using it and we can

save lives with it, I don't see the

1:26:021:26:06

problem with that.

Let me bring in

Freddie and Rose. Hello and good

1:26:061:26:13

morning. Tell us what it's been like

for you living there and what it has

1:26:131:26:19

meant to use.

1:26:191:26:24

meant to use.

I am very, very

friendly with the people. It is so

1:26:291:26:36

hard for me. Seeing people outside

sleeping. A few weeks ago four

1:26:361:26:45

people died because of the snow.

It's hard to me. I can't believe,

1:26:451:26:54

London is a rich city, but there is

a lot of people sleeping outside.

1:26:541:27:04

It's raining, snowing. It's hard for

me to see that.

Freddie, where were

1:27:041:27:17

you sleeping before you came to this

building?

Outside.

I was sleeping in

1:27:171:27:29

a cold and unheated domestic

environment. I came here for a

1:27:291:27:35

reason. I knew this building because

for many years I was dispatch riding

1:27:351:27:38

and I used to deliver and collect

items from here. It seems ridiculous

1:27:381:27:43

that when it ceases to be used, it

just sits vacant, doing precisely

1:27:431:27:49

nothing for anybody. Except maybe

accruing in value, so it is a

1:27:491:27:55

speculative tool rather than the

incredibly

1:27:551:28:04

incredibly creative and interesting

environment that has been created to

1:28:041:28:06

save people's lives in real terms.

We can see the environment behind

1:28:061:28:11

you, but describe it for those who

want to know more about what's going

1:28:111:28:15

on in the four stories.

It's very

simple. People need to have a

1:28:151:28:22

temperature which will not endanger

their lives. So for every degree

1:28:221:28:29

above a certain point, people are

far better off. This is a factory

1:28:291:28:35

for saving lives. You could put it

like that, because it does something

1:28:351:28:42

real for people.

Steve, a factory

for saving lives, is that an apt

1:28:421:28:50

description?

Yes. What we have are

people coming in, not just being fed

1:28:501:28:59

and rested, but they socialise as

well. There is an amazing amount of

1:28:591:29:03

kindness, caring and empathy because

everybody knows what it is like. You

1:29:031:29:08

have people coming out after a good

nights sleep and food. They think

1:29:081:29:14

it's great, it feels wonderful. It's

a phrase I have used a lot, you can

1:29:141:29:21

see them wake up and shake off all

that pressure they have been under.

1:29:211:29:25

They will have breakfast and go,

there are dishes to wash, I will do

1:29:251:29:31

that. People are mopping floors,

doing the dishes, helping to cook.

1:29:311:29:36

People bring their skills. We have

plumbers and carpenters, people who

1:29:361:29:42

are finding something to do within

their own skill set, and reminding

1:29:421:29:47

themselves that it is possible and

they might actually get back to work

1:29:471:29:50

and get back into life. But out on

the street when freezing cold, they

1:29:501:29:56

can only concentrate on surviving.

Give them a break from that and they

1:29:561:30:00

start to think, maybe I can have the

time now to look for work, maybe I

1:30:001:30:05

can go to the building site down the

road and get back on my feet.

This

1:30:051:30:09

is what Westminster City Council

tell us, they say the building is

1:30:091:30:12

privately owned and as such any

further legal action is up to the

1:30:121:30:16

owner to take. But Westminster has a

well-established route to help

1:30:161:30:23

people who might be sleeping rough

and who are homeless through street

1:30:251:30:27

link. The council spends £6.5

million per year on rough sleeping

1:30:271:30:30

services and hostel and rough bed

spaces are available every night and

1:30:301:30:37

council workers are out every night

offering help to rough sleepers.

1:30:371:30:44

I will give you the polite version,

it is not working, our organisation,

1:30:441:30:51

they have been doing outreach in

three different locations most

1:30:511:30:57

nights of the week in London,

Hackney, Central London, Camden,

1:30:571:31:01

they talk to people, if somebody

wants to be connected to StreetLink,

1:31:011:31:06

we try to make phone calls, even if

we gave our mobile numbers, call us

1:31:061:31:12

back, they will say, if you get

through to them, really hard, they

1:31:121:31:16

might say, we will try to get to you

within three hours. Get the person

1:31:161:31:21

to stay where they are... We have

quite a few stories of people

1:31:211:31:25

staying in the same place for five

days, no call-back, no pick-up.

We

1:31:251:31:31

will see what StreetLink have to

say. Thank you. We will see what

1:31:311:31:35

happens when the eviction occurs.

Thank you for coming on the

1:31:351:31:40

programme.

Thank you for hearing us.

Is not a problem.

1:31:401:31:47

Time for the latest news.

1:31:471:31:50

The BBC News headlines.

1:31:501:31:53

The White House has

given its backing to Britain's

1:31:531:31:55

decision to expel Russian diplomats

in retaliation for the nerve

1:31:551:31:58

agent attack on Sergei

Skripal and his daughter.

1:31:581:32:00

The US said it was a just

response and America stood

1:32:001:32:02

in solidarity with its closest ally.

1:32:021:32:04

Russia says it is working

on retaliatory measures

1:32:041:32:08

after 23 of its diplomats

were expelled from Britain.

1:32:081:32:11

The labratory

where scientists helped identify

1:32:111:32:16

the nerve agent used in Salisbury

is to get more funding from

1:32:161:32:18

the Government as part of a defence

modernisation programme.

1:32:181:32:21

An extra £48 million

for a new Chemical Weapons Defence

1:32:211:32:23

Centre at Porton Down

will be announced by Gavin

1:32:231:32:25

Williamson in his first major speech

as Defence Secretary later today.

1:32:251:32:33

The investigation into the fire

at Grenfell Tower has

1:32:331:32:36

found the fire doors may not have

been as effective as they

1:32:361:32:38

were supposed to be.

1:32:381:32:40

The Metropolitan Police

tested a door designed to resist

1:32:401:32:43

fire for half an hour and found

that it only lasted 15 minutes.

1:32:431:32:46

The investigation is ongoing.

1:32:461:32:49

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

1:32:491:32:54

Here's some sport now with Hugh.

1:32:541:32:57

Chelsea were the latest British

team to be knocked out

1:32:571:33:00

of the Champions League last night

after a 3-0 defeat

1:33:001:33:03

away at Barcelona.

1:33:031:33:05

Lionel Messi scored

twice on the night.

1:33:051:33:07

It means Manchester City

and Liverpool are the only domestic

1:33:071:33:11

sides in the hat for

Friday's quarterfinal draw.

1:33:111:33:18

Good news for Arsenal fans -

the club secured its first piece

1:33:181:33:21

of silverware this season

as they shocked Manchester City

1:33:211:33:24

to win the Continental Tyres Cup.

1:33:241:33:27

It finished 1-0 thanks

to Vivienne Miedema's winner.

1:33:271:33:29

The Cheltenham Festival's all-time

leading rider Ruby Walsh will miss

1:33:291:33:31

the rest of this week's event

after a fall yesterday.

1:33:311:33:35

Walsh has a suspected leg

fracture to the same leg

1:33:351:33:40

with which he just spent four months

away from the sport with injury.

1:33:401:33:43

And Great Britain cannot win a medal

in the wheelchair curling

1:33:431:33:45

at the Winter Parlympics.

1:33:451:33:47

Defeat to South Korea

in their penultimate round-robin

1:33:471:33:48

match and Norway's victory over

Slovakia means the Britons cannot

1:33:481:33:51

reach the medal play-off.

1:33:511:33:52

They do have one match remaining.

All the sport for now. More after

1:33:521:33:57

11am.

1:33:571:34:00

When you're drinking bottled water,

do you know what you're

1:34:001:34:03

putting into your body?

1:34:031:34:04

Not just water, it seems,

after a study suggested most major

1:34:041:34:06

brands contain so-called

microplastics - particles that

1:34:061:34:08

are small enough to be ingested.

1:34:081:34:09

The World Health Organization is now

going to review the potential risks

1:34:091:34:12

of plastic in drinking water.

1:34:121:34:15

It absorbs to the surface of the

plastics and under certain

1:34:341:34:41

wavelengths of light, it causes them

to basically sparkle like stars in

1:34:411:34:48

the night sky.

1:34:481:34:51

Let us talk now to Andrew Mayes, one

of the pioneers of the Nile red

1:35:551:36:05

technique, and managing director of

food packaging foundation. What do

1:36:051:36:08

you make of this, Andrew Mayes?

A

very interesting story and it

1:36:081:36:15

highlights the fact micro-plastics

all around us, everywhere look,

1:36:151:36:21

everything we touch, our whole

environment is full of plastic and I

1:36:211:36:25

think this is an excellent highlight

of the fact that it is in

1:36:251:36:30

everything.

Jane, we do not yet have

the research suggesting what Chris,

1:36:301:36:37

if any, there is to human beings,

how do you react to this?

-- what

1:36:371:36:43

risk. It is reasonable to assume

everyone is exposed to these plastic

1:36:431:36:49

particles and that in itself means

the risk is quite high. At the same

1:36:491:36:53

time, what we do not know...

We do

not know that.

We do not know what

1:36:531:36:59

the toxicity is, that is what we do

not know, but exposure seems to be

1:36:591:37:03

very high, we know that.

Do we need

to change the way we bottled water?

1:37:031:37:08

It is premature to say that. The

next step should be to identify in

1:37:081:37:14

great detail what the source is, is

it the packaging, the bottling

1:37:141:37:19

process or and environmental source?

The next step is to reduce the

1:37:191:37:23

exposure levels.

Tell us more about

the Nile red technique works.

It is

1:37:231:37:31

a method where you heard a

fluorescent dye called Nile red to

1:37:311:37:35

the sample and it binds to the

surface of the tiny plastic

1:37:351:37:41

particles -- wear you read. It makes

them grow when you shine a blue

1:37:411:37:45

light on them so you can observe the

samples through an orange filter

1:37:451:37:49

with blue light shining on it and

you can see the particles glowing

1:37:491:37:54

brightly so you can identify them

and count them.

Does it change... Go

1:37:541:37:58

ahead.

I was just going to say, the

reason we developed this technique

1:37:581:38:07

is to allow people to do studies

exactly like this, to be able to do

1:38:071:38:11

large-scale sampling, look at a very

large numbers, and that way you can

1:38:111:38:17

get a much clearer picture of what

is going on in a situation like

1:38:171:38:21

this.

Does it change your behaviour

when it comes to buying bottled

1:38:211:38:25

water?

Well, I would like to think I

am quite environmentally focused

1:38:251:38:32

anyway so I try very hard not to buy

bottled water. But it is very clear

1:38:321:38:38

that worldwide we have to do

something about this problem because

1:38:381:38:42

currently 480 billion bottles are

being sold every year worldwide and

1:38:421:38:48

it is more than one per person per

week for the whole population of the

1:38:481:38:53

planet and this is clearly insane.

We need to think about this in an

1:38:531:38:57

entirely different way.

Would you

agree with that?

I do agree that we

1:38:571:39:01

need to have a discussion as a

society on how we use plastics and

1:39:011:39:07

how we packaged food, consume foods

and how we produce them. I agree

1:39:071:39:12

that this is not a sustainable path

forwards.

Thank you very much, both

1:39:121:39:17

of you.

1:39:171:39:25

of you. Andrew Mayes, one of the

pioneers of the Nile red technique.

1:39:251:39:30

We spoke to water companies, this is

a selection, Nestle told us it's

1:39:301:39:35

internal testing began two years ago

and they have not detected any above

1:39:351:39:42

trace level, Coca-Cola said it has

some of the most stringent quality

1:39:421:39:45

standards and used a multistep

filtration process. It acknowledged

1:39:451:39:53

micro-plastics appear to be

ubiquitous. Tenon said it could not

1:39:531:39:57

comment on the study because, the

methodology used is unclear, but it

1:39:571:40:02

added its own bottles had food grade

packaging. -- Danone.

1:40:021:40:10

Big clinical trials are opening next

year on both sides of the Atlantic

1:40:111:40:14

to find out whether it's possible

to produce individualised

1:40:141:40:17

cancer vaccines to stop

patients who've had cancer

1:40:171:40:19

getting it again.

1:40:191:40:20

A cancer vaccine is one of the holy

grails of modern medical research.

1:40:201:40:24

To talk about this, let me introduce

you to Peter Johnson,

1:40:241:40:26

Cancer Research UK's

professor of medical oncology

1:40:261:40:28

at the University of

Southampton and director

1:40:281:40:29

of the Francis Crick Institute

Cancer Research Network.

1:40:291:40:34

Dr Sophie Acton is a Cancer Research

UK research fellow who

1:40:341:40:36

specialises in immunology.

1:40:361:40:40

And Adrian Webb who was diagnosed

with skin cancer in 2012.

1:40:401:40:48

He had treatment, but a year later

was given the devastating news

1:40:491:40:52

that his cancer had spread

to his lungs, bowel,

1:40:521:40:54

spine, liver and spleen.

1:40:541:40:59

He immediately started on a course

of targeted treatments, including

1:40:591:41:01

immunotherapy drugs,

and five years later, he's

1:41:011:41:05

here to tell us all about it.

1:41:051:41:11

I hope so!

Starting with you, Peter

Johnson. I want to talk about the

1:41:111:41:16

clinical trials beginning next year,

big clinical trials, there have been

1:41:161:41:21

very small ones, into cancer

vaccines. It is worth you explaining

1:41:211:41:25

first of all how a vaccine works,

we're all familiar with the measles

1:41:251:41:28

vaccine, how does it work?

We have

thought for many years it should be

1:41:281:41:32

possible to get the body's immune

system to recognise what is

1:41:321:41:38

different about cancer, they are

different, the mutations, different

1:41:381:41:42

to normal cells of the body, but it

has been very difficult previously

1:41:421:41:46

to get the immune system to lock

onto them. In the last few years, we

1:41:461:41:51

have had treatments switching the

switches of the immune system so it

1:41:511:41:54

cuts the brakes and allows it to

recognise the cancer cells. Now we

1:41:541:41:59

can do that, we want to steer it,

instead of just cutting the brakes

1:41:591:42:03

and letting it roll, we want to

steer it against what is

1:42:031:42:15

particularly abnormal in a

particular person. The technology

1:42:151:42:17

for sequencing the genes in a cancer

cell is available so we can use that

1:42:171:42:20

to work out what it is about the

cancer that might be most visible to

1:42:201:42:23

the immune system.

You would take a

biopsy of someone's cancer, sequence

1:42:231:42:25

the genes, use it to make a

potentially individualised vaccine.

1:42:251:42:33

It is at the cutting edge. We have

seen a few preliminary results in

1:42:331:42:38

small numbers of patients and the

exciting thing as it will now start

1:42:381:42:40

going into much larger trials.

Could

you theoretically do that for all

1:42:401:42:45

people who have had a cancer?

At the

moment, the cancer is responding

1:42:451:42:51

best to the immune therapy are the

ones with lots of mutations, lots of

1:42:511:42:56

abnormalities. Those are the ones we

will focus on, things like melanoma,

1:42:561:43:01

lung cancer, bladder cancer, we know

the way the cancer develops has

1:43:011:43:06

caused damage to the DNA making the

most visible.

Two very small first

1:43:061:43:12

aid Schumann trials have taken place

using the newly created cancer

1:43:121:43:20

vaccine -- human trials. But the

results, would you say they are

1:43:201:43:26

promising, 12 out of the 19 patients

well cancer free up to two years

1:43:261:43:31

later?

Very exciting. Very

preliminary and I do not want people

1:43:311:43:35

watching to think this is going to

be a routine treatment tomorrow,

1:43:351:43:39

really important to emphasise, we

need the evidence, but it is very

1:43:391:43:45

exciting to see that using this

technology, we can get the immune

1:43:451:43:48

system to lock onto the cancers.

We

had a chat last week, you gave me a

1:43:481:43:53

brilliant analogy of how cancer

cells work and they work like a

1:43:531:43:57

woman's placenta does when it stops

the immune system attacking the

1:43:571:44:00

foetus as it grows inside the

uterus, fellow audience about that.

1:44:001:44:05

One of the reasons cancers can

escape the immune system, Sophie

1:44:051:44:09

knows more about this, we have all

sorts of defence mechanisms to stop

1:44:091:44:13

the immune system attacking our body

and particularly if you have to

1:44:131:44:18

carry a baby, a baby is only half

like you genetically.

An alien thing

1:44:181:44:23

inside you.

It is a transplant you

have to carry safely for nine

1:44:231:44:28

months. The mechanisms in the

placenta stopping the immune system

1:44:281:44:31

getting to the baby are exactly the

same as some programmes cancer can

1:44:311:44:35

call on to evade the immune system

themselves.

Sophie, I will bring you

1:44:351:44:40

in in a minute, I want to talk to a

dream, skin cancer, one year later,

1:44:401:44:45

it had spread to many of your organs

-- I want to talk to Adrian. You

1:44:451:44:51

were told you had 12 months to live,

five years ago, what did they do to

1:44:511:44:56

you?

Immune therapy. I was fortunate

enough at that time to be offered a

1:44:561:45:02

trial drug programme. I was in

Birmingham, I jumped at the

1:45:021:45:07

opportunity, given only a potential

12 months to survive, and from then

1:45:071:45:13

on, things moved on rather rapidly.

Fortunately, my body, my immune

1:45:131:45:19

system, it accepted the trial drug

programme. I never really felt ill

1:45:191:45:23

though we went through an

instability where we got the balance

1:45:231:45:26

right and the drug basically the

volume of periodic drugs while body

1:45:261:45:31

would feel comfortable with. And

that was a 12 month programme. We

1:45:311:45:37

changed that because I believed it

was explained to me that melanomas

1:45:371:45:45

are very aggressive, very

intelligent cancer, they can

1:45:451:45:47

potentially outthink the drugs. We

went on then to an intravenous drug,

1:45:471:45:52

and I had two successful different

intravenous... Again, my body

1:45:521:46:02

accepted it. Modern day chemotherapy

type drugs, I accepted them quite

1:46:021:46:08

well, one of the lucky ones.

Your

cancer has shrunk to what?

If I dare

1:46:081:46:16

say, a trace, if I dare say, today I

am cancer free. It is an amazing...

1:46:161:46:22

I have been two years drug-free, so

this was all in the first three

1:46:221:46:27

years. I have led a very active

normal life in the drug periods and

1:46:271:46:33

certainly now that, you know, I am

very fortunate, through people

1:46:331:46:41

around the table today, modern

immune therapies, I was on early

1:46:411:46:46

stages of the immune therapies, as

Peter has explained, and things are

1:46:461:46:49

changing.

1:46:491:46:54

This immunotherapy is the latest

frontier in terms of trying to treat

1:46:541:47:00

cancer. Doctor Acton, in your work

you are trying to figure out, under

1:47:001:47:07

this label of immunotherapy, the

tricks that cancer cells play so you

1:47:071:47:12

can unlock those tricks and counter

them with brand-new treatments.

Yes,

1:47:121:47:18

the treatments out there that

patients are receiving now, as Peter

1:47:181:47:23

described, to take the brakes off so

cancer can trick your activated

1:47:231:47:27

immune cells. Even if we had a great

vaccine and get to the cancer cells,

1:47:271:47:31

the Cancer can switch them off, so

we want to stop them doing that.

1:47:311:47:35

That's some of the immunotherapy out

there now. But there are lots of

1:47:351:47:38

other tricks and other healthy cells

that cancer bring in and change

1:47:381:47:44

their behaviour and we need to find

new ways to design new drugs.

There

1:47:441:47:49

are several issues to unravel.

Beginning with getting our own

1:47:491:47:53

selves to recognise cancer cells and

tumours.

Yes, and it is difficult.

1:47:531:47:57

Something like a vaccine against

measles, as you suggest, it's a

1:47:571:48:02

virus, foreign, definitely not a

human cell and it's difficult for

1:48:021:48:07

our immune system to see and attack.

It knows it is foreign and can kill

1:48:071:48:12

it, as it will kill infected cells.

Cancer comes from the patient's on

1:48:121:48:18

original healthy cells. While they

are different, and we know they are

1:48:181:48:21

misbehaving and we want to get rid

of them, they look much more similar

1:48:211:48:25

to healthy cells than a virus. So

the breakthrough is there,

1:48:251:48:33

sequencing the genomes to find the

sequences and using them for the

1:48:331:48:38

immune system to recognise and

destroy those cells.

The next issue

1:48:381:48:41

is getting the cells inside the

tumour to fight it.

It's more

1:48:411:48:44

competent than just getting

activated immune cells, we need

1:48:441:48:47

those cells to get into the tumours

and find the cells and kill them.

1:48:471:48:52

That much more complicated. A lot of

tumours will going to active

1:48:521:48:59

surrounding cells and form a kind of

scar around them to protect

1:48:591:49:08

themselves. These are other angles

we can take to enhance

1:49:081:49:12

immunotherapy.

Why do healthy cells

sometimes go wrong?

There are a lot

1:49:121:49:16

of environmental factors that we

have heard about in the news and

1:49:161:49:19

agencies like Cancer Research UK,

giving us advice on how to avoid

1:49:191:49:24

them and keep ourselves healthy.

Fundamentally, the human body has

1:49:241:49:30

trillions of cells, dividing all the

time as we grow and age. Every time

1:49:301:49:33

we defined, we have to make a

perfect copy of our whole DNA. If

1:49:331:49:38

you try to do that with trillions of

sells for 90 years, there will

1:49:381:49:43

sometimes be mistakes. Most of those

mistakes are not harmful at all and

1:49:431:49:46

the cells can cope or die. But

sometimes those mistakes happen in

1:49:461:49:52

key areas and that cell can become

cancer.

Cells going wrong is a

1:49:521:49:59

natural consequence of us living so

much longer?

Partly, and partly some

1:49:591:50:03

of the things we do to ourselves,

like ultraviolet radiation in the

1:50:031:50:09

sunshine, smoking cigarettes, being

too heavy, and eating diets that are

1:50:091:50:12

high in saturated fats, all these

things increasing the damage and

1:50:121:50:16

likelihood that some cells will go

wrong. But quite a lot of cancer is

1:50:161:50:20

just down to the play of chance in

the genomes.

A question I know not

1:50:201:50:24

like, but I have to ask, we talked

about the big clinical trial

1:50:241:50:33

starting next year and to customise

cancer vaccines, so how many years

1:50:331:50:37

away from that potentially being on

the market are we?

It will take

1:50:371:50:41

several years to get the trials and

understand the results and see if it

1:50:411:50:44

really works, but it moves

incredibly fast, these checkpoint

1:50:441:50:49

antibodies, cutting the brakes on

the immune system, that we use quite

1:50:491:50:52

widely now, were not even thought of

ten years ago. So once you get the

1:50:521:50:56

information and start to see the

results of the trials, things can

1:50:561:51:00

move very fast, but that's what we

have to do.

Thank you all very much

1:51:001:51:03

for coming in.

1:51:031:51:09

Some breaking news, a man called

Neville horde has pleaded guilty at

1:51:101:51:16

Bradford Crown Court for murdering a

supermarket worker, stabbed to death

1:51:161:51:22

outside and Aldi store just before

Christmas. Jody Wilshere was stabbed

1:51:221:51:30

to death in an Aldi store in

Yorkshire just before Christmas.

1:51:301:51:36

Have you ever worked

a shift for free?

1:51:371:51:39

Or even lots of shifts?

1:51:391:51:40

With no job offer

at the end of it all?

1:51:401:51:46

A call to ban unpaid

trial shifts is being

1:51:461:51:48

debated in Parliament.

1:51:481:51:51

We can speak to SNP MP Stuart

McDonald who is raising the issue in

1:51:511:51:57

Parliament. Daniel is a waiter who

has done on page trials shift. And

1:51:571:52:03

on the phone we have James, not his

real name, who works in catering and

1:52:031:52:07

has also done on page shifts and has

recruited others to do them. James,

1:52:071:52:12

why are you doing these unpaid

shifts?

You do them when you apply

1:52:121:52:16

for a job. If you want to go for the

job and get the job to pay your

1:52:161:52:24

bills etc. On the other side, we are

told as managers within the catering

1:52:241:52:30

industry to recruit staff and go

through the trial process. If you

1:52:301:52:34

don't follow that then you could end

up in disciplinary and stuff like

1:52:341:52:39

that, because you haven't followed

company procedure.

How often do you

1:52:391:52:42

give people a job at the end of an

on page trials shift?

It depends. We

1:52:421:52:47

recruit kitchen porters, chefs,

generally if you get a lot of

1:52:471:52:52

applicants you will pick the best

for the job. With a kitchen porter,

1:52:521:52:56

you could get six or seven people

applying.

Why can't you just give

1:52:561:53:03

somebody a job through the

conventional process of looking at

1:53:031:53:07

their CV and interviewing them?

Sometimes it's a skill set. We want

1:53:071:53:13

to make sure they fit in with a

team, have the right enthusiasm and

1:53:131:53:16

stuff like that. That's what we are

told by the hate charred apartment,

1:53:161:53:20

we need to look at that and make

sure they fit in. -- by the HR

1:53:201:53:27

department. We need to make sure

they fit in and can do the job.

Do

1:53:271:53:30

you think it is fair?

I don't. I'm a

very unions person. I think it is

1:53:301:53:35

unfair. I think people should be

paid for what they do.

Daniel, you

1:53:351:53:43

had three trial shifts for jobs in

the past. All of them unpaid. Did

1:53:431:53:49

you get a job at the end of any of

them?

The third and final trials

1:53:491:53:54

shift I went to, I was given the

job, thank goodness. I was very

1:53:541:53:59

relieved to be given a job as the

previous trial shifts I had done

1:53:591:54:02

were six hours unpaid, and they said

they would get back to me within a

1:54:021:54:08

week but I never heard from them

again.

Could that be you are not the

1:54:081:54:11

right person for the job, or do you

think they were taking the Mick?

I

1:54:111:54:15

think they were taking the Mick. Of

the two trial shifts I never heard

1:54:151:54:22

anything again, I had done a

face-to-face interview, so they knew

1:54:221:54:27

my personality. I don't think they

had a reason not to get back to me.

1:54:271:54:31

Did you try to contact them and ask

what was going on?

I did. Two of

1:54:311:54:36

them I tried to ask what was going

on and I was met with, sorry, you're

1:54:361:54:40

not the right candidate for the

role. There was no further

1:54:401:54:43

explanation and they put the phone

down on me.

How did you feel about

1:54:431:54:47

that?

I was gutted. I'd worked

six-hour shifts with the promise, if

1:54:471:54:55

we think you are the right candidate

and you do well on the shift, you

1:54:551:54:58

will almost certainly get the job,

and to have it taken away from you

1:54:581:55:02

at the end when you have slaved in

the restaurant, and they often put

1:55:021:55:04

you on the busiest time of the week,

so I was on a Saturday night,

1:55:041:55:09

working six hours with the promise

of a job, but it wasn't to be.

1:55:091:55:13

Stuart McDonald, SNP MP. There is

nothing illegal about asking a

1:55:131:55:17

worker to do a voluntary trials

shift, is there?

As the law stands

1:55:171:55:21

at the minute, I think it needs to

be fixed. In 20 years of the

1:55:211:55:25

national minimum wage act, there

hasn't been a single place, a single

1:55:251:55:30

tribunal, fine, ticking off, naming

and shaming, nothing. In 20 years of

1:55:301:55:36

the act, against the use of an

unpaid trials shift. My bill

1:55:361:55:40

proposes to amend the national

minimum wage act to make it crystal

1:55:401:55:44

clear that the cases your callers

have explained this morning will be

1:55:441:55:47

outlawed.

Smaller businesses in

particular rely on these kinds of

1:55:471:55:52

things as part of a recruitment

process. They absolutely have to get

1:55:521:55:56

the right personality in a small

business.

They absolutely do, and

1:55:561:55:59

this isn't about banning the

practice of trialling people. Nobody

1:55:591:56:03

would wish to do that. This is about

unpaid trial shifts and the

1:56:031:56:08

miserable, cynical exploitation that

almost always seems to accompany

1:56:081:56:11

them. It's aggravated by the fact

your first call this morning can't

1:56:111:56:17

even use his own name, so ashamed

people in the industry of them,

1:56:171:56:21

because he is forced to because of

his bosses. I would say to

1:56:211:56:26

businesses, employment law is

currently so heavily stacked in

1:56:261:56:30

favour of the ploy, why not put

people on probation periods, as is

1:56:301:56:34

normal in almost every other

mainstream work? The people who

1:56:341:56:38

suffer here are the lowest paid, and

people who often don't know their

1:56:381:56:42

rights in order to stand up for

them. My bill brings in the

1:56:421:56:46

protections to make sure people

can't be exploited. That where they

1:56:461:56:49

are offered a trial they are paid at

least the minimum weight. I think

1:56:491:56:53

that is good for business.

Let me

read a message, a Tweet, I have

1:56:531:56:58

worked in bars before and been

management before. I have been told

1:56:581:57:03

by higher up people to give trials

shift to people with not a chance of

1:57:031:57:07

getting a job, just because it was

an understaffed weekend.

I hear that

1:57:071:57:10

a lot. And can you think of a more

cynical practice, and can you

1:57:101:57:14

imagine if that was your first

introduction to the world of work?

1:57:141:57:19

Often people covering sicknesses or

holidays of other staff members and

1:57:191:57:23

being strung along. Often working

long hours, without a job to give

1:57:231:57:26

them at the end of it. It's time for

parliament to put an end to it,

1:57:261:57:31

that's what my bill does and I hope

MPs will back it tomorrow.

James, do

1:57:311:57:35

you agree that trials shift is fine,

but paid a person. Would you like to

1:57:351:57:41

see that in law?

Yes, I would. I

think it's fair because they are

1:57:411:57:44

giving up their time coming in. I

think it's all about fairness. In my

1:57:441:57:52

25 years of working in the catering

industry, just the way they treat

1:57:521:57:56

lower paid staff is quite bad. I

believe this is another thing they

1:57:561:58:02

use, being told, bring people in on

busy shifts when you have lots of

1:58:021:58:06

functions going on in your hotel.

Bring in people so you don't have to

1:58:061:58:10

pay that on your Labour budget.

Thank you, James. Thank you to

1:58:101:58:17

Daniel, and continued success with

your job. And thank you to Stuart

1:58:171:58:20

McDonald as well. Thank you for your

company today. Have a good day, we

1:58:201:58:24

will be back tomorrow at 9am. Thank

1:58:241:58:26

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