Edited Coverage Nelson Mandela: A Nation Remembers

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Nelson Mandela achieved what many people believed to be the


impossible, to deliver from the violence and chaos from a country


living with tensions, both between races and within the black


community, a country that did not tear itself apart, but embarked on a


new life as a democracy. That triumph made him a figure admired


throughout the world, admired for his courage, his resoluteness and


his magnanimity in victory. He offered the world a vision that


sometimes life can turn out for the better and that to believe that is


the right way to live. It's the inspiration that brought thousands


of South Africans to Johannesburg today for the national memorial


event in the huge football stadium just outside Soweto, that sprawling


black township where Mandela spent most of his adult life until he was


imprisoned for over 27 years when just 44 years old. Rain in South


Africa, particularly at a funeral, is considered to be a blessing from


God. It may have meant the stadium wasn't completely full today. Inside


the stadium, before the service started, a choir of voices sang in


praise of the man they call Madiba or Tata - Father. There were a host


of famous faces here, nearly 100 heads of state, heads of government,


President Obama, the British Prime Minister, David Cameron, Tony Blair,


distinguished figure of one man who was on Robben Island with Nelson


Mandela. His lawyer at the trials. FW de Klerk, the former President of


South Africa. And the familiar figure of Desmond Tutu and then


Winnie Mandela, his second wife. So, here we are sat in the dark in


Pretoria. Behind us, the wonderful view of the Union Buildings where,


tomorrow, Nelson Mandela's body will lie in state for the ordinary people


of South Africa to pay tribute. I have three guests with me in the


studio, all of whom - you were all there today, weren't you? Yes. Let


me introduce them. On my left, the partner of Steve Beco. In February


of this year, she started a new political party, to chivvy the ANC.


Next to her, a man who was deeply involved in the traditional element


in the services that take place at the weekend, but is also an ANC MP


in Parliament. Then, a woman who is very popular among the black


community for the courage she showed during the apartheid years. You were


banned from singing some of your hymns? I was banned on my return


after performing on the frontline. What happened if you were a banned


person under apartheid? As a singer, it was a bit of a dud for me. I


wasn't allowed to be heard on radio, or on television. Nothing. I was


silenced. How did you know Mandela? What do you remember of him? Like


everybody who grew up in South Africa, I heard about him. I read


about him. It so happened on the day when I was celebrating my


graduation, at home, I got a surprise telegram coming from Robben


Island with Madiba congratulating me for having achieved... Because he


knew your family? He did know my family. My grandfather - actually,


my father and his sister, one of his sisters, grew up with him. You, of


course, have endlessly been described as Steve's partner. He


died in police custody. Have you been a supporter of the ANC, has


that been your position, politically? My position,


politically, has always been that of an active citizen, an activist


student and later an active professional. I never belonged to


any political party and the ANC's association is merely because I'm


very close to many people who are members of the ANC. Of course, I was


very close to Mr Mandela. We are going to... I never carried a card


for the ANC. You were there today. What did you make of it? We are


going to see some scenes in a moment. What did you think of it? It


made me realise that with great leadership, this country can come


together. That's what Madiba did today. For me, even upon his death,


we were privy to a country coming together under extreme


circumstances, extreme weather. It's just the wonderment of this man that


manages again and again to pull us together. This - let's have a look


at the stadium where today's memorial was held. It's become an


iconic location. It did have a particular meaning for Nelson


Mandela himself. The FNB Stadium was opened in 1989. Less than a year


later, huge crowds came here to welcome Mandela home two days after


he was set free. No football game in South Africa ever drew crowds like


these. 48 hours after Nelson Mandela's release, finally the


prospect of seeing their hero on home ground. My return to Soweto


fills my heart with joy. Africa! Africa! Mandela came back in 1993


for two painful events - the funeral of his ANC friend Oliver Tambo and


of Chris Hani, the leader of the ANC's military wing, who had been


murdered. We want an election date now. The following year with Mandela


President, the FNB Stadium was host to the African Cup of Nations. South


Africa reached the final and with only 17 minutes left before the


whistle, Mark Williams scored two goals in two minutes. The victory


proved euphoric. One of the unifying moments in a country obsessed with


sport. South Africans of all races celebrated their nation's triumph.


In 2010, the stadium was completely rebuilt for the World Cup, played


here in South Africa. It was seen as the symbol of a revitalised nation.


The closing ceremony of the World Cup, just three years ago, saw


Mandela's last official public appearance. We will hear some of the


speeches that were made this morning there. It does seem to me there is a


lot of - there are obvious things that were said about Mandela, about


his charm, about his courage. People don't so often talk about his


political astuteness. He seems to me to have been extremely clever and


cunning in his politics? Would you agree with that? Absolutely. He was


a studied strategist of political engagement. He cultivated that


during his imprisonment. He read every book that was to be read about


the Afrikaans people. He read many biographies and he got to know each


and every one of the people that he engaged. So when he talked to his


jailors, he talked to them as fellow South Africans. When do you think it


dawned on them that the Afrikaaner needed him as much as he needed


them? What he did realise was the only way you could break an impasse


was for you who stand to gain more from the breaking of the impasse to


be willing to see the opportunities for compromise. You are asking


people who are in power to share that power and you come from the


outside and, therefore, you are the one who has to be willing to


compromise but do so in a way that takes the collective much further.


Hence his discussions with the ANC when he began talks with the


government saying to them, "We must make the first step to talk to them.


It is ridiculous not to." Them in the end coming around to agree to


that. The point is that he did not get agreement to talk to the other


side, which is one of the reasons why he asked to be put in solitary


confinement because he understood the importance of the moment. That


was the moment to talk. His peers and his comrades were not ready. He


decided to lead from the front. None of them stopped him, it has to be


said. Let's go - we will come back to this - the memorial service. It


began with the singing of the National Anthem. "God Save Africa."


# Nkosi sikelel' iAfrika. # Maluphakanyisw' uphondo lwayo.


# Yizwa imithandazo yethu. # Nkosi sikelela, thina lusapho


lwayo. # Morena boloka setjhaba sa heso.


# O fedise dintwa la matshwenyeho. # O se boloke, O se boloke setjhaba


sa heso. # Setjhaba sa South Afrika - South


Afrika. On behalf of the President, I


welcome all of you who have travelled from all corners of the


world. I also extend warm words of welcome to our friends from all over


the world and let us give Nelson Mandela's friends, as well as the


friends of South Africa from all over the world, a round of South


African warm welcome and say thank you for coming.


We were not able to stop the rain. But this is how Nelson Mandela would


have wanted to be sent off. These are blessings in our African


tradition. When it rains when you are buried, it means that your Gods


are welcoming you and the gates of heaven are most probably open as


well. This occasion should make all of us


to pause today and reflect on the life of Nelson Mandela. Today's


memorial service should hopefully give each one of us together our


memories of Nelson Mandela and on Sunday, we will bid him farewell in


Qunu when we lay him to rest knowing that our memories of him will endure


forever. I would like us now to do what he would have wanted us to do -


that is to open this memorial service with an interfaith opening


prayer. The prayers came from Chief Rabbi


Warren Goldstein, a representative of the Muslim faith and the


archbishop. In whose hands are the souls of the living and the dead,


receive we beseech you in your great loving kindness the soul of Nelson


Rolihlahla Mandela who has been gathered unto his people. Remember


him for the righteousness which he has done. Your sun shall never more


set, for the Lord God shall be your everlasting light and the days of


your mourning shall be ended and let us say amen.


Oh, supreme Lord. Lead us from untruth to truth.


Like our father Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela. Lead us from darkness to


light, like our father, Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela. Lead us from


death to immortality, like our father, Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela.


May he rest in peace. Amen. Our indebtedness to Madiba for his


self--less efforts, in salvaging the nation and leading it to the path of


peace, reconciliation and harmony. And laying the foundation of a free


and prosperous South Africa. With this prayer, we ask, let us


dedicate ourselves to the good ideals he strove to in his life.


Amen. Creator, God, Lord of life and love,


you hold the whole yun verse in your hands. Hell -- universe in your


hands. Help us to draw on the lessons of our past and to build on


the firm foundation that by your grace Madiba laid for us, give us


courage to hold fast to his values, to follow the example of his


practises and to share them with the world.


May he rest in peace and rise in glory.


Amen. # Da-da Madiba


Nelson Mandela The national chair of the ANC, the


African national Congress, who is cochairing this memorial event.


We are here to mourn the great man, but also to celebrate a glorious


life well lived. Today, more than any other is thankfulness for that


wonderful life. A son of Africa Africa. A descendant of a great


king. You will always be remembered. We are now going to call upon


Madiba's grandchildren. Madiba had 18 grandchildren and 12 great


grandchildren. We are going to call them, who are going to come and pay


tribute to their grandfather and great grandfather. I call them to


come to the stage to come and express their tributes to their


grandfather. On behalf of the family I would like


to thank all the heads of state that are here. Thank you. Madiba, the


last walk. Struck by lightning bolts in the dead of night, day dazed and


dis or disorientated, struggling to bid farewell to any mortal, caught


in the whirl wind. What do I do? I need a poem. When sadness and


celebrations can mingle, the body shudders, shakes and implodes. When


it blows in memories, the land is dreamt off. You are lodged in our


memories. You tower over the world like a Comet. Leaving streaks of


light for us to follow. We salute you. Madiba.


Who stole the fire from the Gods. The light to light our path to


freedom. Who lit our stoves to cook a meal of


peace and reconciliation. The giant tree has fallen, scattering one


million bright leafs, each messages of peace of love and reconciliation.


Shall we walk in his footstep footsteps? . Madiba, they say, you


are a brilliant man. They say you are a wise man. You


remind them of a wise man too. They say you have warmth and charm.


Warm and charming too. They say you are resilient. You are a mirror that


reflects the glory and splendour of heart. People reflect this dreams.


You have taught us that. A group of trees break the angry wind. The tree


that towers above the rest is broken by the wind. Proud of dreams of a


future where black and white, rich and poor, men, women and children


must live side by side. Dreaming the same dream. Realising that the time


in our land, we salute you. They were very moving, weren't they,


the grandchildren. That very last. PJ Powers, we saw you in there,


singing the choir. What were you singing? We were sing singing Nelson


Mandela. Let's see it. There you are, in the


middle there. You wrote some songs for these


events. Have you got some songs, your famous songs. You sang at the


World Cup. Yes, I did. That is a song that has been sung at all the


Rugby World Cups. It was a hymn. I did it at the 1995 World Cup. What


did you think of today? What did you make of it? It with us a wonderful


celebration. It was a send-off, as I said earlier, this man who brought


everybody together. That is how it happened Oman Mandela is and will


remain -- is how it happened. Nelson Mandela is and will remain the


greatest thing this country will ever see. What did you make of


today? I realised that Mandela is the unifier.


The whole world was here in South Africa.


You were touched by the number of people who came? The number of


foreign dignitaries. Did you not expect that? I did expect South


Africans would come in their numbers. I did not expect the heads


of state and Government would come in the numbers they did. Countries


that I wouldn't have thought that had a lot of dealings with South


Africa. What do you think brought them here?


Mandela. They had to be here to represent their countries. It looks


like to me, everybody would like to be like Mandela. Anyone who is a


leader of a community of people, a nation, and if they can't, at least


they must be associated with Mandela. And he inspires them in


various ways. Not all of them are able, or none of them are able to


emulate him as much as they would like to, but he is an example that


everybody would like to be associated with. Do you think a new


generation will draw inspiration from Mandela's life. What would you


want them to learn from it? Mandela touches that inside ourselves, that


wants us to be bigger. And I have seen it with young


people. Even young children, having just touched him, having just been


touched by him. Already, so in terms of their


possibilities. And that, I think, is what is amazing about his legacy.


He's legacy calls us to greatness. At every point, because the way he


related to people, he made himself present in the moment that he talks


to you. However young, however old, however poor, however rich, he was


present in the moment. And of course, his example of


servant leadership, a man who gave of himself, in order to serve, not


in a subservient way, but in a way that says, this is what leadership


is about. This is what is possible if we work


together. And so, I believe that today we were


celebrate celebrating the greatness of, not just the man, but the


greatness of what he has inspired in us. And in our country and in the


world. The African National Congress


organised today. You represent also traditional leaders and you are


going to play a special part in the ceremony? As part of the collective


of tragsal leadership in the area. -- traditional leadership in the


area. Being the old original law-giving law-makers. The original


rulers of South Africa. We have heard of things like speaking to the


body and particularly - what actually happens? What will we see


happen? Well, we believe that a person even as he is dead continues


to live through his spirit. So, therefore that is why it is


important that when he is to be moved from one place to the other


that someone has to speak to him. To speak to his spirit, to tell him


this is where we are moving from now, this is where we're going to.


So his spirit does not wander about. It must be together with the body


until the final resting place. So that it become becomes part of the


family - the guardian of the home steed, where he lies to rest. What


is the relationship between traditional leadership and the more


political leadership of the ANC, in your view? I believe South Africa


has strived to do and is still striving to do is to have a place in


our constitutional democracy for traditional leadership. And this is


important because there is a sense in which the evolution of


traditional leadership in South Africa was interrupted by


colonialism. So, the process of bring bringing into modernity those


cultural customary practises has to be enacted in a way that is within


the spirit of a human rights-based constitution. That is the genius of


Madiba, in that he recognised the importance of traditional


leadership. But also recognised the contradictions that are likely to


arise. And, as a lawyer, and as a human rights principled man, he


always made sure that when there is a contradiction, the constitution


must rule. You as, not belonging to that side of South African culture,


are you surprised by that? Do you find a conflict between the modern


politician and the traditional, well you were there dancing and singing


in the traditional style - is it surprising to you, is it natural to


you? I believe the two can co-habit.


There is a place. I cherish the modern side that plans the way


forward. We will see a singer in a moment, I hope. Let's watch a bit


more of what went on this morning. I suppose the highlight of the day for


many was the speech by the American President, Barack Obama. But other


speeches and music before that. Here, for instance, is the


Secretary-General of the United Nations, Ban Ki-moon. Nelson Mandela


showed us the way with a heart larger than this stadium and an


infectious smile that could light up the world. Nelson Mandela is at


rest. His long walk complete. Let us now be inspired by the spirit he


awoken in all of us. It is a duty of all of us who loved him to keep his


memory alive, in our hearts and to embody his example in our lives. May


he rest in peace and eternity. # Can reach down and bless our


hearts # From his heaven above... #


To the people of South Africa - people of every race and walk of


life - the world thanks you for sharing Nelson Mandela with us. It


is hard to eulogise any man - to capture in words not just the facts


and the dates that make a life, but the essential truth of a person -


their private joys and sorrows; the quiet moments and unique qualities


that illuminate someone's soul. How much harder to do so for a giant of


history, who moved a nation toward justice, and in the process moved


billions around the world. We see a man who earned his place in history


through struggle and shrewdness and persistence and faith. He tells us


what is possible, not just in the pages of history books, but in our


own lives as well. Moreover, he accepted the consequences of his


actions, knowing that standing up to powerful interests and injustice


carries a price. "I have fought against white domination and I have


fought against black domination. I've cherished the ideal of a


democratic and free society in which all persons live together in harmony


and with equal opportunities. It is an ideal which I hope to live for


and to achieve. But if needs be, it is an ideal for which I am prepared


to die." There is a word in South Africa - Ubuntu - a word that


captures Mandela's greatest gift: his recognition that we are all


bound together in ways that are invisible to the eye; that there is


a oneness to humanity; that we achieve ourselves by sharing


ourselves with others, and caring for those around us. We will never


see the likes of Nelson Mandela again. May God bless the people of


South Africa. Can I just remind the people sitting up there that we will


wait until you have finished? Can we keep silent, please? Right up there.


We do not call Madiba the father of our nation, merely for political


correctness or relevance: We do so because he laid a firm foundation


for the South Africa of our dreams - one that is united, non-racial,


non-sexist, democratic and prosperous. We do so because Madiba


was a courageous leader. Courageous leaders are able to abandon their


narrow concerns for bigger and all-embracing dreams, even if those


dreams come at a huge price. Madiba embodied this trait. He was a


fearless freedom fighter who refused to allow the brutality of the


apartheid state to stand in the way of the struggle for the liberation


of his people. Our Father, Madiba, has run a good race. He declared in


his own words, in 1994, he said, "Death is something inevitable. When


a man has done what he considers to be his duty to his people and his


country, he can rest in peace. I believe I've made that effort and


that is, therefore, why I will sleep for eternity." Rest in peace, Our


Father, and our hero. Thank you very much.


We promise God, you must say "yes". We promise God that we are going to


follow the example of Nelson Mandela. Yes!


STUDIO: A robust blessing given by Desmond Tutu. He said he wouldn't


give the blessing unless there was silence, so he could hear a pin


drop. Then the dignitaries and the crowd left. Winnie Mandela in the


middle. There were four British Prime Ministers here today for this


memorial. Sir John Major, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and David


Cameron, who I spoke to here about his reaction to the events he had


witnessed. You have come from the stadium. What


was it like in there? It was more like a celebration than a


commemoration, a music, dance, people swaying - it was


extraordinary. I thought the highlight was the Obama speech,


where it was very, very powerful and really roused the crowd. It made


everyone look inwards and think, "What more can I do to honour the


memory of this great man?" You didn't get to speak at all? I wasn't


coming to speak, I was coming to pay my respects. That was a wonderful


thing to be able to do. You felt very proud to be there. Also, an


extraordinary opportunity to meet quite so many other heads of state


and government, the sort of diplomatic argy-bargy was


interesting in itself. Tell us about that. It is quite odd to find four


American presidents all in one place. In fact, Carter, Clinton,


Bush, Obama. That is an interesting start. Then a lot of African


leaders, who I have met before, I was able to talk to. I could


commiserate with Francois Hollande about his losses in the Central


African Republic. Then a wide range of people from the President of


Mexico to the Prime Minister of India. Raul Castro, did you shake


his hand? I didn't. I didn't meet him, actually. I managed to not meet


Robert Mugabe. Other than that, I did meet a lot of people. How did


you manage not to meet Robert Mugabe? I can't think. Deft hands!


There are some African leaders I admire. The President of Botswana is


doing a fantastic job. Yes. There are people who are doing great


things for their countries. Do you really have a chance to say anything


meaningful? You are there for quite a long time. Yes, you do. There are


always - our Foreign Office is very good at making the most of all your


contacts. There's this wonderful thing on some of their notes that


says, "Perhaps best not to talk to you, but if you do, this is the


point you ought to make." You do have a chance. You have cue cards


like Ronald Reagan used to have? Britain is - we are competing in a


global race. We want to have relationships, engagements across


the world. In Africa, you have some of the fastest-growing economies


right now. Getting Britain more involved in South Africa, Nigeria,


Botswana, Mozambique, this is a very important part of our country. It is


not appropriate to do too much of that during a massive commemoration


like today. These relationships matter. I spend a lot of time on


them. You have been critical of the Conservative Party's attitude


towards apartheid. Do you think Mrs Thatcher and that period allowed


apartheid to go on longer than it otherwise would have done? Mrs


Thatcher was an opponent of apartheid. She wanted Nelson Mandela


freed and letters have been released to prove that. There was the


question of the attitude towards sanctions, which I have spoken about


in the past. I think we should be clear that all political parties in


Britain were opposed to apartheid. I remember seeing for myself what an


appalling system it was. What were the mistakes that the Conservative


Party made? I wrote about this in 2006. There was an argument there.


There is always an argument with sanctions. Does it hit the


government? Or does it hit the people? On all sides of politics,


everyone wanted to see change in South Africa. I don't think anyone


believed in their heart of hearts that it really would happen as


peacefully as it did. That was the most wonderful thing about it.


Mandela leaving prison and then this immense political change also made


possible - we should remember this - and he was there today in the seats


with all the world leaders - FW de Klerk who himself was awarded the


Nobel Peace Prize and who helped make this extraordinary change


possible. Just on a political point what, do you think for a politician


is the lesson that Mandela taught? I think the biggest lesson is this


immense generosity and this boldness - this sense that you should do the


right thing. When you think of how bitter Mandela could have been, when


you think of the leadership he could have given in a more sectional


direction. The fact he choose openness, he choose to forgive his


former captors andor mentors and wanted to create an open and


generous South Africa, I think that is an immense political lesson. That


was the best part, for me of the whole day was Obama saying, there


are those who hold up Madiba as an icon, but don't always follow his


lessons about tolerance, not imprisoning your political


opponents. I thought that was a great moment. I thought a very


powerful point that perhaps only Obama could have made in that way,


at that time, in front of all those people. Prime Minister, thank you


very much. Thank you for joining us. David Cameron, who was here earlier.


Now the mourning lasts several days. Tomorrow, something quite different.


Tomorrow, the commemoration moves from the football stadium in Soweto,


here to Pretoria, the capital of South Africa.


For three days Nelson Mandela's body will lie here in state for the


ordinary people of South Africa to file past. These are the Union


Buildings - the headquarters of the presidency and the Government. It


was here that just under 20 years ago we watched Nelson Mandela, up


there on the platform, taking the oath as President, surrounded by all


of the people who opposed him - the General, the chiefs of police, the


nationalist politician, as he became President of South Africa. There was


that great moment when the jets from the South African Air Force streamed


past, flying coloured smoke in the colours of the South African flag.


Tomorrow will be a much more sombre affair, of course. The coffin will


be brought from the military hospital, down there in Pretoria,


will wind up through these gardens to this central platform here. It is


here that people will file past. And each day, for three days, that


coffin is going to be brought from the hospital, to be taken back at


night and then once again to go through the streets. No doubt the


scenes will be very moving. There's another building that is


just as important to the Mandela story here in downtown Pretoria -


the Palace of Justice, on Church Square. It is here where Mandela was


put on trial for plotting violent revolution on 9th October, 1963.


He expected the death penalty, but received a life sentence, to a


hugely relieved public gallery. The 27 years he spent in jail changed


him, as he explained to me when I met him.


Before I went to jail I was very arrogant. And there is evidence of


that. But you know, when I was in jail, I


had something I did not have outside - the ability to sit down and just


think. To review your past life and the future role you have to play. I


became ashamed, because I'd behaved like an animal, to people who were


very kind to me. And I decided that if ever I got a chance, I will make


them appreciate what they did to me. They would know that I appreciated.


In just a few hours, these streets will be blocked off and the solemn


funeral procession will make its way. Another step on South Africa's


long goodbye to Nelson Mandela. The man they call Madiba.


And here we are with the Union Buildings behind us. We will be


there early tomorrow for the funeral procession. Let's use these last


moments to talk about what happens next. Everybody has expressed their


view about what Mandela gave South Africa. The question now is, South


Africa clearly has problems - how is that legacy going to be turned, do


you think, into policies that keep the country united? You have started


a new political party because you don't like what the ANC are doing.


I believe that Mandela's passing gives us another opportunity. A


second chance to re-commit to the values that he lived and worked so


hard for. Which the African National Congress have moved away from that?


I believe that there is a big gap between what leaders in the African


National Congress say and what they do. The issue of human dignity


cannot be set to be met with the kind of conditions under which the


majority of South Africans still live. You speak of poverty and no


electricity and no education and no jobs, indeed. The most important gap


is education, which Mandela himself said, education is the key to the


future. What the ANC has failed to do over the last 20 years is to


provide every child with an education that will awaken the


genius. Instead, we have young people graduating from high school


who can't read, can't write and end up in our streets. Four million of


them are out there. What is to be down? Your party? Let's build a


South Africa of our dreams. A South Africa which will encapsulate this


dream and the focus has to be on quality education that brings out


the best in every child and live livelihoods.


What do you think of this - this criticism of the ANC they are not


delivering what Nelson Mandela intended should be delivered? First


of all, Nelson Mandela himself was an advocate of the community or a


nation that calls on the Government to account. And the good thing about


the ANC is that it lives with the people. Even if the leadership might


seem to be distant from the people at times, but they understand what


the needs of the people are. They always come up with a strategy. It


is different from serving the needs of the people - providing education,


finding a way of providing jobs. Not allowing people, the poor to get


poorer and the rich, richer, isn't it? That is why again on a regular


basis it is policies that address the conditions that obtain - it is


in a position at all times to come up with these strategies that are


going to address... . And you are content with the way things are


going in this country? We could do better, could do more. And the good


thing again is we have this constitution, which guarantees


freedom of expression. Everybody, therefore, is in a position...


People can say what they like, but PJ Powers, you see it as it has


developed since the first universal elections. What do you make of it?


The footage you have shown is the fun mental difference between Nelson


Mandela and the politicians that are -- the funt mental differences


between Nelson Mandela and the politicians.


I think also what is so incredibly amazing about Nelson Mandela is he


always did the unexpected. You know, in 1995, with the World Cup rugby,


he walked into enemy territory, basically. He was surrounded with


people saying, "Nelson. Nelson." He came out of prison and had tea. He


went into areas where he crossed barriers. That is the pam


approximate he has set us -- that is the example he has set us. If we


deliver on those examples, where we are accountable for the actions and


we say, yes, we did wrong, that is the fundamental difference. Has he


reconciled Afrikaans English? You say, no.


Part of the architect's team says to ordinary people, that if you do not


vote for the ANC they will come back and dominate us. That is a said


statement from someone who ought to know better. To for me, the Long


Walk To Freedom is not yet over. The responsibility we have today and the


commitment we ought to make, as we lay this great son of Africa to


rest, is to commit to living the dream he worked so hard for. And


that starts with a Government that, not only does policies, but that is


clean, because corruption is what has stolen the future of many South


Africans. And a Government that is competent and accountable, as PJ


said. Let's just for a moment look ahead to the next days of mourning.


What will happen tomorrow, do you think? You are going to be at the


funeral. You are singing? I am singing in Qunu. And there'll be


choirs... Yes. What do you think the mood will be? The mood here at the


Union Buildings will be a lot more sombre than today. What do you think


it will be like? It should be sombre, mostly because the people


will be viewing the body of Madiba, lying, not speaking, not to speak


any more. And that, meaning therefore, that is the end of Madiba


and we are only left with the legacy that he left us. His family will be


there, won't they, to receive the body - is that right? Here, lying in


state? I am not sure. I imagine there'll always be family members


who are there, even if he will be in the care of the military. What do


you expect to see? You'll be with us, I hope, tomorrow? It will be a


sombre day and viewing the body of a loved one is the hardest thing.


And for those of us who are close to him in more personal ways, it is


something that always touches you in a very fundamental way. Thank you


very much. I thank all three of you very much. That ends this look at


today's events here in South Africa. We will be back at 5 5am tomorrow,


did I say that really, on BBC Two, to watch the procession to the Union


Buildings, high up on the hill behind us. I hope you will join us.


Until then, good evening.


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