02/11/2017: First Minister's Questions Politics Scotland

Hello and a warm welcome to the

garden lobby at the Scottish

Parliament, where the sit and chat

is about the resignation of Michael

Fallon as the Defence Secretary and

his replacement in the UK Government

but the discourse is about this, the

policy paper published today by the

Scottish Government, setting out

four options or possible tax

increases, spreading across the

middle and higher earners. I reckon

that'll come up in First Minister's

Questions but let's find out by

crossing to my colleague.

Thank you,

Brian. General questions still

ongoing, giving us a chance to think

about that document, the finance

secretary will have to get support

from it, a proposal to get tax

reforms through Parliament. The

ministers said they want to avoid

the poorer earners to pay more, they

also raised concerned about raising

tax only on highest earners, that it

could result in a loss of revenue.

Good we look at what income tax and

is? Here is the reaction.

Yesterday,

the UK Parliament unanimously voted

to release 58 sectoral papers on

Brexit...

Moral debates on Brexit on

Labour's Neal Findlay. -- or

debates. The position considered in

this paper is to consider more

taxation bans, with the aim of

increasing revenue to fund public

spending and services while at the

same time, spreading the burden of

that tax across a wider number of

earners, in particular of avoiding

hitting the poorest earners. That's

a priority that the First Minister.

We believe, expect that the

Conservatives would use today's

First Minister's Questions as an

opportunity to attack the

government's approach on tax, we

know they do not support the idea of

April in Scotland paying higher

income tax than voters and taxpayers

elsewhere in the United Kingdom.

Therefore, the finance secretary and

First Minister will look to the

other parties for support, those

that are open to the principle

perhaps of putting taxes up to pay

for public services. Labour, Liberal

Democrats and the Greens. We will

hear from those parties this

afternoon, here at First Minister's

Questions, we will also have heard

from Mr Mackay, with the issue of

tax, which will begin immediately as

soon as this session comes to a

close.

Now we move on to First

Minister's Questions. Before I do

call Ruth Davidson from the

Conservative Party, I am advised

that Alex Rowley is unable to

attend, therefore I will call Jackie

Baillie to call questions on behalf

of Labour. Question number one, Ruth

Davidson.

Thank you, I welcome today

the publication of the Scottish

Government paper on tax, we will

take time to study in detail, and

are happy to engage on it as the

government has requested. To raise

initial questions, in it the First

Minister claims the health of the

economy will be front and centre of

any tax changes she makes. Can I ask

her, will she grant the request made

by economists and trade bodies, to

conduct a full, independent and that

the economic assessment of any tax

changes before they are undertaken?

Well, we will consider any

reasonable request made in the

context of the discussions that we

will have following the publication

of today's paper. But of course, it

is incumbent on the government

generally to put forward proposals

we consider to be in the best

interests of the country as a whole.

The most important aspect of the

paper we have published today in my

view are the four key tests that

should guide our decision-making. We

should make sure we protect the

ability of this Parliament to fund

our public services, to protect

those on the lowest incomes, we need

to make the tax system affair and

tackle inequality, and of course,

make sure the interests of our

economy are at the heart of all our

decisions. One of the things I said

this morning and I genuinely think

all of us in Parliament should

embrace this, often debates on tax

are seen as the interests of the

economy on the one hand versus the

interest of public services on the

other, I think it is the wrong way

to look at it. Our taxes pay for the

infrastructure our economy needs,

the additional support for

entrepreneurs that I announced

yesterday, paying for the

small-business bonuses which removes

small businesses from the burden of

his missa rates. We need to look at

this from the point of view of what

country we want to be, the economy

we want to have an society we want

-- of business rates. I say this in

an open discussion, I hope

Conservatives would reflect on the

fact their policy which has been

analysed in this paper along with

policies from our manifest as last

year and all of our parties. The

Conservative proposal would reduce

public spending in Scotland by £140

million. Given Ruth Davidson

regularly asks me to increase public

spending on a range of issues, I

think it's something the Tories have

to seriously reflect upon.

Ruth

Davidson.

There was a reason,

presiding officer, I asked

specifically about the economic

assessment economists and trade

bodies want, and that is because it

hasn't probably been understood that

under a new deal between the UK and

Scottish governments, if the

Scottish economy grows more quickly

than the UK, the additional revenues

will flow directly to Holyrood,

where as if it grows more slowly,

revenue will drop. So, we all need

to know if a tax rise will slow down

growth in Scotland and paste to the

rest of the UK. Now... Job creators,

retailers and industry figures have

stated their believe this will

happen if taxes rise, so how does

the First Minister answer their

concerns?

Well, their concerns will

be answered in a round of decisions

we take. As I said clearly, those

decisions in the interest of the

public services and lowest in our

society and the economy at heart, is

about balancing the responsible and

progressive decisions that are the

objective of this government. Ruth

Davidson should be aware the

Scottish fiscal commission has the

statutory responsibility to the

forecasts the Budget is going to be

based upon. We have had the office

of the Chief economists carry out

the analysis in this paper but the

analysis for this Budget will be

done by the fiscal commission which

will take on board a range of

factors. Final points, firstly in

terms of Ruth Davidson's points

about tax generally, one of the

points I made this morning and I see

a think tank said this earlier, it

would be better for Scotland if we

had a wider range of tax powers at

our disposal. It's not an ideal

position to be into have income tax

to look at but that is our position,

therefore we have to take balanced,

progressive decisions on the basis

of that. But finally, the

competitiveness and attractiveness

of our economy is not just about our

tax rates, important though that is,

but the quality of our public

services, the skills of our

population, the infrastructure we

have is a country can't right now,

Scotland has the highest quality

public service provision anywhere in

the UK, the most generous social

contract anywhere in the UK, and

taking account of any of the

potential options in the tax paper

we've published today, Scotland will

remain the most cost-effective place

to be in the UK. I think that is a

great position to be in but because

of Brexit, austerity and policies

opposed by Ruth Davidson's party, we

have to ask ourselves how to protect

all that matters to us as a country

and that will drive the decisions

this government takes.

Ruth

Davidson.

Well, there is another

principle I hope these Scottish

Government would follow that they

haven't mentioned so far and that's

simplicity. Because the phrase of

Ireland Institute has made clear a

strong argument for keeping the tax

system as straightforward and

transparent as possible -- the

Fraser Valent Institute. One of the

proposals put forward this morning

suggest as many as six tax bans,

will the First Minister take heed

warnings that a more complex tax

system could create unintended

consequences which detrimentally

impact of the money raised?

First

Minister.

There is an irony behind

that question because I think it is

commonly accepted the UK right now

is the most complex tax system

anywhere in the world! And of

course, much of what lies behind

that, even with income tax, remains

out with the power and

responsibility of this Parliament.

Looking at the proposals which are

in the paper for discussion to

illustrate the options open to us,

some of them do propose a greater

number of tax bans, one of the

things commented on in the paper is

by international standards, that

number, even the highest in these

options today which would be six tax

Theresa May too, would not be

unusual in an international context.

-- six taxation bands. Often in this

system, the more bands there are,

the more progressive the taxation

system is overall cost it allows tax

to be more acutely aligned to the

ability to pay now. I know

progressive tax and relating it to

the ability to pay is not close to

the heart of the Conservatives but

it is close to the heart of this

government. Coming back to the

central point here, presiding

officer, we have good quality public

services, albeit with challenges. We

have a good social contract, good

support from business and

infrastructure, but we face further

austerity from the Tories, the

impact of Brexit and an ageing

population. So, if we want to

protect the society and economy we

want to have, these discussions are

vital. And that's why the point I

posed earlier onto Ruth Davidson is

important. The Tories' proposal

analysed in this paper is to give a

tax cut to the top 10% of earners in

the country, which would take £140

million out of the Scottish Budget.

Ruth Davidson and the Conservatives,

before they go any further in this

tax debate, have to explain how they

would pay for that and who would

bear the burden for that.

Ruth

Davidson.

Presiding Officer, despite

the attempted discussions, the

reasons that we support...

LAUGHTER

.

The reasons we support a

competitive tax regime is we believe

that would develop the Scottish

economy, boosting the income tax

that we need for our schools and

hospitals. And we don't think it's

right any Scott earning more than

£24,000 should have to pay more

because the bottom line here is

about getting growth and we are

lagging behind. The Scottish economy

is currently growing at a third of

the rate of the United Kingdom. And

when we look to the Scottish

Government this week, we look to a

£500 billion growth scheme and a

year ago, still to distribute a

single penny, it has failed to meet

eighth late to set up a strategic

order to set out its plans for

skills by the deadline set, and a

First Minister wanting to start a

debate about raising taxes. Doesn't

she see that first we need to debate

boosting economic growth in Scotland

to meet at least the level of

elsewhere on these islands?

First

Minister.

I'm not quite sure where

Ruth Davidson has been recently but

a very highly respected

businesswoman in Scotland has been

appointed to chair the strategic

board and is currently working hard

to put that in place to make sure we

align the work of our enterprise and

skills agencies. Can I point out to

Ruth Davidson, it may have passed

her by, one of the administrative

options in this paper would reduce

tax for the very lowest income

earners in Scotland making the

system even more progressive. Coming

back to the central point, I

absolutely agree and let's make this

a point of consensus, that it is

absolutely central importance to

support the growth of our economy.

But Ruth Davidson's proposal would

involve in the Budget will set in a

matter of weeks' time, if we were to

take forward her proposal for a tax

cut for the very richest in our

society, of finding £140 million to

take out of our Budget before we do

anything else. I say again to Ruth

Davidson, that is an issue she has

to answer in this debate, form the

part of our government, we put

forward our proposals to protect

public services, our ability to

invest in the economy and make sure

we are doing everything we possibly

can to protect the most vulnerable

in our society. Those are our

priorities and will guide the

development and decisions in our

Budget.

Jackie Baillie?

I welcome

the discussion paper on taxation and

the focus on progressive taxation

but can the First Minister tell the

Chamber how much she needs to raise

to end austerity?

I would encourage

Labour to take part in this

discussion in the spirit we are

opening it. The analysis sets out

very openly how much each of the

proposals of the parties at the

election last year with arrays and

sets out how much would be raised by

the alternative proposals we have

put forward, that is the starting

position we put forward. To Budget,

we have to take into account

different things, mitigate austerity

and as I said before, provide a fair

pay increase for our public sector

workers. So, let's have that

discussion and try to come to a

consensus that is in the best

interests of everybody in our

country. Jackie Baillie? Let me help

the First Minister with an answer,

because

I think you need to know the

scale of the challenge we face. To

end austerity, you need to raise

more than £800 million in revenue

over the next two years. That's

before we consider additional

commitments. Yet the government's

proposal is published today in the

tax paper raises a maximum of £290

million. That doesn't even come

close to closing the gap! There is a

black hole.

There is a black hole in the budget

and more services will end up being

cut. On top of that, after months of

pressure, the First Minister has

missed public sector workers a pay

rise and that is very welcome

indeed. But public sector workers

have not had a pay rise since 2010,

not a proper, decent pay rise. We

need to be clear and we need a

specific answer from the First

Minister. Will Chi keep her promise

and deliver a cost of living, real

terms pay rise to public sector

workers and will it be fully funded

by the Scottish Government?

Labour seems mired in confusion in

this debate. Jackie Baillie puts a

figure of £800 million before us

today. Labour's proposals, at least

the latest proposals because there

had been so many, don't come close

to raising that. So unless Labour is

saying they will pile more pressure

on the lowest income taxpayers, they

have questions to answer. On public

sector pay, I have been very clear

we will set out our public sector

pay policy when we publish our

budget, that is the normal course of

events. I want fair pay increases

for public sector workers, of course

they have to be affordable which is

one reason this debate on tax is so

important. We have set out a range

of possible options, there may be

other options parties want to bring

forward, but let's go into this

discussion in the spirit of trying

to find consensus in the interests

of our society, public services and

economy. That is what I would

encourage all parties to do. At

least those of us on this side of

the chamber, let's not forget that

yes, the impact of Tory austerity

goes further than anything this

Parliament can do to mitigate it,

that is why we should keep up the

pressure on the Conservatives and

Don the Chancellor as we go forward

to his budget to stop austerity at

source and not have it passed onto

the shoulders of the most vulnerable

in our society.

Let me provide the

First Minister with some detail. And

can I refer to page 32 of her own

document? Labour's proposals or

costed at around £700 million in one

year. I talked about £800 million in

two years, I think even she will

agree that there is more than enough

in Labour's proposals to end

austerity, something she has so far

refused to do. Presiding come up

with this Government, promises are

made to be broken. Dutch Presiding

Officer. At promise to cut class

sizes broken, her promise to young

people to abolish student debt

broken, her promise to our elderly

to eradicate delayed discharge in

hospitals broken. Now she also has a

promise that she made the patience

of a legal guarantee the treatment

within 12 weeks, also broken. Now we

have before us a tax plan that

simply does not add up and a list of

commitments she knows she cannot pay

for, so tell me, First Minister, who

are you going to fail next?

First

Minister.

On the basis of that performance, no

wonder Labour are going through

leaders or people at the dispatch

box at the rate that they are! Maybe

one day they will find somebody

capable of asking a decent question!

Let's get back to this. In all

seriousness, Jackie Baillie, James

Kelly is shouting at me, what is the

answer? What was the question?! If

anybody can work that out! They are

doing better than me. Labour have

just demonstrated that it is

incapable of the kind of mature,

serious and honest debate that this

document opens the door to and you

know what? Jackie Baillie, I am not

sure if Jackie Baillie did this

deliberately or if she does not

understand the figures in this

paper. When she was quoting figures

about the labour policy, she

deliberately excluded the behaviour

change element. When she quoted the

figures about the SNP policy, she

included that. So one way or the

other, you have got to be

consistent. So let's get back to the

central point at issue here. We have

opened the door today to a serious,

mature, grown-up discussion about

how we fund public services and our

economy. Let's see if any of the

other parties in this chamber

capable of such maturity!

Would members please be a little

more quiet? Listen to the question

and answer respectfully. I live in

hope! Constituency questions first

from Andy Wightman.

Thank you,

Presiding Officer. The First

Minister will be aware of proposals

by the City of Edinburgh Council to

close the city of end of broken

music school, I declare it personal

interest is my daughter is an

alumni. Was she continue to ensure

the services be provided by the

Scottish government and the City of

Edinburgh does not have discretion

to close the school and will she

considered the financial

arrangements in place to support

national centres of excellence can

be made clear to ensure pupils and

future pupils have clarity and

certainty about the future of these

world-class facilities?

I agree that

these are world-class facilities.

Yes, there is specific funding for

the school although that is now

ruled -- rolled into the total

government settlement. We have

highly value the role of all six

centres of excellence in Scotland

including the city of end wrap music

school. The Scottish government has

been doing with the City of

Edinburgh Council and it is only a

proposal at this stage but I think

the council will want to reflect the

fact the centres of excellence,

including the music school, allow

children and young people across

Scotland the opportunity to receive

expert tuition in their specialist,

in this case music. That is

something very valuable and I think

there is plenty of evidence of that

and I'm sure the importance of that

is something the City of Edinburgh

Council is reflecting on carefully.

Molly is 18 months old, she suffers

from reflux and will not eat solid

food. They a 12 week wait to see a

specialist, her parents were

extremely concerned about the

physical and psychological impact of

this condition. Molly was told by

greater Glasgow and Clyde NHS that

the waiting time had increased to 21

weeks. The development and

well-being of a baby is on the line.

Wilbur First Minister agreed to meet

Molly's parents and urgently look

into this case? -- will the First

Minister agreed?

Absolutely

understand the anxiety of Molly's

parents. This is a situation of huge

concern to them, the well-being and

development of babies is of

paramount importance. I will

urgently look into this case and

make, unveil myself of the detail

and I will ask the Health Secretary

to write to the member and if

necessary engage with the parents of

Molly and I'm sure we all want to

wish them and Molly the very best.

Technical issues and staffing

problems are severely disrupting the

ferry service which is readily off

for weeks on end and is against

suspended this week. The situation

is untenable and unacceptable. The

Transport Minister has promise to

get a grip of the situation but

local patience is wearing extremely

thin. What assurance can the First

Minister provide a solution is in

sight and users of the ferry will

finally get the service they

deserve?

It is hugely important

people who rely on our ferry

services have reliable services to

use, that is the case on this route

as it is with all the routes, we

invest heavily in our ferry

services, there are many new routes

available. Specifically on the

Kilcreggan and issues he is raising,

I will ask the Transport Minister to

reply to the member and if there are

issues, it is vital everything

possible is done to respond.

Can I

also welcome the very interesting

discussion paper on income tax from

the Government today? Last year in

the election, between all the

political parties, three basic ideas

were put forward on tax. One, no

change. With or without tweaking on

the thresholds to benefit only the

wealthy. Or an increase on the basic

rate which would have increased tax

for low earners. And finally, the

Green Party proposition which showed

we can raise revenue for public

services while protecting low

earners and reducing inequalities,

with a fairer range of rates and

bands. Is it not clear now that the

no change option the SNP put forward

is off the table and an increase in

the basic rate is off the table and

the Green option of a fairer range

of rates and bands is the only

serious option left standing?

Ten out of ten for effort in

claiming credit for everything in

the paper! Let me just say, the

SNP's proposal for a manifesto last

year was not no change and that is

borne out in the paper in terms of

revenue forecasts for that. Patrick

Harvie is right to say that we were

not in agreement with proposals to

increase tax for the lowest earners

and I still do not favour proposals

that increased tax for the lowest

earners. But I do recognise the

Programme for Government that given

the pressures we face and our desire

and determination to protect what

really matters to people across

Scotland, we must have an open and

honest discussion about whether

those on the highest incomes pay a

modest amount more to try to enable

us to protect services. So we look

forward to engaging in these

discussions. I hope all parties will

do so constructively. The other

point, and to be fair to Patrick

Harvie, this is a point he has made

previously and I am frequently told

in this chamber we had a minority

administration, if all parties

simply stick to their manifesto

positions, we will not pass a

budget. And this Parliament does not

pass a budget, this Parliament fails

in its duty to the Scottish people,

so we have an opportunity now not to

stick to previous positions but to

come into discussion with the best

interests of the country at heart

and if we do that, we will get a

budget passed and more importantly,

the right budget.

Patrick Harvie. My

first question was not meant as a

criticism. I congratulate the First

Minister foreseeing the sense in

what the Greens have been advocating

for the last couple of years. It is

very clear that the only way the

Scottish Government can pass a

budget this year it is by raising

enough revenue for public priorities

like an impatient increase but to do

it fairly in a way that reduces

inequality. If we do that, plus

they're not be an equally open and

creative discussion about the other

side of the tax picture, the local

tax picture where the SNP has

stalled on local tax reform for far

too long which is overdue and a

project which moderates put back

onto the agenda?

-- and must be put

back. We made reform/ year to local

taxation and those are right now

providing additional revenue to

public services across the country.

I know Patrick Harvie's position on

wider reform the local tax and no

doubt that is a discussion we will

all have in the years to come, but

this Parliament has a job in the

next few weeks and that is to come

to a position on tax and to pass a

budget that protects public services

and investment in our economy. The

document we publish today I think

it's a really good foundation to try

to do that. This is a test not just

of the Government's ability to be

open and honest and realistic and

mature in our approach, it is a test

of every party in this Parliament as

well. Let's see if we can live up to

that test, collectively and the next

few weeks will answer that question.

Supplementary is, the first from

Mary fee.

Papers released this week

from the joint programme board

overseeing the British Transport

Police merger show there is still

work required to assess the cost of

the merger. Does the First Minister

agreed that progressing the merger

of BTB and Police Scotland without

doing a full cost analysis in the

first instance demonstrates a

shocking lack of financial prudence

on the part of the Scottish

Government? And further, what

comments does the First Minister

have on the petition handed in this

week with over 11,500 signatures

against the merger?

No, I don't

agree, the merger of the British

Transport Police, which has now been

devolved to the Scottish Government,

something that Labour supported in

the context of the Smith Commission,

is being taken forward for three

main reasons. To approve, in proof

cap accountability, to make sure the

Transport Police have access to the

wider range of resources Police

Scotland, and to future proof the

governance of the British police

because we know the Conservative UK

manifesto at the last election said

they were going to create a bigger

infrastructure police force and

absorb the British Transport Police

within that so if we do not take

action here, we risk leaving the

British Transport Police isolated

within that governance structure. So

we will take forward these proposals

sensibly and responsibly. The joint

programme board is there precisely

to do the detailed work to make sure

that this is a success and we will

continue of course to work with

those who are employed in the

British Transport Police to make

sure we are taking account of all of

their concerns as we go forward.

50 years ago today, the people of

Hamilton elected Winnie Ewing. 1967

was in many ways the start of modern

Scottish politics in which this

nation are spies to be an outward

looking, gender balanced European

nation.

LAUGHTER

. Does the First Minister agree, the

message should ring out to the

world, Scotland wants to get on?

First Minister.

Of course, it was on

this day in 1967 that Winnie Ewan

Bacharach Game one of the

by-election, that changed the course

of Scottish political history --

Winnie Ewing. She is a champion of

being a woman in a man's world and

in this Parliament she famously

reconvened in 19 99. She is quite

simply a legend in her lifetime, if

you are watching, we send you our

love and we thank you. APPLAUSE

.

Thank you.

Claire Baker?

Thank you, presiding

officer. This week, the UK

Government published the report of

an independent enquiry into deaths

in custody along with their

response. I have previously called

for an enquiry into deaths in

Scotland because I strongly believe

there could be an improvement in the

interests of families and police,

particularly wallowing the death in

police custody in Fife. --

particularly following. Will the

First Minister hold a inquiry and

what is her response to the

published resort? -- report?

We will

consider the Dame's report, the

government and the Crown Office will

do that as well. It is important to

remind members that custody

arrangements in Scotland are

distinct from those in England and

Wales, under the fatal accident and

deaths Scotland act, and inquiry

must be held into any death in

police custody unless the law

advocate is satisfied the

circumstances have clearly been

established in other proceedings. We

recognise improvements are to be

made so we will study this report

carefully and determine whether

there are any actions, this is for

the Crown Office, they decide if any

action is required to take. While

understanding the concerned members

have in the circumstances

surrounding the recent death in

Fife, the member will appreciate I

am not able to comment on that more

right now because that is still

under consideration by the Crown

Office, but these are important

issues the government will continue

to pay serious attention to.

I would

also ask the First Minister in light

of reports by the MacMillan Cancer

Support attempted to combat fake

news regarding health conditions,

what action the Scottish Government

is taking to ensure people are not

misled by fake information online?

This is an important question, I

think Mac Millan's appointment of a

digital nurses welcome and will be a

good resource for patients.

Accessible and accurate medical

information is vital which is why

NHS 24 produces the website NHS

informed. Scott it follows strict

instructions, in partnership with a

range of organisations including

MacMillan Cancer Support, to verify

the accuracy and quality of content

and I would urge anybody who wants

to go online to look into any

medical condition to use NHS

informed because they can be ensured

they can get reliable and accurate

information there -- NHS Inform.

Some of the information on the

website, such as guidance to finding

the right local services can be

useful to many in Scotland. Can the

First Minister outlined what steps

have been taken to promote the

website for use in Scotland?

NHS

Inform does provide a range of

information not on procedures but on

healthy living, illnesses and

conditions and on health rights. In

April of this year, NHS 24 launched

a publicity campaign including

social media activity and

advertisements on buses and trains

that are significantly raised public

awareness of NHS Inform. The number

of visits to it have almost

quadrupled since the launch of the

campaign, from 116,000 visits in

April 2017 to 460,000 in September.

The NHS will continue to take steps

to make people aware of that and as

MS peas, we should all make sure our

constituents are aware of it, too.

-- MSPs.

Bands are rightly concerned

about cancer waiting times, pointing

to the fact that NHS Lanarkshire are

the only area achieving their

targets -- MacMillan Cancer Support

are also concerned. Not only did

they publish details of their delays

but the reasons for it and the steps

they are taking to mitigate. Does

the First Minister agree it is now

time to roll this practice out

across all our health boards to

reduce cancer waiting times in the

same way Lanarkshire has done?

Of

course, the Health Secretary is

already during a grip group to look

at what can be done, one of the

objectives is to look at NHS

Lanarkshire which is to look at what

has been done to see how it can be

better rolled out across the rest of

the country. I will ask the member

to keep up-to-date as the work

progresses.

To ask the First

Minister what criteria will be used

to assess the outcomes of pupil

equity funding.

We are currently

consulting on the criteria to

measure progress towards a closing

the attainment gap, and we will

continue in the national improvement

plan published in September. We

expect authorities to make use of

the data they have in and

incorporates details of equity

funding in the existing processes,

including annual school improvement

plans and standard and quality

reports. School inspection and other

review process will also be used

when necessary to ensure schools are

using their funding appropriately.

This Smith.

The First Minister will

be aware of recent reports which

indicates the pupil equity fund is

being used in some councils to plug

gaps in other areas of the local

education Budget, for example on

janitor overtime -- Liz Smith. Does

the First Minister agree some of

these do not have the focus on

literacy and numerous sea in the way

the government has stated and to

restore this focus, will she agree

to reverse the Scottish decision to

remove Scotland from a

well-respected international

measurements on literacy and new

Morrissey?

Given the discussion we

often have on the PISA results,

there is scrutiny on other Scottish

education system. Part of improving

the National education framework is

to make sure we have more rigorous

and detailed information here in got

them on the performance of our

schools and education system. On the

issue of funding, it is there to

provide additional parts in schools

to close the attainment gap. We plan

to use this money to assess the

janitor 's payment issue, that is

plainly wrong. That is not using

PITH money. It is for headteachers

to determine how they think it best

to use that money, but it should be

used for new services in line with

the criteria for PFF and closing the

attainment gap. The work I spoke in

my initial answer will help us to

monitor that as the pupil equity

fund scheme continues.

Pupil equity

fund is indeed a good thing but it

must indeed be additional. It is

common sense there will be pressure

to plug gaps in court funding as

long as school budgets are being cut

year on year alongside PIFF being

made available. Can the equity funds

do the job it is indeed being

designed to do? Some quick points,

I'm glad to hear

Iain Gray thinks it

is such a good thing and they want

to explain why he voted against it

in the Budget. Well, you did! Order,

please. Amazing how Labour really

don't like having some basic facts

pointed out to them. They get very

uncomfortable. Back to the serious

issue at hand. Secondly, the

spending power of local councils, it

increased in this financial year.

How we continue to protect local

services is part of the discussion

around tax. Local councils also had

the opportunity to increase council

tax and strangely the own milk back

-- the only councils that did not

increase it to work Labour councils.

Their own councils will not exercise

the power they have two increase

funding available.

Question number

six.

To ask the First Minister what

action the Scottish Government plans

to take to help families faced with

financial hardship, should interest

rates rise.

In November 2014, we

launched Scotland's financial health

service, a one-stop web-based

service providing impartial

information for anyone with a

concern about debt, borrowing,

managing money or general financial

concerns. It can point anyone to be

most appropriate area of support. In

addition, we have committed to

establishing a financial health tech

guaranteeing people finding ways to

maximise their income and finding

the best utility and financial

products and families in need

through the Scottish welfare fund.

Pauline McNeill.

Ten years of

stagnation, low wages and the rising

cost of living mean more households

could be tipped over the edge into

is various financial difficulty.

Should there even be a small rise in

interest rates later on today? I

wonder if the First Minister shares

my concern. There are one third of

Scots worried about the money that

they owe, and there are many turning

to credit or the essential things.

That includes things like their gas

and electricity and basic things.

Indeed, the OBE are, this is a

serious point, says that household

debt in four years' time could be as

high as 47% -- the OBR. I realise it

is difficult to respond to the

magnitude of that question, but I

wonder in view of the First

Minister's answer and the importance

of affordable credit, is it time for

the government to invest more

seriously in affordable credit and

to promote credit unions more

seriously because they have a

crucial role to play in increasing

financial inclusion? One area I

think is worth looking at...

A

question, please.

I'm surprised at

the reaction to the question now.

Ask a question, please.

As the First

Minister, if she would look at the

non-for-profit lending such as in

Fife, because of the serious role

that credit unions and schemes like

this can play, for let's not forget

the many Scots...

A question,

please.

Would she prepared to take a

personal interest in taking this

forward? Thank you.

First Minister.

Firstly, on the point of consensus

because there is a big area of

consensus, I am a massive supporter

of the credit union movement. This

government has supported the

movement and will continue to do so

and look at what more we can do for

that. I understand the Bank of

England has announced the first rise

in interest rates since July 2007,

and I know that will be of concern

to families across the country. We

will continue to look at how we

support those on the lowest incomes.

Going back to one of the central

issues we have been discussing at

First Minister's Questions today,

this is genuinely one of the points

of disagreement between those of us

on these benches and Labour's

approach to income tax, we don't

think we should increase it on the

lowest income families for many of

the reasons Pauline McNeill has

talked about. These issues have to

be at the heart of all the decisions

we take and will have to continue to

be so from this government.

George

Adam.

I would ask the First Minister

how many households have received a

port from the Scottish welfare fund?

Since the creation of the Scottish

welfare fund in April 2013, over

265,000 households in Scotland have

received grants totalling £140

million, one third of those

households families with children.

It's not acceptable this type of

support covering the basic cost of

living is needed by so many people

but we know the impact of the UK

Government's harsh welfare cuts its

having and we are repeatedly warned

of the chaotic roll out of Universal

Credit, particularly the delay for

payment. We will continue to do all

we can to support those families and

remain committed to a welfare system

Is the First Minister aware that

report this week warned disabled

people and their families are being

left hungry, cold and closed less by

Tory cuts with some driven the

thoughts of suicide? Given that

30,000 people in Scotland could lose

out once the Government's Pip

Broward is complete, it does the

First Minister see demand for

welfare growing further as the Tory

obsession with austerity continues?

Yes, I do. I was very concerned like

many will have been about the

findings of the report which

highlighted that 44% of disabled

people could see the disability

benefits reduced or completely

removed and that is just an example

of the continued onslaught of

welfare cuts from the Tory

government hitting the most

vulnerable in society. Putting

immense financial and at times

emotional pressure on them. When

there is still a lot of months left,

people need to have somewhere to

turn and I wish it was not necessary

but I'm glad we do provide a safety

net through the Scottish Welfare

Fund. People need more, they need

the UK Government to pay attention

to the catalogue of evidence of

damage they are causing to the most

vulnerable and to act now to reverse

these cuts.

That concludes First

Minister's Questions.

You heard a question from Pauline

McNeill about the possible impact of

any increase in interest rates and

to bring yourselves up to date,

there has been an increase in

interest rates by a quarter of 1%.

The impact of that is to be digested

across the economy more widely as

will be impact of the tax plans put

forward by the Scottish Government.

I'm joined now by journalists

Elisabeth O'Leary from Reuters

and from the Telegraph Simon

Johnson.

The interest rate rise first, it has

been nearly a decade since the

interest rates have been frozen and

it is a tiny increase but a big

symbol.

It is symbolically important

and also important for millions of

mortgage holders across the country.

They will find bills going up

potentially by hundreds of pounds

depending on their mortgages. A lot

of growth in the UK economy is

propped up I consumer spending so

that money is taken out of their

pockets and they might find they are

not spending as much and there might

be a large impact on the entire UK

economy. It feeds into the tax

rates, the problem, the paper that

Nicola Sturgeon published this

morning, because she is trying to

sell tax increases to the country at

a time when household finances of

Fame sink squeezes from different

directions and this is another big

one.

-- finances are facing. Savers

may benefit but the point was made

by Ruth Davidson, a point of

challenge in the economy and perhaps

the tax increases are not the road

to go down.

The increased rate

itself was controversial. And the

concern is that economic growth is

slower in Scotland, so Scottish

taxes are going to be lower. So if

you put that extra burden on the

economy, you are doing nothing tell

Scotland.

Let's talk about the

detail in the paper. The document

examines the opposition and boils

down in options. The first is adding

a penny to the additional rates and

it is extra bands. Four rather than

three or even five or even six.

It

gets increasingly complicated. As

the First Minister said in a

chamber, you are making it more

sensitive to income. So it is a

trade-off. It is more, located and

the crossover point to pay more

money is relatively low, about

£25,000 according to the figures in

the back of the report, £31,000 when

you take into account the Personal

Allowance. This is police officers,

teachers, social workers, not a --

not people who earn a lot of money

but you have to pay more.

At the

news conference which you attended,

she said she was accused of being

cautious on tax and she pleaded

guilty to that because she said she

had to be cautious, it was not a

toy, it has an impact on the

economy, so she was aware of the

potential impact on the economy and

she would argue it is necessary to

raise income tax at this time.

It is

interesting they are publishing this

document. It is opening it up to

public debate, an area they had been

hinting at for quite a long time,

they are under a lot of pressure.

And opposition parties as well.

Exactly, and it is to test the

waters in a way to see what support

there is among the Scottish public

for the needed extra money for

public services. How popular are

these public services and people

prepared to pay the price to

continue with free health, free

prescriptions and also increase

public sector pay?

The shape of a

possible deal, Nicola Sturgeon said

again there could be no budget

because they are minorities, which

you saw they will not deal with the

Tories on tax. Labour and the

Liberal Democrats David an increase

in the standard rate and Patrick

Harvie of the Greens seemed awfully

pleased!

To a degree, anyway.

Suggesting tax increases at the last

election. It was interesting she

chose to put the stuff out on

Thursday morning before First

Minister's Questions, to make life

easy for yourself, you would do it

afterwards, so she wants to get on

the front but to set the political

agenda. We saw a political problem

she's going to base today, the

Labour Party on one hand have said,

look at the promises you have made

on public sector pay, extra spending

for the NHS, the money you are

raising for this is nowhere near

what you say you need. Jackie

Baillie behind you make that very

point. They are right on that. From

the Tories perspective, ordinary

taxpayers saying, why do we pay

more? I think it is going to be on

sale because she's asking households

to pay more not for an improved

service, but to keep what they have.

That is going to be more difficult.

Lisbeth, you have a political

dichotomy on left and right a

philosophical dichotomy about the

nature of taxation. Ruth Davidson

said the economy requires to be

stimulated by low tax, because

Sturgeon arguing you can stimulate

the economy if it is productive

taxation producing investments that

potentially benefit the economy.

Interesting dilemma. Yes, I think

the point really is that they do

need a better consensus. They could

possibly work towards a better

consensus because these are real

dilemmas and people understand them

in the context of Brexit. The reason

interest rates have just risen is

because we have an inflation problem

induced by Brexit. And while we want

to get away, the Scottish and wants

to get away from the idea Brexit is

dominating everything, let's not

talk about that because it does not

do was any favours, they want to put

this debate into the public domain

and convince people this is a debate

that needs to be had and people need

to get involved in it.

Wait to see

this going in terms of the politics

of this place, does look like an SNP

and Green Deal? One stumbling block

could be the money they are raising

under Nicola Sturgeon's modest

proposals, I can't help thinking of

Jonathan Smith, put -- Jonathan

Swift, but never mind! But the money

is rather less than the Greens were

talking about raising.

Yes, I can

see the SNP moving in that favour

towards the Green plans as part of a

deal with the Greens. Politically,

the Tories absolutely, no deal.

Labour, about to elect a new leader

who could be very left-wing and they

will argue they are the real deal

left. It is not benefit them to do a

deal either. I think probably

another deal with the Greens, with

perhaps Nicola Sturgeon moving

further in their direction.

And one

price of that could be to dock the

plan to cut aviation tax because the

Greens are so against it.

They have

already made a step in that

direction so that is not a major

block.

Hold on for a couple of

seconds, you mentioned Brexit and

the Scottish Secretary was giving

evidence to a Holyrood committee

today on the subject of Brexit and

he said it was definitely not the

position of the UK Government that

they anticipated no deal over

Brexit, but they had to prepare for

every opportunity. He is a member of

the UK Cabinet from which the

Defence Secretary Michael Fallon has

just resigned, the replacement

announced today, so we took a chance

after the meeting to ask what he

made those developments.

Resignation

is a personal issue. Michael Beasley

felt it was the right thing to do.

He will be a lost because he was a

real champion of Scotland. We have a

new Defence Secretary in Gavin

Williamson, I have every confidence

in him, is a very experienced

politician and business person and I

am sure he will carry out that job

well. It is for other individuals to

determine whether they carry on or

whether they step back. These are

personal decisions, personal

matters. And so it will just depend

on the decisions they take and the

circumstances as they see them.

David Mandel a short time ago at

Holyrood after giving evidence.

Sympathy for Michael Fallon but

intriguing remark, it is up to

others to take the personal

decision, I suppose he is reflecting

on what the Prime Minister said that

people must look at their conduct

and decide what to do.

This is

interesting, it is Michael Fallon's

resignation the start as Ruth

Davidson put of the dam opening and

a clear out of sexist dinosaurs from

the Government? We will see Minister

after Minister falling over the next

week's and months, or is this more

of an isolated incident, something

that could be absorbed and the

Government can carry on? That is

what we are all waiting to see over

the next 48 hours.

Waiting to see

whether there is more, Elisabeth?

It

is certainly a possibility and this

could not come at a worse time for

Theresa May and there have been a

lot of commentators since Gavin

Williamson was named talking about

if you have the person who is in

charge of getting your party in

line. The Chief Whip. It diminishes

her parity and it shows how weak she

is. This is a terrible moment for

this to happen.

And it had to be

Michael Fallon, the one that has

backed her and is not apparently

pursuing a personal agenda and who

has backed her, one of the few in

the Cabinet who supports the Prime

Minister.

It is dreadful for her on

a personal level. And we will see

what impact it has. More infighting?

Who knows?

In terms of Holyrood,

Nicola Sturgeon expressing a wish it

is up to individuals and the

Presiding Officer stressing there

are no complaints currently. But the

point being made this could be a

turning point in political

environment is generally.

Well, to

be fair to Holyrood, what we have

not seen here that we have seen

Westminster, we have not seen

specific allegations against

individuals. To back up the

accusation that there is basically a

climate of sexism, there have been

dozens of accusations and we have

had a resignation of one of the top

Cabinet ministers and we can see

there is a problem. There have

obviously been accusations there is

the same culture here but what we

have not seen yet the specific

allegations and accusations against

people. There are investigations

under way, but the temperature here

may sort of lower unless there are

specific allegations coming forward

in the next few days.

We just don't

know. Thank you both very much

indeed for joining me. We were able

to bring you information about the

discussion over the nature of the

political environment and the News

on air an increase interest rates

which is a huge development, a small

increase but a huge development, and

we will bring you more throughout

the day everywhere on the subject of

taxation. Bromley Brian Taylor, from

the Scottish polymers, Holyrood,

goodbye.