Browse content similar to 21/09/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Hello, and welcome to Politics Scotland. | :00:16. | :00:17. | |
Coming up on the programme this afternoon: | :00:18. | :00:21. | |
The Scottish Labour Party get more powers to run their own affairs. | :00:22. | :00:25. | |
And the Conservative lead a debate on NHS Scotlands staffing crisis. | :00:26. | :00:32. | |
The ballot has now closed in the UK Labour leadership contest. We will | :00:33. | :00:36. | |
be assessing what lies ahead. The Scottish Labour Party is to have | :00:37. | :00:41. | |
more decision-making power. under plans agreed by the UK party's | :00:42. | :00:46. | |
ruling National Executive Committee. The NEC has approved devolving | :00:47. | :00:49. | |
control over policy, constituency parties and Westminster | :00:50. | :00:51. | |
candidate selection. Our Political Editor Brian Taylor | :00:52. | :00:52. | |
has been following the story. Why are these changes important | :00:53. | :00:55. | |
for Labour supporters? They have been moving steadily, | :00:56. | :01:07. | |
inching towards autonomy for some time. This goes back four or five | :01:08. | :01:12. | |
years in terms of the particular story, October 2015, Kezia Dugdale | :01:13. | :01:17. | |
and Jeremy Corbyn agreed autonomy for the party. And autonomy over | :01:18. | :01:25. | |
Westminster selection policy. The detail for that has been consulted | :01:26. | :01:32. | |
on. It it has been put forward. It goes to the Liverpool conference, | :01:33. | :01:35. | |
and I suspect this will go through there. Kazuo Dugdale says this is | :01:36. | :01:42. | |
the lighting. One of her many as Joanne Lamb said it was treated like | :01:43. | :01:48. | |
a branch office. Labour needs to dispel that. They say that is done | :01:49. | :01:55. | |
here. It gives them a degree of autonomy and Kezia Dugdale as | :01:56. | :02:03. | |
autonomy. They have party autonomy. They have a Scottish Labour Party | :02:04. | :02:11. | |
focus on everything. I asked her what happened with Trident. What if | :02:12. | :02:15. | |
he's got his Labour Party want to do is grab party, and the English | :02:16. | :02:21. | |
Labour Party doesn't? What happens? She said it would go to a | :02:22. | :02:29. | |
consolidation free process. There is only one -- consolidation process. | :02:30. | :02:34. | |
There would be agreement after that. The Scottish Labour Party is in the | :02:35. | :02:39. | |
room arguing the case. I fitted to her that perhaps is not necessarily | :02:40. | :02:45. | |
enough. The difference here is that we will have very different policy | :02:46. | :02:50. | |
decisions. We will see that when under my leadership we had debates | :02:51. | :02:56. | |
and votes in devolved areas. In order to stand up in Scotland, we | :02:57. | :03:00. | |
need to have those conversations. If a Scottish party says no to Trident, | :03:01. | :03:04. | |
they might not get their way when it comes to the UK manifesto. If it is | :03:05. | :03:08. | |
the case that we're talking about a UK wide manifesto. All corners of | :03:09. | :03:15. | |
our Labour Party family will argue it all out and got all the eyes and | :03:16. | :03:20. | |
cross all the Tees. For the first time, we will be able to put forward | :03:21. | :03:26. | |
all our own policies in Scotland. Best of luck with that one will be a | :03:27. | :03:31. | |
lot of people's feeling. Though be a lot of cynics including double | :03:32. | :03:37. | |
inside the Labour Party in Scotland. They try to become more like the | :03:38. | :03:40. | |
SNP. They've been trying for years and have got no where. There is | :03:41. | :03:48. | |
intrinsic cause with the Labour Party about going too much down the | :03:49. | :03:52. | |
Caledonian route cause they fear they lose the UK connections. In | :03:53. | :03:59. | |
longer term perspective, perhaps the international perspective that was | :04:00. | :04:01. | |
the underpinning of so much of the socialist approach in it's earlier | :04:02. | :04:08. | |
lit years. Facts are facts. The SNP are doing awfully well in opinion | :04:09. | :04:13. | |
polls. One of the reasons for that is that they stand up for Scotland. | :04:14. | :04:18. | |
What has happened is that when people are focusing on Scottish | :04:19. | :04:23. | |
issues, they see the party that stands up without Challenger without | :04:24. | :04:25. | |
looking over their shoulder for Scotland. The other party is the | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
same. The Conservatives have gone for autonomy. The Liberal Democrats | :04:33. | :04:35. | |
have always been autonomy. The Labour Party are playing catch up. | :04:36. | :04:41. | |
They've always been behind. They are stressing autonomy. As is only | :04:42. | :04:45. | |
policy question, it can only go so far. They are remaining part of what | :04:46. | :04:50. | |
Kezia Dugdale trying the Lee Mack charmingly called the Labour Party | :04:51. | :04:54. | |
family. They are remaining part of that. She wakes up in the morning | :04:55. | :04:59. | |
wanting to work for a UK Labour Government. Not purely on a Scottish | :05:00. | :05:00. | |
context. Health is the theme of the debate | :05:01. | :05:06. | |
in parliament today which is rather fitting | :05:07. | :05:08. | |
as the Scottish Health Survey was published yesterday with rather | :05:09. | :05:10. | |
glum news about our waistlines. But before we discuss | :05:11. | :05:13. | |
that, A Health boards across Scotland will get an extra | :05:14. | :05:15. | |
?9 million for their People hurt themelves on ice, | :05:16. | :05:17. | |
fall victim to flu, respiratory disease flares up, and they end up | :05:18. | :05:35. | |
in hospital A departments. It's a dangerous time | :05:36. | :05:38. | |
for politicians too. And we saw the criticism | :05:39. | :05:41. | |
the Scottish Government came in for last winter when the NHS | :05:42. | :05:44. | |
failed to meet the commitment that transferred or discharged | :05:45. | :05:48. | |
from A within four hours. Today, ministers have | :05:49. | :05:55. | |
announced an additional ?9 million to, as their | :05:56. | :05:56. | |
Press release puts it, boost A resilience | :05:57. | :05:59. | |
ahead of winter. The answer's very complex, | :06:00. | :06:15. | |
and must be seen in the context of the overall NHS budget | :06:16. | :06:31. | |
in Scotland of around The figure announced last March | :06:32. | :06:33. | |
was specifically for A care. The new cash is aimed at helping A | :06:34. | :06:41. | |
departments certainly, but also the wider NHS and social | :06:42. | :06:44. | |
care sectors which are affected For instance if you look | :06:45. | :06:47. | |
at the condition Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary | :06:48. | :06:50. | |
Disorder, COPD, which is serious breathing difficulty, | :06:51. | :06:52. | |
and which is worsened in the winter, many patients could be | :06:53. | :06:54. | |
treated in their own home. This new cash could be used | :06:55. | :06:57. | |
by health boards to improve support for patients at GP surgeries | :06:58. | :07:00. | |
and with home visits NHS Lothian, which has been running | :07:01. | :07:03. | |
a programme to do just this, could be treated in this way, | :07:04. | :07:09. | |
reducing the need for A visits So this cash is aimed | :07:10. | :07:18. | |
at prevention, preventing people from needing A treatment, | :07:19. | :07:25. | |
rather than curing the problem This might be helping | :07:26. | :07:28. | |
the pressure on hospital emergency departments, | :07:29. | :07:39. | |
but the primary care sector Well, the Royal College of General | :07:40. | :07:41. | |
Practitioners has been looking at an NHS workforce survey carried out | :07:42. | :07:53. | |
in June. It revealed a loss of 90 GPs | :07:54. | :07:55. | |
in Scotland over the past two years. That's almost one a week | :07:56. | :07:58. | |
leaving the service, which the college reckons means a | :07:59. | :08:00. | |
further 12 have gone since June. Well, Holyrood's Health and Sport | :08:01. | :08:03. | |
committee will be looking at this next week in some depth, | :08:04. | :08:07. | |
having already discussed it The GP College has begun a fightback | :08:08. | :08:11. | |
though, with a new YouTube campaign aimed at persuading medical | :08:12. | :08:19. | |
students, and even schoolchildren sitting Highers that general | :08:20. | :08:23. | |
practice is the profession Even if it means dealing with more | :08:24. | :08:28. | |
people over the winter months. Joining me now is The Courier's | :08:29. | :08:36. | |
political editor, Kieran Andrews. First Labour, are they going to get | :08:37. | :08:52. | |
anything here? They are forever going to say they are going to be | :08:53. | :08:55. | |
more Scottish. I don't think it is going to be voter's number one | :08:56. | :09:00. | |
priority on the doorstep. They will ask what about my school and local | :09:01. | :09:05. | |
hospital? Not how autonomous are your party. It is a funny thing to | :09:06. | :09:09. | |
focus on to some degree. On the other hand, the Brian Travers | :09:10. | :09:19. | |
interview was extremely damaging for Labour's perception. Now with big | :09:20. | :09:30. | |
things between Kezia Dugdale and Jeremy Corbyn, it is Kezia Dugdale | :09:31. | :09:38. | |
trying to establish distance. Put some clear blue water between her | :09:39. | :09:45. | |
and Jeremy Corbyn. That is fine. But when trying to explain the process | :09:46. | :09:57. | |
on, let's say Trident, if Labour work pro-Trident and Kezia Dugdale's | :09:58. | :10:10. | |
party were not. If there is one manifesto, that is what they are | :10:11. | :10:13. | |
going to be saying. Everyone will know the Scottish Labour Party | :10:14. | :10:19. | |
doesn't agree with the UK Labour Party. The UK Labour Party has the | :10:20. | :10:23. | |
power to completely undermine the Scottish Labour Party. Not only in | :10:24. | :10:30. | |
policy, but it also holds the purse. It cannot completely break is | :10:31. | :10:35. | |
because the Scottish Labour Party needs money. As far as I control, UK | :10:36. | :10:46. | |
Labour controls the staffing. It feeds into the clash between Kezia | :10:47. | :10:59. | |
Dugdale's narrative and how she that how it feeds into policy. | :11:00. | :11:05. | |
Conservatives... Now, the Conservatives | :11:06. | :11:07. | |
are leading the debate today They say they have no confidence | :11:08. | :11:09. | |
in the Scottish Government's workforce planning for the NHS | :11:10. | :11:12. | |
despite warnings from patient The Conservative Health spokesperson | :11:13. | :11:15. | |
Donald Cameron is on his feet now. I'm delighted to open the debate on | :11:16. | :11:24. | |
health. I would like to begin with a tribute to the incredible work that | :11:25. | :11:28. | |
dedicated staff within our NHS and social care sector carry out on a | :11:29. | :11:33. | |
daily basis. It can be difficult work with long hours, often in | :11:34. | :11:37. | |
challenging circumstances. The efforts of staff frequently go | :11:38. | :11:40. | |
unnoticed and yet professionals in the NHS and care sectors are still | :11:41. | :11:44. | |
among one of the most dedicated public care servants at of all. They | :11:45. | :11:51. | |
need our help to make and do what they do best. Caring for patients, | :11:52. | :11:56. | |
treating illness and saving lives. That work is under threat. It has | :11:57. | :12:02. | |
become clear that the NHS workforce is overstretched and struggling to | :12:03. | :12:06. | |
meet ever increasing demands on front line services. In the last few | :12:07. | :12:11. | |
months, I have worked with patients, professional associations, medical | :12:12. | :12:17. | |
staff and individuals. They message is clear. Staffing levels across the | :12:18. | :12:23. | |
NHS are in crisis. It is a deep, systemic issue that cuts across the | :12:24. | :12:26. | |
whole workforce. It is not just happening in one branch of the | :12:27. | :12:30. | |
medical profession, it is in many. It is not just in the NHS, but in | :12:31. | :12:35. | |
the social care workforce, too. It is not just integral Scotland, it is | :12:36. | :12:40. | |
happening right here in Edinburgh and in other oral sectors. And we | :12:41. | :12:43. | |
know that this problem will get much worse. We have an ageing workforce. | :12:44. | :12:52. | |
Many of whom will soon retire. We will see that midwives are saying | :12:53. | :12:58. | |
there is a retiring time bomb with one in five due to retire over the | :12:59. | :13:03. | |
next decade. The Scottish Government's and figures say that | :13:04. | :13:07. | |
one in three GP's will retire in the next ten years. That brings further | :13:08. | :13:14. | |
pressure to battle the increasing demand. It is an increasing circle. | :13:15. | :13:21. | |
It listen to the professionals. Since they can post is say... Other | :13:22. | :13:30. | |
doctors with the team have to cover the workload or the service may be | :13:31. | :13:35. | |
reduced. Staff are asked to work increasingly long hours and more | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
intensely to fill the gaps. In the last session, I am aware that | :13:40. | :13:42. | |
efforts were made in this Parliament on a cross party basis to try and | :13:43. | :13:50. | |
avert this rises on a manner. But the SNP Government sat on it's | :13:51. | :13:54. | |
hands. So, in many ways this debate is a lament for this lost | :13:55. | :13:59. | |
opportunity. We are now reaping the whirlwind because the crisis is upon | :14:00. | :14:04. | |
us. I have no hesitation in condemning the sheer lethargy of the | :14:05. | :14:07. | |
Scottish Government which has brought us to this point. Often in | :14:08. | :14:12. | |
politics, some of the most robust arguments we have are about start, | :14:13. | :14:17. | |
vigorous policy choices taken by a Government for better or worse. Not | :14:18. | :14:22. | |
here. Despite the repeated warnings, there is no sign of vigour. Instead, | :14:23. | :14:27. | |
we have in Nash and listlessness. We have a Government sleepwalking | :14:28. | :14:33. | |
through this rises. What answers do this bring? To standard responses. | :14:34. | :14:38. | |
Patient satisfaction is at an all-time high and that NHS staffing | :14:39. | :14:42. | |
is at record levels. We are presented with a wall of numbers and | :14:43. | :14:47. | |
a barrage of statistics as if that provides all the answers. Let me | :14:48. | :14:52. | |
save them sometime this afternoon. Patient satisfaction, patients are | :14:53. | :14:56. | |
of course the most important people in our health service. Their care is | :14:57. | :15:00. | |
paramount and it is our job to ensure they have access to | :15:01. | :15:04. | |
world-class health care, based on need. One benchmark we can measure | :15:05. | :15:12. | |
the NHS on is patient satisfaction. However, what is very important is | :15:13. | :15:18. | |
that we have numbers of highly trained staff to surround that | :15:19. | :15:21. | |
patient and provide the care. Patient well-being is intrinsically | :15:22. | :15:27. | |
linked with that. Patient satisfaction today, the NHS is | :15:28. | :15:35. | |
chronically understaffed and morale levels plummet. That will disappear | :15:36. | :15:38. | |
overnight. The Scottish Government and the First Minister like to | :15:39. | :15:44. | |
tellers that it sits at record levels and the NHS has never | :15:45. | :15:49. | |
employed as many people. But record numbers of staff does not mean that | :15:50. | :15:53. | |
there are enough staff. Again, listen to the professionals. Listen | :15:54. | :15:56. | |
to the Royal College of nurses who say as follows. The increase of | :15:57. | :16:00. | |
staff is not keeping pace with demand. Even more worrying, almost | :16:01. | :16:07. | |
600 posts have been vacant for three months or more. Listen to the Royal | :16:08. | :16:10. | |
College of radiologists, they say this. The mismatch between growth | :16:11. | :16:17. | |
and workforce between growth and demand. It grew 3% between 2010 and | :16:18. | :16:28. | |
2015. An MRI scans increased by 15%. That is not forget the key role that | :16:29. | :16:34. | |
radiologists play in health care. It is very simple clear picture. Demand | :16:35. | :16:41. | |
is outstripping staff numbers. So, merely parroting the number that | :16:42. | :16:48. | |
there are record numbers of NHS staff. It does not help. There are | :16:49. | :16:53. | |
record numbers of people getting old and Scotland. There are record | :16:54. | :16:56. | |
numbers of demands being placed on the NHS. It is quite simply selling | :16:57. | :17:08. | |
a fantasy that the NHS is coping under SNP leadership. Like the band | :17:09. | :17:11. | |
on the Titanic, they are trying to tell all well when it is not. | :17:12. | :17:16. | |
MSPs have been hearing from GPs and other health professionals | :17:17. | :17:18. | |
about how Scotland's primary care services could be improved, | :17:19. | :17:20. | |
against a backdrop of staff shortages and recruitment problems | :17:21. | :17:22. | |
One of the key themes that dominated, was how | :17:23. | :17:26. | |
a multi-disciplinary team approach to replacing doctors | :17:27. | :17:27. | |
as the first point of contact for patients, would work. | :17:28. | :17:33. | |
It has been mentioned a couple of times that the driver for the | :17:34. | :17:40. | |
current emphasis for the current model of the GP crisis. I figure was | :17:41. | :17:46. | |
actually to reason that made the point that there are other workforce | :17:47. | :17:52. | |
difficulties. What extent do you think the other primary care | :17:53. | :17:56. | |
professionals are repaired for the proposed changes that are likely to | :17:57. | :18:00. | |
come forward? And from a capacity point of view, how readily can the | :18:01. | :18:04. | |
other health professionals pick up the work from GPs? I'm thinking that | :18:05. | :18:10. | |
one example is the proposal to recruit 140 pharmacists for example. | :18:11. | :18:13. | |
Where are these pharmacists going to come from? I think workforce | :18:14. | :18:16. | |
planning across the teams is not good enough at the moment. We | :18:17. | :18:21. | |
wouldn't have a clue about the projected number of pharmacists or | :18:22. | :18:25. | |
physios or OT's or nurses within the primary care team. We tend to still | :18:26. | :18:29. | |
focus on the real data that they have got. It is likely how many GP's | :18:30. | :18:35. | |
they have got. That is what we talk about when we talk about primary | :18:36. | :18:38. | |
care. We have got to get a better base level. We've got to understand | :18:39. | :18:44. | |
how workforce planning has to look at those disciplines. Several times, | :18:45. | :18:49. | |
people have mentioned that there is a shortage of the professions. | :18:50. | :18:58. | |
Various professions. We have 1000 approximate GP practices and funding | :18:59. | :19:04. | |
for additional 140 pharmacists. And we are supposed to be rolling out | :19:05. | :19:09. | |
this model potentially. How on earth, if we can't staff what we | :19:10. | :19:15. | |
have now, only going to roll this out? Or is this going to develop? | :19:16. | :19:19. | |
Can you see this realistically happening without a huge injection | :19:20. | :19:24. | |
of cash from somewhere? The direction of travel is the wrong | :19:25. | :19:28. | |
direction. The number of GPs are reducing. Effectively, we are facing | :19:29. | :19:36. | |
a huge retirement bulge which we have been highlighting now for as | :19:37. | :19:40. | |
long as ten years. But that was coming. There are a number of | :19:41. | :19:45. | |
challenges of recruiting into general practices for GPs. As Sian | :19:46. | :19:54. | |
alluded to earlier, we just tried to encourage and promote what an | :19:55. | :19:57. | |
attractive career option it is for doctors to come into general | :19:58. | :20:02. | |
practice. But there are some fundamental challenges with | :20:03. | :20:04. | |
recruiting through the system. We recognise that there are only | :20:05. | :20:12. | |
approximately half of our medical students are Scotland's domicile. | :20:13. | :20:16. | |
And therefore we have a big challenge with retaining the number | :20:17. | :20:21. | |
of medical students that are being trained in Scotland. And it is | :20:22. | :20:27. | |
really going to be important to increase the general practice and | :20:28. | :20:29. | |
exposure within the undergraduate training to encourage direction into | :20:30. | :20:36. | |
our specialty. We have had 100 new places for training places. That | :20:37. | :20:43. | |
have been created and have now been advertised and are in the process of | :20:44. | :20:50. | |
appointment. But unfortunately, we are not going to be able to fill | :20:51. | :20:53. | |
these places or anything like it. In fact, we have still got a number of | :20:54. | :20:58. | |
unfilled places for GP training from the previous recruitment round. So, | :20:59. | :21:05. | |
we are not attracting potential GPs at this point in time. It is our | :21:06. | :21:11. | |
role as a college to remark that at every stage in our career low | :21:12. | :21:18. | |
process. It is at the real challenge and concern. To see how we can | :21:19. | :21:27. | |
sustain models with in and out, without a shift of resources into | :21:28. | :21:28. | |
primary care. -- career low process. Now let's speak to some | :21:29. | :21:33. | |
MSPs at Holyrood. For the SNP we have Clare Haughey, | :21:34. | :21:35. | |
for the Conservatives From Labour, Jackie Baillie joins | :21:36. | :21:37. | |
us, and Alex Cole-Hamilton joins us We just heard Donald Cameron from | :21:38. | :21:50. | |
the Conservatives saying that every time they ask about starving in the | :21:51. | :21:56. | |
NHS, the SNP Government tells us that it is at record levels. He said | :21:57. | :22:02. | |
that when demand is going up so quickly, it is not enough. It is not | :22:03. | :22:07. | |
an explanation. More is needed. Well, we do have record levels of | :22:08. | :22:11. | |
staff in the NHS and we have record levels of investment. The SNP | :22:12. | :22:16. | |
Government continues to invest in the NHS. We continue to invest in | :22:17. | :22:22. | |
GPs. We have created more GP training places. We have created | :22:23. | :22:26. | |
more places at University and we have created a graduate school for | :22:27. | :22:32. | |
attracting people to... You say you have created more GP training | :22:33. | :22:35. | |
places. We have just heard someone from the general practitioners | :22:36. | :22:40. | |
Council saying that the extra places are not being taken up. They are not | :22:41. | :22:44. | |
being filled. We continue to work with the Royal College of GPs to | :22:45. | :22:51. | |
make GPs and to make a career as a GP more attractive. Why aren't | :22:52. | :22:54. | |
people taking up the traineeship? We will continue to work with them to | :22:55. | :23:00. | |
make it more attractive to medical graduates. As I say, we are also | :23:01. | :23:08. | |
looking at widening the net, making more medical places available and | :23:09. | :23:12. | |
also setting up graduate training to attract people into primary care and | :23:13. | :23:16. | |
role health services. Miles breaks. A bit of a difference in height | :23:17. | :23:21. | |
there! If the camera can get up to you! They go, everything is fine. | :23:22. | :23:27. | |
This is the issue. We have decided to bring the issue to Parliament | :23:28. | :23:31. | |
today because it is quite clear that we have decided to preside over a | :23:32. | :23:36. | |
crisis over the health service. GPs, everyone is telling us that day in | :23:37. | :23:43. | |
and day out as you have seen from that clip. We have decided we need | :23:44. | :23:49. | |
to meet the crisis. It there will be 830 GPs short soon. We need to see | :23:50. | :23:56. | |
real action taken by the Government to safeguard the future of family | :23:57. | :24:02. | |
GPs. Surely as Tories, you are not arguing fraught unlimited spending. | :24:03. | :24:05. | |
As your colleague Mr Cameron pointed out, the reason that record levels | :24:06. | :24:12. | |
of staff asked enough to cope is because there is such a huge | :24:13. | :24:16. | |
increase of demand key says. Presumably the Conservatives are not | :24:17. | :24:19. | |
saying that we should indefinitely continue to pour money and as long | :24:20. | :24:22. | |
as demand continues to increase because it will continue to increase | :24:23. | :24:28. | |
indefinitely. Yes. That is why we focus resources. We have made a | :24:29. | :24:31. | |
commitment that 10% of all health board funding would go directly to | :24:32. | :24:35. | |
front line GP services. That is what our people are telling is needs to | :24:36. | :24:41. | |
be done. It is worth remembering that the UK Conservative Government | :24:42. | :24:47. | |
has provided 1.46 billion in funding to the NHS. How that money is spent | :24:48. | :24:53. | |
is what we need to focus on. -- funding to the Scottish Government. | :24:54. | :25:00. | |
The GP about committee said that there are about 100 new trainee GP | :25:01. | :25:05. | |
places that have not been taken up. Why do think that is? GPs are pretty | :25:06. | :25:11. | |
well played, -- paid. Why are people not going into it? The role is | :25:12. | :25:16. | |
changing. We should be investing in primary care. I can't help but | :25:17. | :25:22. | |
remember that it was Nicola Sturgeon when she was the health minister | :25:23. | :25:27. | |
that actually cut the number of GP training places, cut the number of | :25:28. | :25:34. | |
wife and nursing places. We reaping the reward of that now. When not. If | :25:35. | :25:42. | |
people are coming into the matter of you increase or cut the numbers. The | :25:43. | :25:47. | |
reality is according to the GPs themselves that people are not | :25:48. | :25:50. | |
coming forward. What you find is that the overall number does matter. | :25:51. | :25:56. | |
The number of GPs and number of medical staff trained matters in | :25:57. | :25:58. | |
terms of the specialisation of medical staff. I'm not questioning | :25:59. | :26:03. | |
that. The point the GPs are making is that it's not the number of GPs | :26:04. | :26:08. | |
don't matter, of course it does. They are saying that these training | :26:09. | :26:11. | |
places that are there and available to people, people are not coming | :26:12. | :26:15. | |
forward to take up the traineeships. There is a stage before that which | :26:16. | :26:19. | |
is actively training at university and university places that they have | :26:20. | :26:23. | |
before they enter a traineeship. If you cut the number of places at | :26:24. | :26:28. | |
university, then you cut the number of... We have not cut the number of | :26:29. | :26:34. | |
university places... It comes back to whether we want to prioritise the | :26:35. | :26:41. | |
NHS. If the NHS digital that we have the adequate number of GPs. The | :26:42. | :26:47. | |
professionals are saying there is a GP writers. Unless the Scottish | :26:48. | :26:54. | |
Government fund those, the Scottish Government... It will just come to | :26:55. | :27:00. | |
any. We should be dealing with people much closer to home. Alex, do | :27:01. | :27:06. | |
the Liberal Democrats think there is a crisis here? After all, the SNP | :27:07. | :27:14. | |
have increased, or at least they have not allowed spending on health | :27:15. | :27:20. | |
to decrease in real terms. I know we have heard from the professional | :27:21. | :27:22. | |
saying there is a crisis, but cynics would say professionals in any | :27:23. | :27:27. | |
profession always say there is a crisis because it is in their | :27:28. | :27:30. | |
interest to hold out for more money and more resources. I think the only | :27:31. | :27:34. | |
people who don't know that there is a crisis in this sector are the SNP. | :27:35. | :27:47. | |
That is why we -- they have tabled a idea to remove the word serious from | :27:48. | :27:52. | |
this. What is release Kerry is not just the number of places that | :27:53. | :27:55. | |
aren't taken up, it is that those trainee GPs who are in place months | :27:56. | :27:59. | |
right now, 50% of them are not domiciled in Scotland. -- | :28:00. | :28:06. | |
placements. We will even practice in Scotland. Even though we are | :28:07. | :28:09. | |
training them, they may not even end up here. We need to recognise that | :28:10. | :28:15. | |
even in our nation's capital, in Edinburgh Western, might | :28:16. | :28:22. | |
constituency, we have needs that a vast inflated. Part of that is that | :28:23. | :28:25. | |
it does not work hand-in-hand with planning. We are throwing up | :28:26. | :28:29. | |
communities left right and centre. Particularly in urban areas without | :28:30. | :28:36. | |
any thought to health services or. They are putting more drain. That is | :28:37. | :28:43. | |
putting a massive strain on exhaustion and morale. Cleverly if | :28:44. | :28:49. | |
we can swing right background you, if you are right, and it Jackie | :28:50. | :28:55. | |
Baillie is wrong that there is a problem at university. If there is | :28:56. | :29:00. | |
no trouble at universities training, what is Europe's place and for why | :29:01. | :29:03. | |
the places that are being made available by the Government are not | :29:04. | :29:08. | |
in taken up? I refuse to take lessons from Tories who cannot run | :29:09. | :29:20. | |
the NHS... This is extraordinary. The levels of funding as a record | :29:21. | :29:29. | |
levels. This is embarrassing. The funding is at record levels. I asked | :29:30. | :29:34. | |
you a very straight question which you spent about half a minute | :29:35. | :29:38. | |
avoiding. The question is this is that if you are right that the | :29:39. | :29:43. | |
number of places at universities is fine... I can't hear you. If you are | :29:44. | :29:50. | |
right that the number of places at university are not falling, had you | :29:51. | :29:53. | |
explain the fact that the traineeships are the Scottish | :29:54. | :29:57. | |
Government that are being made available are not being taken up? We | :29:58. | :30:00. | |
need to tackle this from both ends. We need to take more people into | :30:01. | :30:05. | |
university to train. We need to attract more people into GP training | :30:06. | :30:10. | |
and we also need to look at getting GPs who have retired and perhaps | :30:11. | :30:11. | |
left practice to come back into Miles, if we can climb back up to | :30:12. | :30:23. | |
you again, what is your reply? If it is the case that traineeships are | :30:24. | :30:26. | |
being made available by the Scottish Government and people are not coming | :30:27. | :30:30. | |
forward to take them up, that is hardly the Scottish Government's | :30:31. | :30:39. | |
fault, is it? I think what is key is our people do not depend on the SNP, | :30:40. | :30:43. | |
they depend on the health service workers. After 9.5 years of being in | :30:44. | :30:49. | |
power, it is time the SNP took responsibility for this crisis. How | :30:50. | :30:57. | |
would you explain the fact that the places are there and people are not | :30:58. | :31:03. | |
coming forward? As Alex mentioned, over half our GPs being in training, | :31:04. | :31:13. | |
how we can fund that and keep people working, the SNP have not addressed | :31:14. | :31:21. | |
that. It was Nicola Sturgeon who released the number of training | :31:22. | :31:25. | |
places -- reduced the number of training places. I say to you that | :31:26. | :31:30. | |
the SNP cut training places and it is now that we are reaping the | :31:31. | :31:36. | |
reward. One sentence, Alex Cole-Hamilton? I think we need to | :31:37. | :31:40. | |
invest in our GP surgery and practice managers because if you | :31:41. | :31:43. | |
look at it, the funding for GPs has gone down from about 9% five years | :31:44. | :31:49. | |
ago to 7% now. The Royal College of GPs are asking... We are facing a | :31:50. | :31:56. | |
perfect storm of an ageing population and a rising population. | :31:57. | :31:59. | |
You cannot keep sticking your fingers in your ears and pretending | :32:00. | :32:04. | |
it is not happening. An entire profession is looking for your party | :32:05. | :32:09. | |
and leadership. That was at least five sentences. And about 25 | :32:10. | :32:15. | |
subordinate clauses! We will have to leave it there. Thank you. | :32:16. | :32:18. | |
Now, let's cross back to the chamber where the Scottish Government | :32:19. | :32:21. | |
are responding to a Conservative motion criticising | :32:22. | :32:23. | |
the government's record workforce planning for the NHS. | :32:24. | :32:25. | |
Shona Robinson the Health Secretary is speaking now. | :32:26. | :32:37. | |
We are looking at always of making those posts more attractive, and we | :32:38. | :32:46. | |
have had some success with that. I recognise also the particular | :32:47. | :32:49. | |
challenges we have within general practice which is why there has been | :32:50. | :32:53. | |
such a key focus for me personally and this government on that, and | :32:54. | :32:59. | |
extensive efforts made through the primary care transformation fund, | :33:00. | :33:04. | |
the ?85 million investment in the next three years, the fact we are | :33:05. | :33:09. | |
working with the BME on a new GP contract from 2017 onwards, the fact | :33:10. | :33:13. | |
that we have got rid of all the bureaucracy that goes with it, so it | :33:14. | :33:17. | |
is absolutely unfair for Donald Cameron to claim we have not been | :33:18. | :33:21. | |
giving primary-care and general practice the priority it needs. Of | :33:22. | :33:26. | |
course we have. While we have the highest number of GPs per head of | :33:27. | :33:29. | |
population in the UK and that number has risen to an all-time high, we | :33:30. | :33:34. | |
recognise we need to do more. And we need more GPs, we accept that. But | :33:35. | :33:40. | |
it is not all about securing numbers. We have increased the | :33:41. | :33:48. | |
training places for GPs to grow our GP workforce, encouraging trainee | :33:49. | :33:51. | |
doctors into general practice, helping to make general practice | :33:52. | :33:56. | |
more attractive option and encouraging established GPs to | :33:57. | :33:59. | |
return to practice, but we need to do more, we accept that we need to | :34:00. | :34:04. | |
have the multidisciplinary team around GPs and that is what we are | :34:05. | :34:08. | |
working to do. But it is not simply a numbers game and I will give way | :34:09. | :34:14. | |
on that point. Thank you. The multidisciplinary team will consist | :34:15. | :34:21. | |
of midwives and health visitors. In Glasgow, the healthier wealthier | :34:22. | :34:23. | |
children initiative has had a significant impact on those at risk | :34:24. | :34:29. | |
of poverty. They have received ?11 million in benefits they might not | :34:30. | :34:33. | |
have known about if it had not been for the well-informed midwives and | :34:34. | :34:37. | |
health visitors. Will the government commit to Green manifesto calls that | :34:38. | :34:42. | |
that scheme be rolled out across Scotland? I can say to Alison | :34:43. | :34:46. | |
Johnston that I welcome the contribution made by health visitors | :34:47. | :34:51. | |
and midwives through that project which we funded, and I think the | :34:52. | :34:58. | |
role of the NHS staff and their partners in income maximisation is | :34:59. | :35:09. | |
something that we need to make sure and tackling health inequalities, | :35:10. | :35:11. | |
that everyone sees it as part of their role to do so. So, yes, I can | :35:12. | :35:14. | |
commit to supporting the roll-out of that, and we can build that in | :35:15. | :35:17. | |
through the workforce plans as we take that forward. I think the | :35:18. | :35:21. | |
multidisciplinary model we have with link workers and others really lends | :35:22. | :35:26. | |
itself well to seeing part of that as tackling inequalities and income | :35:27. | :35:34. | |
maximisation also. NHS boards are required to have the correct staff | :35:35. | :35:38. | |
to meet the needs of the service and ensure high-quality patient care. We | :35:39. | :35:42. | |
are working very closely with boards and through the new world of | :35:43. | :35:47. | |
integration to support their efforts on workforce planning and | :35:48. | :35:50. | |
recruitment, and of course, we will work with the RCGP, BME and others, | :35:51. | :35:57. | |
the RCN and others, to take that forward. We have a vision through | :35:58. | :36:04. | |
the National clinical strategy and I intend to introduce proposals for a | :36:05. | :36:09. | |
regional and national planning system in a draft national health | :36:10. | :36:15. | |
care workforce plan by the end of the year, with the plan published in | :36:16. | :36:18. | |
the spring of next year. I can assure... Mr Crowley was looking to | :36:19. | :36:28. | |
intervene and I have told him it is too late... | :36:29. | :36:32. | |
Now, major changes are being made to the new school qualifications. | :36:33. | :36:35. | |
Assessments marked by teachers which make up part of a student's | :36:36. | :36:38. | |
The government says it's been listening to teachers' worries | :36:39. | :36:41. | |
The biggest teachers union says the change is very welcome, | :36:42. | :36:45. | |
but says other concerns still need to be addressed. | :36:46. | :36:47. | |
Here's our education correspondent Jamie McIvor. | :36:48. | :36:54. | |
These are big changes which will affect both students and teachers. | :36:55. | :36:59. | |
Assessments marked by teachers are an important part of National five | :37:00. | :37:06. | |
and higher courses. Teachers say they have added to workload | :37:07. | :37:10. | |
bureaucracy and stress. Now these assessments are to be scrapped. And | :37:11. | :37:13. | |
greater significance is one earner is where young people will not be | :37:14. | :37:17. | |
carrying as much pressure as they did in the past. But will assist | :37:18. | :37:21. | |
young people concentrating on the achievement of their learning rather | :37:22. | :37:25. | |
than purely and simply the assessment of their progress. Final | :37:26. | :37:29. | |
exams will now be strengthened. Coursework will make up part of the | :37:30. | :37:35. | |
final mark but this will be externally marked, reducing the | :37:36. | :37:44. | |
workload of teachers. Some teachers have been on a work-to-rule as a | :37:45. | :37:53. | |
result of this. More time and space for depth of learning, it is | :37:54. | :37:56. | |
supposed our creativity at the heart of it, and for teachers, a | :37:57. | :38:01. | |
significant reduction in the workload associated with | :38:02. | :38:05. | |
bureaucracy. Changes will be made next year and changes to higher | :38:06. | :38:09. | |
courses in 2018. The details of what this will mean for individual | :38:10. | :38:11. | |
subjects will be decided later. Kieran Andrews is still with me. | :38:12. | :38:21. | |
Let's talk about the NHS. Let's talk about language first. Watching that | :38:22. | :38:26. | |
debate in Parliament, why do politicians speak like that? I have | :38:27. | :38:29. | |
no idea what shown Robinson was trying to say. Did you understand | :38:30. | :38:36. | |
it? No, I don't think anyone watching it unless you are familiar | :38:37. | :38:40. | |
with the jargon of the NHS would understand it. I saw your interview | :38:41. | :38:45. | |
with each of the politicians at Holyrood. When the questions are | :38:46. | :38:50. | |
difficult, politicians like to speak and not say anything unless it | :38:51. | :38:53. | |
scores a point against their opponents. At least they were | :38:54. | :38:57. | |
speaking of something approximating the lush language. There is that! | :38:58. | :39:03. | |
What you have here in terms of the GP crisis, the problem with | :39:04. | :39:08. | |
recruiting GPs are straightforward to diagnose. It is a very stressful | :39:09. | :39:13. | |
job. It might pay well, it might have good standing but it is very | :39:14. | :39:19. | |
stressful. Increasingly long hours, especially for GPs who own their own | :39:20. | :39:23. | |
practice. And if you're trying to recruit people to rural areas, it is | :39:24. | :39:27. | |
difficult to attract people may be up to the islands or harder to reach | :39:28. | :39:32. | |
areas. Do you think that explains why they have got places open and | :39:33. | :39:37. | |
people not coming forward? Absolutely. A combination of those | :39:38. | :39:42. | |
factors plus the Conservatives want to look at their immigration policy | :39:43. | :39:49. | |
and post study work visas touched on by the GPs in the health committee | :39:50. | :39:55. | |
about people not staying once they have finished university. It is a | :39:56. | :39:59. | |
multifaceted problem. It is much more difficult to find a solution | :40:00. | :40:03. | |
which is why politicians don't want to talk about the problem. You would | :40:04. | :40:08. | |
think Scotland with its medical traditions could produce enough | :40:09. | :40:11. | |
doctors, of all things, for heaven 's sake, you think we could do that? | :40:12. | :40:17. | |
Indeed, but no one is talking about the problem of producing enough | :40:18. | :40:23. | |
doctors, it is producing enough GPs. So a lot of them are going to become | :40:24. | :40:29. | |
hospital consultants or researchers, it is this idea of saying go to | :40:30. | :40:34. | |
somewhere in the north-west of Scotland and run a GP surgery? | :40:35. | :40:39. | |
Absolutely. There are plenty of issues across the rest of the NHS | :40:40. | :40:43. | |
with it creaking and possibly not enough resources. There are higher | :40:44. | :40:48. | |
and higher demands, but the most obvious problem is within the GP | :40:49. | :40:53. | |
sector and it is attracting people who go in and become medical | :40:54. | :40:59. | |
students to go into that area. Isn't the obvious answer, you put their | :41:00. | :41:04. | |
pay up? That is what the bankers always say! It you want to recruit | :41:05. | :41:11. | |
them you have to pay them. We are clearly not paying enough especially | :41:12. | :41:15. | |
for doctors in rural communities? Possibly. It has been trialled with | :41:16. | :41:21. | |
rural areas with teachers. But these have been taken away as public | :41:22. | :41:27. | |
services are cut. It is very difficult to justify cutting a | :41:28. | :41:31. | |
social worker's salary in an unattractive area and a teacher's | :41:32. | :41:34. | |
salary but saying GPs to get three times more you, you should get a wee | :41:35. | :41:39. | |
bit extra on top of that. It might help the problem but it creates | :41:40. | :41:44. | |
problems. Thank you. A majority of MSPs have voted | :41:45. | :41:47. | |
in favour of a Scottish Government motion, amended by Labour, | :41:48. | :41:50. | |
noting the "negative impact" that leaving the EU will have | :41:51. | :41:52. | |
on the Scottish economy. Labour's amendment also called | :41:53. | :41:54. | |
on Scottish ministers to do more A Conservative amendment calling | :41:55. | :41:59. | |
for the Scottish Government to reduce business rates, | :42:00. | :42:01. | |
and rule out a second independence referendum was | :42:02. | :42:03. | |
defeated. The Scottish Government debate, | :42:04. | :42:04. | |
looking at how Scotland's economy should respond to Brexit, | :42:05. | :42:06. | |
began with the Economy Secretary, Scottish GDP is projected to be | :42:07. | :42:20. | |
between 1.2 billion to 11 billion lower if Brexit does not occur. Now, | :42:21. | :42:29. | |
we know that these forecasts are contingent on political and other | :42:30. | :42:32. | |
events and reaction to those political events in the economy. The | :42:33. | :42:40. | |
uncertainty immediately following the vote is impacting on economic | :42:41. | :42:49. | |
issues. Our workers' rights going to be protected? Is a new holiday these | :42:50. | :42:54. | |
attacks going to be introduced for people travelling to the EU? And | :42:55. | :42:59. | |
there have been no answers on the most important question of all, will | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
the UK remain inside the single market or do you believe, whoever | :43:04. | :43:08. | |
speaks for the Conservative Party, do you believe that the UK should | :43:09. | :43:15. | |
remain inside the single market? I would welcome, in addition to that | :43:16. | :43:21. | |
answer, constructive ideas about how we can further support economic | :43:22. | :43:25. | |
growth and from MEPs across the chamber. In that spirit, I would | :43:26. | :43:30. | |
urge the Chancellor to exploit two key measures which could be taken to | :43:31. | :43:36. | |
protect jobs. First of all, increased capital spending. An | :43:37. | :43:39. | |
increase in 5 billion could produce an additional ?4 million spend in | :43:40. | :43:46. | |
Scotland. Increased support for exporters. The depreciation of | :43:47. | :43:52. | |
Stirling represents challenges to businesses in the UK but it also | :43:53. | :43:56. | |
represents opportunities for companies to move into new Xbox | :43:57. | :44:02. | |
markets. The UK should be investing more to support that -- export | :44:03. | :44:07. | |
markets. I am putting forward a plan for how the UK Government can help | :44:08. | :44:10. | |
at this critical juncture for our economy. I hope the Chancellor will | :44:11. | :44:19. | |
act by the Autumn Statement. For our part, we have taken decisive and | :44:20. | :44:24. | |
positive action to build on the economic strategy. ?100 million of | :44:25. | :44:28. | |
capital investment provides immediate support to the Scottish | :44:29. | :44:34. | |
economy. We have set up a new dedicated service for businesses | :44:35. | :44:41. | |
affected by referendum uncertainty. And we have provided some loans of | :44:42. | :44:46. | |
up to ?5 million for eligible businesses. As the Cabinet Secretary | :44:47. | :44:51. | |
said we had good news on employment published last week. We have seen | :44:52. | :44:55. | |
Scottish unemployment dipped below the UK level. But across a whole | :44:56. | :44:59. | |
range of indicators, Scottish economic performance is lagging | :45:00. | :45:06. | |
behind the UK as a whole. Whether that is GTB growth, business sales | :45:07. | :45:08. | |
or confidence, we're not doing as well as we should be. That debunks | :45:09. | :45:12. | |
the myth being put about in some quarters that any problems with the | :45:13. | :45:16. | |
Scottish economy are purely the responsibility of the Brexit vote. | :45:17. | :45:21. | |
The unique Scottish problem, but one which is holding backs got a | :45:22. | :45:23. | |
recovery is the one they don't want to talk about on the their accession | :45:24. | :45:29. | |
with an independence referendum. We have seen in recent weeks a whole | :45:30. | :45:32. | |
range of business figures saying the last things Scotland needs at this | :45:33. | :45:35. | |
point is another referendum. The last thing we need is another period | :45:36. | :45:40. | |
of economic uncertainty, and yet, two years on from that last vote, | :45:41. | :45:44. | |
one which we were told would be a once in a generation vote, all we | :45:45. | :45:49. | |
hear from SNP figures is how and when another referendum should take | :45:50. | :45:55. | |
place. In the wake of the Brexit vote, a survey of 320 firms across | :45:56. | :46:01. | |
Scotland found 60% believed the outcome of the EU referendum will | :46:02. | :46:06. | |
have a negative effect on their business. 67% believed the | :46:07. | :46:11. | |
uncertainty created was an additional problem. As we all know, | :46:12. | :46:15. | |
the people who will suffer most from any business downturn are those | :46:16. | :46:22. | |
working people who are already on the most precarious contracts. Those | :46:23. | :46:26. | |
who are already the lowest paid. We call on the Cabinet Secretary to | :46:27. | :46:30. | |
join with us on calling on his own government to do more to stimulate | :46:31. | :46:36. | |
investment. Let's look at how we can reclaim the economy so that it is | :46:37. | :46:41. | |
run and its long-term strategic decisions are made in the interests | :46:42. | :46:46. | |
of working people. Deputy Presiding Officer, I move the amendment in my | :46:47. | :46:52. | |
name. That was Richard Leonard speaking there. | :46:53. | :46:54. | |
Voting has ended in the bitter contest to be Labour party leader. | :46:55. | :46:57. | |
More than 640,000 people have been choosing between Jeremy Corbyn | :46:58. | :47:00. | |
The result will be announced on Saturday. | :47:01. | :47:09. | |
The eternal sunshine is beating down on our correspondent David Porter. | :47:10. | :47:18. | |
Yes, as far as the Labour leadership contest is concerned, it is all over | :47:19. | :47:25. | |
now Bardi counting. How is it going to go and how will it play in the | :47:26. | :47:30. | |
weeks and months ahead? Joining me now are two of my journalistic | :47:31. | :47:36. | |
colleagues, David Maddox and Torvill Crichton. David, is there any doubt | :47:37. | :47:41. | |
about how this contest will go? I don't think there's any doubt at | :47:42. | :47:46. | |
all. I think Jeremy Corbyn has won it by a mile, possibly more. All the | :47:47. | :47:52. | |
areas now see is whether the rebel MPs capitulate or how many of them | :47:53. | :47:56. | |
capitulate and fall in line with him or how many go their own way and | :47:57. | :48:00. | |
whether there is a bloodbath essentially. Lots of the selections | :48:01. | :48:08. | |
of his moderates and we see a completely new Labour Party emerge | :48:09. | :48:12. | |
from the wreckage? Torvill, do you agree with that assessment that it | :48:13. | :48:17. | |
is Jeremy Corbyn and it is just by how many he wins by? He punched Owen | :48:18. | :48:24. | |
Smith out of the ring. The new battle, Tom Watson versus Jeremy | :48:25. | :48:28. | |
Corbyn. Tom Watson is more of a heavyweight, the deputy leader of | :48:29. | :48:32. | |
the Labour Party and we saw the first round of that in the NEC. A | :48:33. | :48:48. | |
0-0 draw. The Labour rebel MPs could walk back with dignity, Corbyn did | :48:49. | :48:55. | |
not agree with that. A 2-0 result when getting a Scottish | :48:56. | :49:02. | |
representative of the NEC and a Welsh representative. Kezia Dugdale | :49:03. | :49:06. | |
is the Scottish leader. They put this deal through last night which | :49:07. | :49:11. | |
is a personal win for her. We will deal with that specifically in a | :49:12. | :49:17. | |
moment. Do you think it is possible but Jeremy Corbyn could do better | :49:18. | :49:21. | |
this time? He got about 60% of the vote last time. How will that change | :49:22. | :49:25. | |
the dynamics and tensions in the Labour Party? It is perfectly | :49:26. | :49:31. | |
possible he could do better. John McDonnell is talking about 56% which | :49:32. | :49:37. | |
means they probably expect 66%. His mandate will be even bigger. We will | :49:38. | :49:42. | |
hear more about his mandate, more about direct control of the Labour | :49:43. | :49:47. | |
Party. It is the new membership which has transformed membership. | :49:48. | :49:52. | |
They are not all new. You meet a lot of old timer Labour Party store | :49:53. | :49:55. | |
Watts who have been through thick and thin who are fed up and don't | :49:56. | :50:02. | |
think middle ground is the answer and they like Corbyn. It is not just | :50:03. | :50:08. | |
the entry is it you have old Labour activists who support Corbyn as | :50:09. | :50:12. | |
well. He wants to empower them and at the same time, that means | :50:13. | :50:18. | |
somebody loses. The people who will lose are the Labour MPs who want to | :50:19. | :50:22. | |
do something as boring as getting Labour into power in this country. | :50:23. | :50:28. | |
He is not interested in that. He is interested in building a big social | :50:29. | :50:33. | |
movement across the UK. Three quarters of his Shadow Cabinet | :50:34. | :50:38. | |
walked out. Is it possible that he can, for want of a better phrase, | :50:39. | :50:42. | |
patch this relationship back together again? I am not sure that | :50:43. | :50:47. | |
he needs to. I disagree with Torquil and away. The fight now is between | :50:48. | :50:55. | |
Tom Watson and Jeremy Corbyn. Owen Smith was not up to it. I don't | :50:56. | :51:00. | |
think Tom Watson has any ground to stand on really. If Corbyn, as we | :51:01. | :51:04. | |
expect, comes in with a bigger mandate, then he has this mass | :51:05. | :51:08. | |
movement behind him, he will be able to rewrite the party rules, he will | :51:09. | :51:12. | |
be able to tell the MPs to be the fall in line or get out, and maybe | :51:13. | :51:17. | |
it would be him doing it, maybe it will be John McDonnell who seems to | :51:18. | :51:24. | |
be the iron fist in the velvet glove, and I really think we will | :51:25. | :51:28. | |
see a fairly brutal reshaping of the Labour Party into a very hard left | :51:29. | :51:33. | |
force in British politics. But they will not roll over and die these | :51:34. | :51:37. | |
Labour MPs. I don't think we will see this fight this weekend. So many | :51:38. | :51:43. | |
rebel MPs will not even go to the conference because they know they | :51:44. | :51:48. | |
will get physically beaten up their -- figuratively beaten up there. Tom | :51:49. | :51:58. | |
Watson, much as Jeremy Corbyn was supported by Unite, Tom Watson has | :51:59. | :52:08. | |
links as well. A story we ran today, there is a plan involving Unite | :52:09. | :52:12. | |
bankrolling to get rid of the regional directors. No one will have | :52:13. | :52:16. | |
heard of the regional directors but they are important people who | :52:17. | :52:19. | |
organise the party across the country. You get rid of them and you | :52:20. | :52:27. | |
get rid of the thin red line between deselection and the Lamenting | :52:28. | :52:33. | |
groups. It takes away all protection the moderate MPs have. -- the | :52:34. | :52:44. | |
Momentum groups. Are we going to see a situation where Labour could | :52:45. | :52:47. | |
split, the parliamentary party and Jeremy Corbyn's party there could be | :52:48. | :52:53. | |
some kind of schism? I don't detect that. Where would they go? As the | :52:54. | :52:59. | |
Lib Dems showed us this week, there is hardly any middle ground left in | :53:00. | :53:06. | |
politics. You have a Corbyn Labour Party, a Brexit Tory party, and | :53:07. | :53:13. | |
nationalistic SNP, very little middle road, middle ground politics | :53:14. | :53:21. | |
in Britain right now. The problem is not Will Bayley 's? Will all be | :53:22. | :53:27. | |
middle ground Owen Smith, Tom Watson supporting members leave and leave | :53:28. | :53:33. | |
the party and vacate the ground? Is that a view that you share, that the | :53:34. | :53:38. | |
Labour MPs will hunker down the moderate supporters will say this is | :53:39. | :53:44. | |
not for me now? I think they will. Some will accept their fate as such. | :53:45. | :53:48. | |
But I think the problem for the party is not Labour members as such, | :53:49. | :53:52. | |
or even moderate Labour members, it is those people who voted Labour all | :53:53. | :53:58. | |
their lives but were not party members who will just go elsewhere. | :53:59. | :54:02. | |
They will go to the Conservatives, Ukip and the Lib Dems. That raises | :54:03. | :54:08. | |
an interesting question. If Theresa May is looking at this and all the | :54:09. | :54:12. | |
problems she has got with the Brexit negotiations, could she be tempted | :54:13. | :54:15. | |
to say I will hold that general election sooner rather than later? I | :54:16. | :54:20. | |
think it is a possibility. I have always thought it was a possibility. | :54:21. | :54:24. | |
Her pictures to the centre ground. I know that has been the argument | :54:25. | :54:32. | |
about grammar schools but that is pitched at middle-class working | :54:33. | :54:35. | |
parents. It is not pitched at traditional Tory voters. I think she | :54:36. | :54:41. | |
could do it. She would have to change the law in here to overcome | :54:42. | :54:46. | |
the fixed term parliament act. Jeremy Corbyn would welcome it. | :54:47. | :54:50. | |
Defeat is not really defeat for Corbyn, it just means he gets rid of | :54:51. | :54:54. | |
a few troublesome MPs and at the next election be able to replace | :54:55. | :55:00. | |
them and he can place them with candidates more in his own mould. A | :55:01. | :55:05. | |
big fight within Labour. Labour are not really looking outwards to see | :55:06. | :55:11. | |
if there will be a general election. Their fight is internal. Thank you | :55:12. | :55:17. | |
both for a much for joining us. Gordon, we will get a flavour of the | :55:18. | :55:20. | |
reaction to the new Labour leader, whoever that will be when they are | :55:21. | :55:25. | |
elected on Saturday next week. Thank you. | :55:26. | :55:28. | |
Let's get some final thoughts from Kieran Andrews. | :55:29. | :55:33. | |
I presume you agree that Jeremy Corbyn is likely to win? You talk | :55:34. | :55:43. | |
about a greater mandate. Last time Jeremy Corbyn had 60%. That was with | :55:44. | :55:49. | |
three other candidates. If you did not get a wider percentage this time | :55:50. | :55:53. | |
it would be surprising in a head-to-head against a wishy-washy, | :55:54. | :55:58. | |
not up to a great deal Owen Smith. It is just a mess. The UK Labour | :55:59. | :56:05. | |
Party at this time, where David Maddox touched on the Tories there, | :56:06. | :56:09. | |
looking at grammar schools and Brexit, however you think they are | :56:10. | :56:14. | |
handling it, any of these issues, it is pretty controversial either way. | :56:15. | :56:18. | |
They are doing things which will affect a great any people's | :56:19. | :56:23. | |
day-to-day lives. Even the Lib Dems at their conference, Tim Farron | :56:24. | :56:26. | |
talking about putting money on income taxes to increase health | :56:27. | :56:32. | |
spending. What is Labour's big pitch to the country, how they reorganised | :56:33. | :56:36. | |
the Shadow Cabinet, how they run their internal politics. It is | :56:37. | :56:40. | |
things that people don't care about, navel-gazing that will not get them | :56:41. | :56:45. | |
back into power in any way, shape or form if they continue down this | :56:46. | :56:51. | |
road. What you think the MPs who disagree with Jeremy Corbyn might do | :56:52. | :56:56. | |
following this? Everyone is saying they will be unhappy if Jeremy | :56:57. | :57:01. | |
Corbyn wins. They say I'm likely to split so what happens, it just goes | :57:02. | :57:10. | |
on and happily forever. The most obvious place for someone to give is | :57:11. | :57:20. | |
at an election. Jeremy Corbyn has not been tested with the electorate | :57:21. | :57:26. | |
properly yet despite what he says about council by-elections. Which we | :57:27. | :57:32. | |
should point out, Labour have done quite well in, while everybody has | :57:33. | :57:36. | |
been saying what a disaster Corbyn is. When it has come to the test, so | :57:37. | :57:41. | |
far he has done quite well. Absolutely. They gained in Glasgow | :57:42. | :57:54. | |
and in Fife. The test so far but it takes a knockout 12 it takes a | :57:55. | :58:00. | |
knockout one to test Jeremy Corbyn. Join us for First Minister's | :58:01. | :58:03. | |
Questions tomorrow on BBC Two We'll be back next | :58:04. | :58:05. | |
Wednesday, join us then. Unparalleled talent, | :58:06. | :58:10. | |
unprecedented access. BBC Two takes a sneaky peek | :58:11. | :58:49. | |
behind the celebrity curtain. Go out there, grab it with both | :58:50. | :58:52. | |
hands and stick it in your mouth. Easy peasy, get yourself | :58:53. | :58:57. | |
a catchphrase. | :58:58. | :59:01. |