Browse content similar to 24/02/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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announces more cash for disadvantaged pupils, | :00:15. | :00:29. | |
MPs told the fiscal framework is a new for Scotland. | :00:30. | :00:50. | |
The UK and Scottish governments finally reached agreement yesterday | :00:51. | :00:53. | |
on the fiscal framework - which underpins the transfer | :00:54. | :00:55. | |
of further tax and welfare powers to Holyrood. | :00:56. | :00:57. | |
A short while ago the Scottish Secretary David Mundell confirmed | :00:58. | :00:59. | |
that deal in a statement to the House of Commons. | :01:00. | :01:01. | |
This is a truly historic deal which will pave the way for the Scottish | :01:02. | :01:09. | |
parliament to become one of the most powerful and accountable devolved | :01:10. | :01:12. | |
parliaments in the world. We have respected all the principles set out | :01:13. | :01:19. | |
in the cross-party Smith agreement and a livered deal that is fair for | :01:20. | :01:23. | |
Scotland and fear for the whole United Kingdom. As Lord Smith | :01:24. | :01:29. | |
himself yesterday evening, when the Smith agreement was passed to the | :01:30. | :01:34. | |
Prime Minister and First Minister, both gave their word that they would | :01:35. | :01:39. | |
deliver it into law. They have met that promise in full. Scotland's two | :01:40. | :01:44. | |
governments will give more details in coming days but I would like to | :01:45. | :01:49. | |
set out a few key elements of the deal. The Scottish Government will | :01:50. | :01:55. | |
retain all of the revenue from the taxes that are being devolved or | :01:56. | :01:58. | |
assigned, including around 12 billion of around income tax and | :01:59. | :02:02. | |
around V -- 5 billion of VAT. The block grant of the Scottish | :02:03. | :02:06. | |
Government will be adjusted to reflect the devolution and | :02:07. | :02:11. | |
assignment of further taxes and the devolution of further spending | :02:12. | :02:14. | |
responsibilities. We have kept our commitment to keep the Barnett | :02:15. | :02:23. | |
formula, extending this to cover areas of devolved welfare. The tax | :02:24. | :02:26. | |
we will use the UK was my government 's preferred funding model. | :02:27. | :02:39. | |
That is fair to Scotland and fear to the rest of the United Kingdom. | :02:40. | :02:44. | |
However, for a transitional period covering the next Scottish | :02:45. | :02:50. | |
parliament, the government have agreed to share these risks as these | :02:51. | :02:52. | |
powers are implemented. Specifically the Scottish Government will hold | :02:53. | :02:57. | |
the economic risk, well the UK Government will hold the population | :02:58. | :03:00. | |
risks. The Scottish Government will not receive a penny less than the | :03:01. | :03:05. | |
Barnett funding over the spending review simply due to different | :03:06. | :03:11. | |
population growth. And by the end of 2021, a review of the framework will | :03:12. | :03:19. | |
be formed by an independent report so that we can ensure that we are | :03:20. | :03:23. | |
continuing to deliver Smith in full, with the Scottish Government | :03:24. | :03:25. | |
responsible for the full range of virgin teas and risks associated | :03:26. | :03:31. | |
with its new responsibilities. We have also agreed that the Scottish | :03:32. | :03:34. | |
Government will have additional new borrowing powers. It will invest up | :03:35. | :03:42. | |
to 3 billion in fatal infrastructure. In line with the | :03:43. | :03:45. | |
recommendation of the Smith agreement, we will provide the | :03:46. | :03:51. | |
government ?2 million share to set up the new powers it will control. | :03:52. | :03:56. | |
The government has delivered more powers to the Scottish people, | :03:57. | :04:00. | |
ensuring that they have one of the most powerful devolved governments | :04:01. | :04:05. | |
in the world and economic and national security that comes with | :04:06. | :04:09. | |
being part of our United Kingdom. That is what we have agreed, and | :04:10. | :04:14. | |
that is what we have delivered in full. Now that we have agreed this | :04:15. | :04:20. | |
historic deal, the conversation must move on to how these new powers are | :04:21. | :04:24. | |
to be used. The Scottish Government will have extensive powers on tax, | :04:25. | :04:30. | |
welfare and spending. It will have control over income tax and be able | :04:31. | :04:34. | |
to change the rates and thresholds. It will be able to create new | :04:35. | :04:38. | |
benefits and of course the permanence of the Scottish permanent | :04:39. | :04:43. | |
-- parliament as book with without any doubt. The people of Scotland | :04:44. | :04:48. | |
voted for these new powers and they deserve to hear from the parties in | :04:49. | :04:53. | |
Scotland how they will use them. New powers that infused Welp can broaden | :04:54. | :04:59. | |
the economy and population. And bring greater opportunity and | :05:00. | :05:00. | |
prosperity. I'm joined for the afternoon | :05:01. | :05:01. | |
by Moray Macdonald, who is a former Director of the Scottish | :05:02. | :05:04. | |
Conservatives, and is now a PR I know people are gripped by this. | :05:05. | :05:22. | |
You know get Scotland's budget is baseline allocation. Plus Barnett | :05:23. | :05:26. | |
formula money, minus block grant adjustment, based on what the | :05:27. | :05:32. | |
British government wanted, plus money. Which basically compensates | :05:33. | :05:35. | |
for some of the things taken away. That is right. It is the passport at | :05:36. | :05:49. | |
the there that has been argued over. -- plus pot. It means it will have | :05:50. | :05:54. | |
to be renegotiated at some point. This is because Scotland's | :05:55. | :05:58. | |
population is growing at a slower rate than England. If we did it in | :05:59. | :06:05. | |
the original manor, Scotland would get less money than England per | :06:06. | :06:10. | |
capita. Does the same overall as being reasonable? Scotland has to | :06:11. | :06:14. | |
take some responsibility of its population if it does not grow | :06:15. | :06:18. | |
vastly. And you can see the Scottish Government sing, we do not have | :06:19. | :06:31. | |
control over immigration, so we should not take that responsibility. | :06:32. | :06:33. | |
There will always have to be compromises. The government in | :06:34. | :06:35. | |
Scotland does not have all the levers it would want to have to | :06:36. | :06:37. | |
change some things, for example immigration is easy. So the | :06:38. | :06:41. | |
settlement they have come to, it means the Smith Commission is | :06:42. | :06:44. | |
implemented in full. Through the powers that there, there will be no | :06:45. | :06:49. | |
detriment to the Scottish taxpayer unless the Scottish Government | :06:50. | :06:52. | |
decides to do that by cutting taxes whatever. Part of the principle of | :06:53. | :07:00. | |
this, if the Scottish Government were to cut taxes and its revenues | :07:01. | :07:06. | |
were to fault and not be replaced by extra taxes, Scotland there is a hit | :07:07. | :07:15. | |
for that. Exactly. What Scotland is protected on now, if tax rates stay | :07:16. | :07:20. | |
as they are. If they cut them, then yes, that is a decision of future | :07:21. | :07:24. | |
government might take. It is one the SNP Government might take, then we | :07:25. | :07:29. | |
would have to cut our budget. I do not think sufficient detail has been | :07:30. | :07:35. | |
published for the answer to this. We had a hint a few weeks ago that it | :07:36. | :07:41. | |
is not just population they might be recognising, they might be | :07:42. | :07:44. | |
recognising that the Scotland population is ageing as well. I have | :07:45. | :07:50. | |
not seen that data, but that is an issue in Scotland. We do not have | :07:51. | :07:55. | |
enough people being born and we do not have controls over immigration. | :07:56. | :07:59. | |
We have seen arguments over the last few weeks, wanting overseas students | :08:00. | :08:05. | |
to stay in Scotland, after they have been studying. That has been knocked | :08:06. | :08:08. | |
back by the Home Office. We might see some movement in the argument. | :08:09. | :08:14. | |
The underlying issues about how to do this have not been resolved, have | :08:15. | :08:21. | |
they? It is kicked into touch until 2022 and then you have another | :08:22. | :08:24. | |
fight. I am not sure that is quite the face. There is a framework in | :08:25. | :08:28. | |
place to allow political parties to decide what to do. We have a | :08:29. | :08:33. | |
Scottish Government that could raise 50% of its revenue. No future | :08:34. | :08:37. | |
governments will have to make decisions on how to spend it. We | :08:38. | :08:41. | |
will back with you in a moment. Now, MSPs will scrutinise plans | :08:42. | :08:43. | |
for next year's budget When it's passed, they will have | :08:44. | :08:45. | |
set a Scottish Rate Let's cross over to the chamber now | :08:46. | :08:49. | |
and hear from the Finance Secretary, The rate of tax paid by Scottish | :08:50. | :09:04. | |
residents by 2016-17 will be the same as it is today. Our decisions | :09:05. | :09:07. | |
have been based on the principles I set out in earlier legislation and | :09:08. | :09:11. | |
are designed to deliver a coherent framework. The first decision on | :09:12. | :09:16. | |
setting a rate of income tax in Scotland has been one of substance | :09:17. | :09:20. | |
and one that has required me to bounce the opportunities and risks | :09:21. | :09:24. | |
presented by new tax powers. It has not been about addressing proposals | :09:25. | :09:30. | |
without looking at how they will be implemented and the effects on | :09:31. | :09:38. | |
individuals. With land and buildings transition tax, the first tax | :09:39. | :09:41. | |
devolved to this parliament in 300 years, I delivered a progressive | :09:42. | :09:45. | |
regime were the UK Government had passed up the opportunity to look at | :09:46. | :09:52. | |
that reform in the past. It is not sufficient justification for | :09:53. | :09:58. | |
increasing the tax burden on the lowest paying taxpayers. Taxes must | :09:59. | :10:00. | |
be promotion it to the ability to pay and I stress the ability to pay. | :10:01. | :10:06. | |
It will be limited reassurance to our pensioners or our newly | :10:07. | :10:12. | |
qualified teachers know that people in higher incomes will be paying | :10:13. | :10:15. | |
more than they will be, as we see their weekly budget under strain. | :10:16. | :10:19. | |
They will not kill others are being more, they will care that they will | :10:20. | :10:24. | |
have to pay more. That is not a burden I am willing to impose in | :10:25. | :10:34. | |
this budget. -- they will not be interested. Because of these | :10:35. | :10:38. | |
financial straitjacket, we are now imposing these cuts. A senior SNP | :10:39. | :10:43. | |
councillor spoke out today warning about cuts to music, to school | :10:44. | :10:49. | |
transport, but also to vulnerable children. Is he listening to anybody | :10:50. | :10:52. | |
about these cuts to local authorities? For -- it is for | :10:53. | :11:01. | |
individual authorities to take decisions about their own budgets. | :11:02. | :11:07. | |
If I look at some of the examples that he cites in the list he is just | :11:08. | :11:12. | |
given there, these are often the options that are circulated before | :11:13. | :11:19. | |
council meetings. When councils take their decisions, they reject these | :11:20. | :11:22. | |
options that are put before them. That is what is happened around | :11:23. | :11:24. | |
countless laboratories around the country. If it is for local councils | :11:25. | :11:32. | |
to make their own decisions about how to manage these cuts, why isn't | :11:33. | :11:37. | |
it also for local councils to make their own decisions about tax rates | :11:38. | :11:42. | |
that should be set locally? Because the government has a commitment to | :11:43. | :11:47. | |
freeze the council tax for the duration of this government, and | :11:48. | :11:49. | |
we're determined to ensure that we deliver the commitment to the people | :11:50. | :11:54. | |
of Scotland that we given a 2011 elections. Governments that keep | :11:55. | :11:56. | |
their policies respected by the public. Instead of increasing the | :11:57. | :12:04. | |
tax burden, this budget protects house called incomes, provides | :12:05. | :12:06. | |
leadership across the country by assuming that over 50,000 of | :12:07. | :12:11. | |
Scotland's lowest workers receive a pay rise and earn at least a living | :12:12. | :12:20. | |
edge. Given that tens of thousands of public sector jobs are going to | :12:21. | :12:25. | |
be lost as a result of this budget, regardless of whose fault it is, | :12:26. | :12:28. | |
given that tens of thousands of jobs are going to be lost, will the Dev T | :12:29. | :12:35. | |
First Minister consider setting up an emergency tax forced to help | :12:36. | :12:38. | |
these people get other jobs? -- deputy. The claims about public | :12:39. | :12:44. | |
sector employment are exaggerated. That is what I think about in this | :12:45. | :12:51. | |
debate. And I will cite the evidence for that. Order! In the last 12 | :12:52. | :12:57. | |
months, the number of jobs lost in the public sector in Scotland in the | :12:58. | :13:02. | |
devolved public sector has spent 500. 0.1... That is the context I | :13:03. | :13:14. | |
would put on the point is that Mr Reilly has raised with me in the | :13:15. | :13:21. | |
debate today. This budget ensures that over -- older citizens can | :13:22. | :13:25. | |
access free personal care in an integrated health and social gives | :13:26. | :13:30. | |
system. The prescription tax is abolished, saving those with | :13:31. | :13:35. | |
long-term illnesses around ?104 a year. Countries around the country | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
will benefit from free school meals and 600 hours of early learning in | :13:40. | :13:46. | |
childcare, saving ?707 per child per year and council tax is frozen for | :13:47. | :13:50. | |
the ninth consecutive year, saving the average household around ?1550 | :13:51. | :13:56. | |
over the course of this parliament and we continue as a government to | :13:57. | :14:00. | |
mitigate the most damaging effects of the UK Government s' welfare | :14:01. | :14:04. | |
cuts. That is what this government is doing to protect household income | :14:05. | :14:08. | |
in Scotland, and that is what is implicit in the budget reform | :14:09. | :14:18. | |
Parliament today. -- before Parliament today. what he feels | :14:19. | :14:21. | |
about the Clackmannanshire SNP budget which was passed last week, | :14:22. | :14:27. | |
which imposed a 7.1% cut on every single third sector organisation, | :14:28. | :14:33. | |
primarily supporting self-management in health conditions but also | :14:34. | :14:39. | |
children. If you take into account RPI, that is in real terms a cut of | :14:40. | :14:44. | |
8.4%. Is that what he does approve of? What I would say to Doctor | :14:45. | :14:50. | |
Simpson is that individual local authorities must make their choices | :14:51. | :14:54. | |
within the resources available to them, but I am also entitled to | :14:55. | :14:58. | |
insist upon the need to freeze the council tax, about the need to | :14:59. | :15:02. | |
invest in health and social care and its integration with ?250 million of | :15:03. | :15:09. | |
new investment. Is Doctor Simpson against that investment and also | :15:10. | :15:13. | |
ensuring that the Government takes steps to protect the delivery of | :15:14. | :15:17. | |
education at local authority level? To which I now come in my remarks. | :15:18. | :15:20. | |
We'll be back with that debate shortly, but first, | :15:21. | :15:22. | |
I'm joined from Holyrood's Garden Lobby by the Conservative Alex | :15:23. | :15:27. | |
Liam McArthur from the Liberal Democrats and Linda Fabiani | :15:28. | :15:30. | |
There they are, all neatly arranged. I think we just missed what John | :15:31. | :15:43. | |
Swinney was about to say about money for pupils do you know anything | :15:44. | :15:48. | |
about that? No, I'm afraid I do not. I was hoping to get up there to | :15:49. | :15:53. | |
learn about it. What you are hoping for is some sort of commitment to do | :15:54. | :15:59. | |
something about Nicola Sturgeon and her personal issue about the | :16:00. | :16:04. | |
attainment gap? Absolutely. She has made it a personal issue. She feels | :16:05. | :16:08. | |
very strongly about it and I think that is a general feeling right | :16:09. | :16:11. | |
across the Chamber so I am sure there will be something in there | :16:12. | :16:14. | |
that will help us to achieve that and monitor its properly and make | :16:15. | :16:18. | |
sure that we really do make a difference. And Iain Gray, if John | :16:19. | :16:24. | |
Swinney does come up with extra money or the pupil premium as some | :16:25. | :16:28. | |
call it, you presumably will say that is fantastic, well done, and | :16:29. | :16:33. | |
now we do not need to put the income tax up? Well, you will have to come | :16:34. | :16:37. | |
up with quite a lot. You can't pretend to be investing in closing | :16:38. | :16:40. | |
the attainment gap in our schools while you're cutting hundreds of | :16:41. | :16:43. | |
millions of pounds from the budgets of the council to deliver those | :16:44. | :16:46. | |
skills and let's not forget this budget in real terms cut colleges | :16:47. | :16:52. | |
and universities as well, so it was only last week that we asked the | :16:53. | :16:56. | |
Scottish Government to commit to protect education budgets and they | :16:57. | :17:00. | |
simply refuse to do so. Alex Johnson, what do you make of this? | :17:01. | :17:06. | |
Would you like to see taxes cut? At the moment, I think it is | :17:07. | :17:10. | |
inappropriate for us to be speaking about cutting taxes but that is a | :17:11. | :17:13. | |
prospect that exists with the new power as that were agreed under the | :17:14. | :17:16. | |
fiscal framework yesterday. What we have to remember is the most | :17:17. | :17:19. | |
important thing for Scotland is that we went in the stability of the | :17:20. | :17:22. | |
economy and the most important thing to do that is not started writing | :17:23. | :17:26. | |
more money out of eight by increasing taxation so one of the | :17:27. | :17:30. | |
positives that John Swinney has put forward in this budget is keeping | :17:31. | :17:34. | |
the Scottish rate of income tax at 10p so that we do not pay any more | :17:35. | :17:38. | |
than they do anywhere else in Britain. Sorry, as a conservative, | :17:39. | :17:43. | |
just explain to me why think it is inappropriate to be speaking about | :17:44. | :17:47. | |
tax cuts now. I think there is a time in an economic cycle when | :17:48. | :17:50. | |
cutting the burden of taxation on the economy as a whole will boost | :17:51. | :17:53. | |
growth and will increase production and employment but we are at the | :17:54. | :17:57. | |
point is now it is vital that while we are under pressure to finance | :17:58. | :18:02. | |
public services that we have a sensible, balanced budget, and in | :18:03. | :18:05. | |
that respect, that is one of the things that John Swinney is actually | :18:06. | :18:08. | |
delivering today. Liam McArthur, would you accept that should John | :18:09. | :18:13. | |
Swinney come up with a substantial amount of cash to channel in the | :18:14. | :18:18. | |
direction of schools, then we do not need to have our taxes put up? I | :18:19. | :18:23. | |
will need to see the detail of it. If he goes down the route of a pupil | :18:24. | :18:27. | |
premium, attaching the funding to the needs of the individual child | :18:28. | :18:30. | |
rather than the approach taken today which has been on an area basis | :18:31. | :18:34. | |
which had excluded 11 local authorities and many schools right | :18:35. | :18:39. | |
across the country, that would be a welcome change and approach from the | :18:40. | :18:43. | |
Government, but I think what we need to see is the detail of it and where | :18:44. | :18:49. | |
that money will come from. We are seeing ?500 million of cuts being | :18:50. | :18:51. | |
placed upon local authorities. We are seeing evidence of what that | :18:52. | :18:56. | |
means in terms of the cuts to local services, whether in terms of loss | :18:57. | :19:02. | |
of staff in our schools, whether it be increased costs for transport, | :19:03. | :19:05. | |
for school meals, for music tuition and the like, and therefore what we | :19:06. | :19:11. | |
need to do is see this in the right, but if we go down the route of a | :19:12. | :19:14. | |
pupil premium and recognise that there are children in need, children | :19:15. | :19:18. | |
in poverty in every community across the country, not just those elected | :19:19. | :19:23. | |
by ministers, that will be a step in the right direction. But the trouble | :19:24. | :19:28. | |
is you would equate cuts to local authorities with cuts to schools. | :19:29. | :19:33. | |
Local authorities, as both John Swinney and David Cameron have been | :19:34. | :19:37. | |
saying, can make efficiencies. I keep coming back to this point. The | :19:38. | :19:45. | |
head of COSLA was on the Sunday Politics in a few weeks ago and | :19:46. | :19:48. | |
conceded that the budgets over the past few years had not really meant | :19:49. | :19:51. | |
a decline in the quality of service. He argued that any more cuts would, | :19:52. | :19:56. | |
but the point is that there is no evidence that people find public | :19:57. | :19:59. | |
services any less good than they were five years ago. I think you | :20:00. | :20:02. | |
answered your own question. I think what we have seen is cuts being made | :20:03. | :20:07. | |
where they can't efficiencies, but we are at a stage now where the | :20:08. | :20:12. | |
effect of a ?500 million cut is to dig into services so that they are | :20:13. | :20:15. | |
removed entirely or are being charged for or they are badly | :20:16. | :20:21. | |
affected. What we are saying is we have powers in this Parliament to do | :20:22. | :20:25. | |
something about it and a penny on income tax would deliver ?475 | :20:26. | :20:28. | |
million that could be invested in education and let's not forget, most | :20:29. | :20:33. | |
of what councils do is in education and children's services. Linda, if | :20:34. | :20:39. | |
we can do a quick pan across to you. This is reminding us here in the | :20:40. | :20:44. | |
studio, it is a challenge for us in the studio, of that David Frost | :20:45. | :20:53. | |
sketch with John Cleese in it. John Swinney has said that councils can | :20:54. | :20:56. | |
make efficiency savings and don't necessarily have to cut schools. | :20:57. | :21:00. | |
Yes, and I think that is absolutely right and I also have to say I think | :21:01. | :21:04. | |
the Liberal Democrats in particular have a blooming cheek speaking about | :21:05. | :21:08. | |
cuts when they and the Tories presided over a whole Westminster | :21:09. | :21:12. | |
Parliament of cuts which meant that a lot of the Scottish budget hat to | :21:13. | :21:16. | |
go to mitigation. We are mitigating the excess and then when you look at | :21:17. | :21:25. | |
what is happening, yes, we could have efficiency savings. Liam after | :21:26. | :21:32. | |
is behind you. Yes, he is muttering away. These things are about | :21:33. | :21:38. | |
choices. You have chosen to fun things like free prescription | :21:39. | :21:41. | |
charges by cutting local authority bust budgets. You could choose to | :21:42. | :21:46. | |
put prescription charges back on. Arguably, free prescription charges | :21:47. | :21:51. | |
only benefit the middle classes, and spend the proceeds in schools. You | :21:52. | :21:55. | |
cannot say it is only the fault of London. These are choices that you | :21:56. | :21:59. | |
have made. Yes, anything we have made the right choices. I believe in | :22:00. | :22:02. | |
universality of certain basic services. That is what my party | :22:03. | :22:05. | |
believes in. It is absolute the gristle. When you look at what we | :22:06. | :22:08. | |
are doing, we look at health and social care, that is major. I defy | :22:09. | :22:13. | |
anyone to look at their own local authority and say that there cannot | :22:14. | :22:16. | |
be efficiencies made. We all know there can be. They have to make | :22:17. | :22:20. | |
choices too. There you are, Iain Gray. Can we get to Iain Gray? There | :22:21. | :22:26. | |
he is. Just hack a bit more of efficiency savings. I do not accept | :22:27. | :22:31. | |
the premise of your original question because it is not true to | :22:32. | :22:34. | |
say that services have not suffered and if you look at schools alone, we | :22:35. | :22:40. | |
have 4500 fewer teachers in our schools which saw figures last week | :22:41. | :22:44. | |
showing there had been a drop of a third in teachers in nursery schools | :22:45. | :22:47. | |
in early years, we have seen literacy and new Morrissey skills | :22:48. | :22:53. | |
fall, class sizes increasing. -- new Morrissey. -- numeracy. So it is not | :22:54. | :23:05. | |
conceivable to suggest that you can cut hundreds of millions of pounds | :23:06. | :23:08. | |
cumulatively and in a single year, this year, from local authority | :23:09. | :23:12. | |
budgets, when schools are such a big part of what they do, without having | :23:13. | :23:16. | |
an impact on the future of our children and grandchildren. Why it | :23:17. | :23:26. | |
-- what would your reply to that be? They are having to implement | :23:27. | :23:33. | |
austerity. We are looking at an extraordinary position when in a | :23:34. | :23:37. | |
year when inflation has been virtually zero, this budget | :23:38. | :23:41. | |
represents in cash terms and increase, not a decrease. If there | :23:42. | :23:45. | |
are cuts within this budget then these cuts are decisions that were | :23:46. | :23:49. | |
made by this Scottish Government and have been targeted on local | :23:50. | :23:53. | |
authorities and colleges and other services, not because of anything | :23:54. | :23:56. | |
that happened in Westminster, but because of decisions that were made | :23:57. | :24:02. | |
here in Scotland by an SMP -- SNP Scottish Government. The cuts are | :24:03. | :24:06. | |
about this Government and nobody else. We will have to leave it | :24:07. | :24:13. | |
there. We are going to have a last chance to see this marvellous shot | :24:14. | :24:16. | |
of you altogether. Thank you very much. | :24:17. | :24:18. | |
Back to the Chamber where the Scottish Government's budget | :24:19. | :24:20. | |
The Finance Secretary has pledged not to change income tax rates, | :24:21. | :24:24. | |
but following criticism from opposition parties Mr Swinney | :24:25. | :24:26. | |
has made an effort to help reduce the educational attainment gap | :24:27. | :24:28. | |
by offering a cash boost to schools for disadvantaged pupils. | :24:29. | :24:31. | |
Labour leader Kezia Dugdale is on her feet now. | :24:32. | :24:42. | |
Kezia Dugdale is not giving way at the moment. I say to Mr Stewart that | :24:43. | :24:49. | |
he should listen to the facts before he ignores them anyway. Analysis | :24:50. | :24:57. | |
from spice shows that out of every pound raised by this measure, 92p | :24:58. | :25:01. | |
will come from the top half of earners. Two thirds come from the | :25:02. | :25:08. | |
top 20% of earners. And those SNP MSPs who told us that an entirely | :25:09. | :25:13. | |
new state could be established in 18 months now tell us that a simple | :25:14. | :25:17. | |
flat rate payment of ?100 could not be paid until the new powers come | :25:18. | :25:29. | |
in. Oh, go on. Mr Stewart. Thank you, presiding officer. We have yet | :25:30. | :25:33. | |
to hear from the Labour Party after many, many requests how that rebate | :25:34. | :25:38. | |
scheme is actually going to work. Maybe Kezia Dugdale outline exactly | :25:39. | :25:43. | |
how that is going to work or is she willing to take the gamble of making | :25:44. | :25:48. | |
the poorest in our society pay for their mistake in being unable to | :25:49. | :25:58. | |
deliver that rebate scheme? Order. They tell us it is all too | :25:59. | :26:11. | |
difficult, it can't be done. Council leader after council leader have | :26:12. | :26:14. | |
come out and told us that this cannot be done. Union leader after | :26:15. | :26:18. | |
union leader has said that it is fair. And can I say to them? The | :26:19. | :26:24. | |
expert analysis shows that because of the changes to the personal | :26:25. | :26:29. | |
allowance, even before our ?100 payment, even if you accept that | :26:30. | :26:34. | |
such a simple thing for a single year is all too difficult, even then | :26:35. | :26:42. | |
no one earning under ?19,000 a year will pay a penny more in tax next | :26:43. | :26:50. | |
year than they did this year. The University of Stirling, the | :26:51. | :26:53. | |
resolution foundation, the House of Commons library all confirmed that | :26:54. | :26:57. | |
the riches would pay a higher amount in percentage terms and in cash | :26:58. | :27:03. | |
terms. That is a progressive policy. First Minister. F for a moment I can | :27:04. | :27:13. | |
assume she manages to get the ?100 to low income households, can she | :27:14. | :27:16. | |
confirmed today will any of that ?100 be God back in tax or tax | :27:17. | :27:22. | |
credits? It is a simple question. Can we get a simple answer? It is | :27:23. | :27:26. | |
quite clear that it is protected from tax. Look at the experts. | :27:27. | :27:35. | |
Order, order! Come 2017, the First Minister will have the power to do | :27:36. | :27:40. | |
this. Is she still opposed to it? Is it the detail? Order! Kezia Dugdale, | :27:41. | :27:48. | |
would you sit down for one seconds please? Mr Swinney was heard in | :27:49. | :27:54. | |
almost perfect silence, please. Please can we extend the same | :27:55. | :27:59. | |
courtesy to Kezia Dugdale. Please proceed. Such is the weight of | :28:00. | :28:03. | |
evidence that those searching for reasons to oppose her plans now | :28:04. | :28:07. | |
scrabble in the dirt for excuses not to do the right thing. Each time | :28:08. | :28:15. | |
this has been raised in this Parliament, the First Minister and | :28:16. | :28:18. | |
the Deputy First Minister talk low paid workers that the lowest paid | :28:19. | :28:21. | |
will pay more than higher earners. For them to do this, when they know | :28:22. | :28:27. | |
that the richest will pay more than 100 times more than the lower paid, | :28:28. | :28:32. | |
it is beneath the office that they hold. | :28:33. | :28:40. | |
It is just plain wrong. The second thing, this is now beyond doubt, | :28:41. | :28:49. | |
this budget will inflict unnecessary pain on every community in Scotland. | :28:50. | :28:55. | |
Almost unbelievably the Deputy First Minister told this government that | :28:56. | :28:59. | |
the cuts in this budget would have a minimal impact. You need only read | :29:00. | :29:04. | |
the front pages of any local newspaper, top to any teacher, he | :29:05. | :29:11. | |
did not speak to the hundreds of trade unionists that assembled | :29:12. | :29:15. | |
outside this parliament a lunchtime today, to understand how utterly | :29:16. | :29:19. | |
divorced from reality that position has become. Because the terrible | :29:20. | :29:23. | |
toll of these cuts are there and black-and-white in the budgets being | :29:24. | :29:27. | |
passed with heavy, heavy Hearts by local councillors of all political | :29:28. | :29:32. | |
colours. Here are some of those choices, 170 jobs lost in Angus this | :29:33. | :29:37. | |
week. Clackmannanshire will consider cutting 150 posts, Highland 252. | :29:38. | :29:46. | |
Across Scotland, thousands of workers losing their jobs, cleaners, | :29:47. | :29:51. | |
supply teachers, early years staff. Some ghoul librarians sacked in | :29:52. | :29:55. | |
Argyll and Bute. English and maths teachers cut. -- in the Deputy First | :29:56. | :30:06. | |
Minister's first -- own backyard, they have cut support for families | :30:07. | :30:13. | |
with additional support needs with more cuts across the country. They | :30:14. | :30:17. | |
can put whatever spin they want on these cuts. They can really them, | :30:18. | :30:20. | |
they can re-badge them, they can even be profiled on. But they cannot | :30:21. | :30:27. | |
deny that these cuts are real and that they are painful. The final | :30:28. | :30:31. | |
thing that has been clear since the start of this process is that our | :30:32. | :30:35. | |
proposal is the only alternative to these cuts. Why? Because we cannot | :30:36. | :30:41. | |
escape the responsibility of the choice we are faced with. Will we | :30:42. | :30:45. | |
use powers, the powers we came together to demand, or will we | :30:46. | :30:52. | |
accept cuts? Scottish Labour cannot do anything other than argue to use | :30:53. | :30:54. | |
those powers. It is never others to search their own conscience. | :30:55. | :30:59. | |
Earlier this morning the Finance committee heard from John Swinney. | :31:00. | :31:10. | |
He says that it can be no detriment to Scotland and he can recommend the | :31:11. | :31:16. | |
Scotland Bill for further consent. This is what he had to say to the | :31:17. | :31:20. | |
finance committee. Under this proposal there will not be a single | :31:21. | :31:24. | |
penny of detriment to the Scottish Government's budget. The UK | :31:25. | :31:32. | |
Government will guarantee the outcome of the Scottish Government's | :31:33. | :31:38. | |
preferred funding model, per Capita index model, is used in each of | :31:39. | :31:41. | |
these years. Alongside this there will be a review that will be | :31:42. | :31:44. | |
informed by an independent report with recommendations represented to | :31:45. | :31:50. | |
the governments at the end of 2021. It will not include or assume the | :31:51. | :31:57. | |
method for adjusting the block grant for this period. The two governments | :31:58. | :32:01. | |
will be required to jointly agree that method as part of the review | :32:02. | :32:03. | |
and this must deliver results consistent with the Smith Commission | :32:04. | :32:10. | |
's recommendations, including taxpayer furnace, and the principle | :32:11. | :32:13. | |
of no detriment. This secures no detriment now and for the next six | :32:14. | :32:18. | |
years. And we have ensured that there can be no detriment imposed on | :32:19. | :32:23. | |
Scotland at any point in the future. On capital borrowing we have | :32:24. | :32:29. | |
increased the Scottish borrowing limits to ?3 billion. Cumulatively | :32:30. | :32:31. | |
?3 billion worth than your flexible to 50% of that. This increases are | :32:32. | :32:44. | |
annual borrowing facilities to invest in infrastructure. On | :32:45. | :32:46. | |
resource borrowing, we will receive the powers necessary to manage tax | :32:47. | :32:50. | |
volatility by increasing the resource borrowing limit set by the | :32:51. | :32:56. | |
Scotland act, as well as introducing a new reserve. The aggregate annual | :32:57. | :33:04. | |
limit for forecast error and economic shock will be set at 600 | :33:05. | :33:07. | |
million. The overall resource debt will be one point 7 million. We have | :33:08. | :33:17. | |
agreed a one-off payment of ?200 million to support implementation | :33:18. | :33:22. | |
costs and ongoing funding of ?66 million per annum. The committee | :33:23. | :33:26. | |
will be keen to hear that I have also agreed the Scottish fiscal | :33:27. | :33:30. | |
commission will produce the official forecast of GDP and tax revenues and | :33:31. | :33:34. | |
I will bring forward appropriate amendments at stage three of the | :33:35. | :33:38. | |
commission and bill to give effect to these provisions. This forms the | :33:39. | :33:42. | |
basis of the fiscal framework that is true to the principles of Smith. | :33:43. | :33:46. | |
It will ensure the deal for Scotland cannot be changed within the | :33:47. | :33:50. | |
Scottish Government's agreement, protects the Barnett formula, and | :33:51. | :33:53. | |
allow the powers in the Scotland Bill to be delivered. I am acutely | :33:54. | :33:59. | |
aware that none of the details are in front of the committee today. | :34:00. | :34:03. | |
Once they are published, they will appear before the committee if it is | :34:04. | :34:06. | |
their wish to look at the further detail when it is published to the | :34:07. | :34:11. | |
course of the week. Thank you for that opening statement. I think we | :34:12. | :34:16. | |
are delighted an agreement has been reached. You spoke to a number of | :34:17. | :34:20. | |
areas. The Scottish Government did not compromise. In terms of | :34:21. | :34:28. | |
borrowing there have been some compromise. I wonder if there are | :34:29. | :34:32. | |
further compromises that have been made that you may wide -- quantifies | :34:33. | :34:38. | |
the committee of? In the process of the negotiations, the Scottish | :34:39. | :34:45. | |
Government has advanced particular propositions when we were trying to | :34:46. | :34:51. | |
secure the agreement. For example, on borrowing, I argued for a higher | :34:52. | :34:56. | |
limit than ?3 billion, but I accepted that there had to be the | :34:57. | :35:04. | |
Smith commission requires this army, that the borrowing commission | :35:05. | :35:06. | |
arrangement had to be consistent with that of the United Kingdom. -- | :35:07. | :35:15. | |
requires that. I have to accept that there are constraining factors and | :35:16. | :35:23. | |
are -- we have to live within them. I have compromised on the degree to | :35:24. | :35:29. | |
which the annual constraints within capital borrowing and a variety of | :35:30. | :35:35. | |
other issues. Fundamentally, I think you have to take a step back from | :35:36. | :35:43. | |
the conclusions and say in the round, is this a reasonable package | :35:44. | :35:46. | |
that can be recommended to Parliament. And that my basis for | :35:47. | :35:47. | |
them is Our political correspondent | :35:48. | :35:48. | |
Andrew Kerr joins me Is that it? Mostly happy. There is | :35:49. | :36:04. | |
almost a sense about a feeling of the morning after the night before. | :36:05. | :36:09. | |
You heard Kenny Gibson saying that everyone is relieved that a deal has | :36:10. | :36:15. | |
been done. When he appeared before the devolution committee yesterday | :36:16. | :36:17. | |
morning, I think he was thinking that a deal might not be done at | :36:18. | :36:23. | |
that stage. But there were more than calls during the course of the day, | :36:24. | :36:26. | |
the Chancellor spoke to Nicola Sturgeon and eventually a deal was | :36:27. | :36:30. | |
done. Most people are probably happy. There has been compromise on | :36:31. | :36:36. | |
both sides I would say. It looks like the UK Treasury maybe didn't | :36:37. | :36:39. | |
get their way. There is talk about the initial call about the ?7 | :36:40. | :36:44. | |
billion of cuts over ten years, whether that was the negotiating | :36:45. | :36:47. | |
position or not, we are not quite sure. Now the Scottish Government | :36:48. | :36:54. | |
have had to adopt the Treasury's adopted model of funding. But with | :36:55. | :37:00. | |
making sure that there will be no doubt on to the Scottish budget for | :37:01. | :37:07. | |
the next five years. Interesting as well, there was a row about this | :37:08. | :37:12. | |
only are you few weeks ago. They have accepted that there will be a | :37:13. | :37:16. | |
Scottish version of the Office for Budget Responsibility or sober as we | :37:17. | :37:22. | |
have decided to call it in the studio, that will set the forecast | :37:23. | :37:27. | |
independently of the government, which John Swinney will have to then | :37:28. | :37:32. | |
bases budget around. That was our back track, a compromise, that is | :37:33. | :37:36. | |
what Labour were calling it in the finance committee today. Previously | :37:37. | :37:41. | |
John Swinney did not want these independent forecasts. But the UK | :37:42. | :37:44. | |
Treasury were keen to have the fiscal commission checking, setting | :37:45. | :37:51. | |
out the forecast, GDP and revenue and so on, because when it comes to | :37:52. | :37:55. | |
that review I mentioned, that is going to be fairly critical, just | :37:56. | :38:01. | |
who will decide on whether the preferred model is working or not, | :38:02. | :38:03. | |
and Lott should be the way forward from that. In the House of Commons | :38:04. | :38:09. | |
earlier, David Mandel put appointed criticism when he was saying that | :38:10. | :38:15. | |
many people like to see themselves in Scotland as independent, but | :38:16. | :38:18. | |
perhaps they are not really. -- David Mundell. Perhaps the Scottish | :38:19. | :38:26. | |
Government would like to see this feeding into the current model they | :38:27. | :38:32. | |
have chosen. Andrew, how should we take this? Is this a fantastically | :38:33. | :38:36. | |
bit of diplomacy that has finessed everything and there can be a review | :38:37. | :38:41. | |
and enamoured call discussion in five years? Or have they kicked | :38:42. | :38:46. | |
everything into the long grass? There has been a process of | :38:47. | :38:50. | |
negotiation. Everyone here are surprised. It has just taken so | :38:51. | :38:56. | |
long. They started these initial discussions back in March, I | :38:57. | :38:59. | |
remember waiting outside Saint Andrews house in September. The | :39:00. | :39:06. | |
chief of the secretary was going into the talks. -- Treasury. It has | :39:07. | :39:15. | |
been kicked into the long grass. Six years from now we will have to go | :39:16. | :39:17. | |
through this whole process again. Nicola surgeon was yesterday quite | :39:18. | :39:21. | |
clear to point out who knows what the setup may be in five or six | :39:22. | :39:29. | |
years' time. She was saying, she wants an independent Scotland. Who | :39:30. | :39:32. | |
knows what it might be like. Moray Macdonald is | :39:33. | :39:37. | |
still here with me. Kezia Dugdale looked very fired up. | :39:38. | :39:48. | |
She looked on form today and being very forthright and putting argument | :39:49. | :39:55. | |
across. She is still fighting this idea of putting up income tax by 1p. | :39:56. | :40:02. | |
You can see the politics of this. Labour are trying to... Johann | :40:03. | :40:12. | |
Lamont said we now need to ask people to listen to what we're | :40:13. | :40:15. | |
saying. That is the stage we are at. That is what they're trying to do. | :40:16. | :40:21. | |
We are a left-wing party. And we are to the left of the SNP and put a bit | :40:22. | :40:25. | |
of clear blue water between them. That will be interesting, whether | :40:26. | :40:34. | |
that has, if it will be attractive to people. Will it? Labour's | :40:35. | :40:40. | |
challenge is that they do have to try and do something a bit | :40:41. | :40:44. | |
different, a bit creative, so the public listen to them. The public | :40:45. | :40:47. | |
are apparently not listening to Labour. I am not convinced that a 1p | :40:48. | :40:55. | |
tax rise is going to turn people. You heard earlier one of the MSTs | :40:56. | :41:02. | |
saying that the economy is not ready for... There was a view that Ruth | :41:03. | :41:10. | |
Davidson would go into the next Scottish elections going vote Tory | :41:11. | :41:15. | |
and we will cut your taxes. Exactly. The opposite side of that is that | :41:16. | :41:20. | |
the economy and people are not ready for a tax increase. Many families | :41:21. | :41:25. | |
are still struggling, living hand to mouth on a monthly basis. A tax rise | :41:26. | :41:29. | |
would hurt middle-class Scotland quite dramatically. There will be | :41:30. | :41:36. | |
another political row, controversy, because of this deal that has been | :41:37. | :41:40. | |
done. Presumably, some of the physician parties are going to say, | :41:41. | :41:44. | |
we can start messing around with the tax bands, under the powers that may | :41:45. | :41:50. | |
be coming in 2017. That means vacancy, we will put more tax on | :41:51. | :41:58. | |
higher tax rate payers. But George Osborne has proposed to raise the | :41:59. | :42:04. | |
rate from where you pay 40p. They could say, we are not going to do | :42:05. | :42:09. | |
that. During the election campaign, we're going to see many ways of how | :42:10. | :42:16. | |
you can raise tax, cut tax. One of the things that was interesting | :42:17. | :42:21. | |
today, David Mundell turned around and said I am expecting the Scottish | :42:22. | :42:25. | |
Parliament to use these powers straight after the election. John | :42:26. | :42:29. | |
Swinney said, hang on, it will take us a while to do this. I found | :42:30. | :42:40. | |
rather weird, because one month from today was going to be Independence | :42:41. | :42:43. | |
Day. Given that the election may happen in May, those new powers will | :42:44. | :42:46. | |
come during the term of that government. It is not unreasonable | :42:47. | :42:51. | |
to ask whatever party is in power, what they will do with these birds | :42:52. | :42:55. | |
during the election campaign. What will be exciting on that front, for | :42:56. | :42:59. | |
the first time, the Scottish Government -- public will get a | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
choice. We have been told for so long that Scotland is up for more | :43:04. | :43:11. | |
tax to pay for more services. I am not convinced that is true. Now we | :43:12. | :43:14. | |
will see if that is what the public want. | :43:15. | :43:17. | |
And now to this week's Prime Ministers Questions, | :43:18. | :43:18. | |
where the Labour leader pressed the Prime Minister | :43:19. | :43:20. | |
over his government's dispute with junior doctors over | :43:21. | :43:22. | |
Though it's not an issue that affects us here in Scotland, | :43:23. | :43:26. | |
there were plenty questions raised that do affect us, | :43:27. | :43:28. | |
from the new devolution deal to the state of our oil industry. | :43:29. | :43:35. | |
The NHS staff survey purchased yesterday shows that nine out of ten | :43:36. | :43:40. | |
junior doctors already work extra hours beyond their normal contract. | :43:41. | :43:43. | |
The survey also showed falling morale amongst these vital group of | :43:44. | :43:49. | |
staff. What does the Prime Minister think the Health Secretary's veto of | :43:50. | :43:54. | |
a deal and imposition of a contract would do to their morale? First of | :43:55. | :43:59. | |
all, the Health Secretary did not veto a deal. What matters is making | :44:00. | :44:03. | |
sure we can have a genuine, seven-day NHS. What I say to junior | :44:04. | :44:08. | |
doctor is an old junior doctor working those hours will receive a | :44:09. | :44:12. | |
pay cut, this contract will not impose longer hours. In fact, it has | :44:13. | :44:17. | |
tougher safeguards to make sure that introduces the hours that worked. | :44:18. | :44:21. | |
We'll be Prime Minister congratulate the Scottish element and his own | :44:22. | :44:24. | |
colleagues who secured a deal on financial arrangements for the next | :44:25. | :44:28. | |
phase of Scottish devolution? The Treasury position initially in data | :44:29. | :44:33. | |
?7 million -- ?7 billion of public funding. That was reduced to ?3 | :44:34. | :44:38. | |
billion and then yesterday ?2.5 billion. What change the mind of the | :44:39. | :44:42. | |
Treasury and help them agree to a deal that will make Scotland nor | :44:43. | :44:48. | |
less worse off? Let me agree with the right honourable gentleman. This | :44:49. | :44:51. | |
is an excellent deal for Scotland, but it is also an excellent deal for | :44:52. | :44:56. | |
the UK, are those of us who want to keep the UK together, what we have | :44:57. | :45:00. | |
just demonstrated is that you can have school on devolution with a | :45:01. | :45:05. | |
powerhouse parliament, with a fair fiscal settlement, inside the UK and | :45:06. | :45:09. | |
that is something to be celebrated. Now we will move to the situation | :45:10. | :45:13. | |
where the Scottish Government and the Scottish parliament will have to | :45:14. | :45:16. | |
start talking about policies and decisions rather than processors, | :45:17. | :45:20. | |
but I am happy that the negotiations went as they did and I am happy we | :45:21. | :45:24. | |
have a good outcome and I'm happy that Lord Smith, who was responsible | :45:25. | :45:28. | |
for so much of this, but out a statement saying that this delivers | :45:29. | :45:33. | |
the principles in full, so no more grievance, no more fussing about | :45:34. | :45:37. | |
process, no more arguments about the arrangements, now it is time to get | :45:38. | :45:45. | |
on and governed. Angus Robertson. And we are indebted to John Swinney | :45:46. | :45:51. | |
and Nicola Sturgeon for securing a no detriment deal for Scotland. The | :45:52. | :45:55. | |
Prime Minister is right that all parties will have two layout there | :45:56. | :45:58. | |
are plans in advance of the May election. So Kitty answer this | :45:59. | :46:03. | |
question? Is it actually true that in this time of posterity, his | :46:04. | :46:08. | |
party, the Conservative Party, is planning tax cuts for higher earners | :46:09. | :46:13. | |
in Scotland? It will be Ruth Davidson who is the only proper | :46:14. | :46:17. | |
opposition figure in Scotland will be setting out the plans. If you are | :46:18. | :46:21. | |
worried in Scotland is about having a bit of a 1-party state and a lack | :46:22. | :46:26. | |
of accountability, if you think that the Labour Party in Scotland has | :46:27. | :46:30. | |
lost its way, there is only one choice and that is raised. But I | :46:31. | :46:34. | |
will say this. I think there are opportunities to cut taxes. There | :46:35. | :46:38. | |
are opportunities to shop in incentives. There are opportunities | :46:39. | :46:41. | |
to attract businesses and people into Scotland and I am sure that | :46:42. | :46:45. | |
Ruth Davidson will be making those arguments, and as she does, whatever | :46:46. | :46:49. | |
she decides, she will have my full and unequivocal support. The | :46:50. | :46:56. | |
Scottish Government, trade unions and oil and gas UK are calling for | :46:57. | :47:00. | |
reductions to the headline rate of tax to support the industry in its | :47:01. | :47:04. | |
hour of need. Yet instead of the so-called broad shoulders of the UK, | :47:05. | :47:08. | |
what we see are the sloping shoulders of the Prime Minister | :47:09. | :47:13. | |
repeatedly dodging his responsibilities. Will she commit to | :47:14. | :47:17. | |
reduce the tax level on oil and gas and help this vital industry? First | :47:18. | :47:23. | |
of all, in the budget last year, we reduce the burden of tax on oil and | :47:24. | :47:27. | |
gas, something we were able to do because of the broad shoulders of | :47:28. | :47:31. | |
the UK. And now let us just examine what has happened since that time. | :47:32. | :47:38. | |
Oil and gas revenues are down 94%. If there were not the broad | :47:39. | :47:43. | |
shoulders of the UK Government, if instead this was a genuinely | :47:44. | :47:47. | |
fiscally independent Scotland, there would be a massive black hole in | :47:48. | :47:51. | |
your budget. You would be cutting welfare, you'll be cutting spending, | :47:52. | :47:55. | |
you would be putting up taxes, you would be facing a financial | :47:56. | :47:56. | |
catastrophe. Our Westminster correspondent | :47:57. | :47:57. | |
David Porter is joined by a quartet David. Garden. Thank you very much. | :47:58. | :48:12. | |
The Scottish and the UK Government's former deal about finances, and Lo | :48:13. | :48:18. | |
and behold, the Sun comes out over Westminster. There must be a moral | :48:19. | :48:23. | |
in there somewhere. As we have been hearing, the fiscal framework made | :48:24. | :48:29. | |
its appearance at PMQs. We will be concentrating our discussion on that | :48:30. | :48:33. | |
this afternoon. Joining me for Labour, Stephen Gethin is for the | :48:34. | :48:42. | |
SNP. From the UK Government's point of view, a good deal? When you can | :48:43. | :48:49. | |
sell the elections? , well I think firstly we should congratulate both | :48:50. | :48:52. | |
governments for reaching an agreement. This is a historic moment | :48:53. | :48:56. | |
for both governments and for both peoples and the whole people of | :48:57. | :49:02. | |
Great Britain. This is a good deal for both peoples. What I would now | :49:03. | :49:07. | |
like to see is moving forward how the powers are going to be used in | :49:08. | :49:12. | |
Scotland for the betterment of the people of Scotland, so it is a good | :49:13. | :49:15. | |
deal and we should congratulate both governments for the hard work they | :49:16. | :49:20. | |
both did to get an agreement. Is there a danger of consensus breaking | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
out here? Everyone congratulating everyone else. If it was that easy, | :49:25. | :49:30. | |
why did it take so long? Well, firstly the big bit of | :49:31. | :49:33. | |
congratulations should go to John Swinney. This is what happens when | :49:34. | :49:44. | |
you have a treasurer like this. A finance secretary who sticks to his | :49:45. | :49:48. | |
guns and can beat the Treasury. Was it a case of there was always going | :49:49. | :49:54. | |
to be a deal and the posturing of it was important was a touch and go | :49:55. | :50:00. | |
until the final moments? I think it might have been touch and go. These | :50:01. | :50:05. | |
negotiations are highly complicated. You're talking about very complex | :50:06. | :50:10. | |
ways of indexation in terms of the block grant and income tax and all | :50:11. | :50:13. | |
those big issues around it and it is quite right that the 2-party start | :50:14. | :50:18. | |
of various ends of the spectrum and they come together. I am glad they | :50:19. | :50:22. | |
have done. We are delighted there is fiscal framework in place now, but | :50:23. | :50:27. | |
we will go back and we will now get on with it utilising those powers. | :50:28. | :50:33. | |
This does make the most powerful devolved parliament in the world. We | :50:34. | :50:38. | |
should use that for the benefit of all Scots. We have been putting a | :50:39. | :50:42. | |
very positive policy platform together and we encourage all other | :50:43. | :50:46. | |
parties to do the same. Let's get political on this. From your party's | :50:47. | :50:51. | |
point of view, does this mean your party leader in Scotland, Ruth | :50:52. | :50:54. | |
Davidson, can now going to lose elections and say we are the | :50:55. | :50:58. | |
Conservatives, we are going to be a tax-cutting party in Scotland? It | :50:59. | :51:02. | |
will be for Ruth Davidson and the party to determine the policies that | :51:03. | :51:05. | |
best meet the needs of the people of Scotland. I don't want to get to | :51:06. | :51:11. | |
political about this. This is about the people of Scotland. Hours are | :51:12. | :51:15. | |
being transferred to the Scottish parliament. As Ian rightly said as | :51:16. | :51:21. | |
well and what we now want to see is the Scottish Parliament is using the | :51:22. | :51:25. | |
wealth of powers that it will now have two better the lives of the | :51:26. | :51:29. | |
people of Scotland, so this is an historic moment. It is a good day | :51:30. | :51:34. | |
that we have this agreement and let's now move forward positively | :51:35. | :51:36. | |
and let the people of Scotland decide. I hope they decide that Ruth | :51:37. | :51:40. | |
Davidson and the Scottish Conservative and Unionist party is | :51:41. | :51:44. | |
the right party, but it will be for the people of Scotland to decide. It | :51:45. | :51:49. | |
is boiling down to it. Now that we have this fiscal framework, with | :51:50. | :51:52. | |
bright school responsibilities, particularly financial ones. Of | :51:53. | :51:55. | |
course, that is why the Scottish Government authority set up in that | :51:56. | :51:59. | |
they can tackle, such as Social Security and universal credit and | :52:00. | :52:03. | |
getting rid of the betting tax. They will be looking to see what the | :52:04. | :52:07. | |
other parties think of that. Are looking at Air Passenger Duty and | :52:08. | :52:10. | |
how you can grow your economy. So the Scottish Government has set out | :52:11. | :52:13. | |
its plans and we will see how people vote on that in the future but let's | :52:14. | :52:17. | |
not forget the Treasury still holds an awful lot of the purse strings. | :52:18. | :52:22. | |
Ian Murray, your party actually wants to increase taxation at the | :52:23. | :52:28. | |
top rate in the Scottish elections. Do you think, as so many other | :52:29. | :52:33. | |
elections Wetherby in London or in Edinburgh, will actually be | :52:34. | :52:37. | |
dominated by the taxation issue now? Well, I think it should, because I | :52:38. | :52:41. | |
think a grown-up parliament should have those taxation issues and we | :52:42. | :52:43. | |
have already got a very distinctive difference between all of the | :52:44. | :52:46. | |
political parties. We have the continuation of austerity which -- | :52:47. | :52:52. | |
and we have the SNP managing that austerity and refusing to use the | :52:53. | :52:55. | |
powers of the Scottish Parliament and we have made the choice that | :52:56. | :52:58. | |
when these are the joys of cutting into Scotland's feature or using | :52:59. | :53:03. | |
those powers, we use -- we choose to use those powers. Local services | :53:04. | :53:09. | |
have been decimated and local workers who provide those services | :53:10. | :53:14. | |
are just about to be made unemployed and we have to drop a law -- a line | :53:15. | :53:19. | |
under it. When we have a choice between using those powers or not, | :53:20. | :53:24. | |
we choose to use them. These are extraordinary comments from Labour. | :53:25. | :53:28. | |
A Labour Chancellor said that he was going to cut deeper and tougher than | :53:29. | :53:33. | |
Margaret Thatcher and George Osborne continued that, so Labour and the | :53:34. | :53:40. | |
Conservatives are two peas in a pod. Responsibility is the word that you | :53:41. | :53:44. | |
used. Finally the gripe and the grievance that the SNP have been | :53:45. | :53:49. | |
drumming in this place behind us for years is over because we can hold to | :53:50. | :53:54. | |
account Stephen's colleagues in the Scottish Parliament very shortly on | :53:55. | :53:59. | |
how they use the Scottish powers in the Scottish Parliament for the | :54:00. | :54:02. | |
betterment of the Scottish people and we can't come down here and | :54:03. | :54:04. | |
write and complain about the Treasury or the Government or the | :54:05. | :54:09. | |
Scottish Labour Party. We will be looking very closely at them and how | :54:10. | :54:12. | |
they use these powers and if they do not use them wisely, they have got | :54:13. | :54:16. | |
nobody but themselves to blame and the Scottish people at the election | :54:17. | :54:19. | |
in May will be able to decide for themselves whether they want Ruth | :54:20. | :54:23. | |
Davidson and the Scottish Conservatives to use as power wisely | :54:24. | :54:28. | |
or an SNP Government that just has one agenda, the break-up of Britain. | :54:29. | :54:31. | |
Stephen Gethin is, you have nowhere to hide financially in future. The | :54:32. | :54:37. | |
Treasury still holds a lot of those powers. I am the only person here | :54:38. | :54:43. | |
who has set out positive proposals for what we are going to do with | :54:44. | :54:47. | |
those powers, so I think that is quite telling. They want to cut Air | :54:48. | :54:50. | |
Passenger Duty which is to take flights and passenger flights rather | :54:51. | :54:55. | |
than take them away from public services. We all talk about powers | :54:56. | :54:59. | |
and the Treasury but ultimately this is about other services that are | :55:00. | :55:04. | |
grandmothers use, that our children use, that our neighbours use. These | :55:05. | :55:09. | |
are the services that are being dead submitted and we want to make sure | :55:10. | :55:17. | |
they are not. -- been decimated. Thank you for sharing that consensus | :55:18. | :55:24. | |
you all started with did not last for too long. Normal services | :55:25. | :55:25. | |
resume. Moray Macdonald is with me | :55:26. | :55:26. | |
for the final time this afternoon. Opposition parties, it is pretty | :55:27. | :55:34. | |
obvious what they are toenails. We will give you powers. All, you will | :55:35. | :55:40. | |
have to take responsibility for them. We will not hear any more | :55:41. | :55:44. | |
grievances. I seem to remember hearing all of this in the mid-19 | :55:45. | :55:48. | |
90s before they set up a Scottish parliament and look where that got. | :55:49. | :55:53. | |
Yes, absolutely. I think there is plenty of room left for grievances | :55:54. | :55:56. | |
over the next five years preserving the SNP are still in power, may to | :55:57. | :56:02. | |
lay the issues at Westminster's door, whether it is immigration or | :56:03. | :56:07. | |
defence issues, they will still be griping about the fact that Trident | :56:08. | :56:11. | |
will be based on pure in Scotland and the amount of money being spent | :56:12. | :56:15. | |
on that so there is plenty of room for that. The new powers coming to | :56:16. | :56:19. | |
Scotland are not just financial powers. They will have powers to | :56:20. | :56:24. | |
spend more money on welfare issues, so if he wants to get rid of the | :56:25. | :56:30. | |
bedroom tax, they cannot do that -- they can now do that. And there is | :56:31. | :56:37. | |
also new powers about road speeds and road signs, exciting things like | :56:38. | :56:41. | |
that, so a whole range of things being debated that we have not seen | :56:42. | :56:45. | |
before. Can I ask you just for a moment to take off your former Tory | :56:46. | :56:50. | |
adviser hat and put your involved in business hat on? Do you get any | :56:51. | :56:55. | |
sense from business in Scotland that is new devolution of powers is | :56:56. | :57:01. | |
important to them? I think most businesses at the moment do not see | :57:02. | :57:06. | |
any potential risk. There are not any flag being raised that there | :57:07. | :57:09. | |
will be huge changes to corporation tax at the moment or any other tax | :57:10. | :57:13. | |
that will have a big impact on business. Businesses are impacted | :57:14. | :57:20. | |
over things like the living wage where we have had a host of business | :57:21. | :57:23. | |
is already paying that because they know that the Scottish Government | :57:24. | :57:28. | |
wants to do that, so they don't have to do that, but it perhaps looks | :57:29. | :57:33. | |
better for them if they do. I think most businesses are probably more | :57:34. | :57:36. | |
focus on what is happening at Westminster and Brussels in terms of | :57:37. | :57:40. | |
the EU referendum and that potentially has a bigger impact on | :57:41. | :57:44. | |
businesses in the UK and in Scotland than some of the powers coming to | :57:45. | :57:47. | |
the Scottish parliament. And in the short term, with the election | :57:48. | :57:51. | |
campaign coming up, Labour clearly want to make it about tax. Each said | :57:52. | :57:58. | |
it should be. Will it be about tax? I think it will, but all of the | :57:59. | :58:02. | |
taxes that we have seen any of the party speaking about have all been | :58:03. | :58:07. | |
about income tax on you and I, on the public, not on business, so I | :58:08. | :58:11. | |
think that will be a feature. They think one of the issues might again | :58:12. | :58:15. | |
be council tax. We're still not got that right. There is a lack of | :58:16. | :58:19. | |
democracy at a local level with the fact that councils have actually | :58:20. | :58:22. | |
lost any power to raise revenue because they have been restricted | :58:23. | :58:32. | |
from doing that for the local level now will stop I think we will see | :58:33. | :58:45. | |
powers from the SNP. We'll have to leave it there. | :58:46. | :58:46. | |
I'll be back with Sunday Politics Scotland on Sunday at 11am. | :58:47. | :58:50. | |
We are told that OJ Simpson is in that car, | :58:51. | :59:05. | |
Do you think he did it? She was terrified of him. | :59:06. | :59:16. |