11/06/2013 Stormont Today

Hello and welcome to Stormont Today. Coming up in tonight's programme:

The Health Minister outlines the way forward for the Northern Health

Trust. You have to do better. We will do better. That is why we are

continuing to make differences here and challenge and change and we will

get there, with the Northern Trust. Despite recommendations from a

review panel, the Education Minister refuses to withdraw extra payments

to small schools. I can assure the Assembly that where there is the

case that small schools that have been identified as strategic

important will receive the resources they need to provide the best

possible education for the children they serve.

We'll have reaction from the Chair of the Education Committee to that

announcement. The Health Minister has revealed

that a report into the Northern Health Trust says it is in a poor

position and requires extensive support to improve.

Edwin Poots told the Assembly in a statement that the review team he

brought in last year has made five recommendations to improve the

organisation. I have now received the report from the turn around team

detailing the findings of phase one of the review. The report addresses

the term of references comprehensively. I'm grateful to the

team for significant work in taking this forward. Given the needed to

reduce waiting times, in relation to unscheduled care, the review

examined performance, including quality and safety of services,

outcomes and patient experience, at the Trust's emergency departments

and identified specific areas and aspects of the work of the Trust and

its relationship with ovide providers of health and social care

were improvement in is required. It report provides team's assessment of

leadership capacity at the Trust and the changes necessary to improve

performance. The report makes five distinct recommendations. They are -

to enhance the leadership capacity at the Trust and empower clinicians

to lead change. Ensure support to deliver an improvement plan in three

phases. Gain assurance that is governance and quality systems are

robust. Gain assurance that mortality data is robust. Put in

place performance framework that will ensure delivery of the

improvement plan and contains clear consequences for non--delivery

alongside incentives for delivery. The analysis identified that the

northern health and social care trust is in a poor position and

requires intensive support to improve. It is reassuring to note

that the team concluded that the Trust can be turned around. That is

essential to improve the patient trust and experience it at the

Trust. However, support needs to be provided to enable it to do so. In

relation to the Causeway Hospital the report signals the need to

remove any sense of uncertainty in regard to its future management

arrangements. I'm Dean remove that uncertainty. I told the House on

19th March that TYC consultation had indicated significant sfor for the

action, as set out in the Vision to Action document. I asked officials

to begin work to take forward an options appraisal. Whether it should

remain within the northern trust or transfer in the near future to the

Western Trust. Work on the options appraisal has been begun. Also

ommend recommendations the issue of mortality data has come up are you

indicating there has been doubts about how the data was collated and

if so what impact that had? What does it mean for the future?

terms of mortality there are multiple ways of calculating

mortality. The Met old that the northern trust uses doesn't give any

particular concern. However, just to be absolutely certain, the report

suggests running another methodology such as that of the Dr Foster

organisation to provide maximum assurance. So we are not saying

there is any risk there, but we want to double up there to ensure that we

have that. Could the Minister tell us what are the monitoring and

evaluation techniques to be used to ensure delivery of the

recommendations and the time frame of achieving the same? Well,

certainly, on some of the recommendations, I would want the

time frame to be almost immediate. I would want to see improvement at a

very early point. That is certainly something that we are looking at.

The longer term is that we would be looking for the phase one

improvement to be actually completed within six months. My view is that

the public have to get better. They deserve better. We have to do

better. We will do better. That is why we are continuing to make

differences here and challenge and change and we will get there with

the northern trust. The Health Minister, Edwin Poots.

With me now is Janice Smyth, the Director of the Royal College of

Nursing in Northern Ireland. What do you make of the Minister's statement

today, first of all? I think there will be a huge sense of relief that

we have got a report that records the issues that have been raised now

for some time. I think that certainly nurses and other

healthcare professionals working there, and the public, will, I

think, shy a huge sense of relief that the concerns have been taken

seriously. That we have got recommendations. We have an action

plan and a phased implementation process. I think that the Minister

has been frank and honest today. the problems have been identified

and there is a plan in place to deal with them. Yes.Have confidence that

plan will be implemented and the shortcomings will be dealt with?

Well, the College has confidence that the Department recognised,

albeit some might say late in the day, we had significant problems in

that Trust, there were issues being raised by many people including the

Royal College of Nursing. What I would say to you today is that Royal

College of NursinGordon Brown will certainly beholding to account those

who are responsible now for getting on with that actually making it

right because this is the last opportunity to do that. It's really

important that we get that right. We will do all we can to support people

to make sure it happens. Is very important. One of the things the

Minister mentioned today was this plan will give more power to

clinicians to lead change. Is that sensible, in your view? I think it's

really important. I think there is plenty of evidence that nurses and

other healthcare staff were raising concerns about some of the things

that were happening. Were making suggestions about what might make it

right. Those were falling on deaf ears. If we want to make a

difference to how we care for people, we need to empower the

people who are responsible for delivering that care to get on with

the job and do it. The Minister said the public deserves better and will

get better from the Northern Trust in future. Do you believe him?

believe his commitment to it. I believe that there is a plan to do

it, but I think that people will say that proof of the pudding will be in

the eating. Let us watch and see what happens. We will keep a close

eye on what is going on in terms of the nurses and nursing. Thank you

very much. A proposal that would have saved �28

million a year has been rejected by the Education Minister.

The recommendation to cancel extra payments to small schools was put

forward by an independent review panel, but John O'Dowd said he won't

be implementing it. Withdrawing the money could have led

to the closure of hundreds of small schools.

The Minister made his position clear during a statement to the Assembly

today. The review panel's views is that the current means of funding

small schools does not (inaudible) the panel recommended that I remove

all small schools factors from the current funding. However, it has to

be recognised that small schools would in that scenario have to be

supported with funding outside the new formula to deliver education for

the pupils. There has been much concern expressed with this

recommendation, while I'm accepting the recommendation in principle, I

am not implementing it at this time. I can assure the Assembly that where

there is the case small schools that have been identified as

strategically important will receive the resources they need to provide

the best possible education for the children they serve. The difference

from the current position is that these small schools will be planned

and approved. They will not be there just because they have always been

there, but because they represent the best solution for young people

in that area. The review recognised that the issues schools face in

overcoming barriers created by social deprivation are significantly

increased with children from less affluent backgrounds. The panel

recommended that funding for sow Yeo economic deprivation should be

weighted towards schools with significant concentrations of

disadvantage. It will be no surprise to members to note that I accept and

fully endorse these recommendations. It is my intention to apply the same

elgentleman blt criteria for free school meals. The post-prime

t-primary pupils will have free school means in the same way as our

primary pupils. The Minister clarify how to the House today what is his

definition of a strategically important small school and how will

that be determined in the light of his announcement today? I do fear

that while reference was made to surpluses in some primary schools, I

trust that this is not an attempt to rob the rich to pay the poor?

that has to be done we are going to do it. All the evidence points to

the fact that young people coming from socially deprived backgrounds

face a greater challenges in education than those coming from

more affluent backgrounds. If the evidence points in that direction we

have to deal with it. Now, I think what I have done, the way I'm

setting out the common funding formula, ensures that all schools

are treated fairlied and equally. The Minister signalled today an

investment of �10 million into the school budget next year, could the

Minister outline if there will be investment further in targeting

social need in the year ahead? you. I estimate it will cost

approximately �30 million over the next twole financial years to fund

the additional funding in the formula for targeting socialal needs

and to allow pupils attending post-primary schools to be elible

free school meals and free school uniforms as well. Why is he

attacking the voluntary schools when he seems to be using one. Examples

that how good they well work and why doesn't he look at adopting all the

things that show voluntary schools work extremely well for everyone if

we could sfeed through? I don't accept that I'm attacking voluntary

schools. I attack the social engineering that takes places in

relation to how they allow pupils to access their schools. The question

that I have for the Minister, it does follow on from free school

meals as an indicator, it is recommendation 20 say there is will

be a further examination of other factors that might well be taken

into account. I'm sure the Minister will be aware that many people who

find themselves described as the "working poor" 1p income above Ella

blt what investigation, how will that be taken forward? When might

the Minister draw... Reach a conclusion on that analysis? We have

actually, my predecessor, expanded the Ella blt for free school meals.

We have further expanded. There will be 15,000 more pupils in

post-primary schools entitled to free school meals as a result of my

announcement today than if I would Minister's statement is the Chair of

the Education Committee, Mervyn Storey. Are you satisfied with the

Minister's position on the funding of small schools?

The Minister has not moved according to the recommendation to remove the

small schools factor but what needs to be clearly identified for those

teachers in schools listening to the programme is that what the Minister

said in a document released at the same time as a statement, it said,

we are not removing it yet. Clearly, the Minister bottled out today in

deciding to announce publicly that he was going to remove the small

schools factor, but he intends in the coming weeks and months to look

at a way whereby the factor will be removed.

Why would he have done that today when he had the cover of the

recommendation from this report to go down the road of closure?

He has been under immense pressure. There is huge concern around the

future of small schools. He said on one hand he was going to do this --

was not going to do this, he then rejected out of hand having a small

schools policy, but in a statement, he said he was going to abide

further information and criteria in relation to how you define what is a

strategically important small school. There were mixed messages

from the message -- from the Minister today because he is feeling

the heat around the immensity of this problem.

Just to deal with one of the eye -1 of the wider issues. It is his

Roache the socio- economic issues and protect some schools, perhaps at

the expense of others. -- his Roache.

Free school meals and using socio-economic criteria of blunt

instruments to determine the allocation of funding and while free

school meals is an issue in potent particularly in working class a

distant areas, there has been a row take and we need to ensure that is

maximised rush artist and areas. So that young people do benefit. -- in

Protestant areas. But there needs to be provision for pupils on an

educational basis because many pupils falls short of the free

school meals criteria. You asked specifically if he was going to have

to rob the rich to pay for the war and he said, if that has to be done,

we are going to do it, did that surprise you? -- to pay for the

poor. No, he is happy to attack the successful who benefit the

unsuccessful, and I think the Minister needs to be clear that

schools that even financially prudent should not be penalised in

the process of distributing funds. Mervyn Storey, thank you very much.

Following yesterday's approval of departmental budgets, today, the

Finance Minister was back in front of the House, this time with the

second stage of the Budget Bill. And the Minister warned the Bill must

receive Assembly approval before summer recess, or departments and

other publics bodies could have difficulties accessing cash.

The Budget Bill is admittedly technical and on the surface it can

be hard to translate the figures it contains into real-world public

services. But it is important to emphasise that every doctor,

teacher, road improvement, hospital, indeed, every public service

provided for under the authority of the Assembly is affected eye this

will and requires its legislation to operate legally -- is affected by

this bill. So perhaps it appears dry and the figures are surreal, but it

is a crucial piece of legislation for public services.

At a strategic level, more effective Assembly input and scrutiny of

expended chat will help to further demonstrate that devolution is

making a difference to deliver an efficient governance in the North.

-- scrutiny of expenditure. In terms of the immediate business today, on

behalf of the Finance and personnel committee, I support the general

principles of the bill. With unemployment and youth

unemployment all remaining stubbornly high, we must ensure all

resources are used affect degree. At the outset, I remain particularly

concerned at the latest economic outlook for Northern Ireland which

showed we are slipping behind the rest of the United Kingdom in almost

every economic indicator. We must therefore question whether this

budget is strong enough to reverse that trend.

We are together building a united government, I will as I go on

probably appear script -- appear sceptical about this document, but

at least it is a recognition that bringing our people closer together

is a vital priority for social reasons and for sound financial and

economic reasons. It is concerning so little detail is available in

terms of cost or whose budgets will be affected. It is not reassuring

but a proposal to remove all peace wars in Belfast within ten years

should be brought forward without reference to the Minister of

Justice. -- wars. I cannot form an opinion on this bill because like

everybody else, I do not have sufficient information. This is a

sham, this is going through the process of pretending to deal with

the issues when we are not, so I put this challenge to the Minister who

normally does not bother to respond to me because he thinks that is the

way to go and do politics. I am absolutely happy to take an

intervention! Order, please, the member will

resume his seat. I would remind members and ministers that you

should not crowd -- you should not shout across the chamber.

I have no difficulty with scrutiny of the budget and I think it is

essential we have good scrutiny of the budget. Not only scrutiny of the

budget as it is presented, but also on an ongoing basis. I will let the

member get in front of the TV! Do you want me to speak for you?

We are a regional economy. We are dealing with a global recession. We

are also dealing with a world wide banking crisis. I do not think that

I, as Finance Minister, have ever claimed, nor would I ever be silly

enough to claim, that our budget, even though there is �18 billion

involved of spend here, that that is ever going to be sufficient to

reverse all of the weight of the global economic pressures.

The Finance Minister, Sammy Wilson, and the second stage of that Budget

Bill was passed. And the second stage of that -- and the second

stage was passed. There is not long to go now until the G8 Summit in

County Fermanagh, and today, the Justice Minister faced a barrage of

questions on how much it will cost, though David Ford refused to be

drawn on an exact figure. And the Minister also faced a query about

the PSNI re-hiring retired officers. I would like to ask the Minister, is

he aware that PSNI has engaged in this practice in recent times to

rehire retired police officers and not advertise well paid jobs? Would

he agree that open doors for newcomers, the PSNI needs to shut

the revolving door? His question -- I thank him for his

question but I am not aware of this. The issue of the appointment of

agency staff is a different issue from the issue of rehiring and I

refer to that as being subject to an enquiry and I look forward to the

report. The PSNI and departmental officials

continued to work on the forecast cost of the policing and security

operation associated with the G8 Summit. The cost will not be known

until sometime after the summit and some costs such as compensation

claims and legal aid will be incurred after and will depend on

the level of unrest. I welcome the report to the policing board last

Thursday, where it was advised a letter of assurance had been

received from Danny Alexander had been written assurance that the

majority of cost to the policing operation will be met by the

government. PSNI will bear the cost of purchases and developments

already built into policing spending plans, some of which have been

accelerated as part of the G8 operation.

The Justice committee look for answers to this last week and the

official refused to tell us the in -- tells the information. What is

the estimate of the overall cost associated with the G8 and what

proportion will be carried by the Department of Justice and the PSNI?

Well, Deputy Speaker, I thank my committee chair for his usual

inquisition. I cannot give a forecast of the overall cost.

Because there are many undetermined factors which will not be determined

until significantly after the conference is over. What I can say

is that a sum of money will fall to PSNI and to the Department of

Justice related to expenditure. For example, a variety of capital

programmes have been at -- have been accelerated to enable the policing

operation to function well, those are issues on which we would have

been spending money otherwise. But as I said, we have now seen the

letter which has been sent by the chief secretary to the Chief

Constable and that makes clear the expectation that the funding other

than that for accelerated spending will fall to the UK Exchequer and

not to the Department of Justice. Can the Minister give some

indication of the quantum in terms of the capital costs associated with

staging the G8 and can he give an assurance there will be no revenue

difficulties or the police moving forward?

-- for the police. I am always reluctant to say there will be no

revenue difficulties for policing costs. We look at the events that

could happen, we do not know what it will cost for the policing of the

number of special events happening this summer and the issue of

parading. So I would be cautious to say there is no pressure on the

police in that respect. I am assured that the key additional costs of

being fully funded elsewhere but we will ensure as we look at a

difficult financial situation that we get the best value for money.

The Justice Minister, David Ford. The number of farmers involved in

organic farming here has fallen by almost 40% since 2006. The

Agriculture Minister, Michelle O'Neill, who was sounding a little

under the weather today, gave the details during today's Question

Time. First up, though, she was asked about the recently unveiled

Agri-Food Strategy Board's action plan.

I welcome this proposal and I believe that such a scheme would

improve productivity and efficiency at farm level, prevent them --

dividing the necessary funding can be secured. I believe we can deliver

such a scheme. But we have only recently taken our seat at the

report and are carefully considering each individual recommendation

before we bring forward final proposals on this and other

proposals to the executive. I thank the Minister for her

response. As a Minister -- as the Minister has a substantial

underspend on the development programme, what plans do she have to

use this money to help achieve the targets set within this report and

to increase profitability across farms across Northern Ireland?

The member will be aware that I have a major programme of work going in

terms of potential underspend is and I am committed to making sure that

by the end of the programme, not 1p will be handed back to Europe and

the European money will be spent to the best benefit of our communities.

But I believe the rural development programme will be an excellent

vehicle to bring forward a lot of initiatives recommended in the

report. Through adequate government

assistance, the quantity of organic produce will be increased and would

be of great benefit to farmer and consumer. Can I ask if the Minister

can indicate what additional initiatives her department plans to

introduce to strengthen the organic sector?

Given that the fact that we have higher commodity prices in recent

years, it has resulted in the premiums for farmers so that has

been a disincentive for farmers to get involved in organic farming

practices. In 2006, there were 224 farmers involved in organic

actresses and in 2012, that is down to 139, and that is down to the fact

they were not at acting a premium so it is not attractive to a farmer

trying to sustain an income. So there is a weak market but there is

a niche market for organic products. I am committed to making sure that

through the development work we are doing, the fact we still run an

organic farm, farmers can look at it and if it is something they are

interested in, that is the work we can do. But it is something that is

very much market led. I would like to thank the Minister

for her answer and I wish her a speedy recovery. I would like to ask

the Minister what has been the uptake in support for organic

farming? The scheme itself, the organic

farming scheme, supports farmers who want to convert to organic

production methods and is funded through a programme. There 31

participants this scheme currently and a farming about 1100 acres of

land under organic management but that scheme is currently closed to

new applicants. It opened in March last year and 33 applications came

forward but only six progressed through to agreement. But the scheme

itself within the countryside management scheme provides support

to a further six participants of organically certified land under

management, so there is still a small number of farmers involved in

organic farming, but it very much depends on the market and all the

costs associated with being an organic farmer.

The Agriculture Minister, Michelle O'Neill.