16/04/2012 Stormont Today


16/04/2012

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Hello and welcome to Stormont Today. And after a weekend of

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commemorations for the victims of the Titanic disaster, the Assembly

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returned after its Easter break giving MLAs a chance to pay their

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tributes. But do we need yet another commemorative plaque?

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small memorial, because within the hall Stormont building, we don't

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have anything that commemorates the Titanic.

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Yet it was the issue of more recent victims which dominated business in

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the chamber. Information is the key to progress, and I want to take

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this opportunity to renew the call for information in relation to

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those victims whose remains have not yet been recovered.

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And from the victims' organisation Wave, Sandra Peake is my guest

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Assembly members are back from the Easter break and top of the agenda

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today was victims. Specifically those who were disappeared during

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the Troubles. There's still seven families seeking the remains of

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their loved ones. And during today's debate, there was praise

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for the victims group Wave. And joining me now is the

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organisation's chief executive, Sandra Peake. Welcome to the

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programme. Sandra, what is Wave's role in helping the disappeared?

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have worked with the families of the disappeared since the 1990s,

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initially in a support context. Brian McKinney's mother came to us

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early on, and was very clear that she was looking for his body and

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wanted to know what had happened to him. I wasn't sure how we could

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help initially, but we began to work together, and through that, we

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met the other families and formed a support group which was very much

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about reducing isolation. Remind us again where were are with this

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issue. I understand there will be developments soon. Work is imminent

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and with that the commission in relation hopefully to one family

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case. It is hoped that there will be further work. Our hope is that

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all seven will be returned home for Christian burials with their

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families. We have a very specialist commission with specialist skills

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and knowledge. They have the technology and funding, but what

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they need is more information. That is the thing which is most

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important at present. You listened to the debate today along with some

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of the families. What does it mean to them to have this debate? It was

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good for them to listen. There is a sense that they have some

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recognition now, and a sense that debate is important for the

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families, and to know that they are recognised. How difficult was it to

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get the debate? In relation to Dominic Bradley, it is because of

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his work within the area and families, I suppose that we are

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very keen on pushing the issue and highlighting that we have

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commissioned an independent commission for the disappeared.

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That is what today's debate was about. Her OK, Sandra. Let's hear

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some of the debate today. And we start with Dominic Bradley, who

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proposed the motion. It was people from Northern Ireland and from the

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public who were responsible for the disappearances. Their other people

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who have the information and can bring the suffering of the families

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to the end. I want to place on record our thanks to all of those

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who have come forward to date with information leading to the recovery

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of remains. That is the key word - information. Information is the key

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to progress. I want to take this opportunity to renew the call for

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information in relation to those whose remains have not been

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recovered. Now is the time for those who have said nothing or who

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have not said enough to come forward and speak and give

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information. As the victims commissioner in 2008, I attended a

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funeral mass for a young lad who was disappeared longer than he was

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alive - 21 years old when he was killed, but not buried for a

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further 27 years. I will never forget the picture they used at the

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Requiem Mass, the picture of a young man entering his twenties,

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not the picture of a man being buried nearly 50 years after he was

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born. The family had no choice, because for those 27 years, they

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had no picture, because he was dead but not buried. It was a stark

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visual reminder of how unnatural, inhuman and perverted it is to

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disappear somebody. These bodies would disappear by being buried in

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secret locations, and that is part of the trauma that the families

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have endured. It is an injustice. I do repeat and re iterate... Were at

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the member like to withdraw the statement that he made in January

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2005 that the killing of Jean McConville was not a criminal act?

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Or is it still the position of Sinn Fein that that vile murder was in

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some way justified? Because it was not a criminal act, and if that is

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the member's stance, then so much of what he says today has no

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credibility. I think the Member for that intervention. I have to reply

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in this way. I will address that issue in the context of a process

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of truth recovery and a process of genuine reconciliation. That would

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mean that I could expect from all sections around this room, people

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to acknowledge the role of the British security services in

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procuring murder and procuring collusion with the murder gangs,

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and we address all of those issues... At the beginning of this

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debate, are asked members to refrain and be careful of what they

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said that they would not jeopardise any future proceedings. I asked the

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remember -- the member to remember that. I think we do need to have a

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truth recovery process in which all will come to that table. And number

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of years ago, I was contacted by one of the family is that we

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disappeared, the McVeigh family. -- that were disappeared. I met the

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late Mrs McRae. Writer way I could see on the elderly woman's face the

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trauma, the distress, the agony, and she was pleading for the return

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of the body of her son before she herself would pass away.

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Unfortunately, Mrs McRae has passed away, and she was never to realise

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that longing in ha-ha at to be reunited with the body of her son

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so that she could give him a burial, a Christian burial. Sandra, a very

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poignant story there, but she is not the only one who has passed

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away without seeing any progress. That is right. For those mothers of

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the disappeared, it is a very difficult and poignant journey.

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Kevin McKee's mother - he is still missing - she died before Christmas.

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Many of them mothers have put their sons names on headstones as a way

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to try to end Sjoerd -- ensure that they will have a place of rest.

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heard during the debate that there was progress possibly imminent or

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some development imminent. Is there anywhere and -- anything else you

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can share with us? Hopefully work will take place in the near future,

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and I think that that will come into the public domain. The hope of

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all families when they see work commence is that they will be next.

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Our need is to keep continuing to work on the issue to make sure that

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there is further progress. And sometimes when you least expect it,

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when a search has taken some time and families are beginning to think

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that they are not there, remains have been found. Thank you, Sandra.

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The reform of welfare and coping with its fallout is a major

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challenge facing the Assembly, as we've documented on this programme.

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We'll hear the the social development minister answering

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questions on that shortly, but first, did you know this island

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could be self-sufficient in electricity and could even become

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an exporter of power to other areas?

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Listen now to the environment minister.

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The answer is that in the 2010/2011 year, there were 639 planning

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applications for wind turbines, 620 for a single wind and 19

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applications for wind farms. In the period from April to December of

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the last business year, and figures for the last one had yet to be

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fully updated, during that nine- month period, there were 500

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applications for single wind farm turbines, 29 applications for wind

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farms. Those figures do not take into account other renewable

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applications for anaerobic do jesters and other renewable

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opportunities. But the scale of the opportunities both in the preceding

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year and in the the period up to September last year, it confirms to

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me that renewables remains of this island's and the north of this

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island's single biggest opportunity. Could the minister at this point in

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time give us a figure as regards to how many of these multiple

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applications are within this boundary? I certainly will be able

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to break it down, but not right at this moment. I will come back to

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the member in that regard. Behind the question, there is this. That

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we have been the test-bed for renewable wind applications in

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Northern Ireland. If you look at the map in respect of wind farm and

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wind turbine applications, you will perceive that it is in this Berens

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where the single greatest concentration of applications and

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approvals are demonstrated. And in that regard, we need to learn from

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that experience, to ensure that every opportunity as the

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opportunities for wind farms spread to the east, and as opportunities

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begin to develop for offshore at the end of this colour the year, we

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need to learn from that experience in order to ensure that everybody -

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- every reasonable opportunity is grasped in a way that local

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communities can with live with that doesn't come at a price of natural

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beauty, and yet seizes this opportunity for the people of the

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North. It is the case that when it comes to wind, wave and tide, and

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in the future, thermal as well, the opportunities for this island over

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the next 10 or 20 years are to become self-sufficient in terms of

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electricity and indeed become a net exporter of electricity. It is

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something that our governments are beginning to grasp and need to more

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On to social development and the reform of housing benefit which

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will see people under 35 per one living alone are having their

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benefit reduced. The precise effect of welfare reform on tenants more

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widely is not known. My department is taking steps to identify what

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services and support need to be put in place to assist those who are

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impacted by the changes. This will include assessing the adequacy of

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shared and smaller homes and the house and strategy will address

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this question further. SPEAKS GAELIC thank you, Mr Speaker and

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the Minister for his answer. What exactly will his department did to

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prevent increased homelessness? have given in the initial answer

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the figures for the number of properties that there are already

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in multiple occupation which has 398. In terms of other things that

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can be done, we have certainly spoken very clearly to Housing

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Executive and the housing associations in regard to the type

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of accommodation that they include in their social housing development

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plan so that in bringing a forward they take account of welfare reform,

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rather than simply bringing forward a plan based on the situation as it

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was before and I am awaiting the final outcome of that plan in the

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very near future. In terms of also helping people in the interim

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period, there are a number of measures that can be undertaken and

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the discretionary fund is one of those. We are working in that

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regard. There is already some level of provision. But I have 10th so

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size -- I have to emphasise that detailed provision is not available

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and secondly, the exact implications of welfare reform on

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housing, when we re over in London recently talking with Department

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for Work and Pensions, that was one area where there was the highest

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level of uncertainty. And why are so many homes lying empty when

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people are queuing up for somewhere to live? And impatient Mike Nesbitt

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wanted to know. The indeed, if the member looks down the list of

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questions today, he will see there are questions specifically on the

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issue of empty homes and we are operating two pilot schemes to see

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what is the best way in the Northern Ireland context of

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addressing the issue of empty homes. There are a number of issues where

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there are -- areas where there are a concentration of empty homes. We

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need to address that. What other reasons why they are lying vacant

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and what can be done to get them back into use as quickly as

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possible? Once we have complete the -- completed the pilot scheme, or

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we will be in a position to go on to the next stage.

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There were two new boys starting at Stormont Today. Retired school

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principal and retired principal Sean Rogers replaced Margaret

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Ritchie and Chris has it, a PhD student takes over from Willie

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Clarke, who stepped down in favour of his council work -- Chris hazard.

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I caught up with them. delighted in be here in the

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Assembly. I know have a hard act to follow but I'm looking forward to

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the challenge and I am delighted and feel honoured to represent the

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people of South Down. As a young person I am hoping to get more

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young people involved. There is this idea that young people do not

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see this as somewhere they can come to, and get involved in politics.

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I'm hoping I can help lead that. Economy is at the forefront of all

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of our minds. What you have to offer? I think I bring my

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experience as a parent, as an educationalist but most importantly

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as a community worker in my parish and my football club. These are

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challenging times, particularly on this day when we are at --

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remembering the Titanic in the chamber, there are two aspects that

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I want to bring to your attention in terms of Southdown. It is

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fantastic to bring tourists into Northern Ireland and let Titanic be

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a springboard to bring tourists to all the parts of the area from

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Downpatrick down to Newry. Love aspect as well is on that Titanic

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disaster across the Atlantic, there were 120 people in third class from

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Ireland who were going to find a better life in America. History is

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repeating itself. Four out of my family work outside this country.

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26 members of my football club are now in Australia because there is

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no work in this country. I want to get jobs on the agenda. Whether

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that is tourism, aggro Foods, the opportunities are there in

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sustainable energy to bring jobs to South Down. Sinn Fein are making

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much of that Chris as a young person, the SDLP are missing a

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trick because there was a young person he wanted the job, Colin

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McGrath? Yes, I was selected by the party which ran on at about but I

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bring my experience to this job. seemed a bit anxious to get up here,

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there was speculation that you were unhappy that Margaret Ritchie was

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taking her time to step aside? Don't believe everything you

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reading the papers. I am happy to work closely with Margaret and

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Karen, the three SDLP representatives in South Down.

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Chris, some people said you were tipped to take on Margaret Ritchie?

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I don't know about that. I have a big job on my hands here getting

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settled into the Assembly. Westminster is a while away now.

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The tide is starting to turn in South Down. Sinn Fein has been

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making massive progress. There are big prospects in the future for

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Sinn Fein, right across the island but in areas like Southdown we are

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starting to grow. We are waiting for them, we are happier.

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MLAs and Assembly staff held a special prayer of remembrance for

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the victims of the Titanic. And in the debating chamber, members

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called for any further marking of the anniversary to be a dignified

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tribute to those who have lost their lives. I have already

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mentioned the financial support that the Assembly has given to

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Titanic Belfast and I think we should look at the Assembly

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Commission may be to investigate the potential of some sort of

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memorial, a small memorial. Within the whole Stormont building we do

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not have anything that marks the Titanic and I think that is very

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sad. But I think it is fitting that we have the opportunity to speak

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about the Titanic in the Northern Ireland Assembly today, nearly to

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the day that she was lost and to celebrate the launch as well, to

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remember those lives. The ceremony earlier today, and can I thank the

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Speaker and his office for organising such a solemn and moving

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cross-party event, it was definitely a tribute to this House

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about how we can come together and celebrate joint events. This is a

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tragedy for which really nobody was to blame, except in nature, it

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marks the beginning though for all of us of a decade of what may well

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be much more contentious commemoration. And what we might

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take from the Titanic story is the simple fact of the level of the

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individual and family, all lost as equally tragic. We need to show the

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same respect for all of those who lost lives in the ensuing years

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after 1912 and for all the families who suffered loss, just the same as

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today, we are thinking of and commemorating those people who

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found a cold grave, those 1570 souls who found a cold grave in the

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Atlantic. I do believe I am the only person here who worked in a

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shipyard and that may surprise a lot of people. Can I just say that

:23:22.:23:31.
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the Titanic itself was launched on 31st May 1911. It lost -- it sank

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with the loss of 1517 people. Little did the world know that one

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of the biggest events in the Millennium had occurred.

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We heard therefore I call for a Titanic memorial here at Stormont.

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What do you think about that? suppose the commemoration events

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over the last few days have been important and when you think we are

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marking 100 years. It is interesting because it in the

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context of education, children are learning about the Titanic in

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schools so I suppose it has a symbolic gesture not only for those

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who are older but those who are younger. Regarding a commemoration

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here, I suppose that would be entirely appropriate. The list of

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names has appeared at City Hall. you think we will get a point where

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we have all the victims of the Troubles on one memorial? I would

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hope at some stage there would be something that people would view as

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a fitting form of acknowledgement for those who died. We must also

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remember those who were injured. The scale of injured his height but

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often we concentrate on those who have died but there are those who

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live with deeply embedded wounds and it is important to remove -- to

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remember them. Thank you. A new leader and a new

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broom - Mike Nesbitt has been making some changes in the Ulster

:24:58.:25:05.

Unionist Party. Earlier, Gareth gave me the latest update.

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Sir Reg Empey, as you and I know him, he is not coming back as party

:25:09.:25:15.

leader, he is coming back as Party Chairman. That is quite an own this

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task. The party confirmed his appointment this morning. What they

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did not tell us was that he was not the first choice. That was the

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former Party Chairman James Cooper. I interviewed the party leader this

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morning. He stopped short of confirming that. I certainly had a

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conversation with James Cooper and many conversations with different

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people. It is a bit of a jigsaw when you have four picks only. I

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could have used six or seven. Usain you did not offer the job of

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chairman to James Cooper? I am saying any discussions I had were

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private and confidential. I only have four picks. I had six or seven

:25:55.:26:00.

people I would love to have had on the team. I'm delighted Lord Empey

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has agreed to be Party Chairman. James Cooper has confirmed he was

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offered the job. I called James Cooper this afternoon and he said

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he had been offered it but he was too busy to take up the appointment.

:26:14.:26:18.

He said it was an important and challenging post and required, if

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not a permanent presence in Belfast, more of a presence than he could

:26:23.:26:33.
:26:33.:26:36.

give it. He is a solicitor based in Enniskillen. Easts -- there was

:26:36.:26:40.

another possibility? Environment Minister is discussing

:26:40.:26:48.

ways of curbing illegal drinking and Joanne Dobson is concerned that

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Maisie affect newlyweds who have a drink in a private vehicle on their

:26:54.:27:01.

way to the reception -- that may affect. And case anyone worried

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that Joanne Dobson is asking about this on her own behalf, I can

:27:05.:27:08.

confirm she got married many years ago.

:27:08.:27:12.

We were talking about the importance of information and

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helping families of the disappeared get peace, what can you offer

:27:17.:27:22.

families who might have some information? There is a process in

:27:22.:27:28.

place which protects individuals. It can only be used to protect

:27:28.:27:33.

people who are missing. It is important for anyone to cast their

:27:33.:27:37.

mind back. Something could seem very insignificant but would be

:27:37.:27:41.

important for the Commission. It is important we get information

:27:41.:27:45.

through the channels which are available. There is a number which

:27:45.:27:49.

people can phone confidentially and assist us with the process. There

:27:49.:27:53.

are some developments in the next year because there is a book coming

:27:53.:27:57.

out on the disappeared. We are conscious that the families have

:27:57.:28:03.

been keen to show a -- share their story. A number of families have

:28:03.:28:08.

been recording their stories in a book. That is about the human

:28:08.:28:12.

Saidabad to be missing were in their families, in terms of being

:28:12.:28:21.

brothers, sisters, daughters, sons. -- that is that the human side.

:28:21.:28:27.

Some of them were only 16 up? of them had learning difficulties

:28:27.:28:32.

and other issues. That is a very startling thing. Some of these

:28:32.:28:36.

folks have been missing longer than they were alive. For the families,

:28:36.:28:39.

they are very much bare and the families want to bring them home

:28:39.:28:43.

and it is right and fitting that they did. I'm sure we will hear

:28:44.:28:47.

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