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We all like to think we're getting a fair deal for our money, | 0:00:02 | 0:00:05 | |
whether buying, selling or taking out a loan, | 0:00:05 | 0:00:07 | |
and when times are hard it matters even more. | 0:00:07 | 0:00:10 | |
But many of the deals on offer could cause you real problems. | 0:00:10 | 0:00:14 | |
Some could even wreck your life. | 0:00:14 | 0:00:16 | |
On today's programme. | 0:00:22 | 0:00:24 | |
The ex-soldier whose deal with his bank left him over £100,000 in debt. | 0:00:24 | 0:00:28 | |
-You got a pound coin on you? -No. | 0:00:28 | 0:00:31 | |
-50p? -No. -So you haven't got a penny on you? | 0:00:32 | 0:00:34 | |
The woman who took on her bank and won. | 0:00:36 | 0:00:38 | |
I've got a new nickname. It's Bankslayer! | 0:00:38 | 0:00:41 | |
We head out with the UK's Illegal Money Lending team | 0:00:41 | 0:00:45 | |
as they crack down on the worst deal in Britain, loan-sharking. | 0:00:45 | 0:00:48 | |
And the victim who did a deal with a loan shark | 0:00:50 | 0:00:52 | |
and paid the price for 19 years. | 0:00:52 | 0:00:55 | |
I was laid up ill on the settee once and he started knocking into me. | 0:00:55 | 0:00:59 | |
My mate come around and tried sticking up for me and he actually beat the living daylights | 0:00:59 | 0:01:03 | |
out of my mate in front of my kids. | 0:01:03 | 0:01:05 | |
Alan is 31 years old, homeless and penniless. | 0:01:10 | 0:01:14 | |
He now stays at his brother's house, all because of | 0:01:14 | 0:01:17 | |
the worst deal he ever made, with his bank, Northern Rock. | 0:01:17 | 0:01:22 | |
Alan joined the army when he was 18 and served his country for 10 years. | 0:01:22 | 0:01:26 | |
He was part of the peace-keeping force in Kosovo | 0:01:28 | 0:01:31 | |
and also fought in Afghanistan. | 0:01:31 | 0:01:33 | |
That's what I wanted to do, I wanted to fight for my country. | 0:01:33 | 0:01:37 | |
That's why you join the Army. | 0:01:37 | 0:01:38 | |
You sign your oath of allegiance, and that's a proud moment. | 0:01:38 | 0:01:42 | |
Even though the Army was his childhood dream, | 0:01:42 | 0:01:45 | |
for the sake of his marriage, Alan decided to leave. | 0:01:45 | 0:01:49 | |
But it wasn't easy for him in civvy street. | 0:01:49 | 0:01:51 | |
I struggled because when I decided to come out, the world just | 0:01:52 | 0:01:56 | |
went into financial meltdown. | 0:01:56 | 0:01:59 | |
As Alan tried to find a decent job, his marriage fell apart. | 0:01:59 | 0:02:03 | |
When he became single, he was left with £20,000 worth of debts | 0:02:03 | 0:02:08 | |
made up of a loan, credit cards and all the basics - | 0:02:08 | 0:02:13 | |
phone, electricity and gas bills. | 0:02:13 | 0:02:15 | |
The stress was starting to show. | 0:02:16 | 0:02:19 | |
Stopped sleeping. It's almost like I'm allergic to sleep. You don't get a good night's sleep. | 0:02:19 | 0:02:24 | |
You fall asleep a little bit, | 0:02:24 | 0:02:26 | |
and something will trigger your brain, a bill or a phone call that you've had, or anything. | 0:02:26 | 0:02:32 | |
And it stops you... | 0:02:32 | 0:02:35 | |
it stops the way you normally are as a human being. | 0:02:35 | 0:02:39 | |
The stress just takes over. | 0:02:39 | 0:02:41 | |
In March 2011, the nightmare he dreaded actually happened. | 0:02:41 | 0:02:46 | |
Northern Rock repossessed his home. | 0:02:46 | 0:02:49 | |
When they resold the house at auction, | 0:02:49 | 0:02:52 | |
all they got for it was £67,000. | 0:02:52 | 0:02:55 | |
The shortfall against the mortgage was a massive £83,000. | 0:02:55 | 0:02:59 | |
This was money they expected Alan to pay quickly. | 0:03:00 | 0:03:04 | |
This was a terrible deal for Alan. | 0:03:04 | 0:03:05 | |
The veteran's debts were then a whopping £102,000. | 0:03:05 | 0:03:09 | |
It was almost too much to cope with. | 0:03:10 | 0:03:13 | |
I carried on, just feeling more depressed and more depressed | 0:03:13 | 0:03:18 | |
and then I got to the beginning of May and that's when I was - depending on your point of view - | 0:03:18 | 0:03:26 | |
selfish, silly, foolish and reckless. | 0:03:26 | 0:03:29 | |
That's when I tried to commit suicide. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:31 | |
Former policeman Mike Thomas is a registered debt counsellor | 0:03:33 | 0:03:37 | |
with 17 years experience. | 0:03:37 | 0:03:39 | |
He runs a website giving free advice to people with money worries. | 0:03:39 | 0:03:44 | |
He fights for the consumer rights of those who have taken up deals | 0:03:44 | 0:03:47 | |
they now regret. | 0:03:47 | 0:03:48 | |
Today, he's responding to an SOS call from Alan. | 0:03:49 | 0:03:53 | |
It would appear that the debts are getting too big an issue. | 0:03:53 | 0:03:57 | |
I've got to go in, find out what's going on, get to the bottom of it, | 0:03:57 | 0:04:00 | |
and see if I can find a way forward. | 0:04:00 | 0:04:02 | |
Today, Mike Thomas is meeting Alan for the first time. | 0:04:02 | 0:04:06 | |
To start, Mike works out Alan's budget, and he's quite shocked. | 0:04:07 | 0:04:13 | |
What do you spend on food? | 0:04:13 | 0:04:15 | |
-About 30. -For the month? -I'm not kidding. | 0:04:15 | 0:04:17 | |
Look in my cupboards. | 0:04:17 | 0:04:19 | |
That's my fridge. They're not mine, they're my brother's. Been there since he was last here. | 0:04:19 | 0:04:23 | |
I'm stunned. I've never seen anything like this. | 0:04:23 | 0:04:26 | |
I can't believe a bloke at 30 years of age in this country is living on £30 a month and surviving, on food. | 0:04:26 | 0:04:32 | |
Following such shocking evidence, Mike returns to Alan's budget. | 0:04:32 | 0:04:37 | |
Alan currently has a job in a parking lot - | 0:04:37 | 0:04:41 | |
but nearly everything he earns goes to pay off his debts. | 0:04:41 | 0:04:44 | |
Mike thinks he could negotiate with the creditors to leave him more to live on. | 0:04:44 | 0:04:48 | |
What if I said to you I could give you £50 a week? | 0:04:48 | 0:04:51 | |
It would properly, properly change my life. It just would. | 0:04:51 | 0:04:56 | |
As of this moment, no matter what solution we come to, | 0:04:56 | 0:04:59 | |
you're going to have £50 a week to spend on food and toiletries. | 0:04:59 | 0:05:03 | |
And there's no way a creditor or person that you owe money to | 0:05:03 | 0:05:07 | |
is going to get away with making you live on £30 a month. That's going to stop as of now. | 0:05:07 | 0:05:12 | |
Unfortunately, Mike's increased food budget has come too late to | 0:05:12 | 0:05:17 | |
save Alan's best friend, Henry. | 0:05:17 | 0:05:20 | |
I couldn't afford to feed him, so I had to let him go. | 0:05:20 | 0:05:23 | |
I had to make a choice, it was horrible. | 0:05:23 | 0:05:26 | |
He was the last thing that I lost, | 0:05:26 | 0:05:29 | |
the last thing, he really was - the last thing that... It broke my heart. | 0:05:29 | 0:05:35 | |
As the meeting continues, Mike learns more and more about Alan's lifestyle. | 0:05:35 | 0:05:40 | |
If I asked you now to find some cash, how much could you put your hands on in a couple of minutes now? | 0:05:40 | 0:05:45 | |
Nothing. There's nothing in the house. | 0:05:45 | 0:05:48 | |
-Nothing. Never any... -Have you got a £1 coin on you? -No. -50p? -No. | 0:05:48 | 0:05:53 | |
So you haven't got a penny on you? | 0:05:53 | 0:05:55 | |
Alan then explains to Mike the action that Northern Rock took. | 0:05:55 | 0:05:59 | |
-This is the Northern Rock... -Yes, the outstanding Northern Rock. | 0:05:59 | 0:06:03 | |
What do you think your house was worth? | 0:06:03 | 0:06:06 | |
Someone said 112, then the property sold at auction, I think, for 67. | 0:06:06 | 0:06:12 | |
£67,000? | 0:06:14 | 0:06:16 | |
Someone's bought themselves an absolute bargain, at your expense. | 0:06:16 | 0:06:20 | |
-When did they buy that? -It must have been around four weeks ago. | 0:06:20 | 0:06:24 | |
And already Northern Rock are writing to you asking for methods of repayment. | 0:06:24 | 0:06:27 | |
This is ridiculous. | 0:06:27 | 0:06:29 | |
Alan says Northern Rock offered him no advice or sympathy | 0:06:29 | 0:06:33 | |
and little time to pay. | 0:06:33 | 0:06:34 | |
We asked Northern Rock to comment. | 0:06:34 | 0:06:36 | |
They told us - | 0:06:36 | 0:06:38 | |
You've got £96 a month left over, give or take, | 0:07:20 | 0:07:23 | |
and that is to pay nearly £102,000. | 0:07:23 | 0:07:26 | |
After checking all the facts and figures, Mike has come to | 0:07:26 | 0:07:30 | |
the conclusion that there is only one sensible thing for Alan | 0:07:30 | 0:07:33 | |
to do to escape the consequences of his mortgage deal. | 0:07:33 | 0:07:37 | |
I've been with you now a number of hours | 0:07:37 | 0:07:40 | |
and I can clearly see what a hell of a time you've been through. | 0:07:40 | 0:07:43 | |
I see lots of people in my life, but you're in one of my top ten. | 0:07:43 | 0:07:47 | |
I just cannot believe how you've managed to survive and do things. | 0:07:48 | 0:07:53 | |
The option for you that is screaming is bankruptcy, | 0:07:53 | 0:07:56 | |
and it is the only way forward. | 0:07:56 | 0:08:00 | |
What it will do, it will ring fence all your other creditors, | 0:08:00 | 0:08:04 | |
it will stop these people from telephoning you, taking court action, | 0:08:04 | 0:08:09 | |
attachment of earnings. | 0:08:09 | 0:08:11 | |
You will deal with one authority, | 0:08:11 | 0:08:13 | |
which is the OR, Official Receivers Office, who are there to support you | 0:08:13 | 0:08:16 | |
provided you'll be an honest bankrupt, which is what you are. | 0:08:16 | 0:08:20 | |
You are an honest consumer bankrupt, I don't foresee any problems whatsoever. | 0:08:20 | 0:08:25 | |
And it's designed, it's legislation to rebuild your life, | 0:08:25 | 0:08:28 | |
because you're paying taxes, you're paying national insurance, | 0:08:28 | 0:08:31 | |
you're contributing to society, but you're getting dragged down by this debt that you can't deal with. | 0:08:31 | 0:08:36 | |
You've had triggers in your life. | 0:08:36 | 0:08:38 | |
For goodness sake, you've had a separation, you took a pay cut when | 0:08:38 | 0:08:40 | |
you came out the Army, it made you ill, it made you very unwell, you've | 0:08:40 | 0:08:44 | |
lost an awful lot of things, it's about time you started to rebuild. | 0:08:44 | 0:08:48 | |
But we've got a problem, how are you going to get the bankruptcy fees? | 0:08:48 | 0:08:54 | |
Going bankrupt costs £700 in fees, which Alan simply couldn't afford. | 0:08:54 | 0:08:58 | |
But Mike believes he can get an Army welfare organisation to meet those costs. | 0:08:58 | 0:09:03 | |
If he can, bankruptcy could come very quickly. | 0:09:03 | 0:09:07 | |
What if I said to you that if I can get these fees paid for you, | 0:09:07 | 0:09:11 | |
you could go bankrupt in the next three, four weeks, | 0:09:11 | 0:09:15 | |
and put an end to it all. | 0:09:15 | 0:09:16 | |
That's like a winning lottery ticket. | 0:09:16 | 0:09:19 | |
As the day ends, Mike leaves Alan to think about what he's been told. | 0:09:19 | 0:09:24 | |
This means more to me than I could simply put into words. | 0:09:24 | 0:09:28 | |
Every day it's always on my mind, every day I'm expecting someone to knock on my door. | 0:09:28 | 0:09:34 | |
Every day I'm expecting phone calls, every day I'm worrying how I'm going to make ends meet. | 0:09:34 | 0:09:40 | |
Every single day this is always on my mind. | 0:09:40 | 0:09:43 | |
Later, we'll see if Alan can end his mortgage nightmare. | 0:09:44 | 0:09:48 | |
But first, with people living on less, unsure of their jobs, | 0:09:54 | 0:09:58 | |
and their credit ratings pushed to the limit, | 0:09:58 | 0:10:01 | |
more of us are relying on stores that offer less stringent | 0:10:01 | 0:10:04 | |
credit checks and pay-weekly terms to buy household essentials. | 0:10:04 | 0:10:07 | |
But do these deals represent good value? | 0:10:08 | 0:10:11 | |
We've had a look at the deals from the UK's three most successful | 0:10:12 | 0:10:16 | |
pay-weekly stores. | 0:10:16 | 0:10:17 | |
Since the recession, business has been booming. | 0:10:17 | 0:10:21 | |
These stores allow people to buy items like cookers, | 0:10:21 | 0:10:23 | |
fridges and sofas, by paying in weekly instalments. | 0:10:23 | 0:10:27 | |
'At BrightHouse you can pay weekly for the things you need.' | 0:10:28 | 0:10:31 | |
'You'll want somewhere with | 0:10:31 | 0:10:33 | |
'the lowest weekly payments on the biggest brands.' | 0:10:33 | 0:10:36 | |
'There's something for everyone at Buy As You View.' | 0:10:36 | 0:10:40 | |
Sally doesn't want us to identify her, so it's not her real name. | 0:10:40 | 0:10:44 | |
She lives with her four children, | 0:10:45 | 0:10:47 | |
so when she needed a new cooker, | 0:10:47 | 0:10:49 | |
it was an essential she couldn't do without. | 0:10:49 | 0:10:52 | |
Unable to work, she thought pay-weekly was the most sensible option, | 0:10:52 | 0:10:55 | |
and visited her local Perfect Home store. | 0:10:55 | 0:10:59 | |
I went to Perfect Home to get the cooker | 0:10:59 | 0:11:01 | |
because they don't do credit checks, you have to give three references. | 0:11:01 | 0:11:06 | |
But, as simple as it was to buy the cooker, | 0:11:06 | 0:11:09 | |
the actual cost was a little more confusing. | 0:11:09 | 0:11:12 | |
She signed an agreement for a cooker which cost £927.99. | 0:11:12 | 0:11:17 | |
On top of that were three years of interest, totalling £404.25. | 0:11:17 | 0:11:23 | |
She was also sold maintenance vouchers costing £647.61, | 0:11:23 | 0:11:28 | |
with interest payable on those over three years of £280.59. | 0:11:28 | 0:11:34 | |
She was also to pay £3.09 per week for insurance. | 0:11:36 | 0:11:40 | |
That totalled £482.04. | 0:11:40 | 0:11:44 | |
And finally, she paid £105 to have the cooker installed. | 0:11:44 | 0:11:49 | |
So her £900 cooker was going to cost her £2,847.48. | 0:11:49 | 0:11:56 | |
Sally was to pay £17.58 a week. | 0:11:56 | 0:12:00 | |
To be quite honest, I went in with my eyes closed, to be fair. | 0:12:00 | 0:12:03 | |
Although the cooker would cost her over £2,800, because she was | 0:12:03 | 0:12:08 | |
only paying £17.58 a week, Sally thought it was affordable. | 0:12:08 | 0:12:14 | |
The same cooker was recently on sale in several leading high street stores | 0:12:14 | 0:12:17 | |
for under £700. | 0:12:17 | 0:12:19 | |
Damon Gibbons is the director of the Centre for Responsible Credit | 0:12:19 | 0:12:25 | |
and he thinks these types of deals are very bad news for people like Sally. | 0:12:25 | 0:12:29 | |
Our biggest concern about this sector of the credit industry is the cost. | 0:12:29 | 0:12:33 | |
The fact that they are targeted to people on low incomes and for whom | 0:12:33 | 0:12:37 | |
many people will have had problems repaying credit in past. | 0:12:37 | 0:12:41 | |
Once you've added in some of the optional service covers | 0:12:41 | 0:12:44 | |
and insurances it's a huge amount to pay. | 0:12:44 | 0:12:47 | |
It really is a problem of the poor paying the most for essential items | 0:12:47 | 0:12:52 | |
which anybody really needs in their home in today's day and age. | 0:12:52 | 0:12:56 | |
Damon's been investigating | 0:12:58 | 0:13:00 | |
whether the deal Sally got was typical or unusual. | 0:13:00 | 0:13:03 | |
On the same day in the Midlands, he visited BrightHouse and Perfect Home, | 0:13:03 | 0:13:07 | |
and spoke to a salesman about what deal he could expect on a typical | 0:13:07 | 0:13:11 | |
home necessity, a fridge freezer, one that was stocked at each store. | 0:13:11 | 0:13:14 | |
He also checked out the same fridge freezer on Buy As You View - | 0:13:15 | 0:13:18 | |
who don't operate on the high street, so he went onto their website. | 0:13:18 | 0:13:22 | |
The mid-range fridge freezer we chose was widely available | 0:13:22 | 0:13:27 | |
in other stores for around £600. | 0:13:27 | 0:13:30 | |
So I'm on the Buy As You View website, | 0:13:30 | 0:13:33 | |
and I've found the fridge freezer. | 0:13:33 | 0:13:34 | |
It gives the headline price, the cash price of the item, | 0:13:34 | 0:13:38 | |
and then it gives the weekly rate. | 0:13:38 | 0:13:40 | |
Doesn't really talk about any additional covers, or insurances which might be required. | 0:13:42 | 0:13:49 | |
Damon couldn't actually find all the information | 0:13:49 | 0:13:52 | |
he wanted on their website so we rang them direct to get the details. | 0:13:52 | 0:13:56 | |
'There's something for everyone at Buy As You View.' | 0:13:56 | 0:13:59 | |
The Buy As You View deal works out like this - | 0:14:00 | 0:14:04 | |
the fridge freezer costs £799.99. | 0:14:04 | 0:14:08 | |
The interest would be £589.87. | 0:14:08 | 0:14:12 | |
A total of £1,389.96. | 0:14:12 | 0:14:16 | |
But if the optional maintenance | 0:14:16 | 0:14:18 | |
and insurance is taken, | 0:14:18 | 0:14:20 | |
the new total is £1684.80 | 0:14:20 | 0:14:23 | |
Then Damon visited BrightHouse. | 0:14:25 | 0:14:28 | |
I think BrightHouse were fairly up front with regards to pricing, | 0:14:28 | 0:14:31 | |
and the way that was composed of the cash price of the goods, | 0:14:31 | 0:14:37 | |
the optional service cover, and damage liability cover. | 0:14:37 | 0:14:41 | |
But Damon had a problem finding out | 0:14:41 | 0:14:43 | |
the full details of the deal in the store. | 0:14:43 | 0:14:46 | |
We were asking for a copy of the terms and conditions to | 0:14:46 | 0:14:49 | |
be given to us, and there was a real reluctance to do that. | 0:14:49 | 0:14:53 | |
We both love our weekly payment store! | 0:14:53 | 0:14:55 | |
The BrightHouse deal works out like this - | 0:14:57 | 0:15:00 | |
the fridge freezer costs £724.97. | 0:15:00 | 0:15:03 | |
The interest would be £318.67. | 0:15:03 | 0:15:07 | |
A total of £1,043.64. | 0:15:07 | 0:15:10 | |
But if the optional maintenance | 0:15:10 | 0:15:12 | |
and insurance is taken, | 0:15:12 | 0:15:15 | |
the new total is £1,845.48. | 0:15:15 | 0:15:19 | |
Next up, Perfect Home. | 0:15:19 | 0:15:21 | |
I think with Perfect Homes it was difficult to get | 0:15:21 | 0:15:24 | |
the information that most consumers would want from a salesperson. | 0:15:24 | 0:15:29 | |
There were some missing key bits of financial information on the actual fridge freezer itself. | 0:15:29 | 0:15:38 | |
So, for example, it didn't tell you about the insurance aspects of it, | 0:15:38 | 0:15:42 | |
and it was a bit vague when it came to exactly how much money that was going to cost. | 0:15:42 | 0:15:47 | |
'If you want the perfect home, then come to Perfect Home.' | 0:15:47 | 0:15:50 | |
The Perfect Home deal works out like this - | 0:15:50 | 0:15:54 | |
the fridge freezer costs £799.99. | 0:15:54 | 0:15:58 | |
Total interest would £295.13. | 0:15:58 | 0:16:02 | |
A total of £1,095.12. | 0:16:02 | 0:16:06 | |
But if the optional maintenance and insurance is taken, | 0:16:06 | 0:16:09 | |
the new total is £2,168.40. | 0:16:09 | 0:16:13 | |
So the worst deal on that fridge freezer, | 0:16:13 | 0:16:15 | |
that you could buy elsewhere for £600, | 0:16:15 | 0:16:19 | |
was Perfect Home at £2,168.40, | 0:16:19 | 0:16:23 | |
if you include optional maintenance and insurance. | 0:16:23 | 0:16:26 | |
Even beyond the issue of price alone, there's a question mark here | 0:16:26 | 0:16:31 | |
around the terms and conditions, the transparency | 0:16:31 | 0:16:33 | |
how these things are sold to people, | 0:16:33 | 0:16:35 | |
and whether or not they're really in a position to exercise choice. | 0:16:35 | 0:16:41 | |
We asked the companies to comment. | 0:16:41 | 0:16:43 | |
Buy As You View told us - | 0:16:43 | 0:16:48 | |
BrightHouse made this statement - | 0:17:10 | 0:17:13 | |
Perfect Home did not respond. | 0:17:45 | 0:17:47 | |
If you've got money troubles, then the type of deal you do with | 0:17:50 | 0:17:54 | |
your creditors is critical. Get it wrong and you could lose your home. | 0:17:54 | 0:17:59 | |
Mandy Farmer is on the brink of becoming one of the 100 people | 0:17:59 | 0:18:03 | |
every day who have their homes repossessed. | 0:18:03 | 0:18:05 | |
Mandy had worked for many years with no money worries. | 0:18:06 | 0:18:10 | |
When her father died, she moved in with her mother to | 0:18:10 | 0:18:13 | |
the old family home. | 0:18:13 | 0:18:15 | |
I've lived with my mum because once my dad passed away she didn't want | 0:18:15 | 0:18:18 | |
to be on her own. It's been the family home for 55 years. | 0:18:18 | 0:18:22 | |
I've lived here, | 0:18:22 | 0:18:25 | |
I've been brought up here, I've grown up here, all the memories are here. | 0:18:25 | 0:18:29 | |
Back in 2008, Mandy made what would become a disastrous deal. | 0:18:29 | 0:18:34 | |
She consolidated her unsecured debts with her mother's, | 0:18:34 | 0:18:38 | |
and secured them against the family home. | 0:18:38 | 0:18:40 | |
I was finding it was costing me | 0:18:40 | 0:18:43 | |
more to pay it all separately than it was to get it all paid | 0:18:43 | 0:18:47 | |
in the one payment, and it was easier each month to do it that way. | 0:18:47 | 0:18:53 | |
Mandy had a regular salary, so there were no problems with repayments. | 0:18:53 | 0:18:57 | |
But in 2009, her mum had devastating news. | 0:18:57 | 0:19:02 | |
About a year ago, year-and-a-half ago, she was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. | 0:19:02 | 0:19:07 | |
I had to wash her, I had to clean her, had to feed her. If we went out, | 0:19:07 | 0:19:11 | |
she had to be put in a wheelchair, I was literally doing everything. | 0:19:11 | 0:19:15 | |
I then had to give up my full-time job | 0:19:15 | 0:19:19 | |
because she needed 24-hour care. | 0:19:19 | 0:19:22 | |
So, with her mum dependent on her at every turn, | 0:19:23 | 0:19:25 | |
and now with no income, Mandy had no choice but to claim benefits. | 0:19:25 | 0:19:30 | |
She called the finance company who had given her the loan straight away. | 0:19:30 | 0:19:34 | |
I explained the situation and that I would only be receiving | 0:19:34 | 0:19:38 | |
Carer's Allowance until whenever, | 0:19:38 | 0:19:41 | |
and sort of tried to make an agreement with them | 0:19:41 | 0:19:44 | |
and sort a form of payment out. | 0:19:44 | 0:19:46 | |
But the finance company was adamant. | 0:19:46 | 0:19:49 | |
They wanted the full amount due to be paid every month | 0:19:49 | 0:19:52 | |
and they wouldn't renegotiate a smaller amount | 0:19:52 | 0:19:55 | |
while Mandy was in difficulties. | 0:19:55 | 0:19:57 | |
Once they said to me they needed | 0:19:57 | 0:19:59 | |
the full amount, I just couldn't afford it. | 0:19:59 | 0:20:02 | |
Being on Carer's Allowance, | 0:20:02 | 0:20:03 | |
it was more than what I was getting for Carer's Allowance. | 0:20:03 | 0:20:07 | |
There wasn't a lot I could do, just panic, basically, | 0:20:07 | 0:20:11 | |
because I knew I was going to get this debt. | 0:20:11 | 0:20:14 | |
For the next 12 months, Mandy gave her mum the best care she could, | 0:20:15 | 0:20:19 | |
until one day she was admitted to hospital. | 0:20:19 | 0:20:21 | |
I went in to see her, I walked into the ward, and said hello, | 0:20:21 | 0:20:27 | |
gave her a kiss, turned away, turned back, and that was it, she was gone. | 0:20:27 | 0:20:34 | |
So within five minutes, if I was five minutes late, she'd have been gone. | 0:20:34 | 0:20:37 | |
Mandy contacted the finance company to let them know of her mum's death. | 0:20:40 | 0:20:45 | |
She told them she was no longer entitled to Carer's Allowance. | 0:20:45 | 0:20:48 | |
In short, she was living on even less money. | 0:20:48 | 0:20:52 | |
My mum passed away end of April. | 0:20:52 | 0:20:54 | |
The first letter I got was about the end of May, beginning of June, | 0:20:55 | 0:20:59 | |
to say they'd be going to court and taking possession of the house. | 0:20:59 | 0:21:05 | |
Mandy had found herself in the same awful position | 0:21:05 | 0:21:08 | |
as tens of thousands of other people. | 0:21:08 | 0:21:11 | |
Due to circumstances beyond her control, | 0:21:11 | 0:21:14 | |
she was unable to repay a loan that was secured on her home. | 0:21:14 | 0:21:17 | |
That deal meant she now risked repossession of the property | 0:21:18 | 0:21:22 | |
that had been in her family for 55 years. | 0:21:22 | 0:21:25 | |
The house where she grew up. | 0:21:25 | 0:21:27 | |
I think I just burst out crying. | 0:21:27 | 0:21:30 | |
That day, as soon as I read the letter, I thought, that's it, | 0:21:30 | 0:21:33 | |
I've failed, I've lost the house. | 0:21:33 | 0:21:34 | |
I was sort of still grieving for my mum. | 0:21:34 | 0:21:38 | |
I just collapsed in tears. | 0:21:38 | 0:21:40 | |
Later, we'll find out if Mandy can save the family home. | 0:21:40 | 0:21:44 | |
It's an early morning start in Hull for the Illegal Money Lending Team. | 0:21:47 | 0:21:52 | |
They target the loan sharks who prey on people with poor credit histories. | 0:21:52 | 0:21:57 | |
A deal with a loan shark is the worst deal imaginable. | 0:21:57 | 0:22:01 | |
Today, with local police, they have a warrant to search | 0:22:01 | 0:22:04 | |
the home of Lee Bates, a man they suspect of illegal money lending. | 0:22:04 | 0:22:09 | |
The officers knock on the door. There's no answer. | 0:22:10 | 0:22:14 | |
The team are ready to force entry. | 0:22:14 | 0:22:16 | |
Then one of the officers spots Lee Bates in an upstairs window. | 0:22:17 | 0:22:21 | |
Open the door! | 0:22:21 | 0:22:23 | |
Just as the police prepare to make their way into the property, | 0:22:23 | 0:22:26 | |
someone answers the door. | 0:22:26 | 0:22:29 | |
Once inside, the search begins. | 0:22:29 | 0:22:32 | |
DOG BARKS | 0:22:32 | 0:22:34 | |
Tony Quigley is the head of the national Illegal Money Lending Team. | 0:22:34 | 0:22:38 | |
What he wants is evidence of the loan shark's victims - | 0:22:38 | 0:22:41 | |
perhaps a loan book listing people who have borrowed money, | 0:22:41 | 0:22:44 | |
computer records, or cash. | 0:22:44 | 0:22:47 | |
His team deal with the victims of loan sharks on a regular basis | 0:22:47 | 0:22:53 | |
and some of their stories are harrowing. | 0:22:53 | 0:22:56 | |
Mike, which is not his real name, | 0:22:56 | 0:22:59 | |
says borrowing from a loan shark was his worst deal. | 0:22:59 | 0:23:03 | |
He wants to remain anonymous because he still fears for his safety. | 0:23:03 | 0:23:07 | |
He paid a loan shark for 19 years and suffered intimidation and violence. | 0:23:07 | 0:23:12 | |
It all started with a £300 loan to buy a car from | 0:23:12 | 0:23:16 | |
someone he thought was being helpful - a deal he would live to regret. | 0:23:16 | 0:23:21 | |
When I couldn't pay him, he increased what I owed him. | 0:23:21 | 0:23:25 | |
Then he'd increase the payments and it just got right out of control. | 0:23:25 | 0:23:30 | |
He never once told us what interest he was going to put on, never told us how much we owe him. | 0:23:30 | 0:23:36 | |
If we ever asked it was just, "Oh, you owe me a lot." | 0:23:36 | 0:23:40 | |
I was laid up ill on the settee once, and he just started knocking into me. | 0:23:40 | 0:23:44 | |
Me mate came around and tried sticking up for me, and he beat the living daylights out of my mate, | 0:23:44 | 0:23:49 | |
in front of my kids. | 0:23:49 | 0:23:50 | |
And so... | 0:23:50 | 0:23:53 | |
We just continuously paid, because of the intimidation. | 0:23:53 | 0:23:56 | |
He was the very first thing that we made sure we paid, week in, week out. | 0:23:56 | 0:24:00 | |
Weren't bothered about rent, water, food, gas, electric, weren't bothered about none of that, | 0:24:00 | 0:24:07 | |
as long as he was paid first. | 0:24:07 | 0:24:09 | |
Because if we didn't pay him, I was liable to get another hiding. | 0:24:11 | 0:24:16 | |
When he couldn't meet the payments, | 0:24:16 | 0:24:18 | |
Mike often borrowed more money from the loan shark to pay back | 0:24:18 | 0:24:21 | |
the original loan, and it had a devastating effect on him and his family. | 0:24:21 | 0:24:26 | |
It affected me relationship with me wife, at times we split up. | 0:24:27 | 0:24:32 | |
I ended up with depression, I lost me job because of depression. | 0:24:32 | 0:24:36 | |
I tried to commit suicide, the police picked me up one day, well, one night. | 0:24:38 | 0:24:42 | |
I had a rope in the back of the car, was going to hang myself, they stopped me. | 0:24:42 | 0:24:46 | |
I had a heart attack because of the stress. | 0:24:46 | 0:24:49 | |
I collapsed at work, because I was so ill and should have taken time off, but daren't because obviously | 0:24:49 | 0:24:55 | |
I wanted to keep on paying him. | 0:24:55 | 0:24:57 | |
Mike estimates that across those 19 years, | 0:24:57 | 0:25:01 | |
he actually borrowed about £2,500. | 0:25:01 | 0:25:04 | |
But what he paid to the loan shark was an awful lot more. | 0:25:04 | 0:25:09 | |
In excess of 90,000. | 0:25:09 | 0:25:11 | |
That is a rough guess. | 0:25:13 | 0:25:16 | |
The early morning raid by the Illegal Money Lending Team | 0:25:16 | 0:25:19 | |
on the home of suspected loan shark Lee Bates continues. | 0:25:19 | 0:25:23 | |
Head of the team, Tony Quigley, is waiting to see | 0:25:23 | 0:25:27 | |
if his officers have found evidence to warrant an arrest. | 0:25:27 | 0:25:31 | |
Officers are in the property at the moment, examining paperwork and bits and pieces, | 0:25:31 | 0:25:35 | |
to see whether or not there's any evidence to be seized, | 0:25:35 | 0:25:39 | |
and then we'll have a decision on whether or not there's sufficient to effect an arrest. | 0:25:39 | 0:25:44 | |
The search has taken most of the morning. | 0:25:44 | 0:25:47 | |
The officers cannot afford to leave anything to chance, | 0:25:47 | 0:25:51 | |
and work to ensure nothing is missed. | 0:25:51 | 0:25:54 | |
Search every room, and inspect all the documentation, | 0:25:54 | 0:26:00 | |
and we believe that we have found some material | 0:26:00 | 0:26:03 | |
that is worth seizing. | 0:26:03 | 0:26:05 | |
And there's some cash as well that will be taken. | 0:26:05 | 0:26:08 | |
Finally, with the search at an end, | 0:26:10 | 0:26:12 | |
the team believe they have enough evidence for an arrest. | 0:26:12 | 0:26:15 | |
I am arresting you on suspicion of illegal money lending, | 0:26:15 | 0:26:18 | |
collecting, also money laundering between October 2010 to present day. | 0:26:18 | 0:26:24 | |
You do not have to say anything... | 0:26:24 | 0:26:26 | |
The Illegal Money Lending Team are carrying out raids like this | 0:26:31 | 0:26:35 | |
continually across the country. | 0:26:35 | 0:26:37 | |
The next step in this case is to discover who else may be involved | 0:26:37 | 0:26:41 | |
and who may be a victim. | 0:26:41 | 0:26:44 | |
One of the key things is that we move as quickly as we can now | 0:26:44 | 0:26:49 | |
to establish who's involved and what size the operation is. | 0:26:49 | 0:26:55 | |
And it's quite clear, really, that we need to identify people who may have | 0:26:55 | 0:27:00 | |
had loans from this particular person. | 0:27:00 | 0:27:02 | |
Lee Bates was subsequently charged | 0:27:04 | 0:27:06 | |
and convicted of two counts of illegal money lending. | 0:27:06 | 0:27:08 | |
He received a two-year community order plus 180 hours of unpaid work. | 0:27:08 | 0:27:14 | |
Mike, who was a victim of a different loan shark, | 0:27:14 | 0:27:18 | |
eventually contacted the Illegal Money Lending Team | 0:27:18 | 0:27:21 | |
after reading about another of their successful operations. | 0:27:21 | 0:27:24 | |
I see a bit in the newspaper about another loan shark being caught | 0:27:24 | 0:27:29 | |
and there was a contact e-mail on there, so I contacted the loan shark team. | 0:27:29 | 0:27:35 | |
The loan shark texted me the following day saying it was pay day. | 0:27:35 | 0:27:38 | |
I arranged to meet him, and he turned around and said, "If the money's not paid then I'll go after your wife." | 0:27:38 | 0:27:45 | |
That was the final straw. I then contacted the loan shark team again, | 0:27:45 | 0:27:49 | |
sat down and spoke with one member of them. | 0:27:49 | 0:27:51 | |
He was absolutely fantastic, everything he promised and assured me, he delivered. | 0:27:51 | 0:27:57 | |
Mike's loan shark was prosecuted, pleaded guilty | 0:27:57 | 0:28:01 | |
and received a prison sentence. | 0:28:01 | 0:28:03 | |
When I heard he'd been sent down, I mean, I'm a man, I don't admit to nearly crying, | 0:28:03 | 0:28:08 | |
and I did, I nearly cried. | 0:28:08 | 0:28:11 | |
Just with relief. | 0:28:11 | 0:28:13 | |
Mike's case is just one of many that the Illegal Money Lending Team | 0:28:14 | 0:28:18 | |
deal with all the time. | 0:28:18 | 0:28:20 | |
The stories, though tragic, are often so similar. | 0:28:20 | 0:28:24 | |
With most of these illegal lenders, they come across as your best friend. | 0:28:24 | 0:28:29 | |
It's all about trapping you into that spiral of debt. | 0:28:29 | 0:28:32 | |
You know, if they were nasty to you from the start, you would stay away from them. | 0:28:32 | 0:28:37 | |
But they appear to be the knight in shining armour. | 0:28:37 | 0:28:40 | |
You're in financial difficulties and they come through the door and everything they can help you with. | 0:28:40 | 0:28:46 | |
That's how they respond, and it is that relationship, you know, we're best buddies. | 0:28:46 | 0:28:52 | |
Yeah, I'll give you the money, and I'll give you that instant decision. | 0:28:52 | 0:28:55 | |
But it's when you find you have further difficulties, when you see the real side of them. | 0:28:55 | 0:29:00 | |
It's made a massive difference. Me and me wife, we get on so well now, we don't argue, | 0:29:00 | 0:29:06 | |
because there's no money issues. | 0:29:06 | 0:29:09 | |
Before we wouldn't have dreamt of going to Blackpool, or going to Dorset, | 0:29:09 | 0:29:12 | |
but in April, we're going to Blackpool. | 0:29:12 | 0:29:15 | |
In September-time, hopefully, we're going to be going down to Dorset, if I can get time off work. | 0:29:15 | 0:29:19 | |
It's just so much difference. | 0:29:19 | 0:29:21 | |
The small market town of Royal Wootton Bassett in Wiltshire | 0:29:26 | 0:29:30 | |
is the home of an unlikely heroine. | 0:29:30 | 0:29:33 | |
Josie Lewis's worst deal brought her to the brink of a financial disaster. | 0:29:33 | 0:29:37 | |
But it wasn't with a back street lender, or an online loan company. | 0:29:37 | 0:29:42 | |
Instead, she took on her bank, the mighty HSBC. | 0:29:42 | 0:29:46 | |
It was all about these, her bank charges. | 0:29:47 | 0:29:50 | |
None of us like them, but for Josie they led to an extraordinary confrontation at the bank. | 0:29:50 | 0:29:56 | |
I've always been on a low wage so money has been tight. | 0:29:56 | 0:29:59 | |
Once I start getting into financial difficulties, it is difficult to get out. | 0:29:59 | 0:30:04 | |
When she did not have enough funds to cover direct debits, | 0:30:04 | 0:30:08 | |
she incurred bank charges. | 0:30:08 | 0:30:10 | |
She got into a cycle of missing more payments and getting more charges. | 0:30:10 | 0:30:15 | |
It reached a point where the bank was taking nearly | 0:30:15 | 0:30:17 | |
a third of my salary in bank charges, | 0:30:17 | 0:30:19 | |
which then means there are insufficient funds | 0:30:19 | 0:30:21 | |
to pay your mortgage, Council Tax and essential bills. | 0:30:21 | 0:30:25 | |
The deal then got even worse. | 0:30:25 | 0:30:28 | |
Josie had to have an overdraft of £1,000 to help cover | 0:30:28 | 0:30:32 | |
some of the outstanding bank charges on her account. | 0:30:32 | 0:30:36 | |
One day, she was surprised to hear from the bank that they wanted | 0:30:36 | 0:30:41 | |
all the outstanding charges paid off immediately. | 0:30:41 | 0:30:44 | |
She simply couldn't afford it. She was unable to pay. | 0:30:44 | 0:30:47 | |
Far from helping its customer with their finances, | 0:30:49 | 0:30:52 | |
the bank itself had become the problem. | 0:30:52 | 0:30:56 | |
I had 2,440 in bank charges. That kept my account in the red by 2,100. | 0:30:56 | 0:31:03 | |
Worried the bank would use her wages to pay off all the outstanding charges, | 0:31:03 | 0:31:07 | |
and leave her with nothing, | 0:31:07 | 0:31:09 | |
Josie felt forced to open a bank account elsewhere. | 0:31:09 | 0:31:14 | |
She then asked HSBC to put the account on hold. | 0:31:14 | 0:31:17 | |
I wrote to the bank saying, "You will freeze my account. | 0:31:17 | 0:31:20 | |
"It is not to be used. There are no standing orders to go out. | 0:31:20 | 0:31:23 | |
"There are no transactions whatsoever to be going out." | 0:31:23 | 0:31:27 | |
That didn't work. The bank just ignored it. | 0:31:27 | 0:31:29 | |
HSBC continued to draw money from the account, | 0:31:29 | 0:31:33 | |
putting charges on top of charges. | 0:31:33 | 0:31:35 | |
-Josie was desperate for help. -I wrote to the ombudsman. | 0:31:35 | 0:31:40 | |
He found in my favour. It took ages. It took several months, but he found that bank charges were causing | 0:31:40 | 0:31:45 | |
financial hardship and the bank must deal with these sympathetically. | 0:31:45 | 0:31:49 | |
As a result of her complaint, | 0:31:49 | 0:31:51 | |
the bank offered her £440 to help cover two months' worth of bills. | 0:31:51 | 0:31:56 | |
But that was by no means the end of the matter. | 0:31:56 | 0:31:59 | |
It seemed to Josie that the bank then became | 0:31:59 | 0:32:02 | |
more relentless in pursuing the outstanding charges. | 0:32:02 | 0:32:06 | |
I kept getting hundreds of phone calls, | 0:32:06 | 0:32:08 | |
some of which were threatening. | 0:32:08 | 0:32:10 | |
'Saying to me, "Miss Lewis, you owe was money. When are you going to pay us? | 0:32:10 | 0:32:15 | |
'"These calls won't stop unless you pay us the money."' | 0:32:15 | 0:32:18 | |
It would be on your mind all the time and I can see how people | 0:32:18 | 0:32:22 | |
get suicidal when they've got debts and when someone is chasing them for money. | 0:32:22 | 0:32:27 | |
Josie decided that things had come to a head | 0:32:27 | 0:32:30 | |
and she needed to speak to the bank manager. | 0:32:30 | 0:32:32 | |
Mr Hicks said, "OK, we'll go into the interview room | 0:32:32 | 0:32:35 | |
"and we'll discuss the bank charges." | 0:32:35 | 0:32:37 | |
When we went into the interview room, | 0:32:38 | 0:32:40 | |
he made a big point of locking the door. | 0:32:40 | 0:32:43 | |
He was making it very purposeful, locking the door. | 0:32:43 | 0:32:47 | |
He was making a point of it. That is what I found scary. | 0:32:47 | 0:32:50 | |
He sat down and said, | 0:32:51 | 0:32:53 | |
"We'll go through a financial review for you." | 0:32:53 | 0:32:56 | |
Then he said, "I'm sorry, Miss Lewis. I can't stop these charges." | 0:32:56 | 0:33:00 | |
Josie felt that if he could not do anything about the charges, | 0:33:00 | 0:33:03 | |
the interview was pointless and got up to leave. | 0:33:03 | 0:33:06 | |
Again, he's across the door like this. "No, no, Miss Lewis, it's all right." | 0:33:06 | 0:33:11 | |
By this time, I'm asking to be let out. | 0:33:11 | 0:33:13 | |
The girls have heard all the commotion and they have come through | 0:33:13 | 0:33:17 | |
from the rear door of the interview room to see what is going on. | 0:33:17 | 0:33:20 | |
They could see I was scared. They could see I was in tears. | 0:33:20 | 0:33:23 | |
They could see I was frightened, but I don't think | 0:33:23 | 0:33:26 | |
they had been trained to deal with a situation like that. | 0:33:26 | 0:33:29 | |
The next day, Josie lodged a complaint with the bank. | 0:33:29 | 0:33:32 | |
But the investigation was led by Mr Chris Hicks - | 0:33:33 | 0:33:37 | |
the very man who had locked her in his office. | 0:33:37 | 0:33:40 | |
As she battled to sort out her finances, | 0:33:40 | 0:33:43 | |
with no help from her bank, Josie looked for a way out. | 0:33:43 | 0:33:47 | |
It was affecting my working life, my concentration, my sleep and all | 0:33:47 | 0:33:52 | |
my time was being taken up writing to the bank, dealing with the bank. | 0:33:52 | 0:33:56 | |
I put all my debts with the debt management agency, | 0:33:56 | 0:34:01 | |
that means that the bank and any creditors cannot harass you for money. | 0:34:01 | 0:34:05 | |
They have to deal with the debt management agency. | 0:34:05 | 0:34:08 | |
Whale Josie thought this would be a solution, the bank obviously didn't. | 0:34:08 | 0:34:12 | |
They continued to harass her. | 0:34:12 | 0:34:15 | |
The calls continued. I was getting nowhere with the bank. | 0:34:15 | 0:34:18 | |
I was getting very distressed, having sleepless nights. | 0:34:18 | 0:34:23 | |
The only option was to take the bank to court. | 0:34:23 | 0:34:25 | |
But she didn't have enough money to pay a solicitor for the hearing, | 0:34:25 | 0:34:29 | |
so she represented herself. | 0:34:29 | 0:34:30 | |
I won my case. I won it on three counts. | 0:34:31 | 0:34:34 | |
The judge found that the bank had failed in its care and professional | 0:34:34 | 0:34:38 | |
skill in handling my account. | 0:34:38 | 0:34:39 | |
She found that the bank was guilty of harassment with phone calls, which were threatening. | 0:34:39 | 0:34:44 | |
She also found that the bank manager was guilty of false imprisonment | 0:34:44 | 0:34:47 | |
and that he had caused intimidation and distress during that interview. | 0:34:47 | 0:34:52 | |
After months of fighting with HSBC, they eventually apologised to Josie. | 0:34:52 | 0:34:58 | |
The judge ordered that the bank discharge | 0:34:58 | 0:35:01 | |
over £2,000 worth of charges. | 0:35:01 | 0:35:03 | |
I'm really pleased and lots of other people have since said to me | 0:35:03 | 0:35:08 | |
what a brilliant job I had done. | 0:35:08 | 0:35:12 | |
I had had the strength to see it through. | 0:35:12 | 0:35:15 | |
I've got a new nickname. It's Bankslayer. | 0:35:15 | 0:35:18 | |
Mandy Farmer's worst deal was with a finance company that said | 0:35:23 | 0:35:27 | |
they would consolidate her loans and secure them against her property. | 0:35:27 | 0:35:32 | |
It's a deal that has left her on the brink of losing her home. | 0:35:32 | 0:35:35 | |
Mandy was about to get some help. | 0:35:35 | 0:35:38 | |
She lives in Basingstoke and the local authority | 0:35:38 | 0:35:42 | |
had been startled by the high number of repossessions in the area. | 0:35:42 | 0:35:46 | |
The council employed Mark Fisher, an expert debt adviser. | 0:35:46 | 0:35:50 | |
His mission was simple. | 0:35:50 | 0:35:51 | |
To stop Basingstoke's properties from falling into the control | 0:35:51 | 0:35:55 | |
of the banks and finance companies and keep people in their homes | 0:35:55 | 0:35:58 | |
if at all possible. | 0:35:58 | 0:36:00 | |
This is about the stability of the community. | 0:36:00 | 0:36:03 | |
Homeowners and businesses form the backbone of our community. | 0:36:03 | 0:36:07 | |
What we want to do is keep people where they are. | 0:36:07 | 0:36:09 | |
If we see people moving out of their homes, | 0:36:09 | 0:36:12 | |
they have got to be going somewhere. | 0:36:12 | 0:36:13 | |
If we presume they are not all leaving the borough, | 0:36:13 | 0:36:16 | |
they must be moving in with other people, | 0:36:16 | 0:36:18 | |
so they can be putting pressure on other homes. | 0:36:18 | 0:36:21 | |
It will be difficult with the housing register because people will be | 0:36:21 | 0:36:25 | |
looking to come onto an already stressed housing register. | 0:36:25 | 0:36:28 | |
Because councils have to be informed about repossession orders, | 0:36:28 | 0:36:33 | |
Mark became aware that Mandy was due in court | 0:36:33 | 0:36:35 | |
and on the brink of losing her home. | 0:36:35 | 0:36:37 | |
I'm one of these that tries to sort it out myself, | 0:36:37 | 0:36:40 | |
but it has obviously got to the stage this time where I can't. | 0:36:40 | 0:36:44 | |
I am hoping, relying on Mark. | 0:36:44 | 0:36:47 | |
With just two days until the court hearing, Mark needs | 0:36:49 | 0:36:53 | |
to prepare a concrete defence and he has got something up his sleeve. | 0:36:53 | 0:36:58 | |
Any loan under 25,000 is regulated by the Consumer Credit Act. | 0:36:58 | 0:37:02 | |
That means that you can apply for something called a time order. | 0:37:02 | 0:37:06 | |
A time order means asking the court to change the deal and give you | 0:37:06 | 0:37:10 | |
more time to pay a loan if you have fallen behind with the payments, | 0:37:10 | 0:37:14 | |
irrespective of what the original deal stated. | 0:37:14 | 0:37:17 | |
The judge has absolute discretion to do whatever | 0:37:17 | 0:37:20 | |
he chooses in that case about the repayment. | 0:37:20 | 0:37:23 | |
It is based on the means to pay and the intent to pay. | 0:37:23 | 0:37:29 | |
But getting a time order isn't necessarily easy. | 0:37:29 | 0:37:33 | |
It means Mandy must appear in court and tell the judge about her difficult personal circumstances | 0:37:33 | 0:37:39 | |
and convince the court that she will pay the loan. | 0:37:39 | 0:37:43 | |
If they repossess the house, I haven't got any plans | 0:37:43 | 0:37:45 | |
because, at this precise moment, I've got nowhere to go. | 0:37:45 | 0:37:47 | |
I'll be living in my car. | 0:37:47 | 0:37:50 | |
It's the big day and Mandy drives off to the court. | 0:37:50 | 0:37:53 | |
She leaves her home not knowing if she has a future there. | 0:37:53 | 0:37:57 | |
Mark arrives at the court too and he tries to help Mandy keep calm. | 0:37:58 | 0:38:03 | |
-Feeling nervous? -Scared. | 0:38:03 | 0:38:05 | |
You won't have to say anything. | 0:38:05 | 0:38:07 | |
All the judge is going to do is ask you who you are. | 0:38:07 | 0:38:10 | |
He will understand you are a bit nervous. | 0:38:10 | 0:38:12 | |
It's just a case of what we can put in front of him | 0:38:12 | 0:38:17 | |
that he's going to be happy with. | 0:38:17 | 0:38:20 | |
I just got it in my head that I'm not going home after today. | 0:38:20 | 0:38:25 | |
Can't tell with the court because it's down to the judge, | 0:38:25 | 0:38:28 | |
not what I think. It's what the court thinks. | 0:38:28 | 0:38:31 | |
I think the best thing is we go in there and keep our fingers crossed. | 0:38:31 | 0:38:37 | |
-Are you all right? -I think so. -You won't have to do a lot. | 0:38:37 | 0:38:42 | |
Just follow my lead, all right? | 0:38:42 | 0:38:45 | |
OK. | 0:38:45 | 0:38:46 | |
After an agonising legal battle, finally, | 0:38:52 | 0:38:55 | |
Mandy and Mark emerge from the courts. | 0:38:55 | 0:38:58 | |
Yeah, we got a time order. | 0:39:02 | 0:39:03 | |
It is going to be reviewed after four months, | 0:39:03 | 0:39:06 | |
but we got all the terms that we wanted. | 0:39:06 | 0:39:08 | |
Yeah. | 0:39:08 | 0:39:09 | |
The solicitor didn't know where he was. | 0:39:09 | 0:39:11 | |
-He didn't know where to look. -We got a good result there. | 0:39:11 | 0:39:14 | |
Excellent. I'm really pleased. | 0:39:14 | 0:39:16 | |
Mark put the case to him about what we would offer and all that. | 0:39:16 | 0:39:20 | |
He just looked through it and agreed with it, basically. | 0:39:20 | 0:39:23 | |
I've got to come back for a review in about four months. | 0:39:23 | 0:39:28 | |
I've still got a home. | 0:39:28 | 0:39:30 | |
SHE LAUGHS | 0:39:30 | 0:39:32 | |
Thanks ever so much. I'll speak to you in four months. | 0:39:32 | 0:39:36 | |
Mandy's time order means she keeps her home, | 0:39:36 | 0:39:38 | |
but must pay the new agreed amount. | 0:39:38 | 0:39:42 | |
The court will review in four months to make sure she is doing what she promised. | 0:39:42 | 0:39:46 | |
They saved my home, they saved me. They saved everything. | 0:39:46 | 0:39:50 | |
I probably see 20-30 repossession hearings every month | 0:39:50 | 0:39:55 | |
that comes to Basingstoke. | 0:39:55 | 0:39:57 | |
Our success rate of keeping people in their homes is about 85%. | 0:39:57 | 0:40:01 | |
We think that's really good. | 0:40:01 | 0:40:03 | |
Most of that is by people picking up the phone, talking to us, turning up at court. | 0:40:03 | 0:40:07 | |
She has gone from an absolutely hopeless situation, | 0:40:07 | 0:40:13 | |
not knowing where she'll be, to being able to remain in her home. | 0:40:13 | 0:40:15 | |
I think we can all appreciate what that would mean inside. | 0:40:15 | 0:40:19 | |
Earlier, we heard about ex-soldier Alan Wilson's worst ever deal | 0:40:24 | 0:40:28 | |
with his bank Northern Rock. | 0:40:28 | 0:40:31 | |
They repossessed his house that was worth £112,000 | 0:40:31 | 0:40:34 | |
and sold it at auction for just £67,000. | 0:40:34 | 0:40:39 | |
Only around half of what he owed on his mortgage. | 0:40:39 | 0:40:42 | |
They then chased Alan for the shortfall. | 0:40:42 | 0:40:46 | |
Registered debt counsellor and former policeman Mike Thomas | 0:40:46 | 0:40:50 | |
has advised him to declare himself bankrupt and since his last visit, | 0:40:50 | 0:40:54 | |
an Army charity has agreed to pay the bankruptcy fees. | 0:40:54 | 0:40:58 | |
Today, with his girlfriend and Mike, | 0:40:59 | 0:41:01 | |
he arrives at Stoke-on-Trent County Court for his bankruptcy hearing. | 0:41:01 | 0:41:06 | |
Bankruptcy still carries a stigma for many people. | 0:41:06 | 0:41:09 | |
For someone in Alan's position, who has already lost their home | 0:41:09 | 0:41:13 | |
and has little prospect of ever repaying their debts, | 0:41:13 | 0:41:16 | |
Mike believes it is the only sensible option. | 0:41:16 | 0:41:19 | |
Going bankrupt would mean all Alan's financial | 0:41:19 | 0:41:22 | |
affairs would be looked after by the official receiver or a trustee. | 0:41:22 | 0:41:26 | |
Basically, he would become free from debt. | 0:41:26 | 0:41:29 | |
As a bankrupt, he wouldn't be allowed to do | 0:41:29 | 0:41:32 | |
some things like get credit for over £500 without disclosing bankruptcy. | 0:41:32 | 0:41:37 | |
Most first-time bankrupts are discharged after one year. | 0:41:37 | 0:41:41 | |
I'm nervous. I've never been in this environment before. | 0:41:41 | 0:41:45 | |
I am quite nervous. | 0:41:45 | 0:41:47 | |
I don't know how the protocol works or what is going to be said to me. | 0:41:47 | 0:41:51 | |
I hope they'll look favourable on me and see that I have tried. | 0:41:51 | 0:41:57 | |
I have not just tried to enjoy myself. | 0:41:57 | 0:42:00 | |
And this is how I got there. | 0:42:00 | 0:42:02 | |
Hopefully, they will go in my favour. | 0:42:02 | 0:42:06 | |
An hour and a half later, Alan comes out of the court, officially declared bankrupt. | 0:42:07 | 0:42:12 | |
-Are you all right? -It's done now. | 0:42:14 | 0:42:17 | |
-His debts are now behind him. -That's it. | 0:42:17 | 0:42:20 | |
Alan has become one of the 330 or so people who are going | 0:42:20 | 0:42:24 | |
bankrupt in the UK every day. | 0:42:24 | 0:42:27 | |
I don't believe it. Honestly, I can't believe that's it. | 0:42:27 | 0:42:31 | |
Happy? | 0:42:36 | 0:42:38 | |
Yeah, I just can't believe it. | 0:42:39 | 0:42:41 | |
Thanks, Mike. Thank you. | 0:42:43 | 0:42:45 | |
Thank you very much. | 0:42:45 | 0:42:47 | |
Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd | 0:43:07 | 0:43:10 |