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This programme contains some strong language. | 0:00:02 | 0:00:09 | |
Our brains have an astonishing ability to interpret | 0:00:09 | 0:00:11 | |
the world around us. Most of us are able to tell the difference | 0:00:11 | 0:00:14 | |
between fact and fantasy. | 0:00:14 | 0:00:15 | |
Between real and imagined danger. | 0:00:15 | 0:00:19 | |
We learn to recognise voices, and understand meaning. | 0:00:21 | 0:00:24 | |
But for some, the normal, benign business | 0:00:26 | 0:00:30 | |
of interpreting reality has broken down. | 0:00:30 | 0:00:33 | |
And as I sat there, I knew these things were going to come | 0:00:35 | 0:00:39 | |
and eat me alive from the inside. | 0:00:39 | 0:00:41 | |
I remember being about 13, 14, and having this real knowledge, | 0:00:43 | 0:00:48 | |
this true knowledge, that I had an alien inside me. | 0:00:48 | 0:00:51 | |
I woke up, and the voices were telling me, | 0:00:52 | 0:00:55 | |
"Kill yourself, kill yourself." | 0:00:55 | 0:00:57 | |
You have not experienced terror like that... | 0:00:57 | 0:01:00 | |
..unless you've had a psychotic episode. | 0:01:02 | 0:01:05 | |
They are...beyond any imaginable terror | 0:01:07 | 0:01:12 | |
that a normal person can experience. | 0:01:12 | 0:01:14 | |
For years, these disturbing psychotic experiences | 0:01:16 | 0:01:19 | |
have been given a name - schizophrenia. | 0:01:19 | 0:01:22 | |
In this film, we'll discover first-hand | 0:01:22 | 0:01:24 | |
what this condition is really like. | 0:01:24 | 0:01:27 | |
The floor started buckling, | 0:01:27 | 0:01:30 | |
like that, on either side where my feet were. | 0:01:30 | 0:01:32 | |
And then they opened up, and there were teeth on the inside. | 0:01:35 | 0:01:38 | |
The bloody floor was going to eat me. | 0:01:38 | 0:01:41 | |
We'll explore the research that is throwing new light | 0:01:41 | 0:01:44 | |
on what is happening to the brain. | 0:01:44 | 0:01:47 | |
If you have too much dopamine, | 0:01:47 | 0:01:49 | |
then things which normally are not important in your environment may | 0:01:49 | 0:01:53 | |
suddenly acquire importance to you. | 0:01:53 | 0:01:55 | |
I see all these people looking at me, | 0:01:58 | 0:02:00 | |
I can see their eyes looking at me, staring at me very intensely. | 0:02:00 | 0:02:04 | |
And you can see how an environment like this becomes very threatening. | 0:02:04 | 0:02:09 | |
We'll search for what causes psychosis in the first place. | 0:02:09 | 0:02:12 | |
Growing up in an urban environment increases your risk of developing | 0:02:14 | 0:02:18 | |
psychosis later on. | 0:02:18 | 0:02:19 | |
And we'll see new and experimental therapies in action. | 0:02:21 | 0:02:25 | |
You're in for it now. | 0:02:25 | 0:02:26 | |
But most importantly, | 0:02:28 | 0:02:29 | |
we'll follow three people who live with the condition. | 0:02:29 | 0:02:32 | |
All the crew around me are... | 0:02:34 | 0:02:36 | |
..plotting to kill me. | 0:02:40 | 0:02:42 | |
You're in on it too. | 0:02:44 | 0:02:46 | |
CHOIR SINGS | 0:02:58 | 0:03:00 | |
For decades, people with severe mental conditions | 0:03:02 | 0:03:06 | |
have been called mad. | 0:03:06 | 0:03:07 | |
But is there really such a thing as madness? | 0:03:09 | 0:03:11 | |
Dr David Strange is a former Oxford scholar. | 0:03:14 | 0:03:18 | |
He has a doctorate in epidemiology, the study of how diseases spread. | 0:03:18 | 0:03:23 | |
And his work was award-winning. | 0:03:23 | 0:03:24 | |
But then, on what seemed like a normal day in 1999... | 0:03:28 | 0:03:31 | |
..his world changed forever. | 0:03:35 | 0:03:37 | |
MUSIC: Elephant by Tame Impala | 0:03:38 | 0:03:42 | |
# Bet he feels like an elephant | 0:03:42 | 0:03:44 | |
# Shaking his big grey trunk for the hell of it | 0:03:44 | 0:03:49 | |
# You know that you're dreaming about being loved by him... # | 0:03:49 | 0:03:55 | |
I was in a meeting with my supervisor, sitting in her office. | 0:04:05 | 0:04:09 | |
And suddenly I could hear five voices | 0:04:09 | 0:04:12 | |
screaming at me from positions, strangely, around me. | 0:04:12 | 0:04:17 | |
And there were lots of rats, hairy, | 0:04:17 | 0:04:21 | |
dirty, rat-like things running around and running over my feet. | 0:04:21 | 0:04:25 | |
And as I sat there, I knew these things were going | 0:04:26 | 0:04:30 | |
to come and eat me alive from the inside. | 0:04:30 | 0:04:32 | |
It's frightening beyond belief. | 0:04:37 | 0:04:40 | |
Especially when you're with someone who you've known for several years, | 0:04:41 | 0:04:45 | |
and they are apparently not noticing these things. | 0:04:45 | 0:04:48 | |
And it was so much, I just said, I... | 0:04:50 | 0:04:53 | |
I made a quick excuse, and ran home, and hid under my bed. | 0:04:53 | 0:04:57 | |
# I hear voices in my head | 0:05:14 | 0:05:17 | |
# It gets dark and dangerous... # | 0:05:17 | 0:05:20 | |
Like David, Rachel Woddingham is accompanied by voices and paranoia. | 0:05:20 | 0:05:24 | |
Now 39, she experienced her first | 0:05:24 | 0:05:27 | |
terrifying hallucination aged just seven. | 0:05:27 | 0:05:31 | |
# Catch me when I fall... # | 0:05:31 | 0:05:34 | |
I remember being at my friend's house, | 0:05:34 | 0:05:36 | |
and I was looking in her dressing table mirror and saw this monster | 0:05:36 | 0:05:42 | |
staring back at me where I should have been. | 0:05:42 | 0:05:45 | |
It was...kind of ugly. | 0:05:45 | 0:05:48 | |
It was dark coloured. | 0:05:48 | 0:05:49 | |
It wasn't human. | 0:05:49 | 0:05:51 | |
It's just looked terrifying. | 0:05:51 | 0:05:53 | |
Psychosis is a term used to describe a range of different diagnoses, | 0:05:55 | 0:06:01 | |
including the most notorious of all - schizophrenia. | 0:06:01 | 0:06:04 | |
Each person's experience of psychosis is unique. | 0:06:06 | 0:06:10 | |
But there are three key symptoms that generally define it. | 0:06:10 | 0:06:13 | |
Voice-hearing, paranoia and hallucinations. | 0:06:14 | 0:06:18 | |
There's a rat just on your knee. | 0:06:23 | 0:06:25 | |
There are a few running up and down onto those benches there. | 0:06:25 | 0:06:30 | |
And there's one on that table which is a bit close. | 0:06:33 | 0:06:39 | |
Oh, yeah. | 0:06:39 | 0:06:40 | |
While hallucinations can be terrifying, | 0:06:43 | 0:06:46 | |
they are often accompanied by deep paranoia. | 0:06:46 | 0:06:49 | |
For David, he feels his life is constantly under threat. | 0:06:51 | 0:06:55 | |
I can hear your thoughts now. | 0:06:56 | 0:06:59 | |
And you don't like me very much. | 0:06:59 | 0:07:01 | |
You think I should do something horrible to myself. | 0:07:01 | 0:07:04 | |
Paranoid thoughts have also plagued Rachel for much of her life. | 0:07:09 | 0:07:13 | |
I remember being about 13, 14, | 0:07:18 | 0:07:21 | |
and having this real knowledge that I had an alien inside me. | 0:07:21 | 0:07:25 | |
One night I started to hear these voices talking about me. | 0:07:25 | 0:07:28 | |
I started to believe that they were part of this conspiracy. | 0:07:28 | 0:07:32 | |
I could feel the sensation of being watched, | 0:07:33 | 0:07:36 | |
and the only way I could make sense of it | 0:07:36 | 0:07:38 | |
is that there must be cameras installed in my flat. | 0:07:38 | 0:07:41 | |
It's similar to being in one of those conspiracy movies, | 0:07:42 | 0:07:45 | |
where just something's going on, and no-one else knows, | 0:07:45 | 0:07:49 | |
and no matter who you turn to, who you speak to, | 0:07:49 | 0:07:52 | |
they... | 0:07:52 | 0:07:54 | |
they either won't believe you, they'll think you're crazy, | 0:07:54 | 0:07:58 | |
or even speaking to them will put them in danger. | 0:07:58 | 0:08:02 | |
ELECTRONIC DRUMBEAT | 0:08:05 | 0:08:09 | |
David uses music to express some of the emotions he feels about the | 0:08:12 | 0:08:16 | |
effects of his psychosis. | 0:08:16 | 0:08:18 | |
I quite like ambient | 0:08:21 | 0:08:23 | |
and electronic music. | 0:08:23 | 0:08:25 | |
And I wanted to make something quite hallucinogenic, quite weird, | 0:08:25 | 0:08:29 | |
quite mind-altered state. | 0:08:29 | 0:08:31 | |
And I think I've done it quite well with this piece. | 0:08:31 | 0:08:35 | |
It's quite hallucinogenic. | 0:08:35 | 0:08:36 | |
At times, the paranoia and hallucinations | 0:08:39 | 0:08:43 | |
have become too much for David. | 0:08:43 | 0:08:45 | |
He's been driven to numerous suicide attempts, | 0:08:45 | 0:08:47 | |
and been in and out of psychiatric units for much of his adult life. | 0:08:47 | 0:08:51 | |
His music reflects some of these experiences. | 0:08:52 | 0:08:55 | |
I wrote this piece of music to capture the experience | 0:08:59 | 0:09:02 | |
of coming around after an overdose | 0:09:02 | 0:09:05 | |
and finding all kinds of electronic equipment and tubes | 0:09:05 | 0:09:08 | |
poking out of you. | 0:09:08 | 0:09:10 | |
And I had some horrible experience | 0:09:10 | 0:09:13 | |
of big metal pipes coming out of my throat. | 0:09:13 | 0:09:17 | |
And machines all around me. | 0:09:17 | 0:09:18 | |
And this is that experience. | 0:09:18 | 0:09:21 | |
ELECTRONIC BEEPING | 0:09:21 | 0:09:24 | |
Rachel lives with another key element of psychosis. | 0:09:34 | 0:09:37 | |
Voice hearing. | 0:09:37 | 0:09:38 | |
She creates images of her voices to help her try and understand them. | 0:09:39 | 0:09:43 | |
Rachel hears many voices, | 0:09:44 | 0:09:46 | |
with different characters, different personalities, | 0:09:46 | 0:09:49 | |
but each behave differently to her. | 0:09:49 | 0:09:51 | |
So, Blue is a little girl. | 0:09:52 | 0:09:54 | |
She's one of my youngest voices. | 0:09:55 | 0:09:57 | |
She's about three. | 0:09:57 | 0:10:00 | |
I think she's frightened of other people. | 0:10:00 | 0:10:02 | |
She is frightened of being hurt. | 0:10:02 | 0:10:03 | |
I felt really sad, because there was a young voice, a child, | 0:10:03 | 0:10:08 | |
who was upset and crying. | 0:10:08 | 0:10:10 | |
I felt like I was abandoning her. A little one. | 0:10:10 | 0:10:13 | |
And it felt like it was my fault that I couldn't reach her. | 0:10:13 | 0:10:16 | |
A breakthrough kind of came when I found Bunny. | 0:10:17 | 0:10:21 | |
Bunny is this lovely little toy, just this beautiful little toy. | 0:10:21 | 0:10:26 | |
And for the first time, I kind of felt...like this curiosity in her. | 0:10:26 | 0:10:30 | |
And it felt like I'd reached her, | 0:10:30 | 0:10:32 | |
which was a pretty powerful moment, really. | 0:10:32 | 0:10:36 | |
But not all Rachel's voices are so benign. | 0:10:36 | 0:10:39 | |
So the next ones I'm going to draw is The Three. | 0:10:42 | 0:10:45 | |
These guys were paid to watch me, hated me. | 0:10:47 | 0:10:50 | |
And they just | 0:10:50 | 0:10:54 | |
report to the government, report to the aliens. | 0:10:54 | 0:10:56 | |
They never talk directly to me. | 0:10:56 | 0:10:58 | |
They always talk about me, and about the people that are around me. | 0:10:58 | 0:11:02 | |
The voices are even able to cause Rachel physical pain. | 0:11:03 | 0:11:07 | |
So I'm going to draw Elfie now. | 0:11:08 | 0:11:11 | |
When I first started to hear her, she called herself Monster. | 0:11:11 | 0:11:14 | |
And that's what I saw in the mirror. | 0:11:14 | 0:11:16 | |
The monster. Sometimes I can tell that Elfie's upset... | 0:11:16 | 0:11:22 | |
because I feel burning on my skin. | 0:11:22 | 0:11:25 | |
It's kind of like someone's searing my skin with... | 0:11:28 | 0:11:31 | |
with a hot iron or something like that. | 0:11:31 | 0:11:34 | |
And I know it's not "happening" happening | 0:11:35 | 0:11:38 | |
because I can't see any flames, | 0:11:38 | 0:11:40 | |
there's no marks, but I feel it as intensely. | 0:11:40 | 0:11:42 | |
I was terrified of Elf, and then something changed. | 0:11:45 | 0:11:49 | |
Over time it kind of emerged that she'd been trying to tell me that I | 0:11:49 | 0:11:52 | |
wasn't safe. So what kind of emerged is that Elfie is not this big, | 0:11:52 | 0:11:56 | |
scary monster that she appeared to me as. | 0:11:56 | 0:11:59 | |
She's actually just an 11-year-old girl. | 0:11:59 | 0:12:01 | |
GENTLE CHILDLIKE MUSIC | 0:12:03 | 0:12:06 | |
While there has long been difficulty in the diagnosis of psychosis, | 0:12:17 | 0:12:21 | |
scientists have now largely agreed | 0:12:21 | 0:12:23 | |
on the biological process going on in the brain. | 0:12:23 | 0:12:25 | |
Research suggests that people with psychosis | 0:12:27 | 0:12:30 | |
seem to produce too much of the brain chemical called dopamine. | 0:12:30 | 0:12:34 | |
Dopamine is a chemical that is naturally produced | 0:12:37 | 0:12:40 | |
in all our brains, | 0:12:40 | 0:12:41 | |
and it's absolutely essential to how our brains work. | 0:12:41 | 0:12:44 | |
Our brains are constantly being bombarded by information | 0:12:46 | 0:12:50 | |
from our senses, we are always hearing or seeing things, | 0:12:50 | 0:12:54 | |
and we've got to filter out the things that are | 0:12:54 | 0:12:57 | |
unimportant, the kind of regular things, | 0:12:57 | 0:13:00 | |
from those that are unusual or potentially really | 0:13:00 | 0:13:04 | |
important, either a danger or something that might be a reward. | 0:13:04 | 0:13:07 | |
Dopamine starts... | 0:13:07 | 0:13:10 | |
those nerve cells start firing and signalling | 0:13:10 | 0:13:13 | |
when they detect something unusual, and they then focus attention | 0:13:13 | 0:13:17 | |
and the brain's resources on trying to | 0:13:17 | 0:13:20 | |
make sense of those particular stimuli, | 0:13:20 | 0:13:24 | |
rather than other things that are unimportant. | 0:13:24 | 0:13:27 | |
So they filter out the other things, by saying, "Focus on this." | 0:13:27 | 0:13:30 | |
In the real world, dopamine helps us avoid danger | 0:13:37 | 0:13:40 | |
by allowing us to recognise what could be an actual threat. | 0:13:40 | 0:13:44 | |
The visually packed world of a funfair | 0:13:45 | 0:13:47 | |
is filled with objects that could pose real danger to us. | 0:13:47 | 0:13:50 | |
A fast-moving machine or a suspicious character. | 0:13:51 | 0:13:55 | |
Michelle Kokkinou is part of Professor Howe's team, | 0:13:58 | 0:14:02 | |
and has been researching the effects of dopamine on the brain. | 0:14:02 | 0:14:06 | |
Dopamine fires and tells me to pay attention, | 0:14:06 | 0:14:09 | |
and maybe not go too near it, because it's dangerous. | 0:14:09 | 0:14:12 | |
But if the brain becomes too flooded with dopamine, | 0:14:14 | 0:14:18 | |
things can start to go wrong. | 0:14:18 | 0:14:20 | |
And this is exactly what is thought to happen | 0:14:20 | 0:14:22 | |
in the brains of those with psychosis. | 0:14:22 | 0:14:24 | |
If you have too much dopamine in your brain, | 0:14:27 | 0:14:30 | |
so if there's an excess of dopamine, | 0:14:30 | 0:14:32 | |
then things which normally are not important | 0:14:32 | 0:14:35 | |
in your environment - for your survival, for example - | 0:14:35 | 0:14:37 | |
may suddenly acquire importance to you. | 0:14:37 | 0:14:41 | |
Everyday objects take on new meaning. | 0:14:41 | 0:14:44 | |
The benign and harmless become terrifying. | 0:14:44 | 0:14:48 | |
For example, I see all these people looking at me. | 0:14:49 | 0:14:52 | |
I can see their eyes looking at me, staring at me, very intensely. | 0:14:52 | 0:14:57 | |
And then I have this inherent drive to make sense of it. | 0:14:57 | 0:15:01 | |
And so, depending on my experiences, for example, or my personality, | 0:15:01 | 0:15:06 | |
I may think that they have been sent by the FBI to follow me. | 0:15:06 | 0:15:10 | |
Or by the aliens to spy on me. | 0:15:11 | 0:15:13 | |
And you can see how an environment like this becomes very threatening, | 0:15:13 | 0:15:19 | |
instead of being enjoyable. | 0:15:19 | 0:15:20 | |
Doctors struggled for years to find medication to treat psychosis | 0:15:26 | 0:15:30 | |
but, in the 1950s, found a class of drugs, | 0:15:30 | 0:15:33 | |
originally used as anaesthetics, that reduce symptoms. | 0:15:33 | 0:15:37 | |
A mainstay of our treatment for people with schizophrenia are | 0:15:38 | 0:15:42 | |
anti-psychotic medications. | 0:15:42 | 0:15:44 | |
And these work by blocking the action of dopamine after it's been | 0:15:44 | 0:15:48 | |
released. So they dampen down the effects | 0:15:48 | 0:15:52 | |
of the dopamine overactivity, | 0:15:52 | 0:15:54 | |
and over a few days, or maybe a week or two, | 0:15:54 | 0:15:58 | |
this gradually means that the psychosis - | 0:15:58 | 0:16:01 | |
the paranoia, the hallucinations - | 0:16:01 | 0:16:04 | |
subsides and goes away. | 0:16:04 | 0:16:06 | |
OK, this is my medication cupboard. | 0:16:10 | 0:16:12 | |
And I have rather a lot. | 0:16:12 | 0:16:15 | |
Risperidone, that is my anti-psychotic, | 0:16:18 | 0:16:21 | |
this is the main thing I need to keep me sane. | 0:16:21 | 0:16:24 | |
My dose isn't very high at the moment, but it's been... | 0:16:24 | 0:16:26 | |
it has in the past been so high that about once a day I would have a fit. | 0:16:26 | 0:16:32 | |
It also makes you more hungry than the imagination can handle. | 0:16:32 | 0:16:37 | |
You are crazily hungry when you take anti-psychotics. | 0:16:37 | 0:16:41 | |
And Risperidone is one of the worst. | 0:16:41 | 0:16:43 | |
So I've gone from a 32-inch waist to a 42-inch waist. | 0:16:43 | 0:16:48 | |
Then there's Pregabalin, which is an anti-convulsant. | 0:16:48 | 0:16:52 | |
These deal with my anxiety. | 0:16:52 | 0:16:54 | |
The other anti-psychotic I take is Quetiapine, | 0:16:55 | 0:16:59 | |
which is a very sedating anti-psychotic. | 0:16:59 | 0:17:03 | |
The only other ones that I have that are lunacy-related are Loperamide, | 0:17:03 | 0:17:08 | |
and they stop you pooing your pants. | 0:17:08 | 0:17:11 | |
I need something to cork me up, so I will have two, I think. | 0:17:11 | 0:17:16 | |
I think I will have a couple of the benzodiazepine tranquillisers, | 0:17:16 | 0:17:20 | |
so we need a procyclidine. | 0:17:20 | 0:17:23 | |
This is to deal with the side-effects of the anti-psychotic. | 0:17:23 | 0:17:29 | |
Ranitidine is just for my stomach, I have acid reflux. | 0:17:29 | 0:17:32 | |
And so is the Esomeprazole, that's for my stomach as well. | 0:17:32 | 0:17:37 | |
And that's my medication for tonight. | 0:17:37 | 0:17:39 | |
Today, the primary treatment for people with psychosis, like David, | 0:17:43 | 0:17:47 | |
are anti-psychotic drugs. | 0:17:47 | 0:17:49 | |
They are not actually curing, if you like, | 0:17:53 | 0:17:56 | |
the dopamine overactivity that was the problem in the first place. | 0:17:56 | 0:18:00 | |
So, unfortunately, with our current medications, | 0:18:00 | 0:18:03 | |
we've got something that works very well to dampen down dopamine, | 0:18:03 | 0:18:07 | |
but doesn't cure the underlying problem. | 0:18:07 | 0:18:10 | |
While drugs can't cure psychosis, | 0:18:14 | 0:18:17 | |
a series of new therapies have been developed. | 0:18:17 | 0:18:20 | |
Treatment that could revolutionise how we deal with it. | 0:18:20 | 0:18:22 | |
This is Professor Richard Bentall. | 0:18:37 | 0:18:40 | |
He has been using a treatment for psychosis | 0:18:40 | 0:18:42 | |
that doesn't use any drugs. | 0:18:42 | 0:18:44 | |
It's called experience sampling. | 0:18:44 | 0:18:46 | |
And it's a form of electronic diary-keeping. | 0:18:46 | 0:18:49 | |
So, experience sampling is a method which we've used for many years to | 0:18:51 | 0:18:56 | |
look at the way that people feel in everyday life. | 0:18:56 | 0:18:59 | |
What we do is, we ask people to fill in questionnaires. | 0:19:00 | 0:19:04 | |
We get a kind of snapshot about them. | 0:19:04 | 0:19:06 | |
What they are like at a particular moment. | 0:19:06 | 0:19:09 | |
And in the case of psychosis, | 0:19:09 | 0:19:11 | |
what we're really interested in is what circumstances do people, | 0:19:11 | 0:19:14 | |
for example, hear their voices, | 0:19:14 | 0:19:16 | |
or in what circumstances do they feel paranoid? | 0:19:16 | 0:19:19 | |
And experience sampling can pick that up. | 0:19:19 | 0:19:22 | |
The therapy uses an app which can be installed into a mobile device. | 0:19:22 | 0:19:26 | |
The app bleeps four times a day, | 0:19:26 | 0:19:28 | |
and when it bleeps, the patient answers questions. | 0:19:28 | 0:19:32 | |
The questions are about whether the patient is hearing voices | 0:19:32 | 0:19:36 | |
and how severe they are, | 0:19:36 | 0:19:37 | |
whether they feel paranoid, what their mood is. | 0:19:37 | 0:19:40 | |
We can look at how, for example, | 0:19:40 | 0:19:42 | |
exposure to stressful events leads to an exasperation of senses. | 0:19:42 | 0:19:46 | |
Today Professor Bentall is meeting David to see whether this method can | 0:19:49 | 0:19:54 | |
help him discover what triggers his hallucinations. | 0:19:54 | 0:19:57 | |
Hello, I'm David Strange. | 0:20:01 | 0:20:02 | |
-You must be Richard. -I'm Richard, yes. Hi. -Any chance of an espresso? | 0:20:02 | 0:20:06 | |
The way it works is it uploads your answers, | 0:20:08 | 0:20:10 | |
whenever it's in contact with the web. | 0:20:10 | 0:20:13 | |
So psychiatrists and psychologists can keep an eye on their patients, | 0:20:13 | 0:20:19 | |
and see how they're doing. | 0:20:19 | 0:20:20 | |
And big Brother is watching you! | 0:20:20 | 0:20:22 | |
Well... You could look at it that way, | 0:20:22 | 0:20:24 | |
but on the other hand what it means is that they can... | 0:20:24 | 0:20:28 | |
It's a more reliable picture of how your life is. | 0:20:28 | 0:20:32 | |
Yes. I'm just going to get on my computer, | 0:20:32 | 0:20:35 | |
just so that I can set this up properly. | 0:20:35 | 0:20:37 | |
Uh... There is something next to you. | 0:20:44 | 0:20:47 | |
There's something next to me? | 0:20:49 | 0:20:50 | |
Is this something you...? | 0:20:52 | 0:20:53 | |
Yes, it's a large crab, pointy, spiky...like, thing. | 0:20:53 | 0:20:59 | |
And you can see it right now? | 0:21:03 | 0:21:05 | |
-Yeah. -OK. | 0:21:06 | 0:21:08 | |
And I'm rather scared of it. | 0:21:09 | 0:21:11 | |
OK. | 0:21:11 | 0:21:12 | |
So, what's it doing? | 0:21:14 | 0:21:15 | |
Can you tell me what it's doing, David? | 0:21:20 | 0:21:22 | |
-OK, it's gone. -OK. | 0:21:25 | 0:21:28 | |
So... | 0:21:28 | 0:21:30 | |
Are you OK? | 0:21:30 | 0:21:32 | |
-Yeah, fine. -OK. | 0:21:32 | 0:21:34 | |
How big was it? | 0:21:34 | 0:21:36 | |
About 18 inches long. | 0:21:38 | 0:21:40 | |
Crab-like claws, spikes on its back. | 0:21:40 | 0:21:44 | |
Wow. | 0:21:44 | 0:21:45 | |
Poisonous spikes at the front. | 0:21:47 | 0:21:49 | |
It was a rather grim vision of...Winchester. | 0:21:49 | 0:21:53 | |
Right, OK. | 0:21:53 | 0:21:56 | |
Using the diary technique, Professor Bentall hopes to establish the cause | 0:21:56 | 0:22:00 | |
of the hallucinations, | 0:22:00 | 0:22:02 | |
such as the one David just had. | 0:22:02 | 0:22:03 | |
-All right. -Thank you very much. | 0:22:05 | 0:22:08 | |
I wonder how much I could get for this! | 0:22:08 | 0:22:10 | |
As well as using the app on his phone, David will also record his | 0:22:11 | 0:22:15 | |
experiences on his iPad, | 0:22:15 | 0:22:18 | |
to give a real insight of what it's like living with psychosis. | 0:22:18 | 0:22:22 | |
I had a really... | 0:22:22 | 0:22:24 | |
..difficult night last night. | 0:22:26 | 0:22:28 | |
I woke up, I don't know what time it was. | 0:22:29 | 0:22:32 | |
And there were large, scorpion-type things | 0:22:32 | 0:22:38 | |
scampering around on the floor. | 0:22:38 | 0:22:41 | |
Two or three. | 0:22:41 | 0:22:42 | |
And I thought... | 0:22:42 | 0:22:45 | |
"Bloody hell, I don't want to have all these experiences," | 0:22:47 | 0:22:52 | |
and I got out of bed and I enthusiastically jumped on them. | 0:22:52 | 0:22:56 | |
It's hoped that by recording his experiences in this way, | 0:23:00 | 0:23:04 | |
David may gain an insight into what triggers | 0:23:04 | 0:23:06 | |
his voices and hallucinations. | 0:23:06 | 0:23:08 | |
Like David, Rachel also spent years in and out | 0:23:17 | 0:23:21 | |
of the psychiatric system. | 0:23:21 | 0:23:22 | |
When I was a patient of the mental-health system, | 0:23:27 | 0:23:30 | |
I felt like I was written off as severely mentally ill, | 0:23:30 | 0:23:33 | |
with no hope of recovery. | 0:23:33 | 0:23:34 | |
I was diagnosed with schizophrenia, borderline personality disorder, | 0:23:34 | 0:23:38 | |
schizoaffective disorder, dissociative identity disorder, | 0:23:38 | 0:23:41 | |
complex post-traumatic stress disorder | 0:23:41 | 0:23:44 | |
with psychosis, amongst others. | 0:23:44 | 0:23:46 | |
Rachel turned her back on the psychiatric system, | 0:23:46 | 0:23:50 | |
and looked for alternative support. | 0:23:50 | 0:23:52 | |
A key moment was joining a group | 0:23:52 | 0:23:54 | |
with other people who also hear voices. | 0:23:54 | 0:23:57 | |
I went to the group. And that, I think, | 0:23:57 | 0:23:59 | |
was the huge turning point for me. | 0:23:59 | 0:24:01 | |
I had no fight left in me. | 0:24:01 | 0:24:03 | |
And no belief that I could ever live outside of the psychiatric system. | 0:24:03 | 0:24:10 | |
So, for me, | 0:24:10 | 0:24:12 | |
the first step on my journey back | 0:24:12 | 0:24:14 | |
was realising that I was a human being. | 0:24:14 | 0:24:16 | |
And that took connections. | 0:24:16 | 0:24:18 | |
People connected with me. I connected with them. | 0:24:18 | 0:24:21 | |
And that allowed me to realise I had stories | 0:24:21 | 0:24:24 | |
before the story of schizophrenia. | 0:24:24 | 0:24:26 | |
With peer support and therapy, | 0:24:31 | 0:24:33 | |
Rachel came off medication and has forged a career | 0:24:33 | 0:24:35 | |
as a mental health consultant and practitioner. | 0:24:35 | 0:24:38 | |
However, there is still one group of aggressive, frightening voices that | 0:24:41 | 0:24:46 | |
she struggles with. | 0:24:46 | 0:24:47 | |
The Not Yets. | 0:24:47 | 0:24:49 | |
They are only called the Not Yets | 0:24:51 | 0:24:52 | |
because I didn't want to talk about them in therapy. | 0:24:52 | 0:24:55 | |
So it was the best way of getting the therapist not to ask | 0:24:55 | 0:24:57 | |
a question about them. | 0:24:57 | 0:24:59 | |
I actually feel physically sick just thinking about them. | 0:24:59 | 0:25:02 | |
And actually just drawing this makes me feel slightly frightened. | 0:25:02 | 0:25:08 | |
It's as if, by drawing it, I'm making it real. | 0:25:09 | 0:25:12 | |
Sometimes one of them will talk in depth about me being tortured, | 0:25:13 | 0:25:18 | |
that people are waiting for me. Um... | 0:25:18 | 0:25:21 | |
It's... | 0:25:22 | 0:25:23 | |
..it can get really graphic. | 0:25:24 | 0:25:25 | |
Rachel is going to try a different kind of treatment to deal with the | 0:25:27 | 0:25:30 | |
Not Yets, called Avatar therapy. | 0:25:30 | 0:25:32 | |
She's going to try and put a face to one of them for the first time. | 0:25:34 | 0:25:38 | |
Professor Tom Craig has been pioneering this new technique. | 0:25:41 | 0:25:45 | |
It involves creating a computer-generated face | 0:25:45 | 0:25:48 | |
that Rachel will then have to interact with. | 0:25:48 | 0:25:50 | |
The first stage in the process is to create the voice. | 0:25:52 | 0:25:56 | |
So the first thing we need to do is to find the best approximate voice. | 0:25:56 | 0:26:01 | |
-MALE VOICE: -You could never learn to make a choice. | 0:26:01 | 0:26:03 | |
That's a bit high. | 0:26:03 | 0:26:04 | |
-LOWER: -Whenever his friends asked him if he would like to go | 0:26:04 | 0:26:07 | |
out with them, he would only answer, "I don't know." | 0:26:07 | 0:26:09 | |
-Yes. -Yeah? -I think so. | 0:26:09 | 0:26:12 | |
Next, they move onto the physical features of the face. | 0:26:12 | 0:26:15 | |
I imagine, probably, that one. | 0:26:16 | 0:26:18 | |
Brow - we'll just make him frown a bit? | 0:26:18 | 0:26:21 | |
Yeah. That kind of works better, I think, | 0:26:21 | 0:26:23 | |
cos it just looks a little bit more aggressive. | 0:26:23 | 0:26:26 | |
So, kind of, looking at the depiction of the voice | 0:26:30 | 0:26:33 | |
on the screen, its eyes are pretty piercing and strange-looking. | 0:26:33 | 0:26:37 | |
So I feel a little nervous. | 0:26:37 | 0:26:39 | |
I can feel my heart beating a little bit. | 0:26:39 | 0:26:42 | |
And I'm not entirely sure what to expect. | 0:26:42 | 0:26:45 | |
Professor Craig will take the role of the voice. | 0:26:46 | 0:26:50 | |
Rachel must overcome her fears and attempt to be assertive with it. | 0:26:50 | 0:26:54 | |
He's going to say some of the usual things he says to you, | 0:26:55 | 0:26:58 | |
and when he does, I want you to just say to him, really firmly, | 0:26:58 | 0:27:02 | |
"I don't want to hear this any more. | 0:27:02 | 0:27:05 | |
"Go away! Leave me alone." | 0:27:05 | 0:27:07 | |
-OK? -Mm-hm. | 0:27:07 | 0:27:09 | |
So, here he comes. | 0:27:09 | 0:27:11 | |
You're stupid. You're in for it now. | 0:27:13 | 0:27:16 | |
I'm not going to listen to you. | 0:27:17 | 0:27:19 | |
You know you're in for it. | 0:27:19 | 0:27:21 | |
They're waiting for you. | 0:27:21 | 0:27:23 | |
They're going to cut you up. | 0:27:23 | 0:27:25 | |
-You know it. -That's not true. | 0:27:25 | 0:27:28 | |
You're just talking crap. You're trying to frighten me. | 0:27:28 | 0:27:32 | |
That's not here, that's not now. | 0:27:32 | 0:27:34 | |
Are you telling me you're not scared of me? | 0:27:35 | 0:27:37 | |
Of course I'm scared of you. | 0:27:37 | 0:27:39 | |
But you don't speak the truth. | 0:27:39 | 0:27:42 | |
I wouldn't get much fun if I didn't threaten you. | 0:27:43 | 0:27:46 | |
Why do you want that to be fun? | 0:27:46 | 0:27:48 | |
You know, is it that boring - your life? | 0:27:48 | 0:27:51 | |
You are in for it now. | 0:27:51 | 0:27:53 | |
You know they're waiting outside for you. | 0:27:54 | 0:27:57 | |
They're not waiting outside. | 0:27:57 | 0:27:59 | |
You said this before. | 0:27:59 | 0:28:01 | |
It's not happening. | 0:28:01 | 0:28:02 | |
That's really, really good, excellent, good, good work. | 0:28:04 | 0:28:08 | |
So let's wrap up, I think. How are you feeling? | 0:28:08 | 0:28:12 | |
A little shaky, | 0:28:12 | 0:28:14 | |
kind of, yeah... I've got a few of my voices | 0:28:14 | 0:28:17 | |
-kind of chiming in at the moment. -Right. | 0:28:17 | 0:28:21 | |
But certainly, at times, it felt very intense. | 0:28:21 | 0:28:24 | |
By asking Rachel to confront her voice in this way, | 0:28:26 | 0:28:30 | |
it is hoped that she'll become less frightened, and therefore | 0:28:30 | 0:28:33 | |
better equipped to deal with it. | 0:28:33 | 0:28:35 | |
Talking therapies like this are offering a path to recovery, | 0:28:36 | 0:28:40 | |
and a chance to learn to live with voices. | 0:28:40 | 0:28:43 | |
And this is exactly what Jackie Dillon has managed to do. | 0:28:51 | 0:28:55 | |
I'm off to the States next week, I'm doing some... | 0:28:59 | 0:29:03 | |
doing an event in New York. | 0:29:03 | 0:29:05 | |
And then I'm off to Atlanta. | 0:29:05 | 0:29:08 | |
I've got a big project in America that I'm co-directing. | 0:29:08 | 0:29:12 | |
Jackie has a busy career as an | 0:29:14 | 0:29:16 | |
academic and consultant in mental health. | 0:29:16 | 0:29:19 | |
Over the years, she's developed a positive working relationship | 0:29:19 | 0:29:22 | |
with her own voices. | 0:29:22 | 0:29:24 | |
So, toast is ready. | 0:29:24 | 0:29:27 | |
One of my voices is just reminding me to | 0:29:27 | 0:29:29 | |
make sure I leave some money out for my daughter, for college today. | 0:29:29 | 0:29:33 | |
Rather than attack her, Jackie's voices now actually help her. | 0:29:34 | 0:29:38 | |
So, yeah, I guess, like a lot of working mums, | 0:29:38 | 0:29:41 | |
my head's quite busy at this time of the morning, | 0:29:41 | 0:29:44 | |
trying to think about all the stuff that has to happen. | 0:29:44 | 0:29:47 | |
Maybe the difference for me is my voices are helping me. | 0:29:47 | 0:29:50 | |
They, sort of, chip in. | 0:29:50 | 0:29:52 | |
You know, it's quite good teamwork, really. | 0:29:52 | 0:29:55 | |
Get my bag. | 0:29:55 | 0:29:57 | |
So this is where my voices become very helpful, actually, | 0:29:57 | 0:30:00 | |
because they start saying, "Right, have you got a bottle of water?" | 0:30:00 | 0:30:04 | |
"Have you got a banana?" | 0:30:04 | 0:30:06 | |
"Do you need to do anything for the kids before you leave?" | 0:30:06 | 0:30:10 | |
Oh, yeah, and my phone and my shades. | 0:30:10 | 0:30:12 | |
That's it. OK, thanks, guys. I've got everything. | 0:30:12 | 0:30:16 | |
I'm feeling slightly anxious. | 0:30:17 | 0:30:19 | |
My voices are kind of saying, "Oh, you should have left a bit earlier." | 0:30:19 | 0:30:22 | |
I know I should have, you're right. | 0:30:22 | 0:30:24 | |
I hear a lot of voices. | 0:30:26 | 0:30:28 | |
You know, probably well over 100 voices. | 0:30:28 | 0:30:34 | |
Obviously, we travel as a crew. | 0:30:34 | 0:30:36 | |
And because I've got younger voices and, you know, | 0:30:36 | 0:30:41 | |
quite a lot of cockney geezers who...we have quite a laugh, and | 0:30:41 | 0:30:45 | |
I guess, you know, I've kind of got 24/7 | 0:30:45 | 0:30:50 | |
company, if I want it. | 0:30:50 | 0:30:53 | |
I'm so sorry, everyone. | 0:30:56 | 0:30:58 | |
Today, Jackie is teaching a course to a group of mental-health workers. | 0:30:58 | 0:31:03 | |
Just to remind you that there are | 0:31:03 | 0:31:05 | |
more people living in the general population who hear voices | 0:31:05 | 0:31:09 | |
who have never, ever had contact with psychiatric services. | 0:31:09 | 0:31:13 | |
Jackie's life is in control now. | 0:31:13 | 0:31:15 | |
But it hasn't always been like this. | 0:31:15 | 0:31:17 | |
She first started hearing voices aged three. | 0:31:22 | 0:31:25 | |
I remember playing in the playgrounds of my primary school, | 0:31:28 | 0:31:31 | |
and saying to this other little girl, "You know, | 0:31:31 | 0:31:34 | |
"those voices that you hear." | 0:31:34 | 0:31:35 | |
And her looking at me like, "Huh?" | 0:31:35 | 0:31:39 | |
And I picked up, ah, | 0:31:39 | 0:31:41 | |
this isn't something that, A) other people necessarily experience, and | 0:31:41 | 0:31:46 | |
B) that it isn't necessarily cool to talk about it. | 0:31:46 | 0:31:49 | |
Jackie's voices became more and more aggressive as she grew older. | 0:31:52 | 0:31:56 | |
Things hit a crisis point in her 20s, | 0:31:56 | 0:31:59 | |
with the birth of her first daughter. | 0:31:59 | 0:32:01 | |
When my daughter was a couple of days old, | 0:32:03 | 0:32:05 | |
I remember turning to get some cotton wool to wash her with, | 0:32:05 | 0:32:10 | |
and suddenly, when I looked back, | 0:32:10 | 0:32:12 | |
she was covered in blood... | 0:32:12 | 0:32:14 | |
..which was absolutely horrifying. | 0:32:16 | 0:32:18 | |
And I remember shaking my head and blinking, and that disappeared. | 0:32:18 | 0:32:22 | |
I lived in this kind of nightmarish world, | 0:32:22 | 0:32:25 | |
where I was just having these terrifying voices, | 0:32:25 | 0:32:30 | |
saying that my daughter's life was at risk, | 0:32:30 | 0:32:34 | |
that people might kidnap her. | 0:32:34 | 0:32:36 | |
And the voices began to say, increasingly, | 0:32:36 | 0:32:39 | |
"Your daughter would be better off without you." | 0:32:39 | 0:32:42 | |
Jackie found that talking therapies were the key to helping her. | 0:32:44 | 0:32:48 | |
I worked with a very gifted therapist, | 0:32:49 | 0:32:52 | |
he actually began to encourage me to start listening to the voices, | 0:32:52 | 0:32:55 | |
and actually engaging with them more. | 0:32:55 | 0:32:58 | |
So with his support I began to ask them questions. | 0:32:58 | 0:33:02 | |
And I was astonished to find that they could answer me with really | 0:33:02 | 0:33:07 | |
lucid and helpful responses. | 0:33:07 | 0:33:09 | |
So if I spoke to them with more kindness, and with more respect, | 0:33:09 | 0:33:14 | |
in turn, they would speak to me with more kindness and respect. | 0:33:14 | 0:33:19 | |
Today Jackie lectures on mental health issues, | 0:33:26 | 0:33:29 | |
and is constantly seeking new research | 0:33:29 | 0:33:31 | |
about schizophrenia and psychosis, | 0:33:31 | 0:33:33 | |
so often meets experts across the country, | 0:33:33 | 0:33:36 | |
trying to discover the root causes of the condition. | 0:33:36 | 0:33:39 | |
Professor Charles Fernyhough is interested | 0:33:42 | 0:33:44 | |
in the source of the voices | 0:33:44 | 0:33:45 | |
some people with psychosis hear, and thinks it starts in childhood. | 0:33:45 | 0:33:49 | |
Show me your boat. | 0:33:52 | 0:33:54 | |
I'm doing a boat as well. | 0:33:55 | 0:33:57 | |
What you find, if you walk into any nursery, anywhere in the world, | 0:33:57 | 0:34:01 | |
and see typically developing kids, | 0:34:01 | 0:34:04 | |
in this case, they're about three years old, | 0:34:04 | 0:34:06 | |
playing with some Lego, playing with any sort of toys, | 0:34:06 | 0:34:09 | |
you'll find an awful lot of talking going on. | 0:34:09 | 0:34:13 | |
Now, some of the times the children are talking to other people, | 0:34:13 | 0:34:16 | |
they are talking to each other, | 0:34:16 | 0:34:18 | |
they are talking to teachers or other adults who might be around. | 0:34:18 | 0:34:21 | |
But some of the times, you'll see children talking to themselves. | 0:34:21 | 0:34:25 | |
This train is running away. | 0:34:27 | 0:34:29 | |
This is called private speech. | 0:34:29 | 0:34:31 | |
He is talking to himself. | 0:34:34 | 0:34:36 | |
He's using words directed at himself, and he is kind of | 0:34:36 | 0:34:38 | |
thinking out loud about what's going on in that passage of play. | 0:34:38 | 0:34:42 | |
This kind of speech in childhood helps children | 0:34:45 | 0:34:47 | |
to think through what they are doing. | 0:34:47 | 0:34:50 | |
The cars on the road. | 0:34:50 | 0:34:53 | |
Private speech is an important part of healthy child development. | 0:34:53 | 0:34:57 | |
And this, this train... | 0:34:57 | 0:35:01 | |
The children who are doing private speech | 0:35:01 | 0:35:03 | |
also tend to do more of it when the task is difficult. | 0:35:03 | 0:35:06 | |
They're trying to help themselves think through strategies | 0:35:06 | 0:35:10 | |
and ways of kind of working the problem out. | 0:35:10 | 0:35:12 | |
Exactly. There's something about | 0:35:12 | 0:35:14 | |
putting it into words that is helpful. | 0:35:14 | 0:35:16 | |
As we get older, this private speech becomes internal. | 0:35:17 | 0:35:21 | |
But for people with psychosis, in stressful situations, | 0:35:21 | 0:35:25 | |
it's thought that this private speech | 0:35:25 | 0:35:28 | |
can appear as an external voice. | 0:35:28 | 0:35:30 | |
Put your car on the road... | 0:35:32 | 0:35:36 | |
You no longer recognise part of the dialogue as being your own. | 0:35:36 | 0:35:39 | |
And therefore, you hear it as a voice. | 0:35:39 | 0:35:42 | |
Now, this is still in the realms of speculation until we can get more | 0:35:42 | 0:35:45 | |
evidence on this. We've only really just started to ask these questions | 0:35:45 | 0:35:49 | |
about different kinds of inner speech. | 0:35:49 | 0:35:51 | |
This research is at an early stage. | 0:35:54 | 0:35:57 | |
But it's also thought dopamine plays a part in causing the voices. | 0:35:57 | 0:36:01 | |
In people developing a psychosis, as the dopamine is overactive, | 0:36:05 | 0:36:10 | |
it's no longer correctly identifying | 0:36:10 | 0:36:13 | |
information as either coming from | 0:36:13 | 0:36:15 | |
outside, or internally generated. | 0:36:15 | 0:36:19 | |
So, inner speech might start sounding like a voice | 0:36:19 | 0:36:23 | |
outside of your head. | 0:36:23 | 0:36:24 | |
This increase in dopamine is heavily involved | 0:36:28 | 0:36:31 | |
in another central element of psychosis. | 0:36:31 | 0:36:33 | |
Fear. | 0:36:40 | 0:36:42 | |
Professor Paul Fletcher has been researching how the brain reacts | 0:36:46 | 0:36:51 | |
when it's frightened and scared, | 0:36:51 | 0:36:53 | |
and thinks there are useful comparisons | 0:36:53 | 0:36:55 | |
when likened to people with psychosis. | 0:36:55 | 0:36:57 | |
We can think of experiencing psychosis | 0:36:58 | 0:37:01 | |
as being a little bit like being in a terrifying wood like this. | 0:37:01 | 0:37:05 | |
When you have very little sensory input, | 0:37:07 | 0:37:09 | |
just vague-shaped shadows, flickering lights, | 0:37:09 | 0:37:13 | |
you start to allow your imagination to create the world, | 0:37:13 | 0:37:17 | |
rather than to base it entirely on reality. | 0:37:17 | 0:37:21 | |
So a snapping twig, instead of being interpreted just as the fire, | 0:37:21 | 0:37:26 | |
-now it becomes something more frightening. -Yes. -Maybe an intruder. | 0:37:26 | 0:37:30 | |
For most of us, this state only lasts a few moments, | 0:37:30 | 0:37:35 | |
but for people with psychosis, | 0:37:35 | 0:37:37 | |
their elevated levels of dopamine | 0:37:37 | 0:37:38 | |
mean they can feel frightened all the time. | 0:37:38 | 0:37:42 | |
Some people have suggested that dopamine is associated with the | 0:37:42 | 0:37:47 | |
importance of what's around you. So that you can pay attention to it, | 0:37:47 | 0:37:50 | |
and focus on what it's going to do next. | 0:37:50 | 0:37:52 | |
Now, imagine that dopamine was misfiring. | 0:37:53 | 0:37:56 | |
There, you might have a situation where everything seemed important. | 0:37:57 | 0:38:01 | |
You can see how that vigilance for danger could spiral out of control | 0:38:01 | 0:38:06 | |
until everything becomes a threat. | 0:38:06 | 0:38:08 | |
And probably the closest many people can come | 0:38:08 | 0:38:11 | |
to knowing just what that might be like is when | 0:38:11 | 0:38:14 | |
they're in a situation like this, | 0:38:14 | 0:38:17 | |
where there are flickering shadows that they can't really interpret, | 0:38:17 | 0:38:20 | |
where they've got their fears that are making things up all the time, | 0:38:20 | 0:38:23 | |
and they quite vividly see a figure or a face. | 0:38:23 | 0:38:26 | |
Having psychosis can be like this, | 0:38:27 | 0:38:30 | |
being continually frightened and scared all the time. | 0:38:30 | 0:38:33 | |
This terror is a daily battle for David. | 0:38:36 | 0:38:39 | |
It dominates his life. | 0:38:39 | 0:38:41 | |
Shitting fuck! | 0:38:41 | 0:38:43 | |
Um, I went for a piss. | 0:38:43 | 0:38:45 | |
And the floor started buckling like that on either side, | 0:38:45 | 0:38:49 | |
where my feet were. | 0:38:49 | 0:38:51 | |
And then they opened up, and there were teeth on the inside. | 0:38:52 | 0:38:56 | |
The bloody floor was going to eat me. | 0:38:56 | 0:38:59 | |
Fucking terrifying! | 0:38:59 | 0:39:01 | |
And while I was waiting in the... | 0:39:01 | 0:39:03 | |
in the... | 0:39:03 | 0:39:04 | |
doctor's surgery, I saw this big, | 0:39:04 | 0:39:08 | |
great, big armadillo-like thing | 0:39:08 | 0:39:12 | |
crawling along one of the beams in the top of the building. | 0:39:12 | 0:39:17 | |
And it was covered in spikes, | 0:39:17 | 0:39:19 | |
and there was poison dripping off the spikes, | 0:39:19 | 0:39:21 | |
and when the poison hit the ground, they would fizz and... | 0:39:21 | 0:39:25 | |
um, dissolve their way through the carpet. | 0:39:25 | 0:39:29 | |
I was terrified this was coming towards me, but then | 0:39:29 | 0:39:33 | |
it sort of curled up. | 0:39:33 | 0:39:35 | |
But it curled up on the route to see the doctor, which... | 0:39:35 | 0:39:39 | |
Aaargh! ..was not easy. | 0:39:42 | 0:39:44 | |
For many people, living with psychosis is a daily struggle. | 0:39:52 | 0:39:57 | |
And although the fundamental causes are beginning to be understood, | 0:39:57 | 0:40:01 | |
why some people develop it while others don't, | 0:40:01 | 0:40:05 | |
still largely remains a mystery. | 0:40:05 | 0:40:07 | |
It's thought there is a genetic component to psychosis. | 0:40:10 | 0:40:13 | |
But it doesn't seem to be the most-important factor. | 0:40:13 | 0:40:16 | |
Professor Swaran Singh believes where you live has a big impact. | 0:40:17 | 0:40:21 | |
Growing up in an urban environment increases your risk of developing | 0:40:23 | 0:40:27 | |
psychosis later on. | 0:40:27 | 0:40:29 | |
It is not to do with being born in a city. | 0:40:30 | 0:40:33 | |
It's living in a city, growing up in a city, | 0:40:33 | 0:40:36 | |
especially before the age of 15. | 0:40:36 | 0:40:38 | |
If you compare the relative contribution of genes, | 0:40:42 | 0:40:47 | |
genes contribute about 10%, but urban upbringing, 35%. | 0:40:47 | 0:40:53 | |
So it's a three-times stronger effect than genetics. | 0:40:53 | 0:40:58 | |
Beyond urban living, | 0:41:00 | 0:41:02 | |
research shows that our ethnic background | 0:41:02 | 0:41:05 | |
affects our chance of developing psychosis. | 0:41:05 | 0:41:08 | |
But this isn't as simple as race. | 0:41:08 | 0:41:09 | |
We have known for at least 25 years in this country | 0:41:12 | 0:41:16 | |
that the rates of psychotic disorders | 0:41:16 | 0:41:19 | |
are particularly high in some ethnic minority groups. | 0:41:19 | 0:41:23 | |
So we know... migration, for instance, | 0:41:23 | 0:41:26 | |
is a very significant causal factor in psychosis. | 0:41:26 | 0:41:30 | |
All migrant groups, all over the world, | 0:41:30 | 0:41:33 | |
have higher rates of psychosis than the host population. | 0:41:33 | 0:41:36 | |
It's not an ethnicity issue. | 0:41:37 | 0:41:40 | |
It's not a black and white issue. | 0:41:40 | 0:41:43 | |
It's a migrant versus host issue. | 0:41:43 | 0:41:46 | |
For instance, some of the highest reported rates of psychosis | 0:41:49 | 0:41:53 | |
are amongst Greenlanders in Denmark. | 0:41:53 | 0:41:57 | |
And they are not black. | 0:41:57 | 0:41:59 | |
What all these groups have in common is | 0:41:59 | 0:42:02 | |
social discrimination and adversity. | 0:42:02 | 0:42:05 | |
The higher rates of psychosis in ethnic minorities | 0:42:07 | 0:42:11 | |
seem to be because these groups are more likely | 0:42:11 | 0:42:14 | |
to be migrant populations. | 0:42:14 | 0:42:16 | |
The key issue appears to be dislocation. | 0:42:16 | 0:42:19 | |
Some people have argued that it is social defeat | 0:42:19 | 0:42:24 | |
that is related to psychosis. | 0:42:24 | 0:42:26 | |
By social defeat we mean repeated experiences of marginalisation, | 0:42:26 | 0:42:32 | |
exclusion, and discrimination. | 0:42:32 | 0:42:35 | |
You don't even have to leave the country | 0:42:39 | 0:42:41 | |
for this effect to take hold. | 0:42:41 | 0:42:43 | |
Simply moving to a new school, and the social upheaval that brings, | 0:42:43 | 0:42:47 | |
can be a factor in developing psychosis. | 0:42:47 | 0:42:50 | |
And we found that the greater number of school moves increased your risk | 0:42:51 | 0:42:57 | |
of developing psychotic symptoms in adolescence. | 0:42:57 | 0:43:00 | |
Every time you move schools, | 0:43:00 | 0:43:02 | |
you leave your peer group and your support network. | 0:43:02 | 0:43:05 | |
And you start again as an outsider. | 0:43:05 | 0:43:07 | |
So it's that chronic experience of being an outsider which we think is | 0:43:09 | 0:43:14 | |
related to the development of psychosis. | 0:43:14 | 0:43:17 | |
This new evidence reveals the | 0:43:19 | 0:43:21 | |
powerful impact social environment has. | 0:43:21 | 0:43:24 | |
But there are other aspects of childhood | 0:43:26 | 0:43:28 | |
that also contribute to psychosis. | 0:43:28 | 0:43:31 | |
So this is the area in which I grew up, round here. | 0:43:33 | 0:43:37 | |
And it's quite weird coming back. | 0:43:37 | 0:43:39 | |
It made my voices quite noisy. | 0:43:39 | 0:43:42 | |
Um, so I've got quite a young voice at the moment, | 0:43:42 | 0:43:46 | |
feeling quite frightened that | 0:43:46 | 0:43:47 | |
somebody's going to drag her off and do bad things to her. | 0:43:47 | 0:43:52 | |
So she's there saying, "Don't hurt me, | 0:43:52 | 0:43:54 | |
"don't let anyone do anything to me." | 0:43:54 | 0:43:57 | |
She's screaming. | 0:43:57 | 0:43:59 | |
She's begging me to "please stop him hurting me. | 0:43:59 | 0:44:02 | |
"Don't let him do any more bad things to me. | 0:44:02 | 0:44:05 | |
"I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm such a bad girl." | 0:44:05 | 0:44:07 | |
This neighbourhood holds some terrible memories for Jackie. | 0:44:09 | 0:44:12 | |
I think the reason that I began hearing voices when I was so little | 0:44:15 | 0:44:18 | |
is because of the abuse and trauma I experienced from when I was very, | 0:44:18 | 0:44:21 | |
very small, up until my teens. | 0:44:21 | 0:44:24 | |
There was a paedophile that abused me and many other children. | 0:44:26 | 0:44:30 | |
I went from a whole, | 0:44:32 | 0:44:34 | |
healthy little girl into a shattered mind. | 0:44:34 | 0:44:38 | |
My mind literally fragmented | 0:44:38 | 0:44:40 | |
as a consequence of the things that happened to me. | 0:44:40 | 0:44:43 | |
Although exact figures vary, | 0:44:44 | 0:44:47 | |
there is now a strong and consistent body of evidence that links | 0:44:47 | 0:44:50 | |
childhood abuse to a range of mental disorders. | 0:44:50 | 0:44:53 | |
Including psychosis. | 0:44:54 | 0:44:56 | |
It's been a week since David's experimental therapy began. | 0:45:06 | 0:45:10 | |
And Professor Bentall is back to see how it went. | 0:45:10 | 0:45:13 | |
I'm dropping the laptop while I'm at it. Sorry. | 0:45:13 | 0:45:16 | |
Go straight through to the end. Would you like a cup of coffee? | 0:45:16 | 0:45:18 | |
I'd love a cup of coffee. | 0:45:18 | 0:45:20 | |
I just went into Boots... | 0:45:20 | 0:45:22 | |
..and it was... | 0:45:23 | 0:45:25 | |
..horribly busy, so I was already anxious. | 0:45:26 | 0:45:29 | |
And then we went into McDonald's, which is strange for us. | 0:45:29 | 0:45:33 | |
And it was quite busy. | 0:45:33 | 0:45:36 | |
So all the tables downstairs were full. | 0:45:36 | 0:45:40 | |
And that began to wind me up, and then Downey said, | 0:45:40 | 0:45:42 | |
"Can you pop upstairs and have a look if there are any tables free?" | 0:45:42 | 0:45:45 | |
Both of us clearly not thinking this through. | 0:45:45 | 0:45:48 | |
So by the time I made it most of the way downstairs, | 0:45:48 | 0:45:52 | |
rats were teeming around everywhere, | 0:45:52 | 0:45:55 | |
the voices were screaming, screaming, | 0:45:55 | 0:45:59 | |
screaming in my head. | 0:45:59 | 0:46:01 | |
It was terrifying. | 0:46:01 | 0:46:03 | |
And then... | 0:46:03 | 0:46:05 | |
You look really quite distressed there. | 0:46:06 | 0:46:09 | |
Crowded situations are a particular difficulty for you? | 0:46:12 | 0:46:15 | |
Yes. As the stress level of being with strangers rises, | 0:46:15 | 0:46:21 | |
the hallucinations, visual and aural, go through the roof. | 0:46:21 | 0:46:26 | |
When you get very anxious, | 0:46:26 | 0:46:28 | |
one of the things which SEEMS to happen is that you get this... | 0:46:28 | 0:46:31 | |
kind of what we've described as a dissociative state. | 0:46:31 | 0:46:34 | |
Dissociation is a way of kind of handling threat. | 0:46:35 | 0:46:39 | |
In a situation where you can't escape, it's a way of escaping. | 0:46:39 | 0:46:42 | |
Because what happens is your brain kind of goes, | 0:46:42 | 0:46:45 | |
"Well, I'll just pretend that it's not real." | 0:46:45 | 0:46:48 | |
I'm sort of wondering whether that makes sense to you | 0:46:48 | 0:46:51 | |
in terms of experiences you've had in the past? | 0:46:51 | 0:46:53 | |
My mother remarried when I was four or five, | 0:46:53 | 0:46:56 | |
I can never remember, really. | 0:46:56 | 0:46:59 | |
And the person she married was a | 0:46:59 | 0:47:01 | |
sadistic, randomly violent psychopath. | 0:47:01 | 0:47:07 | |
He was just horrible. If you walked into a room... | 0:47:07 | 0:47:09 | |
..if you walked into the room the wrong way, | 0:47:12 | 0:47:14 | |
if you said the wrong thing, | 0:47:14 | 0:47:16 | |
it could be anything that could trigger off | 0:47:16 | 0:47:19 | |
you getting...getting beaten to a pulp. | 0:47:19 | 0:47:25 | |
How old were you at the time? | 0:47:25 | 0:47:27 | |
From 4 or 5, to 13. | 0:47:27 | 0:47:30 | |
Jesus! So from four or five, | 0:47:30 | 0:47:33 | |
to 13, you lived in the constant fear | 0:47:33 | 0:47:36 | |
that at any unpredictable moment, the adult, one of the adults | 0:47:36 | 0:47:40 | |
who was supposed to be caring for you, | 0:47:40 | 0:47:42 | |
would launch a brutal attack on you. | 0:47:42 | 0:47:45 | |
Yes. The atmosphere at home was terrifying. | 0:47:45 | 0:47:49 | |
Frightening beyond belief. | 0:47:49 | 0:47:51 | |
The question then is, how do you tolerate the intolerable? | 0:47:51 | 0:47:54 | |
If it was a particularly savage beating, | 0:47:54 | 0:47:57 | |
if it started suddenly and it went on for a long time, I would... | 0:47:57 | 0:48:01 | |
..pretend not to be there. | 0:48:03 | 0:48:05 | |
Right. What you're describing there | 0:48:05 | 0:48:07 | |
is what we sometimes call peri-traumatic dissociation. | 0:48:07 | 0:48:10 | |
When you're in mortal danger, in mortal terror, | 0:48:10 | 0:48:13 | |
and there is no way out, you just have to endure it, | 0:48:13 | 0:48:16 | |
your brain does this trick where it kind of goes, | 0:48:16 | 0:48:19 | |
"I'm not really there." | 0:48:19 | 0:48:21 | |
The problem is that, particularly when you have repeated trauma, | 0:48:21 | 0:48:25 | |
such as you have, you kind of learn just to do that. | 0:48:25 | 0:48:28 | |
And you carry forward that as your... | 0:48:28 | 0:48:31 | |
one of your survival strategies to adulthood. | 0:48:31 | 0:48:35 | |
This is all piling on the likelihood of you then starting to have | 0:48:35 | 0:48:39 | |
hallucinatory experiences. | 0:48:39 | 0:48:41 | |
Jackie is going to see a friend whose psychosis was also caused by | 0:48:46 | 0:48:50 | |
childhood trauma. | 0:48:50 | 0:48:51 | |
However, just like Jackie, | 0:48:55 | 0:48:57 | |
Eleanor Longden has learned to live with her voices, | 0:48:57 | 0:49:00 | |
and even become a doctor of psychology. | 0:49:00 | 0:49:02 | |
Darling! Lovely to see you. How are you? | 0:49:05 | 0:49:08 | |
You too. Good, thank you, how are you? | 0:49:08 | 0:49:10 | |
Eleanor believes that she took a big step | 0:49:10 | 0:49:12 | |
when she addressed her voices directly. | 0:49:12 | 0:49:14 | |
You know, the idea of approaching this stuff, | 0:49:14 | 0:49:18 | |
and confronting it, is so terrifying and horrifying | 0:49:18 | 0:49:22 | |
that it does feel like it could kill you. | 0:49:22 | 0:49:25 | |
She thinks her recovery began when she realised her voices weren't just | 0:49:27 | 0:49:32 | |
attacking her, but could potentially help her. | 0:49:32 | 0:49:36 | |
And this was sort of the big turning point. | 0:49:36 | 0:49:38 | |
Realising, actually, the voices weren't my enemies. | 0:49:38 | 0:49:41 | |
Speaking with one of her most frightening voices | 0:49:41 | 0:49:43 | |
proved revelatory. | 0:49:43 | 0:49:46 | |
And I remember, actually, one day saying to that him, | 0:49:46 | 0:49:48 | |
"You've drawn my attention to all this unresolved | 0:49:48 | 0:49:51 | |
"emotional problems. | 0:49:51 | 0:49:54 | |
"And all I've ever done is attack you for it | 0:49:54 | 0:49:56 | |
"and tried to get rid of you. | 0:49:56 | 0:49:57 | |
"And it must have been really lonely | 0:49:57 | 0:50:01 | |
"and really demoralising." | 0:50:01 | 0:50:04 | |
And there was a very long pause. | 0:50:04 | 0:50:06 | |
And then he finally said, "That's right. Thank you." | 0:50:06 | 0:50:10 | |
It was a really, really powerful moment. | 0:50:10 | 0:50:13 | |
And, again, this sort of, absolute sense of reconciliation, | 0:50:14 | 0:50:19 | |
of restitution between me and another part of myself. | 0:50:19 | 0:50:23 | |
Voices absolutely can - | 0:50:24 | 0:50:26 | |
even the sort of really difficult, negative ones - | 0:50:26 | 0:50:28 | |
can be recruited | 0:50:28 | 0:50:30 | |
as a part of the healing process and of the healing journey. | 0:50:30 | 0:50:34 | |
Like Eleanor, Jackie is living proof | 0:50:36 | 0:50:39 | |
that you can be successful despite having psychosis - | 0:50:39 | 0:50:43 | |
by using talking therapies. | 0:50:43 | 0:50:45 | |
However, David still has to rely on medication to deal with terrifying | 0:50:48 | 0:50:52 | |
voices and hallucinations. | 0:50:52 | 0:50:55 | |
Of course I lunge for the tranquillisers, and they take | 0:50:56 | 0:50:59 | |
about 15, 20 minutes to kick in, | 0:50:59 | 0:51:01 | |
so I have all of this going on for 15, 20 minutes. | 0:51:01 | 0:51:03 | |
And I am... | 0:51:03 | 0:51:07 | |
less bothered by it now. | 0:51:07 | 0:51:09 | |
But "less bothered" means I wouldn't mind dying when I go to sleep. | 0:51:09 | 0:51:13 | |
I don't want any more chest pains... | 0:51:15 | 0:51:17 | |
..given to me by an anti-psychotic I took. | 0:51:19 | 0:51:22 | |
The, um... | 0:51:22 | 0:51:23 | |
..cardiologist said I'll be lucky to live until I'm 50. | 0:51:25 | 0:51:29 | |
I don't want to get terrified when | 0:51:31 | 0:51:33 | |
I'm in a group of more than about five people, me included. | 0:51:33 | 0:51:37 | |
Terrified, I want to run away. | 0:51:40 | 0:51:42 | |
Come on, Kitsu, off you go, off you go. | 0:51:44 | 0:51:47 | |
Off you go, Kitsu! | 0:51:47 | 0:51:49 | |
That's a good cat. | 0:51:49 | 0:51:51 | |
Problem solved. | 0:51:53 | 0:51:54 | |
David is going to meet Professor Sir Robin Murray - | 0:51:57 | 0:52:00 | |
one of the country's leading psychiatrists, | 0:52:00 | 0:52:02 | |
who's warned that long-term use of anti-psychotic medication | 0:52:02 | 0:52:06 | |
can cause serious side effects. | 0:52:06 | 0:52:09 | |
So, as I said, I've been on anti-psychotics since 1999. | 0:52:09 | 0:52:14 | |
Should I have been on them for that long? | 0:52:14 | 0:52:17 | |
The ideal is to get off the anti-psychotics, | 0:52:17 | 0:52:20 | |
but it's not always possible. | 0:52:20 | 0:52:22 | |
And we do know that there are side effects - | 0:52:22 | 0:52:25 | |
in particular they tend to make people put on weight. | 0:52:25 | 0:52:29 | |
And that... | 0:52:29 | 0:52:31 | |
Yes. So that, of course, | 0:52:31 | 0:52:35 | |
brings an increased risk of diabetes, | 0:52:35 | 0:52:37 | |
an increased risk of heart disease | 0:52:37 | 0:52:39 | |
and similar problems. | 0:52:39 | 0:52:42 | |
If I don't take anti-psychotics, | 0:52:42 | 0:52:44 | |
I start having extremely florid psychotic episodes where I totally | 0:52:44 | 0:52:50 | |
disassociate from the real world, | 0:52:50 | 0:52:52 | |
and I'm running into walls and things, screaming... | 0:52:52 | 0:52:56 | |
It may be that for unfortunate reasons | 0:52:56 | 0:52:59 | |
you are one of the people who has to continue | 0:52:59 | 0:53:02 | |
to take the anti-psychotics. | 0:53:02 | 0:53:04 | |
For many people with psychosis, | 0:53:07 | 0:53:09 | |
anti-psychotics are still the primary treatment they can access. | 0:53:09 | 0:53:14 | |
The medications that you are taking are much cheaper | 0:53:14 | 0:53:18 | |
than psychological therapy. | 0:53:18 | 0:53:20 | |
And, sadly, many psychiatrists are working in services | 0:53:20 | 0:53:26 | |
where there is very limited psychological or social support. | 0:53:26 | 0:53:31 | |
And therefore, all that can be done is medication. | 0:53:31 | 0:53:35 | |
So that is when the service appears to be so limited | 0:53:35 | 0:53:39 | |
and diminishes people's chances to recover. | 0:53:39 | 0:53:43 | |
# And older now | 0:53:48 | 0:53:51 | |
# I am home again | 0:53:53 | 0:53:57 | |
# Your touch feels like... # | 0:53:57 | 0:54:01 | |
As a child, I believed I was a monster because I was abused. | 0:54:01 | 0:54:06 | |
I had a lovely family. What I kept hidden, what I kept inside | 0:54:07 | 0:54:11 | |
was that someone sexually abused me. | 0:54:11 | 0:54:14 | |
And I never told my family. | 0:54:14 | 0:54:17 | |
I just...pushed it down so far, yet it was there. | 0:54:17 | 0:54:21 | |
And when I looked in the mirror, that's what I saw. | 0:54:21 | 0:54:25 | |
If this trauma caused Rachel's hostile voices, like the Not Yets, | 0:54:25 | 0:54:30 | |
could confronting them with therapy help? | 0:54:30 | 0:54:33 | |
She is meeting with Dr Dirk Corstens. | 0:54:43 | 0:54:46 | |
In the session, he will talk directly to one of the Not Yets. | 0:54:46 | 0:54:51 | |
My intention is to engage with him, and talk with him, | 0:54:54 | 0:54:58 | |
and ask what he stands for. | 0:54:58 | 0:55:01 | |
And the specific question, when he hurts you, | 0:55:01 | 0:55:06 | |
is that trying to hurt or to communicate? | 0:55:06 | 0:55:09 | |
Where do you think he would like to sit in the room? | 0:55:09 | 0:55:14 | |
Separate from you? | 0:55:14 | 0:55:16 | |
Separate from me. Yes. | 0:55:16 | 0:55:18 | |
If he is there, please then connect with me. | 0:55:24 | 0:55:29 | |
Do you have a name? | 0:55:33 | 0:55:35 | |
No. Who do you think you are? | 0:55:36 | 0:55:39 | |
I am someone who wants to support Rachel - | 0:55:41 | 0:55:46 | |
and you, in a way. | 0:55:46 | 0:55:48 | |
Are you scared of me? | 0:55:48 | 0:55:50 | |
No, I'm not scared of you. | 0:55:50 | 0:55:51 | |
What are the things you are telling to her? | 0:55:51 | 0:55:54 | |
Tell her that she will get hurt. | 0:55:54 | 0:55:56 | |
That they will hurt her. | 0:55:58 | 0:55:59 | |
That it's her fault. | 0:56:01 | 0:56:03 | |
Does it make her afraid? | 0:56:03 | 0:56:05 | |
She SHOULD be afraid. | 0:56:05 | 0:56:07 | |
That you are in? | 0:56:07 | 0:56:09 | |
And what's the reason that she should be afraid? | 0:56:09 | 0:56:12 | |
-She will be hurt. -You warn her? | 0:56:12 | 0:56:15 | |
Is that a warning or...? | 0:56:15 | 0:56:16 | |
I just tell her what's going to happen. | 0:56:18 | 0:56:20 | |
And how long do you tell her that? | 0:56:20 | 0:56:23 | |
As long as I need to. | 0:56:25 | 0:56:27 | |
I feel that you feel sad, is that true? | 0:56:27 | 0:56:30 | |
-I don't feel. -You don't feel at all? | 0:56:30 | 0:56:33 | |
-No, I see. -What specific things do you see? | 0:56:33 | 0:56:37 | |
I see them picking at her. | 0:56:38 | 0:56:40 | |
You see a lot... | 0:56:40 | 0:56:41 | |
..things that are dangerous for Rachel? | 0:56:43 | 0:56:45 | |
Yes. | 0:56:47 | 0:56:48 | |
Thank you very much. | 0:56:50 | 0:56:51 | |
Thank you. | 0:56:53 | 0:56:54 | |
By trying to understand the viewpoint of the Not Yet voice, | 0:56:55 | 0:56:59 | |
Dirk hopes he can improve the relationship it has with Rachel. | 0:56:59 | 0:57:03 | |
-How do you feel? -I feel on the edges of emotional. | 0:57:09 | 0:57:13 | |
-He wasn't as aggressive as he usually is to me. -No. | 0:57:14 | 0:57:16 | |
I guess | 0:57:19 | 0:57:22 | |
that this voice | 0:57:22 | 0:57:25 | |
means that he has seen something. | 0:57:25 | 0:57:29 | |
Sometimes, voices are fed up with what they are doing, | 0:57:30 | 0:57:36 | |
and when you open up that perspective, | 0:57:36 | 0:57:38 | |
then you can help the voice to reach their goal in a more fruitful way. | 0:57:38 | 0:57:44 | |
Our experience, | 0:57:45 | 0:57:47 | |
and there is also research that says if you only suppress your voices, | 0:57:47 | 0:57:52 | |
then they become stronger. | 0:57:52 | 0:57:54 | |
So, that was pretty intense. | 0:57:59 | 0:58:02 | |
When I went in to it, I really wanted to know, | 0:58:02 | 0:58:05 | |
I thought the voice was powerful, that it was threatening me. | 0:58:05 | 0:58:08 | |
I thought it meant me harm. | 0:58:08 | 0:58:10 | |
I was just wondering, could it have been trying to warn me? | 0:58:10 | 0:58:13 | |
I think what I've learned is, yes, it WAS trying to warn me. | 0:58:13 | 0:58:16 | |
It IS trying to warn me. | 0:58:16 | 0:58:18 | |
And just knowing that makes it seems less scary. | 0:58:18 | 0:58:21 | |
Psychosis has many names | 0:58:23 | 0:58:26 | |
and was long considered an irreversible condition. | 0:58:26 | 0:58:29 | |
But research now increasingly suggests | 0:58:29 | 0:58:31 | |
that it's primarily the brain's response to traumatic events. | 0:58:31 | 0:58:36 | |
And perhaps if we can identify the cause, we can address it, | 0:58:36 | 0:58:40 | |
and that holds out the prospect of recovery. | 0:58:40 | 0:58:43 |