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Every year, thousands of people die | 0:00:02 | 0:00:05 | |
with no will and with no apparent relatives. | 0:00:05 | 0:00:07 | |
Tracking down their long-lost families | 0:00:07 | 0:00:10 | |
is a job for the Heir Hunters. | 0:00:10 | 0:00:12 | |
Coming up... | 0:00:32 | 0:00:33 | |
...the Heir Hunters uncover an unexpected fortune of a council worker | 0:00:34 | 0:00:38 | |
hidden in the strangest of places. | 0:00:38 | 0:00:42 | |
I was very surprised when I found out he'd got money in suitcases, | 0:00:42 | 0:00:46 | |
but it did fit in with his reluctance to spend money. | 0:00:46 | 0:00:49 | |
And the intriguing case of two Victorian philanthropists, | 0:00:49 | 0:00:53 | |
an £800,000 school and some difficult dying wishes. | 0:00:53 | 0:00:58 | |
There's no clue at all to what was meant and any expert, will expert, | 0:00:58 | 0:01:04 | |
would have to deem this impossible to implement. | 0:01:04 | 0:01:08 | |
Plus, how you may be entitled to inherit | 0:01:10 | 0:01:12 | |
some of the unclaimed estates held by the Treasury. | 0:01:12 | 0:01:15 | |
Could thousands of pounds be headed your way? | 0:01:15 | 0:01:18 | |
More than two thirds of people die without leaving a will. | 0:01:21 | 0:01:25 | |
If they have no obvious relatives, their money goes to the Government, | 0:01:25 | 0:01:28 | |
who last year made a staggering £18 million from unclaimed estates. | 0:01:28 | 0:01:33 | |
That's where the Heir Hunters step in. | 0:01:33 | 0:01:36 | |
More than 30 heir-hunting companies make it their business to track down | 0:01:38 | 0:01:42 | |
the rightful kin to these unclaimed estates. | 0:01:42 | 0:01:46 | |
Fraser & Fraser is one of the largest firms of heir hunters in Britain. | 0:01:46 | 0:01:50 | |
It's run by Andrew, Charles and Neil Fraser. | 0:01:50 | 0:01:54 | |
You can see the smile on their face | 0:01:54 | 0:01:56 | |
as they know they're going to receive | 0:01:56 | 0:01:58 | |
sometimes tens, possibly even hundreds, of thousands of pounds. | 0:01:58 | 0:02:02 | |
A real life-changing event. | 0:02:02 | 0:02:03 | |
In its 30-year history, it's united over 50,000 heirs | 0:02:03 | 0:02:07 | |
with unclaimed estates worth a whopping sum of over £100 million. | 0:02:07 | 0:02:12 | |
It's Thursday, | 0:02:21 | 0:02:22 | |
the day the Treasury publishes its list of unclaimed estates. | 0:02:22 | 0:02:25 | |
The team have identified those which they think contain property, | 0:02:25 | 0:02:30 | |
making them potentially high value cases and ones worth pursuing. | 0:02:30 | 0:02:34 | |
I'm expecting it to be quite active today, quite competitive, really, | 0:02:34 | 0:02:38 | |
and fingers crossed, we'll do well. | 0:02:38 | 0:02:40 | |
How are we getting on with the census? | 0:02:40 | 0:02:44 | |
For every name that the team thinks has a property, there are others that are more difficult to judge, | 0:02:44 | 0:02:50 | |
especially as all estates are listed without giving any values. | 0:02:50 | 0:02:54 | |
Just very briefly remind me what search we've actually got. | 0:02:54 | 0:02:57 | |
Senior Case Manager, Tony Pledger, has been given one such case, | 0:02:57 | 0:03:01 | |
that of Crook. | 0:03:01 | 0:03:02 | |
You never know what you're gonna find and indeed, | 0:03:02 | 0:03:05 | |
life's full of surprises, you know. | 0:03:05 | 0:03:07 | |
I wouldn't be surprised if this didn't work out to be a lot more | 0:03:07 | 0:03:10 | |
than we anticipate. Equally so, | 0:03:10 | 0:03:12 | |
I wouldn't be surprised if it would turn out to be a lot less. | 0:03:12 | 0:03:16 | |
You just dunno, you know. | 0:03:16 | 0:03:17 | |
Albert Edward Crook died on 1st February 2008, aged 69. | 0:03:17 | 0:03:25 | |
He'd never married or had children | 0:03:25 | 0:03:28 | |
but had lived all his life in Cheshire. | 0:03:28 | 0:03:31 | |
He worked for many years as a farm labourer | 0:03:31 | 0:03:34 | |
at Hodge Lane Farm in Northwich, | 0:03:34 | 0:03:36 | |
where he was responsible for the welfare of the working horses. | 0:03:36 | 0:03:40 | |
Peter Cotherall, the current owner of the farm, | 0:03:42 | 0:03:45 | |
recalls Albert's dedication. | 0:03:45 | 0:03:47 | |
Albert was one of the finest horsemen that ever worked on any farm. | 0:03:47 | 0:03:52 | |
When the horse would be out ploughing the fields and if a shower of rain | 0:03:52 | 0:03:56 | |
happened to come, Albert would take his coat off | 0:03:56 | 0:03:58 | |
and put it over the kidneys on the horse, the horse's kidneys, | 0:03:58 | 0:04:02 | |
to keep it warm and forgot about himself. | 0:04:02 | 0:04:05 | |
That's how good Albert was. | 0:04:05 | 0:04:07 | |
His loyalty and industrious nature | 0:04:07 | 0:04:10 | |
must have made Albert a cut above the rest. | 0:04:10 | 0:04:13 | |
I'd certainly, as a contractor on a farm, I worked on farms myself | 0:04:13 | 0:04:17 | |
and I know all about hard work on farms. | 0:04:17 | 0:04:20 | |
I would staff that man. He would work for me. | 0:04:20 | 0:04:23 | |
Albert loved to work outdoors, | 0:04:23 | 0:04:25 | |
but never strayed far from the area where he'd grown up. | 0:04:25 | 0:04:29 | |
Before he retired, he worked as a gardener for the local council. | 0:04:29 | 0:04:33 | |
For the last four years of his life, he lived at Morningside Rest Home. | 0:04:33 | 0:04:39 | |
He had a very reclusive life | 0:04:39 | 0:04:40 | |
and apart from a few holidays in his later life, | 0:04:40 | 0:04:43 | |
I don't think he did a lot. I don't think he went anywhere. | 0:04:43 | 0:04:47 | |
He lived so frugally he must have never spent money at all. | 0:04:47 | 0:04:51 | |
Albert's working life wouldn't have made him a fortune, | 0:04:51 | 0:04:54 | |
but because he made no will, any money he did leave | 0:04:54 | 0:04:57 | |
is being held by the Treasury. | 0:04:57 | 0:05:00 | |
To get Albert's estate united with the rightful heirs, | 0:05:02 | 0:05:05 | |
the office need to kick-start the investigation. | 0:05:05 | 0:05:08 | |
He dies in Crewe in Cheshire and we couldn't positively identify | 0:05:09 | 0:05:15 | |
his home address, but I've now established that when he died | 0:05:15 | 0:05:21 | |
he was at a residential care home. | 0:05:21 | 0:05:24 | |
I've spoken with the care home, | 0:05:24 | 0:05:26 | |
they've given me some of his details, previous address etc. | 0:05:26 | 0:05:29 | |
So, we've been making enquiries. | 0:05:29 | 0:05:31 | |
They thought that he had a niece that went to the funeral | 0:05:31 | 0:05:34 | |
and that rather seems unlikely, | 0:05:34 | 0:05:36 | |
so it's probably either a niece by marriage or... | 0:05:36 | 0:05:39 | |
I don't know what, but we do think that he had a sister. | 0:05:39 | 0:05:42 | |
Tony has some pieces of information, but nothing is confirmed. | 0:05:42 | 0:05:46 | |
To get accurate family records, he needs help on the ground. | 0:05:46 | 0:05:51 | |
That's where the travelling Heir Hunters come in. | 0:05:51 | 0:05:54 | |
Frasers has a network of senior researchers right across the country | 0:06:00 | 0:06:04 | |
who are ready to go wherever the hunt takes them. | 0:06:04 | 0:06:07 | |
They collect the vital birth, death and marriage certificates | 0:06:07 | 0:06:11 | |
as well as interview people who knew the deceased. | 0:06:11 | 0:06:15 | |
But their most important job is finding and signing up heirs. | 0:06:18 | 0:06:23 | |
Ex-Fraud Squad Detective, Dave Mansell, | 0:06:26 | 0:06:29 | |
has been an Heir Hunter for over ten years. | 0:06:29 | 0:06:32 | |
His patch is the Manchester region and he's on hand to help Tony with the Crook case. | 0:06:32 | 0:06:37 | |
Tony thinks he might have identified an address in Northwich, | 0:06:40 | 0:06:44 | |
but Albert Crook is hardly an unusual name, so... | 0:06:44 | 0:06:49 | |
he's gonna make some enquiries, | 0:06:49 | 0:06:51 | |
try ringing a neighbour or two and then... | 0:06:51 | 0:06:53 | |
But we'll carry on and get the death certificate | 0:06:53 | 0:06:56 | |
to see if it confirms his suspicions. | 0:06:56 | 0:06:59 | |
And the only way to confirm these suspicions | 0:06:59 | 0:07:02 | |
is to find the birth, death and marriage certificates which are the building blocks | 0:07:02 | 0:07:08 | |
of creating a family tree. | 0:07:08 | 0:07:09 | |
With the information they get from these, | 0:07:09 | 0:07:12 | |
the researchers need to work out, generation by generation, | 0:07:12 | 0:07:16 | |
who the family is, who is entitled and then find any living heirs. | 0:07:16 | 0:07:20 | |
Only at this point can the company make its commission. | 0:07:20 | 0:07:24 | |
Dave Mansell is getting the death certificate for Albert | 0:07:26 | 0:07:29 | |
to confirm the little information they have | 0:07:29 | 0:07:31 | |
and also to try and find new clues for the family | 0:07:31 | 0:07:34 | |
from the informant's name. | 0:07:34 | 0:07:36 | |
Albert Edward Crook died 1st February, as we knew, | 0:07:36 | 0:07:39 | |
and it's from the Morningside Rest Home that Tony | 0:07:39 | 0:07:42 | |
had already got the information about, | 0:07:42 | 0:07:45 | |
so we're off to the rest home now. | 0:07:45 | 0:07:48 | |
We'll go and see the lady there. | 0:07:48 | 0:07:50 | |
Back in the office, the search room is in full swing... | 0:07:50 | 0:07:53 | |
..but not on Tony's little job. | 0:07:55 | 0:07:56 | |
All the effort is being put into a high value property case. | 0:07:56 | 0:07:59 | |
Yeah, he's married before. When was his first marriage? | 0:07:59 | 0:08:03 | |
So you're on your way up to the care home | 0:08:03 | 0:08:05 | |
to Morningside in Winsford, yeah? | 0:08:05 | 0:08:08 | |
While Tony waits for Dave to quiz the nursing home about Albert, | 0:08:08 | 0:08:11 | |
he and his one researcher are looking at potential Crook family members. | 0:08:11 | 0:08:15 | |
We've got the deceased, we've got that bloke, | 0:08:15 | 0:08:18 | |
who isn't entitled, he's a step-brother. That's the best I can do. | 0:08:18 | 0:08:21 | |
With little office support to dramatically push the case forward, | 0:08:21 | 0:08:25 | |
it's now all down to Dave Mansell and his face-to-face enquiries. | 0:08:25 | 0:08:30 | |
Albert Edward Crook, when was he admitted? | 0:08:30 | 0:08:33 | |
June 04, 2004. | 0:08:33 | 0:08:37 | |
Donna Liddiat looked after Albert for four years. | 0:08:37 | 0:08:40 | |
Her knowledge of him could be vital. | 0:08:40 | 0:08:43 | |
One lady in particular used to cook for him and I believe from speaking | 0:08:43 | 0:08:48 | |
to my deputy, Pauline, that they used to go on holiday together. | 0:08:48 | 0:08:52 | |
After he passed away, the lady's nephew phoned me | 0:08:52 | 0:08:54 | |
-to say that they'd found a suitcase... -Right. | 0:08:54 | 0:08:57 | |
..and when they've opened it, there's a number of pay packets, unopened. | 0:08:57 | 0:09:02 | |
Unopened wage packets - I wish I could leave mine unopened! | 0:09:02 | 0:09:05 | |
SHE LAUGHS | 0:09:05 | 0:09:08 | |
-Great! -Albert was never married. | 0:09:08 | 0:09:10 | |
-He never married? -He lived with his mother and father in a bungalow | 0:09:10 | 0:09:15 | |
and when his mother and father died, | 0:09:15 | 0:09:18 | |
the bungalow was sold and he moved into this sheltered accommodation. | 0:09:18 | 0:09:22 | |
So, he probably got the proceeds from the bungalow? | 0:09:22 | 0:09:25 | |
Never married, lived with his parents. | 0:09:25 | 0:09:27 | |
There was an amount mentioned at that time of £100,000. | 0:09:27 | 0:09:33 | |
Did you tell Tony that? | 0:09:33 | 0:09:36 | |
I didn't... I've only just... | 0:09:36 | 0:09:37 | |
I've not... I found out this information after I spoke to Tony. | 0:09:37 | 0:09:41 | |
Right, OK, that's great. | 0:09:41 | 0:09:42 | |
This has just gone from being a small job for Tony | 0:09:42 | 0:09:46 | |
to a potentially major case for the company. | 0:09:46 | 0:09:49 | |
A suggested estate of up to £100,000 and the possible existence | 0:09:49 | 0:09:54 | |
of a suitcase full of money is an amazing turn of events. | 0:09:54 | 0:09:58 | |
-Bye. -Bye. | 0:09:58 | 0:10:00 | |
Donna at the home here said that when the parents' bungalow was sold, | 0:10:00 | 0:10:04 | |
he got all the proceeds from it and he immediately moved into | 0:10:04 | 0:10:09 | |
the sheltered accommodation, hence never spending his wage packets. | 0:10:09 | 0:10:13 | |
No, no, no, I see what you mean. Right, OK then, that's good. | 0:10:13 | 0:10:18 | |
Our assumption is that the value of the mother's property | 0:10:18 | 0:10:22 | |
that was sold in the 1990s is still complete, | 0:10:22 | 0:10:26 | |
because it's been invested in his name. | 0:10:26 | 0:10:30 | |
So, what we're hoping is it's gonna be in the region of £100,000. | 0:10:30 | 0:10:33 | |
It's been an incredible morning. | 0:10:34 | 0:10:36 | |
A case that started out as possibly worthless could now be | 0:10:36 | 0:10:40 | |
as valuable as £100,000, not to mention the mysterious suitcase. | 0:10:40 | 0:10:44 | |
With this insider information, | 0:10:44 | 0:10:47 | |
it's more important than ever that Tony and his team find heirs. | 0:10:47 | 0:10:51 | |
If they don't, all this money will go to the government. | 0:10:51 | 0:10:54 | |
Coming across unexpected and unusual estates | 0:11:04 | 0:11:07 | |
is the high point of being an Heir Hunter. | 0:11:07 | 0:11:09 | |
One such case was referred to probate researcher company Hoopers, | 0:11:09 | 0:11:13 | |
the oldest heir-hunting firm in the country. | 0:11:13 | 0:11:17 | |
They were asked to unravel the mystery of who owned a valuable | 0:11:17 | 0:11:20 | |
Victorian school site worth almost £800,000. | 0:11:20 | 0:11:24 | |
We had a plot of land, | 0:11:24 | 0:11:27 | |
we had this dilemma of identifying the two donors, | 0:11:27 | 0:11:32 | |
what happened to them, who survived | 0:11:32 | 0:11:34 | |
and then identifying who was going to inherit from that estate. | 0:11:34 | 0:11:38 | |
It just made the whole case different from the normal cases that we deal with. | 0:11:38 | 0:11:46 | |
Essex Council Solicitor, Steven Woodyard, | 0:11:46 | 0:11:48 | |
was in charge of dealing with the ownership status of the school. | 0:11:48 | 0:11:53 | |
The case that I had on my hands was a site which was not owned by the council | 0:11:53 | 0:11:57 | |
but was acquired by two men in the latter part of the 19th century - | 0:11:57 | 0:12:03 | |
a Mr Coope and a Mr Belli - | 0:12:03 | 0:12:06 | |
and they acquired the site and owned it jointly. | 0:12:06 | 0:12:09 | |
This document basically told me | 0:12:09 | 0:12:11 | |
that the use and control of the school site and the school itself, | 0:12:11 | 0:12:15 | |
obviously, was transferred to Essex County Council. | 0:12:15 | 0:12:19 | |
This was in 1913. And it also implied that if | 0:12:19 | 0:12:23 | |
the school ceased to be a school provided by the council, | 0:12:23 | 0:12:26 | |
then it would pass back to the original owners. | 0:12:26 | 0:12:29 | |
If the school ever moved from the building, | 0:12:29 | 0:12:32 | |
the site would revert to the living heirs | 0:12:32 | 0:12:34 | |
of the two men who originally owned it. | 0:12:34 | 0:12:36 | |
And those first title holders were | 0:12:36 | 0:12:39 | |
wealthy philanthropists Reverend Charles Belli and Octavius Coope. | 0:12:39 | 0:12:43 | |
They collective donated £160 to buy the land and create the school. | 0:12:43 | 0:12:49 | |
Local benefactors and life-long friends, | 0:12:49 | 0:12:52 | |
they were buried side by side | 0:12:52 | 0:12:54 | |
in St Peter's Church Graveyard in South Weald. | 0:12:54 | 0:12:56 | |
But 128 years after its creation, the school they built | 0:12:56 | 0:13:02 | |
now had an increasing catchment area and the council needed to relocate | 0:13:02 | 0:13:06 | |
to a bigger building, so Steven Woodyard looked up the deeds to the property. | 0:13:06 | 0:13:12 | |
There was very little paperwork. | 0:13:12 | 0:13:14 | |
Normally I would expect to see several documents relating to land | 0:13:14 | 0:13:19 | |
and relating to the council's title in land. | 0:13:19 | 0:13:22 | |
In this case there are only two documents and the nature of them was, | 0:13:22 | 0:13:27 | |
one in particular, was different from anything I'd encountered before, | 0:13:27 | 0:13:30 | |
so I was entering sort of new territory. | 0:13:30 | 0:13:33 | |
The key article he unearthed was an old legal document | 0:13:33 | 0:13:37 | |
which revealed the ownership status of the land. | 0:13:37 | 0:13:40 | |
What we're looking at here | 0:13:40 | 0:13:41 | |
is the indenture of 1874 which details that the two men | 0:13:41 | 0:13:45 | |
held the property on a joint tenancy but if one of them died, | 0:13:45 | 0:13:50 | |
then the other one would actually take the whole legal interest | 0:13:50 | 0:13:54 | |
in the property and own it in their own right. | 0:13:54 | 0:13:57 | |
According to the indenture, whoever outlived the other | 0:13:57 | 0:14:00 | |
would be the owner of the site and their estate would benefit. | 0:14:00 | 0:14:04 | |
But who died first? | 0:14:04 | 0:14:07 | |
Establishing this would mean delving back into records over hundreds of years old, | 0:14:07 | 0:14:12 | |
so Steven needed to refer the case to the experts. | 0:14:12 | 0:14:15 | |
Hoopers is one of the UK's most established heir-hunting companies. | 0:14:16 | 0:14:21 | |
Founded in 1923, | 0:14:21 | 0:14:22 | |
they have a wealth of experience in genealogical research. | 0:14:22 | 0:14:25 | |
With over 20 full-time researchers, their detective work | 0:14:25 | 0:14:29 | |
has reunited thousands of heirs with unexpected windfalls. | 0:14:29 | 0:14:33 | |
They specialise in seeking out beneficiaries named in wills | 0:14:33 | 0:14:37 | |
and crucially, they also solve issues of property ownership. | 0:14:37 | 0:14:40 | |
Could I get someone to have a look for a death for me? Anna, would you? | 0:14:40 | 0:14:45 | |
Chairman, Mike Tringham, with 35 years of heir-hunting experience, | 0:14:45 | 0:14:49 | |
took up the challenge of unravelling Belli and Coope's final wishes. | 0:14:49 | 0:14:53 | |
Start about 1880. | 0:14:53 | 0:14:55 | |
Even if they were over 100 years old. | 0:14:55 | 0:14:59 | |
Having identified the problem of the two donors, | 0:14:59 | 0:15:04 | |
we then had to try and identify | 0:15:04 | 0:15:07 | |
when they died and who survived out of the two of them | 0:15:07 | 0:15:11 | |
because obviously there's no point in pursuing both families | 0:15:11 | 0:15:15 | |
because we knew from the official documentation | 0:15:15 | 0:15:19 | |
that only the survivor we need to concern ourselves with. | 0:15:19 | 0:15:23 | |
Once we've identified that individual, | 0:15:23 | 0:15:26 | |
then that's the direction we would go. | 0:15:26 | 0:15:29 | |
Right, Coope. | 0:15:29 | 0:15:31 | |
The site was estimated to be worth £800,000... | 0:15:31 | 0:15:35 | |
Yeah, that's him. | 0:15:35 | 0:15:36 | |
..a good inheritance for any surviving family members | 0:15:36 | 0:15:39 | |
of either the Coope or Belli family. | 0:15:39 | 0:15:41 | |
Jolly good. | 0:15:41 | 0:15:43 | |
But which was it going to be? | 0:15:43 | 0:15:45 | |
We discovered that the Reverend Charles Belli | 0:15:47 | 0:15:51 | |
died on 6th January 1886 | 0:15:51 | 0:15:54 | |
in the Brentwood area and to our surprise, I suppose, | 0:15:54 | 0:16:00 | |
Octavius Edward Coope only survived by a matter of a few months | 0:16:00 | 0:16:04 | |
and he died on 27th November 1886, so obviously we knew that | 0:16:04 | 0:16:09 | |
we had to concentrate on the Coope family and as far as the Bellis' were concerned, | 0:16:09 | 0:16:14 | |
I'm afraid they were out of the frame. | 0:16:14 | 0:16:17 | |
The hunt had started for the Coope family, | 0:16:19 | 0:16:21 | |
to inform them of their unexpected windfall. | 0:16:21 | 0:16:24 | |
Octavius came from the upper trading classes. | 0:16:24 | 0:16:28 | |
He started work at his father's sugar refinery business in London's East End | 0:16:28 | 0:16:33 | |
before moving into the brewing industry. | 0:16:33 | 0:16:35 | |
In 1845, he joined Edward Ind's brewery, an already well-established | 0:16:35 | 0:16:41 | |
business in Romford, Essex, renaming it as Ind Coope. | 0:16:41 | 0:16:45 | |
This was to be the source of Octavius's wealth. | 0:16:45 | 0:16:48 | |
As soon as I saw the name Coope, | 0:16:48 | 0:16:49 | |
I obviously connected that with the brewery dynasty | 0:16:49 | 0:16:53 | |
and knowing that there was a big brewery in Romford, | 0:16:53 | 0:16:58 | |
I assume that there was some family connection | 0:16:58 | 0:17:01 | |
with that industry. | 0:17:01 | 0:17:04 | |
Octavius came from a traditional Victorian family, | 0:17:05 | 0:17:09 | |
marrying Emily Fulcher in 1848 and having one son, | 0:17:09 | 0:17:13 | |
Edward and five daughters, Ada, Mabel, Emily, Cicely and Alice. | 0:17:13 | 0:17:19 | |
Usually, the Heir Hunter's job is to trawl through birth, | 0:17:19 | 0:17:23 | |
death and marriage records, | 0:17:23 | 0:17:25 | |
tracing the bloodlines to find heirs. | 0:17:25 | 0:17:27 | |
But if the deceased had left a will, it would cut out all that work. | 0:17:27 | 0:17:31 | |
Unluckily for Mike, Octavius had done just that. | 0:17:31 | 0:17:37 | |
He actually left provision for his widow to benefit from his estate | 0:17:38 | 0:17:44 | |
during her lifetime but after her death, | 0:17:44 | 0:17:48 | |
then did he bequeath the residue of his estate to his five daughters. | 0:17:48 | 0:17:53 | |
There was a son as well, but for some reason | 0:17:53 | 0:17:56 | |
his son wasn't included in his will. Just the daughters. | 0:17:56 | 0:18:00 | |
In fact, his son, Edward, was well-catered for, | 0:18:00 | 0:18:03 | |
with Octavius leaving his portion of Ind Coope shares to him. | 0:18:03 | 0:18:07 | |
We have identified the five daughters and then we have to look to see | 0:18:07 | 0:18:12 | |
what happened to them, who they married, | 0:18:12 | 0:18:15 | |
when they died and then we look to see if they've left a will | 0:18:15 | 0:18:20 | |
and who they had left their estates to. | 0:18:20 | 0:18:23 | |
The will spanned over a century and was difficult to decipher, but they | 0:18:23 | 0:18:28 | |
led the Heir Hunters down through each generation of the Coope family. | 0:18:28 | 0:18:32 | |
Living relatives to Octavius Coope | 0:18:34 | 0:18:36 | |
were slowly being uncovered, including Bob Wayne, | 0:18:36 | 0:18:39 | |
whose great-grandmother, Mabel Coope, | 0:18:39 | 0:18:42 | |
was one of Octavius's daughters. | 0:18:42 | 0:18:45 | |
One suddenly realises one's learning a great deal more than, | 0:18:45 | 0:18:48 | |
or inheriting a great deal more than just a bit of money. | 0:18:48 | 0:18:51 | |
It is the sort of knowledge of what went on in the past. | 0:18:51 | 0:18:56 | |
Inheritance isn't just about money, it's about who you are. | 0:18:56 | 0:19:02 | |
Bob has an appointment with Mike to discover more about the family. | 0:19:04 | 0:19:09 | |
-This is the great man himself. -Yes. Quite a good-looking man, actually! | 0:19:09 | 0:19:14 | |
Yes, I think he was. Obviously looking very prosperous. | 0:19:14 | 0:19:19 | |
I think the more I look at it and looking at you, | 0:19:19 | 0:19:23 | |
I think there is definitely a family likeness. | 0:19:23 | 0:19:25 | |
I received this letter completely out of the blue, | 0:19:25 | 0:19:28 | |
telling me that there was a sum of money resulting from | 0:19:28 | 0:19:34 | |
the sale of a property in Essex | 0:19:34 | 0:19:37 | |
and that it was very likely that we could be entitled to a share of it. | 0:19:37 | 0:19:43 | |
They asked me for the names of my brothers and sisters | 0:19:43 | 0:19:48 | |
and so I then had to turn round and write to them all | 0:19:48 | 0:19:52 | |
and tell them the good news. | 0:19:52 | 0:19:55 | |
I think I started by saying, | 0:19:55 | 0:19:58 | |
"Now is your chance to buy that yacht or that Roller. | 0:19:58 | 0:20:04 | |
"You're in for a share of a fortune!" | 0:20:04 | 0:20:07 | |
I then covered myself by saying it's more likely to be tuppence ha'penny! | 0:20:07 | 0:20:12 | |
With Bob's information, Hoopers was able to find more heirs. | 0:20:12 | 0:20:16 | |
The case was going well, almost too well. | 0:20:16 | 0:20:21 | |
The will of one of Octavius's daughters, Alice Edgerton Green, | 0:20:21 | 0:20:25 | |
stopped the hunt in its tracks. | 0:20:25 | 0:20:27 | |
In later life she'd made changes to her original will | 0:20:28 | 0:20:31 | |
and as she got older, she changed the effect of her will | 0:20:31 | 0:20:36 | |
and each successive codicil | 0:20:36 | 0:20:40 | |
became more and more obscure and complex | 0:20:40 | 0:20:44 | |
until we get to the point where it was, for us, | 0:20:44 | 0:20:49 | |
it was impossible to interpret what her intentions were. | 0:20:49 | 0:20:52 | |
Alice had written numerous notes and amendments, so it was very difficult | 0:20:52 | 0:20:57 | |
to decipher who she really wanted her legacy to go to. | 0:20:57 | 0:21:01 | |
Not knowing her heirs put the Coope legacy in doubt. | 0:21:01 | 0:21:04 | |
The school could not be sold | 0:21:04 | 0:21:06 | |
until Alice's final wishes could be fulfilled. | 0:21:06 | 0:21:08 | |
Nothing more could happen. | 0:21:08 | 0:21:10 | |
All of a sudden, we come up against a brick wall | 0:21:10 | 0:21:13 | |
and until we could resolve that one issue, | 0:21:13 | 0:21:17 | |
the whole matter couldn't be settled | 0:21:17 | 0:21:21 | |
because it would have an impact, | 0:21:21 | 0:21:23 | |
or it did have an impact, on all the other beneficiaries. | 0:21:23 | 0:21:26 | |
The whole case now rested on what to do with Alice's will. | 0:21:27 | 0:21:31 | |
The distribution of the entire £800,000 estate | 0:21:31 | 0:21:34 | |
would grind to a halt unless the Heir Hunters could find a solution. | 0:21:34 | 0:21:39 | |
To try and break the deadlock, | 0:21:39 | 0:21:41 | |
Mike was going to be in for a trip to the High Court. | 0:21:41 | 0:21:44 | |
For every case that is solved, | 0:21:50 | 0:21:52 | |
there are still those that stubbornly remain a mystery. | 0:21:52 | 0:21:56 | |
Currently, over 3,000 names drawn from across the country | 0:21:56 | 0:22:00 | |
are on the Treasury's Unsolved Case List. | 0:22:00 | 0:22:03 | |
Their assets will be kept for up to 30 years | 0:22:06 | 0:22:09 | |
in the hope that eventually | 0:22:09 | 0:22:11 | |
someone will remember and come forward to claim their inheritance. | 0:22:11 | 0:22:15 | |
With the estates valued at anything from £5,000 to millions of pounds, | 0:22:16 | 0:22:21 | |
the rightful heirs are out there somewhere. | 0:22:21 | 0:22:24 | |
Malcolm John Thomas died in Bethnal Green | 0:22:24 | 0:22:28 | |
in London in March 2007. | 0:22:28 | 0:22:29 | |
Originally from Pontypool in Wales, | 0:22:29 | 0:22:31 | |
his mother's maiden name was Griffiths. | 0:22:31 | 0:22:34 | |
Do these details ring any bells? | 0:22:34 | 0:22:36 | |
Could you be Malcolm's closest relative | 0:22:36 | 0:22:38 | |
and entitled to his unclaimed estate? | 0:22:38 | 0:22:41 | |
Gladys Mary Rayner died in London in April 2008. | 0:22:41 | 0:22:45 | |
She was born in West Ham in London in 1913 and her parents | 0:22:45 | 0:22:49 | |
were Robert Thomas Rayner and Mary Elizabeth Sheer. | 0:22:49 | 0:22:52 | |
Was Gladys a friend, neighbour or possibly even a relation of yours? | 0:22:52 | 0:22:57 | |
Since the release of the Treasury's list | 0:23:03 | 0:23:05 | |
of unclaimed estates this morning, | 0:23:05 | 0:23:08 | |
Heir Hunters Fraser & Fraser have been looking into a number of cases, | 0:23:08 | 0:23:11 | |
including that of Albert Crook. | 0:23:11 | 0:23:13 | |
He died at the Morningside Nursing Home in Crewe on 1st February 2008. | 0:23:13 | 0:23:19 | |
From the enquiries that both I have made on the telephone and Dave Mansell has made locally, | 0:23:19 | 0:23:25 | |
he appears to have been a long-term resident at the care home, | 0:23:25 | 0:23:28 | |
he didn't really have any friends. | 0:23:28 | 0:23:30 | |
He had Alzheimer's and advanced Parkinson's Disease, | 0:23:30 | 0:23:34 | |
so those two things combined don't really make you a chatty person, | 0:23:34 | 0:23:39 | |
you know, so he seems to be a bit of a loner, poor old boy. | 0:23:39 | 0:23:43 | |
With no property registered, | 0:23:43 | 0:23:45 | |
Albert's estate was assumed to be quite small. | 0:23:45 | 0:23:48 | |
I don't have a definite value on it yet. | 0:23:48 | 0:23:50 | |
But traveller Dave Mansell's enquiries with those who knew him | 0:23:50 | 0:23:54 | |
uncovered something that surprised everyone. | 0:23:54 | 0:23:56 | |
It has been rumoured that his estate may be worth up to £100,000 | 0:23:56 | 0:24:02 | |
and it seems bricks and mortar | 0:24:02 | 0:24:04 | |
are not the only place to keep one's fortune! | 0:24:04 | 0:24:07 | |
I was very surprised when I found out he'd got money in suitcases, | 0:24:07 | 0:24:10 | |
but it did fit in with his reluctance to spend money. | 0:24:10 | 0:24:13 | |
He was obviously squirreling it away for a later date, | 0:24:13 | 0:24:16 | |
though when, I don't know! | 0:24:16 | 0:24:18 | |
But Tony is hoping to find more than just money. | 0:24:18 | 0:24:23 | |
It might be his marriage certificate, | 0:24:23 | 0:24:25 | |
it might be his wife's death certificate, | 0:24:25 | 0:24:27 | |
and it could be a family tree and it could be documentation | 0:24:27 | 0:24:30 | |
to show that he's directly related to Queen Victoria, I don't know. | 0:24:30 | 0:24:34 | |
But clearly, if we can track down the suitcase and have a look in it, | 0:24:34 | 0:24:40 | |
it might answer the... might solve the matter, mightn't it? | 0:24:40 | 0:24:44 | |
Dave Mansell is going to the sheltered accommodation in Northwich where Albert lived | 0:24:45 | 0:24:50 | |
before the care home and where he left his mysterious suitcase. | 0:24:50 | 0:24:54 | |
But there's some bad news. | 0:24:56 | 0:24:59 | |
Although the sheltered accommodation | 0:24:59 | 0:25:01 | |
confirm there's around £2,000 in the case, | 0:25:01 | 0:25:03 | |
they're reluctant to show Dave the contents. | 0:25:03 | 0:25:06 | |
Absolutely nowhere here. | 0:25:06 | 0:25:08 | |
I ended up speaking to the solicitor | 0:25:08 | 0:25:11 | |
who's got your name and telephone number now. | 0:25:11 | 0:25:14 | |
-The solicitor? -Yeah. | 0:25:14 | 0:25:16 | |
The solicitor for the local authority, | 0:25:16 | 0:25:18 | |
because they wouldn't give this girl permission to talk to us. | 0:25:18 | 0:25:21 | |
Tony takes the matter into his own hands. | 0:25:21 | 0:25:24 | |
The care home is holding a couple of thousand pounds | 0:25:24 | 0:25:28 | |
of the deceased's money, but they don't know what to do with it, | 0:25:28 | 0:25:31 | |
so I've now advised the authorities of that, | 0:25:31 | 0:25:34 | |
the authorities have spoken with the care home, the care home are | 0:25:34 | 0:25:37 | |
now going to pass it over to the authorities | 0:25:37 | 0:25:40 | |
and everything gets a bit smoothed out. | 0:25:40 | 0:25:42 | |
So now at least Tony knows how much is in the case, | 0:25:42 | 0:25:45 | |
and with the possible value of £100,000 on the estate, | 0:25:45 | 0:25:49 | |
more of the team have joined the hunt for Albert Crook's heirs. | 0:25:49 | 0:25:53 | |
I'm entering the marriage of the father, David Ernest Crook. | 0:25:53 | 0:25:57 | |
And it's not long before they start uncovering Albert's relatives. | 0:26:00 | 0:26:03 | |
So far we've established his parents and that he's got a sister. | 0:26:03 | 0:26:07 | |
Unfortunately, from our point of view, the sister was unmarried | 0:26:07 | 0:26:11 | |
and has predeceased him as a spinster, so there's no near kin. | 0:26:11 | 0:26:15 | |
As there are no descendants from Albert, or his only sister, Edna, | 0:26:15 | 0:26:18 | |
the hunt would usually move onto finding cousins, | 0:26:18 | 0:26:22 | |
but Research Director, Gareth, has just found something else. | 0:26:22 | 0:26:26 | |
We've discovered that the parents were previously married | 0:26:26 | 0:26:29 | |
so if they have children from those marriages, | 0:26:29 | 0:26:32 | |
they'll be half-blood near kin. | 0:26:32 | 0:26:34 | |
We're hoping that there are children and we can get some heirs from them. | 0:26:34 | 0:26:37 | |
The team move quickly to find the crucial birth, | 0:26:37 | 0:26:41 | |
death and marriage records relating to Albert's father's previous family | 0:26:41 | 0:26:45 | |
and they soon identify several paternal half-blood relatives. | 0:26:45 | 0:26:49 | |
The deceased, Albert, and his sister, Edna, were children | 0:26:51 | 0:26:55 | |
from David Ernest Crook's second marriage to Annie Burgess. | 0:26:55 | 0:26:59 | |
David Crook's previous marriage was to Margaret Pearson | 0:26:59 | 0:27:02 | |
and together they had four children - | 0:27:02 | 0:27:04 | |
Edna, Edith, William and Charlie. | 0:27:04 | 0:27:08 | |
Although they are now all deceased, Edith and Charlie did have children. | 0:27:08 | 0:27:13 | |
If they, or any of their children, are alive, | 0:27:13 | 0:27:16 | |
they would be half-blood nephews and nieces and, more importantly, heirs. | 0:27:16 | 0:27:20 | |
A search through the phone book | 0:27:20 | 0:27:23 | |
rewards the team with a contact number | 0:27:23 | 0:27:26 | |
for the widow of one of the half-blood nephews, David. | 0:27:26 | 0:27:29 | |
Tony wastes no time in giving her a call to break the news. | 0:27:29 | 0:27:33 | |
Had your husband still been alive, he would, we think, | 0:27:33 | 0:27:37 | |
have been entitled to a share of this estate | 0:27:37 | 0:27:39 | |
that we're dealing with, but as he's passed on, | 0:27:39 | 0:27:42 | |
then unfortunately I don't think you'd be entitled | 0:27:42 | 0:27:45 | |
because you wouldn't be a blood relative of his, you see. | 0:27:45 | 0:27:48 | |
You are sometimes, but I don't think you are. Anyway, so... | 0:27:48 | 0:27:51 | |
Well, you're his wife, yeah, but you're not a blood relative, you see! | 0:27:51 | 0:27:55 | |
So, his entitlement would pass to his children. | 0:27:55 | 0:27:58 | |
It turns out David's widow, Winifred, | 0:27:58 | 0:28:00 | |
had three children who would all be entitled | 0:28:00 | 0:28:04 | |
and several other family members, | 0:28:04 | 0:28:06 | |
who may also be heirs, live close by. | 0:28:06 | 0:28:09 | |
Hello, Dave. | 0:28:09 | 0:28:10 | |
Right, listen. I think it might be best if you up stumps to Warrington, | 0:28:10 | 0:28:14 | |
if you could, because I've seen, I've spoken to this lady | 0:28:14 | 0:28:18 | |
and she's happy for you to go and see her after three o'clock. | 0:28:18 | 0:28:23 | |
So there's several people in Warrington worthy of a visit. | 0:28:23 | 0:28:27 | |
Right, I'm en-route. | 0:28:27 | 0:28:28 | |
Dave Mansell's appointments are now a priority. | 0:28:30 | 0:28:34 | |
It's down to him to visit all of the Crook heirs found so far. | 0:28:34 | 0:28:39 | |
Luckily, his first call is to see several heirs at once. | 0:28:41 | 0:28:45 | |
Alwyn, Albert's paternal half-blood niece, | 0:28:45 | 0:28:48 | |
Win, the widow of a paternal half-blood nephew | 0:28:48 | 0:28:51 | |
who will not be entitled, and her son, Tony, who IS an heir. | 0:28:51 | 0:28:56 | |
A member of the Crook family has died without leaving a will, | 0:28:56 | 0:28:59 | |
so it means all the blood relatives will be entitled | 0:28:59 | 0:29:03 | |
to a part of that estate. | 0:29:03 | 0:29:04 | |
You are one of these people. | 0:29:04 | 0:29:06 | |
You descended from Edith Crook, didn't you? | 0:29:06 | 0:29:08 | |
-That's right. -That was your mum? -Yes. -I just need to take some details. | 0:29:08 | 0:29:12 | |
-Is that all right? -Yes, that's fine. | 0:29:12 | 0:29:14 | |
Without revealing the name of the deceased, | 0:29:14 | 0:29:17 | |
Dave Mansell works through the family information. | 0:29:17 | 0:29:20 | |
Is there anybody else in the family that you know about that's related | 0:29:20 | 0:29:25 | |
to you that you've not told me about, on the Crook side? | 0:29:25 | 0:29:30 | |
-No, not that I can remember or think, no. -Right. | 0:29:30 | 0:29:35 | |
It becomes apparent that Alwyn never knew her half-uncle Albert. | 0:29:35 | 0:29:39 | |
What's happened is this. Your great-grandfather, your grandfather, | 0:29:39 | 0:29:43 | |
married twice and there were children from the first marriage | 0:29:43 | 0:29:47 | |
and children from the second. | 0:29:47 | 0:29:48 | |
It's complicated the whole investigation, really, | 0:29:48 | 0:29:52 | |
into tracing you. | 0:29:52 | 0:29:54 | |
But going over the family history jogs Alwyn's memory. | 0:29:54 | 0:29:57 | |
-There was a disagreement after... -Your mum's Dad? | 0:29:57 | 0:30:00 | |
Is that the one that was married twice, yeah? | 0:30:00 | 0:30:04 | |
It's coming to me now, what she said, | 0:30:04 | 0:30:07 | |
because I think that's how they fell out, | 0:30:07 | 0:30:10 | |
because when he got married again and I think there was children | 0:30:10 | 0:30:16 | |
and she didn't have much to do with her dad. | 0:30:16 | 0:30:19 | |
-Who didn't, Edith? -Yeah. | 0:30:19 | 0:30:22 | |
Often, the reason Heir Hunters investigate cases | 0:30:22 | 0:30:25 | |
is because of past family splits, | 0:30:25 | 0:30:27 | |
but it can be a rewarding part of the job | 0:30:27 | 0:30:29 | |
to inform heirs about their family background. | 0:30:29 | 0:30:33 | |
I found it interesting and you learn things about your family, so... | 0:30:33 | 0:30:38 | |
and I'm waiting for the family tree, you know, | 0:30:38 | 0:30:42 | |
so that would be quite interesting. | 0:30:42 | 0:30:46 | |
It's a big family. | 0:30:46 | 0:30:47 | |
And I think the services of Dave, how he's explained everything today, | 0:30:47 | 0:30:52 | |
has been very good, but it will be better | 0:30:52 | 0:30:54 | |
when I get the family tree because it's gonna open... | 0:30:54 | 0:30:57 | |
I can look back to see where did we come from and who? | 0:30:57 | 0:31:00 | |
Well, no, it's been a marvellous thing today. | 0:31:00 | 0:31:04 | |
As well as Alwyn and Tony, | 0:31:04 | 0:31:06 | |
the office have found a further four paternal half-blood heirs. | 0:31:06 | 0:31:10 | |
-All right. -Well, thanks very much. | 0:31:10 | 0:31:12 | |
-Thank you, thanks for your hospitality. -OK. | 0:31:12 | 0:31:15 | |
It's not quite wrapped up, but I would imagine | 0:31:15 | 0:31:17 | |
that we won't have to do a great deal more research. | 0:31:17 | 0:31:20 | |
There's still other certificates we've got to find | 0:31:20 | 0:31:23 | |
and a great deal of paperwork to do | 0:31:23 | 0:31:25 | |
but actual additional research, | 0:31:25 | 0:31:26 | |
I don't think we've got much more to do. | 0:31:26 | 0:31:28 | |
It's approaching the end of a long, hard day | 0:31:28 | 0:31:31 | |
but matters aren't quite as wrapped up as Tony thinks. | 0:31:31 | 0:31:34 | |
The team have just realised something | 0:31:34 | 0:31:37 | |
that's going to take the investigation into the next day. | 0:31:37 | 0:31:40 | |
A slight administrative cock-up, Al. | 0:31:40 | 0:31:43 | |
Well, you know this Kenneth bloke that we've got, Kenneth Burgess? | 0:31:43 | 0:31:47 | |
Well, being the illegitimate child of his mother, | 0:31:47 | 0:31:50 | |
that's a long word for half-blood! | 0:31:50 | 0:31:51 | |
Prior to her marriage to Albert's father, David Crook, | 0:31:51 | 0:31:55 | |
his mother, Annie Burgess, had two children out of wedlock - | 0:31:55 | 0:31:59 | |
Lillian and Kenneth. | 0:31:59 | 0:32:01 | |
The penny has suddenly dropped that these children, illegitimate or not, | 0:32:01 | 0:32:05 | |
are of course still maternal half-blood to Albert, | 0:32:05 | 0:32:08 | |
so they, or any of their children, would be heirs to his estate. | 0:32:08 | 0:32:13 | |
Unfortunately, despite this late stage of the game, | 0:32:13 | 0:32:16 | |
there's still gonna be more research to be done tomorrow. | 0:32:16 | 0:32:20 | |
It seems the investigations are not quite over after all. | 0:32:21 | 0:32:25 | |
It's day two of the investigation. | 0:32:30 | 0:32:33 | |
We're carrying on from yesterday's job when we went to Northwich, | 0:32:33 | 0:32:39 | |
Crewe, Warrington, Appleton. | 0:32:39 | 0:32:42 | |
We're now onto the maternal side of the family | 0:32:42 | 0:32:45 | |
and we're going to see, hopefully, | 0:32:45 | 0:32:48 | |
two or three heirs to the estate. | 0:32:48 | 0:32:51 | |
So, we're only a minute away so we'll knock onto it. | 0:32:51 | 0:32:54 | |
He's going to see brother and sister, Steven and Alison, | 0:32:56 | 0:32:59 | |
Albert's maternal half-blood nephew and niece. | 0:32:59 | 0:33:03 | |
Your dad was Kenneth? | 0:33:03 | 0:33:05 | |
That's him. | 0:33:05 | 0:33:07 | |
-Kenneth Burgess, otherwise known as Kenneth Burgess-Crook? -Yeah. | 0:33:07 | 0:33:11 | |
How did that come about? | 0:33:11 | 0:33:14 | |
He was actually born out of wedlock. | 0:33:14 | 0:33:17 | |
-Yep? -So he took my nan's maiden name. | 0:33:17 | 0:33:21 | |
-Annie? -She was Annie Burgess. -Right. | 0:33:21 | 0:33:23 | |
So he was actually christened... registered as Burgess. | 0:33:23 | 0:33:26 | |
-Yep. -Nobody knew in the family! | 0:33:26 | 0:33:29 | |
It was only when my mother died | 0:33:29 | 0:33:31 | |
that he actually sorted out my mother's estate and it all become... | 0:33:31 | 0:33:36 | |
-Clearer? -Yeah, that he wasn't actually a Crook, he was a Burgess. | 0:33:36 | 0:33:40 | |
Right. And then Annie remarried, didn't she? | 0:33:40 | 0:33:43 | |
Yes, she married... cos I knew of my granddad, I didn't know that he... | 0:33:43 | 0:33:47 | |
So you knew David Ernest Crook as your granddad? | 0:33:47 | 0:33:49 | |
-My granddad, yeah. -Great. | 0:33:49 | 0:33:51 | |
That's super. | 0:33:51 | 0:33:53 | |
Now Dave Mansell has verified all the family details, | 0:33:53 | 0:33:57 | |
Steven's sister, Alison, arrives. | 0:33:57 | 0:33:59 | |
They both have memories of their half-uncle Albert. | 0:33:59 | 0:34:03 | |
When I used to go up to see my nan, I remember him. | 0:34:03 | 0:34:05 | |
You know, I was only a young kid. | 0:34:05 | 0:34:07 | |
-My biggest memories are when he used to cut the grass. -Yeah, cos he... | 0:34:07 | 0:34:12 | |
He worked for the local council and used to pop in the house. | 0:34:12 | 0:34:15 | |
He'd come up, you know, in the street where we lived | 0:34:15 | 0:34:18 | |
and he'd call to my mum's for a cup of tea and a biscuit | 0:34:18 | 0:34:21 | |
or whatever and they were the memories I remember most of all. | 0:34:21 | 0:34:26 | |
They were the only times I really saw him. | 0:34:26 | 0:34:28 | |
All of the heirs will be in for a substantial windfall, | 0:34:28 | 0:34:32 | |
as a week later confirmation comes through to the office | 0:34:32 | 0:34:35 | |
of the real value of Albert's estate. | 0:34:35 | 0:34:38 | |
It's nice to know that it's turned out to be £100,000 plus | 0:34:39 | 0:34:43 | |
and both we, and of course the heirs that we traced, | 0:34:43 | 0:34:46 | |
will, you know, get a lot more than they might have anticipated. | 0:34:46 | 0:34:51 | |
The fortune that the thrifty Albert Crook never spent during | 0:34:51 | 0:34:55 | |
his lifetime will now get shared between | 0:34:55 | 0:34:57 | |
his nine half-blood relatives. | 0:34:57 | 0:34:59 | |
Uniting unsuspecting heirs with their rightful legacy | 0:35:07 | 0:35:11 | |
is the day to day work of the Heir Hunters. | 0:35:11 | 0:35:14 | |
We always take the view that there is always an answer out there | 0:35:14 | 0:35:19 | |
and if we possibly can, we will find that answer. | 0:35:19 | 0:35:22 | |
But when probate research company, Hoopers, | 0:35:25 | 0:35:27 | |
were trying to find the legal heirs | 0:35:27 | 0:35:29 | |
to a Victorian school site worth £800,000, | 0:35:29 | 0:35:31 | |
they were faced with over 100 years' worth of wills, | 0:35:31 | 0:35:35 | |
all stemming from original owner, Octavius Coope. | 0:35:35 | 0:35:39 | |
Things were going well until they found the will of Alice Edgerton Green, one of Octavius's daughters. | 0:35:42 | 0:35:48 | |
It contained numerous notes about who she wanted to inherit | 0:35:48 | 0:35:52 | |
that became increasingly vague. | 0:35:52 | 0:35:55 | |
It says something along the lines of, | 0:35:55 | 0:35:58 | |
"The residue to be used to build a church | 0:35:58 | 0:36:02 | |
"in a crowded area of London over the border if possible." | 0:36:02 | 0:36:09 | |
By today's standards, in any case, | 0:36:09 | 0:36:11 | |
building a church in a crowded part of London | 0:36:11 | 0:36:14 | |
would just be a financial nightmare. | 0:36:14 | 0:36:16 | |
You couldn't build. You'd need millions for a start. | 0:36:16 | 0:36:19 | |
"A crowded area of London over the border." Over the border of where? | 0:36:19 | 0:36:24 | |
What part of London, north, south, east or west? | 0:36:24 | 0:36:27 | |
I've no idea whatsoever. | 0:36:27 | 0:36:29 | |
There's no clue at all to what was meant. | 0:36:29 | 0:36:34 | |
It wouldn't... You couldn't carry out these wishes anyway, and I think | 0:36:34 | 0:36:39 | |
any expert, will expert, would have to deem this impossible to implement. | 0:36:39 | 0:36:45 | |
At the time when Alice was altering her will, | 0:36:47 | 0:36:49 | |
the school still would have | 0:36:49 | 0:36:51 | |
been playing a thriving part in the community. | 0:36:51 | 0:36:54 | |
Yvonne Limbrick of the British Schools' Museum | 0:36:54 | 0:36:57 | |
has her thoughts as to why patrons, Coope and Belli, | 0:36:57 | 0:37:00 | |
gave their money to build the school in the first place. | 0:37:00 | 0:37:04 | |
I think it's almost certain that the children who would have been going to | 0:37:04 | 0:37:08 | |
that school were from the poor families of the area. | 0:37:08 | 0:37:13 | |
They would have been a very mixed bunch but they would have been poor. | 0:37:13 | 0:37:18 | |
I would have expected that there would have been | 0:37:18 | 0:37:22 | |
one schoolroom, just the one, | 0:37:22 | 0:37:26 | |
and all the children would have been taught in that one schoolroom. | 0:37:26 | 0:37:30 | |
It would have been fairly bare, | 0:37:30 | 0:37:33 | |
quite bleak by today's standards. All the children would have had a slate | 0:37:33 | 0:37:39 | |
and a slate pencil and a sponge to erase their writing | 0:37:39 | 0:37:43 | |
and there would probably have been enough books | 0:37:43 | 0:37:47 | |
for two or three children to share... | 0:37:47 | 0:37:50 | |
..and that really and truly is about it. | 0:37:52 | 0:37:55 | |
Despite basic facilities, | 0:37:55 | 0:37:57 | |
the importance of the school would have been huge. | 0:37:57 | 0:38:00 | |
Attitudes to education were changing and it was no longer seen | 0:38:00 | 0:38:05 | |
as a privilege, but as a right for all. | 0:38:05 | 0:38:08 | |
It would have been very important | 0:38:08 | 0:38:10 | |
because it was a step towards a different life, | 0:38:10 | 0:38:14 | |
a step towards raising the expectations of people | 0:38:14 | 0:38:21 | |
to be able to better themselves. | 0:38:21 | 0:38:24 | |
For Mike, the only way to move the case along | 0:38:24 | 0:38:27 | |
was to get the legal advice of a QC who could make a judgment | 0:38:27 | 0:38:31 | |
on what to do with Alice's unintelligible will. | 0:38:31 | 0:38:34 | |
The QC ruled that Alice's case | 0:38:34 | 0:38:36 | |
should be treated as if she had died intestate, | 0:38:36 | 0:38:38 | |
as if she had not left a will. | 0:38:38 | 0:38:41 | |
Once we'd had the opinion from the QC, | 0:38:41 | 0:38:45 | |
we were able to work out the proportions in which each individual | 0:38:45 | 0:38:52 | |
relative of hers, under intestacy rules, was going to inherit | 0:38:52 | 0:38:57 | |
and we could draw the whole matter to a satisfactory conclusion. | 0:38:57 | 0:39:02 | |
As Alice had outlived her husband and all of her children, | 0:39:02 | 0:39:05 | |
they quickly established that her portion of the estate | 0:39:05 | 0:39:08 | |
would revert to her sisters and their beneficiaries. | 0:39:08 | 0:39:12 | |
It meant that the council could move successfully into their new school | 0:39:14 | 0:39:19 | |
and the heirs got their legacy. | 0:39:19 | 0:39:21 | |
Come on, good boy! | 0:39:21 | 0:39:23 | |
Bob Wayne, the great-great grandson of Octavius, and one of 32 heirs, | 0:39:23 | 0:39:30 | |
received his share of the £800,000. | 0:39:30 | 0:39:33 | |
We only got a small portion. | 0:39:33 | 0:39:35 | |
I believe that the luckiest ones got about £33,000 each, | 0:39:35 | 0:39:42 | |
whereas at the bottom of the tree, we got about £1,600. | 0:39:42 | 0:39:48 | |
I think that one is very interested in knowing about one's family | 0:39:51 | 0:39:58 | |
and I think most people would find if they actually looked into it | 0:39:58 | 0:40:02 | |
that they've got far more interesting relatives than they realised. | 0:40:02 | 0:40:06 | |
Indeed, you know, the connections seem to go on and on and on. | 0:40:06 | 0:40:13 | |
As for the school, Holly Trees is now situated in a new site, | 0:40:13 | 0:40:18 | |
with modern facilities for over 300 students. | 0:40:18 | 0:40:22 | |
I think there are winners all around. | 0:40:22 | 0:40:25 | |
The education authority end up with a bigger and better school, | 0:40:25 | 0:40:30 | |
the family, hopefully they're happy and satisfied financially, | 0:40:30 | 0:40:36 | |
and from the point of view of their ancestor, | 0:40:36 | 0:40:41 | |
the legacy of Octavius Coope and his friend, the Reverend Belli, | 0:40:41 | 0:40:46 | |
does continue and I'm sure they're not forgotten. All in all, | 0:40:46 | 0:40:51 | |
we think it's a pretty good job. | 0:40:51 | 0:40:53 | |
However, the biggest legacy is what Coope and Belli had created | 0:40:53 | 0:40:57 | |
for the wider community back in 1875 when the school was first built. | 0:40:57 | 0:41:03 | |
You see, and this gateway here is where we used to go in | 0:41:03 | 0:41:07 | |
and that part there was a classroom. | 0:41:07 | 0:41:11 | |
Sisters, Beryl Beckwith and Betty Shipton, have fond memories | 0:41:11 | 0:41:15 | |
of the school they attended in 1939. | 0:41:15 | 0:41:18 | |
Well, we were always made welcome. | 0:41:18 | 0:41:21 | |
They tried to make it as happy as they could. | 0:41:21 | 0:41:25 | |
In the first class, obviously, we had slates with the chalks | 0:41:25 | 0:41:31 | |
and then as you moved up after learning your ABC | 0:41:31 | 0:41:36 | |
and learning to write your name, then you obviously went up | 0:41:36 | 0:41:40 | |
to the next class where they took you further with your reading | 0:41:40 | 0:41:44 | |
and also joined up writing and... | 0:41:44 | 0:41:48 | |
-Arithmetic. -Yeah! | 0:41:48 | 0:41:51 | |
Very happy days. | 0:41:51 | 0:41:53 | |
Everybody, you know, all joined in together | 0:41:53 | 0:41:55 | |
for playing games and everything. | 0:41:55 | 0:41:58 | |
There was never really a lot of nastiness with the children | 0:41:58 | 0:42:02 | |
because times were hard and we all had to get on together. | 0:42:02 | 0:42:06 | |
I did use to go home, because every time the bell went, | 0:42:13 | 0:42:16 | |
I naturally thought it was time to go home. | 0:42:16 | 0:42:19 | |
And of course Miss Pickett had other ideas. | 0:42:19 | 0:42:21 | |
She used to come up home after me and run me down Junction Road | 0:42:21 | 0:42:26 | |
with a big stick and I mean I had to literally... | 0:42:26 | 0:42:29 | |
THEY LAUGH | 0:42:29 | 0:42:31 | |
I didn't do anything like that. I was too good! | 0:42:31 | 0:42:33 | |
THEY LAUGH | 0:42:33 | 0:42:35 | |
If you believe that, you'll believe everything! | 0:42:35 | 0:42:38 | |
THEY LAUGH | 0:42:38 | 0:42:40 | |
And it's Octavius Coope's generosity over 125 years ago | 0:42:40 | 0:42:47 | |
that thousands of school children, | 0:42:47 | 0:42:49 | |
as well as 32 lucky heirs, have to be thankful for. | 0:42:49 | 0:42:52 | |
If you would like to find out more about | 0:42:54 | 0:42:56 | |
how to build a family tree or write a will, go to bbc.co.uk. | 0:42:56 | 0:43:00 | |
Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd | 0:43:20 | 0:43:24 | |
E-mail [email protected] | 0:43:24 | 0:43:28 |