19/10/2011 Newsnight


19/10/2011

The latest on the evictions at Dale Farm travellers camp in Essex. With Jeremy Paxman.


Similar Content

Browse content similar to 19/10/2011. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

The outcome of the confrontation isn't in doubt, soon the police and

:00:10.:00:17.

bailiffs will have evicted the 80- odd families living illegally on

:00:17.:00:20.

green belt land in Dale Farm in Essex. The United Nations claims

:00:20.:00:25.

this amounts to state bullying of a minority. Is it? What alternative

:00:25.:00:32.

is there when people refuse to obey the law? One of the UN committee on

:00:32.:00:36.

the elimination of racism, believes we are being willfully blind to an

:00:36.:00:41.

injustice. Newsnight reveals the story of an

:00:41.:00:45.

undercover policeman who was then arrested and gave false evidence in

:00:45.:00:50.

court. It is a perversion of the legal process. I think it's

:00:50.:00:53.

institutionalised police corruption of the legal process for this to

:00:53.:00:57.

happen. As we go on air, it has emerged that our story has delayed

:00:57.:01:01.

an HMIC report into another undercover cop case, which was due

:01:01.:01:04.

tomorrow. What does the former Director of

:01:04.:01:08.

Public Prosecutions think of that? For the first time in British

:01:08.:01:12.

history, you can vote in a referendum, a referendum to shape

:01:12.:01:19.

the lives of your children. It has been the best part of four decades,

:01:19.:01:22.

and many Conservatives think it is long past the time that people in

:01:22.:01:26.

Britain had the chance to say what they think of membership of the

:01:26.:01:30.

European Union. Why doesn't their own party leader? Has the Fox

:01:30.:01:34.

episode brought lasting taint of scandal to - Liam Fox episode

:01:35.:01:39.

brought lasting taint of scandal to the Government. This week of all

:01:39.:01:42.

weeks, my advice to the Prime Minister, is show a bit of humility.

:01:42.:01:48.

I think we should have a little bit of humility from the people who

:01:48.:01:58.
:01:58.:02:03.

gave us cabs for hire, passports For so-called travellers, they have

:02:03.:02:07.

been extremely reluctant to travel any where It kicked off early this

:02:07.:02:10.

morning after the legal process had been exhausted, and police and

:02:10.:02:15.

bailiffs moved in. It has been the staple fare of the news channels

:02:16.:02:22.

all day, as at an estimated cost to tax-payers of some �18 million, the

:02:22.:02:27.

illegal settlement in Dale Farm in Essex is cleared. The confrontation

:02:27.:02:31.

between them and the balaclavaed supporters, and the men and women

:02:31.:02:36.

in high-visibility jackets, provide the scenes that the electronic

:02:36.:02:39.

media love. We tried to look a little deeper.

:02:39.:02:44.

Dawn, in a once quiet corner of the Essex countryside. Hundreds of riot

:02:44.:02:54.
:02:54.:02:56.

police moved in, as Dale Farm became a surreal battleground.

:02:56.:03:01.

Rocks, barricades and taunts, where all the travellers and their

:03:01.:03:08.

supporters had left to defend the largely illegal settlement. They

:03:08.:03:17.

have lost a ten-year courtroom battle. The eviction operation is

:03:17.:03:22.

budgeted to cost up to �17.5 million, enough money to have

:03:22.:03:28.

provided many new traveller sites. The defendants' defiance showed as

:03:28.:03:33.

a caravan went up in flames. They intend to fight yard by yard, over

:03:33.:03:37.

a site that is still a legal minefield. Some constructions can

:03:37.:03:44.

be knocked down, others can't. and 38 have full residential use,

:03:44.:03:48.

the yellow sections have full residential use.

:03:48.:03:55.

Inside the site, beyond police lines, there was an uneasy calm,

:03:55.:04:01.

but travellers claimed legally held property had been damaged.

:04:01.:04:05.

REPORTER: Why did they cross here? I don't know. We will have to ask

:04:05.:04:10.

them. Many families were beginning for evictions to begin in earnest?

:04:10.:04:13.

There is complete confusion with people here unsure how many more

:04:13.:04:17.

nights they will be able to stay and where they will move on to.

:04:17.:04:20.

There is also increasing uncertainty nationally over

:04:21.:04:26.

Government policy towards gypsies and travellers. Dale Farm is a test

:04:26.:04:29.

case, being closely watched by groups involved in similar

:04:29.:04:36.

controversy up and down the country. By councils, by travellers and by

:04:36.:04:45.

permanently settled residents. Gypsy activist Candy Sher din, is

:04:45.:04:50.

worried what other councils will learn from what happened here,

:04:50.:04:54.

where the council has worked so hard to remove the settlement.

:04:54.:04:59.

Firstly, I can't provide for my community, if the council won't

:04:59.:05:03.

provide the land or assist them in planning application, it sends the

:05:03.:05:08.

message, why bother, and that it is acceptable just to ignore us. That

:05:08.:05:14.

is appalling. The total number of gypsy caravans in England has risen

:05:14.:05:24.
:05:24.:05:29.

What gypsies and travellers fear is that major changes to the planning

:05:29.:05:32.

rules, being proposed by the Government, would make it even

:05:32.:05:42.
:05:42.:05:44.

harder for them to find authorised sites to live on. The Government is

:05:44.:05:50.

proposing to Regional targets. It is also bringing in a Localism Bill,

:05:50.:05:53.

which would give voters increased powers to object to particular

:05:53.:05:57.

developments. We know that the key obstacle against provision for gip

:05:57.:06:01.

say traveller sites comes at the local level. Discrimination at the

:06:01.:06:06.

local level, misconceptions at the local level, that gypsy sites will

:06:06.:06:10.

lead to crime and dysfunction in the communities. That isn't, in the

:06:10.:06:15.

majority of cases not true. With the regional spacial strategies

:06:15.:06:20.

combined and others will lead to a huge shortage of gypsy sites in the

:06:20.:06:23.

long-term. Current guidelines say that councils should address the

:06:23.:06:28.

underprovision of authorised sites, and should recognise, protect a

:06:28.:06:32.

facilitate the traditional travelling way of life. But the

:06:32.:06:35.

coalition Government's consultation document on planning for

:06:35.:06:45.
:06:45.:07:01.

In Basildon Council says it is not against travellers, and will

:07:01.:07:05.

continue to provide sites for them, if they show more flexibility.

:07:05.:07:08.

There has to be a deal between travellers, local authorities and

:07:08.:07:11.

communities. The onus is on the travellers to find land that is

:07:11.:07:17.

suitable for development. Travellers in the past have gone

:07:17.:07:20.

for green belt sites, which is obviously not suitable for

:07:20.:07:24.

development, and very hard to get planning permission for. I really

:07:24.:07:26.

think there is an opportunity for the travellers now to move on and

:07:27.:07:31.

act within the law as well. But it won't be easy for travellers to

:07:32.:07:36.

find more appropriate sites. When so many settled residents oppose

:07:36.:07:40.

their presence. Dale Farm is being cleared in the interests of

:07:40.:07:44.

creating a level legal playing field for all. As its defenders

:07:44.:07:47.

prepare for another night of resistance, many here feel that the

:07:47.:07:53.

evictions are just another blow to a community whose way of life is

:07:53.:07:59.

being slowly, but steadily eroded. A little while ago I discussed some

:07:59.:08:05.

of the issues raised with Anastasia Crickley, a member of the United

:08:05.:08:07.

Nations committee on the Committee on the Elimination of Racial

:08:07.:08:15.

Discrimination, and with John Baron MP for Basildon and Billericay. I

:08:15.:08:19.

asked Miss Crickley what a planning application had to do with the

:08:19.:08:22.

United Nations. The situation in Dale Farm was something considered

:08:22.:08:25.

previously by the committee and brought to the attention of the

:08:25.:08:28.

committee by a number of groups representing the residents there.

:08:28.:08:31.

We are saying it is a matter that deserves consideration by a

:08:31.:08:38.

committee which is looking at the possibilities of racism and

:08:38.:08:42.

discrimination. John Baron? Basically it is a lot of tosh and

:08:42.:08:45.

nonsense and mindless meddling by an organisation that should know

:08:45.:08:49.

better. This is not about racial discrimination, this is about a

:08:49.:08:53.

planning regulation that has been brong, contravened, it is about us

:08:53.:08:58.

- broken, contravened, it is about us putting those planning

:08:58.:09:01.

regulations right on behalf of the local majority. They talk about

:09:01.:09:06.

human rights, but what they forget is we all have human rights,

:09:06.:09:09.

including the law-abiding majority, and one of those is an expectation

:09:09.:09:13.

that the law will be applied equitably and fairly, and there

:09:13.:09:18.

should be no exceptions to that. Why should these people be treated

:09:18.:09:22.

any differently to everyone else in in country? It is absolutely the

:09:22.:09:29.

case that in every country, which is a party to the Convention on The

:09:29.:09:33.

elimination of racism, that there is an impolicement acknowledgement

:09:33.:09:36.

that there can be racism in that country. It is the case that you

:09:36.:09:40.

don't achieve equality in any country, in any circumstances, by

:09:40.:09:43.

pretending that everybody is automatically equal, and

:09:43.:09:53.

automatically has equal access to the law or their rights. Otherwise.

:09:53.:09:56.

You're absolutely right. You are barking up completely the

:09:56.:09:59.

wrong tree, make this absolutely clear, this is not about racial

:09:59.:10:02.

discrimination, this is about enforcing the law, which has been

:10:02.:10:12.
:10:12.:10:13.

broken by a group of people who knew they were breaking the law.

:10:13.:10:16.

Our courts decided they were breaking the law and we are

:10:16.:10:19.

enforcing that law. Can I suggest something useful for you to do, get

:10:19.:10:24.

on to the travellers and tell them to call off their protestors using

:10:24.:10:27.

violence against the police. This has involved arrests, throwing of

:10:27.:10:34.

stones, iron bars and so forth, because the protestors are there at

:10:34.:10:37.

the behest of the travellers, and courts have told them that site

:10:37.:10:41.

should be cleared. That is something you could do on behalf of

:10:41.:10:44.

the law-abiding majority and help minimise the violence at present

:10:45.:10:50.

taking place there. First of all there seems to be an implicit

:10:50.:10:53.

assumption that the law-abiding majority do not include travellers

:10:53.:10:57.

or gypsies or include any of the traveller or gypsy community who

:10:57.:11:02.

happens to be living in Dale Farm. That's a useful assumption to make

:11:02.:11:06.

I don't think. Secondly, the circumstances in which people find

:11:06.:11:11.

themselves is ones they must judge and they must make their own

:11:11.:11:15.

decision about the best action to take at this time. Can I take you

:11:15.:11:20.

will not do anything useful and ask them to stop the violence.

:11:20.:11:24.

committee that is responsible for monitoring the implementation of

:11:24.:11:26.

the UN Convention on The elimination of racism has said, we

:11:26.:11:30.

have said there is a case for culturally appropriate

:11:31.:11:34.

accommodation to be provided and identified and provided for the

:11:34.:11:39.

people who are residents in Dale Farm. For the avoidance of any

:11:39.:11:43.

doubt, what is culturally appropriate accommodation?

:11:43.:11:45.

Culturally appropriate accommodation, is accommodation, as

:11:45.:11:50.

I understand it, which has been looked at by other UN committees,

:11:50.:11:54.

which allows for collective expression of culture. Look you

:11:54.:11:58.

signed up to this report, can you please tell us what you meant by

:11:58.:12:01.

talking about the provision of culturally appropriate

:12:01.:12:08.

accommodation, what is it? What we invited and encouraged your

:12:08.:12:12.

Government and your authorities to do is to look to the provision of

:12:12.:12:15.

accommodation which meets the needs and requirements of the community

:12:15.:12:22.

that are there. What do you mean? I'm aware that there have been,

:12:22.:12:28.

what I mean is we do not consider provision of homeless families

:12:28.:12:30.

accommodation to be culturally appropriate accommodation. Because

:12:30.:12:38.

they are not homeless families? This whole situation has emerged

:12:38.:12:42.

because of the reality that the Roma and travelling people that

:12:42.:12:46.

live there, want to live in the way in which they have traditionally

:12:46.:12:49.

lived. That is not the desire of all traveller people in the UK or

:12:49.:12:55.

other parts of Europe, or other parts of the world. It is an

:12:55.:12:59.

acknowledgement of their diversity on their difference. That is what

:12:59.:13:04.

we are asking that your Government and yourself does. Can you help us,

:13:04.:13:08.

why haven't you provided culturally appropriate accommodation? We have,

:13:09.:13:12.

we have 110 authorised sites and pitches locally, many more than any

:13:12.:13:14.

other local authorities. We have offered bricks and mortar, so

:13:15.:13:18.

nobody needs to be homeless, but the travellers themselves have

:13:18.:13:22.

refused that. We have also made the travellers aware of other vacant

:13:22.:13:25.

authorised sites in other parts of the country, they have said they

:13:25.:13:29.

don't want to travel. There is only so much we can do. At the end of

:13:29.:13:33.

the day they have broken the law and that site will be cleared, we

:13:33.:13:36.

hope, as peacefully as possible. Where are they tonight those

:13:36.:13:40.

families who have left? We don't know for sure, they are not on the

:13:40.:13:44.

side of the road, or in the Tesco car parks as they said they would

:13:44.:13:48.

be. There are all sorts of reports, but they are not homeless, as far

:13:48.:13:53.

as we know. The game is over, the problem is finished, once they are

:13:53.:13:57.

somebody else's problem? It is not quite like that. We have said we

:13:57.:14:01.

have obligations to meet, we have offered accommodation, that is

:14:01.:14:04.

refused by travellers. We have made them aware of vacant authorised

:14:04.:14:07.

sites elsewhere, that has been refused, we have provided more

:14:07.:14:12.

sites than anywhere else. We are not trying to wash our hands of it,

:14:12.:14:15.

this site needs to be cleared, because they have broken the law

:14:15.:14:17.

and the law-abiding majority expect that site to be cleared, and it

:14:17.:14:21.

will be cleared. Could I suggest to you that there are a number of

:14:21.:14:23.

useful things that you and your colleagues might be able to

:14:23.:14:27.

consider doing as well. Such as engaging in direct consultation

:14:27.:14:31.

with the travellers and with the people who have been evicted to

:14:31.:14:40.

make sure that their circumstances are not worsened over the next few

:14:40.:14:43.

weeks. We have engaged for ten years, the time for talking is over.

:14:43.:14:48.

I'm not talking about the rights and wrongs of the current situation,

:14:48.:14:53.

I'm aware of the hardship it has caused for the travellers, and also

:14:53.:14:57.

the extent it can exasperate further discrimination against

:14:57.:15:00.

travellers. If I could call on the honourable member of Parliament and

:15:00.:15:05.

others watching the programme, I would call on them and the media to

:15:05.:15:10.

ensure this does nothing to exasperate further the real

:15:10.:15:12.

discrimination experienced by travellers and gypsies in the UK

:15:12.:15:17.

and other countries in Europe. Thank you very much. So far this

:15:17.:15:22.

year there have been no fewer than eight inquiries set up after the

:15:22.:15:28.

discovery that undercover police have been used to infiltrate

:15:28.:15:34.

political organisations. There may be a ninth soon, tonight Newsnight

:15:34.:15:38.

has evidence of another operation where an undercover policeman gave

:15:38.:15:46.

false evidence in court. He became an undercover activist on Reclaim

:15:46.:15:51.

the Streets campaign. These latest revelations have delayed the report

:15:51.:16:01.
:16:01.:16:01.

into another undercover cop case due tomorrow.

:16:01.:16:05.

Though this story has only just come to light, it can be traced

:16:05.:16:08.

back to this demonstration in central London in August 1996.

:16:08.:16:12.

Traffic was brought it a halt by protestors from a non-violent, pro-

:16:12.:16:16.

cycling Campaign Group, called Reclaim the Streets. Prominent

:16:16.:16:20.

among them was an activist called Jim Sutton. Jim was very practical,

:16:20.:16:25.

he was the man with the van. He was super-practical, he was there right

:16:25.:16:28.

at the centre of stuff. A splinter group of demonstrators left

:16:28.:16:32.

Trafalgar Square and came here to St James's Park, to the

:16:32.:16:36.

headquarters of London Underground, amongst them was John Jordan, an

:16:37.:16:42.

activist, and Sutton sut, the undercover policeman. They went

:16:42.:16:46.

into the building and up the stairsment their aim was to get to

:16:46.:16:51.

the seventh floor and the chairman's office, to unfurl a

:16:51.:16:55.

banner. Jim Sutton, the policeman, was playing a leading role. The

:16:55.:17:00.

protestors were here in support of a tube drivers' strike. Jim Sutton

:17:00.:17:05.

was an undercover cop, working with the Metropolitan Police unit,

:17:05.:17:09.

charged with looking at protest movements. As part of the protest

:17:09.:17:13.

group, John Jordan was one of the targets. We occupied the building,

:17:13.:17:17.

we went up, some people got up to the chairman's office, including

:17:17.:17:23.

Jim. Jim went out, put massive banner, which said "don't squeeze

:17:23.:17:26.

the tube". He said the police arrived remarkably quickly, and

:17:26.:17:31.

there were scuffles, as he went upstairs he picked up a policeman's

:17:31.:17:37.

helmet on the ground. Lift doors opened, riot police out, arrest us

:17:37.:17:41.

all, I had the policeman's helmet under my jumper. Clearly I wasn't

:17:41.:17:45.

pregnant. I get arrested. Get to the police station and I'm charged

:17:45.:17:50.

with assault of a police officer. Clearly something I didn't do.

:17:50.:17:54.

activists, including Jim Sutton, were brought here to Charring Cross

:17:54.:17:57.

police station in central London for questioning. They sought legal

:17:58.:18:04.

advice, and a solicitor, from the birm, Bindmans, attended. We have

:18:04.:18:07.

obtained copies of the custody records, it shows Jim Sutton was

:18:07.:18:12.

using his fake name and cover as a cleaner, what police intelligence

:18:12.:18:22.
:18:22.:18:26.

experts call, his legend. His Jim Sutton and 12 other activists

:18:26.:18:29.

were later charged with public order offences, the undercover cop

:18:29.:18:33.

was entering the legal process. This didn't emerge until now. After

:18:33.:18:37.

all the reporting earlier this year about undercover cop Mark Kennedy,

:18:37.:18:41.

Jim Sutton's name appeared in the media, as another undercover

:18:41.:18:47.

operative. The solicitor working on the Kennedy cases of curious.

:18:47.:18:51.

looked at our records, our records confirmed one of them, Jim Sutton,

:18:52.:18:55.

had been a client of our's. must have been amazed when you saw

:18:55.:18:59.

that? I was shocked. I thought it couldn't be true. But it is true.

:18:59.:19:04.

John Jordan, and the others, thought Jim Sutton was a fellow

:19:04.:19:08.

defendant, when their cases all went to a criminal trial. He would

:19:08.:19:12.

have given evidence under oath about who he was b what had

:19:12.:19:16.

happened, and - about what had happened, and as serious, he

:19:16.:19:20.

allowed himself to be put in a position where he was arrested,

:19:20.:19:25.

charged and prosecuted, and potentially convicted of a criminal

:19:25.:19:30.

offence. Just because the District Judge found him not guilty that he

:19:30.:19:33.

wasn't convicted. He and his minders allowed him to be put in a

:19:33.:19:36.

position where he could be found guilty of a criminal offence. If

:19:36.:19:41.

that is a criminal offence committed by a serving undercover

:19:41.:19:44.

police officer, giving evidence on oath, with the benefit of

:19:44.:19:48.

privileged legal advice, he shouldn't have had, that is most

:19:48.:19:50.

serious. Bindmans have asked for an

:19:50.:19:55.

explanation from the Metropolitan Police, and the CPS, but are yet to

:19:55.:20:00.

receive an answer. We asked a Lib Dem member of the Metropolitan

:20:00.:20:04.

Police authority for her reaction tonight? It is almost beyond belief.

:20:04.:20:08.

I'm coming to terms with the fact that it has happened, but it is

:20:08.:20:13.

just, it beggers belief. How on earth can that happen? It make as

:20:13.:20:17.

complete mockery of the judicial system. There are some very serious

:20:17.:20:23.

questions that must be asked of the police, that is, who in the Met

:20:23.:20:28.

authorised it, if anyone? If they authorised it, why did they

:20:28.:20:34.

authorised it, and is that - authorise it, and why are they

:20:34.:20:44.
:20:44.:20:45.

working for the Met. That is what I will be asking at the meeting of

:20:45.:20:49.

metropolitan police officers. John Jordan was found guilty, and

:20:49.:20:54.

is wondering if that is safe? have jobs where I'm working with

:20:54.:20:57.

students and to have assault of a police officer on your record was

:20:57.:21:04.

difficult. I think it is a perversion of the legal process. I

:21:04.:21:09.

think it is institutionalised police corruption and the legal

:21:09.:21:13.

process for this to happen. At the very least they ought to have

:21:13.:21:17.

explained up front what their acceptable limits are, so that the

:21:17.:21:21.

public, politicians and judges, who might or should be regulating their

:21:21.:21:25.

activity, could have a say and a view. They seem to have gone

:21:25.:21:28.

freelance on this. The Metropolitan Police declined to

:21:28.:21:33.

comment today on this specific case, but pointed us towards new

:21:33.:21:37.

legislation from 2000 that should have made it impossible for

:21:37.:21:41.

undercover police officers to give evidence in court under their false

:21:41.:21:45.

identities. The question is now, how many cases went through before

:21:45.:21:49.

this case. Further developments tonight, I

:21:49.:21:54.

gather? Extraordinary development, 15 minutes ago, the HM Inspectorate

:21:54.:21:57.

of Constabulary, due to launch a very important report tomorrow,

:21:57.:22:00.

about the use of undercover officers and the protocol

:22:00.:22:04.

surrounding that. They say in light of the revelations in the media

:22:04.:22:08.

today, they are delaying the launch of the report, so they can consider

:22:08.:22:11.

the relevance of this information, and the recommendations for

:22:11.:22:15.

improvements in undercover policing. We will write to the Guardian and

:22:15.:22:17.

Newsnight to find out additional information they have. The

:22:17.:22:19.

Metropolitan Police have been changing their line on this, I

:22:19.:22:24.

think it is fair to say, all day, at first it was a "no comment",

:22:24.:22:27.

then it became a procedural amount of information about the use of

:22:27.:22:32.

undercover officers. Just tonight in the last six minutes, they have

:22:32.:22:34.

said that the Metropolitan Police Service acknowledges these are

:22:34.:22:37.

serious matters, and is continuing to review the situation and taking

:22:37.:22:41.

account of any additional information becoming available.

:22:41.:22:47.

This story is moving very fast. former Director of Public

:22:47.:22:50.

Prosecutions in England and Wales is here now to react to tonight's

:22:50.:22:54.

story. What do you make of this latest disclosure about an

:22:54.:22:57.

undercover policeman? Well they have crossed the line. You don't

:22:57.:23:02.

send police officers into court to lie about who they are b their

:23:02.:23:05.

identity b what their role is - about their identity, about what

:23:05.:23:11.

their role is in investigations. You don't send them into

:23:11.:23:15.

solicitors' offices and pretending to be party to legal conferences.

:23:15.:23:19.

It is a serious issue and they have crossed the line. What does it do

:23:19.:23:24.

to the convictions of anyone arrested and convicted in those

:23:24.:23:30.

circumstances? It causes issues, if I was in the dock with an

:23:30.:23:35.

undercover police officer and I had advised both defendants in the

:23:35.:23:38.

trial, I would go to the Court of Appeal saying the conviction is

:23:38.:23:42.

unsafe and it has to be overturned. I'm sure that is what will happen

:23:42.:23:47.

were defence lawyers are confident this is the situation. Has to be

:23:47.:23:51.

overturned because? Because you have a situation where a police

:23:51.:23:54.

officer is posing as a defendant, is party to defence conferences

:23:54.:23:59.

with his lawyers, the other defendant's lawyers, is party to

:23:59.:24:04.

confidential information, may be passing it back to his handlers,

:24:04.:24:07.

and going in to court as part of the defence team, telling lies.

:24:07.:24:11.

knows what the defence likely to be? He knows the defence. He may be

:24:11.:24:16.

reporting it back to the police, that may in all sorts of ways

:24:16.:24:19.

affect the way the case is conducted. It is clearly, it seems

:24:20.:24:23.

to me clearly the Court of Appeal with regard a conviction in those

:24:23.:24:28.

circumstances as being potentially unsafe. Do you think this latest

:24:28.:24:33.

revelation makes the case for yet another inquiry? The report that

:24:33.:24:37.

was to be released tomorrow has been held back. I'm not at all

:24:37.:24:41.

surprised by that. I think the authors of that report are going to

:24:41.:24:45.

have to stand back, look at the evidence that you have produced and

:24:45.:24:48.

the Guardian has produced, and see how that impacts on the research

:24:48.:24:52.

they have done. This is a very serious development. This seems to

:24:52.:24:56.

be part of pattern of behaviour of undercover police officers in

:24:56.:24:59.

groups that are not particularly dangerous. We are not talking about

:24:59.:25:03.

terrorists here. It is a bunch of cyclists? We are not talking about

:25:03.:25:08.

terrorists, it is a cyclist Campaign Group. This is what is so

:25:08.:25:11.

difficult to understand the police would have taken the risk of

:25:11.:25:14.

putting people into these situations and into court, not

:25:14.:25:18.

because they are combatting serious crime, but because people are

:25:18.:25:22.

stopping the traffic. That seems to be, on the face of it, a monumental

:25:22.:25:24.

misjudgment. Thank you. The British people

:25:24.:25:28.

aren't going to be given the chance to vote on whether the country

:25:28.:25:31.

should remain part of the European Union. At least they won't, if the

:25:31.:25:34.

Prime Minister gets his way. He says such a vote would be a

:25:34.:25:38.

distraction at a time when the EU needs to be dealing with issues

:25:38.:25:41.

causing riots in Greece and threatening the whole European

:25:41.:25:44.

project. But the deeper issue of whether

:25:44.:25:49.

Britain should be in the EU at all is in the bloodstream of the Tory

:25:49.:25:54.

Party, like some dormant, but potentially paralysing, virus.

:25:54.:25:58.

This was David Cameron's response to a question on the vote on the

:25:58.:26:02.

future of Britain in the European Union? I completely understand and

:26:02.:26:06.

share the frustration that many have about the way the European

:26:06.:26:08.

Union goes about its business, about the costs and butter oxcy.

:26:08.:26:14.

But I have to say, I think the - bureaucracy. But I have to say the

:26:14.:26:19.

key point here is to get on top of the budget, keep Britain out of the

:26:19.:26:23.

bailout schemes, make sure the single market is working. As the

:26:23.:26:26.

Conservative Party we are committed to the return of powers from

:26:26.:26:29.

Brussels to Westminster, we are also committed as a Government, if

:26:29.:26:33.

power passes from Brussels to, from Westminster to Brussels, there

:26:33.:26:36.

would have to be a referendum. That promise is good for the whole of

:26:36.:26:40.

this Parliament and beyond. But I don't support holding a referendum

:26:40.:26:46.

come what may. That is not our policy and I will not be supporting

:26:46.:26:50.

that motion. What is in this motion? I think never mind Dale

:26:50.:26:54.

Farm, there is a stand-off going on at Westminster at the moment. An

:26:54.:26:57.

act of rebellion against the Prime Minister a bit of hostility, it is

:26:57.:27:00.

this motion at the core of it. This isn't a motion simply about

:27:00.:27:05.

withdrawing from the EU. It is a backbench motion which is designed

:27:05.:27:08.

to maximise Euro-sceptic report, by giving three potentially options in

:27:09.:27:12.

the referendum. Those options would be, remaining a member of the

:27:12.:27:16.

European Union on the current terms, leaving the European Union entirely,

:27:16.:27:19.

or renegotiating the terms of membership to carry on a new

:27:19.:27:23.

relationship with Europe. That is quite clever, because the centre of

:27:23.:27:26.

gravity in the Conservative parliamentary party is in the last

:27:26.:27:31.

point on renegotiation. Only about 30 MPs across the House want to

:27:31.:27:34.

leave. That puts pressure on the Prime Minister. Officially 46

:27:34.:27:38.

backbench MPs have signed up to the multioption motion on the

:27:38.:27:42.

referendum, I'm told tonight as many as 80 Conservatives might be

:27:42.:27:45.

prepared to rebel against the Government line by voting this down

:27:45.:27:49.

when it is debated early next week. The reason the Government sees it

:27:49.:27:54.

as a an act of rebellion, is because the option of - as an act

:27:54.:27:56.

of rebellion is the option of complete withdrawal from the

:27:56.:28:00.

European Union is there. Presumably Labour won't go along with this,

:28:01.:28:04.

maybe they will, I don't know, the Liberal Democrats certainly won't?

:28:05.:28:08.

The Liberal Democrats certainly don't. And the latest from Labour

:28:08.:28:12.

is they will whip against it too. The Prime Minister is in a hole, he

:28:12.:28:14.

doesn't necessarily want further splits and divisions on Europe.

:28:14.:28:18.

This was supposed to be discussed next Thursday, it is brought

:28:18.:28:20.

forward now to Monday, when the Prime Minister and the Foreign

:28:20.:28:25.

Secretary can be present. The reason for that is partly the Prime

:28:26.:28:30.

Minister's presence, which will communicate to waivers they

:28:30.:28:38.

shouldn't mess with him if we want a career. William Hague is a famous

:28:38.:28:44.

Euro-sceptic, but in the current circumstance in the mids of the

:28:45.:28:49.

European crisis remotion isn't there. It is a backbench motion and

:28:49.:28:55.

not binding, so there are calls for a free vote on it, and wipe out the

:28:56.:28:59.

rebellion at one fell swoop. For the Prime Minister it may look like

:28:59.:29:05.

an act of weaks in, at the moment it looks like - weakness, at the

:29:05.:29:10.

moment they willth looks he will try to face them down. I'm joined

:29:11.:29:20.
:29:21.:29:21.

by my guests now. My guest was expelled from the

:29:21.:29:25.

Conservative Party after arguments over European partners. Why do you

:29:25.:29:29.

want to embarrass your leaders? don't, I want to make sure the

:29:30.:29:34.

British people have a right to decide their future. People are

:29:34.:29:38.

crying out for a referendum. This will undermine him? No, actually,

:29:38.:29:42.

what needs to happen is the British people to express their views.

:29:42.:29:50.

David Cameron has a very strong negotiating tour - tool when he

:29:50.:29:54.

goes to Brussels to sort all this out. We were told was a market and

:29:54.:29:58.

not a European Union, and that is not what we voted for and people

:29:58.:30:02.

are fed up with it. It says a lot about the state of the Tory Party?

:30:02.:30:07.

I think David Cameron is right. This is a Daily Express engineered

:30:07.:30:14.

operation, I think he's right to say that it should not lead to

:30:14.:30:17.

something - anything but a debate in the House of Commons. That is

:30:17.:30:21.

what the 100,000 signatures get, but nothing else. If, on the other

:30:21.:30:25.

hand, at some point in the next few years, during the lifetime of this

:30:25.:30:29.

Government, there should be any fundamental change proposed between

:30:29.:30:34.

the UK and the European Union, then there will be a referendum. That is

:30:34.:30:37.

absolutely clear. I'm sure Andrew will agree, that is the right

:30:37.:30:43.

approach. To have some sort of, as David Cameron said, willy nilly,

:30:43.:30:49.

and I'm agreeing with him for once, referendum that would be wrong.

:30:49.:30:53.

Suppose there is a three-line whip next week, would you defy it?

:30:53.:31:00.

point is, we have three options, in, out or a new relationship. There is

:31:00.:31:04.

thrae-line whip saying there is no referendum? I think the majority of

:31:04.:31:07.

the population would like to see a new relationship with the European

:31:07.:31:10.

Union based on trade and co- operation, not political union.

:31:10.:31:15.

you prepared to defy the Prime Minister? We will all talk to

:31:15.:31:18.

constituents this weekend and make a decision. Of course I'm prepared

:31:18.:31:21.

to vote for a referendum, I said that today in the House of Commons.

:31:21.:31:26.

Even if there is a three-line whip telling you not to? We don't know

:31:26.:31:30.

the situation on Monday. Would you defy it? I'm sure Mr Cameron would

:31:30.:31:36.

want to keep the party together. Would you defy a three-line whip?

:31:36.:31:43.

would sooner a free vote. Would you defy it? I'm prepared to vote for a

:31:43.:31:47.

referendum. Would you defy a three- line whip? If necessary, what is to

:31:47.:31:50.

be done to obtain the referendum. You still haven't answered the

:31:50.:31:55.

question? Yes, I would. That is what the British people deserve.

:31:55.:31:58.

With the Prime Minister present in the chamber, you feel sufficiently

:31:58.:32:02.

strongly to defy? We don't know the situation on Monday. But the mood

:32:02.:32:05.

of the country and the parliamentary party, is to have a

:32:05.:32:08.

referendum. I hope the Prime Minister will give us a free vote

:32:08.:32:11.

on that. Edward McMillan-Scott, what does this tell us about the

:32:11.:32:14.

state and the mood of the Tory Party now? And for years there has

:32:14.:32:18.

been a problem in the Tory Party, it is what led to my moving out of

:32:18.:32:24.

it. The increasing Euro-scepticism of the Tory Party has been marked

:32:24.:32:29.

by all commentators. Andrwe Rosindell is part of that it's a

:32:29.:32:34.

long standing right-winger, and adorns his dog in the Union Jack

:32:34.:32:39.

and so on. Not a crime? Not at all. But it is part of a process that

:32:39.:32:42.

has led the Conservative Party in the House of Commons, and in the

:32:42.:32:47.

country at large, from being a broadly rational party on Europe to

:32:47.:32:50.

one that is now becoming rather more extreme than it should be. I

:32:50.:32:54.

think David Cameron's problem is, in Government, as Prime Minister,

:32:54.:33:02.

and sharing power with the party, which has been broadly speaking

:33:02.:33:08.

pro-European throughout his lifetime, not madly,. Has it

:33:08.:33:11.

occurred to you why so many people in the Tory Party would want a

:33:11.:33:16.

referendum is because the European Union has turned into something we

:33:16.:33:21.

were never told it would be and it is a walking disaster? It is not

:33:21.:33:24.

walking disaster. This weekend we have a European Summit about the

:33:24.:33:29.

euro, the euro is in crisis, but it has created 14 million jobs and

:33:29.:33:33.

kept inflation at 2% for ten years. It is not walking disaster. But

:33:33.:33:36.

there are problems, systemic problems. We want reform, that is

:33:36.:33:41.

what we should be doing. This noises off from the House of

:33:41.:33:44.

Commons is not going to help in the crisis the European Union is in. We

:33:44.:33:48.

want the European Union to work. David Cameron says he wants it too.

:33:48.:33:51.

The mood of the country has changed dramatically. People want the

:33:51.:33:56.

choice. People want to be part of Europe for trade and co-operation.

:33:56.:33:59.

The Express does. They don't want to be part of political European,

:33:59.:34:06.

they never wanted that. You are dancing to the UKIP tune. And the

:34:06.:34:11.

Express tune? UKIP and the Express have worked together on this

:34:11.:34:18.

campaign, as you know. As apologies go they tried to have it both ways,

:34:18.:34:24.

Liam Fox conceded he had done wrong in blurring the distinctions

:34:24.:34:27.

between professional responsibility and personal loyalties, and not

:34:27.:34:31.

listening to the warnings he was given during it. He couldn't do

:34:31.:34:35.

anything else after the nature of the findings against him. He did

:34:35.:34:42.

point out the media hounding people close to him and throughout the

:34:42.:34:49.

affair. His behaviour has cost him sis job.

:34:49.:34:55.

The new stage version of the classic Yes Prime Minister, is a

:34:55.:34:59.

reminder that the language of Westminster village can be

:34:59.:35:03.

difficult to decipher. That might precipitate operational

:35:03.:35:07.

uncertainties down the line. So that there would be a presumed

:35:07.:35:16.

modicum of iron clad resipcosity that would be to everybody's

:35:16.:35:19.

advantage. The corridors of power resound to rumour, who is in and

:35:20.:35:25.

out, but Liam Fox's resignation has been eagerly followed by a much

:35:25.:35:28.

wider audience. He made it clear today that the last few weeks have

:35:28.:35:32.

been far from a laughing matter. I'm very sorry to my colleagues

:35:32.:35:37.

here in the House and all those let down by the decisions I have made.

:35:37.:35:42.

He said his resignation was without rancour, and it almost was. Last

:35:42.:35:47.

week's media frenzy was not unprecedented, it happens. Where a

:35:47.:35:52.

free press and politics collide. I believe, there was, some from

:35:52.:35:56.

quarters, a personal vindictiveness, even hatred that should worry all

:35:56.:36:00.

of us. The feeding frenzy could tfpblt the Parliamentary

:36:00.:36:02.

Commissioner for Standards is to investigate Liam Fox, and the

:36:02.:36:07.

Government is to publish a full list of ministers who have met his

:36:07.:36:10.

unofficial advisor, Adam Werritty. The public's perception is the

:36:10.:36:14.

politicians, not the media, are to blame. Outside the Westminster

:36:14.:36:19.

bubble, the public perception is that this has impacted David

:36:19.:36:22.

Cameron and the Conservatives, and it is, once again, raising the

:36:22.:36:26.

issue of whether people can trust politicians. So I think that's

:36:26.:36:30.

actually the key things that Cameron is going to have to now

:36:30.:36:34.

address. In the House of Commons today, Ed Miliband tried to exploit

:36:34.:36:37.

this? A piece of advice to the Prime Minister, this week of all

:36:37.:36:41.

weeks, show a bit of humility. think we should have a bit of

:36:41.:36:46.

humility from the people who gave us, cabs for hire, passports for

:36:46.:36:53.

favours, mortgages for mates. Dodgy dossiers. This is a Prime

:36:53.:36:58.

Minister and we see a pattern of activity with him. A pattern of

:36:58.:37:02.

activity he doesn't ask the tough questions of those around him, and

:37:02.:37:06.

when anything goes wrong, it is nothing to do with him. He may have

:37:06.:37:08.

rattled David Cameron, but the leader of the opposition shouldn't

:37:08.:37:12.

be too satisfied. At the moment Cameron has to deal with this issue

:37:12.:37:15.

of trust in politicians widely, actually the whole of Westminster

:37:15.:37:19.

is facing that. But Ed Miliband, currently, doesn't really hold the

:37:19.:37:26.

confidence of the public that he will be any better. So who are the

:37:26.:37:32.

real winners in the drama surrounding Liam Fox. Some seem to

:37:32.:37:35.

regard the Civil Service as the real opposition, people don't like

:37:35.:37:39.

sofa Government they like everything minuted and recorded,

:37:39.:37:43.

today marked another shift in that direction. Or to put in Whitehall

:37:43.:37:48.

speak, the senior echelons of the Civil Service decided to oversee

:37:48.:37:51.

surveillance to people appointed to ministerial office by the Prime

:37:51.:37:56.

Minister. Or something like that. Today the Government said they

:37:56.:37:59.

accepted the recommendations of the Cabinet Secretary, which would

:37:59.:38:06.

allow civil servants to keep a closer eye on their ministers.

:38:06.:38:11.

should attend all meetings overseas. If ministers step out of line,

:38:11.:38:15.

civil servants will report them to higher authorities? The permanent

:38:15.:38:18.

secretary should take responsibility for-to-make sure

:38:18.:38:21.

departmental procedures are followed and raising concerns with

:38:22.:38:24.

ministers, advising the Cabinet Secretary, and ultimately the Prime

:38:24.:38:29.

Minister, where such concerns are not resolved. A former Conservative

:38:29.:38:32.

cabinet ministers, believes this place has too much power in the

:38:32.:38:37.

face of unelected officials. I was a junior minister under Peter

:38:37.:38:42.

Walker, who confronted this issue, and had ministerial meetings most

:38:42.:38:46.

mornings without officials present. There was a degree of confrontation.

:38:46.:38:50.

And the permanent secretary said to Peter, well, first, how will we

:38:50.:38:53.

know what your ministers have decided if one of our people are

:38:53.:38:57.

not there. Peter replied, and he said, I will tell you. That, they

:38:57.:39:00.

didn't like. They fought again and he eventually turned and said I

:39:01.:39:07.

will do a deal with you. If I let you have one of my officials in my

:39:07.:39:11.

ministerial meetings, you will let me have one of my ministers in your

:39:11.:39:15.

official meetings. Game, set and match. The Cabinet Secretary hasn't

:39:15.:39:25.
:39:25.:39:28.

responded to that kind of criticism. I asked the next best thing, Sir

:39:28.:39:31.

Humphrey BaAppleton? I will give you a serious answer to be

:39:31.:39:38.

considered in its context. Certain proadvisors have to be considered,

:39:38.:39:41.

postu lated, designated and specified, a number of

:39:41.:39:43.

considerations have to be conceded sometimes.

:39:43.:39:48.

Is that a yes or a no? Don't you think that yes, and no, are rather

:39:48.:39:53.

broad and unspecific in their applications Mr Watson?

:39:53.:40:01.

With us now are Philip Collins, who writes for the Times and a former

:40:01.:40:05.

speech write Forcione Tony Blair, and my other guests.

:40:05.:40:10.

How big a deal do you think this Liam Fox scandal is? Well, not many

:40:10.:40:13.

things in politics really matter all that much. This problem isn't

:40:13.:40:17.

one of them. I think for most people they will celebrate the

:40:17.:40:21.

resignation of Liam Fox quietly at home. But it matters in this sense.

:40:21.:40:24.

That anyone who is inclined to think that politicians have all got

:40:24.:40:32.

their noses face down in the trough, has got ample confirmation. It is a

:40:32.:40:36.

tiny little world, politicians, lobbyists and advisors, it doesn't

:40:36.:40:41.

look good, does it? I think that's right. The trauma that was the

:40:41.:40:45.

expenses scandal has not been digested by the political world. I

:40:45.:40:48.

think they are still really in denial about how angry the public

:40:48.:40:53.

were about that, still are. They are not paying enough attention. A

:40:53.:40:58.

story like this reconfirms people's worst beliefs. Do you think there

:40:58.:41:01.

is a possibility of the whole sleaze thing coming back? Number

:41:02.:41:05.

Ten were relaxed about the story, because they thought Liam Fox was

:41:05.:41:09.

so distant in Westminster terms from David Cameron, this wouldn't

:41:09.:41:15.

attach personally to Cameron or his Government. Clearly the Fox

:41:15.:41:20.

situation was where no other minister has a friend following him

:41:20.:41:30.

around the globe like Liam Fox did. You have MPs expenses and trust in

:41:30.:41:35.

politics never being lower, combine that with the incredibly tight

:41:35.:41:38.

economic standards, putting a squeeze on people's living

:41:38.:41:42.

standards and an anti-politics mood out there. It will only take one or

:41:42.:41:47.

two more cases like this for a real public backlash against it. That is

:41:47.:41:52.

the danger for the coalition. dangerous for the Government f they

:41:52.:41:55.

allow the idea to take hold that they play by different rules from

:41:55.:42:00.

the rest of us, and they can carry on doing whatever they like. Liam

:42:01.:42:05.

Fox's statement today exhibited the exact arrogance and detatchment

:42:05.:42:09.

that got him into trouble in the first place. This if that attaches

:42:09.:42:16.

to the Government they could be in trouble. It could snowball, if it

:42:16.:42:24.

remains an incident in its own light that it is goodbye Liam Fox.

:42:24.:42:28.

I thought that Ed Miliband led on PMQs, and David Cameron was

:42:28.:42:32.

dismissive of him and effective. There was one moment when you saw a

:42:32.:42:36.

tremor of fear pass through the front bench on the Tories, when Ed

:42:36.:42:41.

Miliband said to David Cameron, by being different did you mean your

:42:41.:42:44.

press officer would get arrested and your Defence Secretary had to

:42:44.:42:49.

resign. You saw them all leaning back and going crikey, that is the

:42:49.:42:54.

danger. On the Werritty story there are these strange echos of the

:42:54.:42:57.

Coulson story, the peculiar idea that if you are loyal to your

:42:57.:43:01.

friends, that is a higher good than being transparent and whiter than

:43:01.:43:05.

white. Let's move on to the question about the relationship

:43:05.:43:08.

between Government and Whitehall. Because Liam Fox went into the

:43:08.:43:12.

Ministry of Defence, determined to sort out the Ministry of Defence,

:43:13.:43:21.

and in fact t sorted him out? - it sorted him out? Or didn't. I think

:43:21.:43:30.

he sorted himself out. He has lined up a whole series of culprits for

:43:30.:43:34.

this and the one person he hasn't lined up is himself. The Civil

:43:34.:43:38.

Service emerges from the whole thing stronger doesn't it? Ever so

:43:38.:43:40.

slightly. The Government have slightly got themselves to blame

:43:40.:43:46.

for this. The Brown Government did the same thing. When you denigrate

:43:46.:43:50.

political advisors you leave yourself open to this kind of thing.

:43:50.:43:54.

Special advisors are a special thing in Government, they do

:43:54.:43:57.

something quite different from unelected officials. Saying we are

:43:57.:44:01.

part of cleaning up politics and not having special advisors you

:44:01.:44:06.

leave yourself open to this kind of thing. They are slightly more

:44:06.:44:12.

powerful than they were, the civil servants, not especially so.

:44:12.:44:18.

agree. This Cameron idea of limenting the number of SP -

:44:18.:44:25.

limiting the number of SPADs. Special advisors? It has left Nick

:44:25.:44:30.

Clegg unequipped in the Cabinet Office. And Liam Fox needed more

:44:30.:44:38.

people around him. It is not transparent, at least if you have

:44:38.:44:40.

enough political staff in each ministerial office, or Secretary of

:44:40.:44:45.

State, rather, at least you noi who is doing what and everything has to

:44:45.:44:48.

be transparent, and funding issues don't come into it as they have in

:44:48.:44:51.

this story. Part of the problem for the Liberal Democrats is they

:44:51.:44:57.

haven't had their own special advisors in Government. Every

:44:57.:45:03.

department with a Tory Secretary of State. There was a story when one

:45:03.:45:09.

minister called up 9 special advisor saying these stories keep

:45:09.:45:14.

appearing and I don't know where they are coming from, and they came

:45:14.:45:18.

from the advisor. It is a real mistake this, to try to limit the

:45:18.:45:22.

number of special advisor, they do something important and necessary.

:45:22.:45:27.

We should also point out that Adam Werritty was doing something not

:45:27.:45:30.

necessary, which is running, essentially, a fanciful parallel

:45:30.:45:33.

national security policy. There are still lots of questions to be

:45:33.:45:41.

answered about this? Many, many. The Lyons Inquiry will be important.

:45:41.:45:44.

That confusion and unanswered questions makes the issues we were

:45:44.:45:47.

talking about earlier to do with public perceptions worse. The

:45:47.:45:52.

confusion, it looks like such a mess. Fox was the opposite of pen

:45:52.:45:57.

tent in the House today, I thought. I thought - pen tent in the House

:45:57.:46:04.

today, I thought he did himself no favours. Not to be there for the

:46:04.:46:08.

George Young response, and then to give your statement and be so

:46:08.:46:12.

unapologetic. That went down bad with colleagues. There was not a

:46:12.:46:18.

feeling among Tory MPs that he came and gave the speech they wanted.

:46:18.:46:22.

They give the passive, the Ministerial Code has been breached,

:46:22.:46:27.

rather than I broke it. All the people who supported him

:46:27.:46:31.

vociferously last week, it puts them in a difficult position?

:46:31.:46:35.

people who supported him last week were not natural Liam Fox allies,

:46:35.:46:40.

they were people the leadership had asked to do a job. One of the

:46:40.:46:47.

misapprehensions about Liam Fox is that there is a bunch of loyal

:46:47.:46:51.

backbenchers rallying to him. After 2005 and his failure to win the

:46:52.:46:55.

Tory leadership, Liam Fox has spent remarkably little time cultivating

:46:55.:46:59.

backbenches, he doesn't go back to a ready-made group. On the whole

:46:59.:47:04.

Europe question, Liam Fox is nowhere to be seen. It is not like

:47:04.:47:09.

Tory backbenchers will be waiting to see which way he comes down on

:47:09.:47:13.

the EU referendum question, one way or the other. He's not the force

:47:13.:47:16.

people think he is on the backbenches. Gavin will be here

:47:16.:47:26.
:47:26.:47:52.

A cold one tonight. It means most of us will have a frosty start

:47:52.:47:56.

tomorrow morning. Quite a few of us will have a sunny morning. However,

:47:56.:48:00.

through the day, steadily it will cloud over with outbreaks of rain

:48:00.:48:04.

for Northern Ireland. Most of Scotland by the afternoon. Some of

:48:04.:48:08.

the rain dribbling into northern England. Dry and bright. Most of

:48:08.:48:10.

the Midlands and the south-east having a fine day. After a cold

:48:10.:48:15.

start, by the afternoon, with light winds in the sunshine, not feeling

:48:15.:48:19.

too bad, temperatures 12-13. Clouding over some what for South-

:48:19.:48:22.

West England and steadily through the day t will cloud over across

:48:22.:48:28.

Wales as well. Eye vently some light rain dribble - eventually

:48:28.:48:32.

light rain dribbling into the south west. By lunchtime it will be damp,

:48:32.:48:38.

and the afternoon staying grey with further outbreaks of rain. The same

:48:38.:48:43.

for the west of Scotland. Further east some sunshine but rain late in

:48:43.:48:47.

the day. Friday promises further cloud and rain across Northern

:48:47.:48:49.

Ireland, parts of Scotland, in the south most of England and Wales

:48:49.:48:54.

will have a dry day on Friday, and you will notice the temperatures a

:48:54.:49:04.
:49:04.:49:05.

little bit higher with sunshine. So Friday it is a bit of a north-south

:49:05.:49:10.