12/11/2013 Stormont Today

Hello and welcome to Stormont Today. Coming up on the programme.

Health Minister Edwin Poots defends his opposition to gay adoption and

gay men donating blood. The natural order, whether one

believes in God or in evolution, the natural order is for a man and a

woman to have a child. Tributes are paid in the Assembly to

the founding member of the SDLP, Eddie McGrady.

His words delivered by our party leader at the weekend that ring true

to the man he was. He said, don't mourn for me, just get out there and

finish the job. And I'm joined by the journalist

Gerry Millar to look over today's events.

It was the Health Minister against the Alliance Party in question time

today. Children's cardiac services being centralised in Dublin and

Northern Ireland's abortion laws were on the agenda but, once again,

Edwin Poots' opposition to gay adoption and gay men donating blood

dominated proceedings. The Minister was asked by Trevor Lunn if he

believes homosexuality is an illness.

In terms of this issue, I don't think it is an illness. I do think

that many people have various elements to their lives that when it

comes to sexuality many people who are heterosexual would desire lots

of other folks. Those of us who are married should not be doing that.

People can resist urges. In terms of all of this, I would encourage

people to take a sensible and rational view on these issues. I

know there has been a number of challenges and the various stances I

take but I make it very clear that Indians of blood safety, that is

truly about safety. Whether one believes in God or evolution, the

natural order is for a man and a woman to have a child and therefore

that has made my view on adoption very clear and on raising children

very clear and it should be a man and a woman that raises a child.

People can criticise me for that and challenge me for it and say it is

backward. The truth is that still today, in this modern era, it is

only a man and a woman that can produce a child and therefore I

think it is in the best order for a man and a woman to raise a child.

Does the Minister accept that since restrictions were put in place, the

lack of clarity on the ongoing delay of outcome but increasing stress on

families and can he give a more concrete timescale for completion

and does he accept that an all Ireland network of children's heart

surgery with a print in Belfast is what is needed? I do accept that the

delay causes further consternation to families and that is not what we

want to have. However, I need people to be agreeable to what we in this

house actually want and that is what we have been working on. That is a

course of work that will have to be seen through if we are to be

successful. I would urge people to be patient a little longer. Time is

of the essence. Professor Wood leaves his role in December so we

will need to have something in place before that happens and that is a

course of work that we are continuing to in gauge upon. I would

hope to be in a position to give this house a full update in the not

too distant future. The law in Northern Ireland does not address

the issue of faecal abnormality. We must fully -- free till

abnormality. My views on the issue are well known. I am opposed to the

liberalisation of the law but I would look at any proposals put

forward by the Minister. As members are aware, the position on the

termination of pregnancy in Northern Ireland is provided in the body of

criminal law. Any guidance to the document produced by my department

can only reflect existing law, it cannot change it. The recent

consultation has been successful in highlighting concerns health

professionals and others have in relation to this sensitive issue. I

have asked them to look at every possibility as ideal everyday with

the difficulties faced by women and their families often in tragic

circumstances. The Health Minister Edwin Poots. I'm

joined now by the journalist Gerry Millar. Edwin Poots once again the

centre of attention at Stormont. If I was working for a tabloid

newspaper, I would be counting every headline Edwin Poots has put in it.

I think it is clear that the public want ministers to keep their own

personal moral opinions out of decision-making and I think Edwin

Poots acknowledged that when he made a clear statement that he decided to

put a ban on blood donors, gay blood donors, that it was done purely for

health reasons. He has repeatedly said his beliefs do not get in the

way of his ability to do his job and they do not unduly influence him in

his decision-making process will stop do you think his position has

changed? Three big issues tend to suggest there is a moral aspect to

his decisions. The three big issues that are always going to grab the

headlines, abortion, gay blood donors and gay adoption. I think

they overshadow all the good work because the press will always try to

grab those headlines. The new children's hospital is being

shadowed -- overshadowed. Using phrases like the natural order as he

did today and the best order is for a man and a woman to raise a child.

I think there were mistakes and he is almost trapped by the opposition

and I think he full story. When questions are asked, he probably

can't help himself. He seems to get himself into the headlines. For me

it is probably not for the right reasons. It is an enormous

portfolio, a huge responsibility, and it is difficult to stay on top

of all the nuances of that. They are very difficult, they are very

delicate and the public is split on them so they are very difficult

things to handle. The DUP had indicated that Edwin Poots would

more likely than not be rotated out of the ministry at this stage so

people are surprised that has not happened. Do you think you will be

there much longer? It is going to happen sooner or later.

Gerry Millar, thank you. A bit of housekeeping earlier today

saw the rules around Topical Questions change. From next week

they'll be asked after the submitted questions. However, today, they

remained top of the Question Time agenda with the SDLP's Alban

Maginness concerned about the future of one of our banks.

Last week the RBS announced a review into the Ulster bank and separations

in Northern Ireland. The RBS being the parent bank and being state

owned. Has the Minister any concerns in relation to that and has he

sought a meeting with RBS to discuss the review? I have concerns. There

are areas in the report that do cause concern. The second review

into establishing long-term and sustainable footing is called for

further restructuring of that bank. It is inevitable that there will be

further job losses. As indeed there probably will be across other banks

before they get to a position where they are probably -- properly

functioning. The valuation process is entirely evidence -based and

naturally that evidence reflects the relative advantages and

disadvantages of particular trading locations. At the end of the day, it

is the open market that establishes current levels. This alone will

determine who pays more and who pays less following reevaluation but I

think we would be in a far worse position if it had not been for

something like small business rate relief scheme which has given ?1.5

million in relief to properties. This department has also frozen the

nondomestic regional rate for the eighth year and we have introduced

empty properties relief to tackle vacancies which are dotted across

towns and city centres across Northern Ireland. The Minister may

be aware of the news today that the town of Ballymena, according to a

survey, is now in the unenviable position of having the highest

proportion of empty shops right across Northern Ireland at a

staggering 27% of all shops being empty. What can the Minister do to

address that? I appreciate he can't rig the rating system but he can do

more, surely, if the present concessions are not arresting the

decline. Is his mind open to doing more in terms of relief for town

centre shops so that we can arrest this situation in a prosperous town?

In terms of what persistence and what support we can give to

Ballymena, it is not just Ballymena it is right across Northern Ireland,

but in terms of small business rate relief scheme, 1183 properties have

got ?1.7 million of relief on their bills. In terms of empty properties

and trying to address some of those vacancies, Ballymena is still to

start. I think that is very uncharacteristic of the Ballymena

area. I don't think, I accept there are probably other things we can do

but I operate within a very defined spending envelope and no matter how

many things I can do, even if I eliminated the Ritz -- rates for

some businesses, it is no substitute for having sufficient turnover. If

you do not have enough turnover to keep you above water, there is

nothing I or anyone can do to keep you above water.

Straight-talking from the Finance Minister, Simon Hamilton. Northern

Ireland's politicians have failed the victims of the Troubles over the

last 15 years. That was the message from Deputy First Minister, speaking

in the Assembly today. Martin McGuinness admitted mistakes have

been made, but he said he hopes the current talks chaired by the

American diplomat, Richard Haass, could come up with a way of dealing

with the past. Mr McGuinness was reporting back to the Assembly from

the latest meeting of the North-South Ministerial Council.

Our meeting was a very positive and good meeting and provided a valuable

opportunity to focus on some of the key challenges we face. Last week

came in a few short weeks after the successful investment conference in

Belfast and the global economic Forum. The council recognise the

value of of events and I have no doubt they will provide an important

platform to provide economic growth and prosperity. Can I ask him if he

and the first Minister took the opportunity to discuss how the

Northern Ireland executive and the Irish government can work together

to deliver a comprehensive victim centre process in dealing with the

past? If so, what ideas were considered? As the member has heard

me and other say over the course of the last 15 years, one of the

greatest flaws in the peace process has been the approach to the past,

of which there are many narratives. There is a huge responsibility on

all of us to deal with that. That is why we agreed and I am pleased the

member's party was part of the agreement to house -- to ask the

diplomat from the United States, Richard Hass, too chaired the

multiparty talks. He has been involved in the engagement, and of

course he has been talking, not just to the parties but to the Irish

government, the British government and we are aware the United States

government through the vice president, who lie and the first

Minister spoke to in the aftermath of the appointment of Richard Hass.

We hope within the process we will see a resolution to the issue of

flags and the issue of parades and find a way forward on the issue of

how we support victims. Yes, I think absolutely all of us need to hold

our hands up, and this is a signal failure. But I hope it is a failure

that can be corrected. We have had in the course of the last number of

days, further positive reports from those who have been analysing the

situation, that there is an upturn in fortunes. Always very and to talk

about green shoots, people have done that before and done it to their

cost. But there is some sense things are beginning to go on the up. We

expressed our concerns that the National dairy Council campaign is

an abuse of country origin labelling. The deputy minister has

raised this issue with the authority and the Irish government

counterparts. She has brought the campaign to the attention of the

European commission. We are concerned it contravenes the

principles of the single market, discriminates against consumers. The

news recently about a new barrier going up in east Belfast, wasn't

good news, particularly in the context of wanting to ring down the

walls in Belfast over the course of the next ten years. -- bring. Last

night we brought you the news of the passing of Eddie McGrady, and today

MLAs from across the chamber paid tribute to the former MP, who was a

founding member of the SDLP. I came to know Eddie McGrady very well. We

served on the first policing board and he was a true gentleman.

Certainly, politics in Northern Ireland will be much sadder with the

loss of Eddie McGrady. Words delivered by Alistair Macdonald at

the weekend ring true to the man he was. He said, " don't mourn for me,

just get out there and finish the job". My thoughts and prayers are

with his children. As well as the wider family circle. His sister, his

brother and of course his deep friend and political colleague,

Margaret Ritchie. When I spoke to Eddie last Wednesday night, I just

said a prayer with him because I knew it would not be long. He will

be deeply missed as a close friend and colleague. He has left a lot for

Margaret, Karen and myself to do to try and fill his shoes in Southdown.

May he rest in peace. Everyone had the highest respect for Eddie

McGrady. I happened to be chairing a meeting in down hospital in what

happened to be his last day of the member of Parliament the Southdown.

I saw him and I realised Parliament would be closed in a few hours time.

I called him up to say if you last words and there was hardly a dry eye

in the house. I always found him a courteous and fair colleague and

enjoyed working with him. I met him recently at the opening of a school

and we had a bit of banter together. I know he will be missed by his

colleagues in the STL P. He will be missed and other colleagues by all

of us here in this house. I want to pay tribute to the service he

provided to the people of Southdown over the last two and a half

decades. As a journalist I always enjoyed interviewing Eddie McGrady.

I will not give too much away, but there was a time around the

negotiations of the Belfast Good Friday agreement when Ulster

television ran a sweepstake on when an announcement was going to come.

Eddie came out to the interview point and I cast him if he would

like to join the sweepstake, and he did. And he warned. Either he had

inside knowledge, or he had some influence over what was going on in

those talks. I will remember him both in terms of the negotiations

which led up to the Good Friday agreement and in the happy days of

the assembly when things were not quite as smooth running as they are

now. The deals that were done in the corridor behind the speaker's chair

generally involving Jim Wilson, Eddie and sometimes I got in if

votes were needed, is a tribute to a man you knew it was a gentleman. If

a deal was reached you knew it would be stuck to and he was a man who

stuck to his word. Warm tributes from across the

political spectrum for the late Eddie McGrady. One in 85 men is

diagnosed with prostate cancer each year in Northern Ireland. Earlier, a

motion was brought to the floor calling on the Health Minister to

introduce a screening programme for the disease. It was tabled by Sinn

Fein's Oliver McMullan who joins me now. Thanks for joining us.

You had a very personal reason for bringing this motion. I was

diagnosed earlier in the year with prostate cancer, so I brought the

motion today. I have asked the Minister to do a screening programme

for those people, those men who have been diagnosed with the cancer.

There is little uptake after they come out of the programme. The

anxiety, mental issues and I believe there needs to be a programme put in

place to look at this. You think that is more important than the

screening programme? At this present time, the medics are not getting a

handle on the whole disease. But there is nothing there when the men

come out of the programme and go home. This is part of the programme

and this is recognised by the medical profession and within the

research team in Queens University. Is that what you found difficult and

received your initial treatment, that was fine but it was after that

you struggled? After you come home, there is pressure on your family as

well. When your surgeon tells you you have been diagnosed with cancer,

it is a new world. A lot of people cannot handle that when you go home.

It does affect your home life, because there is nothing fair and

there is a big void. This is what we want to try and fill and that is why

I was asking the Minister to do something about that. What feedback

did you get from the Minister, how hopeful are you things will change?

He did talk about it and he said he would look on it. I want to see him

put it into operation. The longer we hold this off, because prostrate

cancer is fast becoming the top cancer among men. The area I

representing East Antrim, it is one of the highest areas for prostrate

cancer. So there has to be a problem. There is these hotspots and

the research unit now has a postcode list of all the hotspots of cancer.

Two men watching this who think they have a problem but are nervous about

going to their GP, what would you say to them? Don't be nervous, go

and speak to your GP and get something done. Men are very slow at

coming forward for medical help. I appeal to them to come forward or

talk to someone who has been through the treatment and give them some

reassurance. Oliver McMullan, thank you.

The House got to hear about a raft of Public Account Committee reports

today as MLAs gave their verdict on the work of the committee which

pores over the account books. The PAC chair said the committee is

working hard to ensure public money is properly spent. When I read of

lofty projections and unrealistic business cases of reform projects

and overreliance on consultants of public bodies, whose culture is

transparency and good governance, I wish for some learning to take place

and I cannot help thinking of the benefit my constituents could have

further public money. One example of this was the account consultancy

project. This was an initiative devised to introduce centralised

accounts. The original contract value for this was 970,000. The

final total was 9.6 million and further it was delivered four years

later. Lack of transparency raises its ugly head in several of the

reports. There are serious questions to be answered in relation to

housing maintenance contracts and hopefully be upcoming enquiry by the

committee will shed some light on what has been going on. But there

are also issues elsewhere. The report into the safety of services

provided by health and social care says there is a lack of evidence to

show safety has improved in the last decade. Ten years! And there is an

absence of robust measures of level and client patient harm which makes

it difficult for the department to demonstrate improvement. First of

all, let's remind ourselves what we are debating today. These are the

reports that we are discussing. I am holding in my hands, ?1 million

worth of work by the Public Accounts Committee. Because that is the

average, an average of ?100,000 per report, ten reports, ?1 million. Let

me make something clear, I think there is a role for an effective

Public Accounts Committee, scrutinising expenditure across

government departments. But when I look at these reports, I want to

refer to some of the points members have already made. I ask myself, are

we improving governments, or are we making government more difficult in

Northern Ireland? The truth in some respects is, the average person is

pursued until the ends of the earth for 100, 200 or ?300 of an effect

that might have been falsely claimed or incorrect -- incorrectly claimed.

But because of the nature of the people involved in this, enormous

amounts of money went up in smoke. We recognise we need to find new

ways to deliver public services. We have to do things differently and we

can no longer do what we have always done because that is what has always

been the way. The status quo will no longer suffice. The landscape of

public services delivery is changing. To enable us to deliver

world-class public services we have to be leaner, more productive and

more efficient. The Finance Minister, Simon

Hamilton. And Gerry Millar has joined me again.

Getting back to Question Time, what's your take on Topical

Questions been, they're being moved, but do you think they've been a

useful tool in challenging ministers on their briefs? They are trying to

make them more important and more controversial so they will be more

newsworthy. It was a topical question that got the health

Minister to save the controversial health statement would be big news

today. If they are pushed to the end of questions, there is more chance

people will be able to respond to answers already given. But it does

not give ministers a chance to prepare. If you don't prepare, you

are being asked questions on the hoof and it is then you prove you

know your portfolio. It'll be interesting to see how that changes

the quality of the debate. One other issue before we go. There were very

warm tributes paid to Eddie McGrady in the chamber today. It will be a

great comfort to his family that right across the political spectrum,

the tributes were fantastic. A direct political opponent being so

warm. He was a very kind and personable person and he transcended

party politics, which is a huge tribute you can be involved in party

politics and the tributes were moving and kind-hearted. Also on

social media yesterday. Lots of people from right across the

spectrum making the effort to go on the record? He was the ultimate

constituency politician and he loved Southdown. People felt