Mon, 27 Mar 2017 Ffermio


Mon, 27 Mar 2017

Ydy ffermio ar yr ucheldir o dan fygythiad yn sgil Brexit? Will upland farming come under threat after Brexit? Farmers, politicians and unions share their thoughts.


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Transcript


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-Yes, the view is wonderful...

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-..but don't get tricked by the

-beauty of Wales' mountain landscape.

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-There's a storm on the horizon...

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-..which threatens

-the communities that live here.

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-A storm previously unseen

-in recent Welsh history.

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-80% of agricultural land in Wales

-is classed as upland...

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-..or land in a less favoured area.

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-It's home to 1.5m people...

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-..and offers direct livelihoods

-for 42,000 farmers...

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-..with many more jobs created

-indirectly.

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-Hill farming is the backbone

-of the economy, culture...

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-..and environment of the uplands.

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-Every upland farm

-receives a subsidy.

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-Those payments from Europe

-will continue until the end of 2019.

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-The United Kingdom has decided

-to leave the European Union.

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-As a result, changes will happen.

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-With Britain not contributing

-financially to Europe...

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-..the Common Agricultural Policy

-payments will no longer be relevant.

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-In other words, it will see the end

-of subsidies as we know them now.

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-It might herald the end

-of our tariff-free lamb market...

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-..on the continent

-as we leave the single market.

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-It is estimated

-that there are 9m sheep in Wales.

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-The uplands are home

-to 75% of breeding ewes.

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-At today's price, farmers receive

-between l.26 and 1.76 per kilo...

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-..for their produce.

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-There are costs connected

-with rearing lambs...

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-..as Emlyn Roberts from Rhydymain,

-Dolgellau, knows better than anyone.

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-He keeps 800 sheep

-and 25 Welsh Black cattle.

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-As a hill farm, we're dependant on

-Europe as a market for our sheep...

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-..even though the economy there

-is a little fragile right now.

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-What does the market

-want from you right now?

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-Large lambs,

-there's a market for large lambs.

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-It's a struggle to get a market

-and demand for small lambs.

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-Producing large lambs

-in an upland area is difficult.

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-It's very difficult - we're

-encouraged to produce large lambs.

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-The problem with that is

-you get larger ewes...

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-..the sheep are bigger, there

-are costs to maintain the sheep...

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-..and the sheep

-won't live on the mountains.

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-Welsh mountain ewes are on the

-mountains for over 10 months a year.

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-If that sheep doesn't produce

-the lamb the market demands...

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-..changes are inevitable.

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-..changes are inevitable.

-

-That's a possibility.

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-It's possible to get

-some of those lambs over 15 kilos...

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-..and sell them as store lambs

-in this country later in the year.

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-The income to the farm

-will decrease as a result.

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-The people who finish the lambs

-need their cut...

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-..to guarantee that they have

-an income for finishing the lamb.

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-How much subsidy do you receive now?

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-At the moment, a substantial

-proportion of the farm's income...

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-..comes from direct

-and indirect subsidies.

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-Indirectly, schemes relating

-to environmental agriculture...

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-..but a lot of that money

-is transferred to working capital.

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-I employ lads

-to fence and build walls.

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-Very little of that money

-stays in my pocket.

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-That sustains local workers

-and their families.

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-I employ

-as many local lads as I can.

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-Geraint Davies farms

-Fedw Arian near Bala.

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-He keeps 1,000 breeding ewes

-and 30 cows.

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-Without the payments,

-a hill farm would make a loss.

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-We don't receive enough

-for our produce.

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-Our production costs are high.

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-What are the obstacles

-you face every day?

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-There are a number.

-80% of the farm is classed as SSSI.

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-We receive no help with that

-and it's very frustrating.

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-If we end up selling to the WTO...

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-..and we're bound

-by those guidelines...

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-..which stop us being

-competitive across the world...

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-..we're going to struggle

-to compete with countries...

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-..such as New Zealand, Brazil where

-the environment isn't a concern.

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-What would you like

-to see happening?

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-A policy that will guarantee

-the future of hill farming.

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-The future of carbon storing

-will be a major player.

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-We can go to an industry

-that pollutes...

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-..and tell the authorities

-that carbon emissions...

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-..can be offset on hill farms.

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-That's a strong possibility for us.

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-Lord Elis-Thomas is the AM

-for Dwyfor Meirionnydd.

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-The constituency

-has a high proportion of hill farms.

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-It's important to remember how

-different Welsh hill farming is...

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-..to farming in south-east England

-with the emphasis on crops.

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-We need a pattern of supporting

-agriculture which guarantees...

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-..that the food produced here

-and people who live here...

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-..have an income for the future.

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-In other words,

-hill farmers need subsidies.

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-Of course because the income

-of Welsh farmers, on average...

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-..is 25,000

-and that's not enough income...

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-..to sustain the economy

-in rural Wales.

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-What we receive

-from the European Union...

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-..and Common Agricultural Policy...

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-..and the lamb policy in particular

-has been crucial for hill farmers.

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-Some argue that hill farmers,

-like every other farmer...

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-..should stand

-on their own two feet.

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-They should exist without subsidies.

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-They should exist without subsidies.

-

-That's not a sound argument.

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-There's only one way to work.

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-You either get a fair price

-for the milk or the lambs...

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-..or you receive support

-through subsidies...

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-..to safeguard other objectives...

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-..which include environmental

-objectives in this area.

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-It's not possible to maintain

-the level of farming...

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-..and land management

-in this part of the world...

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-..if there's no increase

-in market price...

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-..maintaining the market price

-through an open market.

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-If we're not part

-of the single market...

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-..how can we export agricultural

-produce to the rest of Europe?

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-There's no need for anyone to be

-a mathematician to realise...

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-..the financial uncertainty

-faced by hill farmers.

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-On top of losing subsidies...

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-..is there a possibility

-of losing the European market?

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-Meat Promotion Wales

-receives a levy of 83p per lamb...

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-..partially to promote the produce.

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-Prys Morgan

-is Meat Promotion Wales'...

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-..Industry Relations

-and Knowledge Exchange Manager.

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-About 35% of lambs produced in Wales

-are exported.

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-Of the lambs that are exported, 90%

-are exported to the European Union.

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-The financial value of the market

-is over 120m.

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-Realistically,

-it's worth more than that.

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-It gives processors the opportunity

-to balance the carcass.

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-That allows them to sell leg cuts

-in this country...

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-..and the shoulder and loin cuts

-can be exported.

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-Can you explain

-the possible system of tariffs?

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-Tariffs exists under the WTO,

-the World Trade Organisation.

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-They vary -

-for lamb it's 46% of the price...

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-..up to 60% of the price.

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-If that lamb is sold,

-if the meat is sold for 100...

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-..the market which imports it will

-have to pay at least 146 for it.

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-It's not competitive in that market.

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-Let's talk about hill farmers.

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-Which markets

-need to be targeted for those lambs?

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-There's an available market at home,

-in the ethnic communities.

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-They export out

-to Italy, Spain and Portugal.

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-As these markets develop...

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-..they will want more cuts.

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-A larger lamb will suit them better.

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-For example, if a 10-kilo lamb

-is cut and it costs 10 to cut it...

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-..it's 1 a kilo.

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-If a 20-kilo lamb is cut,

-it's 50p per kilo.

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-With so much debate, what are

-the unions and politicians doing...

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-..to guarantee hill farming

-in the future?

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-Alun visited a special conference

-to find out.

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-Westminster's Welsh affairs

-committee chose Dolgellau Mart...

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-..as the venue for the next step

-of the Brexit debate.

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-Politicians, unions and farmers

-discussed concerns and hopes...

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-..in the wake

-of leaving the European Union.

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-At crucial times such as this...

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-..you must capitalise

-on opportunities...

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-..to express your concerns.

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-We might not be able

-to influence...

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-..but we hope the politicians

-present listen to us.

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-Every pound

-the government invests in farming...

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-..is multiplied many times

-before its journey's end.

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-In rural areas, they should see it

-as investment in communities...

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-..and not as payments.

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-Agriculture on hill farms

-can only adapt so much.

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-We can't grow crops.

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-We can't diversify - sheep and

-beef cattle are our only option.

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-The contribution of agriculture

-to the rural economy...

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-..of North and Mid Wales is crucial.

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-1 in every 25 jobs

-relies on the sector...

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-..and up to 90% of the produce

-is exported to European markets.

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-Chairing the committee

-was Conservative David Davies.

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-Mark Williams, Liz Saville Roberts

-and Glyn Davies completed the panel.

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-You're known as someone

-who supported Brexit.

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-David Davis recently announced....

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-..that there'd be a tariff

-on agricultural produce.

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-How will that affect

-the rural economy of this area...

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-..and the hill farms

-of Dolgellau and Meirionnydd?

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-It's not going to be good for this

-area, there's no doubt about it...

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-..but David Davis

-is speaking with honesty.

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-There's a possibility of tariffs.

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-If that happened,

-we'd receive more money.

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-We import more than we export.

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-With tariffs,

-we'd benefit in financial terms.

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-We expect to help

-any sector that loses out.

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-At the same time,

-David Davis is correct...

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-..to remember the rest of Europe.

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-If they don't give us a deal...

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-..we're ready to walk away

-without any agreement at all.

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-A lot of people are ready to say

-yes, agriculture is important.

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-The reality is

-we hear from Westminster...

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-..that they're ready to consider

-all tariffs - this is hard Brexit.

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-What's the reality of that for

-farmers and the future of farming?

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-What concerns me on top of that

-is the level of funding for Wales.

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-Will it reflect the needs of Wales?

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-Or will it be Brexitted conveniently

-and halved?

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-That would be disastrous

-and unfair for Welsh farmers?

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-In good faith, political parties

-and the Government of Wales...

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-..has talked about unfettered access

-to the single market.

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-Ears may be open but it's how

-the UK Government delivers on that.

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-Every step of the way,

-the Welsh voice has to be heard.

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-It is so critically important

-to the economy...

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-..of Mid, West and North Wales.

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-Livelihoods are at stake.

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-Yes, there are opportunities.

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-I acknowledge the way

-the country voted...

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-..but we have to get

-the right kind of Brexit...

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-..if our economy is to grow.

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-Presenting the evidence

-were union delegates.

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-With subsidies from

-the Common Agricultural Plan...

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-..worth 274m a year

-to Welsh farmers...

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-..how do the unions think

-farmers will adapt?

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-The end of this two-year period

-is the problem.

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-I think there's a chance

-for every area of Wales...

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-..to survive

-in five to ten years...

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-..but to reach that point,

-it's important to have a plan...

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-..to maintain

-the economy of rural Wales...

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-..not just for farmers

-but other rural economies too.

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-At the heart of my evidence...

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-..was the value of agriculture

-to communities in Wales.

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-In Meirionnydd,

-average farm profit...

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-..is 11,000.

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-If you took Welsh farms

-as a whole...

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-..they invested 111,000

-into the wider community.

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-For me, that proves the value of

-agriculture to the local economy.

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-People don't appreciate the value

-of the Welsh language and culture.

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-We also need to ensure

-the future for those...

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-..for our children

-and our children's children.

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-Strong views there.

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-Join us after the break

-to hear about the important role...

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-..conservation and the environment

-can play on these mountains.

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-.

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-Subtitles

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-There's no doubt that upland farming

-will change after Brexit.

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-Will conservation be its salvation?

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-The future of upland farming after

-the Common Agricultural Plan...

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-..is under discussion

-at this conference in Llanrwst.

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-It was organised by the RSPB, Bangor

-University and Cynidr Consulting.

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-It's important to bring farmers

-and conservationists together.

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-We had Glasdir and Tir Gofal

-as past schemes.

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-Some farmers, many farmers

-weren't happy with what happened.

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-Conservationists get things wrong,

-farmers get things wrong.

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-We have to learn from past mistakes.

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-One of the speakers

-was Professor Peter Midmore...

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-..an expert in environmental

-farming policies of upland Wales.

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-Some of the more pessimistic views

-that have been expressed...

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-..are not really justified.

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-Farmers are very adaptable.

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-We assume they'll have the same

-costs and reduced revenues...

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-..as a result of Brexit.

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-Also, they do have

-a certain amount of time to adjust.

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-There will be big structural changes

-in the uplands...

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-..in terms of the intensity

-of agriculture that's practised.

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-It throws up challenges but there

-are a lot of opportunities.

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-For the opportunities

-to be realised...

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-..a strong unified voice is needed

-on behalf of farmers in the hills.

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-A message needs to get across

-to policy makers.

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-It's not going to be

-a treasure chest of new forms...

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-..of environmental subsidy

-that's unlocked by leaving the EU.

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-I think we can look forward

-to flexible regulation...

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-..better targeted means

-of supporting farmers.

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-Probably less support

-but delivered more efficiently.

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-RSPB Cymru's Land Use Manager

-is Arfon Williams.

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-He works with farmers

-on a daily basis.

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-What changes does he predict

-for upland farmers?

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-Environmental conservation

-could be improved.

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-There are problems

-with the quality of water.

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-Wildlife has suffered -

-a lot of wildlife has disappeared.

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-More needs to be done but as we do

-more, there are more opportunities.

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-What will farmers do differently

-to maintain a level of funding?

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-So far, farmers have been forced

-to produce.

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-That's the requirement of CAP.

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-In the future, farmers need

-to manage their land...

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-..to benefit the public.

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-They need a sustainable way

-to manage land.

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-Gwyn Jones is Chief Executive...

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-..of the European Forum on

-Nature Conservation and Pastoralism.

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-What's his vision for the future?

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-Our challenge to the policy

-is finding a new situation...

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-..where farmers

-have more in their pocket...

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-..through farming,

-not by any other means...

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-..but that doesn't lead

-to more intensity...

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-..and losing the public resource

-that they currently provide.

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-That's quite a challenge.

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-What we've seen is that farming

-with a lot of bio-diversity...

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-..is marginal farming

-and that works both ways.

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-Hill farmers haven't improved

-their land because they can't do it.

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-The fact that they can't improve it

-is reflected in their pockets.

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-Is there too much

-environmental pressure on farmers?

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-Could they be paid in the future

-for farming the environment...

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-..and not farming stock?

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-..and not farming stock?

-

-I don't agree with the question.

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-It's a false dichotomy...

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-..especially in low intensity areas

-and the natural habitat lands.

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-Lots of farmers had the opportunity

-to talk at the conference.

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-My message was that cooperation

-is crucial in uplands areas.

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-It brings personal benefits

-for us...

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-..and wider benefits

-for the community too.

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-What kind of benefits?

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-The benefits of healthy food

-produced by sustainable means.

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-We store carbon,

-we give biodiversity a chance...

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-..and enhance the catchment scales.

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-Without farmers, we have no animals.

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-Without animals,

-we can't manage the land.

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-Wales is beautiful,

-it has so much to offer taxpayers.

0:20:240:20:28

-We receive taxpayers' money

-and we have to justify that.

0:20:280:20:31

-Grazing the land is very important.

0:20:320:20:35

-Agriculture has more to offer

-than food production.

0:20:350:20:39

-Will farmers of the future...

0:20:440:20:47

-..become wardens

-of wildlife in upland areas?

0:20:470:20:51

-Isn't this being done already...

0:20:510:20:53

-..through environmental

-farming schemes?

0:20:530:20:56

-We've been reducing the stock

-through environmental farming...

0:20:570:21:01

-..and we'll probably

-have to swap cattle production...

0:21:010:21:07

-..for environmental production...

0:21:070:21:10

-..but it's crucial that we retain

-the animals to manage vegetation...

0:21:100:21:15

-..and create the habitat

-for wildlife.

0:21:150:21:18

-It'll be cheaper than firing up

-a polluting diesel engine...

0:21:180:21:22

-..to produce the landscape

-they require.

0:21:220:21:24

-Undoubtedly, upland farmers are

-the backbone of rural communities.

0:21:240:21:31

-If upland farming isn't supported,

-people will move away.

0:21:310:21:38

-The Welsh language will suffer

-in our schools as a result.

0:21:380:21:43

-The Government has set a target

-of a million Welsh speakers.

0:21:430:21:47

-Support us here

-and the Welsh language will thrive.

0:21:480:21:53

-Do you think it's time

-for things to change?

0:21:540:21:57

-We need to change things.

0:21:570:21:59

-It's a system

-that's been abused in the past.

0:21:590:22:03

-Everything comes to an end

-but we can start something anew.

0:22:030:22:09

-We could create a positive industry.

0:22:090:22:13

-Agriculture,

-like every other industry...

0:22:170:22:20

-..faces uncertain times.

0:22:210:22:23

-Is agriculture high

-on the priority list...

0:22:230:22:27

-..for the British

-and Welsh governments?

0:22:270:22:30

-One thing is certain.

0:22:310:22:33

-If upland farming is to continue,

-farmers must change and adapt.

0:22:330:22:40

-We need a future for hill farms.

0:22:410:22:43

-Wildlife in upland areas

-rely on them.

0:22:440:22:47

-We must create a system for

-the future which is sustainable...

0:22:470:22:52

-..which includes using

-natural resources and ecosystems...

0:22:520:22:58

-..and take care of the environment.

0:22:580:23:01

-Central to this, we must continue

-to produce traditional foods...

0:23:010:23:06

-..from the stock we rear

-on the hills.

0:23:060:23:09

-I hope there's a future.

0:23:100:23:11

-If there's no future...

0:23:110:23:13

-..it'll be detrimental

-to our environment and society.

0:23:130:23:17

-It's a moral question.

0:23:170:23:19

-If society wants farmers

-to provide the produce...

0:23:190:23:23

-..we have to give them a fair price.

0:23:230:23:26

-If it's clear that the market

-can't provide a fair price...

0:23:260:23:30

-..the policy must guarantee it.

0:23:300:23:32

-Can you live on this land

-without subsidies?

0:23:330:23:36

-No. Simple.

0:23:360:23:39

-S4C Subtitles by Adnod Cyf.

0:23:580:24:00

-.

0:24:000:24:00

Ydy ffermio ar yr ucheldir o dan fygythiad yn sgil Brexit? Will upland farming come under threat after Brexit? Farmers, politicians and unions share their thoughts.


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