Body Beautiful Special Free Speech

This is Free Speech. Your chance to have your say about what matters to

All right. That is a nice Northern welcome.

Good evening. Welcome to Free Speech. I'm Jake Humphrey. Tonight,

we're live from Northumbria University Student Union in

Newcastle. CHEERING Well done to each and every one of you for

braving the floods here this evening.

It's a very special Free Speech tonight. It's a chance to debate

issues raised by BBC Three's Body Beautiful season. Last night you'll

have seen Gemma Cairney's emotional film about skin. I start with this,

a face wash for men. It never works! This is something different.

It is like a scrub. You leave it on for ten minutes. It is quite good

stuff. Everyone has used that. used to use that! Yeah. Then a

cloth, which is handy if you like don't have enough time to put them

on. They take a while. Right. You are an expert! It was a moving

watch. If you've got a comment about any

of the programmes in the Body Beautiful season and our debates

here tonight, now is the time to get talking to BBC Three's very own

Sam Naz. APPLAUSE Sam will be looking at all your

comments so phones, tablets and laptops at the ready. Log onto

Facebook, Twitter and BBC Online. Here are our addresses:

It's time to make your voice heard on Free Speech. And remember, this

is the only TV show with the Power Bar. You can power it up on Twitter

by letting us know what you think of the panel. Just use #Yes or #No

followed by the first name of one of our panellists.

And here they are. She's the CEO of youth charity Central YMCA. She's

Rosi Prescott. He's a personal trainer and author

of controversial diet bestseller Six Weeks to OMG. His real name is

Paul, but he goes by the name of Venice A Fulton.

She's a poet, she's a playwright, she's a feminist campaigner, she's

Sabrina Mahfouz. And finally, visiting us from

Planet Fashion, where she's styled the X Factor and judged Britain's

Next Top Model - Grace Woodward. So, we're talking about the body

beautiful and the efforts young people go to to get it. But what is

the body beautiful and why are people so quick to criticise the

appearance of others? We asked I think my body is purpose built,

muscular, efficient. The perfect body is different in everyone's

eyes. We come in all shapes and sizes. I suppose a fairly feminine

shape in that I go in at the waist and out at the hips. I'm proud of

my bum. We do a lot of squats and that is quite good for getting a

toned bum. It is quite big! It is toned as well. The guys are

appalled at us doing a men's sport. I have some muscles, but it is

nothing out of the ordinary. (A) why do you feel you have to

comment? (B) why do you care? (C) why do you think we care? We are

doing this for us. I think in their brain they imagine us to look a lot

bigger and scarier than we do. Obviously, women do come in lots of

different shapes and sizes. Tall, short, broad, narrow. They are all

very successful and wonderful in their own right. APPLAUSE Isn't

that amazing? So Zoe - an incredibly fit athlete

- faced criticism of her body. Jess Ennis has spoken out about women's

fears of becoming too muscular. I want to ask our audience here

what's important to them when it comes to body image. Twice a week,

really. It is important because I want to be a successful singer. In

magazines you don't see ugly people. So like it helps. How much time do

you spend working on your voice compared to the way you look?

sing every day. I spend an hour before work to get ready for work.

The way you look is as important at this stage to get that first

chance? Definitely. That is interesting. Quincy, how do you

react to comments like that? think you should just be free, you

shouldn't have to cover yourself, your natural body, your natural

image is beautiful in its way. I think that beauty is within, not

outside. You have an amazing voice. You don't need an image to get you

there. With the amazing voice and the image, you get further. You

don't see many ugly people like making it as big as what... That is

a fair point. Define "ugly"? Somebody not socially beautiful,

somebody that can be judged easily. Let's go to Rebecca. When they say

define "ugly" how does that make you feel? It makes me feel not

angry, just disappointed really because I don't really feel the

need to wear make-up. I am really confident in my body. I can't

explain why I feel that way. It is not as if it was drummed into me by

my parents. I feel really confident. I think it is not going to be the

first thing people notice about me when they look at me. I'm really

happy with who I am. I hope more young girls and young people can

feel that way. Fantastic. APPLAUSE Great comment to start the evening.

Rosi, let's just come to you. Central YMCA has commissioned a

poll which you are revealing exclusively here on Free Speech.

That has some shocking stats on how young people feel about their

bodies? It does. We found a couple of interesting things. One of them

was adults in general will spend 17 quid a month on cosmetics and hair

and stuff - no clothes. One in four 18 to 34-year-olds in these

difficult economic times will spend �90 a month on this stuff. This is

shocking. Wow! The other thing is one in seven 18 to 34-year-olds

would have or have had cosmetic surgery and would rather be thin

than healthy. That is the interesting point at the end -

rather be thin than healthy. Where's Katie? Hi. What would you

like to know? I would like to know whether you think cosmetic surgery

should be banned or not. What is the Central YMCA stance on this?

I'm not sure about banning. People will find a way around it, won't

they? We have seen that recently in society. They will go abroad, or to

the back-streets. I do think that we need to have some kind of code,

we need to have something. Think about the Groupon phenomenon, where

you have quick and easy access to stuff. You don't have time to think

about it whether you want it. And furthermore, people that have these

interventions, one in three of those people are not happy with the

results. One other thing - one in five people, that is 20% of people

who have this intervention have bodice more ya, which means once

you have had it, you still want more of it. You say it shouldn't be

banned? It needs to be regulated in some way. Venice, should it be

banned? Should cosmetic surgery be banned? Cosmetic comes from the

Greek word "cosmos". If you are a 15-year-old girl and your nose is

bigger than all the other girls' noses at school and you are being

bullied about it. Or if you are a guy whose ears stick out, you have

no order in your life. For all we know, this is one life. If you even

bring up the question of should cosmetic surgery be banned, you are

removing hope from these people. No-one in this room - myself or any

of the panel, or the Government - has the right to take away hope

from people. OK. Sam? It is something that should be given on

the NHS if it is necessary. A blanket ban would be a disaster.

A blanket ban would be a disaster. Sabrina? I don't think you could

really implement a ban that would work, but advertising of cosmetic

surgery to the extent that exists right now - it is everywhere, page

after page of it - that needs to be curbed. You are promoting it as a

normal thing. I think the fundamental reason behind that

cosmetic surgery demand is the fact that we see so many women,

particularly - I know it is on the rise for men - it is still the

majority of women that do it - and the general thing is that a woman

is valued for her beauty, she gets successful for being sexually

attractive and beautiful so therefore the demand is high.

one thing that stood out there - one in seven would prefer to be

thin than healthy. Is cosmetic surgery part of a real issue in

this country, it is about looking better without? It is an argument

that can work on both points. I think that if somebody's really

desperately unhappy about - you mentioned a really big nose. If you

are not part of the beauty norm and it makes you unhappy, somebody is -

- somebody's pain is the equivalent of somebody else's pain. I would

like to see more psychological testing and more of a difficult

access point to it. It should not be banned. It would go underground.

It would become very dangerous. And also we need to develop this

technology for people who also need it, for accidents, stuff like that.

Yeah. It is interesting. Low body confidence is linked to mental

health. Get your hands up, audience. Sam, a first look at the Power Bar.

Yes. Are you ready? It is time people at home had their say. Let's

get a quick verdict and fire it up! Rosi taking an early lead. A lot of

people connecting with the poll's findings. Rosi is happy with that!

Ely, how important do you think cosmetic surgery is? It is, for

myself, and for my work. What is your work? Glamour modelling.

have you had done? I had two boob jobs and every three months I get

my lips enhanced. Tomorrow morning, I'm getting my next one. Three

months ago, I started with the Botox. I'm 27. But I think it will

be four times a year and then three times a year and then two times a

It is better starting be poor and for your wrinkles. There's

definitely an increase in young people having it as a preventive

measure. Steve, you are the managing director of Transform, a

cosmetic surgery group. Are you concerned about the numbers of

young people wanting the surgery? Concerned, I think you have got to

get into perspective. There is a misconception anybody who comes to

a company like us will receive a procedure but three out of every 10

people a proper consultation with us will be declined for reasons

they have the wrong expectations, they are not medically suitable, or

have underlining medical issues. It's not straightforward. But not a

psychological issue? Absolutely, that could be an issue as well.

They will be referred to their GP. We will check their in the right

frame of mind for it, as well. just seen on the board, cosmetic

surgery should not be allowed on the NHS. Three years ago, I was in

a fire, and 15 of my operations had been cosmetic surgery because it's

been needed. And I think banning cosmetic surgery would be

disastrous. I needed it to save my life, so they are going to take

that opportunity away from people like me who did not have the choice

but needed cosmetic surgery to ultimately save parts of their body.

If you needed for serious reasons such as being caught in a fire,

fine, but it you want to do it for a job, maybe that's a different

case? It's every one's own choice. At the age of 18, when I was 5 ft 7

and a size six, after being burned, I now look back at pictures and

think what was I complaining about because I used to pick at my body,

focus on people I admired in the media and that's why I want to be

like. Now I look back on it, I'm just a shame it took something so

serious for me to wake up and realise I didn't need to be like

the people I watched when I was younger and now I'm happy the way I

am. I've got nothing against cosmetic surgery. OK, Tommy is

sitting next to you. Tommy, you look perfect. Thank you. Have you

had cosmetic surgery? No, in Essex, I am known as a human Ken doll. A

lot of people do judge me balls of I don't care, to be honest. How do

they judge you? I do a lot of TV work. I have a lot of followers on

Twitter and a lot of people judge me. They think I am fake. He's

orange, all of this. You haven't had surgery about you? What is

vague about you? They say my tan, just the way I am and I'm not a

fake person. How do you feel about people who have cosmetic surgery?

Would you wish people would work harder in the gymnasium, or would

work hard on your body? Everybody is different for reason. Everybody

is beautiful. You don't have to conform. A lot of my friends,

glamour models, they are amazing. That's what they want to do. But I

don't think it needs to happen. It's not necessary. Do you think,

by spending money other people could not afford, how much have be

spent on your breasts? �8,000. lot of money for an 18-year-old

girl. Are you creating an image people can't achieve? It's

personally, the first and for myself. I have a little boy and a

breast fed and my breast went down and once the fatty tissue grows

away, then... It's natural, though? Part of being a woman. Not three

years ago. Most of my breast tissue had gone. I felt like a man from

behind so I wanted it to be enhanced so that's why I had the

first one. The second one of this Lee was for to be bigger, the

appearance. -- obviously. You have to try to be the top. You have to

compete? Yes. Michaelis says it will lead to more people going

abroad if you ban it and more dodgy jobs being done. People say here no

one thinks cosmetic surgery should be banned for the the so many

productions on the West End where those who are physically abnormal,

wicked, and two of the opera, hairspray, those who society think

are not physically normal, our And you think that is healthy?

I don't think cosmetic surgery should be seen as a cure for having

a bad body image. I don't think having one part of your body

altered will change how you feel about yourself. It is silly, really,

to say, if I change one thing I am insecure about I will feel fine. I

don't think it should be banned, but by encouraging it, when people

see other people having cosmetic surgery, it's... OK, let's go to

Steve. This young lady is saying, yes, had surgery, but will it make

you happy on the inside? Absolutely. In the overwhelming majority of

cases to come to Transform, they do it for self-confidence, to feel

normal. That self-confidence manifests itself in this socialite,

career. Even going on holiday and feeling comfortable taking your top

off on the beach. It's absolutely about allowing people to feel good

about themselves or for that's the case. Could I pick up on that. I

would question what is normal for the except for identical twins, we

are all individual and if we cannot celebrate and feel confident in

that, we will do an awful lot better. Let's go to you, Sam.

says it should be regulated. People should use it to help further

themselves, not for vanity. Monica disagrees. She thinks it shouldn't

be. Alan it says it should not be bound to but it goes wrong, and its

private... But Tom says only Eddie people say looks don't matter. --

ugly people. Looks mean everything in today's world. It's wrong but

it's true. Maybe that's the case. Hands up anybody who thinks

cosmetic surgery should be completely banned? That tells the

whole story, doesn't it? Thanks, Sam. Remember if you want your

point of view read out, you've got to make it first. So head to

Facebook. Or Twitter. Or use hashtag Free Speech. Or go to the

Next, while we're talking body image we have to talk about size

and how it makes us feel. Thin and healthy, fat and happy, thin and

miserable, fat and fit. Jane has been looking at big deal beauty

pageants. In a world obsessed by skinny, I'm interested in this rare

place. Where girls can bear their flesh and be celebrated for their

size. The moment you are all been waiting for. This is the story of

four of the finalists. I'm a 22 stone and that's it. Everything is

big. Big boobs. Fantastic. Let's get a question. My question is,

does discussing of the city in the context of body image risk

normalising of the biggest killers in the modern world? Venice, how

worried I about normalising obesity? Yes, I am worried because

we are a politically correct world, very afraid of stepping on anyone's

toes. If you take the emotions out of it, go straight to the evidence,

if you were heavier than you need to be your and healthier than you

need to be and that has a knock-on effect on your future family's life.

And on the economy. There's loads of different things, so we must

separate this issue of Vanity and health. I would like to say that,

from your research, you mentioned people would prefer to be thinner,

not healthier. Is that correct? Skinner is actually healthier.

was the sub-heading of York book? - of your book. The you have to sex

a double for be sexier than are your friends. I literally did not

like the title. I gave people a choice. I would be happier if

people picked up any book which is involved in the health arena.

Rather than not pick it up and just go to the internet and find out

gibberish. That is so important for people. Sabrina, are we normalising

obesity in this country? I don't know about that. I don't know how

you can normalise something and, at the same time, pressurising

everybody to be thinner. If surveys say people would rather be thin

than healthy, I don't see that is normalising obesity. It's difficult

because to say Opc is not healthy, I don't think that people are all

and healthy. Where is the liner? People just have a different weight

which is healthy for them. audience have something to save.

interesting point from Gover, who says it's the gay community who are

most harsh on obesity and even bears a don't like big guys.

interesting. Grace, what do you think? I mean, this film looked

very celebratory. But I think that it seems to be always extremely one

way or the other. And I think that we would not show extremely thin

but naturally thin people and I do think there is a fear around that

and I think there is a danger in that normalising really, really

over sized body shapes because it does go back to his find. And, in a

lot of cases, it is not fine. If the message is, don't do exercise,

it is fine to overeat, I would not promote that at all. -- at his find.

Obese people, over half the people, they prefer them are women and they

will earn more money. Loss of the variance in society discriminating.

I want to come back to another point, the correlation between

overweight and health. It is not proved and is on a sliding scale

for the can we please start thinking about the individual and

the person sitting behind us? Here in England we have the fastest

women in Europe and the most abundant dieting industries for the

square that circle if you can afford it wants to look at a whole

person, and see them as a person with politic needs, I think we will

crack this problem. OK. Let's take a look at the Power Bar. Grace, you

have a shot ahead. Really connecting with people at home.

Rosi, you were at the front but have fallen back a bit. I am there.

This is getting hard core. Rosi has got fans. Let's talk about being

obese and talk about losing weight and hear from the audience for the

Loran, tell us your story. I was a size 26, 23 and a half stone, and I

Absolutely, well done it. Was it easy to become that way? It was

easy to become that bigger but losing weight came with a price.

what way? I had body dysmorphic disorder, so when I looked in the

mirror, the more weight I lost, I couldn't see it. The actual thing

which was happening to me psychologically, was not being

taken into consideration. Everybody told me I looked fantastic, but

what was going on up there was not great. Were you losing weight for

them off for you? Both. How could you feel now? Fantastic. I'm now a

size 16, I have put weight back on, the UK average sized girl, and I

think it's important people are healthy and happy mind and a

healthy and happy diet. You need to exercise but they go hand in hand.

Is this a good, help the size to be? There's nothing wrong with it

and anybody has an issue with a, they can tell me. I think it's

fantastic. Well done for the weight loss, as well.

I feel, in today's society, looking at the poverty and unemployment

rates, people have not got much money but when you look at the

supermarkets, they are advertising half price frozen food, chocolate,

biscuits, not cutting down the fruit and vegetables. Also there's

a certain department store which have plus size models, advertising

clinically obese people and I don't think that's right. It's such a

touchy subject for so it should be out front, obesity is on the rise

and so and help before for but it's too touchier subject. How much of

your book was about what people eat? If the first book of its kind

without recipes in it. My publishers wanted to put it in but

I decided I wanted to say to people, you have to learn about food, how

you eat. And it's important about we reach a point of understanding

rather and being told what to do because we are saturated with

Let's hear from more of the audience. I want to contest what he

said about that thin is healthy. I personally think that his book does

promote pro-anorexic tips. There is being healthy but being dangerously

thin, which I was, I was told I was weeks from death eight years ago. I

know a lot of other sufferers of anorexia and I wanted to know what

his thoughts were. Have you read his book? I don't want to!

haven't read it? Why would I want to? To make a fair point. I don't

want to read any of that stuff any more. Eating disorders are mental

disorders with a physical outcome. If you go to rural India and Africa

where they have never heard of my book, they have never heard of the

BBC and of Britain and Ireland's Next Top Model, there are still

eating disorders. They come from intensely personal things, often

within the home, within the parental relationship, from abuse,

from bullying at school and now with social media. Eating disorders

have nothing to do with diet books at all. If you ask people, if you

ask 100 people with anorexia, you will get 98 or 99 who will say, "It

has nothing to do with diet books." It is something else. You are being

patronising to an anorexic! haven't even read the book! I know

that for vulnerable young people who are already disupposed to

having an eating disorder, books like yours can send people to the

extreme. I have had friends who have died from eating disorders.

have I! Your book can, you know, it can be very impressionable on young

people. Shall we ban the internet? No. I'm giving human beings credit

for being bright. We can understand what things mean. Just because

there is a book on the shelf. You don't react to each one of those

books by seeing them. You really don't. You are dumbing down eating

disorders for everyone who has them. I'm not dumbing down disorders.

That is really offensive and upsetting. There is nothing wrong -

if you read the book, there is a big chapter about eating disorders.

The key thing is to see people - I am seeing very few skinny people. I

think we have to get away from this skinny is great and fat is to be

vilified. We have to stop stigmatising people on the basis of

the way they look. Thank you. Well done for winning your own battle

with anorexia. APPLAUSE Sam? Obviously, getting a big reaction

online. The lady was talking about food prices - she said larger

people are poorer because healthy food is ex-pen Si. "There is no

excuse for being obese or skinny, everyone in the UK has the means to

be healthy, unlike some Third World countries where food is precious."

-- expensive. Cliff says celebrating obesity is like

celebrating anorexia. Thank you, Sam.

We wanted to come to Newcastle for our Body Beautiful Special because,

according to research by Sainsbury's, the guys here spend

more on male beauty products than anywhere else in the country. And

you guys buy more tweezers than anywhere else in Britain. What are

you doing with them all?! LAUGHTER Let's get a couple of guys to talk

us through how much they spend on these. Your muscles look great. How

many days a week are you in the gym? Five times a week. But

probably get in there three times. What else do you do to make

yourself look beautiful? I am always getting a fresh haircut.

often? Every week-and-a-half. fast does your hair grow? Quite

fast! OK. Another man with ample muscles - making me feel bad about

myself! Talk us through your beauty regime? Most of the stuff I spend

money on has to do with going to the gym, whether it be protein

shakes or gym membership, or buying loads of meat and that is it. There

is nothing else I spend money on. Really? Everything you do is about

looking good? No, it is not - everything I do is about going to

the gym. Mostly because it's something nice to do and it's - I

mean, there is loads of other things that people keep themselves

busy with. And spend loads of money on. That is never vilified but as

soon as you seem to be vain or something... Why is there a need to

do it? Pressure from society? If there was that amount of

pressure, many more people would have been in the gym and there's

very few that go to the gym. The biggest pressure is on looks, a

quick-fix, the stuff you wear and the way you cut your hair. I

sometimes think that if some famous person decides he is going to shave

off his eyebrows and treat his face with chip fat, then everyone will

start doing it! It is a quick-fix. I think that is where the pressure

lies and not in going to the gym or looking good in that way. OK. Let's

move on to a question from Rose. What would you like to ask? If one

in eight British men consider hair striegt ners as an essential --

straighteners as an essential, have we reached a point in our society

where men are too feminine? many men have used hair

straighteners? Brilliant! Are we too feminine as a male society?

don't think so. It is a personal choice. It depends how your hair

grows as well. LAUGHTER If it is curly, it might need straightening.

My friend from Essex? I curl my hair, like I give it a bit of a

bend! There is nothing wrong with it. Some guys can be scared to do

it because they think, "Oh my God, I don't want to be feminine." Look

at this, babe, you are joking. Would you describe yourself as

feminine? Definitely. Why? It is me, innit?! I love you by the way! Look

at Rylan. He is doing great. I think, like, I go with it! Rosi,

what do you think? The situation with men is complex. It is getting

worse. Of course, the body ideal for men traditionally, bearing in

mind your individuality, but traditionally will be to build bulk.

The problem with that is men are prepared to sacrifice a lot to

achieve that. One in ten would take steroids to build the bulk. The

other shocking thing we found is that at least one in three - no,

one in three would sacrifice at least one year of life to have the

idea body. There are others who would sacrifice five or ten years

of life. This is shocking. Not sure what the reason is. I imagine

something, it is something to do with the social contract that

menused to be the ones with a fat wallet - that was OK. The woman was

the one on the arm. That's different now as women are starting

to come out. We have a different social contract between us. Is this

an issue of men having to conform to the men we are putting on a

pedestal. I see the haircut and tattoo. I'm thinking footballers.

Is that part of this? It is for myself. It is quite embarrassing

because being gay myself I think it is quite embarrassing when you see

people going on like that. People think all gays act like that. It is

embarrassing for myself. Since I have come out, I have more gay

friends now because I have straight friends. I have loads of gay male

friends but hardly any straight male friends because they don't

want to be hanging around with somebody like that. I try to - I be

myself, I don't want to put on a show. I like being who I am. I

would like more straight male friends because I don't want to be

backed off by that. Do you almost think men are being braver to be

who they are and men are a bit more feminine? Definitely. It wouldn't

be the first time that men have worn make-up and high heels. There

was a time when they did wear more make-up and higher wigs. I wanted

to go back to Rosi's point about the point that women are earning

more. If we have had to spend so much time wearing make-up or

looking pretty, isn't it time that guys caught up because will they

not be left behind if women do look more presentable and getting better

jobs? I would challenge what "presentable" is and whether we

should be having men coming up to meet the ideal that women have had

to force themselves into, or should we be coming to terms with the fact

that we should be proud about who we are and what we contribute and

how we are perceived physically? What do you think, Sabrina? Is it a

case of men coming up to match women or women dumbing down to

match men? For me, it is a case of the we didn't have a 15% pay gap

between men and women, if we didn't have one in five women in the

Cabinet, if those sort of figures were more equal, then I might buy

the fact that it's because men need to catch up with women because

women are taking over. I don't think that. I think that is an

interesting point that you said that maybe it is just that men have

always had that feminine side and now it's - they are allowed to feel

free to come out with it a bit more. All right. You have a very

masculine look going on. I think I wanted to ask further to the

research, more and more people are trying to conform now to an ideal,

I think in society, that we are presenting. A lot of it - the

finger gets pointed at the media. Is the expectation on our

generation... You know what? Hold that. Our next question is how much

is the media responsible for what goes on. Stay there, keep that

thought. Sam, can you give us some thoughts? Lots coming in. "So what

if men use straighteners!" Will puts the blame at the women's door.

"Women have double standards." Men make them feel insecure and they

drool over rugby players and divers. OK. LAUGHTER And then Rachel says,

"Will someone tell the muscle men of Newcastle that the extreme gym

look does not look good, you all look the same." Thank goodness. I

felt so inferior! LAUGHTER A quick look at the Power Bar? Yes. Let's

see how it has affected. Sabrina and Grace - your points have hit

home. You are both in the lead. Brilliant. Thank you for getting in

touch. OK, so we've been talking about

pressure to conform to a body ideal - and we've already heard about the

role media images play in that. Rachel has been out and about in

Newcastle. I'm Rachel, I'm 25. I'm from Newcastle. Today, I'm looking

at the pictures we see on a daily basis in the shopping centre in

Newcastle. I think it is dangerous that there isn't diversity of

images in the media. It is an issue close to my heart. I developed

anorexia at the age of 16. About nine months later at 17 I was

dangerously ill and had to be taken to an eating disorder specialist

unit. My body started to eat itself and shut down. They told me I

couldn't survive at the weight I was. In all the magazines there

were celebrities and models who were the same size and weight as me.

I don't think the media causes eating disorders as they are very

complex mental health illnesses. They don't help. I have finished. I

will tally up my results. Today I counted 174 images of people and

only two of those images were plus- sized people. 90% of the images we

saw were young, slim and white. I think it doesn't represent society

and it is no wonder that people are getting low self-esteem and the

number of eating disorders is on Thank you very much for sharing a

report with us. You are very passionate about the subject so

what is your question? Yes, I am passionate about the subject. I

think the government should regulate will media and raise self-

esteem, do you think the media should be regulated? Let's go

straight to the panel. Sabrina, I would like to hear from you. We see

images on the catwalk. Surely there are unattainable? Yes, there is a

range of things, a lot of attention put on skinny catwalk models but at

the same time you are bombarded with images and music videos, more

of a curvy figure, but that also just as unattainable, unless you

happen to have it, so all of this encouraging a very narrow idea of

what is sexy and attractive. It's not healthy. There's a variety of

things. People don't know what they find attractive because they only

see one image they are supposed to deal with. I think that is really

bad and definitely should be regulated. Who should take

responsibility for this? The media is a very big umbrella so where do

you start with it? There are magazines which are really helpful

but the publishing that they do, there are magazines to are

glorifying clothing. Where does it begin and end? I feel we have a

responsibility for our own reactions to things, rather than

being a nanny state, they should be banned and regulated? It's tough

but you're a 16-year-old Gill and see images over and over again.

Within education and the parental home, is there not an awareness, a

discussion? Even in education. If children are learning on computers

now, there's also things which can be going with that from the

beginning. It sounds like this almost no way of keeping kids away

from these images. Lea focuses on one aspect and says ear-bashing

should be banned because it shows something which is supposedly

perfect but also unattainable. Rosi, what would you like to see

changed? I am inherently against regulation. We can have a moral

code, an eating disorder charity has cropper the code and have an

arrangement with some media, they treat people with eating disorders

in a more respectful way. We have a responsibility as a society. If you

start regulating, you end up like China or a fascist state. We have

to take responsibility for a more healthy society. I'm against

regulation but for a moral code. it important for advertising to

reflect all kinds of appearances? Yes, sure, that's important. The

media is simply a reflection of us. They don't create stuff out of

nothing. They reflect us. The most powerful and affecting people's

perception of what is good and bad and beautiful and ugly is social

media. Are you sure about that, really? Absolutely. Facebook has 1

billion subscribers. This is driven by people for support we are

responsible for a lot more. Is that fact? It's fact. From where?

sheer size of the information. just don't think the media is a

reflection on society. It goes both ways and his encyclical. Things are

picked up from society but I also think something like the Daily Mail

forms the way people think about stuff. I totally agree with that

point, actually. We are all to blame, the media, us, and the media

would like to say they held a mirror up to us but we are self-

perpetuating this thing. We have to get back to basics and get people

confident to make their own choices, and then we won't be driven down

this path are feeling insecure about ourselves.

The media are naughty sometimes. They have to sell papers,

advertising, but you are denying the truth of how big social media

has become. People are not looking at what is printed in the Daily

Mail today, but looking at their friends are posting on their walls

and what they are saying online. We have to take responsibility for

ourselves and that's the way to go forward. It's a far more powerful

way to live, take responsibility. member of the audience thought your

book was not something she would like to read for I know the adverts

were banned on the London Underground. It was crazy for that

I didn't know about it at the time. They said was dangers because young

people could walk past them or something. It's like if I vote

there would jump near the Tube platform, will people jump onto the

platform? People will not take health advice from a poster for the

why are we dumbing-down are saying we need regulation? We're all

bright and are living in the brightest era of human history.

why did you call your book, How to get skinnier than your friends?

gets people talking. People will pick up the book and learn about

stuff. So you're dumbing-down and sane people have to be forced to

pick up a book about health. presses on your insecurity, that's

the problem and that insecurity has been foisted upon us by a vast

commercial interest. Creative media has a lot to beat Port about. Films

and TV, if they represented characters, a wider variety, that

would influence the other media. The human species has an in-built

desire to become better over a period of time which has made Abba

species what it is today. Better as individuals. Dominic represent the

advertising industry. So, what is the issue? Is it what we want and

that's what we are being given or is the advertising industry

responsible for telling us what to think? There are two things going

on here. The media do in some ways, this programme reflects the media

echo of what people believe, what they think and feel. Regulating the

media, the press, television, means of regulating the people. Do people

want to be regulated more? That picks up on Rosi's a very good

point. She does not agree with it and I'm inclined to go along with

that, too. Advertising potentially plays a part in the ear bashing

issue. -- they're brushing. Our job in marketing is to make things look

the best they can look. Without lying there. Of course. 5,000

Photoshop images a week. Many ads had disclaimers saying images are

digitally enhance to. Is that a lying? You could not create the

image without deception. because the techniques used in film

making and in photography, so any photographer could tell you it's

extremely difficult accurately to take a picture of a red top and get

that read absolutely right and true thought so that, when that is sent

to print, it reflects exactly what the product is. It's not about

changing the look of the person? Shaving of a woman's waste through

a Photoshop so it is smaller than her head, which was extraordinary.

We could all find extreme examples. That, to me, would sound like an

extreme example of Bogota shopping and ear-bashing. Lots of Mazda's

In. Jonathan says people should have commonsense to see what you

see in advertisements is not reality. Young lady here. On the

point of dumbing-down. Basically, we are in a fast-paced society and

are fed the quickest solution so we don't really think too much. We are

shown what is going to be in build in us, which provokes our thinking.

Sometimes, what do you call it, brainwashing. Brainwashing is a

good word. Let's go with that. Subliminal. If you thought about

the logic, you would think twice, but because it is in your brain,

and you're exposed to it so much, you don't think. OK, thank you.

take issue same regulation has to equal going towards fascism. The

media is an industry and their business is to make money and we

must remember that might not be in our best interests and regulation

can be there to regulate against areas where businesses, if left

unchecked,... More common sense from the consumers, do you think?

It's unfair to suggest people have to continue to remember that when

they see pictures every day. only problem with regulation, and

we have seen that with a police force, the City, a range of

apparently good professions, if there's not a moral code, a social

responsibility, people will always find a way round the regulation so

how much more healthy? That's the opposite point of view. In the

advertising industry there is the Advertising Standards which banner

of fake adverts. Maybe that's not enough, then? This works in both

ways. Advertising for cosmetic surgery I think it would be nice if

99% of those models actually had no procedures. It is implied that

those models have had something done at that clinic when most of

them have had nothing done it. That needs to be corrected. You said how

do you think it makes 16 year-olds feel? I am 16 and it does not

affect me at all. Obviously, I look to people in the media, but I don't

change my life because it... A lot of people. There's more people.

There is more people, like, don't look at the media for I look like

this because I look like that not because I saw some body in a

magazine and one to look like them off. If I said I wanted a boob job,

I would have one for me, not because I want to look like someone.

Blaming the media are for something which is everything sport. We have

to take responsibility. There's a little bit of support for you. If

you don't want to read a book, don't read it. Chris says, we don't

need more regulations. The public needs to think of itself and decide

what is attractive. It's up to the individual to decide. When

considering children, as hard as it may be, it's not the parents'

responsibility to regulate what they are exposed to force a last

look at the Power Bar. Sabrina, you have one of. Well done, so bring up.

You have the final word. On the regulation, something should be

regulated, there is only 0.5% of sponsorship going to women in sport

and after the Olympics, you would think women would have more support

in sport and they don't. 5% of media coverage is about female

sports. If we had more of these female role-models which don't come

down to their looks, this stuff would not matter anyway. Perfect.

Thank you for being us -- with us this evening. Around the applause

for the panel. Thank you. This is my last Free Speech so thank you

for making it such a good one. The show is about to have a break, but

it will be back next year on February 13th. And in the meantime,

you'll find a whole lot more Free Speech online. Have a great

Christmas and a happy new year. We If you fear you look good, you will

feel good inside and everybody wants to feel like that. It's about

natural beauty and not paying money to tweak yourself to feel more

confident. If it means enhancing a little bit, I think it's acceptable

as long as you feel a bit more sexy, cool. Taking care of myself,

looking strong and fit and healthy. Body in it is the projection of

your mind. It's something I would constantly have to think about.